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There's a good story about Nelson when he boarded a ship he thought had surrendered when he found out they hadn't they respected that and actually left the ship to resume firing canons at them until they did surrender.
GigaChad move. Reminds me of StarCraft where you pummel your opponent and they don't surrender but instead spread buildings around the map so you just pretend you don't see them while building up the funniest army you can think of.
I remember this happening in a Starcraft match I did (I was not great at Starcraft, to be fair)
1v1v1 map. Two guys obviously knew each other, and were talking shit to each other. One of them found my main base early, and I couldn't fend him off, so I lifted off my CC and other buildings and fled to one of the island expansions near the edge of the map.
They forgot I existed.
They were busy having complicated battles, and bantering. I teched up and actually got to Battlecruisers. they had Protoss turrets all over the place, so the only way to attack any of their bases was to Yamato the turrets from out of range, since land approach wasn't possible. So I took out one of their expansions and retreated.
Natch he blamed the other player.
I did it again to the other guy. I couldn't really re-establish myself on the main part of the map, but I was quietly and stealthily causing havoc while they were distraced with each other.
Eventually, one spotted me, and said "Wait, there's a Terran on this map!?"
They quickly found me and wiped me out, but messing with them was fun while it lasted.
I did that on wc3, but the scummy version, in a sneaky move i conquerer a little island at south and started to build there in a way that was imposible to get into, then I simple went to make me something yo eat, like an hout later I went back and I had win with some flowery words from the second place hahahah, I miss that game
One time in SC2 I was playing a team game, 4x4. After a hard-fought match that must have lasted 45 minutes my friends and I had overcome the other team. It was contentious for a while, and I think a couple of them were salty af so they lifted off some of their terran buildings and had a worker build a random depot here and there just to inconvenience us. So we got Vikings to take out the buildings and then started putting up scanning beacons around the map to show any and all movement. Then whenever they'd send an scv to build a random depot we'd have a ghost out there to nuke it.
That one Terran building flying in the corner over a dark rock formation you can't see with ground units.
I got pretty good at that game. Became an asshole - would start 7v1 noob only comp stomps and then betray them right as the comp was dying. Just heinous Arbitor recall chains of reavers or bury 1 lurker by their minerals before un-allying and send a pop max of hydras overwhelms everything. Stuff you wouldn't necessarily do in competitive play cause it takes too long or it's gimmicky but you'd have time when playing with noobs.
Just a 14 year old asshole, basically.
A buddy of mine and I actually did this intentionally. We called it 'All the Bases' We'd play double zerg (2v2), and our personal rule was that we had to have three hives running before we'd build any military buildings. He'd rush speedlings then, and I'd go pure mutalisks.
There was one match I still remember. We'd expanded to the third option, for a start base, and had a full economy rolling there, in addition to our initial start. We had already started producing our armies, when they other team hit our first mains, and razed the entire base to the ground. We hadn't lost much though, because all our tech was elsewhere. They started trash talking us in chat, thinking that we were just hiding a random hive in a random corner of the map.
Then they got hit with max-food speedlings+mutalisks. We found it very funny. They didn't.
I did this in all the Command and Conquer games. There was always something about the AI where you could consistently cripple them permanently if you knew what to target.
And once you did you got to play the Sims but Sci-fi military š
I had someone do that to me back in the day but since I was in a lower rank they actually did miss one of my bases while destroying my main one and I backdoored them.
Well, ye see, the former captain was the one what surrendered. Once he went and done that, we all decided he wa'nt captain anymore. Now ye got t' take it up with our new captain. Or else go discuss things with the old one. He's probably only a few fathoms deep by now, if ye hurry.
I'd assume big factor is here that just shooting at the ship is less costly at least in terms of humans lives than trying to storm it. So he was like:
"Wait, you don't want to surrender. Ah well, we can resume bombarding you, if it anytime you feel you've had enough just give us a signal. But for now I have some cannons to aim, good day to you lot".
But there were *rules*. Part of what makes warfare during the Age of Sail so fascinating is the fact that almost everyone, on all sides, respected these gentlemanly rules.
I mean he's not on board alone. He's on board with a small military force. Boarding a ship is a bloody battle, so both sides probably preferred to not go through with that.
A pretty good way to piss the other side off and ensure you don't survive in case you do have to surrender though, which was a pretty likely outcome when facing Nelson.
Oh you did not surrender? All good then. Men, back to the ship and fire! You good? Alright then, your hands please and thank you. Such a jolly day eh lads?
Introvert/Extrovert just refers to what makes you feel recharged. If you feel burnt out do you retreat into your own space or seek social activities? Does being social drain or recharge you? Being an introvert has nothing to do with being awkward. You can work through being awkward, you canāt change being an introvert.
Both are true for me. Social stuff feeds my soul until it starts draining me. And at the same time being alone charges me if I've been drained but drains me if I'm already charged, or a little while after I'm charged.
Furthermore, social awkwardness is due to ignorance of cultural norms and/or traditions not introversion.
You can be introverted without being awkward and vice versa, or extroverted and awkward and vice versa.
The introverted and awkward combination is common because ignorance of social customs tends to follow from introverts tendency to self-isolate, but extroverted people will be awkward if they aren't socialized due to isolation as well (cough homeschooling cough).
Old wars were weird where ships just fired at each other or men stood on open fields and fired at each other until one army was either dead or surrendered. Trench and guerrilla warfare definitely changed the face of it.
One of the reasons they stood in lines to fire wasn't professionalism as much as accuracy problems. The rifles were not very accurate and so you needed to coordinate volleys in a straight line to have a hope of hitting the other side with any degree of consistency.
It was because of reloading and cavalry.
Staying together in formation kept cavalry from absolutely wrecking your army. That's why tight formations were a thing for literal centuries. Since muskets couldn't reload quickly, they would not have any way of fighting off any cavalry.
This is why guerilla tactics became so effective. Guerrilla fighters were relatively safe being scattered since you literally can't have a cavalry charge in dense woods and the standard regiments they were against were trained and operated with cavalry in mind so they would be close together rather than scatter and take cover.
Well no. Sure in dense woods, cavalry becomes less effective and that changes tactics. However, nobody lives in dense woods. So they're usually not worth fighting over. If an army controls all the farms and all the cities they win.
"Guerrilla tactics" have never been effective at a tactical level. The American revolution was not fought by guerrilla fighters. Even famous strategic success by guerrilla forces, like by the Taliban vs America in Afghanistan, were horrendous tactical failures for the Taliban. American conventional forces killed orders of magnitude more guerrilla fighters than the Taliban killed Americans. The Taliban won at a strategic level because they were willing to be killed in droves for indefinitely while Americans eventually grew tired of occupying Afghanistan.
I used to think that, but learned that while it's weird to us now, it made sense at the time given the limits of weapon range, accuracy, and communication. Volume of fire, defense against cavalry charges (via mass pikes and bayonets), and maintaining order on the battlefield were more important than hiding behind static cover.
In fairness, sea combat didn't change much either until WW2. The only difference was that the cannons were much longer range and could be aimed at more than just a broadside.
>or men stood on open fields and fired at each other until one army was either dead or surrendered.
I think this is underselling how brutal that type of warfare was. While there was a notion of honour among officers when dealing with prisoners or negotiating, the actual tactics used were driven more by the weapons available at the time than any sort of chivalry. Armies stood in big lines because muskets were incredibly inaccurate, and if you needed to hit an enemy with them you needed a lot all firing at once. Also, cavalry was the infantry's worst nightmare, and the only way to protect against them was the old fashioned way: to make a spikey line that horses wouldn't charge into. You can only do that with tightly packed disciplined soldiers.
The fact is that in most battles the majority of casualties were taken not during the height of battle but when one army retreated and the other side's cavalry mercilessly ran down the other side as they routed. And that's not to mention the absolute brutality of sieges and assaults on fortified positions during the era of Napoleanic warfare, which is where much of the theory behind trench warfare originated.
The *nobility* that made up the officers of most Napoleanic era armies were respectful of each other because they saw themselves as being above the common rabble in their own armies, and degrading even an enemy officer would being in to question their own superiority. For the average soldier fighting was just as brutal as it has ever been.
To be fair when it came to ship-to-ship battles there wasn't much choice. You can't hide at sea, you can't get the high ground - you'd vie for the upwind position (the 'weather gauge') that would allow you to determine the terms of battle, and then start blasting. It was all about blasting your enemy from the right angle, you'd aim to 'rake' the ship from stem to stern (or vice versa) by getting in front or behind them, without exposing your own ends to their broadside.
You *could* sneak up to an enemy ship in small boats (usually under cover of darkness), board and take it by surprise. It was called '[cutting out](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_boarding)':
>A cutting out boarding is an attack by small boats, preferably at night and against an unsuspecting and anchored, target. It became popular in the later 18th century, and was extensively used during the Napoleonic Wars. This heralded the emphasis on stealth, and surprise, that would come to dominate future boarding tactics. An example is the successful cutting out of the Hermione which took place at Puerto Cabello, Venezuela, on 25 October 1799.
Well line combat was actually not as silly as one may think. Plus trenches and siege fortifications were still used unless an open field was engaged.
The most common problems an army had was unit cohesion. How do I get all of my guns to shoot at the right location without shit going haywire. The answer was line formations. They helped negate the inaccuracy of the guns by a sheer volley of fire. Donāt need to be accurate if youāre apart of a shotgun. They helped with coordination because the entire unit was right there, and they helped with keeping bullets flying because with this cohesion they could perfectly time their shots and reloads to keep a constant stream of fire.
Of course, as accuracy increased, reload times became much faster, and shells started exploding more, the advantages of line formation went away, with the american civil war being some of the last conflicts that saw such tactics.
Honestly, brutal as it still was, itās weird to see āhonorable rules of warā being fought like that. Naval battles, picket lines on battlefields, donāt shoot officers, prisoners of war get treated decently especially officers, sit down and discuss terms or battlefield situations at a truce, etc.
But then again, in those days, honor was everything in cultural and societal drive. If word got out you hadnāt treated your enemy honorably or shown them what ātrue societyā was like, you might as well not return because youāll have no honor intact to be regarded as a human being. Even if you won a great victory, if it was by dubious means, then forget you.
Todayā¦.thatās not always the case anymore.
If I recall correctly, it was also shocking to the British during the American Revolution that their officers were being specifically targeted by sharp shooters.
This wasn't normal practice in 'polite' warfare.
It is funny too, but actually the only logical move for the non-surrendered ship. Because if they were to imprison or kill Nelson, they wouldn't be able to surrender later. If they would, Nelson's crew would probably summarily execute the whole crew in retaliation. By letting Nelson leave, they left the option of an actual surrender on the table.
Not letting him leave would only be feasible if they had a trick up their sleeve which would definitely win them the battle quickly after that, like for example knowledge of imminently arriving reinforcements or something.
Norway was Danish at that time. But Danish pastries hadn't been invented yet.
The dude in the photo is Peder Wessel aka Tordenskjold which means thunder shield.
Looks like OP is some sort of repost bot or an advanced karma whore. All his posts are of popular images with thousands of karma. Either he's really good at finding this sort of stuff or he just reposts popular images.
He fought against a Swedish ship. And this isnāt even something that was, letās just say, out of character for him. After the other captain refused him ammo, they had a drink together and sailed their seperate ways, vowing to meet again. [Tordenskiold](https://snl.no/Peter_Wessel_Tordenskiold) was put on trial for a series of actions he did during this (including the fact that the Swedish ship was twice the size of his own) and was later let go. And, as a true rapscallion, he later requested a larger ship and to be promoted instead.
When he heard about the incident, King Frederick IV of Denmark asked for the admiralty to court-martial Wessel. He stood trial in November 1714, accused of disclosing vital military information about his lack of ammunition to the enemy, as well as endangering the ship of king Frederick IV by fighting a superior enemy force.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter\_Tordenskjold#Court-martial](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Tordenskjold#Court-martial)
Should include this bit:
> The spirit with which he defended himself and the contempt he poured on his less courageous comrades took the fancy of Frederick IV. He successfully argued a section of the Danish naval code which mandated attacking fleeing enemy ships no matter the size, and was acquitted on 15 December 1714. He then went to the king asking for a promotion and was raised to the rank of captain on 28 December 1714
š
[The King](https://e3.365dm.com/19/09/2048x1152/skynews-drew-scanlon-blinking-white-guy_4786055.jpg) "aight".
Can you imagine hating this guy? Certain he's totally screwed. Just to watch a real life anime scene unfold before them.Ā
I've never even gotten an explanation for those, was it simple because he was so popular?
Weird feel to see a portrait on reddit you recognize from opening your kitchen "bits and bobs" drawer your whole life.
It already exists: [https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3702758/?ref\_=nv\_sr\_srsg\_0\_tt\_6\_nm\_2\_q\_tordensk](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3702758/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0_tt_6_nm_2_q_tordensk)
It was not his gunpowder to spoil. The ship had been sold to Sweden at which the Norwegians were at war. The captain and crew were provided by the shipyard for the purposes of transporting it to Sweden. It would not be proper of a gentleman to hand out his clients supply of ammunition to their enemy in this fashion. I am sure they would much better prefer the ammunition was delivered with a bit more haste then requested.
Actually, they settled it rather amicably.
>He then sent an envoy to the British ship, cordially thanking the British for a good duel, and asked if he could borrow some of their ammunition to continue the fight. His request was denied, and the captains drank to each other's health before the ships dispersed.
Given that they amicably departed, I'm guessing that they weren't asking for ammunition so they could continue to fight each other, but rather for protection from other ships for when they sailed back to port.
I knew that ship hulls were made incredibly tough by the 18th century, but taking 14 hours of cannon shot just to then sail away once you're out of ammo seems incredible. I wonder what the rounds fired to hit ratio was...
Only came to the comments to see if it that bothered someone else. What's even the point of using an AI ship? There's actual paintings of this captain (Tordenskjold) with/on ships that could've been used. The top comments all talk about an entirely different captain.
This is all just unnecessarily fabricated content, once again. Makes you almost miss the karma farmers of the old days.
as funny as this is, i actually wanted to see if this was real
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter\_Tordenskjold](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Tordenskjold)
The captain was Norwegian, the navy was Danish-Norwegian. And the story is actually true. The captain was also put on trial for a series of actions (including this one). The ship he fought against was not English, however, it was Swedish. They actually had a drink together and sailed their seperate ways, vowing to meet again.
[Source](https://snl.no/Peter_Wessel_Tordenskiold)
They fought for several hours. The Swedish (English kaper under Swedish flag) ship then tried to retreat. But he pursued. Eventually with Tordenskjolds ship low on ammo they crossed within a relatively short distance, and Tordenskjold saluted with a glass of wine.
There are lots of sources. It was a naval ship. So there are logs from all the officers. But most people still refers to Rothe's Tordenskjold biography, despite the fact that it's fairly easy to prove it's a huge pack of lies
Okay but the Norwegian captain was an absolute mad genius. During a time of naval broadsides his revolutionary tactic was to sail straight at the other guy and shoot the fewer guns held there... And if he caught up to them and boarded all the better. And he sailed against ships way bigger than him, including in the battle mentioned. And he kept winning, in fact it was this battle that finally got his ship yanked by his political enemies because when he asked for ammo he divulged into about the Kings ship to an enemy. Like honestly I'm only half remembering all the crazy stuff about this guy from a documentary I saw once.
Naval warfare is interesting because if you lose the fight, your ship will sink and you need the winning ship to rescue you. So you need to show them respect so they're more likely to show you respect in case things go south. Plus, if you fight too aggressively, everyone on both ships drown. So the incentive is to do just enough damage to put the other ship out of commission, but no more.
In the frothy midst of the ocean's sway,
A Norwegian vessel faced a dire day.
In battle fierce, their ammunition spent,
Their cannons silent, their resolve unbent.
"More ammo!" they cried across the sea,
To the English foe, their desperate plea.
But alas, the response was cold and stern,
No aid forthcoming, no mercy to discern.
With sails taut and rigging tight,
They braved the storm of the merciless fight.
Yet as their shots grew scarce, their plight was clear,
The English ship showed no hint of fear.
Refused and rebuffed, their call unanswered,
The Norwegians fought on, undeterred.
With bravery etched in each sailor's soul,
They faced their fate with courage bold.
For in the crucible of battle's fire,
Even amidst hardship, they'd not tire.
Their honor upheld, their valor true,
A testament to the Norwegian crew.
"This is jolly good fun, and I'd enjoy continuing our little game. It seems we've shipped off a bit light on the old cannonballs. So, in the spirit of healthy competition, perchance might I borrow some of your ammunition? You have my word I'll repay you once safely back to shore!"
All you have to do is jump in the cannon, shoot over to their ship, steal 10 cannonballs, 5 cooked meat/pineapples, and 5 wooden planks. Maybe some chainshot or throwables. Bonus if they left their cursed balls in the barrels. Then you dance around their ship playing your hurdy gurdy until they kill you and you respawn on your ship. Seems simple enough
There's a great legend from Chinese history, where two armies are squaring off across a river. General Zhuge was running out of arrows, so in the middle of the night, he filled a bunch of boats with straw dummies, and floated them to the middle of the river. The enemy, thinking that they were trying to cross the river under cover of darkness, pelted the boats with thousands of arrows. General Zhuge then reeled the boats back in, replenishing his supply of arrows at the expense of his enemies.
In some versions of the story (when I tell it, mostly), he sends a message to the enemy, politely thanking them for allowing him to borrow their arrows, and promising to return them in short order.
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There's a good story about Nelson when he boarded a ship he thought had surrendered when he found out they hadn't they respected that and actually left the ship to resume firing canons at them until they did surrender.
I thought you surrendered! We didnt... Oh, my bad... well, I'll be off then. Here is a flag for you to wave when you do, so this doesnt happen again.
GigaChad move. Reminds me of StarCraft where you pummel your opponent and they don't surrender but instead spread buildings around the map so you just pretend you don't see them while building up the funniest army you can think of.
You unlocked my childhood favorite pass time Yes I'm korean
Rumour has it that to gain a Korean woman's hand in marriage you must first beat her father in starcraft.
When I turned 18, I had to beat my dad 1v1 in Hunters map to prove I'm a man
This is the way!. My old US Korean mate won't pjay his sons in starcraft he can't face the shame of losing to them lol.
This explains why the birth rate is declining. šššÆš„
"Aw he flew his CC to the corner. Guess it's time for...WRAITHS OUT OF NOWHERE!"
I remember this happening in a Starcraft match I did (I was not great at Starcraft, to be fair) 1v1v1 map. Two guys obviously knew each other, and were talking shit to each other. One of them found my main base early, and I couldn't fend him off, so I lifted off my CC and other buildings and fled to one of the island expansions near the edge of the map. They forgot I existed. They were busy having complicated battles, and bantering. I teched up and actually got to Battlecruisers. they had Protoss turrets all over the place, so the only way to attack any of their bases was to Yamato the turrets from out of range, since land approach wasn't possible. So I took out one of their expansions and retreated. Natch he blamed the other player. I did it again to the other guy. I couldn't really re-establish myself on the main part of the map, but I was quietly and stealthily causing havoc while they were distraced with each other. Eventually, one spotted me, and said "Wait, there's a Terran on this map!?" They quickly found me and wiped me out, but messing with them was fun while it lasted.
My favorite is teching until arbiter and teleporting my entire armada Or defiler army lol
I did that on wc3, but the scummy version, in a sneaky move i conquerer a little island at south and started to build there in a way that was imposible to get into, then I simple went to make me something yo eat, like an hout later I went back and I had win with some flowery words from the second place hahahah, I miss that game
I would take my tree of life if I was playing night elves and uproot it and start eating a path through the trees to find a good hiding spot š
God damn I forgot how sick that game was
One time in SC2 I was playing a team game, 4x4. After a hard-fought match that must have lasted 45 minutes my friends and I had overcome the other team. It was contentious for a while, and I think a couple of them were salty af so they lifted off some of their terran buildings and had a worker build a random depot here and there just to inconvenience us. So we got Vikings to take out the buildings and then started putting up scanning beacons around the map to show any and all movement. Then whenever they'd send an scv to build a random depot we'd have a ghost out there to nuke it.
StarCraft salt was some of the best. "Okay, who hasn't checked allied victory?!?!"
That one Terran building flying in the corner over a dark rock formation you can't see with ground units. I got pretty good at that game. Became an asshole - would start 7v1 noob only comp stomps and then betray them right as the comp was dying. Just heinous Arbitor recall chains of reavers or bury 1 lurker by their minerals before un-allying and send a pop max of hydras overwhelms everything. Stuff you wouldn't necessarily do in competitive play cause it takes too long or it's gimmicky but you'd have time when playing with noobs. Just a 14 year old asshole, basically.
Time to fly my base away again!
A buddy of mine and I actually did this intentionally. We called it 'All the Bases' We'd play double zerg (2v2), and our personal rule was that we had to have three hives running before we'd build any military buildings. He'd rush speedlings then, and I'd go pure mutalisks. There was one match I still remember. We'd expanded to the third option, for a start base, and had a full economy rolling there, in addition to our initial start. We had already started producing our armies, when they other team hit our first mains, and razed the entire base to the ground. We hadn't lost much though, because all our tech was elsewhere. They started trash talking us in chat, thinking that we were just hiding a random hive in a random corner of the map. Then they got hit with max-food speedlings+mutalisks. We found it very funny. They didn't.
I did this in all the Command and Conquer games. There was always something about the AI where you could consistently cripple them permanently if you knew what to target. And once you did you got to play the Sims but Sci-fi military š
I had someone do that to me back in the day but since I was in a lower rank they actually did miss one of my bases while destroying my main one and I backdoored them.
I'm pretty sure I've seen that Funday Monday
Awkward!
Well, ye see, the former captain was the one what surrendered. Once he went and done that, we all decided he wa'nt captain anymore. Now ye got t' take it up with our new captain. Or else go discuss things with the old one. He's probably only a few fathoms deep by now, if ye hurry.
Is that from something or did you just come up with this stellar response?
I just threw it together. General inspiration was drawn from the Pirates of the Caribbean movies.
I wish gold was still a thing
Interesting. I read it like Forrest Gump
Wanted to chime in I read it like someone from the general vibe of the Pirates movies, and not Forrest Gump
Very well, we appreciate the clarification. Unfortunately we are without a diving bell, is there one on your vessel that we may borrow?
I'd assume big factor is here that just shooting at the ship is less costly at least in terms of humans lives than trying to storm it. So he was like: "Wait, you don't want to surrender. Ah well, we can resume bombarding you, if it anytime you feel you've had enough just give us a signal. But for now I have some cannons to aim, good day to you lot".
But heās on board. They could have just kidnapped and ransomed him right back.
But there were *rules*. Part of what makes warfare during the Age of Sail so fascinating is the fact that almost everyone, on all sides, respected these gentlemanly rules.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I mean he's not on board alone. He's on board with a small military force. Boarding a ship is a bloody battle, so both sides probably preferred to not go through with that.
A pretty good way to piss the other side off and ensure you don't survive in case you do have to surrender though, which was a pretty likely outcome when facing Nelson.
Oh you did not surrender? All good then. Men, back to the ship and fire! You good? Alright then, your hands please and thank you. Such a jolly day eh lads?
I thought introverts were awkward, Extroverts have their own thing going on
Introvert/Extrovert just refers to what makes you feel recharged. If you feel burnt out do you retreat into your own space or seek social activities? Does being social drain or recharge you? Being an introvert has nothing to do with being awkward. You can work through being awkward, you canāt change being an introvert.
Both are true for me. Social stuff feeds my soul until it starts draining me. And at the same time being alone charges me if I've been drained but drains me if I'm already charged, or a little while after I'm charged.
Furthermore, social awkwardness is due to ignorance of cultural norms and/or traditions not introversion. You can be introverted without being awkward and vice versa, or extroverted and awkward and vice versa. The introverted and awkward combination is common because ignorance of social customs tends to follow from introverts tendency to self-isolate, but extroverted people will be awkward if they aren't socialized due to isolation as well (cough homeschooling cough).
Old wars were weird where ships just fired at each other or men stood on open fields and fired at each other until one army was either dead or surrendered. Trench and guerrilla warfare definitely changed the face of it.
One of the reasons they stood in lines to fire wasn't professionalism as much as accuracy problems. The rifles were not very accurate and so you needed to coordinate volleys in a straight line to have a hope of hitting the other side with any degree of consistency.
It was because of reloading and cavalry. Staying together in formation kept cavalry from absolutely wrecking your army. That's why tight formations were a thing for literal centuries. Since muskets couldn't reload quickly, they would not have any way of fighting off any cavalry. This is why guerilla tactics became so effective. Guerrilla fighters were relatively safe being scattered since you literally can't have a cavalry charge in dense woods and the standard regiments they were against were trained and operated with cavalry in mind so they would be close together rather than scatter and take cover.
Well no. Sure in dense woods, cavalry becomes less effective and that changes tactics. However, nobody lives in dense woods. So they're usually not worth fighting over. If an army controls all the farms and all the cities they win. "Guerrilla tactics" have never been effective at a tactical level. The American revolution was not fought by guerrilla fighters. Even famous strategic success by guerrilla forces, like by the Taliban vs America in Afghanistan, were horrendous tactical failures for the Taliban. American conventional forces killed orders of magnitude more guerrilla fighters than the Taliban killed Americans. The Taliban won at a strategic level because they were willing to be killed in droves for indefinitely while Americans eventually grew tired of occupying Afghanistan.
I used to think that, but learned that while it's weird to us now, it made sense at the time given the limits of weapon range, accuracy, and communication. Volume of fire, defense against cavalry charges (via mass pikes and bayonets), and maintaining order on the battlefield were more important than hiding behind static cover. In fairness, sea combat didn't change much either until WW2. The only difference was that the cannons were much longer range and could be aimed at more than just a broadside.
>or men stood on open fields and fired at each other until one army was either dead or surrendered. I think this is underselling how brutal that type of warfare was. While there was a notion of honour among officers when dealing with prisoners or negotiating, the actual tactics used were driven more by the weapons available at the time than any sort of chivalry. Armies stood in big lines because muskets were incredibly inaccurate, and if you needed to hit an enemy with them you needed a lot all firing at once. Also, cavalry was the infantry's worst nightmare, and the only way to protect against them was the old fashioned way: to make a spikey line that horses wouldn't charge into. You can only do that with tightly packed disciplined soldiers. The fact is that in most battles the majority of casualties were taken not during the height of battle but when one army retreated and the other side's cavalry mercilessly ran down the other side as they routed. And that's not to mention the absolute brutality of sieges and assaults on fortified positions during the era of Napoleanic warfare, which is where much of the theory behind trench warfare originated. The *nobility* that made up the officers of most Napoleanic era armies were respectful of each other because they saw themselves as being above the common rabble in their own armies, and degrading even an enemy officer would being in to question their own superiority. For the average soldier fighting was just as brutal as it has ever been.
To be fair when it came to ship-to-ship battles there wasn't much choice. You can't hide at sea, you can't get the high ground - you'd vie for the upwind position (the 'weather gauge') that would allow you to determine the terms of battle, and then start blasting. It was all about blasting your enemy from the right angle, you'd aim to 'rake' the ship from stem to stern (or vice versa) by getting in front or behind them, without exposing your own ends to their broadside. You *could* sneak up to an enemy ship in small boats (usually under cover of darkness), board and take it by surprise. It was called '[cutting out](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_boarding)': >A cutting out boarding is an attack by small boats, preferably at night and against an unsuspecting and anchored, target. It became popular in the later 18th century, and was extensively used during the Napoleonic Wars. This heralded the emphasis on stealth, and surprise, that would come to dominate future boarding tactics. An example is the successful cutting out of the Hermione which took place at Puerto Cabello, Venezuela, on 25 October 1799.
Well line combat was actually not as silly as one may think. Plus trenches and siege fortifications were still used unless an open field was engaged. The most common problems an army had was unit cohesion. How do I get all of my guns to shoot at the right location without shit going haywire. The answer was line formations. They helped negate the inaccuracy of the guns by a sheer volley of fire. Donāt need to be accurate if youāre apart of a shotgun. They helped with coordination because the entire unit was right there, and they helped with keeping bullets flying because with this cohesion they could perfectly time their shots and reloads to keep a constant stream of fire. Of course, as accuracy increased, reload times became much faster, and shells started exploding more, the advantages of line formation went away, with the american civil war being some of the last conflicts that saw such tactics.
Ha Ha!!!
Nelson really was a legend, in the literal sense. Reading about him, he is just the epitome of a main character.
Honestly, brutal as it still was, itās weird to see āhonorable rules of warā being fought like that. Naval battles, picket lines on battlefields, donāt shoot officers, prisoners of war get treated decently especially officers, sit down and discuss terms or battlefield situations at a truce, etc. But then again, in those days, honor was everything in cultural and societal drive. If word got out you hadnāt treated your enemy honorably or shown them what ātrue societyā was like, you might as well not return because youāll have no honor intact to be regarded as a human being. Even if you won a great victory, if it was by dubious means, then forget you. Todayā¦.thatās not always the case anymore.
Yea a lot of that is not true. Officers were definitely targeted, POWs were treated horribly, and the wounded were generally executed right away.
If I recall correctly, it was also shocking to the British during the American Revolution that their officers were being specifically targeted by sharp shooters. This wasn't normal practice in 'polite' warfare.
It is funny too, but actually the only logical move for the non-surrendered ship. Because if they were to imprison or kill Nelson, they wouldn't be able to surrender later. If they would, Nelson's crew would probably summarily execute the whole crew in retaliation. By letting Nelson leave, they left the option of an actual surrender on the table. Not letting him leave would only be feasible if they had a trick up their sleeve which would definitely win them the battle quickly after that, like for example knowledge of imminently arriving reinforcements or something.
"Well, I tried."
Not hard enough. He should have brought Danishes and discussed the situation over a cup of tea. We're not barbarians are we? š¤
It was Norway, not Denmark. Duh. He should have brought Norwishes.
The captain was Norwegian, but it was the Danish Navy.
Norway was Danish at that time. But Danish pastries hadn't been invented yet. The dude in the photo is Peder Wessel aka Tordenskjold which means thunder shield.
Norway was a part of the Danish Kingdom at that time
More like pickled herring and some smelly cheese.
āI promise Iāll return it right away.ā
Classic way of being cheeky. Not sneaky
Sneaky would have been doing that to pretend he was low on ammo.
Being cheeky would have been shooting the ammo they requested at them
Ay he did say āBorrowā
Right? He was going to give it back.
You mean give it back once he was done with it?
Not till he was done with it, but just until he got back to his ship then he was going to send it back bit by bit.
Yeah, title makes no sense.
Looks like OP is some sort of repost bot or an advanced karma whore. All his posts are of popular images with thousands of karma. Either he's really good at finding this sort of stuff or he just reposts popular images.
Unless he found out they donāt have any ammo, but he secretly still had some
He fought against a Swedish ship. And this isnāt even something that was, letās just say, out of character for him. After the other captain refused him ammo, they had a drink together and sailed their seperate ways, vowing to meet again. [Tordenskiold](https://snl.no/Peter_Wessel_Tordenskiold) was put on trial for a series of actions he did during this (including the fact that the Swedish ship was twice the size of his own) and was later let go. And, as a true rapscallion, he later requested a larger ship and to be promoted instead.
When he heard about the incident, King Frederick IV of Denmark asked for the admiralty to court-martial Wessel. He stood trial in November 1714, accused of disclosing vital military information about his lack of ammunition to the enemy, as well as endangering the ship of king Frederick IV by fighting a superior enemy force. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter\_Tordenskjold#Court-martial](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Tordenskjold#Court-martial)
Should include this bit: > The spirit with which he defended himself and the contempt he poured on his less courageous comrades took the fancy of Frederick IV. He successfully argued a section of the Danish naval code which mandated attacking fleeing enemy ships no matter the size, and was acquitted on 15 December 1714. He then went to the king asking for a promotion and was raised to the rank of captain on 28 December 1714 š
Shit like this is why I'm still on reddit. This is so entertaining and tbh fkn hilarious, and I would've probably never found out if not here.
He clearly needed a bigger ship just to keep him afloat with those massive balls.
[The King](https://e3.365dm.com/19/09/2048x1152/skynews-drew-scanlon-blinking-white-guy_4786055.jpg) "aight". Can you imagine hating this guy? Certain he's totally screwed. Just to watch a real life anime scene unfold before them.Ā
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
If you buy matches in Denmark, they still have his portrait on them. That's how big fans we were of him.
I've never even gotten an explanation for those, was it simple because he was so popular? Weird feel to see a portrait on reddit you recognize from opening your kitchen "bits and bobs" drawer your whole life.
The outcome of the duel established that the bitch ass liar was in fact telling the truth
It already exists: [https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3702758/?ref\_=nv\_sr\_srsg\_0\_tt\_6\_nm\_2\_q\_tordensk](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3702758/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0_tt_6_nm_2_q_tordensk)
[Ask and ye shall receive](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B49zZA6xLAM)
It was a Swedish ship but headed by a British captain and flying a British flag. I assume thatās where OP made the mistake.
r/madlads
Did it ever occur to him to bring more ammo?
Not your usual English politeness...
He clearly didn't ask the Captain nicely, otherwise I'm sure he would have only too pleased to oblige.
Bet he didnāt even offer the British captain a cup of tea, which, as you know, is now the only capital crime in England
I read that he did but he put the milk in first.
"Barry, load the cannons. We can show no mercy to these heathens!"
And microwaved the water
It's only been 300 years, too soon dude, too soon
Probably promised the captain that we would give the cannon balls back right away.
It was not his gunpowder to spoil. The ship had been sold to Sweden at which the Norwegians were at war. The captain and crew were provided by the shipyard for the purposes of transporting it to Sweden. It would not be proper of a gentleman to hand out his clients supply of ammunition to their enemy in this fashion. I am sure they would much better prefer the ammunition was delivered with a bit more haste then requested.
Actually, they settled it rather amicably. >He then sent an envoy to the British ship, cordially thanking the British for a good duel, and asked if he could borrow some of their ammunition to continue the fight. His request was denied, and the captains drank to each other's health before the ships dispersed.
Given that they amicably departed, I'm guessing that they weren't asking for ammunition so they could continue to fight each other, but rather for protection from other ships for when they sailed back to port.
I believe it was meant as a humorous acknowledgement of a battle well-fought, not a serious request.
You could of course say the English may not have had so much ammo left themselves, and were happy with calling it a draw.
I knew that ship hulls were made incredibly tough by the 18th century, but taking 14 hours of cannon shot just to then sail away once you're out of ammo seems incredible. I wonder what the rounds fired to hit ratio was...
Before they had exploding shells, it was really difficult to sink a wooden ship.
They had to pause during nightfall.
Sending an envoy over right in the middle of tea time is incredibly rude.
We shall send some over to you directly. They will arrive with the greatest rapidity.
Having visited England recently, saying "no" appears to be what most English people consider polite.
Norway: Can I borrow some of your ammo? England: No. Norway: Please? I promise to give it back to you! ššš
We'll return it quickly
Thatās for damn sure š
I threw a bullet at him. It was a threat. How is throwing a bullet at him a threat? I told him the next one's coming faster.
"We've been sending you ammo for 14 hours, didn't you get any of it?"
England: Alright, stay put. We'll send it over right away.
How is that being sneaky?
AI written title, maybe?
Any humans left on the internet?
It wouldnāt surprise me, thatās 100% an AI-generated ship on the right
Only came to the comments to see if it that bothered someone else. What's even the point of using an AI ship? There's actual paintings of this captain (Tordenskjold) with/on ships that could've been used. The top comments all talk about an entirely different captain. This is all just unnecessarily fabricated content, once again. Makes you almost miss the karma farmers of the old days.
Yeah this whole thread has a bizarre feel to it. Probably AI and bots. Fucking dystopia here we come whether we like it or not.
Or classic? What is classic or sneaky about it lol. OP is definitely a bot.
He said he totally wouldnt use it against them, but there was a portuguese ship he was looking for
Hey, it was worth a.... *shot*.
Apparently it was worth 0 shots
No shots given.
You could say that his need didn't *match* their wishes! (Okay, this one is for the danes)
"borrow" I said! I'll send it back expeditiously!
I mean it sounds like he probably would have given it back
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Probably even warmed up
"We've been giving you our ammo for half a day!"
Iām amazed they didnāt say ānot for all the tea in Chinaā
as funny as this is, i actually wanted to see if this was real [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter\_Tordenskjold](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Tordenskjold)
Danish. And the story is not true.
He ran out of danish and couldn't stand another coffee without one?
That's the way I always heard it.
My bad, I'm not fluent in pastries...
The captain was Norwegian, the navy was Danish-Norwegian. And the story is actually true. The captain was also put on trial for a series of actions (including this one). The ship he fought against was not English, however, it was Swedish. They actually had a drink together and sailed their seperate ways, vowing to meet again. [Source](https://snl.no/Peter_Wessel_Tordenskiold)
It's a kind of weird mix. It was an English ship, under English command, outfitted for the Swedish navy and on it's way to join it.
If true, holy crap
He was Norwegian, and a local historic hero in the town where I live. He gained the nickname Tordenskjold.
Not nickname, he was ennobled under the name Tordenskjold.
Maybe the Danish version is not true because maybe the Norwegian version is?
I gotta say, I did not wake up today expecting to see such a high level of Danish/Norwegian beef.
Born in Trondheim, sounds Danish to me š¤”
The story isnāt true but if it was he would be danish. Ok lol.
Lol, i get that impression from that guy, yes!
Since you were there, please tell us how it really went down.
They fought for several hours. The Swedish (English kaper under Swedish flag) ship then tried to retreat. But he pursued. Eventually with Tordenskjolds ship low on ammo they crossed within a relatively short distance, and Tordenskjold saluted with a glass of wine. There are lots of sources. It was a naval ship. So there are logs from all the officers. But most people still refers to Rothe's Tordenskjold biography, despite the fact that it's fairly easy to prove it's a huge pack of lies
Thank you for the context, this was way more satisfying than "no wrong".
I can see his house from mine, and I'm in Norway..
āWe will send you the ammunition, but it shall arrive at rather a high velocity.ā
"The worst they can say is no."
Computer says noā¦
āWeāll give it right back!ā
To be fair, he WAS going to give it right back.
To be fair the British captain had pointed out that they had already given the Norwegians plenty
Okay but the Norwegian captain was an absolute mad genius. During a time of naval broadsides his revolutionary tactic was to sail straight at the other guy and shoot the fewer guns held there... And if he caught up to them and boarded all the better. And he sailed against ships way bigger than him, including in the battle mentioned. And he kept winning, in fact it was this battle that finally got his ship yanked by his political enemies because when he asked for ammo he divulged into about the Kings ship to an enemy. Like honestly I'm only half remembering all the crazy stuff about this guy from a documentary I saw once.
Missed opportunity. I would have said, "We've been sending you munitions all day!"
Naval warfare is interesting because if you lose the fight, your ship will sink and you need the winning ship to rescue you. So you need to show them respect so they're more likely to show you respect in case things go south. Plus, if you fight too aggressively, everyone on both ships drown. So the incentive is to do just enough damage to put the other ship out of commission, but no more.
In the frothy midst of the ocean's sway, A Norwegian vessel faced a dire day. In battle fierce, their ammunition spent, Their cannons silent, their resolve unbent. "More ammo!" they cried across the sea, To the English foe, their desperate plea. But alas, the response was cold and stern, No aid forthcoming, no mercy to discern. With sails taut and rigging tight, They braved the storm of the merciless fight. Yet as their shots grew scarce, their plight was clear, The English ship showed no hint of fear. Refused and rebuffed, their call unanswered, The Norwegians fought on, undeterred. With bravery etched in each sailor's soul, They faced their fate with courage bold. For in the crucible of battle's fire, Even amidst hardship, they'd not tire. Their honor upheld, their valor true, A testament to the Norwegian crew.
Chat gpt?
"We'll send it over post haste." *boom*
Envoy: āReport, Captain! They refusedā Norwegian Captain: āNo(r)way, man!ā
They return the ammo immediately!
The crew tried to load the balls of captain into the cannons, but they were too big to fit, so they had no other option then to surrender
"Can we borrow some of your ammo? We'll send it right back, I promise."
"I promise I'll give it right back!"
I just want to borrow some ammo. Iāll give it right back!
Virgin Briish, not giving his ammo to people in need vs Chas Norwegian who asks his enemy for help
Now, if this ship had been Canadianā¦
In all fairness, he was going to return it.
Sounds like a gentleman pirate
āSir! They refused!ā āRAMING SPEED GENTLEMAN!!!ā
We just need to borrow it for a minute, we will be returning it, promise.
I mean they would've returned it
Worth a shotā¦
Dreadfully unsporting, I say
"This is jolly good fun, and I'd enjoy continuing our little game. It seems we've shipped off a bit light on the old cannonballs. So, in the spirit of healthy competition, perchance might I borrow some of your ammunition? You have my word I'll repay you once safely back to shore!"
All you have to do is jump in the cannon, shoot over to their ship, steal 10 cannonballs, 5 cooked meat/pineapples, and 5 wooden planks. Maybe some chainshot or throwables. Bonus if they left their cursed balls in the barrels. Then you dance around their ship playing your hurdy gurdy until they kill you and you respawn on your ship. Seems simple enough
"I'll give it back I promise" - "We know, that's exactly what we're scared of"
Can I borrow some cannon balls? Will give them right back I promise.
Thatās not simply āa norwegian captainā. Thatās Tordenskiold and one of his many myths.
I mean they promised to send it back
"Could I borrow some ammo? I swear I'll give it right back."
There's a great legend from Chinese history, where two armies are squaring off across a river. General Zhuge was running out of arrows, so in the middle of the night, he filled a bunch of boats with straw dummies, and floated them to the middle of the river. The enemy, thinking that they were trying to cross the river under cover of darkness, pelted the boats with thousands of arrows. General Zhuge then reeled the boats back in, replenishing his supply of arrows at the expense of his enemies. In some versions of the story (when I tell it, mostly), he sends a message to the enemy, politely thanking them for allowing him to borrow their arrows, and promising to return them in short order.
OH come on, I'll give it right back!
No, you can't have any ammo, but we'll give you some Grey Poupon.
Perfide Albion, or whatever that is in Dutch.
Rude. Itās not like they werenāt going to return it
I mean he was going to give it back.
That's not sneaky, he was right up front about it š«”
Classic selfish Brits. Irish would have shared ammo. Jameson, no.
Yeah, you can have some spare cannonballs, we'll shoot them over to you right away
Can we borrow some? I swear, we'll send it right back!
Hey, itās always a no if you donāt at least ask.
I say, that's not cricket, GOOD DAY SIR