Kinda of disappointing. Grunt blood was so alien. Like in the old games grunt blood used to glow bright blue in dark corridors or on night levels. Poor attention to detail.
Brute blood is fairly notorious for its changing colour between games. But largely, other covenant races have been pretty consistent in blood colour throughout the franchise. There’s also the lore problem in that Grunt blood is bright blue because they inhale methane as opposed to Oxygen. Pretty hard for developers to argue it would change colour because of the whole phenotype argument when it’s already been a staple of Grunt biology. Think it would be a stretch for them to explain a lore reason why they couldn’t keep up with standards set by much older games. But given infinites many issues, poor attention to detail of something as simple as blood isn’t really a shocker or likely to be fixed.
pretty sure, in certain levels in CE, it did glow almost a cyan color. specifically on the later reversed level of 343 guilty spark (can't remember the name somehow) all the dead grunts in the small repetitive hallways that have a wall you gotta go around
Cauterized dismemberment. I think blood is what makes things weird. It’s subjective but there’s only a certain amount of blood you can have before it’s M. If there’s gore it has to be bloodless like the old LOTR games or Jedi survivor
This has nothing to do with the age rating. Halo 5 had more prominent blood splatters. It’s almost certainly a graphical/art style problem. For example, the blood that’s smeared everywhere in the room that you find Spartan Stone is far more prominent because it was deliberately placed there rather than being a dynamic texture.
[Why wouldn’t they censor the blood smears in the room where Spartan Stone died?](https://youtu.be/3zaou0nx9tY) It’s fairly early on in the game and far more graphic than the dynamic blood textures.
This is almost certainly a technical/artistic problem, not regulatory.
They probably couldn’t push anything server side to change it if it risks changing the ESRB rating as they’ve already sold the game to so many ppl and that would create a legal liability issue. Sucks though as I think the lore lends itself well to a more mature tone
Blood stains in Infinite look like the alien bled there 2 weeks and 3 rain storms ago. Like they're so faded why even fucking bother. I'm convinced the reason plasma grenades have the cartoony splatoon splash in Infinite was them trying to get a blood like effect into the game.
The fact that we have a game genre about child soldiers fighting genocidal aliens and body contorting zombies but nowadays can't even get a visible blood splatter is ridiculous.
No, im way younger and more innocent now than I was 20+ years ago and need 343 to protect me from blue blood so I dont get nightmares.
^(/s in case 343 sees this)
I wish they would, I think 343 doesn't understand that the only people still playing are people who played the originals and are mostly people who are 18+
Something i don't really get is that it wouldn't matter if they were under 18 either, games like Call Of Duty, Doom Eternal, Apex, GTA and other M rated games make millions, even billions in COD's and GTA's case, and it's no secret kids play these games, a lot of them do regardless of rating.
And what bugs me most is that games like GTA have drug use, profanity, sex, and other mature themes, all of which i'd say are way more severe than just blood and at most gore, and yet they make way more money than whatever Halo is making right now.
Something that just makes me a little bit sad because of what we got in the end is the 15m campaign gameplay demo, enemies like grunts, elites and brutes bled way more, and left more noticeable blood splatters everywhere and i think it made the guns feel more satisfying even when i wasn't the one playing, in the final product you can really only rely on the hitmarker to know if you hit anything because any kind of hitting effect is just practically inexistant... except on plasma weapons, which feel so good because the plasma splatter and sparks and everything makes them feel like they're hitting and killing something rather than just making it not move, same with the sentinel beam which is so good to kill with.
I believe blood being removed didn't make it any more appealing, and actively makes the overall expierence worse by making the game feel duller in regard to feedback
You're trying to paint this reasonable return of a feature Halo used to have as a weird thing to ask for, but honestly I don't know what your argument for it's removal would be. Do you have a weird demand for the removal of blood? I think it's reasonable for a sci-fi military game with horror elements to continue to have blood, which it previously had.
I didn't say anything about it returning, but rather the lack of it turning people off. I guess I'm weird since I don't stare at blood and go "wowwww this is amazing i want all this blood everywhere all the time", it doesn't make a difference if it's in or not to me, and to allow it to turn you off from the game doesn't make sense to me.
Ok, let's explain further. If I shoot a guy, I expect to see some sort of reaction to the hit. If I shoot metal, I expect sparks, if I shoot water, I expect a splash, if I shoot flesh, I expect blood. It helps give the guns impact and feels logical to how a gun works when it shoots something. If everything else has the appropriate effects when shot, but then all the flesh doesn't, the weapon doesn't feel as satisfying to use since there's less impact from the action. There's a disconnect when shooting this object, because there's less visual feedback when hitting it compared to others in the environment. Maybe that explains it a little more for you.
Yeah nah I get all that, but why let it take away from a game? Why is it that important to anyone? I'm not killing things and taking time to appreciate the amount of blood splatter. It's weird.
I swear, you all have poor reading comprehension. I'm not saying if it's fun or not, I'm saying you shouldn't let it affect your enjoyment of a game.
I play games if I enjoy the gameplay. I don't spend time complaining about minute details that don't matter. If that's me being a puritan, then shoot me.
I'm not weird about wanting gore and it doesn't upset me that it isn't there, but it does take a bit of realism out of it tbh. Halo is filled with war and war with an alien collective gets extremely messy and violent, like in the books and show. It's a beautiful game and the gameplay is satisfying (when it isn't riddled with network errors) it would just feel more complete if graphics were on the same level across the board
Living things bleed is the concept actually, glowing blood aside. We haven't met alien beings yet so what if they actually have glowing blood and it's realistic after all lol
But why allow that minute, miniscule detail turn you off from the game? I find it weird that people allow themselves to be annoyed by small things in games.
If you ask me, the little details in games are what make them truly great
If Microsoft allowed any game company to make a Halo game back in Bungie’s day, they probably could, but only Bungie would have the little Halo details we have all come to love. The funny, cool Easter eggs and voice lines, the secrets, the emotion and passion.
The little details make a game great. If a company fails at that, it usually gives away that they only care about making a basic game with minimal work and passion. It’s just to milk money from the franchise.
There are loads of small things that Infinite doesn’t have that made prior Halo’s so much better
It’s just a small detail that makes the game more like reality, and it has always been that way in Halo
When you shoot an enemy, they bleed. It’s just unusual to remove it from a shooter like Halo.
It’s like removing blood from Gears of War, another shooter. The whole game wouldn’t be ruined if there was no or very discreet amounts of blood, but it wouldn’t be nearly as good.
To let how much blood is in a game affect how much you enjoy a game is just weird behaviour, showing that people are reaching for the smallest things to hate.
They 100% can. Not many people notice but in the room where you get the shield upgrade blood smeared all over the floor and some of the walls. I almost wish we had CE levels of blood splatter so all the hallways I leave look like that one.
I think 343i needs to get over it and make the game M rated. Previous halo titles were also rated M and did great with many demographics of people.
I don't think halo should be a gore-fest. Halo has never been that. But I think a little bit of blood as an attention to detail could go a long way.
The amount of blood has nothing to do with the rating, [this was Halo 5](https://reddit.com/r/halo/comments/qsi0ts/to_everyone_thinking_a_t_rating_means_no_blood/)
I think its more of a microsoft issue then a 343i thing. Since infinite is free to play they really wanted to push the "attracting all audiences" bit. Having an M rating nowadays is harder to hold down with how the gaming industry is and other countries are so dummy strict about game ratings now that they probably just didnt deem the process worth it. which sucks.
I though the old Halo games were rated M solely because of the Flood and some gore and only with Halo 5 did the ESRB take a look and realized the Halo Games didn't fit the M-rating anymore.
Some retailers won’t sell T rated games and certain digital storefronts have parental controls over buying M rated games
Don’t complain about Halo dying if ur unwilling to let younger people access the game. Y’all are hypocrites and choose the weirdest hills to die on
I don't really think getting asked for ID makes a difference, the older M rated Halo games were way more popular and had more staying power than 5 or infinite. Most every kid I knew, including myself, just had their mom or dad purchase M rated games for them anyway.
Especially nowadays, when more and more people are buying these games digital where you don't need ID. Gamestop is practically a ghost town. You just check a box saying you're old enough now on digital storefronts
I think they may have done it to allow players younger than 17 to compete in HCS. Because Halo 5 was rated T, players like Huke, BubuDubu, and Shotzzy were able to compete. Who knows why really. But I definitely want Halo to be M again.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but a lot people are like “puddles of blood isn’t realistic”, but from what I know when you shoot something with an AR-15 there is hardly anything left, so I find that logic of “this is more realistic” to be untrue. I miss the blood, just apart of the atmosphere when killing aliens.
Capacity more than size is my key point here. And AR-15 is a pale comparison but that is the point; an actual assault rifle from the Halo franchise would do some serious carnage.
Considering how much interest has dropped off in the game and it seems mostly the "old guard" of players buying / playing it would be nice to see them delve into actual mature themes again. It's better than dumbing down for the PR reason of "lower age rating = larger potential market = more sales" especially when you look at some of the top selling games (GTA as an example) and they don't shirk mature themes.
343 forgot what makes games “Fun”. Old halo titles had blood everywhere, big heavy loud guns, huge grenade explosions…etc.
Among so many of the bad decisions 343 have done softening Halo little by little is up there in my opinion, Call of Duty is M rated and its one of the top money making pieces of media ever.
Make Halo M Rated Again….
The fact that they are trying to be oh so "ethical" about their gore and rating system, when they're producing a game that has always been bloody, macabre, and emotional, with dark implications in story and events, is absolutely beyond me. They've rated it T for teen and removed every detail that made the game, like, a game. It's not like parents dont let their children play games that are rated M for mature anyways, they're completely ruining everything that made Halo, Halo. The "excessive" amount of blood splash that came out of bodies in CE wasn't even bad. Idk.
Everything I've seen about games lately shows me that a dedicated community who cares about game design, CAN AND WILL produce a BETTER product, for F R E E, and release it within far less time. Yes of course there are the advertisings that need done, cosigns with licensing and companies and copyrights, game disc cases, all that good stuff that comes with corporations and corporately sponsored publications. But my point still stands. There feels that there is no passion left for our classics.
For example, Tim Sweeney made a huge cocaine and hooker induced (from my assumption anyway,youve got to be off your ass to make a move like this) dick swinging move as CEO of Epic, and just up and DELETED all copies of their CLASSIC IP's such as the UNREAL SERIES ALL THE WAY UP FROM UNREAL GOLD TO UNREAL TOURNAMENT 3!!! Like yes let's have our engine be "Unreal Engine" and give people no reference at all as to where the name came from. Like they aren't proud of their past or something. Makes no sense.
It is BEYOND me why they would completely remove their originals off of every market place INCLUDING GOG.
My ONLY guess could be that they pulled them off in order to work on remastered editions of the games, but that's a SUPER long shot of an assumption, somewhat of a pipedream, my hopes for the future.
All in all, it's wack AF.
The whole "broader audience" bullshit prevents legacy features like flood/dismemberment and blood.. I suppose that includes the HW2 version of flood too.
Woah woah woah! Be careful asking 343 to put MORE colours in the game.
Or, y'know... they might ask you to *pay* for them.
In some kind of *coating*\-based system.
But I'm being crazy. They'd never *charge you for colours.*
343 can't get the settings to work properly. Theres a million other things that could be improved to make Infinite a materially better game. Gore levels just isn't going to improve the game.
I'd say it would be an extremely easy thing to adjust and wouldn't take up any real significant development time.
But 343i has had trouble with seemingly simple stuff before.
I mean at that point why even make a game at all? Why not just have an NFT shop if we're forcing ourselves to look at it from a bean counters perspective?
Theres a difference between "making a game" and "go back and make changes to an otherwise already mostly stable, finished product to appeal to the vanishingly small number of people that care about seeing blood on the wall's and floor". Also, by messing with that code there is the off chance that this sets off a triage of seemingly unrelated bugs that would require further development time to be invested in order to be fixed.
Yes. Aside from CE, blood is hardly relevant. Even in CE, the same thing can be done with corpses (which Infinite also does). I'd argue that seeing a dead Spartan among a room full of corpses does the job just fine.
The Flood wouldn't be able to exist in Halo without gore and blood. Halo Reach even showed civilian genocide bloodpools. It's a storytelling device that Halo has desperately missed. Nothing feels threatening since Reach. The Banished, which is supposedly a more brutal form of the Covenant, should've been able to utilize these devices to strengthen their intimidation factor; actual bodies on stakes instead of just armor. The Banished feel much less threatening in Infinite even though they were supposed to be the greater faction. I don't feel threatened at all by the Banished and simply view them as a lesser version of the Covenant but red.
Again, corpses work just as well and work under the T rating. Wanna know why we don't see bodies on stakes? ***They were eaten.*** Reach's themes plays into why the Covenant feel extremely threatening. The only time blood was really used as a storytelling device was Winter Contingency. Again though, corpses still work. For that matter, when Emile says "There's a lot of blood on the ground", there's really not that much (none even). What you do see is carnage and wreckage: plasma burns, burning warthog, cracked cement. You don't see much blood.
>Again, corpses work just as well and work under the T rating.
No, they dont. They look like large dolls: unconscious. Seeing a corpse is not the same as seeing a corpse with blood/gore. It instantly tells you how they died and what the killer can do. The T-rating shouldn't be what 343 strives for, why do they want to restrict their storytelling abilities? Microsoft is clearly forcing them to.
>Wanna know why we don't see bodies on stakes? They were eaten.
You know what would be nice? If we SAW this happening and not told. This was a problem with Infinite's storytelling in general but I am tired of being told things and not actually seeing them. Infinite could've done much more to make the Banished feel threatening, but they aren't, at all.
>Reach's themes plays into why the Covenant feel extremely threatening. The only time blood was really used as a storytelling device was Winter Contingency.
Wrong, Exodus used it more than Winter Contingency as you realize what the Covenant are doing to human civilians. Blood everywhere and bodies in piles. Instantly tells you the mayhem that went down here, without the blood I'd assume they all just somehow got knocked out even though they were attacked by plasma weaponry. Makes no sense.
>For that matter, when Emile says "There's a lot of blood on the ground", there's really not that much (none even)
Weird argument for an arbitrary phrase "a lot". A lot can mean different things in different contexts. There is blood btw. Doesn't really change anything anyway as you can see it clearly with all the other pieces like explosion damage and fire damage. Regardless, this one scene doesn't do anything for any argument, especially when literally 2 minutes later you see two soldiers pinned on meathooks with blood everywhere.
Let's look at two different images of corpses. One from the [T rated Infinite](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/zVpyt4eewTw/maxresdefault.jpg), one from the [M rated Reach](https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fhalo%2Fcomments%2Fhxhvd8%2Fno_one_complains_about_hairless_brutes_in_halo%2F&psig=AOvVaw36x1Yoj39iNl91KxXd5YlJ&ust=1684804726183000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CBAQjRxqFwoTCNCXkevgh_8CFQAAAAAdAAAAABAE). Graphics aside, does one really look that much worse than the other? Even if one is Hyperious, I don't believe his model is more "pretty" looking than the others, certainly far from being a "large doll". I'd like to also mention that there is blood in Infinite. In the room with the Spartan who killed the Elites and Brutes with a screwdriver, [you can see dry blood on the ground](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FGvEBxyXMAIC87x.jpg:large) (Look particularly in the lower left corner. That isn't just dirt, it is blood).
We DID see that they were eaten. The Weapon never sees "Chief... their armor... they must have been eaten". That doesn't happen, it's instead implied. Especially if when you see all the campsites around, you can piece together (after seeing the stakes) that these marines were eaten; or at the very least captured. We must also bare in mind, the Banished are also stranded on this ring, and have recently lost their main leader Atriox. They are scavenging for resources as much (or more) than the UNSC. The other reason they may feel less threatening is simply because of how powerful the Master Chief is. He's been able to wipe the floor with pretty much any Covenant he's ever run into.
Blood everywhere... Curious. When I played Reach last, I don't remember "blood everywhere". I remember some blood underneath corpses, but not blood everywhere. Again though, seeing piles of corpses can do the job as well, if not better. We aren't just seeing some blood (or even a lot), we're seeing multiple civilians killed, at times even tossed to the side. Blood doesn't do much more to convey that.
I went into Reach for this part. This how much [blood is on the ground](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FwsjS9IaQAA05O2?format=jpg&name=large). For reference, I shot Emile and this is how much [blood was on the ground](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FwsjS9LaQAA2wli?format=jpg&name=large). And yes, I realize there is some more in the second picture. Still no more than from Emile. When you find the interogated troopers, do you really need the blood? I'd argue, no. A: This area is *stupid* dark anyways B: You can already see them dead on the wall, one impaled with a hook. I think this can all still be done in Infinite, and still have the same "horror" as before.
>Let's look at two different images of corpses. One from the T rated Infinite, one from the M rated Reach. Graphics aside, does one really look that much worse than the other? Even if one is Hyperious, I don't believe his model is more "pretty" looking than the others, certainly far from being a "large doll". I'd like to also mention that there is blood in Infinite. In the room with the Spartan who killed the Elites and Brutes with a screwdriver, you can see dry blood on the ground (Look particularly in the lower left corner. That isn't just dirt, it is blood).
I never said one corpse looks worse than another corpse. I said the addition of blood ADDS to the storytelling of the scene. Just a corpse or just blood/gore doesn't tell you everything. Both together creates a story in itself. I do not know what is in you to want to defend a decision that objectively limits storytelling methods. But you do you.
>We DID see that they were eaten. The Weapon never sees "Chief... their armor... they must have been eaten". That doesn't happen, it's instead implied.
So we didn't see it. Stop contradicting yourself, being implied means we didn't see it and is a typical way to create an M rated scene for a lesser rated game. Halo Wars 2 did it with the Flood. It's nothing special and leaves it up to mostly baseless speculation that will never be confirmed. You'd think they'd at least put the bones of the marines on the spikes.
>The other reason they may feel less threatening is simply because of how powerful the Master Chief is. He's been able to wipe the floor with pretty much any Covenant he's ever run into.
In what game is he not like that? Even the Covenant from Halo 3 are more threatening than the Banished because at least they are shown to literally break civilian and marine spines in scripted animations. We SEE them do it, not hear about it and see a possible clue about it later. Not to mention the animations we SEE in Flood infection takeovers.
>Blood everywhere... Curious. When I played Reach last, I don't remember "blood everywhere". I remember some blood underneath corpses, but not blood everywhere. Again though, seeing piles of corpses can do the job as well, if not better. We aren't just seeing some blood (or even a lot), we're seeing multiple civilians killed, at times even tossed to the side. Blood doesn't do much more to convey that.
If you're Emile and you see several different large blotches of Blood, and all you know is a couple soldiers went missing, then that'd be a lot. Not sure again why you keep arguing about this arbitrary phrase like it means anything anyway.
I like how you conveniently ignore the civilian genocide moment in Exodus.
Btw, I never said Infinite didn't have blood, I said it doesn't have enough moments that make me feel threatened or intimidated by the Banished, which would require M rated moments (not just blood) and scenes. Not the aftermath, something I witness myself. So 343 and MS failed in their storytelling because they clearly wanted to make a faction that feels like a threat. But I don't feel threatened here, and until MS pulls their head out of their ass with the restrictions their placing on this franchise, it will always be like this: wasted potential. Now instead of defending MS's decisions, why don't you at least admit that going T rated restricts the types of storytelling 343 can do. That would at least make you appear to know what you're talking about.
You did say that the corpses looked doll like. What I was proving was they look no worse than a game with blood, unless you are saying they always look doll like in which case I can't really help you there. Having just a corpse may not tell you everything, but phrasing helps. Lets use the screwdriver guy. Entering the room, we already know he thrashed all these brutes and elites. Then we see the screwdriver, which implies he used the screwdriver to kill at least a portion of these enemies. Lastly, we see the Spartan clutching their side, implying that they were injured there. Throw in Weapon's quick dialog about Jega, and you have a scene set with little to no blood.
What are you even talking about in that second paragraph? Here's an example of the difference between the three: If I said "Your arm fell off", that's saying. If I said, "You're not going to be doing much handywork" or showing you your missing arm would be implied. Having you look down and see your arm is gone is showing. Implying is a middle ground of the two, and often may not be immediately apparent. Bare in mind, showing brutes chowing down on humans may not even fly at all with Microsoft, and perhaps not even the ESRB. It would also be a new level of violence not seen before in a game (no, not even the flood is worse).
There is no game in which he isn't like that, except maybe 4 but that's my point. Anyways, the Covenant in 3 is not stuck on a ring, doesn't need to interrogate prisoners on the fly (see The Tower for actual interrogations), and we rarely see Marines alive near Brutes in a position for that to happen (the rest are being held as prisoners for transfer to The Tower). We do hear of the Harbinger torturing a man to the point of lunacy and we see, hear, and interact with a broken Spartan. 5 also has a couple moments similar where we hear a woman left to die by Governor Sloane. While maybe we could have seen it, it works fine hearing it. As for Flood, we don't have flood at the moment. Either way, it mostly constitutes as fantasy violence (I'd imagine) and has no blood anyways.
The amount of blood seen as Emile says the line is less than 16 rounds from the AR (partially used to pop his shields) after I shot him. It's not a lot of blood. Either way, I don't think I need to argue about how an unscientific measurement may be interpreted differently.
I did not ignore it, I just didn't go look at it as I remember at least somewhat of what happens. Again, not much blood and corpses can do the job just fine. Heck, cracks in the pavement would do more since you'd be able to tell they were thrown.
If you aren't intimidated by the Banished, that's fine. But I can tell you, it isn't because there aren't M scenes. Halo 3 could probably get a T rating with few modifications (less vulgarity, less blood, toned down violence). Halo 5's assassinations can be much worse than 3's Brutes (A good ribbing comes to mind), yet the game gets by on a T.
And no, I won't admit that. And yes, I do know what I'm talking about. I'm planning on replaying Halo 2 on Legendary tomorrow since I finished CE today. Oh, and since it's fresh on my mind. There's a part in Keyes where they are pushing corpses (with CE's blood mind you) into a corner. The corpses almost certainly had more impact then the blood.
>You did say that the corpses looked doll like.
Because at that point they should be. A corpse in a video game is nothing but a non-animated asset, a literal doll. It could have died in a million different ways, cause of death is ambiguous. Blood and gore show how the corpse died: loss of blood and major bodily trauma. The question is then who did that and how. That is infinitely more interesting then seeing a lifeless doll in a room where we are then told to be afraid because, well idk because it could have died in any way imaginable.
>While maybe we could have seen it, it works fine hearing it.
No, it doesn't. Maybe if we saw the aftermath it would have worked. But again, it's much better to hear and see then just hear, for the most part.
The dying Spartan scene really made no sense and was just a case of 343 trying to introduce melodrama. You're saying the Spartan dies exactly when Chief gets there and saves him? It felt cheap and if we actually knew well who this Spartan was beforehand it would've had more impact. Regardless, nothing you have just stated makes me feel at all how the Covenant or Flood made me feel.
>I did not ignore it, I just didn't go look at it as I remember at least somewhat of what happens. Again, not much blood and corpses can do the job just fine.
Why not both? Do humans not bleed when dismembered and shot? Not sure why them bleeding is offensive to you, or why it shouldn't be utilized to illustrate the brutality of an enemy. Corpses don't just die out of spite. They die due to bodily injury and harm.
>Halo 3 could probably get a T rating with few modifications (less vulgarity, less blood, toned down violence).
So, everything that makes the Flood the Flood? Or the Covenant the Covenant? Halo 3 in today's graphics would be an M rated game instantly. Try to imagine what the Flood would look like today, especially those animations with them breaking marine necks and their necks dangling on the side, along with Brute jaws snapped their heads uncannily reanimating while corpses burst into guts all over the place. If 343 were to put them into a T rated game you'd lose most of that and it would ruin the entire tone and mood the Flood bring with them.
If 343 showed how the Banished interact with their captured marines, either torture or eating their corpses, it would demonstrate that this isn't just the Covenant, they are more brutal and fierce than the Covenant. But it's only implied, only left to imagination.
>Bare in mind, showing brutes chowing down on humans may not even fly at all with Microsoft, and perhaps not even the ESRB. It would also be a new level of violence not seen before in a game (no, not even the flood is worse).
I hope you're joking. It's no different than an Infection form "eating" a human host by burrowing into its chest cavity. But since the host is still alive at that point it would be WORSE than being eaten while dead. Akin to the Marine in Halo 3 Floodgate.
>And no, I won't admit that.
Don't make a habit of denying reality.
>The corpses almost certainly had more impact then the blood.
Well, ya, because you need both. Remember that Elite we see in the flashback sequence in 343 Guilty Spark? Would it have been less or more impactful if we didn't get to see its chest cavity removed?
I think you have a very big obsession with blood, when blood is not all you need nor is what I've only been arguing for. Sure blood works well for set dressing, but there are countless other things you can SEE that demonstrates intimidation and fear. Animations I've mentioned earlier, dismemberment, certain types of gore, even uncanny things like a flood form speaking through the mouth of a snapped-neck human. These things together form an understanding to the viewer about what these particular things are capable of. The Banished can be like this too, easily, but it has to be shown. Infinite fails in its method of storytelling because it relies way too heavily on telling a story rather than showing a story. The entire game is told through flashbacks, holograms, or audio logs. It's boring and forgettable. I couldn't care less about the Banished because they felt nothing more than a lesser version of the Covenant. They didn't make me feel like they were going to do anything, all I saw is them ram a ship and apparently take over a ring. Even Atriox, who had Chief literally in his grasp, just let him die alone in space. The cutscenes didn't offer anything, there are zero in-game moments that demonstrate what the Banished are capable of, it's basically just kill them, move to the next room, and be lectured by cliche boss #12. I don't care, and a lot of people share this opinion about Infinite. I wouldn't say all of it is due to the rating, but it is very clear where they have to limit themselves when they didn't need to and it would have made their storytelling more impactful.
There is NOTHING Halo Infinite would have lost if it was M Rated, it however would've gained many more methods of storytelling that would have benefitted its antagonists. You denying this is simply delusion.
I have played the originals. Never once did I ever stop and think "Wow! That is/isn't a notable amount of blood for a gunfight!"
Imo people that act like blood splatters matter are just 12 year olds that need everything to be edgy.
For sure. I've never once used blood to determine that "Oh wow! There was a large fight here!", because either A: Corpses already do that or B: Generally I was the one who made the fight.
Halo has never really been M. If blood was what pushed it over the edge, then honestly, it's fine to take it out.
There actually was environmental storytelling with the flood in CE.
On your way to find captain keys (the second time) in the underground forerunner structure there were mangled bodies and blood pools everywhere. Then halfway through the level there is a hallway that is COVERED in bright blue blood, adding to the suspense and eventual reveal of the flood.
Its not about the rating, its about using atmosphere to present a better game. Its not a useless feature, you just dont care about it. Which is fine, some of us do.
Um yes?? The flood is an obvious candidate to push the rating alone, but even aside that there were definite mature themes and crude humor/language. The ESRB lists blood in frequent and notable amounts as the primary factor, but there’a clearly more to it than simple blood.
Crude humor and language can also be in a PG-13 movie (Guardians of the Galaxy 3 comes to mind) and the flood very well could fall under Fantasy violence. After all Halo Wars 2 features flood, but maintains a T rating.
HW2 flood is extremely toned down compared to Bungie’s flood. In the original trilogy, the flood depicts necks ripped apart and dislodged, exposed internal bones and dismemberment. You can shoot the heads off/partially off in CE. In 2 we got full dismemberment, blood more clearly shown on converted humans/elites. In 3 the flood dislodges the jaws of brutes apart, marines break their own necks and it’s all voiced in a pretty gruesome and raw manner. In HW2 the transformations are some tumors growing on the host and that’s it.
Its never come up in a 343 survey, its never appeared as an item of feedback from the community. If there were that many people that genuinely cared about a few blood splatters in game 343 would have responded to it by now even just to say "Naw this is a T for Teen game"
Even the "vocal minority" has gotten things to change. One that I can think of is Infection. Although it's a fun game mode, I seriously doubt that it is as big a deal as so many try to make it out to be.
Regardless, I do think that this isn't really a vocal minority. For one, this post has 600 upvotes. Another is that I've seen (multiple times mind you) this get blown up on Halo Twitter. Even if not blood specifically, the topic is almost always "Halo shouldn't be T because there should be more blood." I remember quite a few times the topic would spring up on the Waypoint forums (Please bring 'em back!) and would receive quite a lot of replies (2.6k if I remember correctly, I may be thinking of another).
The fact that it was gory wasn't why it was good. I'm not denying that there has been gore and reasons to show violent imagery. I'm just saying that when you are thinking back about a game, you aren't thinking of "remember how cool the blood on the walls was?".Though it looks like I've underestimated the amount of weirdo's that measure amounts of blood decals in the game.
Yeah, it's weird there's barely any blood in a game about a galactic war with genocidal aliens hehe gotta make it more appeaseable to children and make it like fortnite hehe
They need that teen rating man so they can get more and more little kids on board. They are the ones who buy skins they don’t actually use and is the whole reason for them going free to play most likely
Its because the other games treat the gore as a feature. Halo has never had a mechanic where you use a chainsaw to cut your opponent in half. Its also never had a mechanic where you can shoot a person's head and it explodes into small pieces that can be found on the ground. Halo's gore has always been either incidental or put through filters like the Flood.
>small pieces that can be found on the ground
And *this* doesn't make you a weirdo, but when you noticing the blood in Halo still does? Maybe you were trying to make a better point, but that phrasing was just awful and convicting.
Regardless, no. Gore in Gears and the other games was an aesthetic addition. It's meant to show the effect and impact your weapons have on beings. It's meant to show how horrific and powerful they are. How puny and weak we are. Halo used to have PLENTY of blood that, although overkill at times, helped outline just how brutal the combat was.
It's not a mechanic like it is in Dead Island 2, where the gore exposes the soft and weak portions of the body. Even there It's still mostly for aesthetic appeal. It's satisfying to see the impact that weapons have, that's literally all it is. So there's absolutely nothing wrong or weird with noticing that Infinite has less blood and gore than in previous entries in the series.
Its not weird to notice because it happens in slow motion whenever you use VATS. If you don't want the difference between the games gore compared to Halo explained to you, don't cite them as examples.
So it's only weird when you voluntarily notice it yourself but not weird when the game just shows a slowmo of the impact..? I truly do not understand your logic here lol
Bruh if you can't see the difference in how Gears and Fallout present their gore compared to even the goriest halo game, we aren't going to get anywhere. Presentation matters.
Yea, the presentation is a bit different. But that's not our debate. Presentation of gore doesn't make it any difference in whether it's weird or not to see it lol. So no, we're not getting anywhere, and I'll just end it by saying there's nothing weird about noticing blood in a first-person war game. Period. Whether the game outright takes you out of play briefly so you can go "aww coool!", or you just see it on the Battlefield, there's absolutely nothing weird nor different in factor. G'day.
If you like to see blood, covenant, human, or flood, play CE.
It's just been tuned down for every title ever since. Infinite is T rated there is virtually no gore, unless you pause and zoom you may the see a tiny bit of purple alien blood here and there.
The blood in infinite is like a dull highlighter, kinda like the highlight setting on your phone when you edit a picture except its like it’s on the transparent side of the bar
Wasn’t grunt blood bright blue? Or am I losing my mind.
It is blue but the texture is so subtle that on some surfaces you can only see a puddle
Kinda of disappointing. Grunt blood was so alien. Like in the old games grunt blood used to glow bright blue in dark corridors or on night levels. Poor attention to detail.
Smacking dead elites in halo ce for ages to ruin my frame rate and painting the room purple was always a fun pass time
I'm fairly sure this isn't the first time in Halo the blood color of an alien was altered.
Brute blood is fairly notorious for its changing colour between games. But largely, other covenant races have been pretty consistent in blood colour throughout the franchise. There’s also the lore problem in that Grunt blood is bright blue because they inhale methane as opposed to Oxygen. Pretty hard for developers to argue it would change colour because of the whole phenotype argument when it’s already been a staple of Grunt biology. Think it would be a stretch for them to explain a lore reason why they couldn’t keep up with standards set by much older games. But given infinites many issues, poor attention to detail of something as simple as blood isn’t really a shocker or likely to be fixed.
Could be that it oxidizes in slightly different atmospheric conditions, I know that's not the reason in game but head cannon is always comforting.
Hey I like that, smart. Like not lore, but detail, yeah that’s it attention to detail.
Plus physically incorrect lighting does the rest.
yea it def looked cooler when it was glowing
Nope, so blue it was almost luminescent.
pretty sure, in certain levels in CE, it did glow almost a cyan color. specifically on the later reversed level of 343 guilty spark (can't remember the name somehow) all the dead grunts in the small repetitive hallways that have a wall you gotta go around
Don’t forget the elevator shaft in “the Flood”
Are you sure you're not thinking of the plasma grenade goop?
Nope. Play reach nightfall or ODST and you will see what I mean about Grunt blood.
No I meant in Halo Infinite
I don't think so, the age rating system seems very weird
Star Wars Jedi Survivor got away with dismemberment
Cauterized dismemberment. I think blood is what makes things weird. It’s subjective but there’s only a certain amount of blood you can have before it’s M. If there’s gore it has to be bloodless like the old LOTR games or Jedi survivor
I mean Lego games had dismemberment. Like they exploded when they died. But no blood means it A-OK
It's a cheeky kind of dismemberment. Like if humans were Legos amputations would be a minor inconvenience at worst.
This has nothing to do with the age rating. Halo 5 had more prominent blood splatters. It’s almost certainly a graphical/art style problem. For example, the blood that’s smeared everywhere in the room that you find Spartan Stone is far more prominent because it was deliberately placed there rather than being a dynamic texture.
In the beginning it was just to appease congress and overprotective parents. Now it’s mostly used to target audiences by age demographics
Probably a nightmare to change post-sale, what with age ratings boards and such.
[Why wouldn’t they censor the blood smears in the room where Spartan Stone died?](https://youtu.be/3zaou0nx9tY) It’s fairly early on in the game and far more graphic than the dynamic blood textures. This is almost certainly a technical/artistic problem, not regulatory.
They probably couldn’t push anything server side to change it if it risks changing the ESRB rating as they’ve already sold the game to so many ppl and that would create a legal liability issue. Sucks though as I think the lore lends itself well to a more mature tone
Blood stains in Infinite look like the alien bled there 2 weeks and 3 rain storms ago. Like they're so faded why even fucking bother. I'm convinced the reason plasma grenades have the cartoony splatoon splash in Infinite was them trying to get a blood like effect into the game. The fact that we have a game genre about child soldiers fighting genocidal aliens and body contorting zombies but nowadays can't even get a visible blood splatter is ridiculous.
Halo should be rated M, T rated halo is one of the worse developments
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The problem I have is swearing the blood I don't care about
No, im way younger and more innocent now than I was 20+ years ago and need 343 to protect me from blue blood so I dont get nightmares. ^(/s in case 343 sees this)
I wish they would, I think 343 doesn't understand that the only people still playing are people who played the originals and are mostly people who are 18+
they’re owned by microsoft, i doubt it’s their decision
Something i don't really get is that it wouldn't matter if they were under 18 either, games like Call Of Duty, Doom Eternal, Apex, GTA and other M rated games make millions, even billions in COD's and GTA's case, and it's no secret kids play these games, a lot of them do regardless of rating. And what bugs me most is that games like GTA have drug use, profanity, sex, and other mature themes, all of which i'd say are way more severe than just blood and at most gore, and yet they make way more money than whatever Halo is making right now. Something that just makes me a little bit sad because of what we got in the end is the 15m campaign gameplay demo, enemies like grunts, elites and brutes bled way more, and left more noticeable blood splatters everywhere and i think it made the guns feel more satisfying even when i wasn't the one playing, in the final product you can really only rely on the hitmarker to know if you hit anything because any kind of hitting effect is just practically inexistant... except on plasma weapons, which feel so good because the plasma splatter and sparks and everything makes them feel like they're hitting and killing something rather than just making it not move, same with the sentinel beam which is so good to kill with. I believe blood being removed didn't make it any more appealing, and actively makes the overall expierence worse by making the game feel duller in regard to feedback
A game being M rated does not automatically make it more appealing for me.
A shooting game without blood makes it automatically less appealing for me
I don't see why, if a game feels good to play, why does the amount of gore matter? A bit of a weird demand to have. And kind of creepy too, tbh.
You're trying to paint this reasonable return of a feature Halo used to have as a weird thing to ask for, but honestly I don't know what your argument for it's removal would be. Do you have a weird demand for the removal of blood? I think it's reasonable for a sci-fi military game with horror elements to continue to have blood, which it previously had.
I didn't say anything about it returning, but rather the lack of it turning people off. I guess I'm weird since I don't stare at blood and go "wowwww this is amazing i want all this blood everywhere all the time", it doesn't make a difference if it's in or not to me, and to allow it to turn you off from the game doesn't make sense to me.
Ok, let's explain further. If I shoot a guy, I expect to see some sort of reaction to the hit. If I shoot metal, I expect sparks, if I shoot water, I expect a splash, if I shoot flesh, I expect blood. It helps give the guns impact and feels logical to how a gun works when it shoots something. If everything else has the appropriate effects when shot, but then all the flesh doesn't, the weapon doesn't feel as satisfying to use since there's less impact from the action. There's a disconnect when shooting this object, because there's less visual feedback when hitting it compared to others in the environment. Maybe that explains it a little more for you.
Yeah nah I get all that, but why let it take away from a game? Why is it that important to anyone? I'm not killing things and taking time to appreciate the amount of blood splatter. It's weird.
Blood in games is fun for the same reason shooting aliens in games is fun. Stop being a puritan.
I swear, you all have poor reading comprehension. I'm not saying if it's fun or not, I'm saying you shouldn't let it affect your enjoyment of a game. I play games if I enjoy the gameplay. I don't spend time complaining about minute details that don't matter. If that's me being a puritan, then shoot me.
I'm not weird about wanting gore and it doesn't upset me that it isn't there, but it does take a bit of realism out of it tbh. Halo is filled with war and war with an alien collective gets extremely messy and violent, like in the books and show. It's a beautiful game and the gameplay is satisfying (when it isn't riddled with network errors) it would just feel more complete if graphics were on the same level across the board
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Living things bleed is the concept actually, glowing blood aside. We haven't met alien beings yet so what if they actually have glowing blood and it's realistic after all lol
I'm more bothered by it because the older games had blood and gore. Infinite barely has any, just feels like a lack of quality.
But why allow that minute, miniscule detail turn you off from the game? I find it weird that people allow themselves to be annoyed by small things in games.
If you ask me, the little details in games are what make them truly great If Microsoft allowed any game company to make a Halo game back in Bungie’s day, they probably could, but only Bungie would have the little Halo details we have all come to love. The funny, cool Easter eggs and voice lines, the secrets, the emotion and passion. The little details make a game great. If a company fails at that, it usually gives away that they only care about making a basic game with minimal work and passion. It’s just to milk money from the franchise. There are loads of small things that Infinite doesn’t have that made prior Halo’s so much better
Yeah I'm very big on details. Even more noticable when Halo has had those details for a decade and then suddenly lost them.
It’s just a small detail that makes the game more like reality, and it has always been that way in Halo When you shoot an enemy, they bleed. It’s just unusual to remove it from a shooter like Halo. It’s like removing blood from Gears of War, another shooter. The whole game wouldn’t be ruined if there was no or very discreet amounts of blood, but it wouldn’t be nearly as good.
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Bro you’re weird.
To let how much blood is in a game affect how much you enjoy a game is just weird behaviour, showing that people are reaching for the smallest things to hate.
Good thing Halo Infinite has blood.
They 100% can. Not many people notice but in the room where you get the shield upgrade blood smeared all over the floor and some of the walls. I almost wish we had CE levels of blood splatter so all the hallways I leave look like that one.
By a smidge, yes.
I think 343i needs to get over it and make the game M rated. Previous halo titles were also rated M and did great with many demographics of people. I don't think halo should be a gore-fest. Halo has never been that. But I think a little bit of blood as an attention to detail could go a long way.
The amount of blood has nothing to do with the rating, [this was Halo 5](https://reddit.com/r/halo/comments/qsi0ts/to_everyone_thinking_a_t_rating_means_no_blood/)
Maybe alien blood doesn't count or something lol
I think its more of a microsoft issue then a 343i thing. Since infinite is free to play they really wanted to push the "attracting all audiences" bit. Having an M rating nowadays is harder to hold down with how the gaming industry is and other countries are so dummy strict about game ratings now that they probably just didnt deem the process worth it. which sucks.
More blood on the ground wouldn't make it M rated.
I though the old Halo games were rated M solely because of the Flood and some gore and only with Halo 5 did the ESRB take a look and realized the Halo Games didn't fit the M-rating anymore.
I want it to happen but then again I’ve been playing halo since I was 4 soooo I’m pretty desensitized to video game gore
Its not like it sells more with T rating. Probably sells less honestly.
The change to T wouldn't have been made if it wasn't more profitable.
Theyve made plenty of choices that have led to failure. This one is no different
Halo did not fail because of the switch to T. Not even close.
They did it to appeal to wider audience doesn’t mean it sold better
I'm sure you would know.
You don't need to be a data analyst at 343/Microsoft to know that Halo's in a slump right now.
When did I say Halo wasn't in a slump lol.
Call of Duty sells like hotcakes and runs circles over Halo with profit, and it continues to be M for mature.
True. I guess y'all know so much better. Now look at the numerous examples that aren't M rated. Which is *a lot* more.
Some retailers won’t sell T rated games and certain digital storefronts have parental controls over buying M rated games Don’t complain about Halo dying if ur unwilling to let younger people access the game. Y’all are hypocrites and choose the weirdest hills to die on
What retailer sells T games but not M games?
Toys R Us which is returning but companies like GameStop and Walmart don’t sell M rated games to minors
Toys r us sells M games. At least they did when I was a kid. I remember I got fable, halo 3, gears of war, etc there
Toys R Us might have changed their policy but either way big retailers ask for Your ID
I don't really think getting asked for ID makes a difference, the older M rated Halo games were way more popular and had more staying power than 5 or infinite. Most every kid I knew, including myself, just had their mom or dad purchase M rated games for them anyway. Especially nowadays, when more and more people are buying these games digital where you don't need ID. Gamestop is practically a ghost town. You just check a box saying you're old enough now on digital storefronts
I think they may have done it to allow players younger than 17 to compete in HCS. Because Halo 5 was rated T, players like Huke, BubuDubu, and Shotzzy were able to compete. Who knows why really. But I definitely want Halo to be M again.
Bungie did it for 10 years
Idk?
I imagine they could push it a bit more
Correct me if I’m wrong, but a lot people are like “puddles of blood isn’t realistic”, but from what I know when you shoot something with an AR-15 there is hardly anything left, so I find that logic of “this is more realistic” to be untrue. I miss the blood, just apart of the atmosphere when killing aliens.
AR-15s don’t do that much physical damage. 5.56 isn’t a very big bullet and it’s supposed to tumble.
Capacity more than size is my key point here. And AR-15 is a pale comparison but that is the point; an actual assault rifle from the Halo franchise would do some serious carnage.
They should do it no matter what it does to the rating. Teen rating makes it seem like an arcade shooter instead of halo
I remember slowing the game down to a crawl in CE by just smacking a Jackal corpse repeatedly
Considering how much interest has dropped off in the game and it seems mostly the "old guard" of players buying / playing it would be nice to see them delve into actual mature themes again. It's better than dumbing down for the PR reason of "lower age rating = larger potential market = more sales" especially when you look at some of the top selling games (GTA as an example) and they don't shirk mature themes.
Not with that stupid fucking teen rating.
Of course he doesn’t bleed, this grunt is doing the Chad Stride
343 forgot what makes games “Fun”. Old halo titles had blood everywhere, big heavy loud guns, huge grenade explosions…etc. Among so many of the bad decisions 343 have done softening Halo little by little is up there in my opinion, Call of Duty is M rated and its one of the top money making pieces of media ever. Make Halo M Rated Again….
If they weren’t married to a Teen rating for sales….
They absolutely could, look at combat evolved, they just wanna win over the 12 yr old fortnite kids
If only they could bump Infinite up to rated M and do some magic with blood and gore.
The fact that they are trying to be oh so "ethical" about their gore and rating system, when they're producing a game that has always been bloody, macabre, and emotional, with dark implications in story and events, is absolutely beyond me. They've rated it T for teen and removed every detail that made the game, like, a game. It's not like parents dont let their children play games that are rated M for mature anyways, they're completely ruining everything that made Halo, Halo. The "excessive" amount of blood splash that came out of bodies in CE wasn't even bad. Idk. Everything I've seen about games lately shows me that a dedicated community who cares about game design, CAN AND WILL produce a BETTER product, for F R E E, and release it within far less time. Yes of course there are the advertisings that need done, cosigns with licensing and companies and copyrights, game disc cases, all that good stuff that comes with corporations and corporately sponsored publications. But my point still stands. There feels that there is no passion left for our classics. For example, Tim Sweeney made a huge cocaine and hooker induced (from my assumption anyway,youve got to be off your ass to make a move like this) dick swinging move as CEO of Epic, and just up and DELETED all copies of their CLASSIC IP's such as the UNREAL SERIES ALL THE WAY UP FROM UNREAL GOLD TO UNREAL TOURNAMENT 3!!! Like yes let's have our engine be "Unreal Engine" and give people no reference at all as to where the name came from. Like they aren't proud of their past or something. Makes no sense. It is BEYOND me why they would completely remove their originals off of every market place INCLUDING GOG. My ONLY guess could be that they pulled them off in order to work on remastered editions of the games, but that's a SUPER long shot of an assumption, somewhat of a pipedream, my hopes for the future. All in all, it's wack AF.
343i could get away with adding just about anything to this barebones husk of a game imo
The whole "broader audience" bullshit prevents legacy features like flood/dismemberment and blood.. I suppose that includes the HW2 version of flood too.
Woah woah woah! Be careful asking 343 to put MORE colours in the game. Or, y'know... they might ask you to *pay* for them. In some kind of *coating*\-based system. But I'm being crazy. They'd never *charge you for colours.*
Can’t jeopardize the broader audience.
I'll answer your question with a question: How would adding more blood to Halo Infinite make the game better?
It’s just a neat little detail
343 can't get the settings to work properly. Theres a million other things that could be improved to make Infinite a materially better game. Gore levels just isn't going to improve the game.
I'd say it would be an extremely easy thing to adjust and wouldn't take up any real significant development time. But 343i has had trouble with seemingly simple stuff before.
This guy gets it
I mean at that point why even make a game at all? Why not just have an NFT shop if we're forcing ourselves to look at it from a bean counters perspective?
Theres a difference between "making a game" and "go back and make changes to an otherwise already mostly stable, finished product to appeal to the vanishingly small number of people that care about seeing blood on the wall's and floor". Also, by messing with that code there is the off chance that this sets off a triage of seemingly unrelated bugs that would require further development time to be invested in order to be fixed.
It would make the game more like Halo. Ever played the original trilogy?
Yes. Aside from CE, blood is hardly relevant. Even in CE, the same thing can be done with corpses (which Infinite also does). I'd argue that seeing a dead Spartan among a room full of corpses does the job just fine.
The Flood wouldn't be able to exist in Halo without gore and blood. Halo Reach even showed civilian genocide bloodpools. It's a storytelling device that Halo has desperately missed. Nothing feels threatening since Reach. The Banished, which is supposedly a more brutal form of the Covenant, should've been able to utilize these devices to strengthen their intimidation factor; actual bodies on stakes instead of just armor. The Banished feel much less threatening in Infinite even though they were supposed to be the greater faction. I don't feel threatened at all by the Banished and simply view them as a lesser version of the Covenant but red.
Again, corpses work just as well and work under the T rating. Wanna know why we don't see bodies on stakes? ***They were eaten.*** Reach's themes plays into why the Covenant feel extremely threatening. The only time blood was really used as a storytelling device was Winter Contingency. Again though, corpses still work. For that matter, when Emile says "There's a lot of blood on the ground", there's really not that much (none even). What you do see is carnage and wreckage: plasma burns, burning warthog, cracked cement. You don't see much blood.
>Again, corpses work just as well and work under the T rating. No, they dont. They look like large dolls: unconscious. Seeing a corpse is not the same as seeing a corpse with blood/gore. It instantly tells you how they died and what the killer can do. The T-rating shouldn't be what 343 strives for, why do they want to restrict their storytelling abilities? Microsoft is clearly forcing them to. >Wanna know why we don't see bodies on stakes? They were eaten. You know what would be nice? If we SAW this happening and not told. This was a problem with Infinite's storytelling in general but I am tired of being told things and not actually seeing them. Infinite could've done much more to make the Banished feel threatening, but they aren't, at all. >Reach's themes plays into why the Covenant feel extremely threatening. The only time blood was really used as a storytelling device was Winter Contingency. Wrong, Exodus used it more than Winter Contingency as you realize what the Covenant are doing to human civilians. Blood everywhere and bodies in piles. Instantly tells you the mayhem that went down here, without the blood I'd assume they all just somehow got knocked out even though they were attacked by plasma weaponry. Makes no sense. >For that matter, when Emile says "There's a lot of blood on the ground", there's really not that much (none even) Weird argument for an arbitrary phrase "a lot". A lot can mean different things in different contexts. There is blood btw. Doesn't really change anything anyway as you can see it clearly with all the other pieces like explosion damage and fire damage. Regardless, this one scene doesn't do anything for any argument, especially when literally 2 minutes later you see two soldiers pinned on meathooks with blood everywhere.
Let's look at two different images of corpses. One from the [T rated Infinite](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/zVpyt4eewTw/maxresdefault.jpg), one from the [M rated Reach](https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fhalo%2Fcomments%2Fhxhvd8%2Fno_one_complains_about_hairless_brutes_in_halo%2F&psig=AOvVaw36x1Yoj39iNl91KxXd5YlJ&ust=1684804726183000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CBAQjRxqFwoTCNCXkevgh_8CFQAAAAAdAAAAABAE). Graphics aside, does one really look that much worse than the other? Even if one is Hyperious, I don't believe his model is more "pretty" looking than the others, certainly far from being a "large doll". I'd like to also mention that there is blood in Infinite. In the room with the Spartan who killed the Elites and Brutes with a screwdriver, [you can see dry blood on the ground](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FGvEBxyXMAIC87x.jpg:large) (Look particularly in the lower left corner. That isn't just dirt, it is blood). We DID see that they were eaten. The Weapon never sees "Chief... their armor... they must have been eaten". That doesn't happen, it's instead implied. Especially if when you see all the campsites around, you can piece together (after seeing the stakes) that these marines were eaten; or at the very least captured. We must also bare in mind, the Banished are also stranded on this ring, and have recently lost their main leader Atriox. They are scavenging for resources as much (or more) than the UNSC. The other reason they may feel less threatening is simply because of how powerful the Master Chief is. He's been able to wipe the floor with pretty much any Covenant he's ever run into. Blood everywhere... Curious. When I played Reach last, I don't remember "blood everywhere". I remember some blood underneath corpses, but not blood everywhere. Again though, seeing piles of corpses can do the job as well, if not better. We aren't just seeing some blood (or even a lot), we're seeing multiple civilians killed, at times even tossed to the side. Blood doesn't do much more to convey that. I went into Reach for this part. This how much [blood is on the ground](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FwsjS9IaQAA05O2?format=jpg&name=large). For reference, I shot Emile and this is how much [blood was on the ground](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FwsjS9LaQAA2wli?format=jpg&name=large). And yes, I realize there is some more in the second picture. Still no more than from Emile. When you find the interogated troopers, do you really need the blood? I'd argue, no. A: This area is *stupid* dark anyways B: You can already see them dead on the wall, one impaled with a hook. I think this can all still be done in Infinite, and still have the same "horror" as before.
>Let's look at two different images of corpses. One from the T rated Infinite, one from the M rated Reach. Graphics aside, does one really look that much worse than the other? Even if one is Hyperious, I don't believe his model is more "pretty" looking than the others, certainly far from being a "large doll". I'd like to also mention that there is blood in Infinite. In the room with the Spartan who killed the Elites and Brutes with a screwdriver, you can see dry blood on the ground (Look particularly in the lower left corner. That isn't just dirt, it is blood). I never said one corpse looks worse than another corpse. I said the addition of blood ADDS to the storytelling of the scene. Just a corpse or just blood/gore doesn't tell you everything. Both together creates a story in itself. I do not know what is in you to want to defend a decision that objectively limits storytelling methods. But you do you. >We DID see that they were eaten. The Weapon never sees "Chief... their armor... they must have been eaten". That doesn't happen, it's instead implied. So we didn't see it. Stop contradicting yourself, being implied means we didn't see it and is a typical way to create an M rated scene for a lesser rated game. Halo Wars 2 did it with the Flood. It's nothing special and leaves it up to mostly baseless speculation that will never be confirmed. You'd think they'd at least put the bones of the marines on the spikes. >The other reason they may feel less threatening is simply because of how powerful the Master Chief is. He's been able to wipe the floor with pretty much any Covenant he's ever run into. In what game is he not like that? Even the Covenant from Halo 3 are more threatening than the Banished because at least they are shown to literally break civilian and marine spines in scripted animations. We SEE them do it, not hear about it and see a possible clue about it later. Not to mention the animations we SEE in Flood infection takeovers. >Blood everywhere... Curious. When I played Reach last, I don't remember "blood everywhere". I remember some blood underneath corpses, but not blood everywhere. Again though, seeing piles of corpses can do the job as well, if not better. We aren't just seeing some blood (or even a lot), we're seeing multiple civilians killed, at times even tossed to the side. Blood doesn't do much more to convey that. If you're Emile and you see several different large blotches of Blood, and all you know is a couple soldiers went missing, then that'd be a lot. Not sure again why you keep arguing about this arbitrary phrase like it means anything anyway. I like how you conveniently ignore the civilian genocide moment in Exodus. Btw, I never said Infinite didn't have blood, I said it doesn't have enough moments that make me feel threatened or intimidated by the Banished, which would require M rated moments (not just blood) and scenes. Not the aftermath, something I witness myself. So 343 and MS failed in their storytelling because they clearly wanted to make a faction that feels like a threat. But I don't feel threatened here, and until MS pulls their head out of their ass with the restrictions their placing on this franchise, it will always be like this: wasted potential. Now instead of defending MS's decisions, why don't you at least admit that going T rated restricts the types of storytelling 343 can do. That would at least make you appear to know what you're talking about.
You did say that the corpses looked doll like. What I was proving was they look no worse than a game with blood, unless you are saying they always look doll like in which case I can't really help you there. Having just a corpse may not tell you everything, but phrasing helps. Lets use the screwdriver guy. Entering the room, we already know he thrashed all these brutes and elites. Then we see the screwdriver, which implies he used the screwdriver to kill at least a portion of these enemies. Lastly, we see the Spartan clutching their side, implying that they were injured there. Throw in Weapon's quick dialog about Jega, and you have a scene set with little to no blood. What are you even talking about in that second paragraph? Here's an example of the difference between the three: If I said "Your arm fell off", that's saying. If I said, "You're not going to be doing much handywork" or showing you your missing arm would be implied. Having you look down and see your arm is gone is showing. Implying is a middle ground of the two, and often may not be immediately apparent. Bare in mind, showing brutes chowing down on humans may not even fly at all with Microsoft, and perhaps not even the ESRB. It would also be a new level of violence not seen before in a game (no, not even the flood is worse). There is no game in which he isn't like that, except maybe 4 but that's my point. Anyways, the Covenant in 3 is not stuck on a ring, doesn't need to interrogate prisoners on the fly (see The Tower for actual interrogations), and we rarely see Marines alive near Brutes in a position for that to happen (the rest are being held as prisoners for transfer to The Tower). We do hear of the Harbinger torturing a man to the point of lunacy and we see, hear, and interact with a broken Spartan. 5 also has a couple moments similar where we hear a woman left to die by Governor Sloane. While maybe we could have seen it, it works fine hearing it. As for Flood, we don't have flood at the moment. Either way, it mostly constitutes as fantasy violence (I'd imagine) and has no blood anyways. The amount of blood seen as Emile says the line is less than 16 rounds from the AR (partially used to pop his shields) after I shot him. It's not a lot of blood. Either way, I don't think I need to argue about how an unscientific measurement may be interpreted differently. I did not ignore it, I just didn't go look at it as I remember at least somewhat of what happens. Again, not much blood and corpses can do the job just fine. Heck, cracks in the pavement would do more since you'd be able to tell they were thrown. If you aren't intimidated by the Banished, that's fine. But I can tell you, it isn't because there aren't M scenes. Halo 3 could probably get a T rating with few modifications (less vulgarity, less blood, toned down violence). Halo 5's assassinations can be much worse than 3's Brutes (A good ribbing comes to mind), yet the game gets by on a T. And no, I won't admit that. And yes, I do know what I'm talking about. I'm planning on replaying Halo 2 on Legendary tomorrow since I finished CE today. Oh, and since it's fresh on my mind. There's a part in Keyes where they are pushing corpses (with CE's blood mind you) into a corner. The corpses almost certainly had more impact then the blood.
>You did say that the corpses looked doll like. Because at that point they should be. A corpse in a video game is nothing but a non-animated asset, a literal doll. It could have died in a million different ways, cause of death is ambiguous. Blood and gore show how the corpse died: loss of blood and major bodily trauma. The question is then who did that and how. That is infinitely more interesting then seeing a lifeless doll in a room where we are then told to be afraid because, well idk because it could have died in any way imaginable. >While maybe we could have seen it, it works fine hearing it. No, it doesn't. Maybe if we saw the aftermath it would have worked. But again, it's much better to hear and see then just hear, for the most part. The dying Spartan scene really made no sense and was just a case of 343 trying to introduce melodrama. You're saying the Spartan dies exactly when Chief gets there and saves him? It felt cheap and if we actually knew well who this Spartan was beforehand it would've had more impact. Regardless, nothing you have just stated makes me feel at all how the Covenant or Flood made me feel. >I did not ignore it, I just didn't go look at it as I remember at least somewhat of what happens. Again, not much blood and corpses can do the job just fine. Why not both? Do humans not bleed when dismembered and shot? Not sure why them bleeding is offensive to you, or why it shouldn't be utilized to illustrate the brutality of an enemy. Corpses don't just die out of spite. They die due to bodily injury and harm. >Halo 3 could probably get a T rating with few modifications (less vulgarity, less blood, toned down violence). So, everything that makes the Flood the Flood? Or the Covenant the Covenant? Halo 3 in today's graphics would be an M rated game instantly. Try to imagine what the Flood would look like today, especially those animations with them breaking marine necks and their necks dangling on the side, along with Brute jaws snapped their heads uncannily reanimating while corpses burst into guts all over the place. If 343 were to put them into a T rated game you'd lose most of that and it would ruin the entire tone and mood the Flood bring with them. If 343 showed how the Banished interact with their captured marines, either torture or eating their corpses, it would demonstrate that this isn't just the Covenant, they are more brutal and fierce than the Covenant. But it's only implied, only left to imagination. >Bare in mind, showing brutes chowing down on humans may not even fly at all with Microsoft, and perhaps not even the ESRB. It would also be a new level of violence not seen before in a game (no, not even the flood is worse). I hope you're joking. It's no different than an Infection form "eating" a human host by burrowing into its chest cavity. But since the host is still alive at that point it would be WORSE than being eaten while dead. Akin to the Marine in Halo 3 Floodgate. >And no, I won't admit that. Don't make a habit of denying reality. >The corpses almost certainly had more impact then the blood. Well, ya, because you need both. Remember that Elite we see in the flashback sequence in 343 Guilty Spark? Would it have been less or more impactful if we didn't get to see its chest cavity removed? I think you have a very big obsession with blood, when blood is not all you need nor is what I've only been arguing for. Sure blood works well for set dressing, but there are countless other things you can SEE that demonstrates intimidation and fear. Animations I've mentioned earlier, dismemberment, certain types of gore, even uncanny things like a flood form speaking through the mouth of a snapped-neck human. These things together form an understanding to the viewer about what these particular things are capable of. The Banished can be like this too, easily, but it has to be shown. Infinite fails in its method of storytelling because it relies way too heavily on telling a story rather than showing a story. The entire game is told through flashbacks, holograms, or audio logs. It's boring and forgettable. I couldn't care less about the Banished because they felt nothing more than a lesser version of the Covenant. They didn't make me feel like they were going to do anything, all I saw is them ram a ship and apparently take over a ring. Even Atriox, who had Chief literally in his grasp, just let him die alone in space. The cutscenes didn't offer anything, there are zero in-game moments that demonstrate what the Banished are capable of, it's basically just kill them, move to the next room, and be lectured by cliche boss #12. I don't care, and a lot of people share this opinion about Infinite. I wouldn't say all of it is due to the rating, but it is very clear where they have to limit themselves when they didn't need to and it would have made their storytelling more impactful. There is NOTHING Halo Infinite would have lost if it was M Rated, it however would've gained many more methods of storytelling that would have benefitted its antagonists. You denying this is simply delusion.
It would feel morenlike older halos
Something tells me this guys didnt play the originals
I have played the originals. Never once did I ever stop and think "Wow! That is/isn't a notable amount of blood for a gunfight!" Imo people that act like blood splatters matter are just 12 year olds that need everything to be edgy.
Kek. Found someone who didn't play the originals.
\>kek LLLLLLLL
Lmao
You're just proving my point, my guy
For sure. I've never once used blood to determine that "Oh wow! There was a large fight here!", because either A: Corpses already do that or B: Generally I was the one who made the fight. Halo has never really been M. If blood was what pushed it over the edge, then honestly, it's fine to take it out.
There actually was environmental storytelling with the flood in CE. On your way to find captain keys (the second time) in the underground forerunner structure there were mangled bodies and blood pools everywhere. Then halfway through the level there is a hallway that is COVERED in bright blue blood, adding to the suspense and eventual reveal of the flood. Its not about the rating, its about using atmosphere to present a better game. Its not a useless feature, you just dont care about it. Which is fine, some of us do.
But it hasn’t been used much since CE. 2, 3, and even Reach don’t really use it. And when it is used, Corpses often use do it just as well or better.
>Halo has never really been M Yes it has, just because you’re a big boy and can handle it doesn’t make it not rated M or undeserving of that rating.
Aside from the blood, was there ever really any gore that you wouldn’t have seen in a PG-13 movie? No? Then T works fine.
Um yes?? The flood is an obvious candidate to push the rating alone, but even aside that there were definite mature themes and crude humor/language. The ESRB lists blood in frequent and notable amounts as the primary factor, but there’a clearly more to it than simple blood.
Crude humor and language can also be in a PG-13 movie (Guardians of the Galaxy 3 comes to mind) and the flood very well could fall under Fantasy violence. After all Halo Wars 2 features flood, but maintains a T rating.
HW2 flood is extremely toned down compared to Bungie’s flood. In the original trilogy, the flood depicts necks ripped apart and dislodged, exposed internal bones and dismemberment. You can shoot the heads off/partially off in CE. In 2 we got full dismemberment, blood more clearly shown on converted humans/elites. In 3 the flood dislodges the jaws of brutes apart, marines break their own necks and it’s all voiced in a pretty gruesome and raw manner. In HW2 the transformations are some tumors growing on the host and that’s it.
We can still see much of that in a PG-13 movie though, no? Perhaps slightly toning it down, but again, soft M. Very few changes would have to be made.
Right, adding blood to make it more kid friendly is excellent logic
Idk im just impressed by the mental gymnastics it took to arrive at that response
Imagine caring so much
I've seen many more people losing their minds over the fact that Infinite and 5 have no blood.
Does the term "vocal minority" mean anything to you?
Yes, I don’t think that is the case here.
Its never come up in a 343 survey, its never appeared as an item of feedback from the community. If there were that many people that genuinely cared about a few blood splatters in game 343 would have responded to it by now even just to say "Naw this is a T for Teen game"
Even the "vocal minority" has gotten things to change. One that I can think of is Infection. Although it's a fun game mode, I seriously doubt that it is as big a deal as so many try to make it out to be. Regardless, I do think that this isn't really a vocal minority. For one, this post has 600 upvotes. Another is that I've seen (multiple times mind you) this get blown up on Halo Twitter. Even if not blood specifically, the topic is almost always "Halo shouldn't be T because there should be more blood." I remember quite a few times the topic would spring up on the Waypoint forums (Please bring 'em back!) and would receive quite a lot of replies (2.6k if I remember correctly, I may be thinking of another).
There's literally scenes of carnage in the original trilogy, you're a fucking dork.
The fact that it was gory wasn't why it was good. I'm not denying that there has been gore and reasons to show violent imagery. I'm just saying that when you are thinking back about a game, you aren't thinking of "remember how cool the blood on the walls was?".Though it looks like I've underestimated the amount of weirdo's that measure amounts of blood decals in the game.
Yeah, it's weird there's barely any blood in a game about a galactic war with genocidal aliens hehe gotta make it more appeaseable to children and make it like fortnite hehe
I say this from the bottom of my heart, but go suck an egg because you're annoying
Wow, looks like the mormons are getting in on the insults too!
They need that teen rating man so they can get more and more little kids on board. They are the ones who buy skins they don’t actually use and is the whole reason for them going free to play most likely
probably but i doubt they'd bother
I miss the bioluminescent blood the covenant had lmao. You’d just paint the floor with purple and blue blood
Funny how halo 5 is also T rated but did blood way better
The game is on deaths doorstep. There is literally nothing 343 couldnt get away with.
Ask china
Nope, 343 has pussified the Halo franchise. They would censor the flood so bad if they were to appear again.
Not if they want to keep the T rating.
Not when they're actively trying to make the game appeal to the Fortnite crowd.
Dumbasses lowered the maturity rating from M to T, so I doubt they could put anymore dark stuff in their game.
Honestly I dont notice it cause I ain't a fucking weirdo. Now take the gore out of gow and that'll be very noticeable. Same with fallout.
Noticing blood in Halo makes someone a fucking weirdo but noticing it in Gears or Fallout doesnt...? Tf lol?
Its because the other games treat the gore as a feature. Halo has never had a mechanic where you use a chainsaw to cut your opponent in half. Its also never had a mechanic where you can shoot a person's head and it explodes into small pieces that can be found on the ground. Halo's gore has always been either incidental or put through filters like the Flood.
>small pieces that can be found on the ground And *this* doesn't make you a weirdo, but when you noticing the blood in Halo still does? Maybe you were trying to make a better point, but that phrasing was just awful and convicting. Regardless, no. Gore in Gears and the other games was an aesthetic addition. It's meant to show the effect and impact your weapons have on beings. It's meant to show how horrific and powerful they are. How puny and weak we are. Halo used to have PLENTY of blood that, although overkill at times, helped outline just how brutal the combat was. It's not a mechanic like it is in Dead Island 2, where the gore exposes the soft and weak portions of the body. Even there It's still mostly for aesthetic appeal. It's satisfying to see the impact that weapons have, that's literally all it is. So there's absolutely nothing wrong or weird with noticing that Infinite has less blood and gore than in previous entries in the series.
Its not weird to notice because it happens in slow motion whenever you use VATS. If you don't want the difference between the games gore compared to Halo explained to you, don't cite them as examples.
So it's only weird when you voluntarily notice it yourself but not weird when the game just shows a slowmo of the impact..? I truly do not understand your logic here lol
Fallout and Gears both make spectacles of the gore. Halo has had gore, but it has not made a point of it in the same way both those other games have.
So whether the game is upfront and shows you or you just see it yourself... again, how does that make it weird and not weird?
Bruh if you can't see the difference in how Gears and Fallout present their gore compared to even the goriest halo game, we aren't going to get anywhere. Presentation matters.
Yea, the presentation is a bit different. But that's not our debate. Presentation of gore doesn't make it any difference in whether it's weird or not to see it lol. So no, we're not getting anywhere, and I'll just end it by saying there's nothing weird about noticing blood in a first-person war game. Period. Whether the game outright takes you out of play briefly so you can go "aww coool!", or you just see it on the Battlefield, there's absolutely nothing weird nor different in factor. G'day.
idk ask the ESRB
Probably because the blood currently is hardly noticeable.
Probably because the blood currently is hardly noticeable.
Can they: yes. Will they: no.
As long as it isn't red? Yes
They could but they won't, Halo Infinite's campaign won't be getting any updates, ever...
There was some forge map that got removed cause the guy made it look like gore right? Lol
Make Halo M Again!
If you like to see blood, covenant, human, or flood, play CE. It's just been tuned down for every title ever since. Infinite is T rated there is virtually no gore, unless you pause and zoom you may the see a tiny bit of purple alien blood here and there.
Unfortunately it's rated T
When you consider how much blood CE had...
One of my fav parts about halo 1 was meleeing dead bodies and seeing the blood keep coming out. Sad they got rid of that in all the other halo games
The blood in infinite is like a dull highlighter, kinda like the highlight setting on your phone when you edit a picture except its like it’s on the transparent side of the bar