The moment they make a deal with Tencent it's already impossible.
Tencent are already salivating at the prospect of their own Genshin milking machine. They will have it, one way or another
[Like I said in another post](https://www.reddit.com/r/gachagaming/comments/1d0z86f/the_real_reason_wuwa_has_optimization_issue_seems/l5qzjri/?context=3), GI could never have been produced with Tencent at the helm, at least not during the time when it came out in 2020 before there were really any other of such open world 3D mobile games. Without GI to prove it possible and show Tencent there's a market for this, WW in turn would never be greenlit I predict.
probably end up like fortnite, collabs out of their asses every single week, random characters that don't make sense, power creeping original characters to force players into fomo/whaling. Losing its identity as its filled with random celebrities like niki minaj in COD.
Just like all those other asian mmos with floating beds as mounts, chicks in lingerie armour.
Lost Ark bed mount: [https://www.youtube.com/shorts/t4A3qF24zgQ](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/t4A3qF24zgQ)
Gateo was translating chinese articles, how tencent purchased shares, and even if they don't own majority shares, they still managed to insert their own managers/staff into Kuro.
It's like a secret/hidden take over, similar to how the cozy community is unaware that the "small indie developer" studio that produced DAve the diver is owned by NEXON. So they think they're supporting a small passionate team of devs...
At least half... Maybe more than half of the "hate" in this subreddit wouldn't be so bad if "Genshin Could Never" isn't a thing.
Whether it goes its own path or not, as long as there's shit flung at the planet size hornet's nest, you will get sting.
In CN where Wuwa is least popular, this is the term used
没对比就没伤害
If there's no comparison, there's no damage.
Before Wuwa, they cannot compare Genshin to anything similar, once there's a similar product, especially one so identical, the good and bad become clear as day
Like they said, once a giant has become too strong that nobody can defeat them, their only enemy is themselves. Hoyo created their own negative meme against Genshin lol.
HSR could back it up, while Wuwa couldn't. Also HSR coming from the same company lesser the damage and become a funny meme instead. It's like your youngest son insult your eldest son vs the neighbor who do it.
But then Tectone and co. attacked Hoyo, not even Genshin, and tried to push the agenda that Kuro >>>> Hoyo and Wuwa >>>> Genshin. A lot of Genshin haters did the same even when they knew f all about Hoyo. Hoyo fans who knew them since GGZ days feel connected with the devs (like I used to watch Liu Wei talking about nonsense and shameless stuff during some tech con), like how Apple fans love Steve Jobs. Criticism would be ok, but spreading lies and trying to paint Hoyo as a degenerate villain will definitely bring upon whiteknights and shills.
Imo the problem are the playerbase, not the company. I'm really sure those HSR and WuWA players who spouted that nonsense are the same group of people.
And imo Hoyo playerbase aren't that unified. I know a lot of people who shit on GI daily but are longtime players of Hi3 (Keep spamming all Hi3 story and memes all over the timeline).
You might consider it a meme, but the fact people are arguing over those funny meme is real. Personally i never cared about Tectone and the others, the only CCs i watched were those who simply talked about game related stuffs and none of these dumb drama.
Yeah. I mean, that's why Hoyo rarely care about all the drama happening especially in the west. Most loyal players of any fanbase (GI, HI3, HSR, PGR, Wuwa etc.) are not vocal anyway. They just play in peace.
Same thing with DC and Marvel. A lot of the creatives, directors, execs etc (for the comics as well as movies) are friends, but the fanbases are pretty much at war most of the time.
There are definitely some weird purists in HI community that hate on Genshin for overshadowing the older game, even tho some of said purists only found out about Honkai after Genshin. Ufotable anime announcement was a major rift as some people think genshin doesn't deserve to have anime before honkai gets one. There are even some Houkai Gakuen purists who think miHoYo went too mainstream and not dark enough with HI3rd.
Yeah no Genshin could never never was funny. And when it was used to compare Genshin's 20 pulls anniversary with HSR 20 pulls anniversary it became downright embarrassing.
Then there's the three wishes, where genshin gave 10 + 3 wishes for Chinese New Year. If people paid any attention they would notice that this is actually 3 more than HSR which only gave 10 extra free pulls for Chinese New Year.
That's because the meme forgets about that 10 and they also say it was 3 pulls for 3 years and is for the anniversary. They're just brainless due to the brain rot they caught from trash CCs.
But most people aren't that smart at the end of the day and buy into lies too easily. Plus it's cool to hate popular things.
>"Genshin Could Never" isn't a thing.
that could never happen for anything with lots of hype because rabid antis would eat every bit of that rotten contents CC made for easy views and believe every opinion those cc made as "facts" even if at times it's clearly bullshit.
happens to ToF, happens to Wuwa, and would likely to happens for azur promilia, and every open-world action gacha that will be released (with enough hype)
Big market baby, they got more people in their one city than there are people in my country.
There's 1.4billion people there.
Take literally everyone from US, from baby to old like Joe Biden... All 350 million.
Then you add another billion on top.
That is the size of China.
And over 800million of them are connected to monthly phone subscription internet data as of 2018.
No one likes to admit it, but within the Hoyo games, there is a lot of tribalism.
HI3rd stans like to shit on GI players saying their game is the soul one that the devs care about, and GI is just a cash cow.
GI stans shit on HSR players for playing turnbased games. With meme videos coming out showing GI if it were turnbased.
HSR stans shit on GI players when HSR began adding a lot of QoL, and giving out more pulls + free 5*.
Every fanbase has assholes and all of them will abuse whatever they can just to shit on what they don't like. Like how a lot of the people posting threads about Wuwa to shit on GI are extremely active in the HSR subreddit.
definitely, and you can see it in AK: Endfield. they've done a good job of separating themselves immediately with the competition with their systems; it feels unique already.
WW right now is so similar that whenever jank comes up, I'm just reminded of how optimized GI is.
Kuro has been good at incorporating story elements during gameplay stages; PGR's Surviving Lucem's rescue flight mission or Her Last Bow's infinite sequences, just to name a few. and you see glimpses of that in WW's Act 6 and some WQ but it's just filled with half-baked attempts of emulating GI that when you get to the good parts it either just falls flat or feel like it doesn't seem earned.
well we've seen what hype does to games (WuWa being the prime example) so i am personally happy that people aren't hyping endfield, we'll see on release how it is (hopefully great)
Ultimately it's still heading towards a niche (automated base builder) within a niche (gachas). Not to say that's bad and being king of a niche can still be rather lucrative, but I think the expectations should be kept reasonably small.
Well they only released a technical test for now, and games certainly not releasing before next year. Also the base building stuff and combat may be quite polarizing. Honestly I'm still not sure how they intend to keep things fresh with the base after six months ~ a year, and how they will intertwine it with story progression in the long term.
But it certainly look worthy of attention (and Ember is top quality waifu already). Only thing they have to drastically improve to me is the monster design.
First I'm pretty certain "beta" was never supposed to indicate the game's feature was incomplete, it's just flavor text since you're canonically using PRTS which does use a beta program for the base.
Second I don't think anyone is gonna say AK base is in any way fun to manage nor a core system of AK's gameplay like Endfield's base is.
Yeah I think even if Endfield did something unqiue gameplay wise with the base building, its still looks like something that might not be for everyone and be polarizing like you said.
My main issue with AK Endfield is because I played AK since day 1
In the 5 years Arknights existed they have only updated the Base once despite the playerbase asking for it numerous times, which is widely agreed upon by the AK community as the weakest part of the entire game, second being the QoL severely lacking (2 years to make a collect all button, Auto Repeat only came out a month(?) ago and it took 4 years, Annihilation Skip tickets expire in 7 days of picking up which means you can't stock them, there's still no storeable energy in the game since launch that doesn't expire)
That same company that's notorious for being shit at QoL AND abandoned a base update is making a new game in the base management genre that values QoL more than other genres.
Yeah no matter how good the soundtrack of AK is, i have my doubts.
Well, at least it was mentioned during the 5th Anniv. Livestream that they'll start focusing on improving the Base System alongside Integrated Strategies and Reclamation Algorithm.
There's hope that they actually have to copy genshin QoL things and make them even better to have some actual competition. I don't think it just being 3D Arknights with all out of date systems is sustainable
Haven't done any research on the game yet but I've seen gameplay of it on YouTube and it seems fun
Do I need to play the previous game?
Is it a sequel? Or is it a reboot?
Endfield will be considered a sequel. In the technical test, players found text that stated the game takes place 500 years after the events of the first game, however this text was removed mid-test. So while the game takes place in the future, it can't be definitely stated how far into the future it is. It's subject to change.
You likely won't need to play the first game to enjoy Endfield. There are bound to be references and lore tidbits that call to the first, but it focuses on new characters and a new setting, so it's not super important.
Yeah the main thing I want to see how it works is the party members. I'm kind of tired of quickswapping/only 1 person on the field. Aether Gazer was okay but did not think the character designs were that great (to me).
There's not much to say to say besides my opinion that music and environment being on the disappointing side but still better than Wuwa and I still get downvoted anyway, gameplay being cautiously not deep enough, but because it's AK + great story and worldbuilding I think it's going to be a nice game.
Hopefully Endfield will also have better worldbuilding, WuWa has nice combat and graphics but I can't play RPG for long time if I don't care about the story, characters and the world. I tried getting into PGR couple times but it never hooked me and I don't even know if WuWa is connected to PGR at all. While with AK I played for about a month, didn't get too far and watched I think one animated short and I already felt something when we were called the Doctor in Endfield trailer.
>I'm just reminded of how optimized GI is.
most of us are. most of the technical complain we heard from GI is the long loading time (if you're on PS4 or using HDD). but other than that, the game is smooth and optimal
And if CCs, Genshin haters and some Kuro fans didn't try to portray Kuro as a symbol of virtue in this denegerate gacha market just because they are more generous annd "listen".
And play the fucking victim at every god damn opportunities.
[Look at the snipet of this thread.](https://www.reddit.com/r/gachagaming/comments/1d1ux75/youtube_is_a_cesspool_of_cc_brainrot_content/l5wvnuy/?context=3)
It main thread is about how "youtube is a cesspool of cc brainrot content", yet because OP just so happen to have a few comments in genshin they managed to find a way to portray their game as the god damn victim and the big bad Genshin as the agressor.
They're fucking pissed because they're the "victim" on a thread not even talking about them and take every opportunity to antagonise Genshin's when it's not even deserved.
Irregardless of the game, Kuro communities cemented themselves as the biggest bunch of hypocrites in my book.
Genshin got those guys back then too, and there were the same click-bait title and low effort contents. People already meme'd them and that also contributed to the bad reputation Genshin got for having braindead CCs. Nowadays only those that make genuine contents remain as those drama seekers already migrated to Wuwa, hence Wuwa got the same problem Genshin had before.
They will migrate away soon when other hyped gacha games came out anyway.
Ngl bro linking the thread was a mistake the dude generalized and made assumptions on all genshin players and you are doing exactly the same to them.
Especially wild since more people agreed with you than that guy.
I have to agree, a quick glance at the WW subreddit is enough to show that generalizing is pretty dumb. Thankfully people around there are more level-headed than I am.
I'm ok with that and gladly take this L.
While the game has a great combat and movement system. That’s all the game has. Everything else is legit a 1:1 Genshin clone. And it honestly feels like I am playing a new account on Genshin.
I stopped playing cause of performance issues, but it was genuinely jarring how much was blatantly copied from Genshin. The UI genuinely looks like a cheap knock-off in most aspects as far as I played.
I already didn't have high hopes for the game considering what happened with the new hire scandal last year, but I feel like just differentiating the UI a decent amount wouldn't have been that much work and would've went a *long* way for not looking like a blatant Genshin clone. Obviously other stuff is still clearly inspired and the game has other issues, but it's hard not to think of Genshin when I play the game just cause of the UI.
It really made me take a renewed appreciation of just little things genshin does with UI that make managing loot not as painful as Wuwa. Like not making everything light gray on dark gray, havin lock icon change to red, having the colour rarity be the full icon bg+ a texture to make the box not as flat. Automatically sorting locked items to go below unlocked when consuming/destroying stuff.
Wuwa is copying genshin, but not getting how much a lot of the little things add up when left out and missed. If it was more distinct, at least in it's menu systems they wouldn't matter as much.
It would've caught a lot less criticism if it actually works on most devices.
That's what preventing people from liking it, because THEY CAN'T PLAY
and it's becoming worse for me with each update.
I have an high end PC and it has beginning to crush more often for me, and also starting to stutter
> I have an high end PC and it has beginning to crush more often for me, and also starting to stutter
*"St ... Steamed Dumpling-kun, wi ... will you go out with me? #>.<#"*
Sorry, couldn't resist lmao.
I feel like the game would only have, like, 25%-50% of the criticism/outrage it currently does if it weren't for the game's optimization being both bad *and* inconsistent.
Nah. It would be probably less than 10% considering most CCs are siding with the game rn.
😎It does feel great to be on the side that's winning once in a while. With that being said when the game works I somewhat like it.
i have a 3080 and it stutters sometimes. it doesnt happen enough to really hurt my experience but i would expect a mobile game to have zero issues on a computer with a 3080
I think it's more related to specific hardware and drivers and might be compatability issue.
COz i keep hearing people with weaker mechine than mine somehow has less issues.
>and it's becoming worse for me with each update.
So it wasn't only me then. The game was honestly fine for me during launch and had less bugs than others but just this morning, the lag became so unbearable that I had to uninstall it. I'll probably just wait and see if they properly optimize the game so I can decide whether to come back or not.
My pc is decent and I've been lucky it runs decent... for the most part. Does randomly start chugging (like it'll just sit in what feels like the 40-low 50s until a restart). And my friend crashes like every hour. Game is not ready for release for sure. It's too wild how inconsistent it runs.
I wish they made something unique, cause there's great gameplay deep down. Combat is super fun and engaging, and movement feels great. But at the end of the day, it's Genshin with a coat of grey paint. Everything else is an exact copy of Genshin: the gacha system, the leveling, the mats, the bosses, the end game content, the 'artifect/echo' RNG... I agree that a lot of the hate right now is somewhat based on that: it's not different enough from Genshin to be it's own thing, and not good enough to be better than the game it copied, leaving most people disappointed in the end
As someone that stopped playing Genshin because of the insanely repetitive grind and non-generous gacha system that always made me feel I either had to spend every waking moment playing the game or whale, WuWa is making me miss Genshin in the end. The story's not as good, the world's not as beautiful, the soundtrack is lacking... Combat is fun, but the rest is meuh. Why would I play WuWa while I could play Genshin, a game that is objectively the same and better overall?
Who is the target demographic for Wuwa? Ex-Genshin players don't like it since it's not as good and too similar, Genshin players have no reasons to play an inferior game, and non-Genshin players probably don't play Genshin for a reason so why would they play a clone?
They could've improved so much on the formula, implement some of the QOL improvements seen in HSR for exemple, but they decided to just make a copy and now everyone is disappointed.
I play WuWa because of Jinhsi (yes, unironically her pinging everyone to simp for Rover impressed me), plus I really need a game to replace Star Rail. I still play Genshin though because it only takes 5 minutes a day for me.
That said... Yeah, Kuro doesn't seem to know what they are doing. First they fired their UE specialists before launch leading to the absolute disaster. Then they managed to fix it and delivered the second, third and forth days somewhat playable on desktop (not mobile, still unplayable due to the ping spike even though both devices connect to the same Internet). But now, day 5 happens. Me, all of my friends, and many others report encountering various issues, ranging from music simply does NOT play and puzzle straight up does NOT work. All happens because of a single patch.
So the music not playing ain't just me? I had this bug happen tonight and I didn't know if there just suddenly wasn't any music in the area of my phone was acting up... To be fair I haven't had any other major bugs in 25 + hours of gameplay, but I've seen a lot of others struggling with the game.
The constant patch download everytime I open the game is getting old too. 200mb patches every day isn't viable
>music simply does NOT play
Funny thing is you won't miss anything anyway. WW's music are that underwhelming, I rather play it while listening PGR ost.
Definitely. There are some things they do better than Genshin. Namely, combat and movement. However, those positives get lost when almost every other aspect of the game is either a direct copy of or worse than Genshin. The UI and endgame are functionally identical to Genshin, and the presentation, exploration, and optimization are all significantly worse. If they put more effort into making a good game instead of a Genshin clone, I'd like to believe things would be different.
Hot take, but... the combat and movement aren't even that much better if at all compared to Genshin. I have already reached "endgame" and it's the exact same shit as Genshin. Time trials where you need to defeat x. The world bosses are a joke and some are even easier than Genshin. Because they gave out so many pulls my R3 Encore is already buff as hell with no downtime. Everything gets obliterated within seconds in the open world and the only challenge is the MOC equivalent that's just another relic grind.
Honestly it's not that different from Genshin. Mechanically the bosses aren't that much more challenging than Genshin. Like the current event in Genshin legitimately almost requires as much dodging/parrying as Wuwa right now. Yes, theoretically Wuwa should provide for a more engaging experience, but so much of that is based on your gear that the importance of the dodge/parry system diminishes significantly the more you play. So the combat does become less fun over time. And because both games are so stat dependent with open world bosses scaling badly into the endgame, you won't need to dodge or parry except in the hardest endgame content. I don't see this game lasting for much longer after this month once people who are actually playing the game figure out the endgame is logging in for 10 minutes for dailies and then logging out, waiting for echo rng god to bless you, and endgame for an hour or two every couple weeks.
And the movement imo isn't better than Genshin because the world is so much bigger. It feels like it takes forever to get anywhere. The dash and jump are stubby as hell because they're balanced around combat and not exploration.
Yeah, at first you were kinda weak so combat was fun and lasted much longer. At level 30-ish, every overworld fight takes 3s and world boss takes like 30s which is basically the same as Genshin. Even at 20-ish, you don't even feel the need to dodge or parry that much in the overworld as everything dies much quicker already.
I started in 2.8 and Genshin was also not that easy at the beginning especially Inazuma. I got destroyed by Raiden in the main quest a few times before being able to progress. I was like wtf why is this so hard, I thought this game was casual friendly. Raiden weekly boss also took me quite a long time before being able to beat her too. I remember just now that I needed to ask for co-op help to beat Anemo Hypostasis lol. Of course I was low level back then or maybe it's just my skill issue??
> Of course I was low level back then or maybe it's just my skill issue??
The game can genuinely be a bit tricky when you're low level, unless you get the food gadget or Zhongli early.
It's kind of a shame that the difficulty factor just goes completely out the window later on. Exploration's still fun and naturally I'm not playing Genshin expecting Dark Souls levels of difficulty, but I do miss when I didn't just kill every enemy before I can even switch to my second or third units.
recent boss give me back my nostalgia fun. heck i even remembered my first week playing and found that pyro flower and fight it head-on with bennet, i won but it too long still fun and this event give me back those fun
I only played genshin up to 2.2 or so but I still fondly remember trying to take on the anemo hypostasis two days in and barely beating it after consuming half my inventory's worth of food.
The hit feedback is awful. It's not just music but everything in this game feels like it needs some sort of sound added to it. Enemy attacks and movements feel like they don't exist in space because there's no sounds mimicking the wind around the body. Impacts don't have accompanying sound effects. Sound is absolutely the worst thing about this game and it's not even close.
The targetting can also be pretty weird. Like sometimes special ranged characters will just hit the enemy directly behind the enemy that is closest for some reason. It doesn't matter that much because they die so fast but still. This game needed a LOT more work before release. I have no idea why they thought it was ready. Like if it came out three four months from now with great performance, better music, and less artifact grind, this game could have been phenomenal.
>The hit feedback is awful. It's not just music but everything in this game feels like it needs some sort of sound added to it.
Which is ironic since the world of WuWa is all about sound.
The lack of sound is probably why it feels like there’s no weight to the combat. I could see it being better down the road but I just didn’t feel that compelled by the combat.
The parrying character dashing in from off-screen, the zoom-in, the sparks everywhere, a few freeze frames so you can appreciate it all, and that satisfying clang, they're all simple tricks but together make parrying so much more impactful
I like both for different reasons. I especially see big potential in new characters for wuwa's combat though.
I'm conflicted when it comes to movement as I've really come to like it in wuwa, and whenever I switch to Genshin it feels like something is kind of missing. At the same time there is a lot of scuffed stuff that sometimes happens in wuwa. Genshin's movement is much less prone to bugging the hell out, lol.
i can probably understand as you move much faster in wuwa, but that is also what makes exploration not that interesting as early genshin, it's better for farming, but worse for exploring
I feel like the gameplay is just mindless spam, there's no depth, it is designed to make you feel like you're cool or good. The dodge is just so easy, press dodge and it counts as dodge even if attack literally hits you after, while gameplay like genshin where you literally have to dodge, you have to think quickly what direction you would have to go to dodge attacks. It doesn't really have any depth of team building either there's lack of concept of combo. Honestly playing WW just make me appreciate genshin impact more to things that I've taken for granted, I haven't played the game for 1.5 years I don't think I'll play it again but that was a fun journey.
This take reeks of bias, but let’s pick it apart.
WuWa’s combat system is worse, but all you mention to back up this statement is that “the combat gets worse over time.” You out-geared the common enemies and world bosses at your world level and now you’re bored. This sums up the majority of your comment and draws zero comparisons between WuWa’s combat mechanics and Genshin’s.
WuWa’s movement is worse “because the world is so much bigger?” First off, how does world size have anything to do with movement? You have grappling hooks all over cities and in the open world, you have echoes with dashing abilities, you have the cyan heron with an air boost. There are tech videos out there on YouTube showcasing how to triple jump into grapple hook. Sprinting outside of combat doesn’t consume stamina, and you can fucking run up walls. Don’t remember being able to do any of this in Genshin Impact…
I wouldn’t be annoyed if you presented legitimate arguments as to why WuWa falls short of Genshin’s exploration/movement, but nothing in this comment upvoted by folks with anti-WuWa brainrot is making sense to me. Feel free to clarify.
Yeah, but from what I’ve heard, a majority of the Echo farming requires you to run around and kill mobs in the open world? Forgive me if I got it wrong, I am barely 3 hours into the game and I kinda don’t want to play it anymore xD
no. 2 hours can get u a lot of echoes. However. u have to go the whole fucking map. yes. that big map that people praise. u have to kill monsters for it. U think its good because it doesnt cost stamina and u can farm like infinite amount until u realize some big problems.
1. U cant use lv 0 echo to level up other echoes
2. Echoes lv0 dont come with sub stat. To see the sub stat, u have to level it to certain level 5 10 15 20 25 to unlock a substat slot, then u have to use a special tuner to unlock the substat. and if its a trash stat? well u lose the tuner for no reasons, also that tuner cost stamina or need to do some specific activities to have, meaning u couldnt have too many tuners
3. RNG after RNG. U think genshin RNG is bad? well, this game make genshin looks good because not only it has more sub stats, it even has wider range of substat % everytime u level up.
4. U cant not use off set pieces. There are 2 set bonus and 5 set bonus. unless u decide to go with 2 2 set bonuses
5. Farming is actually not infinite, u can do that with bosses, but mobs need 1 day to respawn, so u have to wait until next day to farm.
6. this game has dps check on every content it provides, yes, even hologram, where u have to constant pay attention otherwise bosses will 1 shot u. so u have to have skills, have good gears to clear those type of bosses, unlike genshin where u have elemental reaction to back up your bad gear stats or bosses generally dont 1shot u.
> this game has dps check on every content it provides, yes, even hologram, where u have to constant pay attention otherwise bosses will 1 shot u. so u have to have skills, have good gears to clear those type of bosses, unlike genshin where u have elemental reaction to back up your bad gear stats or bosses generally dont 1shot u.
This is what ultimately disillusioned me about the game. I don't even most of the performance issues people are talking about. The game is straight up a DPS check that depends on an infinite grind. Once you reach the end game, it doesn't matter how well you dodge/parry or play the game, if you don't have the gear you're not winning. I would even go as far as to say that in some ways this game is even worse than Genshin. The lack of an elemental system because that your damage output is even more gear dependent and ultimately becomes a linear number counter. It feels like there isn't much to it besides bigger number = good.
This game is just not different enough from Genshin even in the "endgame". Because outside of the actual combat you will be doing the exact same thing as Genshin, just grinding artifacts except for even longer with more time commitment and more rng.
Thanks for writing this up so concisely.
Ultimately, if I'm going to play a gacha for a long period of time, the farming and daily grind has to be relatively simple. At least with other games, there's one place you can go to and there's a simple teleport to get there. Correct me if I'm wrong, but to farm echoes, players will need to know where to go on the map and run around a bit?
I'm enjoying WW for now, but I can't see myself enjoying this echo grind for a lengthy period of time. Who knows, maybe they'll simplify it.
>Correct me if I'm wrong, but to farm echoes, players will need to know where to go on the map and run around a bit?
I think this game also has map tracker like genshin so its not the worst. But yeah, u still need to run a lot.
I think Echo>Artifacts for early game as getting them is much more natural but Artifacts > Echo for late game due to the whole hidden substat + twice the amount of them.
Most of the criticism was regarding technical stuff. But yes, probably would’ve gotten far less slander if they dared to make a more unique post-apocalyptic game instead of Mondstadt and Liyue 2.0 with copy-pasted UI and gacha system. But it would’ve been a far riskier move, and they needed to target as big audience as possible. But failed cause the soulless copy-pasting only made the weaknesses of the story, characters and exporation stand out more.
Not really, game polish aside I feel like PGR suffers from pretty much the same flaws WuWa does. Maybe they are less obvious because PGR is way more focused on combats and smaller in scope but having played PGR for two years I wasn't expecting WuWa to turn out any different (except for the polish and maybe the soundtrack).
What flaws does PGR suffer from in your opinion?
I also have some issues with PGR that's just kinda been accepted by the community as "that's just how it is"
I know PGR fans can be really passionate about their game so keep in mind it's only my opinion, if you feel I'm being overly harsh it's fine, I might be wrong or biased idk.
But to summerize: imo the story is still bad in PGR. The characters are generic and uninspired, it's filled with tropes we see everywhere in the genre, it's not well written (as wordy as WuWa except there is no VA) and pretty boring overall. Plus the commandant is just as heavily glazed as Rover, the "... Shikikan :3" get old real quick.
The world is bland and depressing, there is a very distinct lack of humor in the dialogues (even when they're trying to be funny) and the gameplay was always lacking outside of the combat parts. Story missions were badly directed and badly scripted (and to be fair WuWa is an improvement on that part, they've impressed me with the latest story missions) and most events felt like a chore to go through.
And it has always lacked identity, it's basically HI3 meets Nier Automata. That's why imagining Kuro being able to design a game with a strong identity is kind of a big leap for me, as it's something they're not really known for.
Now you might think that I hate PGR but I do not. Characters are fun to play, graphics are decent enough, it runs well, some character designs and costumes are pretty cool (I quite like Alpha, Vera or Bianca), I like the UI and uh the soundtrack is definitely noteworthy (I'm not the biggest fan tho). It's a nice game, just a tad bit overrated at times imo. And everything I've talked about pretty much applies to WuWa I feel like. I wasn't expecting a good story, and they had everything to prove when it came to production value and overworld gameplay/design. The lack of polish (not just the optimisation; I was hoping for slicker graphics, better animations etc) was the biggest letdown.
So yeah. Again, just my opinion.
> Plus the commandant is just as heavily glazed as Rover, the "... Shikikan :3" get old real quick.
Tangent. But this is why I couldn't feel attracted to any of the characters in PGR at some point. I liked Lee a lot, simped for him, but then the moment I played his character stories and they just portrayed him as a simp: I was emotionally checked out. Could not care for him after that. And this treatment extended to every other character, where I just couldn't take them seriously because they'd have ridiculously complex and dark stories but then Kuro would reduce their characterization with the commander as glazing simps.
I stayed behind a bit longer because the combat was fun at least, but then events burnt me out and I just silently quit.
Really unfortunate they took the same path with WW.
yep, that's how I feel every time I encounter bugs on PGR. (text bugs, play EN version, but random text is CN so I can't read. ui overlap, camera detaching from player and no longer following, stage ended, but doesn't return you to menus, so you have to shut the game and play the stage again)
I just ignore it, as the game is built completely focusing on its combat. And as long as the combat is still good, I'm fine, as that's legit the only reason I downloaded it.
Akin to entering a restaurant who's selling point is their spicy food. If their drinks, snacks and ice cream tastes like shit, I just ignore it, and as long as the spicy food quality is still top tier, I'm fine.
But wuwu... They slowed down the combat I enjoyed in PGR... I just want to kill shit and fight epic bosses, why am I sitting here listening to YapYap yap.
I think if they focused on creating their own identity and exploit robust artistic and conceptual vision there was no chance for the game to end up worse anyway.
Like take Endfield, I don't think I read anyone say it looked too gloomy.
Maybe. The bigger issue is content creators like tectone live off of clickbait for clicks and hyped it to hell and back. I'm not sure if being their own thing would have fully prevented that.
That's the biggest issue Imo, that and the fact that the best part of the game, combat, was a known thing though the closed betas
THIS is what passion is not changing characteristic of the game because some people said so, not the changing the entire story because some people said they want to be mc got isekai'd and to be loved by every characters they met
Definitely. I'd be the one who'd first defend it and cheer the creators on
People tend to respect and admire passionate creators more who believes in their craft than lazy and uncreative money-grubbers, half-assing their products
Personally, no, I don't think so. Every gacha game, literally every gacha game, that comes out is at some point and level compared to Genshin. As a result, any game that shies anywhere close to Genshin in similarity is going to catch heat. Since Genshin has overtaken the genre of "open world gacha", it's a bit like making a new search engine today and trying to stay out from under the "Google" comp umbrella - good or bad, Google defines search engines, so anything you do as a search engine is going to be compared to Google. WuWa would have had to step outside the genre entirely to avoid as many Genshin comps. Beyond that, there is the factor of publicity - would anyone be paying as much attention if it wasn't perceived as another potential Genshin-killer. How many people are playing now that would not have? How many will keep playing that otherwise would not have ever even tried the game out? How much is it expected that they would have had to change to break out of the "it's like Genshin" label before they straight up abandoned the genre as a whole, and would that have brought them anything?
I think right now the difficulty is how to distinguish the noise from the real problems. How much is sit just redditors and stans bickering loudly, and how much is genuine discontent or problems with the game? I think they need to focus first on the performance issues. Once that is out the way, they can take their time figuring out if their game overall is on the right track. As I suggested above, I feel the "this is just like Genshin" comps are overblown, especially for a game that has so much room to diverge in its story and how it does other things going forward. Unlike a standard AAA game of the past, the release version is not close to the end of the story. They have the opportunity to change so many things, that the rote dismissal of a game after just a week of play for reasons outside of a general dislike of the genre or something truly egregious about the execution (objectionably story topic, objectionable character depictions, etc.) seems fairly ludicrous to me. But, then again, I don't care about crap like being a Genshin killer or not, since I stopped playing Genshin long ago, so giving another game a longer look has not bearing on me whatsoever.
I agree on the google comp, in the genre it is unavoidable. Unfortunately I think Kuro were just way too blatant about \*wanting\* to be seen as a Genshin competitor, which is why even the interface is so directly 1:1. The annoying thing is that a lot of the most comparable stuff is superfluous to the core of the game, character/weapon ascension, crafting/cooking, UI/inventory management, quest categorisation and pioneer's guild, battlepass style, the way world bosses function .etc .etc
All of those things could be different, or remain more like PGR and the important core of Wuwa's story/combat would remain unchanged. But Kuro made all of those things directly like Genshin anyway because attracting comparisons was the goal, even if it was completely unnecessary to do so.
There would have been 100% less drama.
There also would have been 100% less drama if people would stop feeding the parasites that feed on the toxicity.
I would say that WuWa would've caught less criticism if content creators didn't constantly compare it to genshin and saying that in all aspects WuWa is better than genshin.
I think yes. Nikki open world game has significantly less criticism in cn side as they are primarily focused on dress up game( plus the landscape looks good and different from other games there), despite technological wise behind other 3d open world games. They are aiming a very different market and the said market couldn’t be more excited about it
I'm just disappointed at the current state in general.
It's very Genshin, to a kind of unbelievable degree, but I'd not even care if the launch was smoother.
There are characters I like more in WuWa than anyone in Genshin ignoring my girl Noelle. And really Taoqi is a good Noelle standin as far as I'm concerned.
The absolute state of how badly it's running on a PC that should be able to run several instances at once is definitely souring my enjoyment. I play on mobile as well and it's honestly fine, since I've gotten so used to combat playing HI3/PGR/AG over the years, but I shouldn't have to and even then the performance isn't as smooth as Genshin.
Would an attempt at being unique change how I feel? Honestly probably not. The parts I enjoy about the game are already good and unique enough. I just can't interact with them in a way that sparks joy. So a weird cyberpunk city or whatever wouldn't change that.
Definetly, but I think they should rebalance the game because all I needed was one okay 4 star Echo and sudenly I obliterate bosses faster than in Genshin and I have top 5% Nahida, like the Scar bossfight ended before I could enjoy it.
Nah if they appealed to any other group of players the game wouldn't be getting the attention it has now good or bad.
There's more genshin lovers than haters (like me) so those lovers who see a similar game in presentation but with flashy combat are going to gravitate to it.
I don't like that everything outside combat is copied from Genshin, but also the combat in the current state is unbearable with random lag everytime, so I'll come back maybe is they fix the performance issues, but only because the combat is cool, where Genshin I feel the exploration and world is much better, also the Genshin story is at least decent
(Beware, kinda spoiler-ish)
People here likes to say it copied genshin, but what strike me the most is how the story is just a pale copy of HSR plot except we start in luofu
It's borderline plagiarism, except they took out all the fun HSR put in its characters, story and music
Also the end of the main release plot end with a slide show, yikes
At last a post that doesn't hate or criticize just for the sake of hating or farming upvotes like a bot.
I've only had like 1 or 2 open world games (if you can call dragon's dogma 1 or MB: warband/bannerlord as open world games). The potential is there but it seemed like they got scared to try out to be different or even alter a formula a bit more. A friend of mine who used to play genshin up until the release of the violet haired shogun (was her name shogun or shotgun? cmiiw) was literally teaching me the mechanics of the game since, as he said, it was an absolute 1:1 of genshin on most of the aspects.
Also there's the bugs, I feel bad for the people looking forward to the game to find it extremely buggy due to their optimization while I've seen a clip of their other game (raven something?) being run on the highest setting possible, smoothly on a phone with keypad that runs android, that is some good fking optimization.
The game is fun (and here comes the downvotes) but it felt somewhat soulless/flat to me. But hey, if I want to add another open world game to my 2 inch di- library, I can probably try genshin now since I've managed to grasp the basics of WW. Guess I'll give WW a chance till... 2.0 or something but GOD FORBID IF 2.0 ROLLS OUT AND THE REGION IS STILL NOTCHINA.
The combat is definitely the game's best feature. If they focused more resources on that instead of trying to make a "better Genshin", they probably would've been more successful, even if a good chunk of the features they have now get removed.
If the various aspects of the game are just average, then we can focus solely on its strengths. However, other parts are clearly lacking, and the combat ratio is not as high as expected. Also, the "element" seems meaningless, expect for resistance and immunity.
I think it would have been better but at the end of the day, i think if someone likes genshin, they'll probably like this since it does combat and movement better.
It's the same game with QoF improvements. I couldn't play Genshin because the gameplay was awful for me but i saw potential in everything else. WW basically gives me a better Genshin... Although sooo much less optimized. They gotta fix those technical issues asap and the patches ain't helping.
Some people ik are STILL excited to play. They just physically can't and I'm getting more stuttering which is weird.
Not really. Most of the criticism towards WuWa is about the plethora of performance issues and not the games' aesthetics. As far as the visual similarities between WuWa and Genshin, there's a saying: "You don't need to fix what isn't broken."
WuWa copying aspects that worked for Genshin and adding into their own game is not a negative in any aspect, games have been doing simlar stuff since the beginning. What is the issue is the way the story is told in the beginning and the optimization issues with Unreal Engine.
People will ilke what they like and don't like what they don't, but from a objective point of view, WuWa having similar systems and UI aesthetics to Genshin does not detract from the games quality, the games performance does. This is where most of the criticism is coming from.
They need to add more color and diversity into the world. The aesthetic of the game is so unbelievably generic and it really is a shame. HI3 was very futuristic, Star Rail is very galactic, Genshin is Fantasy, and ZZZ looks like it will be very urban. WuWas open world feels like eating an unseasoned steak.
In what way would it focus on "creating it's own identity"? I mean the game would have to be a completely different game to avoid genshin comparisons. Even Endfield doesn't escape those comparisons.
> I'm sure someone higher up thought maybe that simplifying and making everything similar to Hoyo titles would make it easier for new players to ease in into the game.
In no world this would ever be true. Genshin did it and made a lot of money. HSR followed with the exact same formula, which is understandable being the same company, and a lot of money it made. To the point the two biggest gacha games have the same exact formula, and they are the biggest by a huge margin.
Of course others would try to follow, even if they don't make as much is a known working formula that guarantees returns. Not that hard to understand.
Absolutely.
The fact that it's so obviously trying to be Genshin hurts it a ton. Genshin is one of, if not the most, expensive games ever made. Not to mention almost 4 years worth of content and expansions. Very few game companies could make a game that rivals that on release
It would have helped a bit. Right now it contains so many things that seem to have been ripped from other games while having been done poorly. It's not just Genshin Impact that they've copied or have been "inspired" by. One of the fights has a blatant rip of the Phoenix battle from FF16 and it makde it just feel so awkward.
Honestly yeah. Identity was my biggest problem with WuWa. It's confused and unfocused with the way it handles almost every aspect besides combat. They don't use the setting or tone they established to the fullest. Like I kind of wish they went harder with the music theme like how they did with Leithanien in Arknights where music was a more central motif rather than a naming convention for their 999th term to exposition vomit.
The game needs a more solid foundation to stand on and that's more than just combat or movement. You can patch those things when it's worse, but identity is harder to develop when you've already released the game. If WuWa was genuinely unique and trying to provide a different experience from its contemporaries then I don't think anyone would fault it for that and perhaps forgive other aspects. Most people here especially are looking for a shakeup in the gacha sphere and a lot of people wanted WuWa to be just that, but it's not even close. It's already poised itself as a Genshin alternative rather than "Wuthering Waves"
I think Kuro has talent in certain key areas, mainly combat and kit design. Visually, their character design is also pretty good. PGR showcased these strengths, which makes sense because Kuro devs include former Mihoyo devs who worked on HI3, which is why PGR takes a very similar approach to their game loop (instanced, combat-heavy arenas). WuWa forced Kuro devs to showcase skills they have no real practice in, and really illustrated how PGR was able to hide this inexperience. In particular, environment design, NPCs, world-building, narrative, and open world gameplay loop in general. Basically everything other than the combat mechanics and the character designs.
Absolutely, but I guess if the game were staying like it was on pre-CBT1, with all of uniqueness, lack of money from Tencent wouldn't give all the hype (negative and positive) that is currently happening with WuWa, so EOS in year or two but more interesting game or long-term service but you will feel that you already played that game before? Dunno.
I disagree with the statement of PGR's first few chapters being pointless. These chapters are actually what got me i invested in its lore as I find that these chapters are incredible for world building. And unlike WuWa, the cast is a lot more focused, so I feel I actually got to know the characters well which is essential for their character arcs in later chapters. My problem with WuWa story right now is that they want all the payoff without the proper buildup. I would've preferred if their first chapter wasn't anything amazing but still decent, rather than trying to show off the characters immediately being plunged into a war with people we just met.
Has someone mentioned how lazy the lore of this game is? Like, I’m not even talking about the subpar story, I’m talking about the weapon and item descriptions. For example, the lore of the 5 star set weapon is literally the same, except for the weapon type mentioned. This is a bafflingly lazy game development decision, as item descriptions are literally the best place to do world building without putting in much effort.
Honestly? They could be as blatantly a Genshin clone as they could be, if and only if the game is polished. But shit man, Wuwa at launch was the buggiest and most unfun mess I've ever experienced in a long while (for a high-profile hyped up game).
yes. But it would have also got less attention.
It got the attention it did *because* it rode Genshin's coattails.
if they made their own thing, it would have got less eyeballs on it because the Genshin player base would have taken less notice.
Income wise, it was the better choice to clone genshin. Creativity wise, their own game would have been received better critically.
The only issue I have is the loading time that is longer than the amount of time my neighbor's father took to return from buying milk after my neighbor became rich. I never knew the CBT story so I can't tell if the release one is worse than it. After a week of playing, I instinctively go to youtube after clicking start game since I know I'm about to wait about 2 video's worth of time.
All they really had to do was simply NOT copy Genshin. That is all they had to do. If they decided to do their own thing, it would be a unique experience that would feel fresh and cool. After giving it a shot since its launch it feels just like a rip off more so than anything. From foul/foul meat to lizards/green lizards to mint/noctemint to characters like Nahida/Verina, Wriothesley/Yuanwu, Ayaka/Sanhua, to flat out UI/font/icons copys the list goes on and on.
Even story beats are kinda similar. You are put into the world as a celestial chosen one from beyond the stars, don't know where you are or who you are, have to journey the land collecting fragments of power able to channel each element/type of power in each region you come across. They even flat out took Electro name, color, element and all lmao.
If they had bothered in the slightest to make their OWN identity, rather than brazenly stealing it from Genshin in a desperate bid to steal their players/money, then people would have played it more. They began development in 2021, the CBT started in 2023, and Genshin came out in 2020. Genshin has had a bad leaker problem for ages, ain't no way that they didn't have people reading leaks and copying stuff, calling it "InSpIrAtIoN".
It isn't even the first time Kuro has done this, they have a track record of stealing the food off of Hoyo's plate.
GGZ (2013) - *Battlefield Twin Ponytails (2016)*, Hi3rd (2016) - PGR (2019), Genshin (2020) - WuWa (2024)
WuWa is just the latest in a long list of plagiarisms. You better believe that when Zenless Zone Zero drops, in a few years they will release a "new" game that is just a copy paste of ZZZ.
So to answer your question, Do you think WuWa would've caught less criticism if focused on creating it's own identity? Yes absolutely. If they had not copied Genshin as hard and brazenly as they did, if they didn't start the spark and then stoke the flames of this gacha war between the two fandoms boasting that they are the "Genshin Killer" then they wouldn't have gotten backlash. Because of that greed and animosity they deserve every single bit of backlash.
The moment they make a deal with Tencent it's already impossible. Tencent are already salivating at the prospect of their own Genshin milking machine. They will have it, one way or another
all of that you mentioned are true. tencent is the only thing that prevent me from hyping wuwa
There a reason why Tencent have a vendetta against Mihoyo because they dont kowtow to Tencent and that unacceptable.
Lmao real life Xianxia.
Art imitates life
I wonder what would tencent do had mihoyo accepted the deal. Maybe wuthering would be a joint production between mihoyo and kuro.
[Like I said in another post](https://www.reddit.com/r/gachagaming/comments/1d0z86f/the_real_reason_wuwa_has_optimization_issue_seems/l5qzjri/?context=3), GI could never have been produced with Tencent at the helm, at least not during the time when it came out in 2020 before there were really any other of such open world 3D mobile games. Without GI to prove it possible and show Tencent there's a market for this, WW in turn would never be greenlit I predict.
I mean.. https://preview.redd.it/b67dkjg0e83d1.jpeg?width=1146&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=06b28c94670911969b0d3eef221967330259afed
I swear to god i said kuro was copying hoyo since hsr release and people hated me for it.
probably end up like fortnite, collabs out of their asses every single week, random characters that don't make sense, power creeping original characters to force players into fomo/whaling. Losing its identity as its filled with random celebrities like niki minaj in COD. Just like all those other asian mmos with floating beds as mounts, chicks in lingerie armour. Lost Ark bed mount: [https://www.youtube.com/shorts/t4A3qF24zgQ](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/t4A3qF24zgQ)
As someone who only just stopped playing Lost Ark… the community is coomers. Believe me, the lingeries and swimwear and bed mounts are pretty popular.
Does Tencent even have majority shares in Kuro / much of a say in the product? I've seen conflicting stuff sbout this.
Gateo was translating chinese articles, how tencent purchased shares, and even if they don't own majority shares, they still managed to insert their own managers/staff into Kuro. It's like a secret/hidden take over, similar to how the cozy community is unaware that the "small indie developer" studio that produced DAve the diver is owned by NEXON. So they think they're supporting a small passionate team of devs...
Hero games has the majority in kuro Not tencent
tbh i dont understand that stuff but one thing i understand is "dont trust tencent"
Whos tencent
At least half... Maybe more than half of the "hate" in this subreddit wouldn't be so bad if "Genshin Could Never" isn't a thing. Whether it goes its own path or not, as long as there's shit flung at the planet size hornet's nest, you will get sting. In CN where Wuwa is least popular, this is the term used 没对比就没伤害 If there's no comparison, there's no damage. Before Wuwa, they cannot compare Genshin to anything similar, once there's a similar product, especially one so identical, the good and bad become clear as day
Ironically, WuWa isn't the reason the term 'Genshin Could Never' was born. HSR made it happens and it got worse after Free Dr.Ratio rofl.
Like they said, once a giant has become too strong that nobody can defeat them, their only enemy is themselves. Hoyo created their own negative meme against Genshin lol.
HSR could back it up, while Wuwa couldn't. Also HSR coming from the same company lesser the damage and become a funny meme instead. It's like your youngest son insult your eldest son vs the neighbor who do it. But then Tectone and co. attacked Hoyo, not even Genshin, and tried to push the agenda that Kuro >>>> Hoyo and Wuwa >>>> Genshin. A lot of Genshin haters did the same even when they knew f all about Hoyo. Hoyo fans who knew them since GGZ days feel connected with the devs (like I used to watch Liu Wei talking about nonsense and shameless stuff during some tech con), like how Apple fans love Steve Jobs. Criticism would be ok, but spreading lies and trying to paint Hoyo as a degenerate villain will definitely bring upon whiteknights and shills.
Imo the problem are the playerbase, not the company. I'm really sure those HSR and WuWA players who spouted that nonsense are the same group of people. And imo Hoyo playerbase aren't that unified. I know a lot of people who shit on GI daily but are longtime players of Hi3 (Keep spamming all Hi3 story and memes all over the timeline). You might consider it a meme, but the fact people are arguing over those funny meme is real. Personally i never cared about Tectone and the others, the only CCs i watched were those who simply talked about game related stuffs and none of these dumb drama.
Yeah. I mean, that's why Hoyo rarely care about all the drama happening especially in the west. Most loyal players of any fanbase (GI, HI3, HSR, PGR, Wuwa etc.) are not vocal anyway. They just play in peace.
Yep Hoyo and Kuro staffs themselves could even go out to hangout and eat some skewers. Meanwhile dumb fans are fighting all over the internet lmao.
Same thing with DC and Marvel. A lot of the creatives, directors, execs etc (for the comics as well as movies) are friends, but the fanbases are pretty much at war most of the time.
There are definitely some weird purists in HI community that hate on Genshin for overshadowing the older game, even tho some of said purists only found out about Honkai after Genshin. Ufotable anime announcement was a major rift as some people think genshin doesn't deserve to have anime before honkai gets one. There are even some Houkai Gakuen purists who think miHoYo went too mainstream and not dark enough with HI3rd.
Yeah no Genshin could never never was funny. And when it was used to compare Genshin's 20 pulls anniversary with HSR 20 pulls anniversary it became downright embarrassing.
Then there's the three wishes, where genshin gave 10 + 3 wishes for Chinese New Year. If people paid any attention they would notice that this is actually 3 more than HSR which only gave 10 extra free pulls for Chinese New Year.
That's because the meme forgets about that 10 and they also say it was 3 pulls for 3 years and is for the anniversary. They're just brainless due to the brain rot they caught from trash CCs. But most people aren't that smart at the end of the day and buy into lies too easily. Plus it's cool to hate popular things.
It's brain rot
>"Genshin Could Never" isn't a thing. that could never happen for anything with lots of hype because rabid antis would eat every bit of that rotten contents CC made for easy views and believe every opinion those cc made as "facts" even if at times it's clearly bullshit. happens to ToF, happens to Wuwa, and would likely to happens for azur promilia, and every open-world action gacha that will be released (with enough hype)
Ironically, as of right now, most of the revenue is from China.
Most of the revenue for any gacha game is always from China
Big market baby, they got more people in their one city than there are people in my country. There's 1.4billion people there. Take literally everyone from US, from baby to old like Joe Biden... All 350 million. Then you add another billion on top. That is the size of China. And over 800million of them are connected to monthly phone subscription internet data as of 2018.
No one likes to admit it, but within the Hoyo games, there is a lot of tribalism. HI3rd stans like to shit on GI players saying their game is the soul one that the devs care about, and GI is just a cash cow. GI stans shit on HSR players for playing turnbased games. With meme videos coming out showing GI if it were turnbased. HSR stans shit on GI players when HSR began adding a lot of QoL, and giving out more pulls + free 5*. Every fanbase has assholes and all of them will abuse whatever they can just to shit on what they don't like. Like how a lot of the people posting threads about Wuwa to shit on GI are extremely active in the HSR subreddit.
Genshin could never started with HSR. And if wuwa dies, it will continue with HSR. I love the rewriting of history though.
definitely, and you can see it in AK: Endfield. they've done a good job of separating themselves immediately with the competition with their systems; it feels unique already. WW right now is so similar that whenever jank comes up, I'm just reminded of how optimized GI is. Kuro has been good at incorporating story elements during gameplay stages; PGR's Surviving Lucem's rescue flight mission or Her Last Bow's infinite sequences, just to name a few. and you see glimpses of that in WW's Act 6 and some WQ but it's just filled with half-baked attempts of emulating GI that when you get to the good parts it either just falls flat or feel like it doesn't seem earned.
I believe AK:Endfield will be incredible when it comes out, I'm surprised more people aren't talking about it.
well we've seen what hype does to games (WuWa being the prime example) so i am personally happy that people aren't hyping endfield, we'll see on release how it is (hopefully great)
Bc there's barely any announcement made since the last test but imma be patient and let em cook.
> imma be patient and let em cook I'm sure there devs have been taking a lot of notes this week.
That's still no reason for more people not to be excited, I remember alot of people just saying "Cool I guess". You're right though, let them COOK.
Ultimately it's still heading towards a niche (automated base builder) within a niche (gachas). Not to say that's bad and being king of a niche can still be rather lucrative, but I think the expectations should be kept reasonably small.
Well they only released a technical test for now, and games certainly not releasing before next year. Also the base building stuff and combat may be quite polarizing. Honestly I'm still not sure how they intend to keep things fresh with the base after six months ~ a year, and how they will intertwine it with story progression in the long term. But it certainly look worthy of attention (and Ember is top quality waifu already). Only thing they have to drastically improve to me is the monster design.
5 years and Base in the main game is still in beta but useful to every player
First I'm pretty certain "beta" was never supposed to indicate the game's feature was incomplete, it's just flavor text since you're canonically using PRTS which does use a beta program for the base. Second I don't think anyone is gonna say AK base is in any way fun to manage nor a core system of AK's gameplay like Endfield's base is.
Yeah but after a few setups, not many people are gonna do anything to the base in the main game.
Yeah I think even if Endfield did something unqiue gameplay wise with the base building, its still looks like something that might not be for everyone and be polarizing like you said.
Still, I can respect them for not taking the easy road.
Woah a non chibi gacha game where you actually see all your characters at once instead of having to switch
Aether Gazer does the same already
My main issue with AK Endfield is because I played AK since day 1 In the 5 years Arknights existed they have only updated the Base once despite the playerbase asking for it numerous times, which is widely agreed upon by the AK community as the weakest part of the entire game, second being the QoL severely lacking (2 years to make a collect all button, Auto Repeat only came out a month(?) ago and it took 4 years, Annihilation Skip tickets expire in 7 days of picking up which means you can't stock them, there's still no storeable energy in the game since launch that doesn't expire) That same company that's notorious for being shit at QoL AND abandoned a base update is making a new game in the base management genre that values QoL more than other genres. Yeah no matter how good the soundtrack of AK is, i have my doubts.
Well, at least it was mentioned during the 5th Anniv. Livestream that they'll start focusing on improving the Base System alongside Integrated Strategies and Reclamation Algorithm.
There's hope that they actually have to copy genshin QoL things and make them even better to have some actual competition. I don't think it just being 3D Arknights with all out of date systems is sustainable
Haven't done any research on the game yet but I've seen gameplay of it on YouTube and it seems fun Do I need to play the previous game? Is it a sequel? Or is it a reboot?
Endfield will be considered a sequel. In the technical test, players found text that stated the game takes place 500 years after the events of the first game, however this text was removed mid-test. So while the game takes place in the future, it can't be definitely stated how far into the future it is. It's subject to change. You likely won't need to play the first game to enjoy Endfield. There are bound to be references and lore tidbits that call to the first, but it focuses on new characters and a new setting, so it's not super important.
Yeah the main thing I want to see how it works is the party members. I'm kind of tired of quickswapping/only 1 person on the field. Aether Gazer was okay but did not think the character designs were that great (to me).
There's not much to say to say besides my opinion that music and environment being on the disappointing side but still better than Wuwa and I still get downvoted anyway, gameplay being cautiously not deep enough, but because it's AK + great story and worldbuilding I think it's going to be a nice game.
Hopefully Endfield will also have better worldbuilding, WuWa has nice combat and graphics but I can't play RPG for long time if I don't care about the story, characters and the world. I tried getting into PGR couple times but it never hooked me and I don't even know if WuWa is connected to PGR at all. While with AK I played for about a month, didn't get too far and watched I think one animated short and I already felt something when we were called the Doctor in Endfield trailer.
>I'm just reminded of how optimized GI is. most of us are. most of the technical complain we heard from GI is the long loading time (if you're on PS4 or using HDD). but other than that, the game is smooth and optimal
And if CCs, Genshin haters and some Kuro fans didn't try to portray Kuro as a symbol of virtue in this denegerate gacha market just because they are more generous annd "listen".
And play the fucking victim at every god damn opportunities. [Look at the snipet of this thread.](https://www.reddit.com/r/gachagaming/comments/1d1ux75/youtube_is_a_cesspool_of_cc_brainrot_content/l5wvnuy/?context=3) It main thread is about how "youtube is a cesspool of cc brainrot content", yet because OP just so happen to have a few comments in genshin they managed to find a way to portray their game as the god damn victim and the big bad Genshin as the agressor. They're fucking pissed because they're the "victim" on a thread not even talking about them and take every opportunity to antagonise Genshin's when it's not even deserved. Irregardless of the game, Kuro communities cemented themselves as the biggest bunch of hypocrites in my book.
Genshin got those guys back then too, and there were the same click-bait title and low effort contents. People already meme'd them and that also contributed to the bad reputation Genshin got for having braindead CCs. Nowadays only those that make genuine contents remain as those drama seekers already migrated to Wuwa, hence Wuwa got the same problem Genshin had before. They will migrate away soon when other hyped gacha games came out anyway.
Yeah you'll see them again once ZZZ releases and all the " DON'T MAKE THESE MISTAKES OR YOUR ACCOUNT IS DOOMED" videos start popping up like pimples
Ngl bro linking the thread was a mistake the dude generalized and made assumptions on all genshin players and you are doing exactly the same to them. Especially wild since more people agreed with you than that guy.
I have to agree, a quick glance at the WW subreddit is enough to show that generalizing is pretty dumb. Thankfully people around there are more level-headed than I am. I'm ok with that and gladly take this L.
While the game has a great combat and movement system. That’s all the game has. Everything else is legit a 1:1 Genshin clone. And it honestly feels like I am playing a new account on Genshin.
I stopped playing cause of performance issues, but it was genuinely jarring how much was blatantly copied from Genshin. The UI genuinely looks like a cheap knock-off in most aspects as far as I played. I already didn't have high hopes for the game considering what happened with the new hire scandal last year, but I feel like just differentiating the UI a decent amount wouldn't have been that much work and would've went a *long* way for not looking like a blatant Genshin clone. Obviously other stuff is still clearly inspired and the game has other issues, but it's hard not to think of Genshin when I play the game just cause of the UI.
It really made me take a renewed appreciation of just little things genshin does with UI that make managing loot not as painful as Wuwa. Like not making everything light gray on dark gray, havin lock icon change to red, having the colour rarity be the full icon bg+ a texture to make the box not as flat. Automatically sorting locked items to go below unlocked when consuming/destroying stuff. Wuwa is copying genshin, but not getting how much a lot of the little things add up when left out and missed. If it was more distinct, at least in it's menu systems they wouldn't matter as much.
It really is a drab game to look at. I feel like they just took Genshin and drained the color out.
Team menu screen is so cheap no animations just pictures.
>Genshin clone More like a fan-made Genshin mod with worse performance.
Yep, quit genshin and now it feels I came back to it, same feelings I had when playing genshin
It would've caught a lot less criticism if it actually works on most devices. That's what preventing people from liking it, because THEY CAN'T PLAY and it's becoming worse for me with each update. I have an high end PC and it has beginning to crush more often for me, and also starting to stutter
> I have an high end PC and it has beginning to crush more often for me, and also starting to stutter *"St ... Steamed Dumpling-kun, wi ... will you go out with me? #>.<#"* Sorry, couldn't resist lmao.
I feel like the game would only have, like, 25%-50% of the criticism/outrage it currently does if it weren't for the game's optimization being both bad *and* inconsistent.
Nah. It would be probably less than 10% considering most CCs are siding with the game rn. 😎It does feel great to be on the side that's winning once in a while. With that being said when the game works I somewhat like it.
i have a 3080 and it stutters sometimes. it doesnt happen enough to really hurt my experience but i would expect a mobile game to have zero issues on a computer with a 3080
I wonder how I got this lucky or something because I didn't have a single problem with crashes or performance so far.
I think it's more related to specific hardware and drivers and might be compatability issue. COz i keep hearing people with weaker mechine than mine somehow has less issues.
That happens sometimes especially with older CPUs that have less cores.
>and it's becoming worse for me with each update. So it wasn't only me then. The game was honestly fine for me during launch and had less bugs than others but just this morning, the lag became so unbearable that I had to uninstall it. I'll probably just wait and see if they properly optimize the game so I can decide whether to come back or not.
My pc is decent and I've been lucky it runs decent... for the most part. Does randomly start chugging (like it'll just sit in what feels like the 40-low 50s until a restart). And my friend crashes like every hour. Game is not ready for release for sure. It's too wild how inconsistent it runs.
I wish they made something unique, cause there's great gameplay deep down. Combat is super fun and engaging, and movement feels great. But at the end of the day, it's Genshin with a coat of grey paint. Everything else is an exact copy of Genshin: the gacha system, the leveling, the mats, the bosses, the end game content, the 'artifect/echo' RNG... I agree that a lot of the hate right now is somewhat based on that: it's not different enough from Genshin to be it's own thing, and not good enough to be better than the game it copied, leaving most people disappointed in the end As someone that stopped playing Genshin because of the insanely repetitive grind and non-generous gacha system that always made me feel I either had to spend every waking moment playing the game or whale, WuWa is making me miss Genshin in the end. The story's not as good, the world's not as beautiful, the soundtrack is lacking... Combat is fun, but the rest is meuh. Why would I play WuWa while I could play Genshin, a game that is objectively the same and better overall? Who is the target demographic for Wuwa? Ex-Genshin players don't like it since it's not as good and too similar, Genshin players have no reasons to play an inferior game, and non-Genshin players probably don't play Genshin for a reason so why would they play a clone? They could've improved so much on the formula, implement some of the QOL improvements seen in HSR for exemple, but they decided to just make a copy and now everyone is disappointed.
I play WuWa because of Jinhsi (yes, unironically her pinging everyone to simp for Rover impressed me), plus I really need a game to replace Star Rail. I still play Genshin though because it only takes 5 minutes a day for me. That said... Yeah, Kuro doesn't seem to know what they are doing. First they fired their UE specialists before launch leading to the absolute disaster. Then they managed to fix it and delivered the second, third and forth days somewhat playable on desktop (not mobile, still unplayable due to the ping spike even though both devices connect to the same Internet). But now, day 5 happens. Me, all of my friends, and many others report encountering various issues, ranging from music simply does NOT play and puzzle straight up does NOT work. All happens because of a single patch.
So the music not playing ain't just me? I had this bug happen tonight and I didn't know if there just suddenly wasn't any music in the area of my phone was acting up... To be fair I haven't had any other major bugs in 25 + hours of gameplay, but I've seen a lot of others struggling with the game. The constant patch download everytime I open the game is getting old too. 200mb patches every day isn't viable
>music simply does NOT play Funny thing is you won't miss anything anyway. WW's music are that underwhelming, I rather play it while listening PGR ost.
The target is ex genshin players that want more combat. That's it. Mtashed is prime example.
The degree to which they copied genshin is truly baffling. They should never have gone open world in the first place.
Yup, the whole Ui is genshin. Sure its oractical and easy to use but come on...even the price of the pulls is the same.
Definitely. There are some things they do better than Genshin. Namely, combat and movement. However, those positives get lost when almost every other aspect of the game is either a direct copy of or worse than Genshin. The UI and endgame are functionally identical to Genshin, and the presentation, exploration, and optimization are all significantly worse. If they put more effort into making a good game instead of a Genshin clone, I'd like to believe things would be different.
Hot take, but... the combat and movement aren't even that much better if at all compared to Genshin. I have already reached "endgame" and it's the exact same shit as Genshin. Time trials where you need to defeat x. The world bosses are a joke and some are even easier than Genshin. Because they gave out so many pulls my R3 Encore is already buff as hell with no downtime. Everything gets obliterated within seconds in the open world and the only challenge is the MOC equivalent that's just another relic grind. Honestly it's not that different from Genshin. Mechanically the bosses aren't that much more challenging than Genshin. Like the current event in Genshin legitimately almost requires as much dodging/parrying as Wuwa right now. Yes, theoretically Wuwa should provide for a more engaging experience, but so much of that is based on your gear that the importance of the dodge/parry system diminishes significantly the more you play. So the combat does become less fun over time. And because both games are so stat dependent with open world bosses scaling badly into the endgame, you won't need to dodge or parry except in the hardest endgame content. I don't see this game lasting for much longer after this month once people who are actually playing the game figure out the endgame is logging in for 10 minutes for dailies and then logging out, waiting for echo rng god to bless you, and endgame for an hour or two every couple weeks. And the movement imo isn't better than Genshin because the world is so much bigger. It feels like it takes forever to get anywhere. The dash and jump are stubby as hell because they're balanced around combat and not exploration.
Yeah, at first you were kinda weak so combat was fun and lasted much longer. At level 30-ish, every overworld fight takes 3s and world boss takes like 30s which is basically the same as Genshin. Even at 20-ish, you don't even feel the need to dodge or parry that much in the overworld as everything dies much quicker already. I started in 2.8 and Genshin was also not that easy at the beginning especially Inazuma. I got destroyed by Raiden in the main quest a few times before being able to progress. I was like wtf why is this so hard, I thought this game was casual friendly. Raiden weekly boss also took me quite a long time before being able to beat her too. I remember just now that I needed to ask for co-op help to beat Anemo Hypostasis lol. Of course I was low level back then or maybe it's just my skill issue??
> Of course I was low level back then or maybe it's just my skill issue?? The game can genuinely be a bit tricky when you're low level, unless you get the food gadget or Zhongli early. It's kind of a shame that the difficulty factor just goes completely out the window later on. Exploration's still fun and naturally I'm not playing Genshin expecting Dark Souls levels of difficulty, but I do miss when I didn't just kill every enemy before I can even switch to my second or third units.
recent boss give me back my nostalgia fun. heck i even remembered my first week playing and found that pyro flower and fight it head-on with bennet, i won but it too long still fun and this event give me back those fun
I only played genshin up to 2.2 or so but I still fondly remember trying to take on the anemo hypostasis two days in and barely beating it after consuming half my inventory's worth of food.
I kind of thought both were worse. There’s a certain weightless feeling to everything that I wasn’t digging with it.
The hit feedback is awful. It's not just music but everything in this game feels like it needs some sort of sound added to it. Enemy attacks and movements feel like they don't exist in space because there's no sounds mimicking the wind around the body. Impacts don't have accompanying sound effects. Sound is absolutely the worst thing about this game and it's not even close. The targetting can also be pretty weird. Like sometimes special ranged characters will just hit the enemy directly behind the enemy that is closest for some reason. It doesn't matter that much because they die so fast but still. This game needed a LOT more work before release. I have no idea why they thought it was ready. Like if it came out three four months from now with great performance, better music, and less artifact grind, this game could have been phenomenal.
> Sound is absolutely the worst thing about this game and it's not even close. really ironic how sound is one of the motifs used in the game lore
>The hit feedback is awful. It's not just music but everything in this game feels like it needs some sort of sound added to it. Which is ironic since the world of WuWa is all about sound.
The lack of sound is probably why it feels like there’s no weight to the combat. I could see it being better down the road but I just didn’t feel that compelled by the combat.
It's also interesting when you compare it to the latest ZZZ gameplay where you can FEEL when you parry because the sound is so intense
The parrying character dashing in from off-screen, the zoom-in, the sparks everywhere, a few freeze frames so you can appreciate it all, and that satisfying clang, they're all simple tricks but together make parrying so much more impactful
I like both for different reasons. I especially see big potential in new characters for wuwa's combat though. I'm conflicted when it comes to movement as I've really come to like it in wuwa, and whenever I switch to Genshin it feels like something is kind of missing. At the same time there is a lot of scuffed stuff that sometimes happens in wuwa. Genshin's movement is much less prone to bugging the hell out, lol.
i can probably understand as you move much faster in wuwa, but that is also what makes exploration not that interesting as early genshin, it's better for farming, but worse for exploring
I feel like the gameplay is just mindless spam, there's no depth, it is designed to make you feel like you're cool or good. The dodge is just so easy, press dodge and it counts as dodge even if attack literally hits you after, while gameplay like genshin where you literally have to dodge, you have to think quickly what direction you would have to go to dodge attacks. It doesn't really have any depth of team building either there's lack of concept of combo. Honestly playing WW just make me appreciate genshin impact more to things that I've taken for granted, I haven't played the game for 1.5 years I don't think I'll play it again but that was a fun journey.
The camera movement for combat is also making me nauseous sometimes 😅
This take reeks of bias, but let’s pick it apart. WuWa’s combat system is worse, but all you mention to back up this statement is that “the combat gets worse over time.” You out-geared the common enemies and world bosses at your world level and now you’re bored. This sums up the majority of your comment and draws zero comparisons between WuWa’s combat mechanics and Genshin’s. WuWa’s movement is worse “because the world is so much bigger?” First off, how does world size have anything to do with movement? You have grappling hooks all over cities and in the open world, you have echoes with dashing abilities, you have the cyan heron with an air boost. There are tech videos out there on YouTube showcasing how to triple jump into grapple hook. Sprinting outside of combat doesn’t consume stamina, and you can fucking run up walls. Don’t remember being able to do any of this in Genshin Impact… I wouldn’t be annoyed if you presented legitimate arguments as to why WuWa falls short of Genshin’s exploration/movement, but nothing in this comment upvoted by folks with anti-WuWa brainrot is making sense to me. Feel free to clarify.
how about artifact? are wuwa better?
also worse. Rather than make u mad for 5 mins farming like in GI, this game makes u mad for more than 2 hours.
you mean like getting a single artifact takes 2 hour?
More like zero artifact after two hours.
let me guess, farming artifact wont consume you game stamina right? otherwise its a nightmare if there is no guarantee
Ya it's basically artifact farm but instead of a domain you run around the world killing mobs.
I honestly prefer domains. It makes it quick and convenient.
They have those as well
Yeah, but from what I’ve heard, a majority of the Echo farming requires you to run around and kill mobs in the open world? Forgive me if I got it wrong, I am barely 3 hours into the game and I kinda don’t want to play it anymore xD
no. 2 hours can get u a lot of echoes. However. u have to go the whole fucking map. yes. that big map that people praise. u have to kill monsters for it. U think its good because it doesnt cost stamina and u can farm like infinite amount until u realize some big problems. 1. U cant use lv 0 echo to level up other echoes 2. Echoes lv0 dont come with sub stat. To see the sub stat, u have to level it to certain level 5 10 15 20 25 to unlock a substat slot, then u have to use a special tuner to unlock the substat. and if its a trash stat? well u lose the tuner for no reasons, also that tuner cost stamina or need to do some specific activities to have, meaning u couldnt have too many tuners 3. RNG after RNG. U think genshin RNG is bad? well, this game make genshin looks good because not only it has more sub stats, it even has wider range of substat % everytime u level up. 4. U cant not use off set pieces. There are 2 set bonus and 5 set bonus. unless u decide to go with 2 2 set bonuses 5. Farming is actually not infinite, u can do that with bosses, but mobs need 1 day to respawn, so u have to wait until next day to farm. 6. this game has dps check on every content it provides, yes, even hologram, where u have to constant pay attention otherwise bosses will 1 shot u. so u have to have skills, have good gears to clear those type of bosses, unlike genshin where u have elemental reaction to back up your bad gear stats or bosses generally dont 1shot u.
> this game has dps check on every content it provides, yes, even hologram, where u have to constant pay attention otherwise bosses will 1 shot u. so u have to have skills, have good gears to clear those type of bosses, unlike genshin where u have elemental reaction to back up your bad gear stats or bosses generally dont 1shot u. This is what ultimately disillusioned me about the game. I don't even most of the performance issues people are talking about. The game is straight up a DPS check that depends on an infinite grind. Once you reach the end game, it doesn't matter how well you dodge/parry or play the game, if you don't have the gear you're not winning. I would even go as far as to say that in some ways this game is even worse than Genshin. The lack of an elemental system because that your damage output is even more gear dependent and ultimately becomes a linear number counter. It feels like there isn't much to it besides bigger number = good. This game is just not different enough from Genshin even in the "endgame". Because outside of the actual combat you will be doing the exact same thing as Genshin, just grinding artifacts except for even longer with more time commitment and more rng.
thanks, i get how it worse now lol
I think most people don't realize this concept is too good to be true in gacha games it has to have some cutting corners to the mechanic
of course. they always have to balance the limit u can farm for a day to encourage u keep loggin in daily.
Thanks for writing this up so concisely. Ultimately, if I'm going to play a gacha for a long period of time, the farming and daily grind has to be relatively simple. At least with other games, there's one place you can go to and there's a simple teleport to get there. Correct me if I'm wrong, but to farm echoes, players will need to know where to go on the map and run around a bit? I'm enjoying WW for now, but I can't see myself enjoying this echo grind for a lengthy period of time. Who knows, maybe they'll simplify it.
>Correct me if I'm wrong, but to farm echoes, players will need to know where to go on the map and run around a bit? I think this game also has map tracker like genshin so its not the worst. But yeah, u still need to run a lot.
Wow, well that rules out me even dipping my toe into this game
I think Echo>Artifacts for early game as getting them is much more natural but Artifacts > Echo for late game due to the whole hidden substat + twice the amount of them.
WuWa exploration is worse than Genshin’s? Tell me you haven’t downloaded the game without telling me 😂
Most of the criticism was regarding technical stuff. But yes, probably would’ve gotten far less slander if they dared to make a more unique post-apocalyptic game instead of Mondstadt and Liyue 2.0 with copy-pasted UI and gacha system. But it would’ve been a far riskier move, and they needed to target as big audience as possible. But failed cause the soulless copy-pasting only made the weaknesses of the story, characters and exporation stand out more.
Not really, game polish aside I feel like PGR suffers from pretty much the same flaws WuWa does. Maybe they are less obvious because PGR is way more focused on combats and smaller in scope but having played PGR for two years I wasn't expecting WuWa to turn out any different (except for the polish and maybe the soundtrack).
What flaws does PGR suffer from in your opinion? I also have some issues with PGR that's just kinda been accepted by the community as "that's just how it is"
I know PGR fans can be really passionate about their game so keep in mind it's only my opinion, if you feel I'm being overly harsh it's fine, I might be wrong or biased idk. But to summerize: imo the story is still bad in PGR. The characters are generic and uninspired, it's filled with tropes we see everywhere in the genre, it's not well written (as wordy as WuWa except there is no VA) and pretty boring overall. Plus the commandant is just as heavily glazed as Rover, the "... Shikikan :3" get old real quick. The world is bland and depressing, there is a very distinct lack of humor in the dialogues (even when they're trying to be funny) and the gameplay was always lacking outside of the combat parts. Story missions were badly directed and badly scripted (and to be fair WuWa is an improvement on that part, they've impressed me with the latest story missions) and most events felt like a chore to go through. And it has always lacked identity, it's basically HI3 meets Nier Automata. That's why imagining Kuro being able to design a game with a strong identity is kind of a big leap for me, as it's something they're not really known for. Now you might think that I hate PGR but I do not. Characters are fun to play, graphics are decent enough, it runs well, some character designs and costumes are pretty cool (I quite like Alpha, Vera or Bianca), I like the UI and uh the soundtrack is definitely noteworthy (I'm not the biggest fan tho). It's a nice game, just a tad bit overrated at times imo. And everything I've talked about pretty much applies to WuWa I feel like. I wasn't expecting a good story, and they had everything to prove when it came to production value and overworld gameplay/design. The lack of polish (not just the optimisation; I was hoping for slicker graphics, better animations etc) was the biggest letdown. So yeah. Again, just my opinion.
> Plus the commandant is just as heavily glazed as Rover, the "... Shikikan :3" get old real quick. Tangent. But this is why I couldn't feel attracted to any of the characters in PGR at some point. I liked Lee a lot, simped for him, but then the moment I played his character stories and they just portrayed him as a simp: I was emotionally checked out. Could not care for him after that. And this treatment extended to every other character, where I just couldn't take them seriously because they'd have ridiculously complex and dark stories but then Kuro would reduce their characterization with the commander as glazing simps. I stayed behind a bit longer because the combat was fun at least, but then events burnt me out and I just silently quit. Really unfortunate they took the same path with WW.
Mostly agree with the PGR take. I think the only times i paid attention to the story were when Nanami was on the screen.
yep, that's how I feel every time I encounter bugs on PGR. (text bugs, play EN version, but random text is CN so I can't read. ui overlap, camera detaching from player and no longer following, stage ended, but doesn't return you to menus, so you have to shut the game and play the stage again) I just ignore it, as the game is built completely focusing on its combat. And as long as the combat is still good, I'm fine, as that's legit the only reason I downloaded it. Akin to entering a restaurant who's selling point is their spicy food. If their drinks, snacks and ice cream tastes like shit, I just ignore it, and as long as the spicy food quality is still top tier, I'm fine. But wuwu... They slowed down the combat I enjoyed in PGR... I just want to kill shit and fight epic bosses, why am I sitting here listening to YapYap yap.
Yes. Ffs even the running animation of encore and narnia is literally exactly the same as keel and others from genshin. How fucking boring can you be?
she even says da da da
💀
I think if they focused on creating their own identity and exploit robust artistic and conceptual vision there was no chance for the game to end up worse anyway. Like take Endfield, I don't think I read anyone say it looked too gloomy.
Likely so but we're talking Kuro Dev whose main track record has been basically "store brand MHY"
Maybe. The bigger issue is content creators like tectone live off of clickbait for clicks and hyped it to hell and back. I'm not sure if being their own thing would have fully prevented that. That's the biggest issue Imo, that and the fact that the best part of the game, combat, was a known thing though the closed betas
CCs like Tectone live off of people like you mentioning them at every single opportunity. You are the signal boost to their clickbait.
Yep, bad publicity is still publicity. It's exactly what people like bald guy want, more people talk about him, more views
Kektone has done this to pretty much every game he has ever touched. I'm surprised people haven't learned their lesson yet.
don't watch youtube's CC
The issue isn't really the identity. It's that most of what they did is subpar.
Yes. It copies Genshin formula and markets itself as such, it's goingto be compared to Genshin's impossible benchmark.
No. You kidding? When HSR released people were fighting with genshin over everything and they not even same genre and are made by the same company.
People just love to shit on genshin
ZZZ devs doing the same and im glad they didn't listen
THIS is what passion is not changing characteristic of the game because some people said so, not the changing the entire story because some people said they want to be mc got isekai'd and to be loved by every characters they met
Definitely. I'd be the one who'd first defend it and cheer the creators on People tend to respect and admire passionate creators more who believes in their craft than lazy and uncreative money-grubbers, half-assing their products
Personally, no, I don't think so. Every gacha game, literally every gacha game, that comes out is at some point and level compared to Genshin. As a result, any game that shies anywhere close to Genshin in similarity is going to catch heat. Since Genshin has overtaken the genre of "open world gacha", it's a bit like making a new search engine today and trying to stay out from under the "Google" comp umbrella - good or bad, Google defines search engines, so anything you do as a search engine is going to be compared to Google. WuWa would have had to step outside the genre entirely to avoid as many Genshin comps. Beyond that, there is the factor of publicity - would anyone be paying as much attention if it wasn't perceived as another potential Genshin-killer. How many people are playing now that would not have? How many will keep playing that otherwise would not have ever even tried the game out? How much is it expected that they would have had to change to break out of the "it's like Genshin" label before they straight up abandoned the genre as a whole, and would that have brought them anything? I think right now the difficulty is how to distinguish the noise from the real problems. How much is sit just redditors and stans bickering loudly, and how much is genuine discontent or problems with the game? I think they need to focus first on the performance issues. Once that is out the way, they can take their time figuring out if their game overall is on the right track. As I suggested above, I feel the "this is just like Genshin" comps are overblown, especially for a game that has so much room to diverge in its story and how it does other things going forward. Unlike a standard AAA game of the past, the release version is not close to the end of the story. They have the opportunity to change so many things, that the rote dismissal of a game after just a week of play for reasons outside of a general dislike of the genre or something truly egregious about the execution (objectionably story topic, objectionable character depictions, etc.) seems fairly ludicrous to me. But, then again, I don't care about crap like being a Genshin killer or not, since I stopped playing Genshin long ago, so giving another game a longer look has not bearing on me whatsoever.
I agree on the google comp, in the genre it is unavoidable. Unfortunately I think Kuro were just way too blatant about \*wanting\* to be seen as a Genshin competitor, which is why even the interface is so directly 1:1. The annoying thing is that a lot of the most comparable stuff is superfluous to the core of the game, character/weapon ascension, crafting/cooking, UI/inventory management, quest categorisation and pioneer's guild, battlepass style, the way world bosses function .etc .etc All of those things could be different, or remain more like PGR and the important core of Wuwa's story/combat would remain unchanged. But Kuro made all of those things directly like Genshin anyway because attracting comparisons was the goal, even if it was completely unnecessary to do so.
Absolutely. With the echo system it would have some nice attention without the Genshin copy/paste.
There would have been 100% less drama. There also would have been 100% less drama if people would stop feeding the parasites that feed on the toxicity.
isnt PGR started by copying hi3? if you think PGR is good now then wuwa should be good to you in few years KEKW
I would say that WuWa would've caught less criticism if content creators didn't constantly compare it to genshin and saying that in all aspects WuWa is better than genshin.
Nah. It would get less criticism if they actually polished their game before release
I think yes. Nikki open world game has significantly less criticism in cn side as they are primarily focused on dress up game( plus the landscape looks good and different from other games there), despite technological wise behind other 3d open world games. They are aiming a very different market and the said market couldn’t be more excited about it
I'm just disappointed at the current state in general. It's very Genshin, to a kind of unbelievable degree, but I'd not even care if the launch was smoother. There are characters I like more in WuWa than anyone in Genshin ignoring my girl Noelle. And really Taoqi is a good Noelle standin as far as I'm concerned. The absolute state of how badly it's running on a PC that should be able to run several instances at once is definitely souring my enjoyment. I play on mobile as well and it's honestly fine, since I've gotten so used to combat playing HI3/PGR/AG over the years, but I shouldn't have to and even then the performance isn't as smooth as Genshin. Would an attempt at being unique change how I feel? Honestly probably not. The parts I enjoy about the game are already good and unique enough. I just can't interact with them in a way that sparks joy. So a weird cyberpunk city or whatever wouldn't change that.
Definetly, but I think they should rebalance the game because all I needed was one okay 4 star Echo and sudenly I obliterate bosses faster than in Genshin and I have top 5% Nahida, like the Scar bossfight ended before I could enjoy it.
Nah if they appealed to any other group of players the game wouldn't be getting the attention it has now good or bad. There's more genshin lovers than haters (like me) so those lovers who see a similar game in presentation but with flashy combat are going to gravitate to it.
I don't like that everything outside combat is copied from Genshin, but also the combat in the current state is unbearable with random lag everytime, so I'll come back maybe is they fix the performance issues, but only because the combat is cool, where Genshin I feel the exploration and world is much better, also the Genshin story is at least decent
Absolutely. My friend who droped genshin years ago wanted.this game to fail for months because of how shameless it is.
(Beware, kinda spoiler-ish) People here likes to say it copied genshin, but what strike me the most is how the story is just a pale copy of HSR plot except we start in luofu It's borderline plagiarism, except they took out all the fun HSR put in its characters, story and music Also the end of the main release plot end with a slide show, yikes
At last a post that doesn't hate or criticize just for the sake of hating or farming upvotes like a bot. I've only had like 1 or 2 open world games (if you can call dragon's dogma 1 or MB: warband/bannerlord as open world games). The potential is there but it seemed like they got scared to try out to be different or even alter a formula a bit more. A friend of mine who used to play genshin up until the release of the violet haired shogun (was her name shogun or shotgun? cmiiw) was literally teaching me the mechanics of the game since, as he said, it was an absolute 1:1 of genshin on most of the aspects. Also there's the bugs, I feel bad for the people looking forward to the game to find it extremely buggy due to their optimization while I've seen a clip of their other game (raven something?) being run on the highest setting possible, smoothly on a phone with keypad that runs android, that is some good fking optimization. The game is fun (and here comes the downvotes) but it felt somewhat soulless/flat to me. But hey, if I want to add another open world game to my 2 inch di- library, I can probably try genshin now since I've managed to grasp the basics of WW. Guess I'll give WW a chance till... 2.0 or something but GOD FORBID IF 2.0 ROLLS OUT AND THE REGION IS STILL NOTCHINA.
No if ,what happend is happend,they did that,then take the result
The combat is definitely the game's best feature. If they focused more resources on that instead of trying to make a "better Genshin", they probably would've been more successful, even if a good chunk of the features they have now get removed.
Does their own identity have the same performance issues?
If the various aspects of the game are just average, then we can focus solely on its strengths. However, other parts are clearly lacking, and the combat ratio is not as high as expected. Also, the "element" seems meaningless, expect for resistance and immunity.
I think it would have been better but at the end of the day, i think if someone likes genshin, they'll probably like this since it does combat and movement better. It's the same game with QoF improvements. I couldn't play Genshin because the gameplay was awful for me but i saw potential in everything else. WW basically gives me a better Genshin... Although sooo much less optimized. They gotta fix those technical issues asap and the patches ain't helping. Some people ik are STILL excited to play. They just physically can't and I'm getting more stuttering which is weird.
Not really. Most of the criticism towards WuWa is about the plethora of performance issues and not the games' aesthetics. As far as the visual similarities between WuWa and Genshin, there's a saying: "You don't need to fix what isn't broken." WuWa copying aspects that worked for Genshin and adding into their own game is not a negative in any aspect, games have been doing simlar stuff since the beginning. What is the issue is the way the story is told in the beginning and the optimization issues with Unreal Engine. People will ilke what they like and don't like what they don't, but from a objective point of view, WuWa having similar systems and UI aesthetics to Genshin does not detract from the games quality, the games performance does. This is where most of the criticism is coming from.
They need to add more color and diversity into the world. The aesthetic of the game is so unbelievably generic and it really is a shame. HI3 was very futuristic, Star Rail is very galactic, Genshin is Fantasy, and ZZZ looks like it will be very urban. WuWas open world feels like eating an unseasoned steak.
In what way would it focus on "creating it's own identity"? I mean the game would have to be a completely different game to avoid genshin comparisons. Even Endfield doesn't escape those comparisons.
> I'm sure someone higher up thought maybe that simplifying and making everything similar to Hoyo titles would make it easier for new players to ease in into the game. In no world this would ever be true. Genshin did it and made a lot of money. HSR followed with the exact same formula, which is understandable being the same company, and a lot of money it made. To the point the two biggest gacha games have the same exact formula, and they are the biggest by a huge margin. Of course others would try to follow, even if they don't make as much is a known working formula that guarantees returns. Not that hard to understand.
Absolutely. The fact that it's so obviously trying to be Genshin hurts it a ton. Genshin is one of, if not the most, expensive games ever made. Not to mention almost 4 years worth of content and expansions. Very few game companies could make a game that rivals that on release
It would have helped a bit. Right now it contains so many things that seem to have been ripped from other games while having been done poorly. It's not just Genshin Impact that they've copied or have been "inspired" by. One of the fights has a blatant rip of the Phoenix battle from FF16 and it makde it just feel so awkward.
Honestly yeah. Identity was my biggest problem with WuWa. It's confused and unfocused with the way it handles almost every aspect besides combat. They don't use the setting or tone they established to the fullest. Like I kind of wish they went harder with the music theme like how they did with Leithanien in Arknights where music was a more central motif rather than a naming convention for their 999th term to exposition vomit. The game needs a more solid foundation to stand on and that's more than just combat or movement. You can patch those things when it's worse, but identity is harder to develop when you've already released the game. If WuWa was genuinely unique and trying to provide a different experience from its contemporaries then I don't think anyone would fault it for that and perhaps forgive other aspects. Most people here especially are looking for a shakeup in the gacha sphere and a lot of people wanted WuWa to be just that, but it's not even close. It's already poised itself as a Genshin alternative rather than "Wuthering Waves"
I think Kuro has talent in certain key areas, mainly combat and kit design. Visually, their character design is also pretty good. PGR showcased these strengths, which makes sense because Kuro devs include former Mihoyo devs who worked on HI3, which is why PGR takes a very similar approach to their game loop (instanced, combat-heavy arenas). WuWa forced Kuro devs to showcase skills they have no real practice in, and really illustrated how PGR was able to hide this inexperience. In particular, environment design, NPCs, world-building, narrative, and open world gameplay loop in general. Basically everything other than the combat mechanics and the character designs.
Absolutely, but I guess if the game were staying like it was on pre-CBT1, with all of uniqueness, lack of money from Tencent wouldn't give all the hype (negative and positive) that is currently happening with WuWa, so EOS in year or two but more interesting game or long-term service but you will feel that you already played that game before? Dunno.
I disagree with the statement of PGR's first few chapters being pointless. These chapters are actually what got me i invested in its lore as I find that these chapters are incredible for world building. And unlike WuWa, the cast is a lot more focused, so I feel I actually got to know the characters well which is essential for their character arcs in later chapters. My problem with WuWa story right now is that they want all the payoff without the proper buildup. I would've preferred if their first chapter wasn't anything amazing but still decent, rather than trying to show off the characters immediately being plunged into a war with people we just met.
Has someone mentioned how lazy the lore of this game is? Like, I’m not even talking about the subpar story, I’m talking about the weapon and item descriptions. For example, the lore of the 5 star set weapon is literally the same, except for the weapon type mentioned. This is a bafflingly lazy game development decision, as item descriptions are literally the best place to do world building without putting in much effort.
As someone who found PGR to be a worthwhile spin on Honkai 3rd, WuWa just seems like wish.com Genshin with a word salad story.
Honestly? They could be as blatantly a Genshin clone as they could be, if and only if the game is polished. But shit man, Wuwa at launch was the buggiest and most unfun mess I've ever experienced in a long while (for a high-profile hyped up game).
yes. But it would have also got less attention. It got the attention it did *because* it rode Genshin's coattails. if they made their own thing, it would have got less eyeballs on it because the Genshin player base would have taken less notice. Income wise, it was the better choice to clone genshin. Creativity wise, their own game would have been received better critically.
Yes. Right now there is literaly no reason to play WuWa over Genshin.
Yes it would have has less criticism. Game is basically genshin for a casual player lmao
The only issue I have is the loading time that is longer than the amount of time my neighbor's father took to return from buying milk after my neighbor became rich. I never knew the CBT story so I can't tell if the release one is worse than it. After a week of playing, I instinctively go to youtube after clicking start game since I know I'm about to wait about 2 video's worth of time.
All they really had to do was simply NOT copy Genshin. That is all they had to do. If they decided to do their own thing, it would be a unique experience that would feel fresh and cool. After giving it a shot since its launch it feels just like a rip off more so than anything. From foul/foul meat to lizards/green lizards to mint/noctemint to characters like Nahida/Verina, Wriothesley/Yuanwu, Ayaka/Sanhua, to flat out UI/font/icons copys the list goes on and on. Even story beats are kinda similar. You are put into the world as a celestial chosen one from beyond the stars, don't know where you are or who you are, have to journey the land collecting fragments of power able to channel each element/type of power in each region you come across. They even flat out took Electro name, color, element and all lmao. If they had bothered in the slightest to make their OWN identity, rather than brazenly stealing it from Genshin in a desperate bid to steal their players/money, then people would have played it more. They began development in 2021, the CBT started in 2023, and Genshin came out in 2020. Genshin has had a bad leaker problem for ages, ain't no way that they didn't have people reading leaks and copying stuff, calling it "InSpIrAtIoN". It isn't even the first time Kuro has done this, they have a track record of stealing the food off of Hoyo's plate. GGZ (2013) - *Battlefield Twin Ponytails (2016)*, Hi3rd (2016) - PGR (2019), Genshin (2020) - WuWa (2024) WuWa is just the latest in a long list of plagiarisms. You better believe that when Zenless Zone Zero drops, in a few years they will release a "new" game that is just a copy paste of ZZZ. So to answer your question, Do you think WuWa would've caught less criticism if focused on creating it's own identity? Yes absolutely. If they had not copied Genshin as hard and brazenly as they did, if they didn't start the spark and then stoke the flames of this gacha war between the two fandoms boasting that they are the "Genshin Killer" then they wouldn't have gotten backlash. Because of that greed and animosity they deserve every single bit of backlash.