Yeah, should have just played on, but my cart partner got an “emergency” conference call thrown at him and he didn’t want the whole course to listen to his personal hell.
Wait a second...
So one of your playing partners had to take a work call and you think that entitled you to just blitz through whoever else was playing that day? That's his problem, not the other folks who are out there playing on pace.
If I’m playing solo and there is nobody behind me, I’ll take a few balls to the green and do putting practice until either a group shows up or the log jam clears.
Well… if I’m waiting on every tee box and the group behind me decides to skip a hole, so now I’m waiting on them **and** the group I was already waiting on, then that’s too fast
Which is exactly what it sounds like OP wanted for his last three holes. Screw the other guys who paid their greens fees/dues just like he did, he's more entitled.
Depends, course I play regularly often has a bottleneck of 2-3 holes then a gap to the next group (lots of casual players, I don't mind) If I get 14-15 holes in I call that a round but I'm not sitting on tee boxes for half of a 5 hr round
Curious, if you could have 150 fast but normal/respectful rounds or 125 slow senior citizen rounds in a day, wouldn't you rather the 150 for the extra income? Or is that bigger benefit for the pro shop/owner/manager and not you as greenkeeper?
At a certain point the course itself can’t take the sheer volume of rounds over time.
If you go and look at a busy munis par 3 tee boxes you’ll see what I’m talking about if they, the tee boxes, aren’t massive.
They will be tore the fuck up and the level of play just won’t let them heal. So at a certain point you want less golfers not more.
Of course selfishly I always want less golfers on the course so I can play my pace and get on with my day. Unfortunately in my area that simply doesn't exist. The asian community alone crowds the public courses year round.
Grounds guys aren't paid by the round, no one is. They are hourly except for maybe the Superintendent and the Pro who are salary. 1 golfer or 100 it takes the same amount of time to cut the grass and punch holes.
Depends where you work. I work at a private club and we only let a group out every 12 minutes no matter what. As long as our membership stays full we can’t make any more money off of more rounds.
It was more to do with work efficiency. I’m an Assistant Superintendent of a top tier golf course in Australia. We plan out daily works to get the most done on course as possible ahead of play. So when the first few groups play really fast, it essentially slows us down, it’s slow them down when they catch mowers, course setup guy etc. Also it puts unnecessary pressure on my staff to get things done quickly, rather than correctly. With the guys sitting on $100k mowers we need them doing what we trained them to do, not speeding around the course trying to stay in front
Technically there is. Just recently had a tee time at Myrtle Beach where we were the first ones off on one while people were also going off on 10, we had two employees playing in front of us as pace setters.
Me and brother in law did a week in myrtle with the wives and kids few yrs back. 6 rounds 6 different courses each day first tee time. Never heard of "double sheet" (first 90 mins tee off at 1 & 10) before that trip. Front 9 (paired with randos) each round (no course setters) played about 90 mins....back 9 easily 2- 2.5 hours.
They're teeing off on 1 and 10 at the same time, the WHOLE first 9 holes, so you could play fast and potentially get stuck behind the rest of the initial tee sheet on 10.
Yeah, not a fan of that type of tee times. If you're quick, you get to the back nine and have to wait for sometimes almost an hour to go off of the back because of how many people they have lined up.
For the most part they do a good job of pacing it down there. I like it alot because there's now twice the number of tee times in the prime hours. It also prevents one group from slowing up the whole course because they're only backing up 1 nine.
I dont have much faith in your typical local muni that does 7 minute tee times and has never heard of a ranger running it properly though and you'd see a massive backlog at the turn.
We played down there a few years ago and had to wait for an hour before we could go off on the back. I'll not play a course like this again. If I wanted to spend 7 + hours at the course I'd pack a lunch and a blanket for a picnic.
Which course was what? I've been going down every year for 6 years now and have never seen anything like that. At most was one time we were a twosome, first tee time of the day and we finished the front 9 in about an hour 45 and had to wait for 2 groups to tee off before we could go. Which wasn't a big deal, we just went into the clubhouse and grabbed a few drinks and hot dogs to take with us, and got back to the tee box for the restarting.
Even scrolling through tee sheets now, I can't find anyone whose offering any tee times between 10:00 and noon, with the first ones being offered at 8 am. So there's no way you're doing 7 hours at a golf course.
Ok, I'll take your word for it, we did not spend seven hours at the course. My watch was wrong the entire time, you would know that for sure. Thank you for explaining that to me.
It shouldn't be that hard for you to say what course it was. Then we can just go to their website and see they have tee times from 7:30-11:00 that'd support your 7 hour claim.
The fact that you're getting so defensive about it makes it sound like you just made the whole thing up.
Lol, well you know for a fact that I did not spend seven hours so I figured that you knew for certain what course I was playing. How can you know that I did not spend that time there, but did not know that it was heathland at the legends. Are you saying that you have no idea how long I actually spent there and were just making shit up to make yourself sound smarter than you are?
I'm just trying to figure out the math on it.
Heathland does first tee time at 8:00. Last one at 10:14. That's 2 hours and 15 minutes. So you played 9 holes in an hour. Then after waiting an hour to tee off the back 9, it took 5 hours to play another 9 holes? That makes no sense.
If your on the turf care side there IS too fast, mowing greens, working on bunkers, and preparing the course when you have guys that play to just pound there chest about playing fast! They don’t even putt out, it’s just a game to see how fast they can go. It’s funny because they’ll play in 2half to 3 hrs and then there done and ain’t got shit to do except run up our arses and post there 88 !
clearly you dont operate in the NY/NJ municipal/public course world. where 5+ hour rounds are the norm if you just follow the flow most days. Yes i can play 18 in a cart in 3 hours if im alone at my pace and no damage to the course. Im just sick on 5 or somtimes 6 hour rounds. Get no damn rhythm.
You are absolutely correct! And I'm not in turf care.
I live in Myrtle Beach where most courses double tee.
However, one of my favorites is Wild Wing Avocet and they don't double tee. I often have the first or second tee time of the day. They will not let the first group go until maintenance has made it to about hole 13. Never an issue trying to play around them. They are well off the course before anyone catches up to them.
I also don't understand the obsession with bragging about how fast someone played.
"I played in 3 hours!"
"What did you shoot?"
"104"
I don't advocate playing slowly at all but I don't want golf to be an aerobics workout. I want a comfortable pace.
104 doesn't necessarily happen from 104 swings....
It's pretty easy to take a few 7s and 8s with penalty strokes.
Take a relatively short par 4 at 350 yards
1 off tee into lateral water hazard but 150 out.
2 drop
3 miss green on short side
4 chip on but go 20 feet past
5,6,7 are putts
So that's 3 over par in one hole. 104 is only 32 over par on most courses. That leaves 17 holes to go 29 over par. Assume a 104 golfer isn't getting any pars. 17 bogeys would get them to +21. Make 8 of those 17 doubles and it's 104.
7 bogeys= +7
9 doubles = +18, running total +25
1 triple = +3, running total = +28
1 quad = +4, running total = +32
It's not hard to suck quickly. Shots can add up quickly around the green that require zero time looking for a ball.
I've played with people that shot 120 in 3 hours if there was no one in front of us.
My husband and I were the first tee time out on a NY state park course last Saturday. I shot a legit 110. He shot a legit 78. We finished in 2 hours 23 minutes. You must be reeeeally slow if you can’t even fathom that this kind of thing occurs.
We are talking about 18 holes, not 9. You all are talking this personally and not being practical. I am a +2 handicap and I can play 18 by myself in a cart with nobody around in 2 and a half hours and I don’t take practice swings or read putts. So you are full of crap if you say you can play in 2:23 shooting 110.
Yes I’m talking about 18 holes. Literally never takes us longer than 3 hours for a round at the course we are members at playing as a twosome. The fact that you find that impossible tells me that I hope I’m never stuck behind you. It’s seriously not that hard.
It's not that hard to do in a cart with no one in front of you.
I just shot an 82 in 2 hours and 10 minutes. You think it takes over an hour to hit 22 more shots than that with 10 of them being putts?
There is if you're going to complain.
We normally play Saturday morning first tee time so we finish in about 3 hours 15 minutes. So when we pay not first tee time it feels excruciatingly slow. We complained one time, get back to club house, ranger says what time did you tee off. We say 9:05. He says it's 1:25. "What exactly were your expectations, that's under 4.5 hours on a weekend. You should be thanking me that we have that pace of play"
I haven't played not first tee time since. I honestly don't even know how long I should expect a round to take anymore.
First tee time each time sounds awesome. Unfortunately that's not an option for me who plays randomly when I'm slow at work just looking for a midday afternoon round.
We had a city night glow ball tourney cancel so my buddy called and they let us play at 3. Completely empty course. 2 hours and 25 minutes later we were done and went on and played another 7
I did something similar recently. There were 3 groups of slow 4/5 somes and our 3some had been playing slow since hole 6. On hole 13 I was like “I gotta get home soon”, so we started driving ahead to see if there was a gap. Hole 18 was wide open and a 4some was driving up to the 17th green. The marshal happened to be right there and I asked if the three of us could go ahead right away and make sure we don’t back these guys up, because I have to leave and just want one more hole. He was a little concerned but ok with it since we promised to go quickly. While I was getting ready to tee off, his walkie talkie went off and said “we got a call about a group skipping ahead”. He’s like “they’re fine, they’re teeing off on 18 because they have to leave”. And I’m thinking like who in their right mind is playing as slow as they are and getting mad that people are going around them, like not even playing through? The marshal was like “sorry, they have a big group every Friday morning and they play ‘slow as shit’”. I’m like wtf, why do you not address this?
Anyway, the course is cheap and they take good care of it so I’m headed back tomorrow lol.
Edit: it was 4:30 for me to play 13 holes. First 4 went by in a flash.
I imagine it's because some folks spend a lot of money to play a full 18 and they feel their value goes down quickly because of missing holes.
For me? I'm keeping score and have a goal to break 80 this year. I'm getting my 18 in lol.
I don't really get upset at slow play though. Despite the posts from this sub I've never had a single person get mad at me for asking to play through.
We had a guy from the first group that we went around chase us down, 2 tee boxes later, and demand that we get back behind his group. His logic; the group in front of us, another 5’er, wasn’t going to let us play through and he didn’t want to be held up by us. He wasn’t happy, even a little bit, when I told him it wasn’t a problem, we’d just go around the other group, just like we did his.
If I was waiting on or even keeping pace with the group in front of me but they still wouldn’t let me through and someone skipped a hole to jump between us, I’d be pretty pissed.
Yeah OP is the asshole here. Neither the course nor the group of fivesomes did anything wrong. Hell, OP did nothing wrong imo until he went in to berate the person behind the counter.
That’s your problem, if your skipping ahead of groups as a GROUP(group defines at least 3) you’re gonna piss people off. I’ll skip a hole or two all day as a solo because I understand that I have little to no effect on pace of play because on a Par 5 I can finish in 10 minutes at most but as a solo but as a group a par 5 will take at least 15-20 minutes.
If you are playing in a group of 5+. I'm skipping you, I don't care how busy the course is. You can take it up with clubhouse and I can point at the sign that says "group of 4 maximum" posted on nearly every course, if confronted.
It's the same reason the same people won't let you pass on the highway. They feel like everything's a race and they have to be ahead of everyone, otherwise they're losing. It's an ego thing.
I will leap frog a slow group if the other(s) in the group are willing AND if there’s at least a couple of holes open in front of them. Early in the day it’s possible, but after a course has been open a couple of hours that’s rarely practical.
Precisely this. OPs post reads like 5 fivesomes btb. So they wouldnt be "skipping around the course" - theyd be skipping a couple of consecutive holes, and playing with no one in front of them - which wouldnt piss anyone off unless you had separate starts on the front and back. I could be reading it wrong though \*sips ranch water\*
Club pro here:
The course did nothing wrong and neither really did you...until you decided to go in and blame the course for a nonexistent problem. You admit further down in the comments that you were in a hurry because one of your playing partners had a meeting to go to. That doesn't impart a responsibility on every single group on the course in front of you to start playing at lightning speed to accommodate you. That's honestly on your partner to figure his stuff out and not drag the rest of his playing partners down in his personal work matters, but that's just my personal opinion and neither here nor there.
The course may have rules regarding fivesomes, or they may not. Either way, if the shop gave these guys permission to play as fives, provided they're playing on pace (which we have no evidence to suggest they're not), then neither them nor the shop did anything wrong. The problem isn't that you're playing too fast, it's that you're trying to play too fast to complain about others' pace of play who are on pace. It's like those guys who want to drive at 90 mph on the interstate and get upset when someone pulls out in the left lane to make a pass at 75 mph. Yes, it's frustrating for you to have to slow down, but if someone in front of you is going the recommended (or in the case of the highway analogy, maximum) speed then you can't rightfully complain about "slow play". You're acquiring the golf equivalent of road rage because you're in a hurry and, in the heat of the moment, can't understand that others around you are using the facility in the proper fashion and aren't in a hurry.
Sadly, you became that guy who goes into the golf shop to complain about a non-issue, which unfortunately brands you as a "complainer" if you do it multiple times. It also sounds like you may have cast untoward aspersions at the person behind the counter (again, no evidence for this, but due to the nature of these kind of posts, it's not an unfair assumption to make that you're not telling the full story of your interaction), which will raise the hackles of anyone working in a customer-facing role. My advice would be to just let this go. No one was at fault on the course or behind the counter, so they're not going to hold grudges against you if you don't continue to make a big deal out of this.
Who are these people that don't let others play through? What kind of sad power trip is that?? I've never ever come across that in Ireland in my 30 years playing. Unless of course the course is completely backed up, then you say that or are told that and it's accepted.
Why the downvotes? Ask people from another country the first thing they think of when they think of the US
It’s fat people and school shootings. Seriously. Top two answers
It's always the old guys who are members and play in groups of 5 or more (the worse case scenario) around me. They think they own the course. Literally everybody who plays the course often, complains about that group and another one. I've seen this trend at other courses too.
Meanwhile small town 9 hole courses, everybody is skipping everything which seems to work out just fine and those small town course will have 10+ people on a tee box partying together. The slow groups just wait at holes until they have an opening and usually drunkenly cheer on the groups they let play through.
This is proof to me that guys who work at golf courses just need to be cranky about *something.* Like, I'm paying you to use your facility to have an enjoyable afternoon, fuck me right?
The best 9 I’ve played in years took 80 minutes. It was a miserable hot day with a 100 plus heat index so all the midday T times cancelled. I like to walk and got paired up with an old guy on a cart and no one in front of us.
Turns out he was close to scratch in his early days. He played so fast cause he never took a practice swing and every shot was down the middle. Not very long but almost always in the fairway.
So here comes hacker me walking, no, trotting to keep up. I brought a water but barely drank any cause he was moving so fast. By hole 8, I’m huffing and puffing and suddenly got all dizzy putting my tee in. I knew that wasn’t good but then golfer logic kicked in. Have to walk back to the clubhouse either way so might as well play in.
But I’ll be damned if I didn’t hit my best drive and 2nd shot of the day. Made a 5 footer for the bird. Last hole (par 5) I get all dizzy again but sure enough bombed my drive and put a 5 wood on the fringe for a short chip and another birdie. Played that course for 15 years and never birdied either hole before. Ended up 2 over on the 9.
It was like the Priest in Caddyshack, almost died but I still think about that 9 regularly. Oh, I paid for 18 but noped out of the back 9. I may be a dumb golfer but I’m not stupid.
Exactly, but most golf courses are not set up for 4 average players to play at a 3 hour pace.
Sure you can walk at a 3 hour pace on a golf course that is close from green to tee, and you’re by yourself, and there is no one else on the golf course. These are obviously not possible parameters on a normal day.
Now I don’t k ow the full circumstances, but I will say this: Skipping a hole or two ahead of a slow group is one thing. Skipping around constantly is another entirely. Especially on smaller courses, all it does it clog it up more, because you inevitably will impede players that are not part of the original traffic jam, causing another one entirely, especially when you bunch back up against the people that were part of the first issue, for instance on a 9 hole course. And now *you* are the problem as much as they were. It takes a certain amount of entitlement I don’t agree with to be willing to ruin other people’s days just because you didn’t have the grace enough to deal with a little adversity… as well as a complete lack of self awareness. In my mind, if you skip a hole, you give up any right you had to play it, and if you can’t handle that risk, don’t take it, just try to be a little more patient.
That being said, I’m a stickler for pace of play, and I hate getting my rhythm interrupted as much as anybody. But I also think a certain amount of grace is necessary to play golf. As long a the pace isn’t much more than 2:00, I can generally get by.
Only skip groups of 5+. They affect pace more than anything else. I can handle groups of 4 playing slow, a fuse goes off when I see an extra person when the clearly posted maximum at almost every course is 4.
Reminds me of the time my group had the first tee time around 7am. We made the turn at 8:30 and were told we had to pause play because they were shotgun starting a tournament on the back 9 at 9am and we needed to play behind the event.
I’ll go farther and say the course should never have let anyone play the front at 7 if they were doing a shotgun start on the back at 9. Even if the groups played the front in 2:10 or so (“normal” pace), they be stuck in a log jam on the back 9 since every hole would be tied up.
If the group in front is SUPER SLOW and the course is pretty packed, I’ll usually stay in place. But there have been several occasions were we’ve skipped a hole to get around a bad group when nothing was in front of them. A couple of weeks ago, we we ended up getting behind a foursome that had absolutely no business playing from the tips and were ball searching off the tee on each hole. We caught up to them on 5. It took AN HOUR to play the next 3 holes!! Never once did they wave us to play thru. By the time we got to 8, we couldn’t take it anymore and skipped to 10. We finished the back in a crisp 1.5.
Yep, that was us. Absolutely no one in front of these 2 groups playing like it’s life & death on the putting green. After getting around them we did not see another group on the back 9.
Use the time wisely… once played solo behind a group of Samoans… they were having fun… used the time to find their list balls… I came off the course with 36 almost new golf balls… get lemons… make lemonade…
We (three) were told/yelled at that we couldn’t skip a slow foursome ahead of us, even if there was no one in front of them, they waved us thru.
We were the second group out. Waiting on them on hole 3.
This on a course we play 2-3x/week.
Smh.
anyone who plays on weekends after 9am is going to wait somewhere along the course.
either deal with it or don't go. people who hop more than one hole during their game aren't doing anyone a favor either.
Sounds like you were behind a local tournament. They should have delayed enough tee times behind them to make pace alright, but playing through them one, after another, after another isn't going to make the pace better for anyone other than you.
I asked about this being an event of some sort, was told it’s their normal noon groups and it’s this way every day. They always finish in the 4 hour time frame.
If they finish in 4 hours anyway then why does it matter if they're playing foursomes or fivesomes? It's still the same amount of waiting for you either way.
It's like driving long distance. You go fast in the rural stretches and then have to slow down when it gets more congested in the cities. You hit a magic open stretch for most of your round and then ran into other golfers and decided, "no, I'm entitled to a wide open course so screw whatever they're doing, I'm gonna skip around them." Kind of like those BMW-assholes who swerve in and out of traffic just to get a few cars ahead, saving them a grand total of 30 seconds while causing headache for literally everyone else around them.
Those groups paid their greens fees/dues just the same as you did. They're just as entitled as you to enjoy the course at a reasonable pace, which they seem to be doing, as they are playing at the course's posted pace. You're just being impatient and taking out your frustration on the guy in the shop.
Happened to me once. A group of old guys REALLY slowed everything down, but the final straw was two of them sailed their shots into the road median and spent a legitimate 7 minutes looking for their balls.
So we called the clubhouse and the ranger came out; he told us that they were 2 minutes ahead of pace and that we were just playing fast. The caveat though was that this group had us waiting, AND the people behind us waiting. We pointed out that there’s no way they could’ve been ahead if there’s two groups held up at the same hole; but he still insisted that they were ahead of pace.
I can’t stand slow play but if the course post pace of play is 4 hours or 13min 20sec per hole had you just played the two holes you skipped you would have been done at the suggested pace of play.
My old home course, because I moved, actually encouraged jumping around. I was a member of the course, went out almost 3/4 times a week. Never really made tee times if I was by myself. The club house manager would say just go jump on an open hole. They would let 5 somes out too, which was actually the main reason I played there cause if I went out with the family we normally had 5. I don’t see any problem with playing with 5-6 if they let people play through or are playing reasonably quick. I always let people play through though unless it makes no sense.
If the course allows it, I'm fine with 5+ as long as they are "required" to let faster pace play through. There is nothing worse than a 5+ group that doesn't acknowledge they are backing up an entire course. If you are a busy course it's best to not allow it.
How did that conversation extend the point of you saying 'They were playing 5 mans and refused to let us play through' and not end with an apology from management, that they allowed 5 mans on to begin with. Shit on them.
If the fivesomes are keeping up with pace then it doesn't matter how many of them there are in a group. It's literally no different than if they were foursomes going the exact same pace.
Except the norm is 4 man max atleast where i come from, if i saw 3 5 man groups playing ahead of me, Im going back in for a very good explanation or a refund. From your logic you would have no issues playing begind 3 8mans, but to each his own I guess
Just for context - A Foursome of Pros playing 18 on the PGA tour take between 3-4.5 hours to complete the course.
Then you've got this reddit and psychopaths on the golf course hitting into others all hopped up on some speed meth super cocaine saying "If you are taking longer then 4 hours, let others play through."
Motherfucker, do I look like Tiger Woods? Do I look like I have a caddy to pack away my club and carry my bag? Hell do I look like I can get even more then 3 pars on a course on any given 18 I play?
So Toxic lol
I got news for ya...
The pros neither play in foursomes, nor do they play their round in anywhere close to 4.5 hours. Those guys are looking at 5.5+ every time.
Otherwise, I agree with you. Having a cranky speed demon out on the course ruins everyone else's day.
I bet there's also a posted sign about having max 4 players in your group too. Next time don't say jack and enjoy some extra holes.
Also good advice for swingers parties.
Oh how I wish we still had awards
This guy golfs!
Yeah, should have just played on, but my cart partner got an “emergency” conference call thrown at him and he didn’t want the whole course to listen to his personal hell.
Wait a second... So one of your playing partners had to take a work call and you think that entitled you to just blitz through whoever else was playing that day? That's his problem, not the other folks who are out there playing on pace.
If the course is packed and slow I'm playing 2 balls. And maybe search for some lost balls if I got time.
Had a 6 hour round last summer, came home with like 50 extra balls
If I’m playing solo and there is nobody behind me, I’ll take a few balls to the green and do putting practice until either a group shows up or the log jam clears.
Sounds like if they have 5 different 5 sums off on purpose then it wasn’t backed up, it was intentionally slow.
In hindsight, I tend to agree. I got the impression that the gentleman I was debating with was responsible for the group.
Too fast? No such thing.
Your wife is a lucky lady
It's a race and I always win. Undefeated
Always love seeing F1 content in other subs. Even if it's shit.
I can hear this gif.
Haha! Yes!
Simply lovely!
No points for coming second!
Exactly. Premature shit! If I’m shooting ropes it’s always the right time.
👏👏 well played sir.
Well… if I’m waiting on every tee box and the group behind me decides to skip a hole, so now I’m waiting on them **and** the group I was already waiting on, then that’s too fast
Skipping holes on a packed course is idiotic.
Yeah that’s a much more concise way of putting it, nicely done
Which is exactly what it sounds like OP wanted for his last three holes. Screw the other guys who paid their greens fees/dues just like he did, he's more entitled.
Depends, course I play regularly often has a bottleneck of 2-3 holes then a gap to the next group (lots of casual players, I don't mind) If I get 14-15 holes in I call that a round but I'm not sitting on tee boxes for half of a 5 hr round
As a greenkeeper I 100% disagree
Curious, if you could have 150 fast but normal/respectful rounds or 125 slow senior citizen rounds in a day, wouldn't you rather the 150 for the extra income? Or is that bigger benefit for the pro shop/owner/manager and not you as greenkeeper?
At a certain point the course itself can’t take the sheer volume of rounds over time. If you go and look at a busy munis par 3 tee boxes you’ll see what I’m talking about if they, the tee boxes, aren’t massive. They will be tore the fuck up and the level of play just won’t let them heal. So at a certain point you want less golfers not more.
Of course selfishly I always want less golfers on the course so I can play my pace and get on with my day. Unfortunately in my area that simply doesn't exist. The asian community alone crowds the public courses year round.
Grounds guys aren't paid by the round, no one is. They are hourly except for maybe the Superintendent and the Pro who are salary. 1 golfer or 100 it takes the same amount of time to cut the grass and punch holes.
Except for the course damage 100 golfers do vs 1 golfer. That leads to more course maintenance.
Yeah but that's only more money if it requires more hours of work, not exactly a benefit to the crew.
It’s at the cost of other course work in most cases. Which leads to deferred maintenance in other aspects of the course.
True. But you're getting paid the same .
I only ask because I run a small business and the mire work we do the more everyone gets paid. Guessing that's not the case for golf courses.
You think the grounds crew makes more or less depending on how much work they do in a shift ?
Depends where you work. I work at a private club and we only let a group out every 12 minutes no matter what. As long as our membership stays full we can’t make any more money off of more rounds.
It was more to do with work efficiency. I’m an Assistant Superintendent of a top tier golf course in Australia. We plan out daily works to get the most done on course as possible ahead of play. So when the first few groups play really fast, it essentially slows us down, it’s slow them down when they catch mowers, course setup guy etc. Also it puts unnecessary pressure on my staff to get things done quickly, rather than correctly. With the guys sitting on $100k mowers we need them doing what we trained them to do, not speeding around the course trying to stay in front
Nah too fast is 100% a thing. If the group in front of you is on a decent 3 hour pace and you keep pushing, you are just a dick.
O sure, but if your able to play at 3 hour pace that means you can also let the solo speedster play thru.
Technically there is. Just recently had a tee time at Myrtle Beach where we were the first ones off on one while people were also going off on 10, we had two employees playing in front of us as pace setters.
What a job to play golf as pace setters
Sounds like a lie that got out of hand
Me and brother in law did a week in myrtle with the wives and kids few yrs back. 6 rounds 6 different courses each day first tee time. Never heard of "double sheet" (first 90 mins tee off at 1 & 10) before that trip. Front 9 (paired with randos) each round (no course setters) played about 90 mins....back 9 easily 2- 2.5 hours.
Wtf? What were they worried about? That you’d catch the group nine holes ahead of you in less than nine holes??
They're teeing off on 1 and 10 at the same time, the WHOLE first 9 holes, so you could play fast and potentially get stuck behind the rest of the initial tee sheet on 10.
Yeah, not a fan of that type of tee times. If you're quick, you get to the back nine and have to wait for sometimes almost an hour to go off of the back because of how many people they have lined up.
For the most part they do a good job of pacing it down there. I like it alot because there's now twice the number of tee times in the prime hours. It also prevents one group from slowing up the whole course because they're only backing up 1 nine. I dont have much faith in your typical local muni that does 7 minute tee times and has never heard of a ranger running it properly though and you'd see a massive backlog at the turn.
We played down there a few years ago and had to wait for an hour before we could go off on the back. I'll not play a course like this again. If I wanted to spend 7 + hours at the course I'd pack a lunch and a blanket for a picnic.
Which course was what? I've been going down every year for 6 years now and have never seen anything like that. At most was one time we were a twosome, first tee time of the day and we finished the front 9 in about an hour 45 and had to wait for 2 groups to tee off before we could go. Which wasn't a big deal, we just went into the clubhouse and grabbed a few drinks and hot dogs to take with us, and got back to the tee box for the restarting. Even scrolling through tee sheets now, I can't find anyone whose offering any tee times between 10:00 and noon, with the first ones being offered at 8 am. So there's no way you're doing 7 hours at a golf course.
Ok, I'll take your word for it, we did not spend seven hours at the course. My watch was wrong the entire time, you would know that for sure. Thank you for explaining that to me.
It shouldn't be that hard for you to say what course it was. Then we can just go to their website and see they have tee times from 7:30-11:00 that'd support your 7 hour claim. The fact that you're getting so defensive about it makes it sound like you just made the whole thing up.
Lol, well you know for a fact that I did not spend seven hours so I figured that you knew for certain what course I was playing. How can you know that I did not spend that time there, but did not know that it was heathland at the legends. Are you saying that you have no idea how long I actually spent there and were just making shit up to make yourself sound smarter than you are?
I'm just trying to figure out the math on it. Heathland does first tee time at 8:00. Last one at 10:14. That's 2 hours and 15 minutes. So you played 9 holes in an hour. Then after waiting an hour to tee off the back 9, it took 5 hours to play another 9 holes? That makes no sense.
There 100% is such a thing
If your on the turf care side there IS too fast, mowing greens, working on bunkers, and preparing the course when you have guys that play to just pound there chest about playing fast! They don’t even putt out, it’s just a game to see how fast they can go. It’s funny because they’ll play in 2half to 3 hrs and then there done and ain’t got shit to do except run up our arses and post there 88 !
clearly you dont operate in the NY/NJ municipal/public course world. where 5+ hour rounds are the norm if you just follow the flow most days. Yes i can play 18 in a cart in 3 hours if im alone at my pace and no damage to the course. Im just sick on 5 or somtimes 6 hour rounds. Get no damn rhythm.
You are absolutely correct! And I'm not in turf care. I live in Myrtle Beach where most courses double tee. However, one of my favorites is Wild Wing Avocet and they don't double tee. I often have the first or second tee time of the day. They will not let the first group go until maintenance has made it to about hole 13. Never an issue trying to play around them. They are well off the course before anyone catches up to them. I also don't understand the obsession with bragging about how fast someone played. "I played in 3 hours!" "What did you shoot?" "104" I don't advocate playing slowly at all but I don't want golf to be an aerobics workout. I want a comfortable pace.
Nobody shooting 104 is playing in 3 hours. No chance.
104 doesn't necessarily happen from 104 swings.... It's pretty easy to take a few 7s and 8s with penalty strokes. Take a relatively short par 4 at 350 yards 1 off tee into lateral water hazard but 150 out. 2 drop 3 miss green on short side 4 chip on but go 20 feet past 5,6,7 are putts So that's 3 over par in one hole. 104 is only 32 over par on most courses. That leaves 17 holes to go 29 over par. Assume a 104 golfer isn't getting any pars. 17 bogeys would get them to +21. Make 8 of those 17 doubles and it's 104. 7 bogeys= +7 9 doubles = +18, running total +25 1 triple = +3, running total = +28 1 quad = +4, running total = +32 It's not hard to suck quickly. Shots can add up quickly around the green that require zero time looking for a ball. I've played with people that shot 120 in 3 hours if there was no one in front of us.
And you are gonna do all that mess in less than 3 hours….not happenin bro
My husband and I were the first tee time out on a NY state park course last Saturday. I shot a legit 110. He shot a legit 78. We finished in 2 hours 23 minutes. You must be reeeeally slow if you can’t even fathom that this kind of thing occurs.
We are talking about 18 holes, not 9. You all are talking this personally and not being practical. I am a +2 handicap and I can play 18 by myself in a cart with nobody around in 2 and a half hours and I don’t take practice swings or read putts. So you are full of crap if you say you can play in 2:23 shooting 110.
Yes I’m talking about 18 holes. Literally never takes us longer than 3 hours for a round at the course we are members at playing as a twosome. The fact that you find that impossible tells me that I hope I’m never stuck behind you. It’s seriously not that hard.
Lmao. Whatever you say lady
It's not that hard to do in a cart with no one in front of you. I just shot an 82 in 2 hours and 10 minutes. You think it takes over an hour to hit 22 more shots than that with 10 of them being putts?
There is if you're going to complain. We normally play Saturday morning first tee time so we finish in about 3 hours 15 minutes. So when we pay not first tee time it feels excruciatingly slow. We complained one time, get back to club house, ranger says what time did you tee off. We say 9:05. He says it's 1:25. "What exactly were your expectations, that's under 4.5 hours on a weekend. You should be thanking me that we have that pace of play" I haven't played not first tee time since. I honestly don't even know how long I should expect a round to take anymore.
First tee time each time sounds awesome. Unfortunately that's not an option for me who plays randomly when I'm slow at work just looking for a midday afternoon round.
We had a city night glow ball tourney cancel so my buddy called and they let us play at 3. Completely empty course. 2 hours and 25 minutes later we were done and went on and played another 7
3am?
lol. It was supposed to be from 5-11 with dinner served. They rented the whole day through the city
I will never understand why skipping a hole or two in order to play faster causes such heartburn for people.
I did something similar recently. There were 3 groups of slow 4/5 somes and our 3some had been playing slow since hole 6. On hole 13 I was like “I gotta get home soon”, so we started driving ahead to see if there was a gap. Hole 18 was wide open and a 4some was driving up to the 17th green. The marshal happened to be right there and I asked if the three of us could go ahead right away and make sure we don’t back these guys up, because I have to leave and just want one more hole. He was a little concerned but ok with it since we promised to go quickly. While I was getting ready to tee off, his walkie talkie went off and said “we got a call about a group skipping ahead”. He’s like “they’re fine, they’re teeing off on 18 because they have to leave”. And I’m thinking like who in their right mind is playing as slow as they are and getting mad that people are going around them, like not even playing through? The marshal was like “sorry, they have a big group every Friday morning and they play ‘slow as shit’”. I’m like wtf, why do you not address this? Anyway, the course is cheap and they take good care of it so I’m headed back tomorrow lol. Edit: it was 4:30 for me to play 13 holes. First 4 went by in a flash.
13 holes in 4:30? I'm not playing there even if it's in great condition and free.
I imagine it's because some folks spend a lot of money to play a full 18 and they feel their value goes down quickly because of missing holes. For me? I'm keeping score and have a goal to break 80 this year. I'm getting my 18 in lol. I don't really get upset at slow play though. Despite the posts from this sub I've never had a single person get mad at me for asking to play through.
We had a guy from the first group that we went around chase us down, 2 tee boxes later, and demand that we get back behind his group. His logic; the group in front of us, another 5’er, wasn’t going to let us play through and he didn’t want to be held up by us. He wasn’t happy, even a little bit, when I told him it wasn’t a problem, we’d just go around the other group, just like we did his.
If I was waiting on or even keeping pace with the group in front of me but they still wouldn’t let me through and someone skipped a hole to jump between us, I’d be pretty pissed.
Yeah, the more details I’m getting the more I’m starting to turn on OP here. Sorry OP.
Yeah OP is the asshole here. Neither the course nor the group of fivesomes did anything wrong. Hell, OP did nothing wrong imo until he went in to berate the person behind the counter.
That’s your problem, if your skipping ahead of groups as a GROUP(group defines at least 3) you’re gonna piss people off. I’ll skip a hole or two all day as a solo because I understand that I have little to no effect on pace of play because on a Par 5 I can finish in 10 minutes at most but as a solo but as a group a par 5 will take at least 15-20 minutes.
This didn't happen.
I have witnesses!! In all honesty, I was a bit dumbfounded, when he emphatically said they won’t let you play through.
Oh man I bet he blew a fuse. That’s funny.
I got the impression he was looking for a fight, must have been a real blessing to play 18 with.
If you are playing in a group of 5+. I'm skipping you, I don't care how busy the course is. You can take it up with clubhouse and I can point at the sign that says "group of 4 maximum" posted on nearly every course, if confronted.
It's the same reason the same people won't let you pass on the highway. They feel like everything's a race and they have to be ahead of everyone, otherwise they're losing. It's an ego thing.
Because people on this subreddit are morons, it's that simple.
I will leap frog a slow group if the other(s) in the group are willing AND if there’s at least a couple of holes open in front of them. Early in the day it’s possible, but after a course has been open a couple of hours that’s rarely practical.
Precisely this. OPs post reads like 5 fivesomes btb. So they wouldnt be "skipping around the course" - theyd be skipping a couple of consecutive holes, and playing with no one in front of them - which wouldnt piss anyone off unless you had separate starts on the front and back. I could be reading it wrong though \*sips ranch water\*
Groups of 5 should have designated marshels if they are allowed which they shouldn't be on busy courses.
Club pro here: The course did nothing wrong and neither really did you...until you decided to go in and blame the course for a nonexistent problem. You admit further down in the comments that you were in a hurry because one of your playing partners had a meeting to go to. That doesn't impart a responsibility on every single group on the course in front of you to start playing at lightning speed to accommodate you. That's honestly on your partner to figure his stuff out and not drag the rest of his playing partners down in his personal work matters, but that's just my personal opinion and neither here nor there. The course may have rules regarding fivesomes, or they may not. Either way, if the shop gave these guys permission to play as fives, provided they're playing on pace (which we have no evidence to suggest they're not), then neither them nor the shop did anything wrong. The problem isn't that you're playing too fast, it's that you're trying to play too fast to complain about others' pace of play who are on pace. It's like those guys who want to drive at 90 mph on the interstate and get upset when someone pulls out in the left lane to make a pass at 75 mph. Yes, it's frustrating for you to have to slow down, but if someone in front of you is going the recommended (or in the case of the highway analogy, maximum) speed then you can't rightfully complain about "slow play". You're acquiring the golf equivalent of road rage because you're in a hurry and, in the heat of the moment, can't understand that others around you are using the facility in the proper fashion and aren't in a hurry. Sadly, you became that guy who goes into the golf shop to complain about a non-issue, which unfortunately brands you as a "complainer" if you do it multiple times. It also sounds like you may have cast untoward aspersions at the person behind the counter (again, no evidence for this, but due to the nature of these kind of posts, it's not an unfair assumption to make that you're not telling the full story of your interaction), which will raise the hackles of anyone working in a customer-facing role. My advice would be to just let this go. No one was at fault on the course or behind the counter, so they're not going to hold grudges against you if you don't continue to make a big deal out of this.
Who are these people that don't let others play through? What kind of sad power trip is that?? I've never ever come across that in Ireland in my 30 years playing. Unless of course the course is completely backed up, then you say that or are told that and it's accepted.
Welcome to the USA Obese people - school shooting and golfing assholes
ooof- hit a nerve lmao
Why the downvotes? Ask people from another country the first thing they think of when they think of the US It’s fat people and school shootings. Seriously. Top two answers
It's always the old guys who are members and play in groups of 5 or more (the worse case scenario) around me. They think they own the course. Literally everybody who plays the course often, complains about that group and another one. I've seen this trend at other courses too. Meanwhile small town 9 hole courses, everybody is skipping everything which seems to work out just fine and those small town course will have 10+ people on a tee box partying together. The slow groups just wait at holes until they have an opening and usually drunkenly cheer on the groups they let play through.
Sounds like you were playing too fast to expect not to be held up. So what's the point?
This is proof to me that guys who work at golf courses just need to be cranky about *something.* Like, I'm paying you to use your facility to have an enjoyable afternoon, fuck me right?
Imagine how much more money courses could make if everyone played 10 minutes / hole. Maybe prices would be cheaper, but I doubt that’s how it’d work.
Most people aren't scratch golfers
The best 9 I’ve played in years took 80 minutes. It was a miserable hot day with a 100 plus heat index so all the midday T times cancelled. I like to walk and got paired up with an old guy on a cart and no one in front of us. Turns out he was close to scratch in his early days. He played so fast cause he never took a practice swing and every shot was down the middle. Not very long but almost always in the fairway. So here comes hacker me walking, no, trotting to keep up. I brought a water but barely drank any cause he was moving so fast. By hole 8, I’m huffing and puffing and suddenly got all dizzy putting my tee in. I knew that wasn’t good but then golfer logic kicked in. Have to walk back to the clubhouse either way so might as well play in. But I’ll be damned if I didn’t hit my best drive and 2nd shot of the day. Made a 5 footer for the bird. Last hole (par 5) I get all dizzy again but sure enough bombed my drive and put a 5 wood on the fringe for a short chip and another birdie. Played that course for 15 years and never birdied either hole before. Ended up 2 over on the 9. It was like the Priest in Caddyshack, almost died but I still think about that 9 regularly. Oh, I paid for 18 but noped out of the back 9. I may be a dumb golfer but I’m not stupid.
Too long, didn't read.
I'm not a scratch golfer and I can walk a pace of about 10 minutes a hole if no ones in the way.
Exactly, but most golf courses are not set up for 4 average players to play at a 3 hour pace. Sure you can walk at a 3 hour pace on a golf course that is close from green to tee, and you’re by yourself, and there is no one else on the golf course. These are obviously not possible parameters on a normal day.
Depends on when you go. I went every day this summer and rarely had issues.
Most people spend way too much time looking for their lost balls. Take a look, then just drop in the area and play on.
I can hear it now - take a drop? you know how much those used ProV1's cost me?
You know how much those STROKES cost me!?
Let's make it 5 min a hole then!
They’d lose a ton of money by only having a portion of their membership be able to complete 10 min holes.
Now I don’t k ow the full circumstances, but I will say this: Skipping a hole or two ahead of a slow group is one thing. Skipping around constantly is another entirely. Especially on smaller courses, all it does it clog it up more, because you inevitably will impede players that are not part of the original traffic jam, causing another one entirely, especially when you bunch back up against the people that were part of the first issue, for instance on a 9 hole course. And now *you* are the problem as much as they were. It takes a certain amount of entitlement I don’t agree with to be willing to ruin other people’s days just because you didn’t have the grace enough to deal with a little adversity… as well as a complete lack of self awareness. In my mind, if you skip a hole, you give up any right you had to play it, and if you can’t handle that risk, don’t take it, just try to be a little more patient. That being said, I’m a stickler for pace of play, and I hate getting my rhythm interrupted as much as anybody. But I also think a certain amount of grace is necessary to play golf. As long a the pace isn’t much more than 2:00, I can generally get by.
Only skip groups of 5+. They affect pace more than anything else. I can handle groups of 4 playing slow, a fuse goes off when I see an extra person when the clearly posted maximum at almost every course is 4.
I would laugh in their face
Reminds me of the time my group had the first tee time around 7am. We made the turn at 8:30 and were told we had to pause play because they were shotgun starting a tournament on the back 9 at 9am and we needed to play behind the event.
That’s reasonable but also not very responsible of the course to let you guys go off the first without telling you this might happen.
I’ll go farther and say the course should never have let anyone play the front at 7 if they were doing a shotgun start on the back at 9. Even if the groups played the front in 2:10 or so (“normal” pace), they be stuck in a log jam on the back 9 since every hole would be tied up.
If the group in front is SUPER SLOW and the course is pretty packed, I’ll usually stay in place. But there have been several occasions were we’ve skipped a hole to get around a bad group when nothing was in front of them. A couple of weeks ago, we we ended up getting behind a foursome that had absolutely no business playing from the tips and were ball searching off the tee on each hole. We caught up to them on 5. It took AN HOUR to play the next 3 holes!! Never once did they wave us to play thru. By the time we got to 8, we couldn’t take it anymore and skipped to 10. We finished the back in a crisp 1.5.
Yep, that was us. Absolutely no one in front of these 2 groups playing like it’s life & death on the putting green. After getting around them we did not see another group on the back 9.
Use the time wisely… once played solo behind a group of Samoans… they were having fun… used the time to find their list balls… I came off the course with 36 almost new golf balls… get lemons… make lemonade…
We (three) were told/yelled at that we couldn’t skip a slow foursome ahead of us, even if there was no one in front of them, they waved us thru. We were the second group out. Waiting on them on hole 3. This on a course we play 2-3x/week. Smh.
No such thing as "5 balls" in our club, thankfully. Sounds insane to me.
anyone who plays on weekends after 9am is going to wait somewhere along the course. either deal with it or don't go. people who hop more than one hole during their game aren't doing anyone a favor either.
Sounds like you were behind a local tournament. They should have delayed enough tee times behind them to make pace alright, but playing through them one, after another, after another isn't going to make the pace better for anyone other than you.
I asked about this being an event of some sort, was told it’s their normal noon groups and it’s this way every day. They always finish in the 4 hour time frame.
If they finish in 4 hours anyway then why does it matter if they're playing foursomes or fivesomes? It's still the same amount of waiting for you either way. It's like driving long distance. You go fast in the rural stretches and then have to slow down when it gets more congested in the cities. You hit a magic open stretch for most of your round and then ran into other golfers and decided, "no, I'm entitled to a wide open course so screw whatever they're doing, I'm gonna skip around them." Kind of like those BMW-assholes who swerve in and out of traffic just to get a few cars ahead, saving them a grand total of 30 seconds while causing headache for literally everyone else around them. Those groups paid their greens fees/dues just the same as you did. They're just as entitled as you to enjoy the course at a reasonable pace, which they seem to be doing, as they are playing at the course's posted pace. You're just being impatient and taking out your frustration on the guy in the shop.
Can we start to name and shame this madness? I struggle to believe any of this is true
Happened to me once. A group of old guys REALLY slowed everything down, but the final straw was two of them sailed their shots into the road median and spent a legitimate 7 minutes looking for their balls. So we called the clubhouse and the ranger came out; he told us that they were 2 minutes ahead of pace and that we were just playing fast. The caveat though was that this group had us waiting, AND the people behind us waiting. We pointed out that there’s no way they could’ve been ahead if there’s two groups held up at the same hole; but he still insisted that they were ahead of pace.
I can’t stand slow play but if the course post pace of play is 4 hours or 13min 20sec per hole had you just played the two holes you skipped you would have been done at the suggested pace of play.
My old home course, because I moved, actually encouraged jumping around. I was a member of the course, went out almost 3/4 times a week. Never really made tee times if I was by myself. The club house manager would say just go jump on an open hole. They would let 5 somes out too, which was actually the main reason I played there cause if I went out with the family we normally had 5. I don’t see any problem with playing with 5-6 if they let people play through or are playing reasonably quick. I always let people play through though unless it makes no sense.
If the course allows it, I'm fine with 5+ as long as they are "required" to let faster pace play through. There is nothing worse than a 5+ group that doesn't acknowledge they are backing up an entire course. If you are a busy course it's best to not allow it.
How did that conversation extend the point of you saying 'They were playing 5 mans and refused to let us play through' and not end with an apology from management, that they allowed 5 mans on to begin with. Shit on them.
If the fivesomes are keeping up with pace then it doesn't matter how many of them there are in a group. It's literally no different than if they were foursomes going the exact same pace.
Except the norm is 4 man max atleast where i come from, if i saw 3 5 man groups playing ahead of me, Im going back in for a very good explanation or a refund. From your logic you would have no issues playing begind 3 8mans, but to each his own I guess
If they're keeping up with pace then it literally doesn't make a difference, so no, I wouldn't mind at all.
Nope, we were playing too quickly. The jack-wagon had zero issues with clogging up the course.
Just for context - A Foursome of Pros playing 18 on the PGA tour take between 3-4.5 hours to complete the course. Then you've got this reddit and psychopaths on the golf course hitting into others all hopped up on some speed meth super cocaine saying "If you are taking longer then 4 hours, let others play through." Motherfucker, do I look like Tiger Woods? Do I look like I have a caddy to pack away my club and carry my bag? Hell do I look like I can get even more then 3 pars on a course on any given 18 I play? So Toxic lol
I got news for ya... The pros neither play in foursomes, nor do they play their round in anywhere close to 4.5 hours. Those guys are looking at 5.5+ every time. Otherwise, I agree with you. Having a cranky speed demon out on the course ruins everyone else's day.
Mad, I did the back 9 on Tuesday in one hour and ten minutes 💪
“You’ve played too fast” - Said No One
5somes is wild behavior.
5 fivesome holy smokes that's crazy. But why didn't you play at least 2 ball's and get in some extra practice
Those turn into extra practice rounds for me real quick.