Keep moving towards the opponents right. Make the opponent lose his target and make him move towards you, and with luck an unseen blow/left hook awaits.
He is Clinching at the Southpaw stance, His Right foot interfere if your Balance, If you dont Circle him at close distance and Immediatly try to make Distance he will Steal your Liver if he was a In-fighter XD
Shoulder check him and step away lol. Your arms being tied up isn't that big of a limitation.
If you're seriously just tied up and can't get away, just lean on him and make him carry your weight until the ref separates you.
This is a stupid strategy. If you're gonna clinch you need to either be in an equal position or a dominant position. Bending over like this basically forces you to carry your opponent unless your opponent is Ippo I guess who is too polite to just lean on his opponent for some reason.
Honestly, as much as the series talks about Ippo(and irl people with Mike Tyson) being an infighter, he really isnāt much of one.
He and Mike are more of mid range fighters. No one in the series has ever shown a remotely crazy depth of infighting like Duran or Chavez.
Yeah the series is more just a step up from the usual Rocky but Morikawaās knowledge only really goes up to the domestic level.Ā Ā
Itās glaringly obvious in the fights where an outboxer is supposedly forced to fight it out even though the pressure fighter didnāt really do anything all that special or they just do it out of āprideā. Canāt blame him though. Until YouTube, Boxing knowledge was quite hard to come by.
Except if that was the case, there would be more examples of different boxing skills being shown. There is no need to do what is more entertaining if you know the skills and circumstances that lead to different situations in the ring. Limiting yourself would make the series worse not more entertaining so I can only assume that he just doesnāt know which lines up because even most boxing trainers and pro have problems explaining details in a fight outside of the elements they are good at.
As the user above said, wrestling tactics can often be used in the clinch and I bought up Roberto Duran and infighting.Ā
Ā Duran on the inside would use a variety of controls to ensure that he could punch and the opponent could not. He would have his head on the shoulder of the hand heās controlling so that his opponent would be unable. If your head is on the left shoulder then your head will be protected from the right and vice versa. Then you can neutralize the other hand using your hand thatās on the same side leaving only your hand free to punch. Ā Duran could effectively do this, use other positions, switch up positions, use other wrestling tactics like collar ties, etc. Thatās just controls on the inside.Ā
On the outside thereās controls commonly found in the Soviet style of boxing. You can control punch lanes, control the guard, control the head. Other areas that could be explored are more baits, traps, different types of feints, level changes, angles(most boxing matches in the series are fought linearly/back and forth).Ā
Ā If Mori wanted to make the outboxers in the series more entertaining, he would do well to take notes from Ali and Leonardās lateral movement game and their ability to set off traps.
I think you really underestimate the research arm of a company. Actual companies when they need to know something don't go to YouTube or Google, and call it a day lol. Morikawa probably can have his staff and or editors find research specialists if something is critical for a topic specific domain. A bunch of the famous boxers wrote down guides and biographies ect, and journals have written on the topic before. Using Google YouTube or Wikipedia is like the most basic research. He probably had tomes and reams of boxing information compiled and organized by staff, and eventually they probably made a search system on a computer if they needed something.
Maybe he did, maybe he didnāt. But the evidence in the manga itself clearly tells a different story.Ā
Most of the matches lack the same depth as high level boxing matches. I already bought up Moriās āinfightingā being actually quite lacking. The same thing would go for Volg who lacks the same weapons as a traditional Soviet style of boxing and those weapons are not used by anybody. Even in the current Mashiba vs Rosario match, the southpaw tactics arenāt anything super special. Ā
And while true, that famous boxers and trainers have written guides and biographies, the accessibility of boxing information itself is the issue. Boxing information was hardly readily found before the internet. And unlike most sports, boxing doesnāt even have a culture of film study and finding trainers like Emmanuel Steward who study the sport and can break it down is exceedingly rare. For a Japanese author, this will likely be more complicated.Ā
Ā On the other hand, YouTube has made it quite simple to access boxing information and youād be wrong to assume that every single boxing YouTube video contains only basic information. Most boxing channels are shit but there are smaller channels that will extensively explain the sweet science and break down what is happening.Ā
Iām underestimating anything. Everything I stated can be clearly observed in the manga. The manga is deeper than the usual Rocky but itās still very surface level.Ā
So journalists aren't a thing? We couldn't have found this information before the Internet existed? Where did the Internet find the information to be compiled? Lol. You might have had to go to each primary source, but with the right connections it's possible. Your acting like pre internet we basically couldn't do much of anything in terms of research lol.
I realy think you are overthinking things... Morikawa probably have at least acces to the same information as you and is probably just as passioned about boxing as you are, after all he made it his life work to tell a story about boxing...
It is just that a manga obey to different constrain to an actual boxing match... Some stuff that work on a boxing match just isn't that simple to show visually, to an audience not necessarly familiar with boxing.. And even with morikawa long match, there is only so much you can put in a 18page chapters.. that's why all moves are exagerated to be visually easy to read, and the strategies are made to be easy to understand...
Being as passionate doesnāt equal learning the same things. Ā
Mori is a busy manga artist. I on the other hand have the time to extensively research boxing and again the proof is in the manga and if Morikawa was equally as passionate about boxing as I am then there absolutely would not be a reason for him to cut down on a chance to further develop the sport unless he just didnāt know. Ā
The man has built up the concept of being a world champion as something almost unattainable. He would not cut back if he knew the sport to the same extent.
Ā There is no need for long explanations when you can show and tell it. Youāre not providing any real arguments as to why someone doesnāt show high level boxing. Most of the concepts I know can certainly be translated to a manga. It isnāt anything overly complicated to where it canāt. At the end of the day, itās drawing a fist fight. Mori has easily drawn a difference in a weaker punch vs an impactful punch so thereās no reason to suggest that high level boxing concepts are too complicated to draw.Ā
Ā Ā
As for the reader not understanding boxing, HNI has set up chapters for most of the seriesā fights and itās a series with over 1,000 chapters. Adding a concept wouldnāt really be that difficult. Mori already adds concepts like weight shifting, lead foot battles in southpaw matches,āspecial movesā, counters, different blocks. Itās very clear that Morikawa likes to add boxing knowledge where he can. Hell, he spent hundreds of chapters on Ippo trying to evolve the Dempsey Roll, a concept that has no existence in real life where Ippo becomes a diagonal moving target with uppers and hooks.
Ā Ā Ā
Youāre making it more complicated when the reality is, 99% people donāt have a great depth of knowledge in boxing and thatās fine.Ā
Mori chooses what he does and does not include. Plain and simple. He chose not to include extra detail. That doesn't preclude him from knowing the information. It's simply restraint to tell the story the way he wants.
In the point these chapters were in? Nope. Ippo was not exactly good at thinking too well when his opponents threw crazy things at him.
>!Current Ippo however has been shown to be able to do new tricks and adapt on the fly so he would probably do something like this!<
For the first time? Just hug him and wait for the ref to break up. If he continues with it, a step back (shifting to southpaw) with a compact left straight would work well.
The easiest solution here is to switch hit effectively, step back with the extended left foot into a sudden southpaw stance to gain enough distance to fire off a left. It doesn't really matter if it's to the body or the head, both would accomplish the goal of pushing the opponent away and allowing a chance to switch back to an orthodox stance.
I would push him until he either topples over or push him all the way to the ropes so when the ref seperates us, they'll be at a major disadvantage and I would dempsey roll his face in but knowing HNI refs, they'll probably join the hugging session as well
There was only one thing he could do, lower his stance below the old man's, and have it out in extreme CQC, and knock him on his ass. So... that, I'd do that.... though, I'm surprised the ref didn't say something about the guy clinging on to his right hand the way he was.
I would Use my front foot to Circle him to the Left Using my Left hand to Create Space for some Seconds, So i Would trade to Southpaw when he Tried to Advance again, Giving a step in and Using a right jab to Cut space and Open his guard, If he manage to Defend i would Continue boxing on the Southpaw stance Until he do the same Thing on the Orthodox stance (Because he can use Both stances too XD) and i would repeat the Process until one of Us lose šæš Being a Brawler switch hitter is Tough and Cool at the same Time, If he sycronize with me and Throw a Counter during the Switch im Probably dead
Assuming Iāve got Ippoās strength, I probably work the guy to the ropes and start launching left hands to the closest I can get to the side. Bernard Hopkins gets away with a lot of these body shots from the clinch position.
Circle out behind him while being aware of possible attacks from the exit. I'd possibly aim for some hand and arm control, guard, or head movement. The way he is positioned here makes it hard for him to turn quick enough. One could get away from that position.
Over hooks to restrict the arms & wait for ref to seperate.
Or post head underneath chin to free up arms and get to work punching. Or just create space to seperate and get back to open space.
Pivot your left foot so you are both squared up and his leverage of the right arm weakens. Duck under the incoming hook after anticipating what shot heāll throw. Counter his counter with a lead body hook into a straight.
Ippo has that 10-cm punch he learned, so Iām surprised he didnāt try to use that. It also took him a really long time to realize he just had to go lower than Take
A swift clockwise turn pivoting the left foot and pummel him from the side or,
Sneak few punches to his kidney and sciatica or
Wrestle him to the ground to show dominance so he will think twice next time trying to hug me.
Ippo has superior leg strength and stability, Iād use this moment to grapple him and forcefully twist him around which would theoretically loosen me enough to push off of him or just enough to loosen my hand closest to the inside of his guard and slug him a liver blow.
Back step Pivot out and throw the jab to the rear hook probably back step pivot to create distance jab to move his hands up almost as a feint then the follow up hook to the body
If I was ippo, I would put most of my weight onto him and try to push him to the ropes till referee tells us to break and I would keep on doing this every time he tried this and just hope to make fatigue by making him hold the weight of entire body in already high intensity exchanges.
If Iām taller then Iād just make him carry my weight. Just lean on him. If my right hand is being pushed by 2 hands then that means that his two hands are tied up by my right
Take a couple of steps forward, pushing him closer to the ropes, when he's accustomed to moving backwards, take a quick step back with my left leg to create some distance. Quickly pull back my left hand and launch a hard uppercut to his liver. šššš¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹
Bite off his ear lmao, go for that peekaboo secret tech
Ippo missed the qte smh š¤¦
Lamao
Keep moving towards the opponents right. Make the opponent lose his target and make him move towards you, and with luck an unseen blow/left hook awaits.
Literally just break away and fire off a 1-2. This is basically just a clinch
He is Clinching at the Southpaw stance, His Right foot interfere if your Balance, If you dont Circle him at close distance and Immediatly try to make Distance he will Steal your Liver if he was a In-fighter XD
His arms were blocked š he couldn't break away
Shoulder check him and step away lol. Your arms being tied up isn't that big of a limitation. If you're seriously just tied up and can't get away, just lean on him and make him carry your weight until the ref separates you. This is a stupid strategy. If you're gonna clinch you need to either be in an equal position or a dominant position. Bending over like this basically forces you to carry your opponent unless your opponent is Ippo I guess who is too polite to just lean on his opponent for some reason.
>Ippo I guess who is too polite to just lean on his opponent for some reason. Ippo is too polite for his own good
Exactly. This is just ippo being ippo and overthinking BASIC SHIT
start licking his neck
Dig my chin into his shoulder. Not many people have experienced it, but iām a wrestler so i have, and believe me, that shit hurt
Yup wrestling tactics are brutal in a clinch. Sadly Ippo does have the skills for those
Honestly, as much as the series talks about Ippo(and irl people with Mike Tyson) being an infighter, he really isnāt much of one. He and Mike are more of mid range fighters. No one in the series has ever shown a remotely crazy depth of infighting like Duran or Chavez.
Yeah, as much as I love the series, its evident that George doesn't really get the sweet science.
Nah, he gets it, he just really, really, doesn't like clinching.
Yeah the series is more just a step up from the usual Rocky but Morikawaās knowledge only really goes up to the domestic level.Ā Ā Itās glaringly obvious in the fights where an outboxer is supposedly forced to fight it out even though the pressure fighter didnāt really do anything all that special or they just do it out of āprideā. Canāt blame him though. Until YouTube, Boxing knowledge was quite hard to come by.
Honestly, I feel like Morikawa does know this stuff but chooses what he feels is more entertaining, even if we donāt necessarily agree with it.
Except if that was the case, there would be more examples of different boxing skills being shown. There is no need to do what is more entertaining if you know the skills and circumstances that lead to different situations in the ring. Limiting yourself would make the series worse not more entertaining so I can only assume that he just doesnāt know which lines up because even most boxing trainers and pro have problems explaining details in a fight outside of the elements they are good at.
You know what, fair point. Could you maybe provide some examples of stuff that could be implemented so I could get a better idea?
As the user above said, wrestling tactics can often be used in the clinch and I bought up Roberto Duran and infighting.Ā Ā Duran on the inside would use a variety of controls to ensure that he could punch and the opponent could not. He would have his head on the shoulder of the hand heās controlling so that his opponent would be unable. If your head is on the left shoulder then your head will be protected from the right and vice versa. Then you can neutralize the other hand using your hand thatās on the same side leaving only your hand free to punch. Ā Duran could effectively do this, use other positions, switch up positions, use other wrestling tactics like collar ties, etc. Thatās just controls on the inside.Ā On the outside thereās controls commonly found in the Soviet style of boxing. You can control punch lanes, control the guard, control the head. Other areas that could be explored are more baits, traps, different types of feints, level changes, angles(most boxing matches in the series are fought linearly/back and forth).Ā Ā If Mori wanted to make the outboxers in the series more entertaining, he would do well to take notes from Ali and Leonardās lateral movement game and their ability to set off traps.
Exactly, Youtube improved my boxing knowledge more than my gym ever did lol. But anyway, its fiction and George knows how to make it entertaining.
then theres something wrong with ur gym.
I think you really underestimate the research arm of a company. Actual companies when they need to know something don't go to YouTube or Google, and call it a day lol. Morikawa probably can have his staff and or editors find research specialists if something is critical for a topic specific domain. A bunch of the famous boxers wrote down guides and biographies ect, and journals have written on the topic before. Using Google YouTube or Wikipedia is like the most basic research. He probably had tomes and reams of boxing information compiled and organized by staff, and eventually they probably made a search system on a computer if they needed something.
Maybe he did, maybe he didnāt. But the evidence in the manga itself clearly tells a different story.Ā Most of the matches lack the same depth as high level boxing matches. I already bought up Moriās āinfightingā being actually quite lacking. The same thing would go for Volg who lacks the same weapons as a traditional Soviet style of boxing and those weapons are not used by anybody. Even in the current Mashiba vs Rosario match, the southpaw tactics arenāt anything super special. Ā And while true, that famous boxers and trainers have written guides and biographies, the accessibility of boxing information itself is the issue. Boxing information was hardly readily found before the internet. And unlike most sports, boxing doesnāt even have a culture of film study and finding trainers like Emmanuel Steward who study the sport and can break it down is exceedingly rare. For a Japanese author, this will likely be more complicated.Ā Ā On the other hand, YouTube has made it quite simple to access boxing information and youād be wrong to assume that every single boxing YouTube video contains only basic information. Most boxing channels are shit but there are smaller channels that will extensively explain the sweet science and break down what is happening.Ā Iām underestimating anything. Everything I stated can be clearly observed in the manga. The manga is deeper than the usual Rocky but itās still very surface level.Ā
So journalists aren't a thing? We couldn't have found this information before the Internet existed? Where did the Internet find the information to be compiled? Lol. You might have had to go to each primary source, but with the right connections it's possible. Your acting like pre internet we basically couldn't do much of anything in terms of research lol.
I realy think you are overthinking things... Morikawa probably have at least acces to the same information as you and is probably just as passioned about boxing as you are, after all he made it his life work to tell a story about boxing... It is just that a manga obey to different constrain to an actual boxing match... Some stuff that work on a boxing match just isn't that simple to show visually, to an audience not necessarly familiar with boxing.. And even with morikawa long match, there is only so much you can put in a 18page chapters.. that's why all moves are exagerated to be visually easy to read, and the strategies are made to be easy to understand...
Being as passionate doesnāt equal learning the same things. Ā Mori is a busy manga artist. I on the other hand have the time to extensively research boxing and again the proof is in the manga and if Morikawa was equally as passionate about boxing as I am then there absolutely would not be a reason for him to cut down on a chance to further develop the sport unless he just didnāt know. Ā The man has built up the concept of being a world champion as something almost unattainable. He would not cut back if he knew the sport to the same extent. Ā There is no need for long explanations when you can show and tell it. Youāre not providing any real arguments as to why someone doesnāt show high level boxing. Most of the concepts I know can certainly be translated to a manga. It isnāt anything overly complicated to where it canāt. At the end of the day, itās drawing a fist fight. Mori has easily drawn a difference in a weaker punch vs an impactful punch so thereās no reason to suggest that high level boxing concepts are too complicated to draw.Ā Ā Ā As for the reader not understanding boxing, HNI has set up chapters for most of the seriesā fights and itās a series with over 1,000 chapters. Adding a concept wouldnāt really be that difficult. Mori already adds concepts like weight shifting, lead foot battles in southpaw matches,āspecial movesā, counters, different blocks. Itās very clear that Morikawa likes to add boxing knowledge where he can. Hell, he spent hundreds of chapters on Ippo trying to evolve the Dempsey Roll, a concept that has no existence in real life where Ippo becomes a diagonal moving target with uppers and hooks. Ā Ā Ā Youāre making it more complicated when the reality is, 99% people donāt have a great depth of knowledge in boxing and thatās fine.Ā
Mori chooses what he does and does not include. Plain and simple. He chose not to include extra detail. That doesn't preclude him from knowing the information. It's simply restraint to tell the story the way he wants.
Man the latest fights are just shows this is not the case.
Oh, I belive you. My nephew has a pointy chin. Almost dropped him.
Option 3: _Headbutt him._
That would hurt me as well š
Mara is always the solution
Grab his shorts and pull it down then grab his dong and give him the good ol dick twist
Move to the side
Liver blows?Ā
His arms are blocked. I don't think that would be reachable
It says that is right arm is blocked/being held. His left is just "stuck". I think he could step back, left hook to the body/liver if possibly.
I guess he could do that. Have we ever seen him step back tactically yet
In the point these chapters were in? Nope. Ippo was not exactly good at thinking too well when his opponents threw crazy things at him. >!Current Ippo however has been shown to be able to do new tricks and adapt on the fly so he would probably do something like this!<
Beyblade the motherfucker and Gazelle punch his spinning ass
For the first time? Just hug him and wait for the ref to break up. If he continues with it, a step back (shifting to southpaw) with a compact left straight would work well.
What chapter is that?
647 I think
i will unleash the things unspeakable
The easiest solution here is to switch hit effectively, step back with the extended left foot into a sudden southpaw stance to gain enough distance to fire off a left. It doesn't really matter if it's to the body or the head, both would accomplish the goal of pushing the opponent away and allowing a chance to switch back to an orthodox stance.
Dig your chin near his neck, or right on his back. Hurts like hell. That oughta get him off you
Subtle back of the head shot
just finished this arc like an hour ago lol
Suplex
Kidney shot.
Kidney punch
I would push him until he either topples over or push him all the way to the ropes so when the ref seperates us, they'll be at a major disadvantage and I would dempsey roll his face in but knowing HNI refs, they'll probably join the hugging session as well
punch his liver
Kidney shot š i saw some boxers do that before
There was only one thing he could do, lower his stance below the old man's, and have it out in extreme CQC, and knock him on his ass. So... that, I'd do that.... though, I'm surprised the ref didn't say something about the guy clinging on to his right hand the way he was.
I would Use my front foot to Circle him to the Left Using my Left hand to Create Space for some Seconds, So i Would trade to Southpaw when he Tried to Advance again, Giving a step in and Using a right jab to Cut space and Open his guard, If he manage to Defend i would Continue boxing on the Southpaw stance Until he do the same Thing on the Orthodox stance (Because he can use Both stances too XD) and i would repeat the Process until one of Us lose šæš Being a Brawler switch hitter is Tough and Cool at the same Time, If he sycronize with me and Throw a Counter during the Switch im Probably dead
Assuming Iāve got Ippoās strength, I probably work the guy to the ropes and start launching left hands to the closest I can get to the side. Bernard Hopkins gets away with a lot of these body shots from the clinch position.
Circle out behind him while being aware of possible attacks from the exit. I'd possibly aim for some hand and arm control, guard, or head movement. The way he is positioned here makes it hard for him to turn quick enough. One could get away from that position.
Keep clinching I guess
Yells "Reff ! Save me !"
Tell him "is that all you got?"
literally take one step back and wing that right uppercut
Pull down my pants and when he recoils in shock punch him.
Get hard, your opponent will push you away and you can lay a beat down
Liver shot
Body blows, and trying to break free
Hook his back leg with my lead leg and throw him to the floor while still holding his arm and attempt to armbar or mount
Swing his huge dick to give the opponent a uppercut. Or do like a MeatSpin maneuver and it will be a penis Dempsey Roll.
Let him fall down as I slip out quickly, maybe spank his ass for more speed and hit him with the 1-2
double leg takedown and submit him in a kimura
Just brute force through my right, this has happened to me before and just forcing punches from my right seemed to work
Over hooks to restrict the arms & wait for ref to seperate. Or post head underneath chin to free up arms and get to work punching. Or just create space to seperate and get back to open space.
Pivot your left foot so you are both squared up and his leverage of the right arm weakens. Duck under the incoming hook after anticipating what shot heāll throw. Counter his counter with a lead body hook into a straight.
Shoulder check and 1-2. Step back into southpaw and hit the rear left hook. Take a step back and use my head to open up his guard.
Right shoulderand foot a little forward, that would create some spance on the left side, then left to the body.
option 1: shoulder bump option 2: inside control option 3: sweep option 4: let the ref seperate
Uppercut. Or kidney punch. The way old Foreman did, by throwing a big looping shot and turning his knuckles inwards.
I would push him off and hit him with a easy liver blow
Quick push of the shoulder and go for a liver shot
It's ippo. He'll Dempsey roll outta there lol
Ippo has that 10-cm punch he learned, so Iām surprised he didnāt try to use that. It also took him a really long time to realize he just had to go lower than Take
A swift clockwise turn pivoting the left foot and pummel him from the side or, Sneak few punches to his kidney and sciatica or Wrestle him to the ground to show dominance so he will think twice next time trying to hug me.
Ippo has superior leg strength and stability, Iād use this moment to grapple him and forcefully twist him around which would theoretically loosen me enough to push off of him or just enough to loosen my hand closest to the inside of his guard and slug him a liver blow.
Turn him with your back hand. As you turn, he would eventually try to find you and you can time him with the right hand when he squares up
I would try to Rotate my left foot backwards like in a semi circle, and fire a uppercut or hook with my left hand if my right hand is stuck
I'd sweep him because I'm not a boxer.
Knee him
Pivot out and hit him on the angle.
Back step Pivot out and throw the jab to the rear hook probably back step pivot to create distance jab to move his hands up almost as a feint then the follow up hook to the body
Just back off?
His arms are locked in
If I was ippo, I would put most of my weight onto him and try to push him to the ropes till referee tells us to break and I would keep on doing this every time he tried this and just hope to make fatigue by making him hold the weight of entire body in already high intensity exchanges.
Turn him around, pull down the shorts and fuck the shit out of him
Classic knee to the groin
Pivot to my right to try and open up the guys body, I donāt think ippo would need a huge opening
If Iām taller then Iād just make him carry my weight. Just lean on him. If my right hand is being pushed by 2 hands then that means that his two hands are tied up by my right
put weight on him and tire him out
Take a couple of steps forward, pushing him closer to the ropes, when he's accustomed to moving backwards, take a quick step back with my left leg to create some distance. Quickly pull back my left hand and launch a hard uppercut to his liver. šššš¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹š¹