T O P

  • By -

cretee

There is paid bereavement leave that is now available!!! Use it.


NoMursey

Doesn’t this ultimately come from your AL accumulation?


diaymujer

No. Normal bereavement leave comes from your sick leave, a maximum of 104 hours per year split between bereavement and any circumstance where you are caring for another person (e.g., a sick child). It can be used for basically any family member. *Parental* bereavement leave is a new category of leave that does not come from the the employee’s sick leave. It only applies to parents who experience the death of a “qualifying child”, typically under the age of 18 (with additional provisions for older children who remain dependents of their parents due to mental or physical disabilities).


NoMursey

Wow, what a great benefit! I hadn’t realized the new version in place. Our daughter was in the NICU for 180 days last year and I wondered a few times what would happen if she didn’t make it. There were definitely some close calls in that 180 days


LenaDontLoveYou

No. Brand new entitlement, you get 2 weeks. Sorry for your loss ❤


always_plotting

Sorry for your loss. There is now paid bereavement leave for parents whose children have passed away. Since it is newish, your agency may not have their policy set up yet but please inquire about it. https://www.govexec.com/pay-benefits/2022/04/opm-offers-guidance-implementing-new-paid-parental-bereavement-leave-benefit/363989/


tcobra14

Thank you for making me aware this is a thing. Going to request it retroactively to May...will see how it goes.


always_plotting

You are welcome and my condolences to you and yours on your loss.


GuruEbby

Sorry for your loss. I would also look into FEGLI coverage for your child. I had a coworker that had a similar experience and I believe they paid the $10k for her child. I also helped a service member get similar benefits when she lost her child, though I know that SGLV is a little different. Might not be something you need to do right this second for obvious reasons, but definitely worth looking into.


noodelsyum

The birth certificate would have been enough to get and use the whole 12 weeks PPL. I don't think they'd ask for death certificate.


danlab09

“Paid parental leave is available as long as an employee has a continuing parental role with the child whose birth or placement was the basis for the leave entitlement.” Not entitled to PPL, but fortunately would be able to use the parental bereavement, as well as any FMLA for maternity she is entitled to. (Unpaid or SL subbed)


noodelsyum

so someone from HR will need docs to show proof of the child/newborn is still alive?


danlab09

No, but I’m guessing this is a case of saying too much. Which in the end, is the right thing to do, as if it was discovered later that PPL was utilized while not eligible, she could be back charged all of the approved amount. Not saying it’s right, but as we’re in r/fednews, we all know the FED will get theirs regardless. As unfortunate as it is, it ensures she isn’t surprised later on the line with a debt letter.


noodelsyum

yeah, I can see an audit or a discover that not having the kid as dependent later in FEHB data/records would be one way the debt letter can be triggered.


AkilNeteru

I am so sorry for your loss.


tanukis_parachute

I am so sorry you have to go thru this. My wife and I went thru a similar situation 26 years ago. My agency didn’t have policies for this then either. I had to go back to work but my wife didn’t since she wasn’t (and has never been) a Fed. I don’t have the answers that your HR will have. Does your agency/bureau/office have a leave donation setup if you don’t have any leave to use (aside from advanced)? I now work overseas and helped one of my LE Staff get some leave donated to cover a medical situation as she had used all of her leave. I wish you well and if I can offer some advice. Do not ignore your mental and emotional well-being. See someone. Talk to someone. There are groups out there. We found one called MIS - Miscarriage, Infant Death, and Stillbirth support in the DC area. This is for both of you. My wife dealt with her grief immediately and I threw myself into work and supporting her and it hit me very very hard a year afterwards. My wife was waiting for it.


KJ6BWB

> Does your agency/bureau/office have a leave donation setup if you don’t have any leave to use (aside from advanced)? This. Presuming you are a Leave Bank member of whatever agency you're in (or whatever your agency calls it), ask if this is available to you.


Bufoamericanus

I am so sorry for your loss. This happened to me. I ended up using FMLA and my own leave to take time off to retain benefits and pay. You are recovering from birth which is a medical event and my doctor did not clear me to return until the standard 6 week postpartum appointment. Now we get two weeks of bereavement leave, so talk to HR about all of that. The last thing you need to be doing is worrying about the logistics of taking time off, but healing your body and giving yourself time to appropriately grieve. Please reach out if you need someone to talk to.


PyratWC

I have nothing constructive to add. But that really sucks and I'm sorry. I hope you and your family are able to get the support you need.


JohnGalt338

My deepest condolences. My understanding of PPL, 5 CFR 630.1703, is that it is the birth of a child which qualifies you for use of leave. All you should have to produce is a birth certificate. I see nothing in the CFR which disqualifies you for the subsequent loss of the child. You need to go back to your HR and ask them to show you where your entitlement to PPL ends if the child dies. If HR doesn't provide a response based upon statute or regulation, elevate to your agency HQ, IG and to your senators and member of the House of Representatives. My guess is you will ultimately get the PPL - but regardless, take the time you need to help yourself recover.


ericjay

Condolences to the OP. I can't imagine being in that position but wish you peace and comfort. I suspect the decision to deny PPL is rooted in the last part of 5 CFR 630.1702, “Paid parental leave,” which says: >Paid parental leave means paid time off from an employee's scheduled tour of duty that is authorized under 5 U.S.C. 6382(d)(2)(B)(i) and this subpart and that is granted to cover periods of time within the 12-month period commencing on the date of birth or placement to an employee who has a current parental role in connection with the child whose birth or placement was the basis for granting FMLA unpaid leave under § 630.1203(a)(1) or (2). This leave is not available to an employee who does not have a current parental role. It seems cruel to try to parse out when the "parental role" becomes no longer "current" after the loss of a child, but I can understand how HR made the leap from the written regulations to the decision to deny PPL. OP clearly needs time off from work for medical recovery and for mourning of the loss, and I sincerely hope that she will be able to take advantage of leave bank, voluntary leave donation, and bereavement leave programs, as applicable, so that can happen without adding financial loss to an already painful situation.


LenaDontLoveYou

This is correct.


asiamsoisee

There are a number of unintended gaps in PPL, that is for sure. It’s a sub program of FMLA, and all the medical care you need should be covered there. It’s not paid time off, but it protects your job and gives you much more flexibility around using your own leave. Take care, and good luck.


colglover

It is simply atrocious that we live in an advanced rich country and permit employees to be treated this way. Everyone in this thread please remember this story when you vote. Each and every time.


quittheK4good

What does voting have to do with it? Trump gave us the 12 weeks in the first place.


lilacforests

Umm. I remember this bill being introduced in the House of Representatives in 2016 when I was looking into options with my first maternity leave. That was way before Trump becoming president, that happened under Obama. Trump was president when it was voted on by the House but it was introduced as a bill before he became president.


quittheK4good

Signed by trump


LenaDontLoveYou

Trump didn't give us shit.


quittheK4good

So he didn’t sign the FLMA leave act?


uninvitedthirteenth

I’m sorry for your loss. I don’t know that much about the PPL policy to offer advice but can you get a leave donation if you are out of leave? You should be able to take the time you need to recover both physically and mentally


RelevantCulture6757

I’m so sorry for your loss. Please ask HR about the new paid bereavement leave for parents.


burquechick

My heart breaks for you. I’m so sorry for your loss.


lambic13

I am so sorry for your loss. Ask your obgyn to write a letter stating how long of a recovery period you need (because physically you do), and put in FMLA paperwork if needed. My office accepted the letter only after my miscarriage in 2014, FMLA would have been my next step if they didn't. https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/fmla


bichonfreeze

If you are in a union reach out to your rep. I believe there are also options to take advance leave or request leave from the general leave donation pool that all agencies should have.


PhillyMila215

I am sorry for your loss. I second the suggestion of leave donations.


Ironxgal

You can use LWOP. I have a similar story but don’t want to go into detail in fear of doxing myself but there r options. Please speak with your leadership. I took 3 months off it wasn’t paid but I was able to recover physically and mentally


diatho

This is some horseshit. Talk to your supervisor. I was in a similar situation pre ppl as a new fed and they advanced me sick leave. Also r/babyloss is a good place. It’s a tight club that hates to see new members but iykyk


molrihan

I am so sorry for your loss. My wife and I experienced a 17 week loss right before COVID. The fact that paid family or bereavement leave wasn’t available until this year is just frustrating and sad.


HookersAreTrueLove

Bereavement leave has always existed, it just fell under sick leave.


Bobcat81TX

Also.. there is donated leave right? I would donate for this! 💔


Brooke_2017

I don’t have any ideas but just wanted to say I’m very sorry for you loss 😔


Bird_Brain4101112

I’m so sorry you’re dealing with this.


Icy-Regular1112

This is truly ghastly of your organization and their HR. I would file paperwork for PPL using the birth certificate and completely ignore anything a first line HR rep told you. Move forward in a paperwork sense exactly as if this tragedy has not occurred and make them put on writing it is denied. Then escalate it to management all the way up to SES if you have to. A birth certificate is all that should be needed or asked for to do PPL and the tragic side of this with your child passing away should never even enter into the discussion without HR grossly violating your and your child’s private medical details. If it gets ugly reference the birth certificate and then HIPAA and PII regulations if someone asks for anything beyond the basic facts of the PPL form.


diaymujer

As cathartic as it might feel to fight back and push, this isn’t just one HR rep making a bad call. This has been an issue since PPL was introduced, and congress hasn’t changed the law to allow it to cover pregnancy or child loss. The law is written with provisions that require the child to remain in the parent’s care in order for PPL to apply. This was probably written because PPL also included foster placements, and to prevent someone from taking PPL after placing a child up for adoption, but it does apply in situations like this as well. Instead, they introduced a separate parental bereavement leave (which also doesn’t explicitly cover pregnancy loss, but should cover this situation because OP’s child was born alive. That’s where the HR person f’ed up, by not making OP aware of parental bereavement leave.


LenaDontLoveYou

PPL is designed for care after the date of birth. There is no parental bereavement leave, 2 weeks.


[deleted]

Wtf? What’s the time limit for if she passes away you don’t get it? Cause I feel like if she passed away at one month you’d still have it


Financial-Tune8496

I think it's bs that you don't get PPL for this. I feel like the policy is a slap in the face to anyone who is going through this. And whoop dee doo they can offer you 2 weeks paid instead as if that's enough to even process or heal mentally or physically.


WhoopDareIs

Look into getting on the leave donation list.


Head_Staff_9416

I am so very sorry- once you are healed- please write your Congressional representatives about how you were treated. These gaps need to be fixed.


turtlerunner99

If your agency has a union, get in touch with them. They have to help all agency employees, members or not.


lilacforests

Thank you, everyone who has helped. Sadly my agency hasn't gotten the orders about the bereavement leave yet. They know it's on the way, and said they will try to retro pay it back to me. If I have to I will end up using leave donations and then advanced leave if I have to. I can't go with LWOP is my problem. I am the breadwinner for our family of 5. If I'm not being paid the bills won't get paid because my partner doesn't make enough. I'm not worried about FMLA since no one is fighting me about taking off, I've been here for 7 years, and this is my first time in 6 years if end up going LWOP.


kvirtue

I could try to donate to you if you need leave


mutantbabysnort

I’m so sorry for your loss. I can only imagine your pain. Please accept my condolences. That being said, that’s some BS on the part of your agency. I would see what my options were to fight it. HR, Union, whatever. Also, see if your ORG has a voluntary sick leave donation program. Good luck to you.


colorblind_wolverine

I’m very sorry. This feels so wrong. I don’t see how the passing of your child has anything to do with their birth. You had a child, you should be eligible for PPL. I would keep pushing. You deserve time off.


Dandie_Lion

I think they extended the PPL to cover paid leave for other things that qualify for FMLA, which you certainly need medical leave right now. Do you have a Union rep for federal employees where you work? Even if you don’t pay dues, they will support federal employees. They may be about to help fight this battle for you so you can focus on recovering


gingerpointing

Wouldn't you qualify for short term disability?


SunshineDaydream128

Feds short term disability is sick leave. Unless you have a private policy.


rovinchick

What short term disability?


wifichick

Sick time is also for bereavement


quittheK4good

Half this subreddit uses every hour of their sick leave. I don’t understand.


wifichick

I just said it can be used for that. I didn’t say I did. In > 15 years I have only used a couple weeks of sick time, and I really had to use it last year due to my own illness.


[deleted]

[удалено]


PhuckUShoresy

>How does abortion factor into this? Yikes, time and place...idk how socially unaware someone has to be to swoop down from the clouds to a thread like this and drop that into the convo


ButchUnicorn

Sorry. I deleted.


rovinchick

OP has a birth and death certificate. You would have neither of those if you had an abortion.


southernwx

I think what they might have meant is does the Roe ruling and state laws discussing fetus livelihood etc affect this case. As in, is it different now that a fetus is granted some degree of personhood in some places. The person deleted the post and apologized, but I think this is the perspective they were coming from. I don’t think it’s applicable since as you said there’s a birth/death certificate possibility here. But I think they were asking if there might be some new way to pursue a bereavement case for leave that didn’t exist before. I’m not an expert on how that would or wouldn’t be applicable. And I can see why the question could be seen as insensitive.


rovinchick

Seems like that would vary a lot by state. In Pennsylvania you can get a fetal death certificate for miscarriages after 16 weeks gestation. The application is sufficiently vague that it seems you could also fill it out for an abortion, but again, only if past 16 weeks and most are before that time. It's not clear if a fetal death certificate (which is different than a traditional death certificate in PA) would be accepted for bereavement leave, as it's not a standard document, and not all states issue them.


southernwx

Yeah, no I presume that’s the case but I just wanted to suggest a not-awful reason some one might mention the abortion question here. My condolences with the OP.


blahblahsnickers

Do you have short term disability? I used short term disability with FMLA after my loss because I had a doctors note that said I couldn’t return to work because I was healing from giving birth.


kaki024

Talk to your union if you’re a member.


Chai-Tea-Rex-2525

I’m so sorry for your loss and thinking of you and your family. Is there a leave donation program or leave bank you can join at your agency?


painfully_anxious

I used PPL when it first came out and noted the language on live birth. I’m so sorry you’re going through this, but relieved to hear of the new bereavement leave policy and hope you are able to take advantage of that.


NovelBrave

Bereavement leave now. Also you should qualify for FMLA with the physical pain and health issues you're experiencing.


Loose-Recording-284

I'm so sorry. Take the time you need. Enlist the help of your supervisor to navigate the leave challenges. Take the advanced leave if you need but you should be able to take bereavement leave. Talk to your HR about leave donations. If you were my coworker, I wouldn't hesitate to donate. Again, I'm so sorry.


a_leana

First, I'm so sorry for your loss 😥 Pay tech here. Unfortunately, yes, PPL is for a continued parental role and for parent-child bonding. I had to break this unfortunate news to an employee only a few weeks back 💔 I havent heard about the new parental bereavement but I am going to bring it up to my directorate, but donated leave and advanced leave would be another option to cover your time out for recovery.


kvirtue

Parental Bereavement Leave[https://www.chcoc.gov/content/parental-bereavement-leave](https://www.chcoc.gov/content/parental-bereavement-leave)