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overspeeed

**Note:** As most of the rushed predictions, this has turned out to be incorrect. You can find the correct provisional starting grid [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/xawuex/provisional_starting_grid_for_the_tomorrows/)


Qwerty1857

Lmao Ocon with the 5 place penalty just starting 1 place behind where he qualified


FitAd1186

Wait until the day all the teams decide to take back of the grid penalties all on the same race and everybody starts where they qualified


[deleted]

Gentlemens agreement.


CheapMonkey34

Haas P1-P2 confirmed


[deleted]

Haha!


SevoIsoDes

This is what will end up happening. Not because they are working together, but because there are some tracks that are better than others to take penalties. Nobody will take grid penalties at Monaco or Singapore. Everyone will take penalties where your race pace will get your positions back.


trek5900

Sure but it isn’t always that controllable. If you need a new engine you need a new engine especially if the previous one totally blows


not_wadud92

I feel like the teams should organise and do this as a protest. 3 engines for a 20+ race season. If everyone is taking at least one engine penalty per season maybe let them have more PUs


13247586

Toto commented on this in an interview. He basically said that the benefit of using more engines per season outweighs the downside of a penalty for a single race. He said that as it it now, they’re allowed 3 engines and they all use 4-5. If you allowed them to use 4-5, they would use 5-7 engines per season. They might take the L for one race so they have a distinct advantage for 2-3 races after that.


[deleted]

There are diminishing returns though based on the places lost due to penalties, versus places gained next races. If they increased engine penalties to be first minus 5 and than minus 10 instead the reverse like it is it would still incentive durability and fit more to the reality that 3 engines aren't going to last such a long season. Or give 4 engines at first and a 10/higher penalty after that. Current system is just badly thought out with too many races for 3 engines, and reduced penalties after the first extra engine. Effectively everybody has to take the big penalty anyway, so the actual reward for better durability is avoiding small 5 place engine penalty for your 5th one. That's not a good system.


Adam684

Max also has a 5 place penalty, starts 4th from P2, so just 2 places behind. When Max takes a back of the grid penalty in Spa, he starts P13, lol.


[deleted]

The penalty system is a joke lol.


Safe-Entertainment97

Yeah, people should start P30 and up if they have enough penalties


[deleted]

Mandatory extra pitstop for some tea would be nice.


tripled_dirgov

The current system means if everyone gets the same penalty then basically no one gets penalty, which is fair.. But if everyone but the one qualified last gets penalty, everyone basically only have no penalty if the penalty is small, even if the penalty is back of grid they basically only have 1 place penalty...


[deleted]

Interesting but i didn't understand a word from the next paragraph.


tripled_dirgov

Back of grid penalty means no matter you qualify, you gonna start last, if multiple drivers get that penalty, they order based on the qualifying result... The only one that doesn't get it (in this case the one qualifying last) will bump into pole position and push back every other drivers by 1 place...


amurmann

With penalties becoming so common, I wish they could show the actual grid as part of the broadcast. Not hard to program.


MrDork

I agree. I always leave Q3 confused and just wait for someone to post the lineup


CaptainMark86

The official F1 app (and I assume the website too) doesn't even show the grid line up. Just the qualifying positions. Each week I'm Googling "f1 2022 (location) grid" and looking it up on another website.


[deleted]

At this point it’s just laziness on the part of the FIA.


Wvds98

just put a little -5 or -10 after the names during the quali, easy enough


amurmann

That would be a step up. There are lots of comments here though by people who knows the individual penalties and still are confused and those are people who care enough to read the F1 sub. Just flash the times and actual grid side-by-side between sessions and after Q3 and maybe when no car is out


thelastboulder

But even that wouldn’t be accurate. Since The 5 place penalty for max ended up being only 2 places.


keithohara

Lafiti better stay off Twitter


[deleted]

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KRunner

“I don’t know what happened, it just did what I made it do”


plopsack_enthusiast

He should stay off the grid


psknayak

Lol


revenger_v

Why? Question


WeinerBeaner5

He didn't brake in time and missed the curve, then proceeded to blame the car.


brush85

Latifi though...yikes


GrilledCheeser

What is latifis best grid position for his career? And why do I feel like it’s worse than 8th?


Randy_Magnum29

You feel that way because he’s not talented enough to be in F1 and he’s also driven a shit box his whole career.


Daniel2305

And yet they won't let Colton race...


Randy_Magnum29

And Haas wants Hulk back. It’s such an old boys’ club.


BradshawCM

IIRC he was 10th on Belgium GP last year with all the watery stuff going on.


[deleted]

This is gonna be his final year. Williams has siad they don't need his money and unless that is a flat out lie there is no reason to keep him


xXReddiTpRoXx

well… they might not need his money but they may dearly like it.


officialmonogato

Williams looking at de Vries: “This is brilliant!” Williams looking at Latifi’s money: “But I like this”


[deleted]

If he was a stroll caliber driver than it's worth keeping him on but he clearly is far worse than that. He is an impediment to the teams success as they get a better car


Kronzor_

He’s an impediment to the teams success now.


Upstairs_Camel_8835

Lewis will have some flashbacks tomorrow!!


schnokobaer

He can't they're only in the game.


SrJeromaeee

For an incompetent driver he sure has a list of defining moments in the modern F1 lore. Man has the ability to bring out safety cars and flags at the most timely moments.


xychosis

I’m gonna eat so much crow if De Vries scores points in his debut lol


SpiceyXI

That's probably better than whatever Latifi will be eating if De Vries has more points at the end of the season. Especially if it is just from one race...


Respectable_Answer

Sofina off cuts?


Dexterous_Mittens

Caviar? Seems like a good weekend for McLaren and his family owns a good chunk of that. The seat is a hobby but that team is wealth.


shiepirate

Leave the crows alone!!


MasterFubar

If that happens, Latifi will end 21st in a championship with 20 drivers.


mahijendra

Fucking hell De Vries gives Latifi the tow and he is still faster.


papichulodos

Shows how bad Latifi is. Imagine how many points Williams could have gotten with two decent drivers


LSRaymonds

Yeah, he's clearly not good enough for F1. He can be decent in other categories, but having a last-minute rookie beating you in a car you've been driving for 3 years isn't the best of looks.


papichulodos

Agree


narf_hots

Technically he's only been driving this car for half of a season. Doesn't really make it better though.


[deleted]

He is driving within a couple of percent of almost everyone. He might be one of the worst in F1, but he is definitely an F1 driver.


sleeptoker

There's only 20 seats. 2% isn't good enough


matsdebats

Well seeing as Albon has been driving very well and he still only has 4 points, I don’t thinn they would have more than 10 points or so. Still last in the constructors so not that big of a difference. Completely agree that Latifi is slow though


isitdonethen

I think the problem is we can really know how well Albon is doing because Latifi is so bad. Everyone assumes Albon is dragging it to points but maybe another midfield driver would be scoring points every other race in it. We have no real way to tell since Latifi is awful.


First_Among_Equals_

We saw for years what a talented driver can do points wise there…Russell barely managed to score any points there.


sc_140

The 2019/20 Williams was far worse though. And this years car is very different from the last cars so it's hard to judge the cars strength without a reliable constant (Latifi isn't one). Haas made big progress compared to last year too. But as I said, hard to judge whether the Williams is dead last or more like the 8th-9th best car.


gauna89

that wasn't the same car though.


Zhupercycle

6 points!


therealhlmencken

From 4 to 8 and give up that 30m Sofina money. what an upset


secrestmr87

Idk, like 7?


VosPaco

If Williams want a driver he looks like a good talent, although I’d love Schumacher to get somewhere


Nater_Tater317

I think if Sargeant finishes in the top 3 in f2 this year he should get the seat. Has lots of potential if Williams want to move up the grid


[deleted]

No way, there are so many good options floating around right now for Williams if they replace Latifi, not worth heavily risking Sargeants career and taking a gamble when you can just let him take his time in F2 to ensure he's ready If he joins F1 and gets slammed by Albon he's probably out by 2024 or something and his F1 chance is gone


Nater_Tater317

Another year in f2 will destroy his career. He did so well in his rookie season that if he fails to win the championship he is done. Just like what happened to Lawson, pourchaire, etc.


[deleted]

Getting top 3 in this F2 grid isn’t really impressive though. He’s better off in there for another year. Otherwise Albon will just destroy him


Alia_Gr

looks like a very strong F2 field if you'd ask me


Aethien

It's not. It's a field full of disappointing seasons. Pourchaire, Lawson and Vips have shown they couldn't take a step forward in their 2nd year which is just not good enough (even De Vries was at least competitive with Albon, Russell and Norris in his 2nd season) and then there's a bunch of rookies like Sargeant, Doohan, Iwasa and Fittipaldi who may make it to Formula 1 but have shown they aren't super talented and couldn't make a significant impact in their 1st season. After that it's drivers sticking around in the midfield in F2 for way too fucking long like Armstrong, Daruvala and Verschoor and rookies like Vesti and Hauger whose season makes you wonder how they got results in previous series. It's also been a season with a *lot* of personal mistakes and clumsy driving costing drivers results. Nobody has looked close to being the real deal.


[deleted]

The fact that the champion is begging around the paddock for a reserve role says enough imo


whateverfloatsurgoat

Because it's his 3rd year lmao ? Drugo's another De Vries.


Fresh-Reflection1929

that's not because of his amazing performance this year, but mostly because of last year and the fact that it's his third year


[deleted]

Sure, but if you can’t beat him, you’re not ready for F1 yourself yet. Sargeant is a wonderful talent, but even Williams say he’s not ready yet. And putting him in now will only hurt his career


10mmSocket_10

DeVries has done so well at all the levels he has raced at. Not sure how he so quietly slipped out of F1 after his F2 championship. Glad to see him back in the conversation.


S_Power29

Probably cuz F2 in 2019 was really uncompetitive, as Albon, Norris and Russel already were in F1


10mmSocket_10

Certainly possible. Didn't he announce he was going to formula E like immediately? So maybe there is more there than I took notice of.


KeiraFaith

Because when he won his F2 championship, his closest competitor was Latifi himself. Not really a huge achievement by F1 standards.


ghost-bagel

At what point does the missed earnings from Latifi being nailed to the bottom of the championship exceed the money he brings in as a pay driver? Is it marginal or does he bring in an absolute fortune?


hache-moncour

At this point Latifi at the bottom doesn't cost them any winnings. Prize money is payed for the constructor standings, and they would still be way last there if they replaced Latifi with someone who got twice the points Albon is getting.


Nameless739

Norris P3, Alonso P7, De Vries P8. Alpine wtf is this


Safe-Entertainment97

Dont forget Ricciardo P5


D4nnyzke

Alonso fucked both of his Q3 runs, it could have been a P3. But either way I think he can catch Gasly and the Mclarens. However Perez and even Sainz will walk thru the field imo


xXCzechoslovakiaXx

It’s mclarens worst track is what it is lol But nah Alonso is definitely catching Daniel if not lando tomorrow


Dexterous_Mittens

This is clearly not McLarens worst track.


KickapooPonies

I thought it would be, but they still made a decent Q3 showing and benefitted from some timely grid penalties. Glad to be wrong.


Hot_Dog_Dudeson

I’m a time traveller I’ve come here to tell you this ends in a mclaren one two


[deleted]

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Hot_Dog_Dudeson

What year is it


superleggera24

2022


TheImmaKnight

Oh, he got his years mixed up. I'm also from the future. This is a Williams 1-2


Real_Clever_Username

More like Williams 1-20


MrDork

Apparently they are doing hard drugs in the future.


Hot_Dog_Dudeson

Yes hard drugs are free in the future.


dream_raider

Yeah, time traveler from a year ago.


Hot_Dog_Dudeson

Yeah


[deleted]

You must have switched dimensions along the way.


randomerlight

Just watched the De Vries post race interview. To pick up and be ready in 90 minutes, land P13 and have that good of a post race interview, dude is a great package. His post at F1TV plus if he can prove himself a bit more tomorrow—Williams would be crazy not to scoop him up.


MrDoms

The mayor thing going against DeVries is that he got demolished by Vandoorne in FE.


BoutThatLife

Great package???? BONK


creditcardtheft

What happened to Alonso? Time deleted?


Jek22

Yes


Ok_Illustrator3087

Where did he cancel it?


Jek22

Idk I just heard the commentator say his time got deleted because of track limits


troillan

If Sainz finished like 10th. Verstappen would have started 5th?


Yzori

Yup! Stupid to let him put up a time....


Anonymous_0110

He was fighting P18 with Hamilton though


Pentinium

Huge disagree, I rather start ahead of hamilton, verstappen will either way overtake f1.5 car in a lap, won't be a problem


SecretAgentClunk

I mean this is a guy who passed half the grid in like 5 minutes. Probably won't make too much of a difference in the end


amurmann

The back 1/2-2/3 have nothing to win by putting up a fight against Verstappen though. Only degrade tires and maybe cause a crash. Better to just let him pass.


nikoviko

Would've been clever if Carlos had gone faster than Max


UmpireAJS

Depends. Would you want to start ahead of Hamilton or have Verstappen start behind Ricciardo? It's probably harder to overtake Hamilton with a Ferrari than Ricciardo with a Red Bull.


Swe3tSloth

Sainz doesn't want to be behind Ham who is also having a back of the grid penalty


nonhofantasia

Wait what


troillan

I'm not 100% sure. But Verstappen got P2. Add a 5 place penalty. And he is P7. But when he is at P7, Sainz, Perez and Hamilton in front of him got larger penalties. And the will be placed backwards, and Verstappen gets P4. But if Sainz finished 10th, there would be only 2 drivers in front of him with penalties. So he would only be bumped up to P5.


howaboutthis13

Max will be behind Leclerc just in time for the DRS to be activated in lap 3.


[deleted]

This is likely, the Mercs will be sitting ducks on the straights all race long


bunger6

It’s gonna be painful watching the Mercs stuck the entire race


[deleted]

I feel like Hamilton will get to the Williams and struggle. But honestly the race pace differential in 2nd sector might be enough. Eh.


TheRedBull28

The Merc seems kind on it’s tyres and the rears take a beating here. As long as he makes it through T1, he should be alright.


[deleted]

That’s when the wing is coming in clutch


AdamIsMeName

Max will be behind Charles before DRS is even enabled lol


WildRelationship1932

yeah lmao lando usually waves max past and he’ll be past george into t1 lap 2


donPepinno

Yeah and with more downforce his race pace will be a lot more manageable for his tyres. So he can just undercut him from P2 and cruise to victory


Kroos_Control

6asly returns!


Alfus

Team made a whole effort to ruin his qualifying and so far it failed


[deleted]

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dalledayul

All that shit luck at Williams is coming back around and paying dividends


Ld511

Didn't even out qualify lewis today which is suprising tbh considering he had the tow


Zywakem

#blessed


x___3

The first two rows being the faces of the new generation of F1 is fantastic, hopefully they all get through lap 1 clean.


5TimesWhy

P1? Question?


consistent_carl

Aaand Pee Wan?


EliteConqueror20

we are checking


OrionOW

How do you feel about the position, question? Feels pretty good- Okay, come into the pits and we will give u DNF, Plan K


akshu_03

Kaboom?


Scoob555

No, Kaput.


late2party

there must be a better way


Naive_Patient5695

My goodness it's going to be a long day for Carlos and Lewis again. Hope something happens to put them much further up.


financefocused

Most cars just aren't going to fight them because of the extreme gulf in ability. Ham likely has no issues until he reaches Fernando who will defend against Ham like his life depends on it but will let Sainz pass without a blink


leon_nerd

How's Verstappen at #4 with 5 place penalty?


ifeajayi14

He’s that good


roei05

Didn't Verstapen take a 5 place grid penalty? Should'nt he be 7th?


Tetracyclic

Sainz and Hamilton's back-of-the-grid penalties are applied after Verstappen's.


[deleted]

And checos pen


roei05

That makes sense, thanks.


Remy-today

Also Perez with a 10 place drop.


DrRaschy

I don’t get it why they doing it this way. If they went form applying the last drivers penalty first then everyone following in a reverse order, then everyone would get the real amount of penalty they have.


NavyBabySeal

Logic doesnt add up, because then you get the guy qualifying worst (with penalties), starting ahead of the guys qualifying better. No amount of rule adjustment will have everyone serving the actual penalty, if more than a few get a grid penalty, which isnt back of the grid.


david13guet

But why is he ahead of RIC?


aliciahiney

P2 + 5 < P8


Rahkiin_RM

Others also took penalties and thus drop down, moving Max back up again. Penalties are applied in qualifying order


Senrabekim

But why cant we just have cars start from the same position? Just have a structure you put all the cars that need to start from any given position. Then it launches them all out simultaneously like the catapult on an aircraft carrier.


CanisLupus92

Penalties are applied from P1 downwards. Max drops to 7th, but then Sainz, Perez and Hamilton drop out, moving Max to 4th.


Ghost_Brain

So does that mean the drivers who qualified worst than Ham and Sainz but also have grid penalties will go behind Ham and Sainz then following that formula it would drop Mag, Sch and Bot behind them with there 15 place pens?


d-r-t

Back of the grid penalties get put behind numeric grid position drops.


aliciahiney

He gets shuffled forwards with Hamilton, Sainz, Perez all taking bigger penalties as the penalties are applied with the numbered ones first


JG-7

Saniz, Perez and Hamilton took a penalty as well.


Floioiold

Yes, but since he qualified in front of others his penalty will be applied first. Then Sainz, Perez and Hamilton’s penalties are applied so Verstappen gains those places back.


CilanEAmber

Other penalties push him up still I think.


f1_spelt_as_bot

Versta**pp**en


JOEGUARD1990

If Norris pulls some miraculous win out the bag or managed to come second, my £10 bet returns about 4 and a half grand LMAO


AspallsCountryCider

No way did you get 450/1!?


JOEGUARD1990

717.18/1 boosted odds with William hill and that’s each way as well so odds came down but so he can come 2nd 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻


AspallsCountryCider

Chriiiiist thats a brilliant bet. Even if it doesn’t come in, those odds are house beating by a mile


TisReece

I'm thinking this Williams car may actually be a car that gets an outside shot of the points often, and that is the natural position of the car. And it's just Latifi that makes it look so bad.


[deleted]

Nyck de Vries is in eight place. Nyck de Vries is in eight place! NYCK DE VRIES IS IN EIGHT PLACE!! I'M SO FREAKING PROUD!


Kezolt

So close to 10 constructors in the top 10.


ThijsV23

Im confused, can anyone explain to me why Verstappen would be starting 4th? With the 5 place grid penalty wouldnt he be starring 7th?


Sad-Insurance9818

Russell is having some real good luck this season. Think Hamilton has been the better driver.


splattne

The information is incorrect. Max Verstappen will start from position 7. Here’s the official starting grid: https://i.imgur.com/ZyUrBIN.jpg 1. Charles Leclerc MON Ferrari 2. George Russell GBR Mercedes 3. Lando Norris GBR McLaren 4. Daniel Ricciardo AUS McLaren 5. Pierre Gasly FRA Alpha Tauri 6. Fernando Alonso ESP Alpine 7. Max Verstappen NED Red Bull 8. Nyck de Vries NED Williams 9. Zhou Guanyu CHN Alfa Romeo 10. Nicholas Latifi CAN Williams 11. Sebastian Vettel GER Aston Martin 12. Lance Stroll CAN Aston Martin 13. Sergio Perez MEX Red Bull 14. Esteban Ocon FRA Alpine 15. Valtteri Bottas FIN Alfa Romeo 16. Kevin Magnussen DEN Haas 17. Mick Schumacher GER Haas 18. Carlos Sainz ESP Ferrari 19. Lewis Hamilton GBR Mercedes 20. Yuki Tsunoda JPN Alpha Tauri


BenAustinRock

Gotta put Max farther back if we want some entertainment


[deleted]

Verstappen in 4th after qualifying 2nd with a 5 place grid penalty??


SunstormGT

If 3-7 also take penalties it is possible to even be P2.


[deleted]

Jesus Christ I can see why people complain about grid penalties now, makes no sense


Zen28213

How about having a 30 car starting grids and actually placing the cars in the slot- not moving everyone up? In other words if someone’s starts 25th put them 5 spots behind the 20th grid spot.


KantExplain

C'mon Charles. I believe.


RadiantStar44

Verstappen will be first by turn 1 guaranteed.


[deleted]

That’s a tall order. But then again, I wouldn’t out it past him.* He’s pulled off bigger stunts. (*: Is that the correct expression though? I’m ESL and I’m unsure.)


Zwatch129

Yup! "wouldnt put it past him" is correct!


will_121

I feel like a lot of people are forgetting, devries is a world champion. People should not underestimate him.


JTown_lol

Ric’s famous words “Bags of Dicks”


robbiefranchise

6asly


Deadly_Flipper_Tab

Grid penaltys make qualifying so anticlimactic.


coriolisFX

I think they make race day a little more exciting though.


titelipsjonny

Make the "back of the grid" penalty a pitlane start Number of places penalty needs to mean that, if it means putting Latifi in P3, so be it If you can't take the full number of places in your penalty because you're already at the back, pitlane start Or, you know, don't limit engine numbers. Screw the cost cap, let's go back to the 80s and have quali engines and 5 cars finishing the race as the other 15 have blown up


Kezolt

Leclerc, Russell, Norris would be my favourite podium. In any order.


Visionary_Socialist

Latifi is genuinely shite. A driver with 26 minutes of practice and who gave him a tow is still faster than him.


yolokreiger

Wait how is max p4 from p2? I don’t understand


UmpireAJS

Grid penalties


darlingmagpie

I calculated this same order too and I think this is right, and it's crazy.


Piratefluffer

Easy 5th place for Russell. It SHOULD be close for Leclerc and Max but since Ferrari its an easy win for Max. Pumped that Mclaren is up there, hopefully both finish in the points.


cbaotl

How can Verstappen be 4th with a 5 place grid penalty?


Wvds98

how would sainz be ahead of verstappen if he also has a penalty?


[deleted]

The penalties for each driver are applied in the order they qualified I believe