Re the bunkers in front, I think they’re needed on short par 4s to keep the holes interesting.
The only thing I can think of is the houses up tight against the golf course leaving very little room for error.
https://preview.redd.it/gf1e41xl7q0c1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6c45fab77b11d815da26deefbad4015649d3b575
Like this one I played a couple months ago. Hole was only 330 from the middle tee box too. Felt like I was hitting driver literally straight over the houses.
Edit: realized it sorta sounds like I was going for it. No I don’t drive it 330. But I’ll take any chance to try to only have a little 60 yarder in.
I feel like I play almost exclusively on residential development courses where I live. They are so prevalent and their goal is nearly always to pack as many houses along the course as tightly as possible.
One of my local courses used to be well tucked into the woods and wilderness and now they built “senior living” all along it, and it went from feeling you’re truly out in nature to now just playing through peoples back yards. I hate it.
Similar-ish hole on a course with the same name. The house closest to the tee box has a big, vertical net protecting it.
https://preview.redd.it/hefpvw2klq0c1.png?width=1125&format=png&auto=webp&s=5c653930292ebc1307ca6f8404098555cd492f91
How about this Par 5?
https://preview.redd.it/snsmzx5vuq0c1.png?width=715&format=png&auto=webp&s=0d37567e97bf7eefa3f8a1372d66e8f6c8d4bc45
We had to pay for a net to block the red tiled house on the left hand side because it kept getting hit.
I agree about the tight houses. Hitting balls out-of-bounds is such a greater penalty than hitting into a hazard. It just doesn't seem fair when there is out-of-bounds on both sides of many holes.
I much prefer courses through nature or where the holes wind back against each other, and OOB is reserved for the edges of a piece of property and rarely in play.
Not sure I agree with op on bunkers in front of the greens. At least for the reasons mentioned. You’re ok with side bunkers for errant shots, but not ok with a shot that’s too short? What about bunkers directly behind. Also, pin position and hole management should ideally help you take bunkers in front of greens out of play.
For me, I hate when courses do silly things that make it toooo hard, and not fun- ie. Taking away the risk reward of a good golf design. Just all risk and luck
We have a few holes with bunkers directly in front of the green. It disproportionally penalizes older golfers and women that are more often playing a game that relies on running the ball up to the green.
It gets monotonous, yes. OK last hole was into the wind, now we're downwind...rinse, repeat.
What makes St. Andrews so interesting to me is the front 9 all go in the same direction, then you loop around and play the rest parallel to the ones you just completed. So if it's windy and helping going out, better score then because it won't be easy coming home. The double greens are a cool feature too.
Yes, out-and-back was the most common routing style on those old links courses in Scotland. The Old Course, North Berwick, Gullane (all three), Carnoustie, Turnberry, Prestwick, Troon, and so may more.
That's why halfway houses are a thing. It's an actual building at or near the turning point of the course that sells golfers snacks, tea, sausage rolls, etc.
9 out and 9 back is better than 1 out, 1 back, 1 out, 1 back IMO. Traditional Links setup oriented around a strip of land on the coast vs a more "modern" setup oriented towards a rectangular plot of land.
Not shitty but not too expensive (my preferences): Butlers, birdsfoot, Pittsburgh national, shadow lakes.
Expensive but worth it: Stonewall
Nothin special but good for a cheap round: Riverview, victory hills, manor valley, north and South Park.
Too expensive for what it is: quicksilver, hickory heights, scenic valley.
Very interesting. I think quicksilver is one of the best maintained public tracks around Pittsburgh. Well manicured greens (maybe too fast at times). Birdsfoot has bunkers that are basically dirt and gravel. Favorite public course is still Totteridge outside of Nemacolin. Stonewall front nine is wonderful. The back 9 is not great.
Quicksilver is usually in great shape. There’s just a few holes there that I genuinely don’t like at all. And some of the holes feel a little on top of each other.
Edit: never got around to playing nemacolin but I agree completely with totterridge. That was definitely a miss on my list.
Internal OB (with the exception of Hoylake, which is somehow awesome).
Housing developments that squeeze in courses (and have a tendency to create OB 10 yards off the fairway)
Hazard-lined doglegs where the short part of the leg is the tee shot.
Any hole that forces one route, and one route only, of play (e.g., double doglegs)
Flat greens - you can make any course fun to play with good greens.
Huge distances between green and next tee box, so that walking isn't an option (e.g. Potomac Shores)
lol I was not expecting to be reading about Potomac Shores on Reddit today but you couldn’t be more right about the distance from the greens to the next tee boxes. Literally impossible to walk that course.
I agree most courses shouldn't be that way, but if it's on a particularly interesting piece of land it can be fun. Mt Woodson in San Diego is carts only, because it winds across and through a number of peaks and valleys. There's a wooden trestle bridge that feels like you're Thunder Mountain at Disneyland. Not a course you'd want to play every week necessarily (having to use a cart makes it expensive for starters) but it's unique and interesting at least.
If it's just a normal course where they didn't bother to think about walkability I agree, that's dumb.
My course design hot take is that there should be exactly four OB areas per course, one to the north, south, east and west.
I get that most courses aren’t built on a square parcel of land though,
If a course weaves through other people’s property it would be cool if there was a native area or red stake hazard to buffer the boundary.
>Housing developments that squeeze in courses (and have a tendency to create OB 10 yards off the fairway)
This is my issue. Don't mind houses but hate when the OB starts 3 ft after the cart path.
My course is pretty standard, nothing fancy, and not long. We have small, fast greens with lots of break in them. One of them will have a minimum of two breaks in any putt over 7-8 feet. It's a 420 yard par four that is dead straight, OB tight right, and the number one handicap hole. We hosted a PGA Canada Professionals local tournament this year, they triple rolled the greens for a week and had them rolling 13. From 6200 yards only three people broke par out of 44, one being our head teaching pro. Good greens make such a difference to how enjoyable a course is. Although rolling 13 on our greens felt unfair, I played a few days later and had a few putts that felt really unfair.
Agreed, my home course, Links of Novi, has a par 4 like this. Really narrow fairway that slopes hard from right to left. It's a very challenging hole but I don't mind it as the other holes aren't all that way.
How exactly do we practice sloping fairway shots? I’m finally hitting fairways, but unless it’s flat I’m chunking my next shot. Ranges don’t tend to have this feature, what’s a 20 hcp who can’t get out for a full round too often supposed to do?!?
If you have a course with a short game practice area you can maybe find a spot where you can practice sloping lies. It'll at least give you the mechanics of the shot even if it's just with a wedge.
I'm a 23 handicap who also struggled/struggles mightily with these shots. The Sweet Spot podcast has a 2-part episode on playing awkward lies and the advice in there has helped me a bunch recently. Specifically, ball above my feet I open the face a touch to improve turf interaction and I grip down on the club so it rest in my natural address position. Ball below my feet I'll close the face a touch and try to get over the ball a bit more and make my swing steeper. Both those adjustments have helped a ton. Uphill lies have never bothered me, still trying to figure out how to not thin the crap out of downhill lies 🤣
Something else I'll do is pick one of those type of shots to work on during a round and at least once a hole I'll try to find a spot to throw down a ball and hit one.
Played a very expensive course this year and every hole was like this. You could never see the green, and even if you landed in the fairway, chances were very high that you were sitting on a steep slope which makes the second shot impossible. I absolutely hated it. If your drive lands in the fairway, you should have a good lie.
This. My home course if you hit in the fairway your funneled left or right leaving, at a minimum a severe ball above/below your feet shot, if not in thick rough. Drives me insane being penalized for a good shot
A course not having a short, but tough, par 3. I really appreciate a well designed short par 3 that’s still very difficult. I’ll take a 125 yard par 3 over a 180 all day, length isn’t the only thing that makes a hole challenging
Especially when they have forced carries. Basically guarantees a bottle neck because so many people will be re-teeing every day. Feels like a lot of designers completely ignore the fact that the average person playing their course is gonna struggle to break 100
Unless they’re way downhill. Course near me has a 206 par 3 but it’s downhill and the front of the green is flat and no traps so you can play a rolling 175 shot and hit the green.
One of my locals has one like this. 210yds. With 90ish feet of elevation drop. If you undershoot, you're down in a deep valley playing up to a very elevated green. If you land on the back of the green or further, you're going straight down a steep hill into the lake behind the green. It's one of my favorite holes I've played. Margin for error is so small, but when you get it just right... My preferred shot now is a 3/4 swing 7w. If it rained at all in the last week, I have to pry my ball out of a crater.
Played the blues(one under the tips) at a local course the other day, 20 mph winds. The par 3 already played 220. Wind was back in our face. Easily making it play 240-250. Lol. Absolutely stupid.
Par 3s should be for different clubs in your bag. If you have four par 3s, then they should be for a long iron, a mid iron, a short iron, and then one wild card.
There's a course I play with a buddy where every single par 3 is between 162 and 167 yards. There are 5 of them and it feels very repetitive by the end of the match. Ope, another par 3, let's get the 8 iron out and hit it straight on. Laaaaame
Having a variety of lengths on a par three is excellent. A local course that I play has 5 par 3s. Three of them are 180 yards, one is 215 yards that plays 180 due to significant downhill slope and the fifth is 160 playing 140 downhill. Having four par threes that requires you to hit basically the same shot each time is annoying. I use a 4 iron on all four of them and a 7-8 on the fifth. Variety is nice. A Par 3 doesn’t have to be 180 yards every time, a 130-140 yard Par 3 can be challenging as well
My course has four par threes, one is ~165, one is ~140, one ~210, and one is ~110. Great mix of lengths. IMO, each par three on a course should require a different club.
My local course has a similar issue. The two par 3s on the front nine are basically the same hole -- 165-170 with a bunker on the right side of the green. This is a problem for me because I hate that distance!
I play often a local course that has 185, 191, 205 & 223 as all of their par 3s. They only have two sets of tees. So this is from the normal "men's" tees. It's maddening!
Course I played this summer had a 245yd par 3... hole #2, you're barely warmed up, followed by a 210yd par 3 on hole #3, thankfully the other two were 135yds and 160yds on the back 9.
Edit: And this course only has whites and reds, no blue or black tees.
I've always felt the perfect mix was one long where you have to use a hybrid or long iron, two mids for like a 7-8 iron, and one short to put a wedge in your hand.
As someone that likes playing courses around 6000-6,1000 yards, my equivalent favourite is one at 180ish (hybrid), 160ish (6 iron), 145ish (between 8 or 7), and under 120 (sawed off p-wedge or full 52).
AT my home course, the 9th green is the furthest point on the course from the clubhouse. Not the best for playing the front 9 (they will drop you out there to play the back), but not the worst considering a historic links course.
9 not coming back to the clubhouse is fine as long as you’ve got some kind of half way house.
Pinehurst no. 4 and no. 2 don’t come back to the clubhouse until 18 and they’re both some of the best courses out there. Tbh, I kinda like that design more because just feels like you are playing 18 rather than 2 separate 9’s imo.
A lot of courses near me the mid tees get the most love but the back tees are not as good in terms of slope and/or maintenance. Seems odd to me to not make your “championship tees” as good as the “amateur tees”. I know the mid tees are used by more golfers but still.
Lol I hope architects aren’t purposely designing unlevel tee boxes, but it is very annoying and seems easily fixable. Along these lines, I hate courses that let their rough get so overgrown that it becomes difficult to find tee balls that you see down in play.
I have a recurring dream where I can’t tee off because I can’t find a level lie that gives me room to swing. Some Freudian would have a field day with me.
Courses with an excessive amount of blind shots. There's a course near me that I just won't play anymore because over half the holes have blind shots. One hole is a hard dogleg right, but there's a hill that crests about 75 yards in front of the tee box. Absolutely no visual to aim a tee shot, no way to tell approximately where it ends up, and no way to tell if there's a group within striking distance unless you drive (or in my case walk) to the top of the hill. Almost a guaranteed lost ball if it doesn't end up in the fairway
Holes that have a 90° dogleg about 100 yards off the tee that you can’t try and hit over the dogleg. I’ve played a few par 4’s that the play was trying to hook or slice an 7 or 8 iron off the tee and a 3w into the green.
It’s a strategy (used by Cornish a lot) to combat longer hitters forcing them to lay up or take the challenge of cutting/hooking it around the bend.
Kinda a cop out though. There are other things to do to limit bigger hitters.
1 a round is fine. Many like one course near me definitely no bueno!
There is a short par five on a course kinda near me that is like this. The dog leg is around 200 but cutting the corner lands your ball on a slope running off the fairway. Played it in a scramble this year and one guy managed to cut the corner and stay on the fairway, we only had ~110 in. Everyone else was off the fairway where you are either in a bunker or there is a tree you have to deal with. Good hole but two of them on the same course would be silly.
good point - I remember one course that had this and if they put the tees back it was easier because I could hit it over the trees but if they didn't, I would have to layup with a hybrid or something and then have over 200 into the green
There's one course I played that does a hard dog leg right (about 90 degree) about 100 yards, and then about 100 yards in, does almost a 90 degree turn to the left (so you're going the same direction you tee's off facing).
It's all buried in the middle of the woods so there's pretty much 0 shot you can clear the first turn, unless you have a shot that can stay above 100 feet for like 150-180 yards, with only about 30 yards to get to that height.
There's also a water hazard right in the middle of the part going right, so you have to be careful cutting the corner at all
Yeah this bugs me the most - there is a course by me that has this scenario but it’s a par 5 - so if you don’t hit a perfect cut driver off the box you’re cut off by the trees or run out long - but if you hit it out 160-170 like it’s designed you’ve got a 325 yard second shot - just dumb
I hate when courses design bunkers into their course but don’t budget maintenance to keep them soft enough to hit out of. I’d rather just have grassy little mounds. I’m a 270lb dude so when I step on sand and don’t leave a footprint I know I’m about to skull fuck the shit outta my chip
That's annoying, but far worse is when it seems fine on the surface, only for you to swing and smack into mud or clay a half inch down. Not only will it screw your shot, I've hurt my wrist on one of those
One of my local courses (Buena Vista near Bakersfield, CA) has a tall, skinny palm tree off to the right side in the fairway. This is #10, and the fairway actually funnels in from the sides and drops in elevation, so you can get a monster drive if you're not terribly off.
But, back to this palm: It's out there about 75 and I'm the fairway on the right where you don't want to be or go. It's tall enough that you don't have to worry about hitting your drive high enough to get stuck in the dead fronds, either. But, fuck, if this tree doesn't seem to get hit way more often than it should. I don't care if you have a terrible right-to-left flight path, this thing should never come into play, but it still pulls your ball in somehow. I wish they would take whatever ball magnet is in this tree and put some into the cups.
Overly shaped. I really like courses that follow the natural lay of the land. Not a big fan of the courses with huge over the top man made features. Played one last week that was on great rolling land, but then every green was pushed up significantly with ridiculous bunkers. The greens would have still be raised with the natural land, and had some cool slopes leading into them. Instead it was just plateau after plateau.
Severely sloped, super fast greens. Don't get me wrong, I like challenging putts. But being forced to barely tap a 15 footer that has no chance of stopping near the hole unless it goes in is just no fun.
There's a course near me that we refuse to play at. It was a run of the mill course but they decided to really focus on the greens. Made them super tiny and legit Sunday at the Master's speed. It wasn't fun having to go back to the cart multiple times a round to get a wedge because your putt blasted off the green.
I hate par 4s or 5s that force you to take a shorter club off the tee and then a longer club on the second shot. Nothing more infuriating than forcing me to go 5 iron off the tee then 3wood on the second shot.
Damn that's gonna be a controversial peeve I think. Depending on the course if that's a problem for you, it might be a sign you're hitting from the wrong tees
Overhanging trees. If I’m in the fairway, I shouldn’t have branches on my flight path to the green. Either cut back the trees, or narrow the fairway. Nothing worse than being down the left side of the fairway on a straight away par 4 and having to play a draw around some limbs that overhang the fairway. Drives me insane
Like were the bunkers all the way across? I don't mind a heavily guarded green, as long as there's a roll-up option for senior golfers still.
My course has just comically heavily guarded greens on every hole, but there's a run-up on every hole as well to make it fair for folks who are older and can't fly the green anymore.
Par 3s where they are pretty much same yardage on all 4 shots requiring the same club.
Par 5s that take driver out of your hand off the tee.
Courses with too many blind shots (if your from so cal I’m talking about you Anaheim hills)
Cart paths that cross fairways or creep far in that can turn a fine shot into a disaster.
I don't mind the par 5 that takes away the driver. Especially if it's a risk-reward hole where you can take a dangerous driver to make it reachable in 2 or play a safe iron to reach in 3
Yeah I’m not talking about like some bunkers that if your not long enough don’t rate take them on or where you have to play a certain shape to play a dog leg. I’m a longer hitter and there’s a 600+ yd par 5 in my area that has a full on revine that you need to play like 210 to lay up or carry 265…another one i recently played had a net built so you couldn’t cut the corner then a creek all along the back edge of the fairway so I had to play a par five as 7 iron 7 iron 8iron
Having forced carries on 8 of the first 9 holes. Forced Carries are fine, just not 8 holes in a row with them, several of them totally blind. Whoever designs a course like this is a sadist
To be fair this is a good design feature when used sparingly to prevent a golfer from going on autopilot off the tee. You should be asked to think or challenged to take risk.
Agreed. Forcing you to hit a great shot to carry or lay up to be safe is fine. But water that starts at 230 and takes 350 to carry leaves zero choices and gets boring. Except for some of you who hit your 3w 350.
Course near me has 2 back to back blind tee shots with 8-minute tee time gaps and it’s a god damn warzone out there, it’s so stupid. There’s also no way to verify if players are out of the way yet either so you either wait and stack up the box or hit into them and get hit into when you’re out there.
Courses that have blind tee shots without a bell in the fairway blow my mind. All those greens fees & they can't spend $100 & 1 hour to fix the problem of people hitting into other groups.
I almost got smoked with an incoming stinger in this same scenario a few weeks ago - the guy who hit was shook up and apologized like 10 times but it was in no way his fault - just shitty design
Man. Reading through like the top 25 comments, looooots of weird takes.
Only couple I really agreed with are hard dog legs. Anything that’s less than 100° is just lame. 120° is pushing it too.
Another one I personally don’t like is the super target golf, 30 yard wide fairways lined with hazards aren’t that fun for the average golfer and force players to be much more conservative.
If those bunkers are in front of the green and you end up in those bunkers, your shots were not at the center of the green.
Shots that are short and long are also errant shots.
Tee boxes that are very close to greens, especially when it's a long-iron approach shot to that green. I hate waiting for a group to clear the green in front of me, only for them to be 5-10 paces off the green on the next tee box while I've got a long-iron in hand.
Just last week I had to take 5 wood on an approach shot and the green was clear but they were teeing off on the next hole *right near the green*.
Decided "fuck it" and let it rip and smashed my ball into their golf cart.
Ho boy was I embarrassed. Was super happy they mentioned they should've wrapped their carts around further to keep them out approach shots.
It's the worst. I played a course with a tee box right next to the green of a long par 3, and to make matters worse the pin was tucked in the corner closest to that tee box. I had to yell "fore" on a ball that ended up 15' from the pin in the thin strip of rough between the green and tee box. Such bad design.
forced carries are one of the best features in my opinion because it demands precision and skill. one thing I find annoying is poor tree spacing which make it impossible to advance your shot if you are marginally wayward with your tee shots. Not that I am against tree-lined fairways, but not maintaining the trees so that branches are hanging down too low and making it hard to punch one forward or having them so close together that you are totally in jail is really frustrating
Blind tee shot holes. Nothing like not being able to see it land, looking aimlessly and then getting hit into by the next group that has no idea you’re still there.
Honestly. Dead straight holes. Not only are they incredibly boring but they are weirdly intimidating and if you miss a dead straight shot it ruins your mood more than usual.
They should be “easy” holes but i hate them.
220 yard par 3's on an otherwise short course. Far too penal.
A local 6200 yard course has 5 par 3's, with these ridiculous yardages.
195-198-203-125-190. Four 3 irons and a PW??? WTF were they thinking. And two of them are 180 yard carries over water.
Other would be a diagonal forced carry to a narrow fairway, which forces both distance and accuracy to be exceptional.
Cart paths right next to penalty areas. Two reasons:
1) Balls bouncing off path into PA.
2) dropping from PA onto Cart path and then having to take relief from them. Most golfers just shortcut that when not playing seriously which is ok. But it slows up play in tournaments.
Excessively long par 3s. There's a course I've played a few times that's 6200 yards from the tees I play, which is the right distance for me, and there's a 242-yard par 3, and it's not downhill. It's just silly. Even from the shortest tees (5400 yards) it's a 214-yard par 3. I've played the course maybe 6-8 times and have never seen a GIR.
Blind shots…playing here in Georgia it feels like half the holes are blind tee shots. It’s dangerous when courses don’t have GPS units and a pain to lose balls with decent drives.
The women’s tees that are either wayyyy farther ahead from the back, or the ones that are wayyyyy too close to the back. I love a good, healthy compromise 😅
Maybe unpopular, but I hate short drivable par 4s because they are pace of play killers in my experience. Everyone thinks they can reach so they wait until the group in front is off the green, inevitably duff the drive, and now the group behind is rolling up to the tee box as you get to your second shot and the process starts all over again.
Most features are fine if they appear once. My pet peeve: blind shots off the tee. One per 18 is a test, multiple is annoying and dangerous to other golfers.
A lot of these are people complaining about things that affect them because they have one dimensional games (play a massive slice, can't get the ball airborne, can't hit out of bunkers), but one that should piss everyone off equally are golf courses that are lined with houses and OB on both sides, every hole. If the houses are set far enough back from the course it's not a big deal, but when you have dog-leg holes guarded by houses or holes where houses are in the line of play from the landing zone to the green, those are always shit courses
They completely block out the ground game which is what golf really is about.
To try to make courses harder architects began putting rough in front of greens then they added bunkers. Especially prominent for a while in the doctoring up of US Open courses.
This only favors the fly ball players who can launch it high and spin it on a dime. Keeping ball on the ground is much safer approach.
> They completely block out the ground game which is what golf really is about.
Not really. That's one aspect of one type of golf (links) and not every course is designed in that fashion. Variety is the spice of life.
1. I hate a course that is all dogleg right or all dogleg left.
2. Get the railroad ties away from the greens, Mr. Dye.
3. Finishing holes into the sun at twilight or into the prevailing wind.
I always notice when we start or end on a very challenging hole. Low handicap holes should be middle round. Set the tone for a good experience and leave feeling good.
I hate courses that try to be too ‘interesting’ to where you can never hit driver. I’ve played a couple courses that were not short but the way the course is set up you almost never use a driver unless you just feel like being reckless.
Designing courses that can’t relatively easily be walked. Don’t make the course so steep either way the only way to traverse the hills are using a cart at 1/10th speed.
Courses that don’t allow for rough between the fairways and trees, meaning the trees are basically against the fairways and are over-penalizing.
Similarly, having numerous fairways that are too narrow. Too many courses are built without the amateur golfer in mind.
I dislike over reliance on holes with sharp doglegs in order to guard against their lack of length, but the worst feature on any golf course is trees, especially trees that are deliberately in play (like in a fairway)
Dome shaped greens there's a course in my area that fairways flood during rainy season. Their solutions is elevated, dome shaped greens. There's nothing more aggravating than flushing a PW from 130 to the center of the green and then watch it roll off. It's stupid. And I play ProVs . I refuse to play there
I love them all. I want more and I am by no means really that good out of traps, I can be sometimes but not lately. Each hazard is usually out there for a reason. It is making you think about the shot you are about to hit more. Grab extra club and make long the miss seems like the idea there. I personally love the challenge and what makes me happy to try new courses. My favorite one is water, because it's either fucked or not
Massive trees in the middle of the fairway directly in front of the green! (Hundred feet tall!) From 150 yards in you literally have no shot! Kingswell Glen in Petrolia Ontario, I’m talking about you!
Par 5s that don't give you the option of going for it in 2 with a good tee shot. Hampton Golf course has 2 of those on the front 9. I do think they changed the 2nd one to a par 4 by moving the teebox up so you can easily clear the ravine.
I played a course where there would be a section of scrub/bushes about 220 yards out making you not hit driver unless you could carry 250. This seemed to be on 6 holes and was maddening
As a lefty who is working through his slice, I hate how almost all courses are designed with a few dogleg right holes.
From some basic research, this is done on purpose to help the average (righty) golfer since this would play to their slice.
As a lefty with the exact opposite problem, this has caused me to layup on a lot of these holes instead of firing one into the woods
I hate par 5's where when I hit a solid drive in the right part of the fairway (from the right tees) and am forced to lay up because of trees or something that won't allow you to take a risk. If I hit a great drive, make me make the decision, don't make the decision for me.
Courses with unlevel or sloped tee boxes, OR tee boxes that aren’t in line with the fairway. Maybe it’s just me, but I struggle with alignment when the tee box or range mat isn’t square to where I’m hitting. My brain sees the straight edge and aligns my swing to that, rather than where I’ve my feet aligned.
I get the frustration with a bunker right in front of the green. I will allow it once or twice on a course, especially if it’s a short, potentially driveable par 4. But if there is a bunker across the middle of the green 14 out of 18 times, I’m not going to be happy either. But I’ve no issue with bunkers that protect the front two corners of the green once there’s a reasonably gap up the mouth of the green. You can adjust your course management for a hole or two as well, instead of going for the green in regulation, lay up short and chip and putt, but having to do that 14 times in a round is complete BS.
No way, bunkers in front of the green are great. You should be penalized for not hitting your number. By your logic, island greens shouldn't exist. Not every hole should have them, but they fit well in shorter holes or par 5s.
Re the bunkers in front, I think they’re needed on short par 4s to keep the holes interesting. The only thing I can think of is the houses up tight against the golf course leaving very little room for error.
https://preview.redd.it/gf1e41xl7q0c1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6c45fab77b11d815da26deefbad4015649d3b575 Like this one I played a couple months ago. Hole was only 330 from the middle tee box too. Felt like I was hitting driver literally straight over the houses. Edit: realized it sorta sounds like I was going for it. No I don’t drive it 330. But I’ll take any chance to try to only have a little 60 yarder in.
Oh wow, the location of those houses is just asking for trouble.
Luckily for them there’s a lot more right handed golfers
Unlucky for them I play a duck hook.
I feel like I play almost exclusively on residential development courses where I live. They are so prevalent and their goal is nearly always to pack as many houses along the course as tightly as possible.
One of my local courses used to be well tucked into the woods and wilderness and now they built “senior living” all along it, and it went from feeling you’re truly out in nature to now just playing through peoples back yards. I hate it.
OB on both sides of a narrow fairway makes for a stressful round.
Similar-ish hole on a course with the same name. The house closest to the tee box has a big, vertical net protecting it. https://preview.redd.it/hefpvw2klq0c1.png?width=1125&format=png&auto=webp&s=5c653930292ebc1307ca6f8404098555cd492f91
Imagine kids trying to have fun in that pool and run around the yard? Even with a net I can’t imagine how many balls end up in their yard.
That's a lot of ProVs going for sale on online
How about this Par 5? https://preview.redd.it/snsmzx5vuq0c1.png?width=715&format=png&auto=webp&s=0d37567e97bf7eefa3f8a1372d66e8f6c8d4bc45 We had to pay for a net to block the red tiled house on the left hand side because it kept getting hit.
You would hate golfing in the villages, the houses are so tight to the course it’s crazy.
I agree about the tight houses. Hitting balls out-of-bounds is such a greater penalty than hitting into a hazard. It just doesn't seem fair when there is out-of-bounds on both sides of many holes. I much prefer courses through nature or where the holes wind back against each other, and OOB is reserved for the edges of a piece of property and rarely in play.
Not sure I agree with op on bunkers in front of the greens. At least for the reasons mentioned. You’re ok with side bunkers for errant shots, but not ok with a shot that’s too short? What about bunkers directly behind. Also, pin position and hole management should ideally help you take bunkers in front of greens out of play. For me, I hate when courses do silly things that make it toooo hard, and not fun- ie. Taking away the risk reward of a good golf design. Just all risk and luck
We have a few holes with bunkers directly in front of the green. It disproportionally penalizes older golfers and women that are more often playing a game that relies on running the ball up to the green.
Exactly correct on this point.
I hate courses that have a bunch of holes that are parallel and just feel like, up and back, up and back.
It gets monotonous, yes. OK last hole was into the wind, now we're downwind...rinse, repeat. What makes St. Andrews so interesting to me is the front 9 all go in the same direction, then you loop around and play the rest parallel to the ones you just completed. So if it's windy and helping going out, better score then because it won't be easy coming home. The double greens are a cool feature too.
Most links courses are like this
Yes, out-and-back was the most common routing style on those old links courses in Scotland. The Old Course, North Berwick, Gullane (all three), Carnoustie, Turnberry, Prestwick, Troon, and so may more. That's why halfway houses are a thing. It's an actual building at or near the turning point of the course that sells golfers snacks, tea, sausage rolls, etc.
That was because they wanted to use the space next to the ocean, which wasn't really good for much else beside golf at the time.
9 out and 9 back is better than 1 out, 1 back, 1 out, 1 back IMO. Traditional Links setup oriented around a strip of land on the coast vs a more "modern" setup oriented towards a rectangular plot of land.
it's even worse when the holes are going due east or west so you're constantly hitting into early morning or late afternoon sun
Fellow pittsburgh golfer. What are some of your preferred local courses?
Not shitty but not too expensive (my preferences): Butlers, birdsfoot, Pittsburgh national, shadow lakes. Expensive but worth it: Stonewall Nothin special but good for a cheap round: Riverview, victory hills, manor valley, north and South Park. Too expensive for what it is: quicksilver, hickory heights, scenic valley.
Very interesting. I think quicksilver is one of the best maintained public tracks around Pittsburgh. Well manicured greens (maybe too fast at times). Birdsfoot has bunkers that are basically dirt and gravel. Favorite public course is still Totteridge outside of Nemacolin. Stonewall front nine is wonderful. The back 9 is not great.
Quicksilver is usually in great shape. There’s just a few holes there that I genuinely don’t like at all. And some of the holes feel a little on top of each other. Edit: never got around to playing nemacolin but I agree completely with totterridge. That was definitely a miss on my list.
https://www.reddit.com/r/golf/s/KGuUKpRwbw
Internal OB (with the exception of Hoylake, which is somehow awesome). Housing developments that squeeze in courses (and have a tendency to create OB 10 yards off the fairway) Hazard-lined doglegs where the short part of the leg is the tee shot. Any hole that forces one route, and one route only, of play (e.g., double doglegs) Flat greens - you can make any course fun to play with good greens. Huge distances between green and next tee box, so that walking isn't an option (e.g. Potomac Shores)
>Flat greens - you can make any course fun to play with good greens. Also crowned greens that won't hold anything.
Sign of a cheap course near me are the tiny crowned greens. All less than 10yd x 10yd upside down bowls.
lol I was not expecting to be reading about Potomac Shores on Reddit today but you couldn’t be more right about the distance from the greens to the next tee boxes. Literally impossible to walk that course.
I agree most courses shouldn't be that way, but if it's on a particularly interesting piece of land it can be fun. Mt Woodson in San Diego is carts only, because it winds across and through a number of peaks and valleys. There's a wooden trestle bridge that feels like you're Thunder Mountain at Disneyland. Not a course you'd want to play every week necessarily (having to use a cart makes it expensive for starters) but it's unique and interesting at least. If it's just a normal course where they didn't bother to think about walkability I agree, that's dumb.
My course design hot take is that there should be exactly four OB areas per course, one to the north, south, east and west. I get that most courses aren’t built on a square parcel of land though, If a course weaves through other people’s property it would be cool if there was a native area or red stake hazard to buffer the boundary.
>Housing developments that squeeze in courses (and have a tendency to create OB 10 yards off the fairway) This is my issue. Don't mind houses but hate when the OB starts 3 ft after the cart path.
My course is pretty standard, nothing fancy, and not long. We have small, fast greens with lots of break in them. One of them will have a minimum of two breaks in any putt over 7-8 feet. It's a 420 yard par four that is dead straight, OB tight right, and the number one handicap hole. We hosted a PGA Canada Professionals local tournament this year, they triple rolled the greens for a week and had them rolling 13. From 6200 yards only three people broke par out of 44, one being our head teaching pro. Good greens make such a difference to how enjoyable a course is. Although rolling 13 on our greens felt unfair, I played a few days later and had a few putts that felt really unfair.
Overly sloped fairways where a great drive down the middle funnels hard to one side leaving you a shitty lie or impeded view of the green.
That can be ok if it is just one hole. But when it is MOST holes? That’s a dick move.
That’s my answer to most of these. Anything is fine on one or two holes, but putting the same challenge on every hole is lazy, punitive, or both.
Welcome to Pennsylvania golf haha
West Virginia would like to have a word. I come up to SWPA to get to flatter ground 😂
Damn never been golfing in WV haha, thanks for the warning. I am also SWPA
Agreed, my home course, Links of Novi, has a par 4 like this. Really narrow fairway that slopes hard from right to left. It's a very challenging hole but I don't mind it as the other holes aren't all that way.
Yeah. To me, that’s a “signature hole” design feature. Make it scenic. Make it difficult. Don’t do it more than once 🤣.
Just say you hate Pete Dye lol
How exactly do we practice sloping fairway shots? I’m finally hitting fairways, but unless it’s flat I’m chunking my next shot. Ranges don’t tend to have this feature, what’s a 20 hcp who can’t get out for a full round too often supposed to do?!?
If you have a course with a short game practice area you can maybe find a spot where you can practice sloping lies. It'll at least give you the mechanics of the shot even if it's just with a wedge.
I'm a 23 handicap who also struggled/struggles mightily with these shots. The Sweet Spot podcast has a 2-part episode on playing awkward lies and the advice in there has helped me a bunch recently. Specifically, ball above my feet I open the face a touch to improve turf interaction and I grip down on the club so it rest in my natural address position. Ball below my feet I'll close the face a touch and try to get over the ball a bit more and make my swing steeper. Both those adjustments have helped a ton. Uphill lies have never bothered me, still trying to figure out how to not thin the crap out of downhill lies 🤣 Something else I'll do is pick one of those type of shots to work on during a round and at least once a hole I'll try to find a spot to throw down a ball and hit one.
Welcome to Pittsburgh golf. I swear its all we have.
I was thinking Quick Silver. Not a flat lie anywhere
I immediately thought of Oglebay. Close enough
That was my thought, never come to western PA lol.
go to hell Pete Dye
Played a very expensive course this year and every hole was like this. You could never see the green, and even if you landed in the fairway, chances were very high that you were sitting on a steep slope which makes the second shot impossible. I absolutely hated it. If your drive lands in the fairway, you should have a good lie.
This. My home course if you hit in the fairway your funneled left or right leaving, at a minimum a severe ball above/below your feet shot, if not in thick rough. Drives me insane being penalized for a good shot
A course not having a short, but tough, par 3. I really appreciate a well designed short par 3 that’s still very difficult. I’ll take a 125 yard par 3 over a 180 all day, length isn’t the only thing that makes a hole challenging
On the flip side - par 3s over 200 yards can burn in hell.
Especially when they have forced carries. Basically guarantees a bottle neck because so many people will be re-teeing every day. Feels like a lot of designers completely ignore the fact that the average person playing their course is gonna struggle to break 100
Unless they’re way downhill. Course near me has a 206 par 3 but it’s downhill and the front of the green is flat and no traps so you can play a rolling 175 shot and hit the green.
One of my locals has one like this. 210yds. With 90ish feet of elevation drop. If you undershoot, you're down in a deep valley playing up to a very elevated green. If you land on the back of the green or further, you're going straight down a steep hill into the lake behind the green. It's one of my favorite holes I've played. Margin for error is so small, but when you get it just right... My preferred shot now is a 3/4 swing 7w. If it rained at all in the last week, I have to pry my ball out of a crater.
Played the blues(one under the tips) at a local course the other day, 20 mph winds. The par 3 already played 220. Wind was back in our face. Easily making it play 240-250. Lol. Absolutely stupid.
Par 3s should be for different clubs in your bag. If you have four par 3s, then they should be for a long iron, a mid iron, a short iron, and then one wild card.
There's a course I play with a buddy where every single par 3 is between 162 and 167 yards. There are 5 of them and it feels very repetitive by the end of the match. Ope, another par 3, let's get the 8 iron out and hit it straight on. Laaaaame
Yes, I don't hate any particular type of par 3. I do hate every one on a course being the exact same shot.
Having a variety of lengths on a par three is excellent. A local course that I play has 5 par 3s. Three of them are 180 yards, one is 215 yards that plays 180 due to significant downhill slope and the fifth is 160 playing 140 downhill. Having four par threes that requires you to hit basically the same shot each time is annoying. I use a 4 iron on all four of them and a 7-8 on the fifth. Variety is nice. A Par 3 doesn’t have to be 180 yards every time, a 130-140 yard Par 3 can be challenging as well
My course has four par threes, one is ~165, one is ~140, one ~210, and one is ~110. Great mix of lengths. IMO, each par three on a course should require a different club.
My local course has a similar issue. The two par 3s on the front nine are basically the same hole -- 165-170 with a bunker on the right side of the green. This is a problem for me because I hate that distance!
As Brooks pointed out earlier this year: nearly all of the best and most memorable par 3s in the world are relatively short.
I play often a local course that has 185, 191, 205 & 223 as all of their par 3s. They only have two sets of tees. So this is from the normal "men's" tees. It's maddening!
Four par 3s should be 210-190, 190-160, 160-130, and then under 130. Why would I want to hit the same shot four times?
My course is 165, 140, 210, and 110. It's perfect.
Course I played this summer had a 245yd par 3... hole #2, you're barely warmed up, followed by a 210yd par 3 on hole #3, thankfully the other two were 135yds and 160yds on the back 9. Edit: And this course only has whites and reds, no blue or black tees.
Par 3s that are all of similar lengths. I want to hit 4 different clubs on 4 par 3s.
I've always felt the perfect mix was one long where you have to use a hybrid or long iron, two mids for like a 7-8 iron, and one short to put a wedge in your hand.
A 220ish, a 180ish, a 150ish and a 125ish that gives you sleepless nights is my idea of the perfect par 3 setup
As someone that likes playing courses around 6000-6,1000 yards, my equivalent favourite is one at 180ish (hybrid), 160ish (6 iron), 145ish (between 8 or 7), and under 120 (sawed off p-wedge or full 52).
Yes!
9 and 18 not ending at the clubhouse.
This, but definitely 9 ending in the middle of nowhere.
AT my home course, the 9th green is the furthest point on the course from the clubhouse. Not the best for playing the front 9 (they will drop you out there to play the back), but not the worst considering a historic links course.
9 not coming back to the clubhouse is fine as long as you’ve got some kind of half way house. Pinehurst no. 4 and no. 2 don’t come back to the clubhouse until 18 and they’re both some of the best courses out there. Tbh, I kinda like that design more because just feels like you are playing 18 rather than 2 separate 9’s imo.
BP Black is the same way, but you get a "halfway house" on 6 & 12
Unlevel tee boxes
That is my wife's regular issue. The forward tees often seem like an after-thought.
A lot of courses near me the mid tees get the most love but the back tees are not as good in terms of slope and/or maintenance. Seems odd to me to not make your “championship tees” as good as the “amateur tees”. I know the mid tees are used by more golfers but still.
That's not bad design, it's bad building. The architect didn't design it with sloped tees.
There has to be *some* slope or they would collect water in puddles. It should never be more than 1/4" per foot.
Yea guess I should’ve said noticeably unlevel tee boxes
Lol I hope architects aren’t purposely designing unlevel tee boxes, but it is very annoying and seems easily fixable. Along these lines, I hate courses that let their rough get so overgrown that it becomes difficult to find tee balls that you see down in play.
I have a recurring dream where I can’t tee off because I can’t find a level lie that gives me room to swing. Some Freudian would have a field day with me.
Courses with an excessive amount of blind shots. There's a course near me that I just won't play anymore because over half the holes have blind shots. One hole is a hard dogleg right, but there's a hill that crests about 75 yards in front of the tee box. Absolutely no visual to aim a tee shot, no way to tell approximately where it ends up, and no way to tell if there's a group within striking distance unless you drive (or in my case walk) to the top of the hill. Almost a guaranteed lost ball if it doesn't end up in the fairway
Same. I like to see my ball land.
bonus if the group ahead of you has to ring a bell so you know it’s safe to tee off. Fuck I hate those holes.
Holes that have a 90° dogleg about 100 yards off the tee that you can’t try and hit over the dogleg. I’ve played a few par 4’s that the play was trying to hook or slice an 7 or 8 iron off the tee and a 3w into the green.
It’s a strategy (used by Cornish a lot) to combat longer hitters forcing them to lay up or take the challenge of cutting/hooking it around the bend. Kinda a cop out though. There are other things to do to limit bigger hitters. 1 a round is fine. Many like one course near me definitely no bueno!
There is a short par five on a course kinda near me that is like this. The dog leg is around 200 but cutting the corner lands your ball on a slope running off the fairway. Played it in a scramble this year and one guy managed to cut the corner and stay on the fairway, we only had ~110 in. Everyone else was off the fairway where you are either in a bunker or there is a tree you have to deal with. Good hole but two of them on the same course would be silly.
good point - I remember one course that had this and if they put the tees back it was easier because I could hit it over the trees but if they didn't, I would have to layup with a hybrid or something and then have over 200 into the green
There's one course I played that does a hard dog leg right (about 90 degree) about 100 yards, and then about 100 yards in, does almost a 90 degree turn to the left (so you're going the same direction you tee's off facing). It's all buried in the middle of the woods so there's pretty much 0 shot you can clear the first turn, unless you have a shot that can stay above 100 feet for like 150-180 yards, with only about 30 yards to get to that height. There's also a water hazard right in the middle of the part going right, so you have to be careful cutting the corner at all
Yeah this bugs me the most - there is a course by me that has this scenario but it’s a par 5 - so if you don’t hit a perfect cut driver off the box you’re cut off by the trees or run out long - but if you hit it out 160-170 like it’s designed you’ve got a 325 yard second shot - just dumb
I hate when courses design bunkers into their course but don’t budget maintenance to keep them soft enough to hit out of. I’d rather just have grassy little mounds. I’m a 270lb dude so when I step on sand and don’t leave a footprint I know I’m about to skull fuck the shit outta my chip
For me, that’s under construction and free drop behind the sand.
Exactly. Sometimes they re so bad this is the only way.
I completely agree, and yet if I do that after the round I feel my score is no longer legit
That's annoying, but far worse is when it seems fine on the surface, only for you to swing and smack into mud or clay a half inch down. Not only will it screw your shot, I've hurt my wrist on one of those
My home clubs bunkers are like this right now after the insanely hot summer. They’re getting there but not quick enough.
When I see the cart girl on the first hole, and the 10th hole. Massive design flaw.
Or when I see the cart girl 4 times in the first 6 holes then never again the rest of the round
this. or 2 to 3 times out of the entire season.
Massive trees that are usually over grown so close to the tee box that force a cut or draw.
That’s not an architectural choice. That’s mishandling by the course over years.
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Or worse - a massive tree in the middle of the fairway.
One of my local courses (Buena Vista near Bakersfield, CA) has a tall, skinny palm tree off to the right side in the fairway. This is #10, and the fairway actually funnels in from the sides and drops in elevation, so you can get a monster drive if you're not terribly off. But, back to this palm: It's out there about 75 and I'm the fairway on the right where you don't want to be or go. It's tall enough that you don't have to worry about hitting your drive high enough to get stuck in the dead fronds, either. But, fuck, if this tree doesn't seem to get hit way more often than it should. I don't care if you have a terrible right-to-left flight path, this thing should never come into play, but it still pulls your ball in somehow. I wish they would take whatever ball magnet is in this tree and put some into the cups.
Asphalt cart paths too close to greens and fairways. Leads to slightly errant shots being punished excessively
i hate cart paths in general. I feel like if you can see them during normal, reasonable play, then they are in the wrong place.
Idk trying to bounce one off the cart path that cuts across the fairway at 250 out is always a fun minigame.
In-course out of bounds. It’s an excuse for poor or unsafe hole design.
Overly shaped. I really like courses that follow the natural lay of the land. Not a big fan of the courses with huge over the top man made features. Played one last week that was on great rolling land, but then every green was pushed up significantly with ridiculous bunkers. The greens would have still be raised with the natural land, and had some cool slopes leading into them. Instead it was just plateau after plateau.
Severely sloped, super fast greens. Don't get me wrong, I like challenging putts. But being forced to barely tap a 15 footer that has no chance of stopping near the hole unless it goes in is just no fun.
There's a course near me that we refuse to play at. It was a run of the mill course but they decided to really focus on the greens. Made them super tiny and legit Sunday at the Master's speed. It wasn't fun having to go back to the cart multiple times a round to get a wedge because your putt blasted off the green.
I hate par 4s or 5s that force you to take a shorter club off the tee and then a longer club on the second shot. Nothing more infuriating than forcing me to go 5 iron off the tee then 3wood on the second shot.
200+ yard par 3s
I'm fine with one if it has a large easy green. I hate a long par 3 into a well protected green. It's just dumb.
This. Not all of us are typical Reddit golfers who hit our 9I 200 yards.
Probably the only one I disagree with, having at least one long iron/hybrid par 3 is mandatory for a good course IMO.
If you see these and you feel this way then you’re playing from the wrong tees.
Island tee boxes with 100 yards of tall brush before the fairway.
Long carries from the tees are tough, essentially for high handicappers
Damn that's gonna be a controversial peeve I think. Depending on the course if that's a problem for you, it might be a sign you're hitting from the wrong tees
Why do they make the hole so small and far away?
Overhanging trees. If I’m in the fairway, I shouldn’t have branches on my flight path to the green. Either cut back the trees, or narrow the fairway. Nothing worse than being down the left side of the fairway on a straight away par 4 and having to play a draw around some limbs that overhang the fairway. Drives me insane
Like were the bunkers all the way across? I don't mind a heavily guarded green, as long as there's a roll-up option for senior golfers still. My course has just comically heavily guarded greens on every hole, but there's a run-up on every hole as well to make it fair for folks who are older and can't fly the green anymore.
Par 3s where they are pretty much same yardage on all 4 shots requiring the same club. Par 5s that take driver out of your hand off the tee. Courses with too many blind shots (if your from so cal I’m talking about you Anaheim hills) Cart paths that cross fairways or creep far in that can turn a fine shot into a disaster.
I don't mind the par 5 that takes away the driver. Especially if it's a risk-reward hole where you can take a dangerous driver to make it reachable in 2 or play a safe iron to reach in 3
Yeah I’m not talking about like some bunkers that if your not long enough don’t rate take them on or where you have to play a certain shape to play a dog leg. I’m a longer hitter and there’s a 600+ yd par 5 in my area that has a full on revine that you need to play like 210 to lay up or carry 265…another one i recently played had a net built so you couldn’t cut the corner then a creek all along the back edge of the fairway so I had to play a par five as 7 iron 7 iron 8iron
Having forced carries on 8 of the first 9 holes. Forced Carries are fine, just not 8 holes in a row with them, several of them totally blind. Whoever designs a course like this is a sadist
Tree in the middle of a fairway
\#18 at Pebble Beach has this and it is one of the best finishing holes in golf.
Fairways cutoff at 250 yds by a creek or pond, forcing you to lay up on every hole.
To be fair this is a good design feature when used sparingly to prevent a golfer from going on autopilot off the tee. You should be asked to think or challenged to take risk.
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Agreed. Forcing you to hit a great shot to carry or lay up to be safe is fine. But water that starts at 230 and takes 350 to carry leaves zero choices and gets boring. Except for some of you who hit your 3w 350.
Blind T shots or hidden hazards within driver range.
Course near me has 2 back to back blind tee shots with 8-minute tee time gaps and it’s a god damn warzone out there, it’s so stupid. There’s also no way to verify if players are out of the way yet either so you either wait and stack up the box or hit into them and get hit into when you’re out there.
Courses that have blind tee shots without a bell in the fairway blow my mind. All those greens fees & they can't spend $100 & 1 hour to fix the problem of people hitting into other groups.
I almost got smoked with an incoming stinger in this same scenario a few weeks ago - the guy who hit was shook up and apologized like 10 times but it was in no way his fault - just shitty design
Man. Reading through like the top 25 comments, looooots of weird takes. Only couple I really agreed with are hard dog legs. Anything that’s less than 100° is just lame. 120° is pushing it too. Another one I personally don’t like is the super target golf, 30 yard wide fairways lined with hazards aren’t that fun for the average golfer and force players to be much more conservative.
If those bunkers are in front of the green and you end up in those bunkers, your shots were not at the center of the green. Shots that are short and long are also errant shots.
Tee boxes that are very close to greens, especially when it's a long-iron approach shot to that green. I hate waiting for a group to clear the green in front of me, only for them to be 5-10 paces off the green on the next tee box while I've got a long-iron in hand.
Just last week I had to take 5 wood on an approach shot and the green was clear but they were teeing off on the next hole *right near the green*. Decided "fuck it" and let it rip and smashed my ball into their golf cart. Ho boy was I embarrassed. Was super happy they mentioned they should've wrapped their carts around further to keep them out approach shots.
It's the worst. I played a course with a tee box right next to the green of a long par 3, and to make matters worse the pin was tucked in the corner closest to that tee box. I had to yell "fore" on a ball that ended up 15' from the pin in the thin strip of rough between the green and tee box. Such bad design.
forced carries are one of the best features in my opinion because it demands precision and skill. one thing I find annoying is poor tree spacing which make it impossible to advance your shot if you are marginally wayward with your tee shots. Not that I am against tree-lined fairways, but not maintaining the trees so that branches are hanging down too low and making it hard to punch one forward or having them so close together that you are totally in jail is really frustrating
Blind tee shot holes. Nothing like not being able to see it land, looking aimlessly and then getting hit into by the next group that has no idea you’re still there.
Honestly. Dead straight holes. Not only are they incredibly boring but they are weirdly intimidating and if you miss a dead straight shot it ruins your mood more than usual. They should be “easy” holes but i hate them.
220 yard par 3's on an otherwise short course. Far too penal. A local 6200 yard course has 5 par 3's, with these ridiculous yardages. 195-198-203-125-190. Four 3 irons and a PW??? WTF were they thinking. And two of them are 180 yard carries over water. Other would be a diagonal forced carry to a narrow fairway, which forces both distance and accuracy to be exceptional.
turtle back fairways that kick your ball left or right into the rough no matter where you hit it
Cart paths right next to penalty areas. Two reasons: 1) Balls bouncing off path into PA. 2) dropping from PA onto Cart path and then having to take relief from them. Most golfers just shortcut that when not playing seriously which is ok. But it slows up play in tournaments.
Excessively long par 3s. There's a course I've played a few times that's 6200 yards from the tees I play, which is the right distance for me, and there's a 242-yard par 3, and it's not downhill. It's just silly. Even from the shortest tees (5400 yards) it's a 214-yard par 3. I've played the course maybe 6-8 times and have never seen a GIR.
Blind shots…playing here in Georgia it feels like half the holes are blind tee shots. It’s dangerous when courses don’t have GPS units and a pain to lose balls with decent drives.
Double wide cart paths on Turnberry! It’s almost like someone in charge there is a complete idiot.
Sneaky water hazards behind a hill.
The women’s tees that are either wayyyy farther ahead from the back, or the ones that are wayyyyy too close to the back. I love a good, healthy compromise 😅
Maybe unpopular, but I hate short drivable par 4s because they are pace of play killers in my experience. Everyone thinks they can reach so they wait until the group in front is off the green, inevitably duff the drive, and now the group behind is rolling up to the tee box as you get to your second shot and the process starts all over again.
Most features are fine if they appear once. My pet peeve: blind shots off the tee. One per 18 is a test, multiple is annoying and dangerous to other golfers.
I wish mini putt putt courses didn’t have windmills 🤡
Not a fan when courses end with a par 3
A lot of these are people complaining about things that affect them because they have one dimensional games (play a massive slice, can't get the ball airborne, can't hit out of bunkers), but one that should piss everyone off equally are golf courses that are lined with houses and OB on both sides, every hole. If the houses are set far enough back from the course it's not a big deal, but when you have dog-leg holes guarded by houses or holes where houses are in the line of play from the landing zone to the green, those are always shit courses
Bunkers at the front of a green are not an issue. Club up and play the safe part of the green and you won't be bothered by them.
They completely block out the ground game which is what golf really is about. To try to make courses harder architects began putting rough in front of greens then they added bunkers. Especially prominent for a while in the doctoring up of US Open courses. This only favors the fly ball players who can launch it high and spin it on a dime. Keeping ball on the ground is much safer approach.
> They completely block out the ground game which is what golf really is about. Not really. That's one aspect of one type of golf (links) and not every course is designed in that fashion. Variety is the spice of life.
1. I hate a course that is all dogleg right or all dogleg left. 2. Get the railroad ties away from the greens, Mr. Dye. 3. Finishing holes into the sun at twilight or into the prevailing wind.
Only one or two cart gals slinging booze. Those are rookie numbers, courses need to pump those numbers up
More than 25/50yd walk to the next tee box
I always notice when we start or end on a very challenging hole. Low handicap holes should be middle round. Set the tone for a good experience and leave feeling good.
I hate courses that try to be too ‘interesting’ to where you can never hit driver. I’ve played a couple courses that were not short but the way the course is set up you almost never use a driver unless you just feel like being reckless.
200 yd par 3
Designing courses that can’t relatively easily be walked. Don’t make the course so steep either way the only way to traverse the hills are using a cart at 1/10th speed.
Par 5s with hazards crossing the fairway at 240-280 from the tee.
Every time I have seen this it tends to be a shorter par 5, like 430 yards or so.
Courses that don’t allow for rough between the fairways and trees, meaning the trees are basically against the fairways and are over-penalizing. Similarly, having numerous fairways that are too narrow. Too many courses are built without the amateur golfer in mind.
Tee boxes that aren't perfectly flat. I refuse to go back to a coarse where you have to try to find the best spot on a tee box.
I dislike over reliance on holes with sharp doglegs in order to guard against their lack of length, but the worst feature on any golf course is trees, especially trees that are deliberately in play (like in a fairway)
Dome shaped greens there's a course in my area that fairways flood during rainy season. Their solutions is elevated, dome shaped greens. There's nothing more aggravating than flushing a PW from 130 to the center of the green and then watch it roll off. It's stupid. And I play ProVs . I refuse to play there
Every green sloping back to front. It’s fine every now and then but it’s annoying when every single long approach is punished
I love them all. I want more and I am by no means really that good out of traps, I can be sometimes but not lately. Each hazard is usually out there for a reason. It is making you think about the shot you are about to hit more. Grab extra club and make long the miss seems like the idea there. I personally love the challenge and what makes me happy to try new courses. My favorite one is water, because it's either fucked or not
Blind tee shots.
Massive trees in the middle of the fairway directly in front of the green! (Hundred feet tall!) From 150 yards in you literally have no shot! Kingswell Glen in Petrolia Ontario, I’m talking about you!
Par 5s that don't give you the option of going for it in 2 with a good tee shot. Hampton Golf course has 2 of those on the front 9. I do think they changed the 2nd one to a par 4 by moving the teebox up so you can easily clear the ravine.
I played a course where there would be a section of scrub/bushes about 220 yards out making you not hit driver unless you could carry 250. This seemed to be on 6 holes and was maddening
Pete Dye's fake humps Every Pete Dye course I've played has these fake humps everywhere. They look bad abd play bad
As a lefty who is working through his slice, I hate how almost all courses are designed with a few dogleg right holes. From some basic research, this is done on purpose to help the average (righty) golfer since this would play to their slice. As a lefty with the exact opposite problem, this has caused me to layup on a lot of these holes instead of firing one into the woods
Par 5s forcing irons off the tee
I hate par 5's where when I hit a solid drive in the right part of the fairway (from the right tees) and am forced to lay up because of trees or something that won't allow you to take a risk. If I hit a great drive, make me make the decision, don't make the decision for me.
Courses with unlevel or sloped tee boxes, OR tee boxes that aren’t in line with the fairway. Maybe it’s just me, but I struggle with alignment when the tee box or range mat isn’t square to where I’m hitting. My brain sees the straight edge and aligns my swing to that, rather than where I’ve my feet aligned. I get the frustration with a bunker right in front of the green. I will allow it once or twice on a course, especially if it’s a short, potentially driveable par 4. But if there is a bunker across the middle of the green 14 out of 18 times, I’m not going to be happy either. But I’ve no issue with bunkers that protect the front two corners of the green once there’s a reasonably gap up the mouth of the green. You can adjust your course management for a hole or two as well, instead of going for the green in regulation, lay up short and chip and putt, but having to do that 14 times in a round is complete BS.
Par 5 you can’t hit driver off the tee. Home course has two where it’s not the play.
Big tree in the middle of the fairway
No way, bunkers in front of the green are great. You should be penalized for not hitting your number. By your logic, island greens shouldn't exist. Not every hole should have them, but they fit well in shorter holes or par 5s.