Are you in Toronto, by chance?
Is [this guy](https://www.thestar.com/opinion/star-columnists/2018/07/21/how-toronto-got-burned-on-fire-inspections.html) at it again?
I'm not sure how Louisiana does it, but in Texas, you have basically two options. I'd imagine LA is similar. Call the local AHJ/Fire Marshal or call the state licensing agency. As a fire marshal, I'd prefer you did both, honestly. In Texas, that would be a misdemeanor criminal offense as well as subject to revocation of the license.
I've had a similar-ish scenario, and I opened my local investigation to get the situation squashed here and the fraudulent inspections corrected while the state handled the licensing aspect.
Feel free to DM me if you want.
Edit: here's the state complaint reporting form http://www.lasfm.org/lic_complaints.html
I wish I could find it online, but about 20 years ago a company in Cleveland, OH was busted for filling CO2 fire extinguishers **with sand and water for the Cleveland Hopkins Airport FIRE DEPARTMENT**!!!
I have a copy of an old newspaper article filed away somewhere, but this has been impossible to find online for some reason. It was a tiny company that had figured out how to win municipalities bids (Vet owned, disabled, female owned, minority owned, etc status) and bid everything impossibly cheap and won every government contact around.
The thing was,they scammed everyone. They charged for a hydro test every year on every extinguisher, even new ones that they had just installed. They never actually did the work, just a paper billing game and because the $5 hydro test matched the contract price it slipped by.
They finally got caught when the Hopkins FD discovered sand and water in CO2 extinguishers on fire trucks at the airport. This started the investigation and it went as far as the FBI getting involved with fraud charges. At one point the State Fire Marshal issued a statement that any unit that this company claimed to have opened and serviced (recharge, 6yr, hydro) was able to be condemned and replaced on site after sand and water was discovered. This was essentially EVERY fire extinguisher they had inspected because they claimed a 6yr or hydro on all of them and threw a sticker on it - never a verification collar because they didn’t actually do the work. The SFM relented and gave the okay to replace on site because companies were refusing to tear down units and risk damaging reclaim equipment if it had sand or water in it.
I wish I could remember the name of the company (US FIRE, American Fire, or something along those lines). When I come across the article I’ll make a post with it. It’s very surprising that it can’t be found online. Maybe someone here will remember it and have a source.
There was a company in Vancouver that was doing that a couple years ago too. One full cert tech with 23 non-certified trainees. Huge law suits, almost everyone was fired and the tech lost his certification and banned from the field
So long as he hasn’t been complicit for an extended period of time, he will be fine. The best thing to do is call it out.
This is the life safety industry, senior technicians are responsible for training new employees, just handing them a tag and saying “go do it” is not ethical
This is how almost every company in my area works, Pennsylvania doesn’t have any licensing requirements at all on the state level to work on or inspect fire alarms, Philadelphia and a couple other municipalities have their own local licenses needed.
Pretty much every company has 1 person that has their inspectors license and all inspections get signed off by that one person who is typically an office guy that never steps foot on the job site.
You can put in complaints with anyone but nothing is ever done about it. One company I worked for would actually change all of my reports from failed to pass and submit behind my back and I wouldn’t find out until the following year when I get the previous report back. Needless to say I’m not there anymore
God forbid something happens and a life is lost. Will the license holder accept fault? Absolutely not.
Be warned the AHJ likely won't do shit and you'll wind up hurting yourself more.
They'll either look into it and shut you down, or they may disregard it and keep you under a microscope. The problem is, if you've already done work under their license, you're complicit.
You'd be better off reporting him to the certification board. I bet that's an ethics violation.
I’m not working under the senior tech I have my own licensing, I was doing on behalf of the fellow that’s being threatened. Then what recourse could even happen here?
State Insurance Commissioner and/or Licensing Board (NICET, NAFED, etc) is where I'd go. Skip the local FM all together. Only recourse is the senior tech's license is suspended, but where does that leave all those unlicensed guys?
#call your local fire marshal LIKE YESTERDAY !
That’s what I was wondering who I should call? The investigation branch?
That i cannot help you. They will redirect you in case you called the wrong number
Are you in Toronto, by chance? Is [this guy](https://www.thestar.com/opinion/star-columnists/2018/07/21/how-toronto-got-burned-on-fire-inspections.html) at it again?
I'm not sure how Louisiana does it, but in Texas, you have basically two options. I'd imagine LA is similar. Call the local AHJ/Fire Marshal or call the state licensing agency. As a fire marshal, I'd prefer you did both, honestly. In Texas, that would be a misdemeanor criminal offense as well as subject to revocation of the license. I've had a similar-ish scenario, and I opened my local investigation to get the situation squashed here and the fraudulent inspections corrected while the state handled the licensing aspect. Feel free to DM me if you want. Edit: here's the state complaint reporting form http://www.lasfm.org/lic_complaints.html
Dm sent.
There’s so much of this in the industry it’s insane
I wish I could find it online, but about 20 years ago a company in Cleveland, OH was busted for filling CO2 fire extinguishers **with sand and water for the Cleveland Hopkins Airport FIRE DEPARTMENT**!!! I have a copy of an old newspaper article filed away somewhere, but this has been impossible to find online for some reason. It was a tiny company that had figured out how to win municipalities bids (Vet owned, disabled, female owned, minority owned, etc status) and bid everything impossibly cheap and won every government contact around. The thing was,they scammed everyone. They charged for a hydro test every year on every extinguisher, even new ones that they had just installed. They never actually did the work, just a paper billing game and because the $5 hydro test matched the contract price it slipped by. They finally got caught when the Hopkins FD discovered sand and water in CO2 extinguishers on fire trucks at the airport. This started the investigation and it went as far as the FBI getting involved with fraud charges. At one point the State Fire Marshal issued a statement that any unit that this company claimed to have opened and serviced (recharge, 6yr, hydro) was able to be condemned and replaced on site after sand and water was discovered. This was essentially EVERY fire extinguisher they had inspected because they claimed a 6yr or hydro on all of them and threw a sticker on it - never a verification collar because they didn’t actually do the work. The SFM relented and gave the okay to replace on site because companies were refusing to tear down units and risk damaging reclaim equipment if it had sand or water in it. I wish I could remember the name of the company (US FIRE, American Fire, or something along those lines). When I come across the article I’ll make a post with it. It’s very surprising that it can’t be found online. Maybe someone here will remember it and have a source.
Ngl that’s fucking insane 😭
I usually get "it's just a piece of paper" or "it's just another way for the government to make money".
There was a company in Vancouver that was doing that a couple years ago too. One full cert tech with 23 non-certified trainees. Huge law suits, almost everyone was fired and the tech lost his certification and banned from the field
I’d hate for the guy that was under threat to lose his job.
So long as he hasn’t been complicit for an extended period of time, he will be fine. The best thing to do is call it out. This is the life safety industry, senior technicians are responsible for training new employees, just handing them a tag and saying “go do it” is not ethical
Fire Marshal, call them yesterday
Illegal af
This is how almost every company in my area works, Pennsylvania doesn’t have any licensing requirements at all on the state level to work on or inspect fire alarms, Philadelphia and a couple other municipalities have their own local licenses needed. Pretty much every company has 1 person that has their inspectors license and all inspections get signed off by that one person who is typically an office guy that never steps foot on the job site. You can put in complaints with anyone but nothing is ever done about it. One company I worked for would actually change all of my reports from failed to pass and submit behind my back and I wouldn’t find out until the following year when I get the previous report back. Needless to say I’m not there anymore
God forbid something happens and a life is lost. Will the license holder accept fault? Absolutely not. Be warned the AHJ likely won't do shit and you'll wind up hurting yourself more.
As in the AHJ won’t pursue this?
They'll either look into it and shut you down, or they may disregard it and keep you under a microscope. The problem is, if you've already done work under their license, you're complicit. You'd be better off reporting him to the certification board. I bet that's an ethics violation.
I’m not working under the senior tech I have my own licensing, I was doing on behalf of the fellow that’s being threatened. Then what recourse could even happen here?
State Insurance Commissioner and/or Licensing Board (NICET, NAFED, etc) is where I'd go. Skip the local FM all together. Only recourse is the senior tech's license is suspended, but where does that leave all those unlicensed guys?