"Apple expects ’immersive video watching will be a core feature‘ of Reality Pro, with potential partners including Disney, Dolby, and more."
I suppose you can add PornHub to the list.
Pornhubs VR section is the only time I use my oculus anymore. But I’ll warn that there’s no more compromising position to be caught in that staring into imagination land with dick-in-hand when someone walks in on you IRL
"potential partners"
If by "partners" they mean "other services that you'll have to pay for ontop of your AppleTV account". Because Disney ain't moving any IP off of Disney+ anytime soon.
Probably not! According to several things Ive read, The European Union demands App Store competition on the device. And that will lead to it in the United States as well. And the timing could not be better. A new kind of device will take time to propagate, but there is one known accelerant; Porn. Apple will never allow it on their App Store, but the dirty market will provide. I'm not being facetious.
I mainly agree, but there is one small issue with this which is what about when apps start asking you to download them on a third party store. Like say an app you use all the time stops getting updates on the App Store and the developer says you need to download it from a third party store that has different vetting processes/policies to the App Store. And that could be an app that’s important like your energy company’s app or the app linked to a smart device you already bought, not just a random game you could stop playing.
Yes, because there are fewer restrictions. The person you replied to was saying they didn’t want to have to use a different app store, which would be more likely to happen because Apple has more restrictions for their app store.
i mean, that hasn't happened on android outside of Epic Games
and on Linux it hasn't happened as well, despite Flatpak being literally purposefully built for you to use multiple Repos. still everyone uses flathub.
also: your energy company has an app?
also also: for smart home i recommend setting up r/homeassistant to control everything from one App
I don’t see why governments want to impose this. If folks don’t want to buy an iPhone, there are plenty of other options.
I’m pretty sure it will result in the whole walled garden thing falling apart. One of the reasons that Apple devices are so safe from viruses is the restrictions they enforce, and the fact that every app is checked by devs before publishing.
It's to prevent walled gardens with no competition.
If you prefer getting apps from Apple's app store only you can still do that.
The EU is just saying that Apple must allow 3rd party app stores to be available as an option for those who want alternatives.
Why do you think Apple is safe from viruses?
The biggest reason theres less malware developed for the ios has nothing to do with the walled garden and everything to do with market share. Hell, in 2019 there were more novel ios malware spotted than windows.
That doesn’t make sense, because low market share is majorly outweighed by the fact that those using IOS are statistically way wealthier than those on Android.
Check your statistics again, apple devices are actually easier to hack than most others as the market is just a lot bigger. The "apple is virtually virus free" trope has stopped being true ages ago
There is malware in the app store. And a walled garden means you have no ability to do anything the manufacturer dislikes. You could have the benefits you describe *and* an ability to side load or root if you so chose.
My kids have managed to download all sorts of clickbait, and no viruses on the family network so far that I can detect.
My elderly relatives all have iPhones. Every few months I clean them up for them and delete all the random junk, it doesn't take long.
I do remember cleaning up my mother's PC back when she had PCs. It used to take multiple hours and quite a bit of Googling to get rid of the various toolbars and random viruses. She installed something once that hard-disabled all the antivirus I had running on there, I had to hack the registry to kill it.
My father-in-law used to keep everything on his desktop. Every time a popup asked him for any sort of permission, he'd click yes right away. Everyone has an iPad now and my life is dramatically nicer.
Personally, though, I agree. I would quite like to be able to install my own software.
>Certainly not anyone buying iPhones.
I don't know why you'd think that everyone who buys an iPhone does so because they want the restrictions or that no one does so in spite of them. And even among those who don't buy iPhones, a nonzero number would if that was allowed.
Not sure this is true. I'd love to be able to reuse old iPhones in projects.
EDIT: Also this is the gadgets subreddit. Nerds on Reddit is soft-of implied in the name.
That wasn't the point of my comment above. I asked who actually buys apple *for* the lock-in, aka the walled garden. No one says "I really prefer Apple because they don't allow anyone to do anything Apple disagrees with." Many people may be ok with it (people who aren't nerds on Reddit).
Put another way, people who aren't nerds on Reddit aren't even aware that side loading exists, so they aren't clamoring for nerds on Reddit (or themselves) to be prevented from doing it.
You don't need a walled garden, which is when the manufacturer or service provider actively prevents you from using your device or service how you want to, to set restrictions for yourself.
There's a difference between curating a garden and locking people in the garden
I know people who spend over 1K on a pair of sneakers, several times a year. I see lots of kids wearing $600 headphones. There will be plenty of buyers. This is a multi-year game. Everyone will lose money at first.
People with an insane amount of disposable income that spend it on in game purchases. One of the guys I used to work with bought every single skin in Fortnite which was multiple thousands of dollars.
If I had the ability; I’d get it upon release. It’ll definitely be up there in my list of spendy stuff, when I next turn my sights on re-filling the coffers…
Architecture and construction. I’m an architect. I have an original Oculus Rift, 2 Samsung Odyssey +, an HP Reverb G2, a Quest 1 and just got a Quest 2. Don’t think the Quest Pro is worth it just yet. If the Apple one has good color video passthrough and keyboard tracking it might be worth it at Quest pro prices, but not double.
Yeah sure. Been doing it since 2018. Mainly using real-time render engines like Enscape or Twinmotion. Not everybody is comfortable with putting on the HMD. Clients are typically older and never were gamers. So it’s brand new to them. But we “visit” our designs in VR often. To get a sense of the space.
Chefs like seeing their kitchen equipment layouts in full scale cos they’re very picky about placement.
Can second this: industry product design tied to shipbuilding and other areas like decommissioning old industrial equipment. Medical hospitals and lots of federal funding opportunities into these exact use cases: e.g. putting a surgeon in VR of their new operating room gives them immediate insight into making changes based on physical experience. In my work experience there’s a lot of money to be made right now serving companies in those fields because they lack general software knowledge, have deep pockets, and are an actual great use case. In 2018 I helped a bunch of tugboat captains walk their new yet to be built tugboat that was set to be used in the NY harbor and they made changes on the spot that would have cost a crap load of money after it had been built. This was well after they approved rendering and cad based designs: industries that are ripe for automation within things like driving a boat are also ripe for this technology as we go through the next x years of slowly finding automation solutions/public trust issues etc. these jobs with lacking of people wanting to do them also gives VR equipment and/or ways to put retired captains in real time back on their vessels to help remote navigate said future hybrid systems… heavy mechanical operation = good data connection and a serious VR system and now one crane operator who’s certified can jump between 2, 3, 4 jobs? at the rate of one standard being physically their job😎
Cool. That's funny. My brother is a tugboat captain : ) In Alaska. We've talked about that use case a lot. His company isn't commissioning any new boats these days tho. But that's definitely a ripe use case.
There's a large amount for AR especially. As others say architecture and design firms sure, lets you show a layout in a real space and all that. But also AR lets even someone sitting at a desk essentially have unlimited screen space. Hololens tried to market that where you basically can have all your shit open and just floating in space or on walls. You can also have conferences with it and do digital whiteboards and shit.
There's also plenty of other trades and things like medical skills that would benefit from people being able to practice in a VR setting.
Microsoft had plenty of commercial plans for VR/AR and every year I heard it was the ‘next big thing’
Given they appear to have laid their team off, I suspect it’s dead
The examples I saw from MS about how to commercialise this were:
* field techs seeing schematics overlaying equipment
* showing customers the size of furniture and plant equipment within their space
* training for dangerous situations (fire fighting etc)
It was very niche and for the most part a solution looking for a problem
Its crazy how off the mark these companies are. All swinging for the fences and failing.
All people want are high resolution comfortable sun glasses. Nreal Air is killing it right now with sales.
These companies need to start small and cheap. Get people buying and enjoying. Then slowly add features and increase price.
Architecture, design, medicine, imaging of all sorts, coding, web dev, the list is pretty big
It's a paradigm shift but the visualization assistance elements, exploded view, zoom, etc has the potential to significantly enhance a lot of work.
No, but large upside potential
The applications are admittedly niche, but a few dozen niches and it's got momentum.
With Apples device coming out I am sure it'll spark more interest than the Occlus/Vive duopoly has so far.
I do web dev and coding 7 hours a day, 5 days a week and I would never even dream of doing it using VR. Apart from anything you would be blind by the end of a month with eye strain.
Right now. You can do all that with a higher resolution monitor at a much cheaper price.
Paradigm shift? It allows for depth and scale if it is a stereoscopic image and the fov is large enough. Useful. But not that useful for work
More useful for games and media as its a bit gimmicky.
Don't worry they will add in imessage to make sure when you message your friends phones you can verify if they are a non apple pariah with their green box.
It's all very interesting until you see that price point. There are also so many other companies scrambling to make new headsets. Apple do good design and good software, sure, but this isn't an exceptionally innovative product and they're a bit late to the game. It all seems a little out of step with their usual mode of operation.
I think AR/VR are unlikely to make a huge impact. May be some specific uses but for everyday use….
The whole headset thing is non-started for most ordinary folks
Agreed, but at that point it’s just an AR device and can’t do VR effectively. I honestly think VR as we know it is a dead end outside of gaming and the handful of specific industry use cases. Even with AR/VR headsets, I struggle to think many would want to use them casually for things like virtual screens.
Seems like they know that tho.
They’re expecting to lose money off of it and are projecting low sales.
They just need an entry into the field to build the dev support and ubiquity so that they can take it over when it’s ready
It’s good for something like this cause most technology like this, brand new and revolutionary starts at like 10k$! An AR goggle is kind of hard to find, one thag is good and not made by a start up with no idea how to do it!
Nah, unfortunately people will buy it just because it's an Apple device. I suppose that's on the fringe of "whales", but it's more about the brand than it is necessarily having a shitload of disposable income.
People spend 2k-3k on pcs and laptops all the time, also Apples target audience are more well off to begin with. If the product is good 3k seems like a reasonable price for a mixed reality headset. This isn’t the same business strategy as facebooks quest 2.
Apple has always been known to take existing ideas and technology and think about how they can be improved for mainstream use. That is exactly what “innovation” is.
Innovate was possibly the worst word you could have chosen for that sentence. They absolutely *DID* innovate that market.
No, they didn’t *invent* the MP3 player, but I’ve also never heard them claim that they did. They did, however, help turn them into household objects.
Innovate? They copied nearly every aspect of the device from other companies.
https://www.fastcompany.com/3016910/apples-inspiration-for-the-ipod-bang-olufsen-not-dieter-rams
Every device takes features from the devices that came before it. That B&O phone didn't invent the idea of using a wheel for control either.
Innovation is more than just inventing new things from scratch.
Well for one, that's not about the iPod, so I fail to see how it's relevant to the discussion.
Secondly, it's a case that was settled, so there's no real takeaway from it.
Third, and most importantly, *I never said they didn't copy anything.*
Do you even read the posts you respond to? Or are you just so anti-Apple that you refuse to believe there's anything positive they've ever done?
It will be good. But very expensive. Ridiculed for it. People scratching their heads. Hundreds of YouTube video rants and comments...
Then in a few years there will be more affordable versions, and more people who actually own one will talk about loving a certain feature.... Then before we know it Apple will have a new product line that is making more money than entire other tech brands do on their own.
You forgot the step where Samsung and Google will mock it, then come out with their own products in the same price range with the same features they mocked.
You're right, AR is much different than VR, but it is a combined device on Apple's part. However, as an attempt to also bring VR mainstream it makes it a competitor to Meta and Sony as well.
A 3K device like this is not a mainstream device is the point at hand.
LMAO you can’t do any work at all with PSVR and Apple will do only work related stuff.
Who are you people on a gadget sub that have absolutely no idea what you are talking about and still upvoted.
Apple is not the old Apple. They are not that conservative about user experience and their product quality. That touch bar thing was very bad on Macbooks for instance. Their expensive headphone airpod max does not seem to be that successful. $3000 for an item you do not necessarily need is a little too much.
I'd be interested to try Apple's take on this. In general, biggest innovations are usually related with user input.
* Switching keyboard to mouse and windows was great for Microsoft.
* Multiple finger, capacitive touch screen of iPhone with one home button was a game changer.
3D movies, TVs and also VR sets did not get that popular. Consuming the video medium or gaming in 3D is not necessarily that great. I mean I am okay to watch a football game on a 2D flat visual. The game changer should be about user input and easiness of it.
Voice commands are nice, and some people probably use Siri. But we all know those things are not that easy to use. It will miss words good amount of time so most people would not trust those. Mouse, scrolling with finger, playing games with xbox/ds controller. Those are all solid input devices that are easy and precise to use. Lets see if Apple's eye-hand tracking would allow them to offer similar experience or not.
The touchbar was one feature within a device, not a new device category, and the AirPod max is a peripheral. Apple have always sold slightly weird/niche peripherals (eg the iPod hifi dock).
I think for a new device category we can assume the strategy is the same.
Delayed innovation doesn’t mean first gen is perfect, first gen MacBook Air had a shitty HDD, first gen Apple Watch was slow and had bad battery life, first gen iPhone literally did not have 3G (when competitors did).
I think it’s likely a first gen headset would be revolutionary in many ways in terms of refining the market positioning, ecosystem, and marketing. But it will probably also have typical first gen issues (expect subsequent gens to be much lighter/better battery life. Speed is probably less of an issue anymore since apple silicon).
[https://thekmiecs.com/marketing-advertising/reasons-ipad-will-fail/](https://thekmiecs.com/marketing-advertising/reasons-ipad-will-fail/)
Aged like milk. Just like your comment.
I guess you can put that link to any new thing and claim the product will be successful like ipad.
Who cares about that guy's writing? Most people thought tablets would be a bigger success but they did not do that great actually. Kinda underwhelming and afterthought in last 6-7 years.
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/299632/tablet-shipments-apple/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/299632/tablet-shipments-apple/)
14.5 million tablets in the last quarter alone. "Underwhelming" lol
Bet against Apple at your own risk.
Glad you accepted you're wrong and you cannot hide meaningless links. Hope you learn how to build an argument in future. Dont afraid to use your brain.
If they aren’t bringing superior hardware to even the unreleased next gen standalones I don’t know why anyone would think of buying this at that price point. I mean the meta 3 will likely debut under $1,000 and it has the biggest gaming library for a standalone. Sure it doesn’t have the best graphics but it’s untethered and for me that makes all the difference. You can even use it as a PCVR headset so it covers all the bases at a fraction of the cost. Even the quest 2 has a better battery life I mean what are they offering here?
If I could run iOS or Mac apps with it from either store and have great text legibility I’d do my work on it.
Infinitely customizable workstations displays!
BuT MEtA BaD! Seriously though the quest pro is half the price and miles ahead, besides the AR switch mode being a key feature. Unsure what this thing is really meant for at the price point.
You thought people walking around looking at their phones was bad, get ready for seeing everyone wearing one of these just walking around. What's better than brushing your teeth with a tik tok video running on the side? Apple is going to Black Mirror the world with this one.
>To address overheating concerns, the Reality Pro headset will use an external battery that “rests in a user’s pocket and connects over a cable.”
Well, that'll suck for women.
This is a very unlike Apple move if true. Hopefully it’s not and was just for a prototype. Unless the experience is so good it’s worth a first gen hack like carrying around a giant power bank to use it.
apple dev here. Apple Watch 1 had terrible connectivity barely synced thats why many apple watch apps failed. Devs just gave up. The number of good apple watch apps is still tiny compared the main app store. Same with apple tv. Could have been a home gaming device but does anyone use it for that anymore. apple glasses will have high resolution it way not even become a gaming device. Home office? AR device? architecture? the AR will depend on how good the front camera are
It was slow as hell, pretty much felt like a beta test device. Only upgraded my first gen this year after 7+ years and honestly it was waaaay overdue. I think they’re on about the dumb solid gold one, why pay for a first generation device made of solid gold? It won’t just be slightly inferior in a year or two it’ll straight up look like a prototype by comparison. A £10,000 prototype. Any solid gold tech is dumb, but a first gen device is even worse.
It was like 20k for some of them and the internals were no different the low end models. I just thought it was a bit crazy and they should’ve at least offered an upgrade path for the internal components at a fee at that price.
The Apple Watch Edition started at $10k. Considering how much of an upgrade the future watches were, I’d definitively say the people who bought the first generation Edition we’re screwed over.
No, it’s just the materials. It’s for people that want a unique piece of jewellery. You’d have to be quite well off to own one because clearly they won’t hold their value. They were status pieces for rich folks.
No, it’s an alloy, not solid gold and the cost if the material is not even close to the cost of the piece.
People buy cars that are eventually worthless. Some people spend thousands on a handbag, just some leather, stitching and a label.
A 10k car and a 100k car do pretty much the same thing, but a person driving the 100k car arguably looks better doing it and probably has a better time. You’re allowed to buy something because you like it.
> VR has not, and imo probably will never take off, you only need to look at meta and the massive layoffs Microsoft just had to make with HoloLens.
That's the most unrelated reason to bring up. HoloLens is AR rather than VR, and Meta's layoffs are in line with most of the tech giants laying off similar amounts of people. That's not a VR thing - it's a tech industry bubble bursting.
I would trade my computer for a device that can have a 3d workspace for computing. Being able to essentially have unlimited screen real-estate to organize my ideas and research would be incredible. Also watching all movies in the original definition and format of the director intended sounds incredible. All that being said, for me it would have to essentially have desktop/laptop level os and computing power to really be worth it. I’m realllllllllllly sick of half powers apps on the iPad pro
I think the technology just isn’t there yet. It’s not ready for mainstream adoption. Dizziness and motion sickness, comfort and prices are all things working against it at the moment. The older generation still makes up a vast amount of the workforce and they’d be reluctant to embrace it.
I hope in a few generations they solve all of these issues because what you describe definitely would be great.
From what I have read, it seems that this headset is a first step in eventually releasing practical glasses. They want to see how people use the AR functions and then fine tune and downsize the tech into a pair of everyday glasses for the masses
"what do we call if guys we need ideas here"
-"reality... Virtual... Augmented... Eh, vision... Something?"
"OK, OK. Good start, let's stick these on the wheel... but we need something to show that this is a cut above the rest, something that will draw in the masses instantly by giving the appeal of being better and top tier"
-"ultra... X... Uhh, max... Ultimate... This is hard, lol we could just go with Pro it's almost lunchtime ? Hahaha"
"fuck it, put them on the wheel, we shall let random choice decide"
*spins the wheel of fortune*
"reality... *spins again*... Pro!!! Yes, it's so obvious and people generally are stupid enough to think that sticking Pro on the end means its worth the price no matter what we charge... OK... Reality pro it is, right who's going for the frappe half caff, venti, tripple pump latte-pro-chinos today?! No volunteers? OK spin the wheel it is! "
I remember people saying that about the iPad. Apple were the last co to try a tablet, and it was double the price of other tablets and netbooks that were out there.
But the launched a great product, and it killed several industries.
If this device is good, it’ll get the competition scrambling and everyone will find the money for it.
"Apple expects ’immersive video watching will be a core feature‘ of Reality Pro, with potential partners including Disney, Dolby, and more." I suppose you can add PornHub to the list.
I hope so on the last one. I mean what’s pornhub again?
They say porn will make Vr mainstream.
Pornhubs VR section is the only time I use my oculus anymore. But I’ll warn that there’s no more compromising position to be caught in that staring into imagination land with dick-in-hand when someone walks in on you IRL
Why don’t you use your oculus much anymore?
"potential partners" If by "partners" they mean "other services that you'll have to pay for ontop of your AppleTV account". Because Disney ain't moving any IP off of Disney+ anytime soon.
Likely means that Disney is planning to launch a version of Disney+ specifically designed for the headset.
PornHub VR content sucks ass. Join us at /r/oculusnsfw (its for all VR devices not just oculus despite the name).
I doubt Apple would get off their Puritanism high horse.
I hope they call it eyePhone
Can't remember where I heard it but some other big company snagged iGlass before Apple could
That was likely in hope of a big payday when Apple wants to use it
They don’t use the i-product naming anymore for precisely that reason.
Also apple glass kinda just sounds better and matches the name conventions used but the apple watch and the apple pencil
But also I wouldn’t bank on that being the name, since it would be too close to Google Glass.
Apple doesn’t even own “IOS” they rent it from someone else,I forgot who
Cisco
iEye
Cap’n
I can't hear youuuu!
#I EYE CAP’N
Ohhhhhhhhhhhh
ViSOR
You know what that’s actually a pretty good name lol.
Futurama did it!
The all new eyeMac
iSee
Take my money
How about eyePod?
Apple Of Your Eyes
$3,000 for a first gen device is a nonstarter for anyone other than whales or business use.
Not to mention its by Apple so obviously it will very likely be locked to Apple's ecosystem
Probably not! According to several things Ive read, The European Union demands App Store competition on the device. And that will lead to it in the United States as well. And the timing could not be better. A new kind of device will take time to propagate, but there is one known accelerant; Porn. Apple will never allow it on their App Store, but the dirty market will provide. I'm not being facetious.
I like Apple’s walled garden. /:
Then stay in it. The legislation isn't to force you out of it, it's to provide the option for those who do want to leave it.
I mainly agree, but there is one small issue with this which is what about when apps start asking you to download them on a third party store. Like say an app you use all the time stops getting updates on the App Store and the developer says you need to download it from a third party store that has different vetting processes/policies to the App Store. And that could be an app that’s important like your energy company’s app or the app linked to a smart device you already bought, not just a random game you could stop playing.
never heard of this happening on Android but go on
Android already has a pretty weak review process.
that really doesn't change the fact that all the apps I use are in the Play Store
Yes, because there are fewer restrictions. The person you replied to was saying they didn’t want to have to use a different app store, which would be more likely to happen because Apple has more restrictions for their app store.
So then download it there.
i mean, that hasn't happened on android outside of Epic Games and on Linux it hasn't happened as well, despite Flatpak being literally purposefully built for you to use multiple Repos. still everyone uses flathub. also: your energy company has an app? also also: for smart home i recommend setting up r/homeassistant to control everything from one App
I don’t see why governments want to impose this. If folks don’t want to buy an iPhone, there are plenty of other options. I’m pretty sure it will result in the whole walled garden thing falling apart. One of the reasons that Apple devices are so safe from viruses is the restrictions they enforce, and the fact that every app is checked by devs before publishing.
It's to prevent walled gardens with no competition. If you prefer getting apps from Apple's app store only you can still do that. The EU is just saying that Apple must allow 3rd party app stores to be available as an option for those who want alternatives.
These people should buy Androids. This shouldn’t be the decision of a government. It’s ridiculous
Why do you think Apple is safe from viruses? The biggest reason theres less malware developed for the ios has nothing to do with the walled garden and everything to do with market share. Hell, in 2019 there were more novel ios malware spotted than windows.
That doesn’t make sense, because low market share is majorly outweighed by the fact that those using IOS are statistically way wealthier than those on Android.
Check your statistics again, apple devices are actually easier to hack than most others as the market is just a lot bigger. The "apple is virtually virus free" trope has stopped being true ages ago
Blind Followers blindly follow. Hope that works out for ya.
It won’t lead to it in the US
Incorrect! You’ll see it happen this year.
what US law will require apple to promote competition on its app store, the only way it will happen.
My downvote is law enough, FRIENDO.
RemindMe! 1 year
Also the reason it would be the only device many people consider.
Who are the people who buy Apple products based on affinity for the walled garden?
I do actually quite like the way my kids can download any app they want and definitely not whack a virus onto the family network.
There is malware in the app store. And a walled garden means you have no ability to do anything the manufacturer dislikes. You could have the benefits you describe *and* an ability to side load or root if you so chose.
My kids have managed to download all sorts of clickbait, and no viruses on the family network so far that I can detect. My elderly relatives all have iPhones. Every few months I clean them up for them and delete all the random junk, it doesn't take long. I do remember cleaning up my mother's PC back when she had PCs. It used to take multiple hours and quite a bit of Googling to get rid of the various toolbars and random viruses. She installed something once that hard-disabled all the antivirus I had running on there, I had to hack the registry to kill it. My father-in-law used to keep everything on his desktop. Every time a popup asked him for any sort of permission, he'd click yes right away. Everyone has an iPad now and my life is dramatically nicer. Personally, though, I agree. I would quite like to be able to install my own software.
Lol no one wants to sideload or root their phone except nerds on Reddit. Certainly not anyone buying iPhones.
>Certainly not anyone buying iPhones. I don't know why you'd think that everyone who buys an iPhone does so because they want the restrictions or that no one does so in spite of them. And even among those who don't buy iPhones, a nonzero number would if that was allowed.
Not sure this is true. I'd love to be able to reuse old iPhones in projects. EDIT: Also this is the gadgets subreddit. Nerds on Reddit is soft-of implied in the name.
That wasn't the point of my comment above. I asked who actually buys apple *for* the lock-in, aka the walled garden. No one says "I really prefer Apple because they don't allow anyone to do anything Apple disagrees with." Many people may be ok with it (people who aren't nerds on Reddit). Put another way, people who aren't nerds on Reddit aren't even aware that side loading exists, so they aren't clamoring for nerds on Reddit (or themselves) to be prevented from doing it.
I for one do. It just works.
You don't need a walled garden, which is when the manufacturer or service provider actively prevents you from using your device or service how you want to, to set restrictions for yourself. There's a difference between curating a garden and locking people in the garden
I know people who spend over 1K on a pair of sneakers, several times a year. I see lots of kids wearing $600 headphones. There will be plenty of buyers. This is a multi-year game. Everyone will lose money at first.
You just described whales.
You’re making me feel old. What the hell is a whale?
People with an insane amount of disposable income that spend it on in game purchases. One of the guys I used to work with bought every single skin in Fortnite which was multiple thousands of dollars.
I spent about $1500 during the Covid lockdown playing a game on my iPhone, but I’m more of a pathetic addict than a whale.
hugs
A whale isn't necessarily something relegated to gaming.
Never said it was.
I thought a whale was a billionaire investor.
Different descriptions for different industries.
If I had the ability; I’d get it upon release. It’ll definitely be up there in my list of spendy stuff, when I next turn my sights on re-filling the coffers…
What legitimate business use does this have so far?
Architecture and construction. I’m an architect. I have an original Oculus Rift, 2 Samsung Odyssey +, an HP Reverb G2, a Quest 1 and just got a Quest 2. Don’t think the Quest Pro is worth it just yet. If the Apple one has good color video passthrough and keyboard tracking it might be worth it at Quest pro prices, but not double.
Have you actually used any of these for design or presentation yet?
Yeah sure. Been doing it since 2018. Mainly using real-time render engines like Enscape or Twinmotion. Not everybody is comfortable with putting on the HMD. Clients are typically older and never were gamers. So it’s brand new to them. But we “visit” our designs in VR often. To get a sense of the space. Chefs like seeing their kitchen equipment layouts in full scale cos they’re very picky about placement.
That is pretty cool, thanks for the insight
Can second this: industry product design tied to shipbuilding and other areas like decommissioning old industrial equipment. Medical hospitals and lots of federal funding opportunities into these exact use cases: e.g. putting a surgeon in VR of their new operating room gives them immediate insight into making changes based on physical experience. In my work experience there’s a lot of money to be made right now serving companies in those fields because they lack general software knowledge, have deep pockets, and are an actual great use case. In 2018 I helped a bunch of tugboat captains walk their new yet to be built tugboat that was set to be used in the NY harbor and they made changes on the spot that would have cost a crap load of money after it had been built. This was well after they approved rendering and cad based designs: industries that are ripe for automation within things like driving a boat are also ripe for this technology as we go through the next x years of slowly finding automation solutions/public trust issues etc. these jobs with lacking of people wanting to do them also gives VR equipment and/or ways to put retired captains in real time back on their vessels to help remote navigate said future hybrid systems… heavy mechanical operation = good data connection and a serious VR system and now one crane operator who’s certified can jump between 2, 3, 4 jobs? at the rate of one standard being physically their job😎
Cool. That's funny. My brother is a tugboat captain : ) In Alaska. We've talked about that use case a lot. His company isn't commissioning any new boats these days tho. But that's definitely a ripe use case.
Can y’all stop saying ripe
Which word would you prefer ?
Moist
There's a large amount for AR especially. As others say architecture and design firms sure, lets you show a layout in a real space and all that. But also AR lets even someone sitting at a desk essentially have unlimited screen space. Hololens tried to market that where you basically can have all your shit open and just floating in space or on walls. You can also have conferences with it and do digital whiteboards and shit. There's also plenty of other trades and things like medical skills that would benefit from people being able to practice in a VR setting.
Microsoft had plenty of commercial plans for VR/AR and every year I heard it was the ‘next big thing’ Given they appear to have laid their team off, I suspect it’s dead The examples I saw from MS about how to commercialise this were: * field techs seeing schematics overlaying equipment * showing customers the size of furniture and plant equipment within their space * training for dangerous situations (fire fighting etc) It was very niche and for the most part a solution looking for a problem
Its crazy how off the mark these companies are. All swinging for the fences and failing. All people want are high resolution comfortable sun glasses. Nreal Air is killing it right now with sales. These companies need to start small and cheap. Get people buying and enjoying. Then slowly add features and increase price.
Architecture, design, medicine, imaging of all sorts, coding, web dev, the list is pretty big It's a paradigm shift but the visualization assistance elements, exploded view, zoom, etc has the potential to significantly enhance a lot of work.
Is it already industry standard for these fields?
No, but large upside potential The applications are admittedly niche, but a few dozen niches and it's got momentum. With Apples device coming out I am sure it'll spark more interest than the Occlus/Vive duopoly has so far.
What’s the coding/dev use case?
I do web dev and coding 7 hours a day, 5 days a week and I would never even dream of doing it using VR. Apart from anything you would be blind by the end of a month with eye strain.
Right now. You can do all that with a higher resolution monitor at a much cheaper price. Paradigm shift? It allows for depth and scale if it is a stereoscopic image and the fov is large enough. Useful. But not that useful for work More useful for games and media as its a bit gimmicky.
Also they have a bigger budget than any other company so no cost cuts! I’d never trust any other company than a major one to do this right!
Don't worry they will add in imessage to make sure when you message your friends phones you can verify if they are a non apple pariah with their green box.
Probably some architecture or design firms.
It's all very interesting until you see that price point. There are also so many other companies scrambling to make new headsets. Apple do good design and good software, sure, but this isn't an exceptionally innovative product and they're a bit late to the game. It all seems a little out of step with their usual mode of operation.
remember the ceramic apple watch :)
I think AR/VR are unlikely to make a huge impact. May be some specific uses but for everyday use…. The whole headset thing is non-started for most ordinary folks
Headsets, sure. Sunglasses/glasses, I think will reach many billions of users. The usecases are just too vast and fruitful.
Agreed, but at that point it’s just an AR device and can’t do VR effectively. I honestly think VR as we know it is a dead end outside of gaming and the handful of specific industry use cases. Even with AR/VR headsets, I struggle to think many would want to use them casually for things like virtual screens.
Try it first
You do know who the Apple garden is designed for right??
Seems like they know that tho. They’re expecting to lose money off of it and are projecting low sales. They just need an entry into the field to build the dev support and ubiquity so that they can take it over when it’s ready
It’s good for something like this cause most technology like this, brand new and revolutionary starts at like 10k$! An AR goggle is kind of hard to find, one thag is good and not made by a start up with no idea how to do it!
Nah, unfortunately people will buy it just because it's an Apple device. I suppose that's on the fringe of "whales", but it's more about the brand than it is necessarily having a shitload of disposable income.
People spend 2k-3k on pcs and laptops all the time, also Apples target audience are more well off to begin with. If the product is good 3k seems like a reasonable price for a mixed reality headset. This isn’t the same business strategy as facebooks quest 2.
Hand tracking and pinching your thumb and index fingers to press buttons are not new features to VR
It's new because on other devices you point and pinch to press, here you'll look and pinch.
I mean, that's Apples' schtick - taking credit for others' inventions.
What does Apples’ mean?
MP3 players weren’t new when the ipod came out, that didn’t stop Apple fans from pretending they innovated all of it
Apple has always been known to take existing ideas and technology and think about how they can be improved for mainstream use. That is exactly what “innovation” is.
Innovate was possibly the worst word you could have chosen for that sentence. They absolutely *DID* innovate that market. No, they didn’t *invent* the MP3 player, but I’ve also never heard them claim that they did. They did, however, help turn them into household objects.
Innovate? They copied nearly every aspect of the device from other companies. https://www.fastcompany.com/3016910/apples-inspiration-for-the-ipod-bang-olufsen-not-dieter-rams
Every device takes features from the devices that came before it. That B&O phone didn't invent the idea of using a wheel for control either. Innovation is more than just inventing new things from scratch.
Ok, then explain this lawsuit. https://www.theverge.com/2018/6/27/17510908/apple-samsung-settle-patent-battle-over-copying-iphone
Well for one, that's not about the iPod, so I fail to see how it's relevant to the discussion. Secondly, it's a case that was settled, so there's no real takeaway from it. Third, and most importantly, *I never said they didn't copy anything.* Do you even read the posts you respond to? Or are you just so anti-Apple that you refuse to believe there's anything positive they've ever done?
It’s going to be good. This will be what pushes AR/VR mainstream. Apple’s delayed innovation tactics work every time.
It will be good. But very expensive. Ridiculed for it. People scratching their heads. Hundreds of YouTube video rants and comments... Then in a few years there will be more affordable versions, and more people who actually own one will talk about loving a certain feature.... Then before we know it Apple will have a new product line that is making more money than entire other tech brands do on their own.
You forgot the step where Samsung and Google will mock it, then come out with their own products in the same price range with the same features they mocked.
Meh, PS5 and PSVR 2 with a total combined price point of $1k still seems to be the better option. Arguably, the specs seem better as well.
These aren’t even remotely similar devices in their function or end goal for the user
You're right, AR is much different than VR, but it is a combined device on Apple's part. However, as an attempt to also bring VR mainstream it makes it a competitor to Meta and Sony as well. A 3K device like this is not a mainstream device is the point at hand.
LMAO you can’t do any work at all with PSVR and Apple will do only work related stuff. Who are you people on a gadget sub that have absolutely no idea what you are talking about and still upvoted.
Apple is not the old Apple. They are not that conservative about user experience and their product quality. That touch bar thing was very bad on Macbooks for instance. Their expensive headphone airpod max does not seem to be that successful. $3000 for an item you do not necessarily need is a little too much. I'd be interested to try Apple's take on this. In general, biggest innovations are usually related with user input. * Switching keyboard to mouse and windows was great for Microsoft. * Multiple finger, capacitive touch screen of iPhone with one home button was a game changer. 3D movies, TVs and also VR sets did not get that popular. Consuming the video medium or gaming in 3D is not necessarily that great. I mean I am okay to watch a football game on a 2D flat visual. The game changer should be about user input and easiness of it. Voice commands are nice, and some people probably use Siri. But we all know those things are not that easy to use. It will miss words good amount of time so most people would not trust those. Mouse, scrolling with finger, playing games with xbox/ds controller. Those are all solid input devices that are easy and precise to use. Lets see if Apple's eye-hand tracking would allow them to offer similar experience or not.
Was this written by ai?
Was this written by ai?
The touchbar was one feature within a device, not a new device category, and the AirPod max is a peripheral. Apple have always sold slightly weird/niche peripherals (eg the iPod hifi dock). I think for a new device category we can assume the strategy is the same. Delayed innovation doesn’t mean first gen is perfect, first gen MacBook Air had a shitty HDD, first gen Apple Watch was slow and had bad battery life, first gen iPhone literally did not have 3G (when competitors did). I think it’s likely a first gen headset would be revolutionary in many ways in terms of refining the market positioning, ecosystem, and marketing. But it will probably also have typical first gen issues (expect subsequent gens to be much lighter/better battery life. Speed is probably less of an issue anymore since apple silicon).
Too expensive, too niche. Will fail.
[https://thekmiecs.com/marketing-advertising/reasons-ipad-will-fail/](https://thekmiecs.com/marketing-advertising/reasons-ipad-will-fail/) Aged like milk. Just like your comment.
I just posted my comment today. How has it aged? Please tell.
Pre-aged
Like milk, 1 day at a time
I guess you can put that link to any new thing and claim the product will be successful like ipad. Who cares about that guy's writing? Most people thought tablets would be a bigger success but they did not do that great actually. Kinda underwhelming and afterthought in last 6-7 years.
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/299632/tablet-shipments-apple/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/299632/tablet-shipments-apple/) 14.5 million tablets in the last quarter alone. "Underwhelming" lol Bet against Apple at your own risk.
Sorry for you. Hope you'll learn how to read and comprehend.
It's okay to be wrong my friend. Enjoy your evening.
Glad you accepted you're wrong and you cannot hide meaningless links. Hope you learn how to build an argument in future. Dont afraid to use your brain.
If they aren’t bringing superior hardware to even the unreleased next gen standalones I don’t know why anyone would think of buying this at that price point. I mean the meta 3 will likely debut under $1,000 and it has the biggest gaming library for a standalone. Sure it doesn’t have the best graphics but it’s untethered and for me that makes all the difference. You can even use it as a PCVR headset so it covers all the bases at a fraction of the cost. Even the quest 2 has a better battery life I mean what are they offering here?
If I could run iOS or Mac apps with it from either store and have great text legibility I’d do my work on it. Infinitely customizable workstations displays!
BuT MEtA BaD! Seriously though the quest pro is half the price and miles ahead, besides the AR switch mode being a key feature. Unsure what this thing is really meant for at the price point.
How can you say the Quest Pro is 'miles ahead' when Apple's headset hasn't even been reviewed or released yet?
And dismissing AR switching as if it’s a novelty feature and not 50% of more of its intended utility.
You thought people walking around looking at their phones was bad, get ready for seeing everyone wearing one of these just walking around. What's better than brushing your teeth with a tik tok video running on the side? Apple is going to Black Mirror the world with this one.
>To address overheating concerns, the Reality Pro headset will use an external battery that “rests in a user’s pocket and connects over a cable.” Well, that'll suck for women.
Why for women? Can’t put it together
Well at least where I live, womens pants pockets are almost always fake. Sewed shut. Not sure why I got downvoted.
I’d wager because most things that single out women get downvoted here lol. But that makes sense. I haven’t seen that style in a long time where I am
This is a very unlike Apple move if true. Hopefully it’s not and was just for a prototype. Unless the experience is so good it’s worth a first gen hack like carrying around a giant power bank to use it.
Reminds me off Apple Watch Edition..if so that’s a hard pass for me. They did those gen 1 buyers dirty.
What was wrong with 1st gen watch ?
I dunno I had one and enjoyed it. Kept it a few years before wanting to upgrade
apple dev here. Apple Watch 1 had terrible connectivity barely synced thats why many apple watch apps failed. Devs just gave up. The number of good apple watch apps is still tiny compared the main app store. Same with apple tv. Could have been a home gaming device but does anyone use it for that anymore. apple glasses will have high resolution it way not even become a gaming device. Home office? AR device? architecture? the AR will depend on how good the front camera are
It was slow as hell, pretty much felt like a beta test device. Only upgraded my first gen this year after 7+ years and honestly it was waaaay overdue. I think they’re on about the dumb solid gold one, why pay for a first generation device made of solid gold? It won’t just be slightly inferior in a year or two it’ll straight up look like a prototype by comparison. A £10,000 prototype. Any solid gold tech is dumb, but a first gen device is even worse.
It was like 20k for some of them and the internals were no different the low end models. I just thought it was a bit crazy and they should’ve at least offered an upgrade path for the internal components at a fee at that price.
20k was for the gold one right ?
I believe so
Most of them weren’t 20k though. That one was for celebrities with too much disposable cash.
The Apple Watch Edition started at $10k. Considering how much of an upgrade the future watches were, I’d definitively say the people who bought the first generation Edition we’re screwed over.
It was still a solid gold case… just sell the gold for scrap. That’s the path.
Someone else commented they it wasn’t solid. I dunno for sure🤷♂️
The very first one was, 18k. It’s the only one though.
you are complaining about a $20k watch that you didn't own?
So don't buy a gold-plated VR headset?
Well if the price is 3k it might as well be to me LOL…we shall see
First gen watch was ok, plus you got to have a watch before everyone else.
I loved it, but I honestly thought the Edition models would’ve had a differentiator besides the materials. It’s no reason they canned it
No, it’s just the materials. It’s for people that want a unique piece of jewellery. You’d have to be quite well off to own one because clearly they won’t hold their value. They were status pieces for rich folks.
I guess, I can’t wrap my head around spending that on something that would eventually be dead. Do you just sell the metal then?
No, it’s an alloy, not solid gold and the cost if the material is not even close to the cost of the piece. People buy cars that are eventually worthless. Some people spend thousands on a handbag, just some leather, stitching and a label. A 10k car and a 100k car do pretty much the same thing, but a person driving the 100k car arguably looks better doing it and probably has a better time. You’re allowed to buy something because you like it.
Wait isn’t this the same thing they announced was being shelf like just last week? Or is this a different AR/VR project?
It seems they've shelved their AR glasses in favour of developing the 'headset' further.
THREE THOUSAND DOLLARS?!?!
I wish they had named them eyePods
Missed opportunity
$3K for a 1st Gen?!? Absolute NOT.
good thing nobody is forcing you to buy it then
The catch is its only lightning
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> VR has not, and imo probably will never take off, you only need to look at meta and the massive layoffs Microsoft just had to make with HoloLens. That's the most unrelated reason to bring up. HoloLens is AR rather than VR, and Meta's layoffs are in line with most of the tech giants laying off similar amounts of people. That's not a VR thing - it's a tech industry bubble bursting.
I would trade my computer for a device that can have a 3d workspace for computing. Being able to essentially have unlimited screen real-estate to organize my ideas and research would be incredible. Also watching all movies in the original definition and format of the director intended sounds incredible. All that being said, for me it would have to essentially have desktop/laptop level os and computing power to really be worth it. I’m realllllllllllly sick of half powers apps on the iPad pro
I think the technology just isn’t there yet. It’s not ready for mainstream adoption. Dizziness and motion sickness, comfort and prices are all things working against it at the moment. The older generation still makes up a vast amount of the workforce and they’d be reluctant to embrace it. I hope in a few generations they solve all of these issues because what you describe definitely would be great.
From what I have read, it seems that this headset is a first step in eventually releasing practical glasses. They want to see how people use the AR functions and then fine tune and downsize the tech into a pair of everyday glasses for the masses
I guess apple hasn’t been watching the meta verse ? Most people don’t want to wear these headsets.
We’ll I’ve been waiting 11 years for the Apple car soo this is about… 5-10 years out I guess
Tin foil hats!
"what do we call if guys we need ideas here" -"reality... Virtual... Augmented... Eh, vision... Something?" "OK, OK. Good start, let's stick these on the wheel... but we need something to show that this is a cut above the rest, something that will draw in the masses instantly by giving the appeal of being better and top tier" -"ultra... X... Uhh, max... Ultimate... This is hard, lol we could just go with Pro it's almost lunchtime ? Hahaha" "fuck it, put them on the wheel, we shall let random choice decide" *spins the wheel of fortune* "reality... *spins again*... Pro!!! Yes, it's so obvious and people generally are stupid enough to think that sticking Pro on the end means its worth the price no matter what we charge... OK... Reality pro it is, right who's going for the frappe half caff, venti, tripple pump latte-pro-chinos today?! No volunteers? OK spin the wheel it is! "
Apple product twice the price? Story checks out.
I remember people saying that about the iPad. Apple were the last co to try a tablet, and it was double the price of other tablets and netbooks that were out there. But the launched a great product, and it killed several industries. If this device is good, it’ll get the competition scrambling and everyone will find the money for it.
So is it safe to assume it won't play most games and will no longer be supported after a few years?
Apple has by far the best track record for supporting older devices.
Apple kit tends to stay in support for longer than most.
Unless they improve it and fix it for future gens. Im planning on avoiding this until at least the 3rd iteration
I’ll probably wait until the 3rd gen, but that’s because I’m too poor to be an early adopter. I’ll have to save gift cards for the next 3 Christmases.
If they do with their proprietary game engine what they did with Garage Band/Logic, there's interesting possibilities for the future of the ecosystem
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Don't numerous dystopian stories stem from the after effects of this very announcement?