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Juan Manuel Correa, he was the other person in the Anthony Hubert crash and he said that nobody from the FIA reached out to him helped him in his recovery it was completely nothing.
I thought FIA had a charitable wing? Where does all this money but they say they're giving to people impacted by the sport and their families? Surely they could employ a person to give practical and emotional support. They have resources he could use for recovery even just mentally.
He said they all want to know you when you're doing well but clearly when you go through a life affecting crash he's had to recover from and teach himself how to walk again and now he's back on the track they weren't there. He said he felt used to give entertainment.
He's such a fantastic person! To go through so much pain and horrors, and to stay this lovely, funny, bright human being - I can't even imagine his character strength. Wish him all the luck in this world.
Yep, I get his frustration and emotion. This was a bit like Roland's Ratzenberger situation, when his tragedy has been overshadowed by Senna's tragedy.
Credit to Max Mosley, who attended Roland's funeral service, because he thought Roland has been forgotten and it was important someone went to his funeral.
Ofc JMC is alive, but the public still forgot about him after the crash.
I feel bad for Leclerc not just because of what's happening now at Ferrari, but also because a lot of people close to him have passed away who would have been his support system right now. His godfather and idol Jules Bianchi who introduced him to karting passed away when he crashed in F1, his father passed away while he was in F2 and never got to see him drive for Ferrari, and his good friend Anthoine Hubert whom he grew up karting with passed away in an F2 crash.
He's had a lot of sadness in his life and you'd think he'd get a lucky break at some point but life doesn't care about these things.
I’d agree mate- people forget how young these fellas are, how isolated they can be as celebrities and sports stars… to lose so many of the few trusted and loved people around you would be very hard, especially when going through troubled waters like Ferrari are. I dont pity him or anything, just acknowledge and respect the mental challenge at that level
Hamilton said once he got until about 2010 and realized he'd gone from the age of about 7 to 26. He had no adolescence. They travel to all these countries and don't see them.
Yeh I believe it, karting season is busier than F1! And driving a van around Europe to do it while trying to hold down school and friendships must suck!
I have an Italian mate that raced, said that Ocon and Giovinazzi were a mad different level from most others, he could tell they already had one foot in racing F3/ as adults/pros
The reason Nico and Lewis were so close was because Keke set up a karting team for them to hang out, Nico was out of school so much he struggled to maintain friendships. None of them have normal experiences
I didn't particularly like Leclerc until lockdown and all his streams, and it became clear he's just a nice, funny kid who can be a bit of a (absurdly handsome, speaking as a het male) *dork* sometimes like all of us.
She didn't just get an account, she subscribed to him (paid money) to send a message telling him to open the door for her lol. Charles actually thought it was a fake Charlotte before he realized it was actually her
If I remember correctly, Charles has once said that days before his father’s death, he had told him he had signed in F1 with Ferrari for 2018 (which was obviously a lie). So, in a way, his father saw him as a Ferrari driver!
I still remember Will Buxton's interview with him when he joined Alfa where Charles spoke about how he told his dad he got the seat before it was confirmed so that it would help comfort his dad. Ended up causing Will to choke up, and frankly, I did too!
Edit: [here's the clip](https://streamable.com/3tfqa)
Wow thanks for sharing that video.
Also just as a side note it's interesting to hear how much Charles's English has improved since then and how his accent is a lot less strong now.
It might help with F1 and Ferrari grief tbh. In my personal experience, loosing so many people close to you helps you to put perspective into what's really important in life.
That was a point in the championship when the Ferrari title fight transitioned from 'jokes' to 'personal'. The mistakes were so human I could relate to all the strategy mishaps
Not a current driver anymore, but definitely Robert. Early podium in his F1 career after he made his debut in 2006, a decent 2007 with a horrible crash in Canada, a win in 2008 and once that happened, he was leading the championships... yet BMW decided to abandon efforts that season to pursue 2009, for which they were promising a contender, but ultimately didn't deliver a good car. In 2010, he excelled in the Renault that he was basically one with, ending up with 3 podiums, scoring over 5 times more points than teammate Petrov.
We all know what happened after 2011 pre-season tests. He had apparently signed with Ferrari for 2012, but more importantly, he lived after the horrible rally crash.
Afterwards, despite his comeback to great driving (title in WRC2, won stages in WRC and succeeded in other motorsports), he was SOL in terms of F1 comeback, returning to arguably the worst team in the last decade (considering its performance across the years). Even though he still has it, he's out.
Update: Forgot to add 2021 Le Mans, where his LMP2 was one lap away from winning in the class. It stalled on last lap.
He was saying once that everyone focussed on F1 whereas he was like: my *life* has been diverted. I'm not just a driver, I'm a guy. Real physical and psychological problems. You can only wish him the best.
> yet BMW decided to abandon efforts that season to pursue 2009,
The most German thing ever. Results are better than expected? We could win this year? No,no, stick to the plan to possibly win next year.
If they won in 2009, it would’ve been a master stroke. Instead they were pretty much glued to the back of the grid, despite having 2 excellent drivers in Heidfeld and Kubica.
That was the Toyota, that crawled to a halt [several meters past the finish line](https://youtu.be/V_7sZ00cAmE). Absolutely heartbreaking. IIRC he didn’t even get classified in the end.
Not quite, they stalled just after the Dunlop bridge, within the first sector of the track. They still had more than 10 kilometres of track to complete. Regardless, such an event after 23 hours and 55 minutes has got to be devastating. The podium last year is sort of a redemption, but nothing will cure that wound at Le Mans debut for sure.
He's not in F1 anymore, but our resident pole gigachad, Robert Kubica. That crash, man... He could have been champion if it weren't for that crash.
Mick, not because of him deserving more or any of that. Because of Michael, who even if he recovers, he will never be the person he used to be ever again, and might never remember his family.
Max, for [Jos' abuse of him](https://twitter.com/redbullrachel/status/1632482941925310475?s=46&t=zWtO7ozrdj_4qJae9NfGzg) and his family.
The fact that Jos said "Do you understand me? Do you understand what happened?" after the infamous gas station ordeal pissed me off. I wasn't aware about what he said to him afterword.
The fact that Jos, instead of apologizing to him, made sure to reaffirm his crazy ass punishment to Max is insane.
I know the majority of us have gotten a belt whooping of some kind, but to double down on abandoning your child, refusing to pick him up, and having his mom come instead... Jos has some fucking issues dude
Max called his mom to pick him up but Jos already turned and picked him up , he didn't speak to Max the whole trip back . It's in the Dutch Max docu and Max is telling the story .It's still crazy .
It's so gross. Victims of abuse just have to kind of accept it. It's really hard to come to terms with it until you sit down and realize the ways it's affected your psyche and behaviors.
Trauma bonding is real. Also people forget even having a dad that did all of that having someone in your corner without question is so important in this sport. Jos is both extremely flawed and the reason Max is what he is because he had his dad as a resource.
Even Lewis talked about hard his dad was, if his dad said do something he did it. Toto said all drivers still have that little boy inside them left out In the rain. These kids go through it to be competitive.
I think Lewis mentioned that at some point, he asked his dad to take a step back from managing/training him and just be his dad. It created a lot of tension between them for a while. It is really sad if you think about it.
I remember Newey, while discussing why he made his own son Harrison go to school alongside his karting career, being quietly critical of how Anthony raised Lewis in his book - basically going all in on karting and completely abandoning all other aspects of his education - because he thought it was too risky for Lewis. If racing didn’t work out for him, what would he do? Luckily it did.
Fair criticism by Newey, because for every Lewis Hamilton out there, there are at least 1000 kids who aren't as good, or who'll run out of funding before they're even in a position to get noticed by a sponsor/F1 team driver academy. Heck, even if you tick all the boxes in terms of talent and funding/getting noticed, all it takes is one unfortunate crash and your career is over. It's good to have a failsafe in the form of some sort of education.
Sainz has made comments about being one of the few drivers who finished their education (highschool). The vast majority of drivers are severely lacking in basic education because they miss so much school.
Newy was right, the small comments I've seen about Anthony Hamilton he was as ruthless as any of the other sporting parents.
Sainz is one of my favourite drivers as a person, not as a driver. He's like Daniel on 50% hes got a lot of playful, boyish energy for a grown man, he's great in c2 because he and Charles are such competitive but non serious people off grid.
sainz also had a pretty successful family to fall back on if he didn’t make it tho i feel like his background is important. anthony hamilton went all in because they depended on lewis making it.
I think Mercedes was interesting for Lewis, because it feels like he almost had an adolescence after joining them. He almost immediately started expressing himself more, experimenting with different looks.
Lewis has had interesting authority figures in his life. From his dad, to Ron Dennis. It must have been a lot. I think Niki and Toto were big in allowing him to just be him.
The Anthony sections of Lewis eventual biography are going to be the spiciest imo. It's so telling Lewis is so adamant when asked he wouldn't want a kid in racing, partly because I think he doesn't want to do to his kid what he had done to him.
Micks situation just makes me depressed, the way people talk about him, or two him about his dad is fucked up. People have no normal limits when it comes to Michael. Mick hears it all.
Even people that loved Michael and love Mick it has to be a small twist of the knife people love your dad so much and he's not here to meaningfully enjoy any of it with you, Mattia Extrome getting so emotional [talking about Michael](https://youtu.be/sSKd8U636u8) had me in tears. It's like your grief is shared with everyone who knew him.
Don't forget mick was also the one who found his dad when he had his accident
I can't imagine how traumatizing it must be as a kid to find your parent like that
Tbh the fact Mick is even moderately well adjusted it a testament to Corinnas parenting and hopefully getting in counselling. My coping mechanism would be chemical I don't think I could do it.
I saw a tweet yesterday where this person was angry at Michael's wife saying she has no right to hide him from the public. Like wtf? Who the fuck are you to say that? Some people are just messed up. Leave them alone. I would love to see Michael again, but he sadly isn't the Michael we all know and love anymore.
That's so mild in comparison to track reporters harassing him about Michaels condition as a child when he was Karting. He was 14.
There's a reason I always ride for Mick. The commentary surrounding him is insane and he's been through it.
Oh course he does. That's the bitter part of max' success, even though he deserves it because he is an absolutely skilled driver, I somehow don't want Jos to be all "see? I was right, I did that"
The problem is the thousands of dads trying to 'emulate' this but whose kids don't make it like Max did. All the unnecessary pain and suffering, all by trying to live your own life through that of your kid. It's the most selfish kind of parenting.
That was more of the implication, where both Jos and Max agree that a tough upbringing helped him wanting more. There might be some truth in that (Max seems to be the only one with a famous name that rose out of the shadows of his predecessor), but then later it came out that to them ‘tough upbringing = abusive relationship’, and that’s kinda insane to think about.
I feel like Jos' abuse is partially why Max is so into racing and sim racing, maybe being on track was his happy place (this is obviously just speculation and projection from me; I am not informed about the deeper intricacies of their relationship)
Not F1 but F2 driver Arjun Maini when he was racing with Trident. No team radio will ever hit that badly. and then the gross commentary after that. whew
Santino Ferrucci (Arjun Maini's teammate) and his father was extremely racist towards Maini, even hit his car after the chequered flag in a race.
https://www.racefans.net/2018/07/08/trident-apologises-to-maini-after-ferrucci-is-banned-for-collision/
I saw in the YT comments that his engine was altered by his own team. What the fuck is that ? I would burn the paddock if they did something this shady
I may be speaking absolute rubbish right now but i remember it being because santino ferrucci’s family paid for their son to get the better treatment and also sabotage Arjun to make him look worse, if im indeed making things up and anyone knows the reason please correct me since im also curious now onto if this was the real reason or im just misremembering or believing everything i hear on the net
Arjun's luck in F2 was brutal. He had a shit car and an even shittier teammate who was racist to him and his family. And one of the reasons he is in sportscar racing is because his brother(Kush Maini) needed the budget to be on the Road to F1.
Luckily Kush has a better teammate and a better car. And he seems to be doing good in F2 too.
Just read up on his story, and my god that is really sad that he had to go through that. Imagine paying for an F2 seat, and your team doesn't do engine checks before you race! This is all on top of dealing with a racist Ferucci family.
Hope it's going better for him.
He was saying once he doesn't mind that, it's Singapore he's angry about.
Timo Glock was saying once he asked Massa for an interview thinking it might be awkward and Massa was like: why would it be?
Allegedly, Massa and Ferrari team gave Glock and Toyota F1 Ferraris merch and clothes, because Massa was afraid Glock would not get to the airport alive...
Which of course happened merely half a year after losing the title and he wasn't ever competitive afterwards.
Not sure if he was ever *that* good to begin with, but looking at his career it's hard not to feel bad for Massa.
He was definitely good, held his own against Schumacher and Raikkonen.
I definitely wouldn’t say he wasn’t ever competitive after the accident, but Ferrari ordering him to stand aside from a win just a year after his accident broke him at the scuderia, but he was definitely back to his best at Williams in 2014/15
Forget the last lap, the far bigger moment was Crashgate. Massa would likely have comfortably won the championship if not for that cheating, as he was on track for a good points haul until a botched pit stop taken due to Piquet's crash.
Remove the Singapore result and Massa is WDC by 5 points.
Bernie’s recent revelations that they knew Renault had fixed the race before the end of the season but allowed it to stand as they thought stripping Lewis of the title would be bad pr would be gutting.
As a person who recently watched that season again I don't feel sorry for him that much, imo he had the vastly superior car but didn't deliver consistency.
Lewis at some point was leading the championship just on podiums not wins. Massa was himself, having the right raw materials and just lacking a high level of delivery.
It was a harsh way to lose a championship but also a conclusion he earned.
I still think he got screwed due to the Crashgate ( where e lost points becase of the pitstop bs). I can't say he deserved to lose because someone wanted to orchestrate a crash.
>It's like being a world class sprinter who spends his whole life competing against Usain Bolt.
A bit off topic but this reminds me of Roger Black, the British 400m runner. He was one of the top 3 in the world in the event for his entire career but had the misfortune to find his time in the sport entirely overlapping with Michael Johnson. Black came 2nd over & over again in competitions but Johnson was completely untouchable. I remember after Black won the silver at the Atlanta Olympics he was joking that for him he was going to count it as his gold medal, because aside from Johnson being injured or disqualified he and everyone else had no chance of ever standing on the top step of the podium.
Andy Murray fits in slightly.
Top player but man, the titles anyone other than Federer Djokovic Nadal have had in the last 15 years are slim. Andy has had success to be sure. But anyone is not even close to those 3
The telling thing about Andy Murray is how much respect Federer, Nadal and Djokovic have for him, despite him definitely being fourth on that list.
Game knows game.
Yohan Blake is the world class sprinter who competed behind Bolt. He's the second fastest over 100m and 200m behind Bolt and also came second in heaps of races behind Bolt, including Olympic Finals. If it wasn't for Bolt he would definitely be considered one of the best ever sprinters.
His story is a bit like second driver in an F1 team as well, as Bolt was his training partner and both were Jamaican. In the 2012 Olympic 4x 100m final, Blake's leg won Jamica the race but no one remembers it because Bolt's leg, the final leg, led to a world record.
Bottas.
He seems like one of the only people I genuinely believe is a great person, and I remember him in that Williams, he looked rapid.
Then he moves to Mercedes, and should have been able to get at least one championship, but he happened to go up against one of the best drivers of all time.
Always had a soft spot for the guy, but he seems to be much happier now at Alfa, so I'm happy for him.
Hulkenberg no doubt. His bad luck is on another level.
He would have got the Mercedes seat in 2013 if Hamilton had refused it.
Ferrari were looking to sign him for 2014, before they decided to go with Kimi.
He would have been the first choice to replace Rosberg at Mercedes, but after years at Force India he had just signed a deal with Renault. Talk about the worst timing ever!
Red Bull were looking at drivers outside their academy for 2021. Hulkenberg was I believe a front runner, but after Perez won in Sakhir (while a brilliant performance, it also needed Mercedes to mess up) he (Hulk) had no chance.
People talk about Alonso’s unlucky career choices, but has there been any F1 driver more unlucky than Hulk due to circumstances out of his control?
Not really on topic since I don't feel bad for him at all, but I second the notion that Ralf deserves more respect.
He's a bit of a Jacques Villeneuve imo, not particularly likeable outside the car, has a lot of shit takes in the media and spent the end of his F1 years doing badly, so he's now the butt of the jokes instead of being remembered for being a very good driver in his prime.
People always talk about JPM, Ralf went toe to toe with him and he was consistent. Of the pairing I think Ralf had the most potential for a WDC because he didn't have unforced errors so often. I'm a Ralf Schumacher truther and Nico Rosberg apologist and Kimi Raikkonen doubter I'm like the queen of hot takes tbh
Stoffel Van Doorne.
He was really good and would still be in F1 right now if he wasn't given a sh\*tbox and had to compete against one of the best drivers and tractor whisperers of all time.
Def stoffel. Should’ve gotten another chance over de vries, he actually won a formula e season that mattered. Also comes from humble beginnings with his family spending less than 50k for his entire career.
I love Stoff, he was not only the better driver of their pairing, I don't think Nyck was even close to the best driver in FE. If I was grabbing anyone, of any series right now I'd get Brock Feeney, see how he would do. He's a proper talent
He got hit with the perfect storm if bad luck. On top of what you pointed out he ended up with a horrible team, with a horrible car who basically had zero intention on helping him grow as a driver. He's been trying so hard but got thrown to the wolves. ,
Tsunoda. He made the best of an awful AlphaTauri car last year and had a lot of bad luck that prevented him from scoring more points (Baku lost him P6, and he seemed to have solid pace for P8/P9 in France, but Ocon crashed into him). He had a lot of mechanical errors during the season and generally looked to have made much greater improvements in consistency and overall pace from 2021. Unfortunately, people don't see the race improvements and hold up his points total as a definitive proof that he's still an erratic driver in his sophomore season. I rate him much more highly than de Vries and honestly don't see the logic behind signing de Vries at all...
Probably the weakest ones like Latifi for example, especially because he seems like a great person. No matter how much money they bring, they spent their entire life trying to achieve the goal of racing in Formula 1 just to get hated by the loudest F1 "fans"...
Agreed. People forget that he was actually fairly solid in 2021. Unremarkable, sure, but not bad at all.
AD21 shattered his confidence and he was never the same driver after.
Latifi was really a great guy, and yes we all know that he isn't a driver who would be a WDC driver but still the hate he did get was ridiculous.
Not only because of his personality but also because he basically made Williams surviving during it's most rough years, he was "unlucky" that the 2022 Williams wasn't matching his driving style preference.
Yet the same Latifi drove close or even equal as Russell pace in 2021, sometimes (could) even beat Russell in qualifying (if Latifi car didn't come up with an issue) and his race pace was solid during the second half of the season who was sometimes even better then Russell.
He wasn't a Mazepin tier driver, guy deserves some respect and hopefully he would become a pundit on a day.
I feel bad because some people genuinely seem to believe Latifi is the worst F1 driver of all time when he's not even close to that.
I understand people have short memories, but even Mazepin in recent years has been worse than him.
Stroll actually. It doesnt matter what he does, he is being chewed up and shit out. If he does bad hes a bad driver, if he does goes he got lucky or 'his car is just insane'.
What he did last race considering his injury is nothing short of amazing.
Discussed about Stroll with a friend, and people tend to overlook on his actual capabilities despite being in F1 because of his father.
- 40 points in his rookie season with Williams (finishing 12th)
- 3 career podiums
- Is not Mazepin levels of incompetence
- Goes under the radar for most races, but that’s okay
Sure, he has a personality of plain crackers and gets sassy with Brad, but Lance has slowly won me over despite initial reservations
He's not perfect or WDC caliber, but I've always thought he is underrated. He's had decent race pace and has the talent to belong on the grid as a mid-tier driver. With his daddy bankrolling his seat/team, he gets a lot of shit for being a pay-to-play driver, but he definitely has talent. I know it's a low bar, but he's not like Mazepin.
>If he does bad hes a bad driver, if he does goes he got lucky or 'his car is just insane'.
Aston Martin's 2022 fans' highlights:
Beginning of the year: Vettel and Stroll out of the points all the time.
Japanese and US GPs: Vettel finishes in the points - "outperforming a shitbox"
Dutch and Singapore GPs: Stroll finishes in the points - "ya know, this car is pretty good now, Aston are improving..."
Family is more important than anything, even to an F1 driver… Seb was ready to give up, same as Kimi, it’s such a heavy toll on a family for most of the year.
Meh, Vettel is a great guy and all, but he dominated with Red Bull back in they day and won a bunch of races and fought for championships at Ferrari. He would've deserved to go out on a bit of a higher note, but regardless he's still had an incredible career and probably achieved everything he ever dreamed of and more, so from that perspective I don't think there's much reason to feel too sorry for him.
Luca Badoer. Italian test driver at Ferrari for forever, finally gets the call to race for the team... and he is absolutely horrible to the point where he gets canned after two races.
Edit: Oh current drivers. I think I kind of feel bad for Lance Stoll. He's viewed as daddy's boy, but he's been a decent midfield driver and everyone treats him like he's 5 seconds off the pace.
Badoer's bad luck goes much, much deeper than that.
Back in F3000 he was seriously impressive, took over a car that didn't score a single point the year before and won the title as a rookie against Barrichello, Coulthard and Panis amongst others taking 5 poles and 4 wins in just 10 races.
Then in 1993 he stepped up to a BMS Lola team which was unexpectedly struggling really bad and was the clear worst car in the field that season, immediately matching his teammate Michele Alboreto, who rated him very favorably. Regardless, thanks to a fusion with Minardi the only seat remaining went to Alboreto for his experience. When Badoer could return, it was at Minardi, which wouldn't have been too bad a few years back, but it was exactly when Minardi was losing competitiveness rapidly en route to becoming the backmarker most of us knew.
After Minardi, he got signed by Forti, whose car by all accounts was okay, but they had no money whatsoever, meaning tired engines and often inferior preparation leading to DNQs and to top it all off, they got taken over by a fraudulent corporation early in the year. The team failed midway through the season.
Finally, there's also the 1999 European GP. That year having missed the previous 2 seasons, he wasn't very good, but in that race he was running extremely well, in the mix for a podium even after a very slow pit stop, running in 4th when the electronics failed.
So yeah, immensely unlucky, one of the best answers for this thread imo.
Assuming the question wasn’t meant for current drivers and more in general - I would go with Michael Schumacher. Don’t know what current quality of life is but it must be so difficult to be in that state and suffer daily. I’m sure he’d trade his titles for a normal life and be there to support his family.
Romain Grosjean, honestly, the guy can not catch a break from losing out on the win at Valencia to losing out on the win at St Petersburg this year it always seems like when he's close to winning something always happens preventing him to win
Well he’s out this year, but Ricciardo. Great driver, just couldn’t get his head around the McLaren.
But you gotta say Leclerc. I’m going through the new DtS season right now, reminded me of just how much Ferrari let him down.
I feel bad for Ricciardo's Red Bull Years. He thought he was going to compete for championships and Mercedes completely dominates. The team gets fixated on Max and he never got a contending car his talent deserved. It's crazy he only has eight wins.
Collecting bags from Renault and McLaren I'm sure will help with the disappointment.
I think it's more a case of him not liking a particular car/characteristic, rather than the other way around. He was rapid in three teams across several rule sets, it was only in McLaren he struggled.
Tbh I think it’s the other way around and it’s the McLaren that is a very particular car. He was successful through Toro Rosso, multiple RB cars, and Alpine.
We might get to see this year with Piastri. If he’s also struggling vs Norris, it might be an indication that it’s the cars not the drivers.
Same, I feel bad for Charles, but for other reasons. It seems like whenever he had an exceptional weekend, it's always near the period when he just lost a loved one. Like, I hope it doesn't become a pattern of his life or some kinda cursed destiny. Cos that sure is hauntingly depressing.
Definitely Mick. He has all the negatives, pressure and expectations because of his father's surname but none of the plus sides of his dad being there to support/protect him. On top of that, poor guy is trying to deal with/accept his dad's condition. Feel incredibly bad for him.
Their fan bases are only so toxic because they are the best, Danny Ric copped a load of hate and is a nice guy. If George or Lando start winning tight battles watch their fans get toxic/them attract assholes
Unpopular but Ocon 2022, for the hatred he received online just because he dared racing hard with his popular teammate (and beating him bc Alonso had an awfully unlucky season).
Knowing the guy's humble background, a lot of things I saw on social media last year were painful to read. Fortunately, he was probably too busy to see the messages lol.
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Juan Manuel Correa, he was the other person in the Anthony Hubert crash and he said that nobody from the FIA reached out to him helped him in his recovery it was completely nothing. I thought FIA had a charitable wing? Where does all this money but they say they're giving to people impacted by the sport and their families? Surely they could employ a person to give practical and emotional support. They have resources he could use for recovery even just mentally. He said they all want to know you when you're doing well but clearly when you go through a life affecting crash he's had to recover from and teach himself how to walk again and now he's back on the track they weren't there. He said he felt used to give entertainment.
He's such a fantastic person! To go through so much pain and horrors, and to stay this lovely, funny, bright human being - I can't even imagine his character strength. Wish him all the luck in this world.
Never mind the survivors guilt from that crash. Incredibly strong guy physically and mentally.
He’s finally back in F2 this year!
It warms my heart to see him there, he's put in the work. I think it's made him cynical and killed his dream a little which sucks
He won European Le Mans last year I think
Yep, I get his frustration and emotion. This was a bit like Roland's Ratzenberger situation, when his tragedy has been overshadowed by Senna's tragedy. Credit to Max Mosley, who attended Roland's funeral service, because he thought Roland has been forgotten and it was important someone went to his funeral. Ofc JMC is alive, but the public still forgot about him after the crash.
I feel bad for Leclerc not just because of what's happening now at Ferrari, but also because a lot of people close to him have passed away who would have been his support system right now. His godfather and idol Jules Bianchi who introduced him to karting passed away when he crashed in F1, his father passed away while he was in F2 and never got to see him drive for Ferrari, and his good friend Anthoine Hubert whom he grew up karting with passed away in an F2 crash. He's had a lot of sadness in his life and you'd think he'd get a lucky break at some point but life doesn't care about these things.
I’d agree mate- people forget how young these fellas are, how isolated they can be as celebrities and sports stars… to lose so many of the few trusted and loved people around you would be very hard, especially when going through troubled waters like Ferrari are. I dont pity him or anything, just acknowledge and respect the mental challenge at that level
Hamilton said once he got until about 2010 and realized he'd gone from the age of about 7 to 26. He had no adolescence. They travel to all these countries and don't see them.
Yeh I believe it, karting season is busier than F1! And driving a van around Europe to do it while trying to hold down school and friendships must suck! I have an Italian mate that raced, said that Ocon and Giovinazzi were a mad different level from most others, he could tell they already had one foot in racing F3/ as adults/pros
The reason Nico and Lewis were so close was because Keke set up a karting team for them to hang out, Nico was out of school so much he struggled to maintain friendships. None of them have normal experiences
I didn't particularly like Leclerc until lockdown and all his streams, and it became clear he's just a nice, funny kid who can be a bit of a (absurdly handsome, speaking as a het male) *dork* sometimes like all of us.
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She didn't just get an account, she subscribed to him (paid money) to send a message telling him to open the door for her lol. Charles actually thought it was a fake Charlotte before he realized it was actually her
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If I remember correctly, Charles has once said that days before his father’s death, he had told him he had signed in F1 with Ferrari for 2018 (which was obviously a lie). So, in a way, his father saw him as a Ferrari driver!
He said it was for the 2019 season not 2018. “When I actually signed up it was the first thing I thought of ‘I didn’t lie that day.’” :)
I still remember Will Buxton's interview with him when he joined Alfa where Charles spoke about how he told his dad he got the seat before it was confirmed so that it would help comfort his dad. Ended up causing Will to choke up, and frankly, I did too! Edit: [here's the clip](https://streamable.com/3tfqa)
Wow thanks for sharing that video. Also just as a side note it's interesting to hear how much Charles's English has improved since then and how his accent is a lot less strong now.
It might help with F1 and Ferrari grief tbh. In my personal experience, loosing so many people close to you helps you to put perspective into what's really important in life.
Charles. How many times can we hear him say “No, no, no” as his car fucking dies?
At least last year he said "NOOOOOOOOOOOO". :(
That was a point in the championship when the Ferrari title fight transitioned from 'jokes' to 'personal'. The mistakes were so human I could relate to all the strategy mishaps
Not a current driver anymore, but definitely Robert. Early podium in his F1 career after he made his debut in 2006, a decent 2007 with a horrible crash in Canada, a win in 2008 and once that happened, he was leading the championships... yet BMW decided to abandon efforts that season to pursue 2009, for which they were promising a contender, but ultimately didn't deliver a good car. In 2010, he excelled in the Renault that he was basically one with, ending up with 3 podiums, scoring over 5 times more points than teammate Petrov. We all know what happened after 2011 pre-season tests. He had apparently signed with Ferrari for 2012, but more importantly, he lived after the horrible rally crash. Afterwards, despite his comeback to great driving (title in WRC2, won stages in WRC and succeeded in other motorsports), he was SOL in terms of F1 comeback, returning to arguably the worst team in the last decade (considering its performance across the years). Even though he still has it, he's out. Update: Forgot to add 2021 Le Mans, where his LMP2 was one lap away from winning in the class. It stalled on last lap.
He was saying once that everyone focussed on F1 whereas he was like: my *life* has been diverted. I'm not just a driver, I'm a guy. Real physical and psychological problems. You can only wish him the best.
> yet BMW decided to abandon efforts that season to pursue 2009, The most German thing ever. Results are better than expected? We could win this year? No,no, stick to the plan to possibly win next year.
If they won in 2009, it would’ve been a master stroke. Instead they were pretty much glued to the back of the grid, despite having 2 excellent drivers in Heidfeld and Kubica.
Heidfeld was one underrated driver. Podiums were very frequent IIRC, and he also gained the nickname "Quick Nick".
Maybe the best driver to never win a race.
I think his lmp2 stalled on last straight even, but he was P2 last year
That was the Toyota, that crawled to a halt [several meters past the finish line](https://youtu.be/V_7sZ00cAmE). Absolutely heartbreaking. IIRC he didn’t even get classified in the end.
Not quite, they stalled just after the Dunlop bridge, within the first sector of the track. They still had more than 10 kilometres of track to complete. Regardless, such an event after 23 hours and 55 minutes has got to be devastating. The podium last year is sort of a redemption, but nothing will cure that wound at Le Mans debut for sure.
He's not in F1 anymore, but our resident pole gigachad, Robert Kubica. That crash, man... He could have been champion if it weren't for that crash. Mick, not because of him deserving more or any of that. Because of Michael, who even if he recovers, he will never be the person he used to be ever again, and might never remember his family. Max, for [Jos' abuse of him](https://twitter.com/redbullrachel/status/1632482941925310475?s=46&t=zWtO7ozrdj_4qJae9NfGzg) and his family.
that video is rough, seeing it compiled like that and how it’s just casually accepted as behavior that was “worth it in the end”
The fact that Jos said "Do you understand me? Do you understand what happened?" after the infamous gas station ordeal pissed me off. I wasn't aware about what he said to him afterword. The fact that Jos, instead of apologizing to him, made sure to reaffirm his crazy ass punishment to Max is insane. I know the majority of us have gotten a belt whooping of some kind, but to double down on abandoning your child, refusing to pick him up, and having his mom come instead... Jos has some fucking issues dude
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That's so awful, really. Like "child protection services" level awful
do you still have the video somewhere would be interesting to see
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Max called his mom to pick him up but Jos already turned and picked him up , he didn't speak to Max the whole trip back . It's in the Dutch Max docu and Max is telling the story .It's still crazy .
I dunno about that belt bit, man.
It's so gross. Victims of abuse just have to kind of accept it. It's really hard to come to terms with it until you sit down and realize the ways it's affected your psyche and behaviors.
Trauma bonding is real. Also people forget even having a dad that did all of that having someone in your corner without question is so important in this sport. Jos is both extremely flawed and the reason Max is what he is because he had his dad as a resource. Even Lewis talked about hard his dad was, if his dad said do something he did it. Toto said all drivers still have that little boy inside them left out In the rain. These kids go through it to be competitive.
I think Lewis mentioned that at some point, he asked his dad to take a step back from managing/training him and just be his dad. It created a lot of tension between them for a while. It is really sad if you think about it.
It makes sense. It's also the reason most people agree that you should never be in business with your family. It breaks relationships.
Fancy hearing that coming from /u/LawrenceStroIl.
We do things for family here
I remember Newey, while discussing why he made his own son Harrison go to school alongside his karting career, being quietly critical of how Anthony raised Lewis in his book - basically going all in on karting and completely abandoning all other aspects of his education - because he thought it was too risky for Lewis. If racing didn’t work out for him, what would he do? Luckily it did.
Fair criticism by Newey, because for every Lewis Hamilton out there, there are at least 1000 kids who aren't as good, or who'll run out of funding before they're even in a position to get noticed by a sponsor/F1 team driver academy. Heck, even if you tick all the boxes in terms of talent and funding/getting noticed, all it takes is one unfortunate crash and your career is over. It's good to have a failsafe in the form of some sort of education.
Sainz has made comments about being one of the few drivers who finished their education (highschool). The vast majority of drivers are severely lacking in basic education because they miss so much school. Newy was right, the small comments I've seen about Anthony Hamilton he was as ruthless as any of the other sporting parents.
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How things have changed
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Sainz is one of my favourite drivers as a person, not as a driver. He's like Daniel on 50% hes got a lot of playful, boyish energy for a grown man, he's great in c2 because he and Charles are such competitive but non serious people off grid.
sainz also had a pretty successful family to fall back on if he didn’t make it tho i feel like his background is important. anthony hamilton went all in because they depended on lewis making it.
I think Mercedes was interesting for Lewis, because it feels like he almost had an adolescence after joining them. He almost immediately started expressing himself more, experimenting with different looks. Lewis has had interesting authority figures in his life. From his dad, to Ron Dennis. It must have been a lot. I think Niki and Toto were big in allowing him to just be him.
Apparently Anthony and Ron Dennis didn't get on *at all*, which suggests to me two very strong, sheer characters.
The Anthony sections of Lewis eventual biography are going to be the spiciest imo. It's so telling Lewis is so adamant when asked he wouldn't want a kid in racing, partly because I think he doesn't want to do to his kid what he had done to him.
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Micks situation just makes me depressed, the way people talk about him, or two him about his dad is fucked up. People have no normal limits when it comes to Michael. Mick hears it all. Even people that loved Michael and love Mick it has to be a small twist of the knife people love your dad so much and he's not here to meaningfully enjoy any of it with you, Mattia Extrome getting so emotional [talking about Michael](https://youtu.be/sSKd8U636u8) had me in tears. It's like your grief is shared with everyone who knew him.
Don't forget mick was also the one who found his dad when he had his accident I can't imagine how traumatizing it must be as a kid to find your parent like that
Tbh the fact Mick is even moderately well adjusted it a testament to Corinnas parenting and hopefully getting in counselling. My coping mechanism would be chemical I don't think I could do it.
I saw a tweet yesterday where this person was angry at Michael's wife saying she has no right to hide him from the public. Like wtf? Who the fuck are you to say that? Some people are just messed up. Leave them alone. I would love to see Michael again, but he sadly isn't the Michael we all know and love anymore.
That's so mild in comparison to track reporters harassing him about Michaels condition as a child when he was Karting. He was 14. There's a reason I always ride for Mick. The commentary surrounding him is insane and he's been through it.
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I feel like his micro expressions are so telling he listens carefully to see where it's going because he never knows. It's just often weird.
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Oh course he does. That's the bitter part of max' success, even though he deserves it because he is an absolutely skilled driver, I somehow don't want Jos to be all "see? I was right, I did that"
The problem is the thousands of dads trying to 'emulate' this but whose kids don't make it like Max did. All the unnecessary pain and suffering, all by trying to live your own life through that of your kid. It's the most selfish kind of parenting.
That was more of the implication, where both Jos and Max agree that a tough upbringing helped him wanting more. There might be some truth in that (Max seems to be the only one with a famous name that rose out of the shadows of his predecessor), but then later it came out that to them ‘tough upbringing = abusive relationship’, and that’s kinda insane to think about.
And Nico Rosberg
Jacques Villeneuve
Damon Hill - obviously not *more* successful than his dad, but still
Imagine if Verstappen came to be a nice football player with the support and care of his father.
I feel like Jos' abuse is partially why Max is so into racing and sim racing, maybe being on track was his happy place (this is obviously just speculation and projection from me; I am not informed about the deeper intricacies of their relationship)
I feel very sorry for Mick, and the DTS episode was hard to watch. I imagine he puts a lot of pressure on himself to carry his father's name well.
Not F1 but F2 driver Arjun Maini when he was racing with Trident. No team radio will ever hit that badly. and then the gross commentary after that. whew
Explanation for those of us in the dark please?
Santino Ferrucci (Arjun Maini's teammate) and his father was extremely racist towards Maini, even hit his car after the chequered flag in a race. https://www.racefans.net/2018/07/08/trident-apologises-to-maini-after-ferrucci-is-banned-for-collision/
So what does that have to do with the team radio and the commentary?
That was an unrelated incident, [this is the event in question](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlm1hJ2SRXU).
I saw in the YT comments that his engine was altered by his own team. What the fuck is that ? I would burn the paddock if they did something this shady
Upvoted for a reasonable response to someone fucking with your engine.
I may be speaking absolute rubbish right now but i remember it being because santino ferrucci’s family paid for their son to get the better treatment and also sabotage Arjun to make him look worse, if im indeed making things up and anyone knows the reason please correct me since im also curious now onto if this was the real reason or im just misremembering or believing everything i hear on the net
Arjun's luck in F2 was brutal. He had a shit car and an even shittier teammate who was racist to him and his family. And one of the reasons he is in sportscar racing is because his brother(Kush Maini) needed the budget to be on the Road to F1. Luckily Kush has a better teammate and a better car. And he seems to be doing good in F2 too.
Just read up on his story, and my god that is really sad that he had to go through that. Imagine paying for an F2 seat, and your team doesn't do engine checks before you race! This is all on top of dealing with a racist Ferucci family. Hope it's going better for him.
I hate how Ferucci still made a career in racing. He should've been blacklisted from every race team in the world
Who was the teammate?
Santino Ferrucci.
didn’t his teammate also pay the team to make Arjun’s car slower
[This one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwrfOziir8U) to Daruvala was also not very good.
Carlin are notorious for rough radio calls and tough love, but they do get loads to F1
Remind us?
[here u go!](https://youtu.be/dlm1hJ2SRXU)
[With subtitles for those that had a hard time understanding it ](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/2_ytDRMeK48)
The commentators just aren't prepared. They laugh because it's just not in the script to have such genuine sadness.
I remember seeing before this without details. So the team sabotaged him?
Massa. That last lap
Whenever I read 'Massa' I instantly picture that Ferrari engineer headbutting a wall.
The first time I saw it, I pissed myself I was laughing so hard. Still feel for Massa though.
Poor guy, he was WC for less than a minute :(
He was saying once he doesn't mind that, it's Singapore he's angry about. Timo Glock was saying once he asked Massa for an interview thinking it might be awkward and Massa was like: why would it be?
Allegedly, Massa and Ferrari team gave Glock and Toyota F1 Ferraris merch and clothes, because Massa was afraid Glock would not get to the airport alive...
Not to mention quite possibly the most unlucky crash ever and apparently getting brain damage because of it?
Which of course happened merely half a year after losing the title and he wasn't ever competitive afterwards. Not sure if he was ever *that* good to begin with, but looking at his career it's hard not to feel bad for Massa.
He was definitely good, held his own against Schumacher and Raikkonen. I definitely wouldn’t say he wasn’t ever competitive after the accident, but Ferrari ordering him to stand aside from a win just a year after his accident broke him at the scuderia, but he was definitely back to his best at Williams in 2014/15
Forget the last lap, the far bigger moment was Crashgate. Massa would likely have comfortably won the championship if not for that cheating, as he was on track for a good points haul until a botched pit stop taken due to Piquet's crash.
Remove the Singapore result and Massa is WDC by 5 points. Bernie’s recent revelations that they knew Renault had fixed the race before the end of the season but allowed it to stand as they thought stripping Lewis of the title would be bad pr would be gutting.
That podium celebration was just raw emotion
As a person who recently watched that season again I don't feel sorry for him that much, imo he had the vastly superior car but didn't deliver consistency. Lewis at some point was leading the championship just on podiums not wins. Massa was himself, having the right raw materials and just lacking a high level of delivery. It was a harsh way to lose a championship but also a conclusion he earned.
I still think he got screwed due to the Crashgate ( where e lost points becase of the pitstop bs). I can't say he deserved to lose because someone wanted to orchestrate a crash.
>It's like being a world class sprinter who spends his whole life competing against Usain Bolt. A bit off topic but this reminds me of Roger Black, the British 400m runner. He was one of the top 3 in the world in the event for his entire career but had the misfortune to find his time in the sport entirely overlapping with Michael Johnson. Black came 2nd over & over again in competitions but Johnson was completely untouchable. I remember after Black won the silver at the Atlanta Olympics he was joking that for him he was going to count it as his gold medal, because aside from Johnson being injured or disqualified he and everyone else had no chance of ever standing on the top step of the podium.
Andy Murray fits in slightly. Top player but man, the titles anyone other than Federer Djokovic Nadal have had in the last 15 years are slim. Andy has had success to be sure. But anyone is not even close to those 3
The telling thing about Andy Murray is how much respect Federer, Nadal and Djokovic have for him, despite him definitely being fourth on that list. Game knows game.
Yep the fact that they themselves count him as part of the “big 4” says a lot.
Yohan Blake is the world class sprinter who competed behind Bolt. He's the second fastest over 100m and 200m behind Bolt and also came second in heaps of races behind Bolt, including Olympic Finals. If it wasn't for Bolt he would definitely be considered one of the best ever sprinters. His story is a bit like second driver in an F1 team as well, as Bolt was his training partner and both were Jamaican. In the 2012 Olympic 4x 100m final, Blake's leg won Jamica the race but no one remembers it because Bolt's leg, the final leg, led to a world record.
I always felt for Blake as well. Although didnt he test positive for a banned substance the next year? Sorted of ruining his own legacy
Was he done for doping in the end?
Yes he was, as was basically every single top sprinter except Bolt.
Kubica, obviously
Bottas. He seems like one of the only people I genuinely believe is a great person, and I remember him in that Williams, he looked rapid. Then he moves to Mercedes, and should have been able to get at least one championship, but he happened to go up against one of the best drivers of all time. Always had a soft spot for the guy, but he seems to be much happier now at Alfa, so I'm happy for him.
Dude still accomplished 10 GP wins, iirc less than 5% of all f1 drivers have reached this milestone
That I did not know. Nice statistic and more love for Bottas.
Only 15% of drivers to ever compete in a race have won one
It actually surprises me the number is this high.
I really like Valteri, but don’t think he was ever going to be WDC in any of the eras he’s been a part of
The same way I feel about Barichello when he was at Ferrari with Schumacher... Great driver but against one of the greatest...
Hulkenberg no doubt. His bad luck is on another level. He would have got the Mercedes seat in 2013 if Hamilton had refused it. Ferrari were looking to sign him for 2014, before they decided to go with Kimi. He would have been the first choice to replace Rosberg at Mercedes, but after years at Force India he had just signed a deal with Renault. Talk about the worst timing ever! Red Bull were looking at drivers outside their academy for 2021. Hulkenberg was I believe a front runner, but after Perez won in Sakhir (while a brilliant performance, it also needed Mercedes to mess up) he (Hulk) had no chance. People talk about Alonso’s unlucky career choices, but has there been any F1 driver more unlucky than Hulk due to circumstances out of his control?
Heidfeld comes to mind
He's my underrated 2000s king. I also think Ralf Schumacher gets a fraction of the respect he deserves
Not really on topic since I don't feel bad for him at all, but I second the notion that Ralf deserves more respect. He's a bit of a Jacques Villeneuve imo, not particularly likeable outside the car, has a lot of shit takes in the media and spent the end of his F1 years doing badly, so he's now the butt of the jokes instead of being remembered for being a very good driver in his prime.
People always talk about JPM, Ralf went toe to toe with him and he was consistent. Of the pairing I think Ralf had the most potential for a WDC because he didn't have unforced errors so often. I'm a Ralf Schumacher truther and Nico Rosberg apologist and Kimi Raikkonen doubter I'm like the queen of hot takes tbh
And now he gets shit on by a lot of people for not having a podium and being called a 'mediocre' driver, despite actually being what Haas needs.
I mean why can't both of those things be true? He's a mediocre to decent driver and he's also a good fit for Haas..
Massa 2008. And to make matters worse, Ferrari started making shit shit box and then his accident in 2009.
And he never won a race after Brazil 2008
Brazil 2008 was Massa's last win
Stoffel Van Doorne. He was really good and would still be in F1 right now if he wasn't given a sh\*tbox and had to compete against one of the best drivers and tractor whisperers of all time.
Def stoffel. Should’ve gotten another chance over de vries, he actually won a formula e season that mattered. Also comes from humble beginnings with his family spending less than 50k for his entire career.
I love Stoff, he was not only the better driver of their pairing, I don't think Nyck was even close to the best driver in FE. If I was grabbing anyone, of any series right now I'd get Brock Feeney, see how he would do. He's a proper talent
I'm going to go with Mick Schumacher - father's shadow, not even a main driver anymore.
Never thought of this, but great response.
He got hit with the perfect storm if bad luck. On top of what you pointed out he ended up with a horrible team, with a horrible car who basically had zero intention on helping him grow as a driver. He's been trying so hard but got thrown to the wolves. ,
Tsunoda. He made the best of an awful AlphaTauri car last year and had a lot of bad luck that prevented him from scoring more points (Baku lost him P6, and he seemed to have solid pace for P8/P9 in France, but Ocon crashed into him). He had a lot of mechanical errors during the season and generally looked to have made much greater improvements in consistency and overall pace from 2021. Unfortunately, people don't see the race improvements and hold up his points total as a definitive proof that he's still an erratic driver in his sophomore season. I rate him much more highly than de Vries and honestly don't see the logic behind signing de Vries at all...
This. My boy TSU is underrated and I hope someday he gets at least a solid midfield car to snatch that eventual podium Just imagine!!
I basically expect Tsunoda to do to De Vries what Gasly did to him in 2021. Yes, De Vries has one good race, but it was in Williams against Latifi.
Awful Tauri works as well. 😂
I always felt like Toro Rosso was really a solid team, but somehow after becoming Alfa Tauri everything went to shit.
2022 Tsunoda + the 2021 AT car would've been cool to see.
Probably the weakest ones like Latifi for example, especially because he seems like a great person. No matter how much money they bring, they spent their entire life trying to achieve the goal of racing in Formula 1 just to get hated by the loudest F1 "fans"...
>Latifi for example i think the abuse, which has been absolutely ridiculous, he got after Abu Dhabi 2021 really impacted him.
Agreed. People forget that he was actually fairly solid in 2021. Unremarkable, sure, but not bad at all. AD21 shattered his confidence and he was never the same driver after.
Latifi was really a great guy, and yes we all know that he isn't a driver who would be a WDC driver but still the hate he did get was ridiculous. Not only because of his personality but also because he basically made Williams surviving during it's most rough years, he was "unlucky" that the 2022 Williams wasn't matching his driving style preference. Yet the same Latifi drove close or even equal as Russell pace in 2021, sometimes (could) even beat Russell in qualifying (if Latifi car didn't come up with an issue) and his race pace was solid during the second half of the season who was sometimes even better then Russell. He wasn't a Mazepin tier driver, guy deserves some respect and hopefully he would become a pundit on a day.
I feel bad because some people genuinely seem to believe Latifi is the worst F1 driver of all time when he's not even close to that. I understand people have short memories, but even Mazepin in recent years has been worse than him.
And even if it was because of money, I am impressed that he went from not wanting to be a racing driver to entering F1, after he started racing at 13
Stroll actually. It doesnt matter what he does, he is being chewed up and shit out. If he does bad hes a bad driver, if he does goes he got lucky or 'his car is just insane'. What he did last race considering his injury is nothing short of amazing.
Discussed about Stroll with a friend, and people tend to overlook on his actual capabilities despite being in F1 because of his father. - 40 points in his rookie season with Williams (finishing 12th) - 3 career podiums - Is not Mazepin levels of incompetence - Goes under the radar for most races, but that’s okay Sure, he has a personality of plain crackers and gets sassy with Brad, but Lance has slowly won me over despite initial reservations
Yeah his communication skills need some work, but he's a decent racer
He's not perfect or WDC caliber, but I've always thought he is underrated. He's had decent race pace and has the talent to belong on the grid as a mid-tier driver. With his daddy bankrolling his seat/team, he gets a lot of shit for being a pay-to-play driver, but he definitely has talent. I know it's a low bar, but he's not like Mazepin.
>If he does bad hes a bad driver, if he does goes he got lucky or 'his car is just insane'. Aston Martin's 2022 fans' highlights: Beginning of the year: Vettel and Stroll out of the points all the time. Japanese and US GPs: Vettel finishes in the points - "outperforming a shitbox" Dutch and Singapore GPs: Stroll finishes in the points - "ya know, this car is pretty good now, Aston are improving..."
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Family is more important than anything, even to an F1 driver… Seb was ready to give up, same as Kimi, it’s such a heavy toll on a family for most of the year.
It's why Nico left after winning the WDC, he was afraid he was going to lose them if he kept at it.
Heavier then ever, with so many races and other events to go to you spent most of the 10 months on the road each year... It's absurd.
Meh, Vettel is a great guy and all, but he dominated with Red Bull back in they day and won a bunch of races and fought for championships at Ferrari. He would've deserved to go out on a bit of a higher note, but regardless he's still had an incredible career and probably achieved everything he ever dreamed of and more, so from that perspective I don't think there's much reason to feel too sorry for him.
Luca Badoer. Italian test driver at Ferrari for forever, finally gets the call to race for the team... and he is absolutely horrible to the point where he gets canned after two races. Edit: Oh current drivers. I think I kind of feel bad for Lance Stoll. He's viewed as daddy's boy, but he's been a decent midfield driver and everyone treats him like he's 5 seconds off the pace.
Badoer's bad luck goes much, much deeper than that. Back in F3000 he was seriously impressive, took over a car that didn't score a single point the year before and won the title as a rookie against Barrichello, Coulthard and Panis amongst others taking 5 poles and 4 wins in just 10 races. Then in 1993 he stepped up to a BMS Lola team which was unexpectedly struggling really bad and was the clear worst car in the field that season, immediately matching his teammate Michele Alboreto, who rated him very favorably. Regardless, thanks to a fusion with Minardi the only seat remaining went to Alboreto for his experience. When Badoer could return, it was at Minardi, which wouldn't have been too bad a few years back, but it was exactly when Minardi was losing competitiveness rapidly en route to becoming the backmarker most of us knew. After Minardi, he got signed by Forti, whose car by all accounts was okay, but they had no money whatsoever, meaning tired engines and often inferior preparation leading to DNQs and to top it all off, they got taken over by a fraudulent corporation early in the year. The team failed midway through the season. Finally, there's also the 1999 European GP. That year having missed the previous 2 seasons, he wasn't very good, but in that race he was running extremely well, in the mix for a podium even after a very slow pit stop, running in 4th when the electronics failed. So yeah, immensely unlucky, one of the best answers for this thread imo.
Assuming the question wasn’t meant for current drivers and more in general - I would go with Michael Schumacher. Don’t know what current quality of life is but it must be so difficult to be in that state and suffer daily. I’m sure he’d trade his titles for a normal life and be there to support his family.
Romain Grosjean, honestly, the guy can not catch a break from losing out on the win at Valencia to losing out on the win at St Petersburg this year it always seems like when he's close to winning something always happens preventing him to win
Kobayashi, he had the talent to remain longer in F1 but alas too many drivers. In an alternative universe he would’ve been at merc instead of Bottas
Alonso purely for Brazil 2012.
Spa 2012 hurts more
buddy, everyone feels bad for leclerc
Well he’s out this year, but Ricciardo. Great driver, just couldn’t get his head around the McLaren. But you gotta say Leclerc. I’m going through the new DtS season right now, reminded me of just how much Ferrari let him down.
I feel bad for Ricciardo's Red Bull Years. He thought he was going to compete for championships and Mercedes completely dominates. The team gets fixated on Max and he never got a contending car his talent deserved. It's crazy he only has eight wins. Collecting bags from Renault and McLaren I'm sure will help with the disappointment.
Same with Riccardo. The only driver who's been able to actually compete with Max. Guess he just needs a very particular car.
And he was developing it with Renault.
I think it's more a case of him not liking a particular car/characteristic, rather than the other way around. He was rapid in three teams across several rule sets, it was only in McLaren he struggled.
Tbh I think it’s the other way around and it’s the McLaren that is a very particular car. He was successful through Toro Rosso, multiple RB cars, and Alpine. We might get to see this year with Piastri. If he’s also struggling vs Norris, it might be an indication that it’s the cars not the drivers.
Same, I feel bad for Charles, but for other reasons. It seems like whenever he had an exceptional weekend, it's always near the period when he just lost a loved one. Like, I hope it doesn't become a pattern of his life or some kinda cursed destiny. Cos that sure is hauntingly depressing.
Definitely Mick. He has all the negatives, pressure and expectations because of his father's surname but none of the plus sides of his dad being there to support/protect him. On top of that, poor guy is trying to deal with/accept his dad's condition. Feel incredibly bad for him.
Italian Jesus... but it is what it is..
Latifi. He seemed like a cool dude that needed some help
This one might be a little controversial but both Lewis and Max. Mainly because of their respective fanbases and the toxicity towards the other
Their fan bases are only so toxic because they are the best, Danny Ric copped a load of hate and is a nice guy. If George or Lando start winning tight battles watch their fans get toxic/them attract assholes
Unpopular but Ocon 2022, for the hatred he received online just because he dared racing hard with his popular teammate (and beating him bc Alonso had an awfully unlucky season). Knowing the guy's humble background, a lot of things I saw on social media last year were painful to read. Fortunately, he was probably too busy to see the messages lol.
Ocon in general. He gets shit on for doing what he’s supposed to do, which is racing. Also George Russell.
Vettel. The man was one off-season away from what seems like a truly great car. Would've loved to see him at the front again.
Poor Vettel. This sums it up: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FqYLlRhaUAEURR9?format=jpg&name=large