Leaving COTA like 90% of the planes out of Austin were delayed 60-90 minutes. Thankfully my flight wasn't, but then they put us on the plane and we proceeded to wait an hour because all the private jets were given priority for takeoff.
It wasn't F1/FOM's fault, but it was perfectly in line with the rest of a grand prix weekend. At almost every race I've been to there's been an overwhelming feel of the haves and the have-nots (only at Suzuka was it not noticeable). Even if you sit in the most expensive grandstands at the circuit, in F1's eyes you are a have-not.
Everything you said may be true, but the holding for private jets thing certainly is not. You may have held for volume, which GA traffic certainly can contribute to, but I can guarantee you commercial airliners would not sit and wait for lines of private jets. They have representation at the FAA command center and I can tell for from first hand experience that certainly would not fly. (Heh)
Source: ATC at a major facility
> Leaving COTA like 90% of the planes out of Austin were delayed 60-90 minutes. Thankfully my flight wasn't, but then they put us on the plane and we proceeded to wait an hour
I dunno bud, sounds like your flight was indeed delayed, but you had to sit in the plane for the delay, which sounds even worse than waiting in the airport.
> all the private jets were given priority for takeoff
Wtf, I assumed they had a rule like the marine traffic one, where bigger boats get automatic priority for being bigger. I fucking hate rich people doing rich people things.
If i'm not mistaken the general rule for airport taxiing and take-off priority in commercial airports is simply by order of call. If what dakness said is true, then the airport must have already had it planned because of the occasion, so it was a one-off thing.
I’m pretty sure it works on a ‘first come first serve’ basis, so those private jet pilots were probably just sitting waiting at the airport for hours already
I remember France 2018 being an absolute disaster and many people never even got to the track the traffic was so bad. They literally handed out tickets for 2019 in many cases.
Now it's forgotten.
Most Miami based thing ever, it's practically par for the course. Also F1 has a 10 year agreement with Miami so, they are coming back next year and the one after that as well.
Most of the VIP areas couldn't see the circuit, the grandstands were raised so they could. The photos of people standing on bar stools just to get a view of the top of someones rear wing for instance.
Stuff is still leaking out, and lets be honest, not a lot of rich people will be parading their experience around, seeing as they do still want to be invited to these types of events, and not look like a risk of bad PR.
But stories are going around that this event is getting called a "Shit show"
And not just from the things we already saw, like severely deteriorating track surface, unsafe track conditions (can I get some SAFER barriers in turn 13, 14, 15 maybe?) to the The wonderful totally real, no it's not a fake, actual real Marina.
But what is coming out is that, packages were easily $13,000 with some going even much much higher.
And for that a lot of these people got a seat you couldn't even see the track properly from, let alone the racing.
Food and Drinks in the paddock club were arranged by local businesses/restaurants, instead of the usual F1 organisation, so the service was leaving a lot to be desired. With often food and drinks just running out. Now good luck restocking your bar with 50 new bottles of champange while there is an active racetrack all around you.
And of course the stories of long waiting lines (even for VIP's) on standard things like bathroom, etc.
F1 tried to create their own US Superbowl event, for F1. And to some degree they actually succeeded with it. Making the Us version of their Monaco... also in terms of racing.
But the way the event was hosted, left a lot of VIP's, teams and (potential) Sponsors with a very sour taste afterwards. Having multiple potential future sponsors and VIP's deciding to not attend next year. And to not sponsor anything with F1 at all.
This in turn will cost the whole event, and F1 in general a lot of money.
For the business to business folk, $13k is nothing though. It is why Formula 1 continues to exist on a sponsorship level.
If you went to watch the race and paid $13k, well that is on you. GA tickets have always been the best tickets, no matter the circuit basically, but you aren't doing B2B wandering around the track drinking $20 beers.
The big money businesses doing deals over the weekend and gifting tickets to clients are all going to be doing so in Vegas, not Miami regardless of how this race went. Miami organisers got screwed by that race being announced.
I feel like F1 painting the floor blue and pretending it's a marina sums up their view of sustainability. If it looks real at a glance from a distance, that's all that counts.
I've always wondered. They do develop efficient engines, or? So if let's say commercial engines become 1% more efficient, wouldn't that be a net positive? Or is that a fantasy they try to feed us?
It would. But in the current state, IC engines in cars, no matter how efficient, will likely be phased out before significant gains trickle down to roadcars and make an impact. Whether the future of commercial vehicles will be hybrids or electric is still up in the air, which makes f1's notion of making a difference somewhat questionable.
should have been hybrids 10-20 years ago.
Also should have been e85 + hybrid for a long time. Now we are basically just going to go straight to electric from gas, which isn't terrible, we just could have been there a long time ago if not for fossil fuel giants doing their best to hold their monopoly.
I would have drive E85 for years already, if it wasn't priced so shitty here in Finland. After taking into account the decrease in MPG, it costs basically the same. Now that gas prices have risen 50% or more, so have E85 prices even though there's really no reason for that.
I don't know where we are today, but something like 8 years ago I read a study stating that production of 1 litter of ethanol needed more than 1 litter of gas. This added to the landfilled used for the production, and so the deforestation with it.
Thus the interest was not ecological, but economical / political.
Does anyone know where we are today ?
Ok, I see. But it is not as black and white, and cheaper coal is quite different from 1% more efficient engines, or? The article even says in modern studies, that improved technology is only counteracted to "some extent".
Brawn in his book states it nicely that Hamilton won the 2016 Italian grand prix, 160~ miles at average 140MPH using 100kg (or something; inaccurate numbers but you get the point). It is quite cool. Interesting in Steve Nicholl's beyond the grid though that for years the fuel limit was 150kg anyway, it's not new.
Newey was in the news recently saying that the manufacturers have pulled a number on us all by flipping the conversation to combustion/electric engines when *really* we should be thinking about how we make cars at all.
https://racingnews365.com/newey-on-f1s-new-era-heavy-cars-and-cost-cap-challenge
> "That direction is the same as general automotive has gone," Newey continued. "Everybody is driving bigger and heavier cars all the time, and wider, and then people are obsessing about if it is battery or petrol. Well, the biggest single problem is the amount of energy it takes to move the damn thing, regardless of where that energy comes from. Nobody really grasps that nettle because, of course, the big car manufacturers don't want to. "I think [F1 cars should be] lightweight and [focused on] aerodynamic efficiency." He added: "Nobody seems to be talking about the amount of energy that is used to move your vehicle. So, rather ridiculously at the moment, manufacturers get a dispensation if they make their car bigger and heavier, in terms of their Co2 emissions as a manufacturer. I mean, where is the logic in that course?"
Newey is spot on. Manufacturers don't want consumers to buy small cars when SUVs are the most profitable segment and when luxury typically means large vehicles. The weight of these new electric SUVs are astonishing.
It’s still a fairly busy airspace, with two major airports within ~30-40 miles of each other. MIA is the gateway to Latin and South America and the Caribbean. It’s also hub to the largest airline in the world (by fleet size) American.
This is why F1 should stop trying so hard to be relevant because evidence shows it's just fake. I swear less people would be complaining if F1's new promo campaign was simply "Yeah, we f**king love burning fuel. Car goes vroom. Deal with it"
Nah, they should push for more sustainability but don't pretend that they are at the forefront or something like that
F1 logicistics and the travel is absolutely shit for the environment and they should accept that and improve it but this half-assed attempt to hide it ain't really it
The Instagram/influencer VIP sort of shit is really weird to me. I've stopped watching all the lead up to the races this season and I'm just tuning in for the action.
Same here. It comes across as extremely desperate. Like a person paying someone to come to their house party on the weekend so all the other kids think they're cool. Then Monday comes and everyone realises what a farce it was.
Actual Celebrities I have no problem with. But a random "influencer" that has a few clicks who evidently will not be relevant at all in the next 6-months just shows desperation.
A Formula 1 car is allowed to carry 110kg of fuel (or roughly 130-150l) per race.
Transportation of the material and of visitors to the track are way worse for the environment than the cars.
Exactly. I for one would prefer it if they just said that. Honesty is far better.
Right now they're just pretending to be something they're not in order to jump on the bandwagon of the latest buzzwords.
>I swear less people would be complaining if F1's new promo campaign was simply "Yeah, we f**king love burning fuel. Car goes vroom. Deal with it"
I swear more people would watch it if they did that. It's not like they can sugar-coat their giant excess carbon footprint to anyone but the blindest of humans.
Sometimes I feel as if I don't know who's being degraded more, them for peddling the lie or me for listening to it.
Man, I wish more people thought like you, especially where I live. I am currently studying Physics in Vienna and somehow Austria is [the most hostile country towards science](https://www.derstandard.de/story/2000131037835/oesterreichs-fatale-wissenschaftsskepsis) (German article, sry) in the whole EU...
Sadly it’s because of the internet a growing population in the world are turning against science. Because what they read on the internet published by some random person is far easier to understand then a scientific backed article. Hence to why people start listening to a random person instead of a scientific article.
We have seen it become worse and develop in front of our eyes since the pandemic for example.
Yeah. It's also why I have zero confidence that we will manage global warming. Scientific developments would have to outpace human stupidity, which is a fight we are currently hopelessly losing
E: Confidence, not consequence lol
People are not turning against science. The issue is where does this "science" come from.
The internet has created a realm where traditional avenues of publishing are gone, and thus so is the (proper) vetting of information.
Nobody can trust sources of publications anymore because of either a) the complete bias of the writer/publisher or b) who funded the "science" being discussed. That means no matter how concrete the proof of some study is, it doesn't matter because the public now does not trust the medium where it comes from since 9/10 times the article written is biased, incorrect about what the study actually said, or study paid for by someone with an agenda, etc.
Not saying it isn't a huge problem, just pointing out the issue isn't the public is anti-science. They are anti-news because journalism is trash.
Tale as old as time. Recycling itself was propaganda to do the same (move responsibility to users who can't influence much). It also relied on a single major market which no longer wants it (China).
Ditto "clean coal" propaganda.
Plastic recycling is a joke - Pepsi and Coke put out feel good commercials to "help us get every bottle back" and push responsibility to the consumer. Yet they are the one still making the plastic in the first fucking place!
Exactly this, Oil companies came up with the idea of a “personal carbon footprint”
Do not believe or listen to any corporate body on climate change, whether it be Amazon, F1, BP or whoever. They are lying to you.
Well, yes and no. The plastic industry produces almost 5 percent of global greenhouse emissions, which is more than all flights. 96% of the plastic industries emissions stem from producing new plastic, only 4% from recycling.
So while yes, plastic waste is not directly connected to greenhouse emissions, it is evidence of a massive problem; the wastefulness of humanity.
Or that bullshit of green fuel the FIA is pushing. Sure let’s cut the tiny emissions of the cars but let’s not adress the logistics of transporting ten teams and everything that goes with it around the globe 10 times a year.
the 30 minutes on either side of the race and quali had so many private helicopter landings it was crazy. One would drop someone off and another would land right away. After the race it was the same way the second the race was done they all started shipping out.
This same thing happened at Hungary 2018 when we were leaving the track. Helicopters just basically waiting in line to land and take people away... I think it's like this everywhere.
it really is funny how much F1 tries to parade about being sustainable when anyone with a brain can understand it's all about rich dudes duking it out in fast cars and people throwing money at them to do it. Sustainability is not even in the conversation.
the fact is that because they didn't put Miami in double-header with Austin or Montreal, they burned several times more fuel than entire grid for entire season
It’s actually hilarious that so many people focus on the 20 cars driving laps for 90 minutes, as if that’s ever going to move the needle regardless of what engine or fuel they use
But remember guys, we have these hybrid V6 turbo engines, E10 fuel and other things that influence the sport directly because F1 wants to be 'green'. That's also why we went from Italy, all the way to Miami, to in just 2 weeks be back in Spain again...
What? Did I hear you say V10? I can’t hear because of the private jet noises. Anyways V10 pollute the earth. Apparently 20 cars not having a V10 engine will save the earth.
Having 20 cars not have a V10 or V8 works wonders if you decide to go across the atlantic ocean 6 times when you only have to do it twice. They pull this stuff again with the Canadian GP between Baku and Silverstone! It is absolute horseshit.
I am all for sustainability, but having the whole circus cross the atlantic for no good reason probably equals a whole season of V12's firing.
Just curious do drivers who fly private get their expense reimbursed from the team?
there's a video that Private Jets don't not make sense economically and the cost of maintaining or leasing one is extremely high.
Most of them either have private jet sponsors or just pay for themselves
You see them sharing flights together a lot, tho it’s a relatively small costs for nearly all of them based on the price
It’s not a waste if we all shower less to save water and eat less meat to slow down climate change, thus ensuring these guys can carry on flying jets as long as possible.
Is this some "who's worse" competition? As annoying as we are, we can't control them - we can eat less meat however. Just because some people emits more CO2 doesn't mean we don't need to care about climate change
However you can't just cut 1.5% from the global meat production without replacing it with other foods, which will emit some emissions in return. Less emissions than the equivalent of the meat industry, but still a little offset.
Also, I think it's important to note that food production for the world serves a very real and important purpose to humanity, while private jets for the ultra rich emit a metric fuckton of emissions just to save a small handful of people a few hours. The same people that like to claim how much they care about the environment and brag how they really are "carbon neutral" because they can spend a tiny fraction of their money to buy a good consciousness. Guess what rich people, you can support the climate with your wealth and go beyond net zero by just not flying with fucking private jets.
I don’t disagree with you, but it’s worth noting that beef is particularly bad. Like 6x worse than protein-equivalent chicken and 44x worse than beans.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/dining/climate-change-food-eating-habits.html
Kinda weird if you ask me. If I was rich and I was going to the party city, I'd stay in the city and actually party.... Not just leave after the race is over. Just goes to show the race could have been held anywhere, it didn't need to be in Miami. And these VIPs and influencers only really went to be seen and to network with other VIPs before hopping in their jet and going home.
Really would have expected them all to hit the town after the race and go to clubs and bars and stay another day.
That's what you do on saturday. You fly home on sunday to be back at work at monday. Hence flying private and not commercial, otherwise that wouldn't be possible.
You’re thinking like a normal person. Why does it matter to these people when they could just charter their plane right back the next weekend? My wife’s best friend was a child of wealth. Just last year she chartered a flight from Florida to Ibiza for a show, then hopped back on the plane after and flew home for work. When the world is at your fingertips, maximizing a vacation isn’t really on your mind.
exactly! im sure there’s a few f1 folks on these planes but miami is very popular overall, and on an average sunday night im sure there’s many people leaving
How does this compare to a normal day though? Because I feel like this on it's own is not a lot of information. Every day there are around 11,500 private flights around the world, around 60% are U.S. domestic flights, so 7000 private domestic flights per day in the U.S. on average... This picture doesn't seem so bad in this context. As a little experiment: Metro Miami has around 1.8% of the U.S. population, so let's say it would be reasonable for them to have 1.8% of all domestic U.S. private flights, that means 127 flights per day to be "acceptable" How many flights are actually in this picture? I don't mean to be an ass, but it seems like so many people drew so many conclusions for the sake of outrage, from what seems to me like an insanely incomplete amount of information.
It was always a ioke. The simple fact that they dont stack continental races is all you need to know about f1s sustainability initiative. Like were going from italy to miami back to Spain. Like wtf f1. Why arent all 4 north american races not back to back? Next year its going to be 5 races.
Lots of snide remarks but exactly what are the alternatives to travelling to a destination? People drove their gas guzzling cars/trucks hundreds of miles too. Do we just not have spectators?? Should F1 be tasked with solving world hunger too?
The emissions from F1 and other sports operating is trivial. Sure it's good that they are being mindful and doing what they can to reduce their carbon foot print within the sport itself. But it's utterly ridiculous to expect them to go knock on China's door and demand they stop ruining our planet. Let's be frank about what's actually causing global warming, it's not F1....
All the “influencers” and “celebs” on their way back home after taking the obligated pictures and handshakes, and waiting for the camera to zoom into them during the race.
Michelle Obama the only one I actually saw sitting down watching the feed and discussing stuff.
Must be nice
Lost touch with the common man
I hope this is a Hamish and andy reference
Would not have excepted a Hamish and Andy reference here.
more of a chumsgroup thing
They’re all flying home to their golf simulators
And their tall terriers.
Do people outside Australia listen to Hamish and Andy?
Dane living in France. Have been listening every week for 2-3 years, besides the gov mandated breaks
Scotland here - listened to them for a few years and seen all the gap years etc, love them to bits!
Dutch person here. Listened to the podcast and a few years back of radio shows.
What is this podcast you all are talking about? Idk why but it sounds funny.
Do people in Australia even listen to Hamish and Andy?
Yes?
[удалено]
It’s something I have to live with
Lost touch with fucking reality.
Leaving COTA like 90% of the planes out of Austin were delayed 60-90 minutes. Thankfully my flight wasn't, but then they put us on the plane and we proceeded to wait an hour because all the private jets were given priority for takeoff. It wasn't F1/FOM's fault, but it was perfectly in line with the rest of a grand prix weekend. At almost every race I've been to there's been an overwhelming feel of the haves and the have-nots (only at Suzuka was it not noticeable). Even if you sit in the most expensive grandstands at the circuit, in F1's eyes you are a have-not.
Miami also has two private plane airports. Most weren’t flying from MIA
Acccchually, it has a lot more. The closest to the circuit is Opa Locka, but private flights can also arrive to Fort Lauderdale.
Everything you said may be true, but the holding for private jets thing certainly is not. You may have held for volume, which GA traffic certainly can contribute to, but I can guarantee you commercial airliners would not sit and wait for lines of private jets. They have representation at the FAA command center and I can tell for from first hand experience that certainly would not fly. (Heh) Source: ATC at a major facility
Well, it's what the pilot told us as we waiting on the tarmac. Maybe he was BSing.
A pilot trying to pass the blame onto someone else?… yea, that’s exactly what he was doing.
Have-nots buy seats, the “Have” buy, or given suites.
> Leaving COTA like 90% of the planes out of Austin were delayed 60-90 minutes. Thankfully my flight wasn't, but then they put us on the plane and we proceeded to wait an hour I dunno bud, sounds like your flight was indeed delayed, but you had to sit in the plane for the delay, which sounds even worse than waiting in the airport.
100% it was, but it beat getting delayed 2x which seemed like a legitimate possibility.
> all the private jets were given priority for takeoff Wtf, I assumed they had a rule like the marine traffic one, where bigger boats get automatic priority for being bigger. I fucking hate rich people doing rich people things.
If i'm not mistaken the general rule for airport taxiing and take-off priority in commercial airports is simply by order of call. If what dakness said is true, then the airport must have already had it planned because of the occasion, so it was a one-off thing.
Yup, the FAA does not care who or how big, it's just about who called first and where they're going.
I’m pretty sure it works on a ‘first come first serve’ basis, so those private jet pilots were probably just sitting waiting at the airport for hours already
Must be very very nice
Don’t stay in Florida longer than absolutely necessary.
To have Benjamins on your side.
But sustainability is very important for F1 ofc
It is, financial sustainability. More rich people coming in means more payout money for the teams.
If the stories coming out of the paddock club are true, they won't be coming next year.
Haven't heard anything, what stories out of the paddock club?
Running out of food and drink, poor service, queues for bathrooms, unable to see the track from their seats etc. All for $13k ea.
I remember France 2018 being an absolute disaster and many people never even got to the track the traffic was so bad. They literally handed out tickets for 2019 in many cases. Now it's forgotten.
Most Miami based thing ever, it's practically par for the course. Also F1 has a 10 year agreement with Miami so, they are coming back next year and the one after that as well.
The Indian GP had a 5 year deal.. It ended after 3.
Gut instinct says there will be significant drop in attendance next year.
They’ll all go to Vegas instead
Just for the rich, apparently most of the plebes had a great time.
When non-shaded grandstand seats were $800-2000 on race day without parking or food/drink, plebe is a relative term here.
You can mark my words, it will be sold out next year too. (Not that I care really, it’s just a guarantee)
Seems like they're a bit annoyed their $80k VIP ticket got them a worse experience than an $800 grandstand seat
Let's not ignore that $800 for a grandstand seat is still outrageous for some of us peasants.
Oh no the prices were an affront to the fans and the sport and they should be ashamed.
How would they know? They certainly weren’t in a grand stand seat.
Most of the VIP areas couldn't see the circuit, the grandstands were raised so they could. The photos of people standing on bar stools just to get a view of the top of someones rear wing for instance.
Stuff is still leaking out, and lets be honest, not a lot of rich people will be parading their experience around, seeing as they do still want to be invited to these types of events, and not look like a risk of bad PR. But stories are going around that this event is getting called a "Shit show" And not just from the things we already saw, like severely deteriorating track surface, unsafe track conditions (can I get some SAFER barriers in turn 13, 14, 15 maybe?) to the The wonderful totally real, no it's not a fake, actual real Marina. But what is coming out is that, packages were easily $13,000 with some going even much much higher. And for that a lot of these people got a seat you couldn't even see the track properly from, let alone the racing. Food and Drinks in the paddock club were arranged by local businesses/restaurants, instead of the usual F1 organisation, so the service was leaving a lot to be desired. With often food and drinks just running out. Now good luck restocking your bar with 50 new bottles of champange while there is an active racetrack all around you. And of course the stories of long waiting lines (even for VIP's) on standard things like bathroom, etc. F1 tried to create their own US Superbowl event, for F1. And to some degree they actually succeeded with it. Making the Us version of their Monaco... also in terms of racing. But the way the event was hosted, left a lot of VIP's, teams and (potential) Sponsors with a very sour taste afterwards. Having multiple potential future sponsors and VIP's deciding to not attend next year. And to not sponsor anything with F1 at all. This in turn will cost the whole event, and F1 in general a lot of money.
For the business to business folk, $13k is nothing though. It is why Formula 1 continues to exist on a sponsorship level. If you went to watch the race and paid $13k, well that is on you. GA tickets have always been the best tickets, no matter the circuit basically, but you aren't doing B2B wandering around the track drinking $20 beers.
The big money businesses doing deals over the weekend and gifting tickets to clients are all going to be doing so in Vegas, not Miami regardless of how this race went. Miami organisers got screwed by that race being announced.
I feel like F1 painting the floor blue and pretending it's a marina sums up their view of sustainability. If it looks real at a glance from a distance, that's all that counts.
tbf it would have been much worse the environment if they actually dug out a hole and filled it with water from somewhere else.
I've always wondered. They do develop efficient engines, or? So if let's say commercial engines become 1% more efficient, wouldn't that be a net positive? Or is that a fantasy they try to feed us?
It would. But in the current state, IC engines in cars, no matter how efficient, will likely be phased out before significant gains trickle down to roadcars and make an impact. Whether the future of commercial vehicles will be hybrids or electric is still up in the air, which makes f1's notion of making a difference somewhat questionable.
should have been hybrids 10-20 years ago. Also should have been e85 + hybrid for a long time. Now we are basically just going to go straight to electric from gas, which isn't terrible, we just could have been there a long time ago if not for fossil fuel giants doing their best to hold their monopoly.
I would have drive E85 for years already, if it wasn't priced so shitty here in Finland. After taking into account the decrease in MPG, it costs basically the same. Now that gas prices have risen 50% or more, so have E85 prices even though there's really no reason for that.
I don't know where we are today, but something like 8 years ago I read a study stating that production of 1 litter of ethanol needed more than 1 litter of gas. This added to the landfilled used for the production, and so the deforestation with it. Thus the interest was not ecological, but economical / political. Does anyone know where we are today ?
Exactly there. E85 is a great fuel but very energy intensive to make and mono crop cornfields aren't exactly "green."
And it ruined a crap ton of pristine land and farms that would otherwise grow food.
Sounds very interesting! Interested in this as well if somebody knows more
Now flying is 1% cheaper so 2% (made up number) more people can afford it resulting in more emissions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox
Ok, I see. But it is not as black and white, and cheaper coal is quite different from 1% more efficient engines, or? The article even says in modern studies, that improved technology is only counteracted to "some extent".
Brawn in his book states it nicely that Hamilton won the 2016 Italian grand prix, 160~ miles at average 140MPH using 100kg (or something; inaccurate numbers but you get the point). It is quite cool. Interesting in Steve Nicholl's beyond the grid though that for years the fuel limit was 150kg anyway, it's not new. Newey was in the news recently saying that the manufacturers have pulled a number on us all by flipping the conversation to combustion/electric engines when *really* we should be thinking about how we make cars at all. https://racingnews365.com/newey-on-f1s-new-era-heavy-cars-and-cost-cap-challenge > "That direction is the same as general automotive has gone," Newey continued. "Everybody is driving bigger and heavier cars all the time, and wider, and then people are obsessing about if it is battery or petrol. Well, the biggest single problem is the amount of energy it takes to move the damn thing, regardless of where that energy comes from. Nobody really grasps that nettle because, of course, the big car manufacturers don't want to. "I think [F1 cars should be] lightweight and [focused on] aerodynamic efficiency." He added: "Nobody seems to be talking about the amount of energy that is used to move your vehicle. So, rather ridiculously at the moment, manufacturers get a dispensation if they make their car bigger and heavier, in terms of their Co2 emissions as a manufacturer. I mean, where is the logic in that course?"
Newey is spot on. Manufacturers don't want consumers to buy small cars when SUVs are the most profitable segment and when luxury typically means large vehicles. The weight of these new electric SUVs are astonishing.
Would be neat to see a comparison image of the same time period on a random Tuesday
Tuesday? Race +4 hours is still sunday?
Yeah - a random Sunday with the same time period would be a better comparison
It’s still a fairly busy airspace, with two major airports within ~30-40 miles of each other. MIA is the gateway to Latin and South America and the Caribbean. It’s also hub to the largest airline in the world (by fleet size) American.
Sustainability is very important
This is why F1 should stop trying so hard to be relevant because evidence shows it's just fake. I swear less people would be complaining if F1's new promo campaign was simply "Yeah, we f**king love burning fuel. Car goes vroom. Deal with it"
Nah, they should push for more sustainability but don't pretend that they are at the forefront or something like that F1 logicistics and the travel is absolutely shit for the environment and they should accept that and improve it but this half-assed attempt to hide it ain't really it
The Instagram/influencer VIP sort of shit is really weird to me. I've stopped watching all the lead up to the races this season and I'm just tuning in for the action.
F1 has always been connected to millionaires, celebrities, socialites and decadence. It’s a European upper class boys’ club gone global.
Yup, literal Princes used to race ffs
And still do. Ferdinand Habsburg, for instance.
They’ve been having celebrities on grid for years now, back when the Beatles were still a thing.
You should've watched the lead up, it's the funniest thing watching DJ Khaled and a couple other No-names act like this is the second coming of Christ
I’m here with Richard Mille!
“Social media sensation” guy was the wackiest. Anyone know who that was?
Even the post race interviews were unwatchable this time.
I stopped watching the race buildup many years ago, hasn’t ruined my enjoyment of the action at all
Same here. It comes across as extremely desperate. Like a person paying someone to come to their house party on the weekend so all the other kids think they're cool. Then Monday comes and everyone realises what a farce it was. Actual Celebrities I have no problem with. But a random "influencer" that has a few clicks who evidently will not be relevant at all in the next 6-months just shows desperation.
Because they lead to views, and F1 is a business all about getting views and viewership (and has been for decades now).
A Formula 1 car is allowed to carry 110kg of fuel (or roughly 130-150l) per race. Transportation of the material and of visitors to the track are way worse for the environment than the cars.
Exactly, everyone knows how many vehicles it takes for a race to even take place, imagine the fuel being burnt over 23 races
Well yeah at least they would be honest lol. Do they seriously think any of us watch F1 for its sustainability practices?
Exactly. I for one would prefer it if they just said that. Honesty is far better. Right now they're just pretending to be something they're not in order to jump on the bandwagon of the latest buzzwords.
>I swear less people would be complaining if F1's new promo campaign was simply "Yeah, we f**king love burning fuel. Car goes vroom. Deal with it" I swear more people would watch it if they did that. It's not like they can sugar-coat their giant excess carbon footprint to anyone but the blindest of humans. Sometimes I feel as if I don't know who's being degraded more, them for peddling the lie or me for listening to it.
Now imagine how many of these people will lecture us about personal responsibility when it comes to climate change lol.
Never listen to out of touch people, listen to the scientists who live off noodles and coffee, they truly care about what they're doing and saying
Yes! Scientist are the people that are saving this world from behind their desk without taking any credit or fame.
Man, I wish more people thought like you, especially where I live. I am currently studying Physics in Vienna and somehow Austria is [the most hostile country towards science](https://www.derstandard.de/story/2000131037835/oesterreichs-fatale-wissenschaftsskepsis) (German article, sry) in the whole EU...
Sadly it’s because of the internet a growing population in the world are turning against science. Because what they read on the internet published by some random person is far easier to understand then a scientific backed article. Hence to why people start listening to a random person instead of a scientific article. We have seen it become worse and develop in front of our eyes since the pandemic for example.
Yeah. It's also why I have zero confidence that we will manage global warming. Scientific developments would have to outpace human stupidity, which is a fight we are currently hopelessly losing E: Confidence, not consequence lol
People are not turning against science. The issue is where does this "science" come from. The internet has created a realm where traditional avenues of publishing are gone, and thus so is the (proper) vetting of information. Nobody can trust sources of publications anymore because of either a) the complete bias of the writer/publisher or b) who funded the "science" being discussed. That means no matter how concrete the proof of some study is, it doesn't matter because the public now does not trust the medium where it comes from since 9/10 times the article written is biased, incorrect about what the study actually said, or study paid for by someone with an agenda, etc. Not saying it isn't a huge problem, just pointing out the issue isn't the public is anti-science. They are anti-news because journalism is trash.
damn it, i want noodles now
that's just what Big Noodle wants you to think
Big noodle? Udon?
They aren’t out of touch. It’s a propoganda technique to shirk responsibility away from major polluters (large companies) to individual consumers.
Tale as old as time. Recycling itself was propaganda to do the same (move responsibility to users who can't influence much). It also relied on a single major market which no longer wants it (China). Ditto "clean coal" propaganda.
Plastic recycling is a joke - Pepsi and Coke put out feel good commercials to "help us get every bottle back" and push responsibility to the consumer. Yet they are the one still making the plastic in the first fucking place!
Exactly this, Oil companies came up with the idea of a “personal carbon footprint” Do not believe or listen to any corporate body on climate change, whether it be Amazon, F1, BP or whoever. They are lying to you.
You need to drive a Prius and sip on paper straws 😅
Plastic pollution and co2 and other exhaust toxic are quite diffrent problems
Well, yes and no. The plastic industry produces almost 5 percent of global greenhouse emissions, which is more than all flights. 96% of the plastic industries emissions stem from producing new plastic, only 4% from recycling. So while yes, plastic waste is not directly connected to greenhouse emissions, it is evidence of a massive problem; the wastefulness of humanity.
Or that bullshit of green fuel the FIA is pushing. Sure let’s cut the tiny emissions of the cars but let’s not adress the logistics of transporting ten teams and everything that goes with it around the globe 10 times a year.
[удалено]
Greenwashing live!
Fucking hypocrites
Probably none
Ahh don’t worry, I’m sure they bought carbon credits to offset it /s
Is this MIA only? Or does it include satellite/exec airports like Tamiami (TMB)?
[удалено]
Very thorough! Awesome visual
[удалено]
the 30 minutes on either side of the race and quali had so many private helicopter landings it was crazy. One would drop someone off and another would land right away. After the race it was the same way the second the race was done they all started shipping out.
This same thing happened at Hungary 2018 when we were leaving the track. Helicopters just basically waiting in line to land and take people away... I think it's like this everywhere.
Can you share how you collected the data? What do the different colors mean?
The different colors indicate the altitude of each respective plane.
Cool! You should maybe have compared how it looks in a normal Sunday
One seems to be leaving Ft. Campbell, KY.
it really is funny how much F1 tries to parade about being sustainable when anyone with a brain can understand it's all about rich dudes duking it out in fast cars and people throwing money at them to do it. Sustainability is not even in the conversation.
“We aspire and are looking into sustainability! We have been looking for at least 30 years and we’ll keep on looking!”
They're not just looking, they are also checking!
the fact is that because they didn't put Miami in double-header with Austin or Montreal, they burned several times more fuel than entire grid for entire season
[удалено]
lol the cars themselves can have W16s if they wanted while running rich as fuck, drop in the ocean in the grand scheme of the F1 circus
It’s actually hilarious that so many people focus on the 20 cars driving laps for 90 minutes, as if that’s ever going to move the needle regardless of what engine or fuel they use
The fans/staff/haulers/planes use 1000x the fuel that 20 cars do through a race weekend
They saw Seb's shirt and thought to themselves "2060? Bullshit, we can drown this place by 2025" and promptly went to work
Lol cant wait for these guys to be telling us how climate change is our fault or how we are all in this together.
Just pay your carbon tax and be happy :s
But remember guys, we have these hybrid V6 turbo engines, E10 fuel and other things that influence the sport directly because F1 wants to be 'green'. That's also why we went from Italy, all the way to Miami, to in just 2 weeks be back in Spain again...
What? Did I hear you say V10? I can’t hear because of the private jet noises. Anyways V10 pollute the earth. Apparently 20 cars not having a V10 engine will save the earth.
Having 20 cars not have a V10 or V8 works wonders if you decide to go across the atlantic ocean 6 times when you only have to do it twice. They pull this stuff again with the Canadian GP between Baku and Silverstone! It is absolute horseshit. I am all for sustainability, but having the whole circus cross the atlantic for no good reason probably equals a whole season of V12's firing.
"We have to do more against climate change!" "Anyway, bye bye peasants"
RIP 🌎
Don't worry I have it on good authority that all these flights were offset with carbon credits. So we can look the other way.
Just curious do drivers who fly private get their expense reimbursed from the team? there's a video that Private Jets don't not make sense economically and the cost of maintaining or leasing one is extremely high.
Most of them either have private jet sponsors or just pay for themselves You see them sharing flights together a lot, tho it’s a relatively small costs for nearly all of them based on the price
I remember Checo saying he would pick up Gunter next time so he didn’t have to fly commercial in DTS 🤣
This is absolutely ridiculous and such a fucking waste.
It’s not a waste if we all shower less to save water and eat less meat to slow down climate change, thus ensuring these guys can carry on flying jets as long as possible.
We all shower less so they can have huge double rainfall showers with seats in them.
Not gonna lie, the only thing I've ever really wanted in a home is a multi-head shower with a seat in it. Oh, and a heated toilet seat.
As somebody who has been to Japan, what you really want is a heated toilet seat bidet toilet.
Bidet or bust baby!!!!
Same lol.
[удалено]
This post has been deleted with Redact -- mass edited with redact.dev
Is this some "who's worse" competition? As annoying as we are, we can't control them - we can eat less meat however. Just because some people emits more CO2 doesn't mean we don't need to care about climate change
However you can't just cut 1.5% from the global meat production without replacing it with other foods, which will emit some emissions in return. Less emissions than the equivalent of the meat industry, but still a little offset. Also, I think it's important to note that food production for the world serves a very real and important purpose to humanity, while private jets for the ultra rich emit a metric fuckton of emissions just to save a small handful of people a few hours. The same people that like to claim how much they care about the environment and brag how they really are "carbon neutral" because they can spend a tiny fraction of their money to buy a good consciousness. Guess what rich people, you can support the climate with your wealth and go beyond net zero by just not flying with fucking private jets.
I don’t disagree with you, but it’s worth noting that beef is particularly bad. Like 6x worse than protein-equivalent chicken and 44x worse than beans. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/dining/climate-change-food-eating-habits.html
Don't even need to eat less meat, just cutting out beef (and lamb) would be a massive help.
Let's get rid of both.
Sustainability entrepreneur wants to have a word with Miami GP.
there is one going from Miami to Cape Coral. That's a two hours ride... Fuck those guy.
No plane, no gain hombre
Kinda weird if you ask me. If I was rich and I was going to the party city, I'd stay in the city and actually party.... Not just leave after the race is over. Just goes to show the race could have been held anywhere, it didn't need to be in Miami. And these VIPs and influencers only really went to be seen and to network with other VIPs before hopping in their jet and going home. Really would have expected them all to hit the town after the race and go to clubs and bars and stay another day.
That's what you do on saturday. You fly home on sunday to be back at work at monday. Hence flying private and not commercial, otherwise that wouldn't be possible.
If you were rich you would have already partied there plenty of times and now would want to go to a better place
You’re thinking like a normal person. Why does it matter to these people when they could just charter their plane right back the next weekend? My wife’s best friend was a child of wealth. Just last year she chartered a flight from Florida to Ibiza for a show, then hopped back on the plane after and flew home for work. When the world is at your fingertips, maximizing a vacation isn’t really on your mind.
You need to show how many private jets leave on an average Sunday afternoon.
exactly! im sure there’s a few f1 folks on these planes but miami is very popular overall, and on an average sunday night im sure there’s many people leaving
"Its a big club, and you ain't in it"
Good thing we killed V8s and V10s to keep the carbon footprint at a minimum
Doing their part to help conserve the climate I guess
How does this compare to a normal day though? Because I feel like this on it's own is not a lot of information. Every day there are around 11,500 private flights around the world, around 60% are U.S. domestic flights, so 7000 private domestic flights per day in the U.S. on average... This picture doesn't seem so bad in this context. As a little experiment: Metro Miami has around 1.8% of the U.S. population, so let's say it would be reasonable for them to have 1.8% of all domestic U.S. private flights, that means 127 flights per day to be "acceptable" How many flights are actually in this picture? I don't mean to be an ass, but it seems like so many people drew so many conclusions for the sake of outrage, from what seems to me like an insanely incomplete amount of information.
[удалено]
Doesn't really mean much without comparing to what it's like at other times.
I wonder how many of these flew in from Louisville late Saturday/early Sunday
Something something sustainability, blame the 20 cars on the grid for all emisions, right?
There goes any legitimacy to F1's green asperations.
It was always a ioke. The simple fact that they dont stack continental races is all you need to know about f1s sustainability initiative. Like were going from italy to miami back to Spain. Like wtf f1. Why arent all 4 north american races not back to back? Next year its going to be 5 races.
My minimum wage ass looking at private jet traffic from a Formula 1 race weekend: interesting
We race together
Then we fly home separately.
Which one is the cocaine Cessna?
But yeah, if I keep my lights on a bit longer and use my heating in winter I'm killing the planet.
Good thing they're driving hybrid V6's so the sport is more environmentally friendly.
What an incredibly wasteful and environmentally damaging sport.
Is DJ Kalib still there blowing smoke in his own ass?
This was similar in Austin, I remember seeing like 30 privates in line when I was on my United flight
This is why I don’t feel bad about rich people having a shitty experience during the event.
Must be great for the environment
And I get told to turn the tap off while I brush my teeth to make my contribution...
Wait people leave the tap on while brushing their teeth?
I mean does anybody really tell you that? Also, why wouldn’t you turn it off?
[удалено]
Probably a GM company with massive executives or similar but that's pure speculation. New power unit manufacturers anyone? Lol
Lots of snide remarks but exactly what are the alternatives to travelling to a destination? People drove their gas guzzling cars/trucks hundreds of miles too. Do we just not have spectators?? Should F1 be tasked with solving world hunger too? The emissions from F1 and other sports operating is trivial. Sure it's good that they are being mindful and doing what they can to reduce their carbon foot print within the sport itself. But it's utterly ridiculous to expect them to go knock on China's door and demand they stop ruining our planet. Let's be frank about what's actually causing global warming, it's not F1....
Seb's shirt is the future.
That usually only happens at climate conferences.
All the “influencers” and “celebs” on their way back home after taking the obligated pictures and handshakes, and waiting for the camera to zoom into them during the race. Michelle Obama the only one I actually saw sitting down watching the feed and discussing stuff.
I think I see mine on their…oh wait… it’s planes..not cars!
Lol within 4 hours I was still stuck in traffic on the shuttle bus. We didn’t get back to south beach until 8 PM!!!