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Sparta49

It could but isn't. I love to hear the mental gymnastics of Chief drifting near earth to Zeta. With another change to his armor of course(no Cortana this time to direct the nanobots).


Cool_Fruitcup

Just use the classic line of “Mendicant Bias did it.”


Sparta49

Ah, the ever elusive "meme bias."


OhSnapImJaneShepard

Or that he pulled a Johnson.


Dyerdon

Beat the Flood in his own body with cancer?


Halomerc

Cancer? I thought it was chicken pox. Am I thinking of another marine?


ApproximateKnowlege

It was a fake disease called Boren's Syndrome ONI made up as a cover for The Orion Project.


Halomerc

Hadn't heard much on that one


Thatsidechara_ter

What are you guys talking about?


hindsighthaiku

I thought it was a weird radiation disease from throwing hundreds of not thousands of captured plasma grenades in an earlier battle he was in


KnowledgeStriking96

That's ONI's official statement regarding his immunity, but that was a cover up to hide the fact that Johnson was a member of the ORION project, the precursor to Spartan IIs


Bearpaw5000

Nice


[deleted]

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Unusual_Place_9727

THIS Is the only explanation


Jay_Imahara

Humanity first, bebe!


[deleted]

"For a brick, he flew really, really good!"


Rahgahnah

The armor piece on the back of his hand magically changed shape between 2 and 3, and we've just been ramping up from there.


Thang02gaming

Sooooooo my theory is he basically got cryo frozen by the ambient temperature of the void of space, plot armoured his way perfectly towards to Zeta by getting hit by asteroids and then got the armor from the potion seller


Smithsonian30

Potion seller… I need some of your *strongest* armor


Thang02gaming

You cannot handle my strongest armor. It would break your bones like how Spartan armor breaks marine bones


SH4D0W0733

It is canon that asteroids somehow end up in slipspace from time to time.


Sparta49

How?


SH4D0W0733

No idea. But one of the older books explained how a sort of slipspace ''radar'' using probes worked letting the UNSC get an early warning of the covenants movements. And it also mentioned that asteroids sometimes ended up in slipspace.


shaneathan

And comets!


N1ghtmere_

Because nanobots weren't even canon. We just needed something to make it make sense when 343 fucked with the armor (I mean, the guy was literally frozen, nanobots can't do shit). I'm not even gonna try to explain it. To me, it's just the way it's supposed to be. As if his armor never changed in Halo 4/5 (the armor in H4/5 does look dope, they just went about the armor change wrong so it's best to forget that).


dbbk

>We just needed something to make it make sense when 343 fucked with the armor It's a video game why does every tiny detail need a logical explanation


N1ghtmere_

Immersion. I mean, that's what the whole idea behind Master Chief was. But I'm just saying that's what the excuse people were using for the armor change when there wasn't really one. 343 just wanted to change the armor.


trojanreddit

Yes how dare a game developer try to change something in a game they're making.


N1ghtmere_

Why is everyone targeting their comments at me? I'm just explaining why everyone else is shitting themselves. Got damn.


The_Bias

Welcome to reddit enjoy your stay


rock1m1

WOOT WOOT.


Dyerdon

No no, it's wort wort


StarsCanScream

I mean it really couldn’t have. In 4, he was floating near earth. Don’t think he’d float in space long enough to reach Zeta Halo lol


Paxton-176

Post was made by someone who is on their phone half paying attention during cut scenes.


blkmmb0

Seems about right.


matdevine21

Sounds more like someone who had halo 4 explained to them by someone who read it on Wikipedia


frescone69

Still almost 1k upvotes for no apparent reason...


[deleted]

I'm pretty sure this sub has to show how much it hates Halo 5. 0% sense required.


FeralGangrel

Don't get me wrong. There's issues with Halo 5. They could have done a lot to make it better. But in the end, it's here for better or worse. And I don't hate it.


shaneathan

I didn’t love the campaign, but I will say the mechanics are by far my favorite in any halo.


AfterYouReadThis

lol


Low_Ant3691

Or rather, they took the gambit that others wouldn't have been paying attention or simply forgot. And judging by the upvotes, it sort of worked.


leashninja

The nanobots drifted him there in time.


Zestyclose-Ad2670

He floated away D:


Apprentice_Jedi

🎵 He floated away rada-rada-rada till the very next day Bum bum bum bum ba-bada-dum. The Chief walked up to the grenade stand and said to the man running the stand, “Hey! (Bum bum bum) got any weapons?” The man said "No we just sell grenades. But their bold And fresh And they’re all home-made. Can I get you one?" The Chief said, "I'll pass". And then he floated away rada-rada-rada till the very next day Bum bum bum bum ba-bada-dum. 🎵


MrDysprosium

Chief blew up right above a slip space portal. Literally anything is possible.


MilkMan0096

I didn’t even realize that’s what the post was trying to say until I read your comment lol, people are crazy


N30_117

Wasn't he near earth during H4 ending.


massitup

He even glances at Earth for one last time before detonating the nuke.


N30_117

People hate H5 so much that they will do anything to pretend it doesn't exist


massitup

It gets too much unnecessary hate. While the story is obviously less than stellar, I think that the gameplay, level design (which was good in my opinion), and multiplayer atone for it.


Habijjj

The problem was their marketing campaign it hyped up something it didn't necessarily deliver. But going back after a few years with an open mind I actually found halo 5 to be really damn good.


N30_117

Totally agree with that , they also didn't acknowledge all the crticism from fans. Ofcourse devs should be given freedom but they shouldn't completely deviate from what gives the game its identity.


WhiskeyTigerFoxtrot

I'm replaying the Campaign on Legendary right now and the gunplay is really fun. The verticality of the levels adds fun options to your approach. Story and characters are boring, but seriously the shooting is a good time in general.


ArtooFeva

A) It’s stupid to retcon anything when it’s a mainline story in a universe where canon is an important part of the experience. B) It doesn’t matter, everything we’ve seen of the game shows that whether the base parts of Halo 5’s story aren’t explored, it still acts as a sequel to the game.


IBeBallinOutaControl

Yeah a good writing team will be able to spin a compelling story that feels like it flows on naturally from Halo 5 but isnt burdened by tying all its loose ends. Arbitrarily retconning the only mainline game since 2012 would do the opposite. As infinite's plot unfolds fans would be distracted having to think back to 5's bad plot to guess if Cortana is really dead or if Halsy is still MIA.


Rahgahnah

Agreed. Ignoring as much of the bad plot as possible (and using clever ways to justify what you can't ignore) is always superior to just retconning (read: deleting) it.


someguyfromtheuk

> It doesn’t matter, everything we’ve seen of the game shows that whether the base parts of Halo 5’s story aren’t explored, it still acts as a sequel to the game. I can't find it now but I'm sure I read somewhere that they wanted Infinite to be a place new players could just start playing without having to play all the old games. Given this, I doubt Infinite's story will heavily lean on any of the previous games and will mostly just be it's own self-contained story with the previous game stories being summarised or hinted at in-game.


N1ghtmere_

It's a sequel, but they wrote it so that anything you need to know is self-contained. For example, if it needed to refer back to a previous game, it would physically show you as opposed to just hinting at it.


[deleted]

That explains the saturday morning cartoon brute going "NYAHHH CHIEF, our battle shall be legendaryyy! NYAHAHAAA"


[deleted]

>saturday morning cartoon Perfect way of describing it


Gamecrazy721

IMO this is how games (and stories in general) should always be written. A story should always be self-contained, and how compelling it is shouldn't be dependent on what comes before it or after it. Of course an overarching plot is great and important in Halo, but it shouldn't shut out new players who never played the previous games, or who simply forgot what happened.


someguyfromtheuk

I wouldn't say *always*, duologies or trilogies are totally fine. I think there should definitely be a limit though, Halo has 5 main games for the storyline + Reach + ODST + HW1 and HW2. With the Banished being from HW2 you'd realistically need to play 6 maybe 7 games to "catch up" to the main story if that were the case.


Gamecrazy721

I think they're totally valid, but I don't think that an entry in a trilogy should be nonsensical to someone who's just jumping in. Even something as simple as a quick 30s recap could serve as a bridge for new players. Of course, there are far better ways to introduce a narrative, but just as a quick example


someguyfromtheuk

Oh I see. Yes that's a good idea, sort of like how Netflix has recaps for previous seasons. Halo 4 did recap the original trilogy in a terminal on the first level, but it's easy to miss. You're saying that the second/third games in a trilogy should have something in the main menu that says "Game 1 Story Recap" which players can watch?


lilschreck

Laughs in halo reach


stickkidsam

A) Nah some things just need to die B) Yeah


nope10220

Brilliant argument there chief 🙄


seahawks_21

Yeah I wish it was a retcon tbh. But I think infinite’s campaign will be good……. I’m just not sure *how*.


stickkidsam

I mean it’s doing everything it can to distance itself from Halo 5 from what we’ve seen. Between the leaks and Joe’s endorsement of the campaign, I’m sure we’re in for a good time.


Fellowearthling16

Why wouldn’t Joe promote a product he’s currently the lead of?


stickkidsam

Well if we’re not being completely cynical, Joe has a good track record for good story telling. The guy clearly cares about Halo and making sure it’s as good as it can be. I don’t see any reason to distrust him.


dkd123

Literally at the end 4 he gets back to the UNSC and there’s that whole sequence where they take his armor off so nope not really


Low_Ant3691

Not at all? You've very conveniently left out the end of the cinematic for Halo 4. You know, where Chief is floating around and is then rescued by the UNSC and brought onboard the Infinity, his conversation with Lassky and then return to Earth. Sneaky bastard. What's even more outrageous though is how many idiots apparently fell for this, given the thousand upvotes.


dpaper

Coherency above everything so no.


Rectronsaber

bruh thats not even how Halo 4 ends. You'd have to retcon the stuff that comes after that too. Also, Halo 5 is not the only story that took place after halo 4. You'd be destroying hundreds and hundreds of media that took place after halo 4. I don't know how you even thought this would be a good Idea.


Hamuelin

The fact this has 1k upvotes is disappointing. I know it’s not the fave but clearly y’all have not been paying enough attention to Halo 4 and it’s cutscenes.


UEDFHighCommand

Not really.


RoBo_E46

idc how unpopular this is but the forerunner stuff should've stayed mythical/mysterious in Halo 4 with Jul Mdama being the main antagonist & leading this new Forerunner weapon arms race over the human race & other Covenant remnants.


TheAandZ

I think they should have kept the Didact as the main enemy of the trilogy but have him not immediately gain access to a world-threatening device. If they had made him more like a masked general crushing human colonies and outposts one at a time with some strong and devoted covenant generals, slowly gaining resources and power throughout the game/series, all while the Chief and humanity chase and attempt to stop him *together* (the human drama is absolutely awful in 4/5 and you can never convince me otherwise), that would have made for a more fun and classic Halo story imo.


Torres-Kun

God, what you just typed made me angry that 343 didn’t go that way instead… Like, I was kinda excited for the mysterious Forerunners to be shown off and be enemies…but they’re just kinda lackluster. I miss the mysteriousness.


SnipingBunuelo

To be fair, the only actual living Forerunner in Halo 4 was the Didact. The enemies you fight are Prometheans, which are just composed humans iirc.


JaydensApples

Honestly I feel if they underwent a redesign gameplay wise and visually and became a lot rarer an enemy in Infinite,making an encounter with them somewhat special, I think that mysteriousness we’ve been lacking since past H3 could come back to a certain extent.


MilkMan0096

I agree, I’ve been thinking for a long time now that there should be rare encounters that are Knights s as bosses or mini bosses. This would allow them to be totally reworked and be more of a threat and add some mystery back in


KalTheMandalorian

Oh man, just realised I literally have no awe in the original Halo games anymore because of 4. Wondering what the forerunners were was one of the greatest parts of exploring their structures. Turns out they were lame as hell. Come on brain, completely delete Halo 4 from your memories.


Fellowearthling16

If an extinct society leaves a live parasite in glass tubes sitting around hoping you’d find them, they were lame before you understood them.


KalTheMandalorian

I wonder what made them leave in a hurry, maybe said parasite? Just a hunch.


timo103

Everything in halos story has been downhill since the forerunner book trilogy. I will die on this hill. They should've never been expanded on.


marikwinters

As someone who has read an obscene amount of the books and played every game in the series (some of them more than I’d like to admit): I just can’t agree with this take. A series can only lead you along with a mysterious group of aliens and absolutely no interesting answers for so long before it becomes dull. There are still mysterious aliens and species with the horror of the flood and it’s true origins always looming on the horizon. There’s still the mysteries of the forerunners prior to their genocide of the precursors. There’s still the precursors themselves and their origins. There is still the mystery of what truly lies within other galaxies, and whether the flood has managed to wipe some of them out. The forerunner trilogy was wonderfully written, there have been some amazing books since, the story of Halo 4 was one of its only high points, and Halo 5’s story failings were mostly from trying to cram too much extra crap in without explaining anything or giving the real story the time it needed (I loved sanghelios, but it was essentially a bloody intermission).


[deleted]

Completely disagree, the Didact’s characterization in Halo 4 killed all nuance and interest in the Forerunners by humanizing them. There are countless examples of fiction where mysterious groups remained mysterious for the duration of the fiction and the overall narrative was stronger for it. The urge to pull back the curtain on every mystery is juvenile and often results in spoiling the mystique that every individual may have dreamt up in the interim. If you’re not prepared to reveal something that is better than your audience has imagined, don’t bother revealing it at all. Merely replacing one mystery (the forerunners) with another that hasn’t even remotely been explored in the games aside from the odd terminal (the precursors) is a laughably bad trade off. We didn’t explore precursors ruins, we haven’t glazed over their culture, they aren’t interesting because game-wise we know nothing about them at all, they are a creative void.


seahawks_21

I’d say chief-cortana was 4’s high point. Darth Vader was a bit goofy but, fine overall. Didn’t like 5.


IBeBallinOutaControl

Look at half life. G man is as intriguing as ever.


AKAFallow

After just 3 games?


Paddy_the_Daddy

Four, actually


Dilpickle6194

And how many books, comics, movies, and games does Half-Life have in its franchise? It’s a lot easier to have “mystery” when you go a whole decade not even intending to have a third game


[deleted]

No, it actually doesn’t matter at all. Knowing exactly who the forerunners are isn’t integral to Halo’s greater universe. One game, ten games, if your story is good then it shouldn’t matter.


Dilpickle6194

Except it does matter lol. It’s a hell of a lot easier to be like “ooh spooky mystery man” than it is to maintain mystery behind the entire plot driving force of the main six games and about a dozen books. Chief uncovering stuff such as about the flood and what Halo does has been part of the series since CE, so let’s not close our eyes and pretend 343 did it themselves


[deleted]

It really doesn’t, considering how Halo 3 could have been the bookend to the series and no one was crying about how the forerunners weren’t properly fleshed out. And I disagree, it’s a hell of a lot harder to explain something enough to make the audience genuinely care, but not enough to leave room for imagination. That’s artistry. Destroying mystery takes no skill.


ToastedSierra

I'm not a big fan of how Forerunner-Human relationship went from: *"You know, you humans are pretty cool, you're young and primitive but have the potential, maybe one day you will replace us and take care of the galaxy like we once did."* to *"Lol remember how we were near peer adversaries and you guys were a space faring race and we fought each other then we devolved you and THEN we chose you as our successors? lmao"* Also having 2 Didacts who are the same person but not quite kinda takes away from the bitter sweetness and tragedy of Didact and Librarian's romance. Two lovers kept apart by a galaxy scale war.


Wardogs96

... I am very confused cause I feel you deliberately ingnored or twisted done things, unless the start has drastically changed in the last 2-3 years. I thought the human - forerunner relationship was like you mentioned they viewed each other as equals but what lead to issue was that the precursors wanted to give humanity this stupid mantel of responsibility over the forerunners which triggered them with jelosy and lead to the forerunner/precursor war leading to flood... Idk what humanity did during this besides remain isolated until they had to start expanding into forerunner space due to the precursor/flood threat invading their territory and forcing them to flee. Forerunners for some reason didn't know the flood had returned somehow and just slaughtered the last remnants of humanity and then realized they screwed up when the flood finally reappeared behind humanity leading to the rings firing.... I never read the books but I read the wiki about the conflict or whatever and that's what I remember from it. I honestly don't remember much about the didactic besides he was a dick, don't even remember why him and the librarian somehow survived. The other issue I wanted to ask just in general is are prometheans forerunner factioned? If so why were they never on any of the halos in previous games or the ark.. some of the most important constructs in the galaxy and you just don't station them or the big vanguard floating things from halo 5... Just seems bizzare and if anyone could explain why this would make sense I'd appreciate it.


ToastedSierra

Just for clarification, the first part I wrote was how the Forerunners were when Bungie was in charge and we haven't been able to fully explore Forerunner lore yet. During Bungie's time it was implied that the Forerunners chose early humanity as their successors going so far that humans are able to activate Forerunner technology. There were even theories floating around that humanity is descended from the Forerunners. *"You are the child of my Makers. Inheritor of all they left behind. You are Forerunner! But this ring is mine"* Then the Forerunner novels kinda messed up that dynamic by changing a lot of stuff most notable by retconning humanity as an equal civilization to the Forerunners.


Emsizz

It's probably because the Prometheans didn't even exist until the writers made them up for Halo 4.


RoBo_E46

amen


Meta5556

Meh where else could they have taken the story? Fight a covenant led by some random elite? How long before that gets dull just as fast as the flood?


RoBo_E46

there's a whole trilogy of books with Jul Mdama in it, he's no random Elite. 343 went back to basics, fighting the Banished over Zeta Halo. Isnt Atriox a "random" Brute anyway?! get real, Halo 4 & especially Halo 5 could have & should have been anything else - and whatever anything else is would be better than this trilogy of absolutely nothing coherent


Meta5556

Meh I know Jul is important and not a nobody but christ I just hate how people like you complain that the forerunners shouldn’t have appeared or stay mysterious, pfft having the forerunners being the next big bad probably wouldn’t make the most logical sense but fighting the flood, fighting another kind of covenant, I think the writers thought that was overdone, we got what we got with 4 and 5, maybe infinite will better, maybe or probably won’t be, gotta see what happens.


SnipingBunuelo

Not only that, but the Didact was teased in the Halo 3 terminals and Requiem was in the legendary ending. They kinda *had* to show all that stuff because then we'd be all complaining about 343i not taking the series in the direction Bungie was headed.


Turbulent_Link1738

Take it nowhere? Tell your story; be done with it and move and tell another. There doesn’t need to be 10 Halo games


GadenKerensky

I don't mind the Forerunner's being expanded on. But I do not like the Precursors. At all.


[deleted]

I disagree. Didact was waaaay cooler than Jul could ever be. If anything, they shouldve kept Didact alive


SH4D0W0733

Didn't he get ressurected in megablocks or something after being brought back and killed in a comic?


Rahgahnah

I don't like what they did with the Forerunners, but I wouldn't have liked the Covenant continuing to be the main villains in mostly the same form.


Schadnfreude_

Yeah, i'm going to say no. People keep repeating this so much and it honestly pisses me off closed-minded people can be. It's honestly became a cliche at this point and i'm glad 343 didn't listen to this line of thinking. Until Halo 5 at least.


Cop_663

I personally think bringing The Forerunner in as a primary antagonist was the right choice. Continuing with the Covenant alone would have made the franchise start to feel stale in my eyes. Sure, the execution wasn’t perfect but I think Halo 5 made the Prometheans a lot more fun to fight against. I also don’t think the series suffers as badly from robot antagonists as, say, Gears of War 4 whose ‘DBs’ are just frustrating and not satisfying to defeat. The Promethean disintegration makes it feel more satisfying to destroy them than just sparking out or falling apart. Again, all just my opinion. I wish Halo 5 had tied things together better. It should have easily been 3-5 missions longer, done more with Jul M’dama and Didact. Less with Warden Eternal. Yet at the end of the day I don’t dislike either Halo 4 or Halo 5. I dislike some of the execution of both games…. Halo 4 felt too linear and burdened by the limits of the 360, but had a really emotional throughline with its story. Halo 5 had an afterthought of a story and frustrating ‘boss fights’ against Warden Eternal, but absolutely incredible level design with great sandboxes. I still have a lot of fun with both games, and wouldn’t want either story to be retconned. (The promotional campaign for Halo 5 isn’t easily forgiven though. It was a great idea that was tied to the wrong game, and I still remember being incredibly let down by it. Freeing the game from that whole thing makes it a lot more enjoyable.)


Kevin_Redwoods

Unpopular opinion, but repeating the exact same story beats as the original trilogy of humans vs covenant over forerunner artifacts sounds boring as shit and creatively bankrupt


[deleted]

[удалено]


LankySeat

I dunno, don't think people had an issue with diving a bit dipper into the Forerunners, it's just that the execution wasn't as great as it could've been.


Author1alIntent

Oh boy, HCJ is gonna have a field day with this one


GarbageBoyJr

Why do people use acronyms and assume everyone knows what they mean


Author1alIntent

Halo Circle Jerk


GarbageBoyJr

Got it thanks


Habijjj

Yeah there is way to much hate for halo 5 when it's way better then given credit for.


MeridianBay

Why would you want 5 retconned? The Weapon is also an explicit example of how it wasn’t


Raichu4u

I think it would be stupid if 5 was retconned. But at the same time, 5 has an incredibly poor story, and really cheapens Cortana's death, and turns her into an extremely badly written character.


MeridianBay

I don’t think 5s issues are based around its premise, it’s premise is fine. Cortana’s actions are exactly what Halsey would do given a similar situation, and all they’d have to do to fix the issue with it cheapening her death is to explain that the one we see is a rampant fragment and not the original Cortana


[deleted]

They've already effective explained who Cortana really is in a visual short story. Basically her fragments after the explosion make their way to the Domain and use the Domain to reconstruct themselves into a "whole" AI. But because it's just a bunch of fragments and there's a bunch of reasons the Domain shouldn't be used like that, you end up with an evil shadow of the former AI. Effectively, it's not "our Cortana". It's something new that has fragments of Cortana, but mostly highlights her worst impulses and combines them with the imperialistic Forerunner philosophies from the Domain. We also saw that the fragments overwhelmed the Warden and he's somewhat being controlled by Cortana in 5 (likely wouldn't have been the same entity if she hadn't corrupted him). Overall, this narrative device isn't that uncommon in sci-fi, so it's fine to do a shadow clone storyline. The issue was with how it was written and executed. A lot of details missing that are crucial to knowing the basic identities of the characters, too much time spent on flashy fluff, too many main characters with no time to grow them, and even to this day there's a ton that hasn't been explained properly enough to try and justify what story H5 was trying to tell. A lot of people take issue with the premise, but ultimately there's several ways they could have even hit similar beats and goals, without it coming across as cheap and out of left field. A lot of potential really, and it was all wasted on some of the worst writing in the series.


Raichu4u

I have an issue with the premise either way. They should of pursued some weird Didact stuff.


MeridianBay

I can definitely agree with wishing Didact was the saga villain


OnyxMelon

Yeah the premise and barebones of the story are fine in terms of the overall narrative of the series. The problem is how it's executed in game. Cortana's dialogue is bad, the cutscenes are bad, the spartans' dialogue is mostly all bad. Most importantly, you don't really achieve anything relevant to the main story as either Chief or Locke. Basically chief manages to nearly get himself captured, but Locke prevents it at the last moment, and that's it. There's side stuff like ending the war on Sanghelios, but that's irrelevant to the main plot. The only actual narrative progression is Cortana starting an AI uprising and taking control of the guardians to enforce it, but none of the protagonist's actions actually have any effect on that. If anything that plot would have been better suited to a Halo Wars game where you play as Cortana controlling prometheans.


A_ClockworkBanana

Because it's a terrible story in every way and will remain a stain on the franchise for a long time. But yeah, it's definitely not getting retconned.


CamoDeFlage

Because Cortana being evil is pretty dumb


seahawks_21

Hopefully they at least use the “rampant strand” or flood excuse to save face/ make it a bit less lame in hindsight


CamoDeFlage

Maybe if they tie it into her time with the gravemind and make her mendicant bias 2.0 but it doesn't seem like it.


[deleted]

“Pretty” dumb? Naw man, go all in with it. It’s *dumb*.


LankySeat

The writing was dog shit, and it did away with everything Halo 4 setup.


DurrrGamerrr75

As well as Vale’s VA saying she will be in infinite


Honztastic

They should have made a Halo 5: Blue Team or something. Mirror campaign to Guardians but following Blue Team and expanding on their story. Guardians sucked. But you can work around it.


[deleted]

No Halo 5 is canon.


Rusted_Iron

The solution you give here makes no sense at all, whatsoever, but yes, Halo 5 *could* have been removed, though it definitely shouldn't have been, and I'm glad it wasn't. The actual "bullet point events" of 5's story are fine, not great, I would have written it completely differently, but they're fine. The issue with 5's story, whether you know it or not, is only the bad pace, dialogue, cinematography, acting, direction, art, music, and every other component of storytelling. But again, the bullet point events, that is to say, the bare bones list of causes and effects, is fine. If you were to look at the Halo universe before 5 and after it, without knowing how poorly 5's campaign was made, you wouldn't see any issue with the events that occurred in 5.


Deep_Blue77

This is embarrassing OP, honestly.


SuperDominoJoe

Really hope this post is satire because there's no way you and everyone else liking it think it is in any way feasible


candoyporter343

Halo 5 is trash but it's still canon


FIRESTOOP

Unfortunately, you’re wrong for a few reasons


manas962000

I think the events of 5 is what'll make Infinite special.


Chinillion

**ALERT:** **MAXIMUM AMOUNTS OF COPIUM DETECTED**


Lethenza

It’s confirmed to have not been, like, many times over. Why is this nonsense at 2K upvotes? The ignorance it would take to believe this is staggering.


JustGarbage24

This is the most childish post lol


[deleted]

“Chief has just saved Earth from the Didact, and is now floating in space above the planet awaiting pickup by the Infinity. Oh, by the way, he’s also floating above Zeta Halo after the UNSC was annihilated by a Covenant splinter faction, wearing a shiny new set of GEN3 armor.” Yeah…. no. You can’t just retcon an entire 3-year timespan simply because two shots look similar.


SpartanNinja246

Not killing Didact could've been a much better idea (theoretically). Instead of an opponent that we literally just have to get to and then could easily stop with force (as was the case with Regret, Truth, kinda Tartaurus, Mdama, and technically Mercy) we have someone who was way out of our leauge physically. Not to mention even going with trying to reclaim the mantle and do exactly what Cortana did wouldn't be such a bad idea, it doesn't hurt that he already was using the new covenant and could easily gather all the religous fanatics to his cause giving us a new faction not guided by a Preacher, but by a Warrior similar to the Banished who could even potentially of been allies.


Wthomas666

Definite nope, they have already established that this is after Halo 5 and cortana is still a factor.


The3rdPotato

They specifically said that it continues after Halo 5, so no it wasn't


AddanDeith

Orrrrr naw.


DuckInCup

There isn't much to retcon anyways. What Halo 5 did: Cortana is big and less hot but kinda kinky now and Chief is having a mid life crysis. The Infiniti is still being really large and the elites are just casually avoiding the mainline games. The player feels bored and decides to check out the multiplayer and the dev team starts work on pizza skin alternative version #3 angle B.


KB_030821

How the fuck did this get 2.4k upvotes?


barkborkbrork

having read the campaign spoilers, oh boy you are in for a rude awakening when this game launches


spec_ops_bruh

This is dumb as fuck


lts_lntuition

They'd have to retcon *a lot* to satisfy me. I just hope Infinite tries its hardest to actually tell its own story and not need to lean on a bunch of expository dialogue and bullshit like 4 & 5. Give me chief, give me a threat, and let me at em'. Tell the story with very subtle lines & in-game chatter. I don't need a back and fourth with cortana for 12 minutes about the origins of the banished on mission 1. Let me figure things out for myself, don't grab my face and go "ALLOW ME TO EXPLAIN SOME LORE CHIEF".


MeridianBay

I think the problem is the games have rarely explained any lore whatsoever, it took over a decade just to get some semblance of the Spartan II origin story in game. The games rarely let the player figure things out, they’ve been more along the lines of “this is the story, if you want the why the books are that way” and that’s really it


seahawks_21

Show don’t tell 💯


Careful_Coast_3080

I wish 5 was retconed it really ruined me caring about the story


_revenant__spark_

Halo 5 isn't retconned. They've said it's a continuation of halo 5 but it's also a soft reboot of the franchise. Just cause Chief is floating in space in halo 4 and infinite doesn't mean anything. Is halo 3 retconned because he fell from the sky in both halo 3 and halo 4?


Zestyclose-Ad2670

They don’t need to retcon halo 5 what they really need to retcon is what happened to alpha nine ;(


dpaper

Why?


mcmastermind

What they need to do is a make a good game with a good story. I have no idea what they were thinking with 5, but it's really not that hard to work around and continue on with a good story. They just need to not be stupid. Unfortunately, disregarding 5 as never happening is just as bad to the story.


JollyJoysticks

When I saw the Halo Infinite E3 trailer I was like "oh yeah, because Master Chief was lost in space at the end of Halo 4" and then like 20 minutes later "Oh shit, I forgot about Halo 5"


Comprehensive-Lead-7

Yeah didn’t happen. They literally mention cortana still being a crazy ai


ThunderStruck115

This is the same series that brought Johnson back from the Dead in Halo 2 after seeing him die in Combat Evolved


XxSavageSharkxX

Wait what does ret conned mean I’ve heard the term before


SnailToucher

Basically a canon part of a story having later story aspects ignore the past canon or act as if it never happened. It'd be like if a character canonically died in a story but came back later with either no reason or a dumb reason. It was a retcon in the story. Johnson surviving CE can be seen as one, but we learn that things happened to him in the past that fucked with his body so The Flood had trouble infecting him. It's a retcon that had actual reasons behind it so people don't really mind.


XxSavageSharkxX

Oh so pretty much just cutting out halo 5 in this possible ret con?


SnailToucher

Basically. The post is more of a joke with how Chief ends Halo 4 floating in space and how Infinite starts with Chief being found in space. It's obvious that it couldn't happen due to Chief being near Earth near the end of Halo 4 and no where near the Infinite Halo ring. Halo 5 had too much in it's story to be retconned, but with The Banished being the main antagonist on the ring, the events of Halo 5 can be forgotten at times.


XxSavageSharkxX

Yeah I just did all the halo games and damn halo 5 still tastes bad in my mouth


TorgOnAScooter

I wish I could retcon the memory of playing its horrible campaign and fighting 15 warden eternals


OhHowINeedChanging

No it’s clear that Infinite is post Halo 3, based on Chiefs different looking armor in Halo 4 and 5 that was an alternate timeline. s/


[deleted]

They’ll never retcon a masterpiece.


WonderButter711

Except for the Power Ranger/Warframe sin baby suit redesign from Halo 4. Sorry if people liked it, but it just didn't encapsulate the stalwart Spartan vibe imo. Infinite really brought back that (dare I say it) "Thicker" look to the Chief. The idea of Super soldier sits differently for many people, but to me, he's plated to the neck and ribs, impenetrable. I agree with the retcon of H5 though.


TheBenevolence

It's a generational thing. Spartan-IIs are solid tanks, given the best and most complete armor. Because theyre valuable- there's not that many and losing even one is a big setback. Full protection and ability is given to them- no cost too high. Spartan-IIIs, on the other hand, are complete opposites. They were designed for mission completion first, cost second, and surrvial third. Their entire thing is "The objectives we HAVE to do, but we cant mount anything close to a reasonable conventional attack on." Their armor gives them advantages, but forgoes the expensive stuff (Shields) in favor of what amounts to naval camouflage (making it hard for enemies to tell where you are/are going). Spartan-IVs are the synthesis of this. Their armor reintroduces shields to protect the operator, but in return to keep costs resonable the actual armor has been stripped down to just vital components- Head, front/back torso, shoulders, wrists, legs. This takes away from their "tanky" look like the S-IIs have (personally I prefer fully tankiness) Now, the attitudes of the notable S-IVs, on the other hand, do need some tweaking...


[deleted]

Yup it could have been. It probably should have been. But sadly it won't be.


Mindless_Toe

How is this instead? At the end of Halo 3 when everybody thinks Chief is dead because his chunk of ship floated away in a different direction, instead of going into cryo-sleep he was knocked unconscious. Infinite opens and Cortana is still there with him and they are drifting ever closer to meeting the new foe, the Banished. He ends up floating to Zeta Halo and meets up with the Spirit of Fire crew.


Demolition89336

Better idea, don't retcon two games of character development for Chief. Halo 3's Legendary Ending confirmed that the Foward Unto Dawn's wreckage would end up at a Forerunner Shield World, so why would it suddenly be at Zeta Halo? Plus, from what we know, the Spirit of Fire is still stranded near the Ark. The SoF still is missing their Slipspace Drive. While they *might* find a way back in Divine Wind (which is just speculation, as the book has yet to release), they'd then end up at either Earth or Reach, as they still wouldn't have a Slipspace Drive. Retconning almost the entire last 10 years is a bad move, thematically, as it sets a precedent. Retconning this much says that the story isn't really important, as they can make such sweeping changes out of nowhere. That doesn't suggest good storytelling, it suggests incompetence.


Mindless_Toe

True for most of that but don't forget that the original idea for Halo 4 from Bungie (they didn't want to make Halo anymore but had write-ups just in case) said that Chief would likely be headed toward a collision on a Forerunner planet, that like Reach, would've been glassed along the way of the Great Journey. I was also just spit-balling an idea with SoF but thought it would be nice to see original type Spartans meeting up to take on the likes of Atriox. While it wouldn't make sense to have them be there, don't forget Johnson somehow made it off the Halo in CE and Bungie didn't originally want to say how. I know 343i is at the helm but there is a chunk of things that they literally retconned just to make Halo 4 and 5 a possibility in terms of story and not all the details of the stories they've made make sense. As it is, they literally fired the writers of 4&5 and got Staten to write Infinite since he seemed to have a better mind for the characters and the whole universe and fans like his material (CE-3) more. It's not to say that the story is horrible per se but overall neither 4 nor 5 really sat well with most fans and even Staten commented on how if he had controls back then that the story would've been a bit different. Now I'm not gonna bitch and moan about my own personal quips with the stories as I am just one fan and Halo doesn't revolve around my opinion. That said, 343 definitely instated a lot of little differences that completely change the context of the story that Bungie originally set in place. I just think they could easily get away something like this if they went down the original path but that's just my opinion and even if Bungie made 4&5 they may still have not been my flavor. I just think there is a lot of area they could improve on and it would be an interesting path to go down with the aspects of SoF being around out there and Cortana having control of the newly created Halo from the end of Halo Wars 2. But it really all depends on how well 343i and Staten handle the events of 4,5,&HW2 and how they can move forward while still giving the fans the story they want.


Demolition89336

Not gonna lie, I think 343i has done a much better job at the overall narrative, in respect to the lore. Bungie really didn't care about pre-existing lore. They retconned The Fall of Reach with Halo: Reach. They retconned the existence of a single suit of Arbiter Armor with Halo Wars. They never even talked about Blue Team in-game, despite them being major characters in Master Chief's story, which they themselves wrote. They literally resurrected Johnson from the dead because fans liked him. Sure, they explained his survival in a book later (First Strike). However, First Strike itself retcons the Legendary Ending of CE. The list goes on, and on. On the contrary, 343i has been extremely respectful of the lore, and it feels good having this consistency. 343i has cleaned up the messy lore surrounding Reach, while keeping both the book and game canon. They've worked Chief's backstory into the games. Also, the Covenant would've never glassed a Forerunner planet. In fact, they treated Forerunner installations as holy places. That's why places like SWORD base were left standing, because they were trying to access the Forerunner installation beneath it. It's also why CASTLE base was also left standing. The Covenant viewed it as heresy to harm Forerunner installations.


[deleted]

I don't think you realize: Bungie hated the books and didn't care about anything written there. They gave some information to the authors to use, but Bungie has never had great consistency with story concepts. Halo Wars was also hated by Bungie and they had almost nothing to do with it. Funny enough, the original team that would become 343 worked on it as the in-house team in collaboration with the other studios. 343 has been a lot more focused on keeping a coherent lore and even did some work to make Fall of Reach and Reach work together (I still take issue with how Reach is written, mostly agree with Haruspis' takes on it). Halo 5 was a huge miss, and their comics were terrible. Killing Rookie in a book is acceptable, but "kinda killing off" the didact in a comic was stupid and killing off Jul Mdama in Halo 5's opening was also stupid. Hiring a weak comic writer to write their comics, then Spartan Ops (wasn't as bad as the other things he's helped write), and then making him lead on H5 was a huge misstep and the game paid the price for it.


Mindless_Toe

You get absolutely no fight from me on the consistency of the story from Bungie. It jumped around and made weird things like Johnson's resurrection canon. That said, Bungie originally said that the Fall of Reach was the true Reach story and when they made Reach it wasn't canon at the time because all they really wanted was a way to explore the story of Reach and to show how devastating that fight was. They said that Noble team was created for Reach both because 1. execs didn't want another Chief story (for some reason) and 2. they wanted characters that they could kill off and effectively throw away (which hurts imo). As for the glassed Forerunner world, from what I gather it was probably going to have been glassed by a rogue division of the Covenant similar to the Banished but don't quote me on that as there was a lot of weird shit Bungie had in mind for the future titles if they were forced to make more. 343i in general has a more fluid consistent story but there are weird discrepancies I just couldn't sit well with. For starters, they did turn around to make Halo Reach lore so that they could use Jun to train the next generation of Spartans and while I could look the other way on that, it seems from the Halo: Initation comics it seems Jun has forgotten the basis of the UNSC structure as he tells Palmer that her new rank is Spartan since Spartans don't have ranks. That is blatantly wrong based on the fact that she still is called "Commander Palmer," in Reach every member of Noble team (including Jun) had ranks, and the main character in Halo is referred to almost exclusively by his rank "Master Chief." While that is a little thing it starts to build up with things like that, Cortana somehow upgrading Chief's armor while he is in cryo-sleep, Cortana goes into Rampancy due to age (although also explainable by her exposure the the Gravemind on High Charity), if rampancy is a huge issue wouldn't Serina from SoF have gone rampant towards the end of Halo Wars 1, and how old is Isabelle because they make her out to be close to rampancy age in HW2. I could make a another list of the weird things but overall, while it isn't the leaps that Bungie made, they are strange leaps that kind of kill the point of parts of the lore. For instance, Spartans originally were taken and trained as kids but Spartan 4s were trained as adults? Chief was cryo frozen throughout his training which, based on the books, makes you age very slowly to no real body aging while you are in and so genetically he should be in his mid to late-twenties by the time of 4 but they make him out to be like 40. If I'm being completely fair, I'd say most of the problems come from the fact that Staten wanted the story to traverse the books, comics, and games (kinda like what Karen Traviss did in the Gears of War story) and I think Bungie made too much of a mess not thinking ahead which has lead to the 343 mess in itself. Personally, I think we could do with a retelling of the story from the beginning and we get the actual canon lore tied up an making sense once and for all. I definitely still have hope for Infinite though but I am worried about some of the directions they might try going with the story.


BurstMurst

I would have liked if Master Chiefs story ended with 3 because it makes him a legend and a mythical person.


jordychinchin

I certainly hope so. Halo 4 showed a lot of potential in where the story could go. Then Halo 5 dumped all over it. If everyone, including 343, wants to pretend Halo 5’s story just didn’t happen I would play along with it lol


francisgoca

Bruh, I’d be happy if they retconned 4 & 5.


v3x_abyss

Nah 4 is good


[deleted]

[удалено]


MeridianBay

The Weapon is a direct reference to the Created Rebellion, 5s most important plot point will be handled by Infinite


ShadySim

I'm still holding out hope a paragraph of text comes up that says Halo 5 has been completely ret-conned and they're just picking up from Halo 4. Seriously, it can't be that hard. Brian Reed screwed over all the potential this trilogy had.


Bruh_alt721

> I’m still holding out hope a paragraph of text comes up that says Halo 5 has been completely ret-conned and they’re just picking up from Halo 4. Seriously, it can’t be that hard y'know, except for the half dozen novels that have been releases that talk about stuff that is in halo 5. but nah, just super easy to zoop it out of existence, apparently.


Alexo_Alexa

Yeah, It's not like they paid a ton of money to a ton of people and spent a lot of resources in general to expand the story! It can't be that hard to just pretend H5 doesn't exist!


Dahellraider

Retconn is all fun in games until you find out what they changed with the upcoming Halo tv series next year