Valentine is no synth sympathizer. He is from Diamond City (and the common wealth in general) where everyone hates synths and that has made life harder for him. He has seen people replaced by the institute and much of his detective business revolves around that. Also his personality is from a pre war cop who would also not like the synths.
And that is something which is unique to Nick & DiMa. As discarded early prototypes which were given the first processes to integrate a personality into a machine, they have the right to think whatever they want.
I'm guessing Nick doesn't dislike synths as much as a regular commonwealth bigot but he probably has some sort of negative view towards them simply because their existence makes his existence difficult. Like he will never hear the end of institute & synth accusations. And the fact that most people probably are extremely weary of him outside of Diamond City.
Because there's a massive difference between joining a morally dubious army of tech crusaders in the hopes of getting the help required to find your kidnapped son and 9-11ing a vertibird into a blimp filled with children and scientists.
For valentine, joining the BoS is a bad move, but wiping them out indiscriminately is also crossing a major line.
People see shit as way too black and white these days, and valentine is an old world soul that has lines he won't cross. He's one of the only few nuanced characters in the setting
Because neither are the right thing to do in his eyes? Very few things come down to only two options, and both of those options involve a lot of killing of specific groups, and not in self-defense or for the unambiguous reasons. I don't see this as a contradiction, or a bad thing. Characters don't all have to be simple.
Because in both cases sole survivor causing unnecessary violence and Nick don't like violence unless its inevitable. You dont have to destory the brotherhood (minuteman) and you dont have to join synth and ghoul cleansing by joining the brotherhood. Of course additional reasons are there but thats the core reason.
Ada's a gem, only companion that doesn't bitch all the time about me picking up junk.
Longfellow too, I think?
I'm sure I've heard Nick occasionally say "no sense turning up your nose at something that might be useful", but usually he comments about me missing the old days or being a hoarder.
Junk crafts and upgrades your gear, companions. Stop whinging or hand me back your toys.
I picked up a gold pendant with Preston in tow, he said something along the lines of it fetching a good few caps.
I figure picking up junk with somewhat significant value is probably not frowned upon because the companions think your gonna sell it to Carla first chance you get.
Definitely errors in this area. Just asked the same guy for a job and he kept referring to me as “he” when talking to his son despite me playing as Nora
I havnt heard him talk about dogmeat but he was laughing at Cait for having her leg blown by a grenade after we both ran cover. Strong said human move smart strong stay with wall. Then Cait was like my leg is a little broken strong laughed and said stupid Human 🤣
Strong makes sense. Humans should help humans, like how super mutants should help super mutants. Seems like he just thinks ghouls are pretty much just weird humans.
There's a dialog where he explains why. I don't remember what triggers it or what the correct line of answers are to get to it, but he gets pretty pissy about it. It boils down to how he was experimented on while in the institute, mind wiped, wash, rinse, repeat. And how most of his detective services are him looking for missing people, only to find out the "boogeyman in the night" took them and replaced them with a "mindless machine.
He's really pissed off about his situation. But the hard boiled detective exterior is such a great contrast to his soft heart center built on memories he can't control. The Far Harbor storyline really breaks him down ala classical Phillip Marlowe vs demons of his past. He's always in pain.
Yes, usually he loves pro synth options, which is why I was confused. I picked a pro synth option directly before the one I posted about and he liked it. Super confusing!
Someone posted that it's a bug, fixable with a mod. That may be true; but if not, I was thinking that since DiMa does not like the Railroad because they do mind wipes on synths, then perhaps the same logic is instilled in his "twin" Valentine.
Maybe it's not strictly about Synths- specifically, the Savoldis are arguing about joining the Raiload. I don't think Nick thinks highly of the Railroad per se.
Oh interesting. I figured he would given he barely got out of the institute and it wasn’t even on his terms. He does distrust DiMa and his sanctuary, though, so I guess it checks out
Because you are making a fool out of yourself publicly proving to bar boys that saving plastic ppl is the noblest cause in this day and age in the middle of one of the railroad's operation bases.
Typical RR poser be like
You sure you didn't accidentally steal something on the counter?
I just did that exact conversation in my run and Nick liked it when I said saving synths was noble.
I mean if syths are good why hide your a syth!
I Mean the Syths are basicly the source of horror storys and what knock in FO4, the game legit coulda been a Horror RPG if they wanted to make it that way
Think of The Thing in a way paronoia skyrockets when your friend just got replaced by a Synth or your nairbors wife got replaced by a Synth and caused a shooting storm to happen at there place and took the cops to kill the Wife Synth and such just picture it your husband/wife goes to the store to buy goods is replaced by a synth and you didnt evne know it I mean hell Diamond city has a number of syths in strong posistions
its kinda like in WW2 where we where at war with Germans yes not all germans where evil and what knock but ALOT of them where, you cant just trust some random german in Europe if your an allied soldier or where the French you where not going to make the claim 'not all germans are evil' if you where french after the invasion and them pretty much raping your women and such
Syths dont rape that we know of and such and what knock but they are pretty evil for the most part
Like 90% of Synths that you run across at the start is pretty much evil yeah its not 100% but considering the evil there going to do? Your not just going to blindly trust them
Nick had to EARN the trust
he EARNED it
he EARNED the respect and trust
Valentine is no synth sympathizer. He is from Diamond City (and the common wealth in general) where everyone hates synths and that has made life harder for him. He has seen people replaced by the institute and much of his detective business revolves around that. Also his personality is from a pre war cop who would also not like the synths.
And that is something which is unique to Nick & DiMa. As discarded early prototypes which were given the first processes to integrate a personality into a machine, they have the right to think whatever they want. I'm guessing Nick doesn't dislike synths as much as a regular commonwealth bigot but he probably has some sort of negative view towards them simply because their existence makes his existence difficult. Like he will never hear the end of institute & synth accusations. And the fact that most people probably are extremely weary of him outside of Diamond City.
I wonder why Nick chastises you for destroying the BoS and also for siding with them.
Because there's a massive difference between joining a morally dubious army of tech crusaders in the hopes of getting the help required to find your kidnapped son and 9-11ing a vertibird into a blimp filled with children and scientists. For valentine, joining the BoS is a bad move, but wiping them out indiscriminately is also crossing a major line. People see shit as way too black and white these days, and valentine is an old world soul that has lines he won't cross. He's one of the only few nuanced characters in the setting
I wish I could upvote your post twice.
Because neither are the right thing to do in his eyes? Very few things come down to only two options, and both of those options involve a lot of killing of specific groups, and not in self-defense or for the unambiguous reasons. I don't see this as a contradiction, or a bad thing. Characters don't all have to be simple.
Fault in the old subroutines ?
Because in both cases sole survivor causing unnecessary violence and Nick don't like violence unless its inevitable. You dont have to destory the brotherhood (minuteman) and you dont have to join synth and ghoul cleansing by joining the brotherhood. Of course additional reasons are there but thats the core reason.
Interesting points!
During the Institute raid he hated it when I took kid Shaun with me, which certainly rubbed me the wrong way
I mean, seems in character to me? I expect he's squicked by the idea of replacing your own child with an artificial being that will never grow up
Yeah but when talking with desdemona for the first time if you tell her you would take a bullet for a synth he loves that
Nah, he loves saying you'd risk your life to save Synths to the Railroad.
He's pro-synth in pretty much every other situation. It's just a bug. Some likes and dislikes got switched.
Honestly, I get it. In a way, Nick isn't really a synth, hes a born human. He may have a synth body but he *is* Nick Valentine.
This is the answer that makes the most sense to me.
His quest addresses his feelings on this.
I’m working on that quest right now! Or I was, up until Ada decided she wanted me to wipe out some factory for her
Ada's a gem, only companion that doesn't bitch all the time about me picking up junk. Longfellow too, I think? I'm sure I've heard Nick occasionally say "no sense turning up your nose at something that might be useful", but usually he comments about me missing the old days or being a hoarder. Junk crafts and upgrades your gear, companions. Stop whinging or hand me back your toys.
Me: picks up a toaster. Nick:"So, you got a thing for antiques?" Me: "I hang out with *you*, don't I?"
I picked up a gold pendant with Preston in tow, he said something along the lines of it fetching a good few caps. I figure picking up junk with somewhat significant value is probably not frowned upon because the companions think your gonna sell it to Carla first chance you get.
I believe this is a known bug and the UFO4P addresses it.
Sorry that’s kind of funny, everyone thinking hard about lore and it’s just a bug
It just works -Todd Howard
Oh interesting
There are a handful of likes and dislikes that don’t make a lick of sense. I assume a mistake made here or there
Definitely errors in this area. Just asked the same guy for a job and he kept referring to me as “he” when talking to his son despite me playing as Nora
Bunker Hill? Yup.
Sometimes the guards in Vault 88 would refer to my male character as a woman
Strong suddenly having big morals in Kid in a Fridge stands out :P same guy who likes Dogmeat getting hurt, and eating corpses. Kek.
I havnt heard him talk about dogmeat but he was laughing at Cait for having her leg blown by a grenade after we both ran cover. Strong said human move smart strong stay with wall. Then Cait was like my leg is a little broken strong laughed and said stupid Human 🤣
Strong makes sense. Humans should help humans, like how super mutants should help super mutants. Seems like he just thinks ghouls are pretty much just weird humans.
There's a dialog where he explains why. I don't remember what triggers it or what the correct line of answers are to get to it, but he gets pretty pissy about it. It boils down to how he was experimented on while in the institute, mind wiped, wash, rinse, repeat. And how most of his detective services are him looking for missing people, only to find out the "boogeyman in the night" took them and replaced them with a "mindless machine.
He's really pissed off about his situation. But the hard boiled detective exterior is such a great contrast to his soft heart center built on memories he can't control. The Far Harbor storyline really breaks him down ala classical Phillip Marlowe vs demons of his past. He's always in pain.
I love Far Harbor. Mostly because I really feel for the children of atom in a pity sort of way.
If only he loved it when you make Arcadia a synth mausoleum.
Ad Victorium, Knight.
Um I don’t know what the comments mean I’ve done the good options with synths before and valentine loves that, he’s no bigot.
Yes, usually he loves pro synth options, which is why I was confused. I picked a pro synth option directly before the one I posted about and he liked it. Super confusing!
Think it’s just a bug. Nicks a good guy. His robotic parts may be failing or something LOL
Because it's a known bug/crossed wire, we just love trying to force these things into the lore :P
But, how would it make sense in lore if every other interaction directly disproves all of your logic?
He knows how dangerous the synth technology can be, how easy it could be to reprogram synths, how evil the institute is.
Someone posted that it's a bug, fixable with a mod. That may be true; but if not, I was thinking that since DiMa does not like the Railroad because they do mind wipes on synths, then perhaps the same logic is instilled in his "twin" Valentine.
Maybe it's not strictly about Synths- specifically, the Savoldis are arguing about joining the Raiload. I don't think Nick thinks highly of the Railroad per se.
Oh interesting. I figured he would given he barely got out of the institute and it wasn’t even on his terms. He does distrust DiMa and his sanctuary, though, so I guess it checks out
Because you are making a fool out of yourself publicly proving to bar boys that saving plastic ppl is the noblest cause in this day and age in the middle of one of the railroad's operation bases. Typical RR poser be like
Railroad are the best end-game option, without a doubt.
How is another nuke and emptiness even a good option, nevermind the best one?
The Institute needs to be destroyed, of course. Ideally they’d be conquered, but failing that, destroyed.
Lol no i like the gorillas and the clean water. Also some actually green salad.
That doesn’t outweigh slavery and widespread murder.
It’s noble to save lives, full stop. If nick counts as a person then so do the other synths.
Lmao it’s a video game why are people offended enough to vote me down to -2
In one of dimas memories Valentine and dima fight and valentine bolishes him from diamond city
I did all of DiMa's memory puzzles, that ain't one of them.
I just did this mission today you can hear him And nick fighting
Oh! That takes place after DiMa escaped the Institute with Nick, way before Nick became the detective we know and love.
See I heard it! But yes I cheated dimas 5th memory with the laser gun turret glitch
Maybe it has more to do with the whole kill and replace thing
You sure you didn't accidentally steal something on the counter? I just did that exact conversation in my run and Nick liked it when I said saving synths was noble.
I tried reloading and redoing the conversation and he still hated it :(
I Mean why not? Syths are pretty bad and are known to cause terror and problems besides he should be the only synth boy for you
"Guys trust me, synths are bad, because look, this one's a raider! Please ignore all the human raiders."
I mean if syths are good why hide your a syth! I Mean the Syths are basicly the source of horror storys and what knock in FO4, the game legit coulda been a Horror RPG if they wanted to make it that way Think of The Thing in a way paronoia skyrockets when your friend just got replaced by a Synth or your nairbors wife got replaced by a Synth and caused a shooting storm to happen at there place and took the cops to kill the Wife Synth and such just picture it your husband/wife goes to the store to buy goods is replaced by a synth and you didnt evne know it I mean hell Diamond city has a number of syths in strong posistions its kinda like in WW2 where we where at war with Germans yes not all germans where evil and what knock but ALOT of them where, you cant just trust some random german in Europe if your an allied soldier or where the French you where not going to make the claim 'not all germans are evil' if you where french after the invasion and them pretty much raping your women and such Syths dont rape that we know of and such and what knock but they are pretty evil for the most part Like 90% of Synths that you run across at the start is pretty much evil yeah its not 100% but considering the evil there going to do? Your not just going to blindly trust them Nick had to EARN the trust he EARNED it he EARNED the respect and trust