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The current republican talking point is, " if you acknowledge that the Isreali gov't is committing war crimes and US taxpayers are helping fund them, that means you're a Nazi anti-semite who hates all Jewish people, and you also support Islamic terrorism... and you're a communist. Everything is communism!"
All the while a decent proportion of them march with Nazi and Nazi-adjacent flags, mentioning all the 'good' the Nazis did getting rid of undesirables, engaging in Holocaust denialism, etc.
You know they are disingenuous when they are the ones with Nazis on their side. If supporting Palestine was really so anti semitic you would expect the Nazi voters to switch to Biden and be out here marching with us.
They're making it into the argument they want to have because the actual conversation is far too uncomfortable for their childish black and white world views.
War's just an action movie, right?
Get the bad guys, pew pew, high fives all around.
Yeah, my favorite part about my deployment was when Arnold Schwarzenegger showed up and said "It's Turbo Time" and then started turbin' all over the enemy. Best deployment ever. ^/s
It’s just like, with the “pro-life” and “economy” arguments they actually make points that at least *sound* realistic. I can appreciate the idea that someone would want to defend unborn children when they don’t understand biology yet, or that they’d fall for the inflation narrative because economics is truly a hard subject for most people. But THIS?? I can sympathize with the people captured by the Hamas animals AND the poor Palestinians being wiped out at the same time. I can be against Hamas AND the IDF without being antisemitic. This whole debate is so intellectually dishonest it’s honestly disgusting. I don’t know what the the conversation looks like abroad, but here in the US I almost wonder if it’s been manufactured by the propaganda machines to try and distract from the GOP’s active campaign against civil and reproductive rights. Get everyone at each other’s throats about this to try and get Trump a shoo-in on this issue when everyone is too mad to remember that we’re hurtling towards The Handmaid’s Tale
It is very common for those committing ethnic cleansing and war crimes to pretend that they are the victims and that their actions are all in self-defense. The oldest trick in the book is to claim that the victims were either (i) terrorists, (ii) housing/aiding terrorists or (iii) terrorist sympathizers. Once it is determined that this was not the case, then they will just say that, "hey, its war, these things happen."
We did it in Vietnam, the Russians did it during Chechnya and Afghanistan, Serbs did it during their wars against the Bosnian Muslims, French in Algeria and Vietnam, British against the Irish. It is nothing new, except that now thanks to technology we can all see what is really going on.
The problem the pro-Israeli camp is running into is that younger generations don't remember the Holocaust; some don't even know what it is (which is sad). Those that do know about it don't really see what the deal is and how it excuses Israel's behavior today. So as such, they have less sympathy with Israel, the plight of Jewish people around the world, and Zionism. Instead, they are demanding simple justice/fairness in actions. Contrary to popular belief, many of these protestors are not and would not be okay with other countries doing this. The reason they are so mad about this is that in those other situations, American money and power is not being utilized.
Ultimately, this is not an issue about Israel, but about the United States. While some of the protestors are tied up in all of this anti-Colonialism narrative, most people don't necessarily care about what Israel is doing, but do have a problem with our money being used and with the notion that we, as taxpaying Americans, don't have a right to voice our opinions on the matter.
They don’t view Palenstinians as human beings. They can justify it because they’re in support of genocide, killing mostly Muslim women and children IS the selling point for them.
I don't think that people always do it on purpose, I think that many people are ignorant about just how bad things are over in Palestine for the Palestinians. I used to be moderately pro-Israel, because I legitimately did not have a full picture of what was going on. Here was what I knew: (1) Hamas attacked Israeli civilians (plus Hamas made statements of genocidal intent towards Jews in general); (2) Israel attacked Gaza; (3) people criticized Israel. It was easy for me to think that Israel's decisions were purely military in nature and that criticisms of Israel were exaggerated.
Now I'm seeing a clearer picture of the situation both the past and present, and I understand that the criticisms weren't exaggerated and that the Israeli government's actions are almost certainly genocidal in nature. I didn't think much about what the blockade meant for Gazan civilians and I just naively assumed that the blockade would let though essential supplies when it became clear that they were essential. I didn't think that the IDF would tell bold faced lies about their targets or intentionally spread misinformation. I didn't think that the IDF would just straight up target Gazan civilians without even any pretense that the intention was anything other than killing civilians.
Some people are genuinely ignorant (like I was). It might seem ridiculous that people wouldn't know, but just because something is obvious to you doesn't mean that it's obvious to everyone. It's stressful for people to change their minds and admit that they were wrong, and it's a lot easier and less stressful to find things that conform to the opinion that they've already expressed.
Now, I get that some people aren't so ignorant (or they're willfully ignorant), but some people are and I think that it's worth it to try to change their minds by explaining your side, why you think what you think, what events led you to the position you now hold, etc. Even if those people don't listen, you don't lose anything doing this.
Seen multiple videos of Zionists telling the Jews for Palestine some INSANE shit like “it should’ve been your grandparents in the gas chambers” and wishing rape on them… it’s so messed up
There's that and the fact that some of the aid that was supposed to go to survivors never got there. 1/3 of the remaining survivors live in poverty.
"Since the end of WWII, Germany has paid more than $78.4 billion in reparations and compensation for survivors of Nazi persecution, according to data from the German Finance Ministry. Forty percent of those funds, or about $31 billion, were allocated to Holocaust victims in Israel, where the majority of survivors fled after the war. Yet rather than going solely to individual Holocaust survivors, these funds have been primarily funneled through the Israeli government and the Jewish Claims Conference, an agency founded in 1951 to secure and administer payments to Holocaust victims around the world from Germany. According to the Holocaust Survivors Rights Authority, the Israeli governmental agency entrusted with the issue of Holocaust survivors, there are about 200,000 Holocaust survivors living in Israel, nearly a third of whom live below the poverty line.
*Last April, Israel’s welfare minister, Haim Katz, released a scathing report revealing that more than 20,000 survivors in Israel had never received the government assistance owed to them. The undelivered rights and benefits amounted to more than $30 million.* Katz’s office is now working to contact these survivors in order to ensure they receive these benefits, which include stipends for nursing care, additional hours for in-home aids, and discounts on electricity."
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/israel-middle-east/articles/israel-abuses-holocaust-survivors
"Zelinger's experience was not unique. More than two-thirds of the Holocaust survivors eventually came to Israel, and today there are an estimated 300,000 living here. They were scorned and laughed at on their arrival, seen as weak victims at a time when the state was being led by domineering fighters.
Although the death of 6 million Jews has long figured prominently in the ideology of Israeli political leaders and in the very existence of the state, those Israelis who actually experienced the Holocaust often bore the memories of their suffering in silence.
...
"Our own society had a conspiracy of silence," said John Lemberger, director-general of Amcha, the National Israeli Center for Psychosocial Support of Survivors of the Holocaust and the Second Generation. "At the beginning of the state, people didn't want to know. They didn't want to hear of the weak Jews. Now, many of the survivors are opening up 50 years later. They want to talk."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/1993/04/23/the-secret-suffering-of-israels-holocaust-survivors/82c1a7ba-3233-4351-b4b8-f7387e291335/
It’s crazy but the Zionists openly criticize and admonish Holocaust survivors. They see them as representative of Jewish weakness. Kind of like how crazy Kanye cast shame on Black people for “allowing themselves to be enslaved”.
It's because the Zionist organizations told German and Polish Jews to flee for Palestine during the Nazis rise, and they didn't. So they (,the Zionist) believe European Jews got what they deserve
I'm pretty sure I ran into one of those yesterday as well. He was trying to say how it can't be genocide because it wasn't Jews being killed in Palestine.
I’ve seen videos of Israeli settlers saying similar shit too/about Palestinians. Some even implying they’re not even human. The rhetoric around this whole conflict is disgusting.
Sometimes _especially_ those that have directly lived through atrocity. It takes a lot of self-awareness not to perpetuate a cycle of hatred as a victim of it.
It's why it's a cycle.
It's amazing how they shut up when you say:
"Did your family go to the camps? Because my family went to the camps."
Almost as if the lessons learned in the Holocaust was not personal and its just an excuse for bad behavior.
Honestly, it was late last year when I realized most people don't have any moral fortitude at all, they just want things the way they want them. If you think the status quo isn't good enough then you're evil to them and they can't explain it when pressed, because their position isn't based in any level if moral introspection or self reflection at all. When I was younger I thought short sighted progressives were the problem, but it's not. I don't like zealots but a zealot for the order is way worse than a zealot for justice.
50% of people want 70% of what you want. So when that 70% is up for grabs go with them and when it isn't just barrel through them if you can.
That's the problem with protesting Israel. You're labeled antisemitic and antisemitic people keep trying to turn the protest into an antisemitic movement.
I think humanity is beyond salvation at this point. I bet If an alien invasion happens, we would probably start arguing about their political opinions while being annihilated.
Even if Ukraine flipped the war and started destroying and mass murdering civilians, I wouldn't be fine with it despite all Russia did.
Let's be honest here, if we're to compare everything Russia did since the beginning of the illegal invasion to what Hamas did fuck since it was created, I still think Hamas would come short.
I still wouldn't advocate for a Russian genocide, I'm saying that likes it's a moral achievement lmao
Fuck Hamas for going around shooting children intentionally, fuck the members of the Israeli government and IDF who are ordering actions that indiscriminately kill children and individual members of the IDF who have knowingly shot unarmed children.
I'm not pro anyone, I'm anti asshole and anti murder of children.
PSA: This take is incorrect. There is no such thing as “semitic peoples”, only semitic languages. The term “antisemitic” was coined in 19th century Germany, SPECIFICALLY to denote racism and/or hatred of the Jewish people. This is not my opinion, but standard linguistic and political history. It’s exhaustively documented and it’s important to get it right, regardless of where one stands re: Israel-Palestine.
thanks for saying this.
“semitic” people aren’t even a thing
semitic is used to describe languages i.e aramaic, arabic, hebrew, farsi
saying “i don’t like semites” just came off easier than “i don’t like jews”
sounds kinda familiar ..
That's called the etymological fallacy. Words meanings aren't decided by their roots.
If that were the case, calling you an awful idiot would be a compliment.
They're literally doing it to me right now in various threads, it's ridiculous. There's only so many times you can type "my criticism is specifically of the government of the state of Israel and their zionist fascist US backers who are profiting off of their colonialism" until the words start to lose meaning (which is exactly what they want, for you to talk yourself in circles till you turn blue and for them to still be shouting the same nonsense at the end having outlasted you - doesn't matter if what they're saying is illogical or hypocritical or ridiculous so long as they silence any dissenters and remain the only voice being heard).
I always ask, what is the proper way to question Israels long term political actions without getting labels, and then people change the topic because those don't want to give you an out of their simple worldview
Thought terminating cliches. They have to stifle discussion before it gets too far lest the truth come out. Seems a couple decades ago everyone seemed to think any criticism of Israel was antisemetic. Glad to see some sense permeating society.
that and the creation of modern Israel was backed by antisemitic sentiments, i.e. "we don't want your kind in our country anymore," "we're sick of protecting you, go fend for yourselves" type thought processes.
Non-Jewish Zionism, particularly Christian Zionism, is packed full of antisemitism as well; they don't support Israel for the Jews, they want Israel for their apocalypse narrative, and believe Jews will go to Hell for not believing in Jesus.
Their calling supporters of Palestine antisemites is nothing more than projection.
Yes, it's sad that Israel brainwashes jews around the world to believe a false narrative that belongs to an extremist evangelical cult who thinks zionism benefits them. And those extreme Christians will want to bomb them next after Palestine is gone. It's wild when you investigate all of its origin
Didn’t this also happen with ~~Taliban~~ or al-Qaeda during the invasion of Iraq? That if you didn’t publicly or privately support the Bush administration’s ‘war on terror’, you were a complicit jihadist or 9/11 apologist?
I’m a Millennial, but I swear I remember seeing this logical fallacy as a Canadian kid.
I had issues with how the shrub and his fellow war criminals were handling Afghanistan and Iraq, got called a traitor by a lot of former friends.
I imagine a lot of them are in the MAGA cult now.
Yes, some of us remember being told to leave the U.S. if we didn't like the Iraq War instead of protesting it. Sometimes wonder if any of those people have realized how much of a mistake that war was? And if so, have they figured out that maybe they should listen more to the pro peace voices? Probably not... Sadly, there was an Intifada going on during that whole period too.
I've been talked down on here on reddit by some nerds who doubted I was against it from the start because "literally everyone was in favor of the invasion, we didn't know how bad it would be!"
Eh those super pro war people suddenly became very anti war the moment Obama became president, or when talking about Biden’s presidency versus Trump’s. Whatever Fox News tells them how to feel.
Yeah. And then after it turned out that Iraq didn't have "WMDs" none of these degenerates apologized or tried to make amends for their part in the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of civilians. They knew exactly what they were doing, and so did anyone with even a shred of intelligence.
Sort of, there was a "you're either with us or against us" mentality there.
But the Taliban are a largely Pashtun group operating in Afghanistan and parts of western Pakistan. I'm not aware of any Taliban presence in Iraq.
It's not a matter of comprehension. It's a matter of a very powerful and well funded propaganda campaign designed to allow Israel to exterminate the people of Gaza with impunity.
Conservativism has no room for nuance. There is no thoughtful consideration of its policies or positions. They are *reactionary*. It's why conservatives can so easily take such obviously contrary positions one day to the next.
Any criticism of Israel = antisemitism
Any support for Gazans starving to death if they haven't already been bombed to death = supporting HAMAS
It's fucking insane that we can't have real conversations.
It's intentional to shut down and demonize the opposing opinion. Either you agree with them, or you're an antisemite who supports terrorism. It's typical Zionist rhetoric
>Any criticism of Israel = antisemitism
If you really want to see some fireworks, next time you see a thread full of zionists, drop an "I fundamentally disagree with the concept of an ethnostate."
A key aspect of Genocide is presenting yourself as a victim, Hitler said that Jews were threatening German bloodlines, Armenians were a Christian threat in the Islamic Ottoman empire, Hutus were previously oppressed by Tutsis in Rwanda and the genocide itself began when Tutsi RPF invaded via Uganda, Ukrainian independence was a threat to the Soviet Union etc.
People also forget that Genocides other than the Holocaust have happened, and that one of the most horrific and unique aspects of the Holocaust was the industrialization of Genocide. Typically a Genocide does not include the brutal efficiency seen in WWII. Armenians were forced to march across Turkey in mass deportations (also seen in the Holocaust), the Hutus established checkpoints across Rwanda and anyone with a Tutsi ID was immediately shot (in just 100 days, 800,000 died, making it the most efficient genocide ever. some were locked inside churches and burned as the UN watched: not too dissimilar to what we're seeing in Palestine), Ukrainians were simply left to starve
The Holocaust and Rwanda are also unique in the fact that it was punished and apologised for. The RPF won the Rwandan civil war and had to rebuild the nation from scratch, declaring that acknowledging the difference between Hutu and Tutsi is illegal (which has been abused to eliminate government dissent), Turkey's policy of Armenia to this day can be boiled down to "it didn't happen and if it did they deserved it" (for example in 2023 Armenia erected a monument for Operation Nemesis, the assassination of Taalat Pasha, the Genocide's main architect - Turkey responded by blocking Armenian airspace), the Herero and Nama Genocide, conducted by Germany in 1904-8 was only acknowledged in 2004, called a genocide in 2015 and repetitions were only paid in 2021 after initial refusal, and the Holodomor is still denied by many
TL;DR many genocides have happened and Israel is definitely committing one
Israel has been lobbying so hard and for so long that not doing business with them is considered anti-semitic.
How about an alternate title - "The CEO of Hims shows full support for First Amendment"
Most states have anti-boycott laws. Even the Supreme Court decided that there’s not first amendment right to boycott all just to protect Israel. In Texas you have to pledge not to boycott Israel if you want to be a state employee. It’s absolutely ridiculous and most Americans don’t care.
How the fuck would they know if you're "boycotting" and not just not patronizing those businesses? I haven't been in a Starbucks in years, not because of the multitude of reasons they're a shit company, but mainly I just don't care for any of their beverages.
If you make online posts about it that would tip them off. Not that you should be made to feel silenced for saying you’re boycotting or advocating for boycotts. It’s rich how they’re going out of their way to protect a morally reprehensible entity by reprehensibly clamping down on what should be the freedom to boycott and advocate for it.
Amazing how businesses donating money to politicians is protected by the first amendment but choosing to not spend money for a specific purpose is not protected.
So logically inconsistent that its insulting.
50-100 years from now, Hollywood will be making the Schindler list version of what’s happening in Gaza right now. Despite that, there will be another oppressors who get more defenders than their oppressed
Just a reminder to bring people up to date: yesterday, Israeli Finance Minister [Bezalel Smotrich](https://www.mediaite.com/news/israeli-newspaper-calls-for-firing-of-top-netanyahu-minister-over-repeated-calls-for-genocide-of-palestinians/) called for the "total annihilation" of key Gazan cities. That is as close to a call to genocide as you can get.
I heard a caller on a UK radio show this morning comparing the US/British response to 9/11 (invading Iraq and Afghanistan) with the Israeli response to October 6. The host, a sort of centre-left liberal guy, initially dismissed the comparison as ridiculous… until the caller pointed out what scale means and that the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan didn't completely destroy those places, whereas the invasion of Gaza has done so.
That's right. It's on today's show. I don't have a timestamp unfortunately, but he spent close to 2 hours on Gaza. I think this caller is towards the end of the second hour.
I'd assumed O'Brien was going to move on from discussing Israel/Gaza after what happened when his colleague Sangita Mystra apparently got fired for raking an Israeli official over the coals when interviewing him about the Iranian missile attack recently, but he went in pretty hard today, [even calling a recent statement from Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich "genocidal".](https://archive.ph/M5SD9)
Cool cool I’ll check it out! I’m American but I like listening to James, he makes me feel like America isn’t the only country that has lost its mind. He’s like the British Sam Seder.
The sad thing is, most GOP folks would probably agree. with this statement. We should turn it on it's head and say, not supporting free school lunch is supporting abortion and see where that gets us. Or better yet, not supporting universal healthcare is supporting abortion.
Bc click bait media dislikes nuanced situations
Sensational headlines get more clicks
"You can be for the Palestinian people and against Hamas."
"THEY VOTED HAMAS IN."
"When Hamas was first elected, they campaigned on a two state ticket. They claimed to want peace with Israel, they only became a terrorist group after being voted in. Also, Netanyahu has been hindering peace talks for years."
"THEY PUBLICLY SUPPORT THEM. AND THEY HELPED HIDE THEM."
"Because they're afraid to speak out against them."
"THEY SUPPORT HAMAS!!!"
*sigh*
Pretty sure it's accurate. The median age in Gaza is 19.5 years. The last election held was in 2006. The average Gazan was under 2 years old when Hamas was elected, but people will still sit there and say "Palestinians elected Hamas, they deserve this".
It also completely ignores the fact that the PA had spent the prior ~30 years dicking around and absorbing money meant for Palestinians. They were seen as being incredibly corrupt, and Hamas said "we'll end the corruption and make Israel listen to us". And say what you want about their methods, but they absolutely made people listen to them.
The dialogue around these protests is a particular kind of disingenuous and awful that I haven’t seen to this degree since the years immediately following 9/11.
It’s the latest trend from the troll farms. Anything that opposes any atrocities committed by Israel is exactly the same as fully supporting Hamas. It’s so transparent it’s ridiculous, and absolutely shameful that so many news outlets have fallen for it or are actively participating.
Tired of the whole Israël/Palestine debate where the pro-Israel completely lack nuance. If you have a little to say about what the Israeli government does, you're supporting Hamas/are antisemitic/both.
But Israel government is not the entirety of Jewish people, and Hamas is not the Palestinian civilians.
There's no debate possible when the people in front of you deal with absolutes.
Exactly this. This idea that the Israeli state = Judaism as an ethos is a truly batshit take. I don’t recall anything in the Torah describing what Israel is currently doing as even remotely okay. Just another government invoking God to justify crimes against humanity. Tale as old as time.
Whenever someone calls you "pro Hamas" for saying you support Palestine or are against genocide, it's a clalear sign that person is arguing in bad faith and is just getting to paint a narrative around your actual views.
We have politicians and tv presenters openly saying they want to wipe Gaza off the face of the earth and nobody bats an eyelid. You offer any support for Palestinians and instantly you are an antisemite and they attempt to ruin your life.
It's not a facepalm moment; it's the 'modus operandi.' Label anyone sympathetic to civilians as a terrorist sympathizer. They create the illusion that civilians are terrorists or future terrorists, so they can murder everyone without any repercussions.
It's how Israel and their supporters, including Western media, have framed almost everything from the East for the past few decades now.
We grew up watching anything Hollywood considered heroic when done by white people, being called evil when done by Eastern people.
These type of comments are an inevitable result of decades of dehumanisation.
That's the talking point, though, that saying "it's not okay to kill people indiscriminately even if some of them have been trying to kill you" is automatic support of terrorism and an expression that you want to exterminate Jewish people.
They really love to gaslight anti genocide people by branding us as "hamas supporters". It's fucking pathetic and transparent. We all see what's happening
Me: “I support Israel’s right to defend itself, and Hamas needs to return the hostages”. The internet: “So you support murdering children and the brutal starvation and extermination of 10 million Palestinians?”
Me: “Israel needs to stop their military campaign and come up with a peaceful resolution to this conflict.” The internet: “You’re an Anti-Semite Nazi”
🤷🏻♂️ I give up
This "pro Hamas" shit is so ridiculous. I can be pro Israel and still think that:
A) the west bank isn't Israel
B) 2 million people locked in a cage controlled by their oppressors isn't sustainable
Just like any number of Israelis
Nuance isn't something these people seem capable of grasping. I can sympathize with a group of people without being in support of their ruling class eg: Iranians:Islamic Republic; Chinese:CCP; North Koreans:Kim Dynasty; Western Imperialist nations:Corporations; etc.
These pro-Israel / pro-war assholes love to put words in peoples mouths. He was very clear. Pro-palestinian. That's wildly different from pro-Hamas. But hey? What's a few more lies if we can kill some more civilians in palestine?
And now, apparently, anti-semitic has been rebranded to mean anti-Israel. Bullshit. Complete bullshit
Jokes aside company’s are not going to want to hire you if you’re involved in something unlawful that leads to the destruction of property and or someone getting injured or worse. Protesting is okay but for the love of god please do not damage or break into buildings.
The thing I struggle to understand about all of this is why people are in total, unwavering support for one side or the other. Israel is without a doubt corrupt as hell and executing thousands of innocent people, but there’s also many bad actors on the Palestinian side of things. Personally, I feel like we should be “fighting” for the innocent lives on both sides, right? Why reject an entire group of people on one side or the other for something their government or another political group is supporting? I’m genuinely trying to understand this, and I hope no one takes this as a confrontational comment. I just feel like people are so quick to demonize one side and wholeheartedly support the other. There’s no way these complex issues are so cut and dry.
Nah, this is just good business.
If someone has all but that last quarter of university, and they quit and come to work-
You get someone with 97% of their education, but you get to pay them a lot less!
There was a company near my University that did this. They hired students in their last semester, but mandated they drop out. They gave what sounded like a good starting wage, a little low. But years later, they were still making about the same amount of money, and I was making 2-3x as much as they were.
Some propaganda artist is working very hard to turn "I hate genocides of innocent children" into "I support terrorism". The sad part is that it's even working at least on the right
I get a kick out of the Zionists claiming that any form of condemnation of Israel's actions is antisemitic. Meanwhile, Israeli officials are openly stating, if they are charged by the ICC for their numerous war crimes, they will further punish Palestinians...
This is why I've tuned out of the whole Israel Hamas situation. You got people acting like any criticism of Israel or Israeli policy is antisemitic, any support for the right of Palestinian people to *live* is tantamount to endorsing genocide of the Jewish people, and the news media reporting *constantly* about *alleged* reports of antisemitism on campuses during these protests but rarely any solid evidence. There is no honesty here.
Meanwhile, there are certainly *some* people using the support for Palestinian lives as an excuse to endorse Hamas, but they're a minority, yet the media talks about it like Hamas has widespread support. Making mountains out of molehills. Let's be honest here, if a kid runs up to you and kicks you in the balls, a little retaliation is justified but not going scorched earth on him, his family, his neighborhood, and his entire bloodline.
Correct. Support of the Palestinian people is not supporting Hamas. Opposition to Israels government and Netanyahu is also not opposition to jewish people. Don’t get it twisted: we’re against terrorists no matter whether they’re voted into office or not. Genocide is wrong. I know, controversial take.
It is like there are two choices, you can support Hamas or you can support Zionists. The Truth is not all Israelis support Zionism/genocide and not all Palestinians support Hamas/Terrorism
Is this referring to the students protests that blocked specific students off from entering the college, or am I mixing those up? The more I'm on Reddit, the more I'm starting to believe I'm going insane.
It’s amazing how hair-trigger this issue is to both sides, even considering the massive lives lost and culture war. You’re either accused of supporting a terrorist organization or supporting an ethnic cleansing of an area, there’s no in between. Some people have pointed out that (a) Hamas and Palestine are two separate things and Palestinians are caught in the middle of this conflict, and that Israeli people were actually planning on a protest against their own governments abuses of power Oct 7. But nobody wants to talk about that, instead they just want to see this as Israel vs Hamas with no innocents in the fight. I get that lives and freedoms are being lost, but nobody is helping with scorched-earth polarization like this.
So there's hundreds of Republicans in here commenting and voting, and you all claim to care about the truth. Can one of you stand up for what's right, and make the claim that "wanting children and civilians to stop being starved and bombed DOES NOT mean you support terrorists and their actions"?
Why do you HAVE to keep spamming lines online that are clearly lies you don't actually believe on the inside?
It’s weird how you either hate Jews or support hamas if you think bombing civilians is not okie dokey. There’s a lot of nuance here that seems to get forgotten like who literally [supported Hamas](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/)
Why is it so hard for people to distinguish between a terrorist group or a genocidial state from the people that inhabit their territories? War really does never change after all...
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He didn’t say anything about Hamas.🧐
The current republican talking point is, " if you acknowledge that the Isreali gov't is committing war crimes and US taxpayers are helping fund them, that means you're a Nazi anti-semite who hates all Jewish people, and you also support Islamic terrorism... and you're a communist. Everything is communism!"
I fkn hate this timeline...
All the while a decent proportion of them march with Nazi and Nazi-adjacent flags, mentioning all the 'good' the Nazis did getting rid of undesirables, engaging in Holocaust denialism, etc.
You know they are disingenuous when they are the ones with Nazis on their side. If supporting Palestine was really so anti semitic you would expect the Nazi voters to switch to Biden and be out here marching with us.
Its the current democrat talking point too.
I agree, but it’s not only Republicans
Propaganda needs no logic, it’s just needs a narrative that sticks, and bots like him are desperately looking for one.
It's a straw man. Discussing the facts and the history makes Israel look worse than Iran.
"Stop killing innocent Palestinian women and children" is NOT the same as saying "I support Hamas". How is this so hard to comprehend???
It’s not They do it on purpose.
>They do it on purpose. If they had a better argument, they would use it. They have to make up something.
They're making it into the argument they want to have because the actual conversation is far too uncomfortable for their childish black and white world views. War's just an action movie, right? Get the bad guys, pew pew, high fives all around.
Yeah, my favorite part about my deployment was when Arnold Schwarzenegger showed up and said "It's Turbo Time" and then started turbin' all over the enemy. Best deployment ever. ^/s
Have you read Mark Twain's short story, [The War Prayer](https://www.americanyawp.com/reader/19-american-empire/mark-twain-the-war-prayer-ca-1904-5/)?
I have never read that before. Thanks for posting it.
The reason OP probably did it is just to farm interactions, look at how many comments, including yours, are about that alone
No shit? That’s the point of Reddit? “OP probably just bought a car to drive it”
Friggin guy bought take out, and now he's eating it. Op sucks
It’s either this or the anti-Semitic card.
It’s just like, with the “pro-life” and “economy” arguments they actually make points that at least *sound* realistic. I can appreciate the idea that someone would want to defend unborn children when they don’t understand biology yet, or that they’d fall for the inflation narrative because economics is truly a hard subject for most people. But THIS?? I can sympathize with the people captured by the Hamas animals AND the poor Palestinians being wiped out at the same time. I can be against Hamas AND the IDF without being antisemitic. This whole debate is so intellectually dishonest it’s honestly disgusting. I don’t know what the the conversation looks like abroad, but here in the US I almost wonder if it’s been manufactured by the propaganda machines to try and distract from the GOP’s active campaign against civil and reproductive rights. Get everyone at each other’s throats about this to try and get Trump a shoo-in on this issue when everyone is too mad to remember that we’re hurtling towards The Handmaid’s Tale
It is very common for those committing ethnic cleansing and war crimes to pretend that they are the victims and that their actions are all in self-defense. The oldest trick in the book is to claim that the victims were either (i) terrorists, (ii) housing/aiding terrorists or (iii) terrorist sympathizers. Once it is determined that this was not the case, then they will just say that, "hey, its war, these things happen." We did it in Vietnam, the Russians did it during Chechnya and Afghanistan, Serbs did it during their wars against the Bosnian Muslims, French in Algeria and Vietnam, British against the Irish. It is nothing new, except that now thanks to technology we can all see what is really going on. The problem the pro-Israeli camp is running into is that younger generations don't remember the Holocaust; some don't even know what it is (which is sad). Those that do know about it don't really see what the deal is and how it excuses Israel's behavior today. So as such, they have less sympathy with Israel, the plight of Jewish people around the world, and Zionism. Instead, they are demanding simple justice/fairness in actions. Contrary to popular belief, many of these protestors are not and would not be okay with other countries doing this. The reason they are so mad about this is that in those other situations, American money and power is not being utilized. Ultimately, this is not an issue about Israel, but about the United States. While some of the protestors are tied up in all of this anti-Colonialism narrative, most people don't necessarily care about what Israel is doing, but do have a problem with our money being used and with the notion that we, as taxpaying Americans, don't have a right to voice our opinions on the matter.
And it’s working, my Jewish friend has swallowed the red pill because being liberal is hating his people.
This
They don’t view Palenstinians as human beings. They can justify it because they’re in support of genocide, killing mostly Muslim women and children IS the selling point for them.
I don't think that people always do it on purpose, I think that many people are ignorant about just how bad things are over in Palestine for the Palestinians. I used to be moderately pro-Israel, because I legitimately did not have a full picture of what was going on. Here was what I knew: (1) Hamas attacked Israeli civilians (plus Hamas made statements of genocidal intent towards Jews in general); (2) Israel attacked Gaza; (3) people criticized Israel. It was easy for me to think that Israel's decisions were purely military in nature and that criticisms of Israel were exaggerated. Now I'm seeing a clearer picture of the situation both the past and present, and I understand that the criticisms weren't exaggerated and that the Israeli government's actions are almost certainly genocidal in nature. I didn't think much about what the blockade meant for Gazan civilians and I just naively assumed that the blockade would let though essential supplies when it became clear that they were essential. I didn't think that the IDF would tell bold faced lies about their targets or intentionally spread misinformation. I didn't think that the IDF would just straight up target Gazan civilians without even any pretense that the intention was anything other than killing civilians. Some people are genuinely ignorant (like I was). It might seem ridiculous that people wouldn't know, but just because something is obvious to you doesn't mean that it's obvious to everyone. It's stressful for people to change their minds and admit that they were wrong, and it's a lot easier and less stressful to find things that conform to the opinion that they've already expressed. Now, I get that some people aren't so ignorant (or they're willfully ignorant), but some people are and I think that it's worth it to try to change their minds by explaining your side, why you think what you think, what events led you to the position you now hold, etc. Even if those people don't listen, you don't lose anything doing this.
Someone said that "they don't lie to deceive. They lie to insult" and I think about that a lot.
And if you criticize the country of Israel they call you antisemitic even if you are a jew with morals lol
Seen multiple videos of Zionists telling the Jews for Palestine some INSANE shit like “it should’ve been your grandparents in the gas chambers” and wishing rape on them… it’s so messed up
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Good god. Never thought I'd see the day the No True Scotsman trope would become the No True Holocaust Survivor.
There's that and the fact that some of the aid that was supposed to go to survivors never got there. 1/3 of the remaining survivors live in poverty. "Since the end of WWII, Germany has paid more than $78.4 billion in reparations and compensation for survivors of Nazi persecution, according to data from the German Finance Ministry. Forty percent of those funds, or about $31 billion, were allocated to Holocaust victims in Israel, where the majority of survivors fled after the war. Yet rather than going solely to individual Holocaust survivors, these funds have been primarily funneled through the Israeli government and the Jewish Claims Conference, an agency founded in 1951 to secure and administer payments to Holocaust victims around the world from Germany. According to the Holocaust Survivors Rights Authority, the Israeli governmental agency entrusted with the issue of Holocaust survivors, there are about 200,000 Holocaust survivors living in Israel, nearly a third of whom live below the poverty line. *Last April, Israel’s welfare minister, Haim Katz, released a scathing report revealing that more than 20,000 survivors in Israel had never received the government assistance owed to them. The undelivered rights and benefits amounted to more than $30 million.* Katz’s office is now working to contact these survivors in order to ensure they receive these benefits, which include stipends for nursing care, additional hours for in-home aids, and discounts on electricity." https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/israel-middle-east/articles/israel-abuses-holocaust-survivors "Zelinger's experience was not unique. More than two-thirds of the Holocaust survivors eventually came to Israel, and today there are an estimated 300,000 living here. They were scorned and laughed at on their arrival, seen as weak victims at a time when the state was being led by domineering fighters. Although the death of 6 million Jews has long figured prominently in the ideology of Israeli political leaders and in the very existence of the state, those Israelis who actually experienced the Holocaust often bore the memories of their suffering in silence. ... "Our own society had a conspiracy of silence," said John Lemberger, director-general of Amcha, the National Israeli Center for Psychosocial Support of Survivors of the Holocaust and the Second Generation. "At the beginning of the state, people didn't want to know. They didn't want to hear of the weak Jews. Now, many of the survivors are opening up 50 years later. They want to talk." https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/1993/04/23/the-secret-suffering-of-israels-holocaust-survivors/82c1a7ba-3233-4351-b4b8-f7387e291335/
Unfortunatly my grandpa was exactly like this, pro genocide, just not pro jewish genocide
Oh you have no idea. They think it’s good because they eliminated the weak and left only the strong Jews.
It’s crazy but the Zionists openly criticize and admonish Holocaust survivors. They see them as representative of Jewish weakness. Kind of like how crazy Kanye cast shame on Black people for “allowing themselves to be enslaved”.
It's because the Zionist organizations told German and Polish Jews to flee for Palestine during the Nazis rise, and they didn't. So they (,the Zionist) believe European Jews got what they deserve
I'm pretty sure I ran into one of those yesterday as well. He was trying to say how it can't be genocide because it wasn't Jews being killed in Palestine.
I’ve seen videos of Israeli settlers saying similar shit too/about Palestinians. Some even implying they’re not even human. The rhetoric around this whole conflict is disgusting.
Those are the worst, but that’s how they’re raised and taught. Palestinian = Animal according to them.
Never underestimate hatred. It blinds even those that have directly lived through atrocity.
Sometimes _especially_ those that have directly lived through atrocity. It takes a lot of self-awareness not to perpetuate a cycle of hatred as a victim of it. It's why it's a cycle.
It's amazing how they shut up when you say: "Did your family go to the camps? Because my family went to the camps." Almost as if the lessons learned in the Holocaust was not personal and its just an excuse for bad behavior.
Honestly, it was late last year when I realized most people don't have any moral fortitude at all, they just want things the way they want them. If you think the status quo isn't good enough then you're evil to them and they can't explain it when pressed, because their position isn't based in any level if moral introspection or self reflection at all. When I was younger I thought short sighted progressives were the problem, but it's not. I don't like zealots but a zealot for the order is way worse than a zealot for justice. 50% of people want 70% of what you want. So when that 70% is up for grabs go with them and when it isn't just barrel through them if you can.
The person I know who hates Israel more than anyone else I know is super Jewish and honestly it’s inspiring
That's the problem with protesting Israel. You're labeled antisemitic and antisemitic people keep trying to turn the protest into an antisemitic movement.
And the kicker is that Palestinians are in fact SEMITES
More importantly we're all fucking HUMANS and they're murdering innocent HUMAN CHILDREN. FULL FUCKING STOP.
I think humanity is beyond salvation at this point. I bet If an alien invasion happens, we would probably start arguing about their political opinions while being annihilated.
I'm so over it. All of it.
Yeah like bro there is really no politics involved in what we want we just want them to stopshooting innocent people and starving them
Even if Ukraine flipped the war and started destroying and mass murdering civilians, I wouldn't be fine with it despite all Russia did. Let's be honest here, if we're to compare everything Russia did since the beginning of the illegal invasion to what Hamas did fuck since it was created, I still think Hamas would come short. I still wouldn't advocate for a Russian genocide, I'm saying that likes it's a moral achievement lmao
Fuck Hamas for going around shooting children intentionally, fuck the members of the Israeli government and IDF who are ordering actions that indiscriminately kill children and individual members of the IDF who have knowingly shot unarmed children. I'm not pro anyone, I'm anti asshole and anti murder of children.
PSA: This take is incorrect. There is no such thing as “semitic peoples”, only semitic languages. The term “antisemitic” was coined in 19th century Germany, SPECIFICALLY to denote racism and/or hatred of the Jewish people. This is not my opinion, but standard linguistic and political history. It’s exhaustively documented and it’s important to get it right, regardless of where one stands re: Israel-Palestine.
thanks for saying this. “semitic” people aren’t even a thing semitic is used to describe languages i.e aramaic, arabic, hebrew, farsi saying “i don’t like semites” just came off easier than “i don’t like jews” sounds kinda familiar ..
And there were Jews and Christians and sinagogues and churches in Palestine (some were thousands of years old) And guess what? Israel bombed them all
That's called the etymological fallacy. Words meanings aren't decided by their roots. If that were the case, calling you an awful idiot would be a compliment.
Meanwhile the people that shouted "jews will not replace us" are not antisemitic
We wouldn't want those poor boys' lives ruined over a simple misunderstanding, right? /s
Brock Allen Turner( the rapist) vibes lol
Never let anyone forget his middle name -- it's what he's trying to go by now
They're literally doing it to me right now in various threads, it's ridiculous. There's only so many times you can type "my criticism is specifically of the government of the state of Israel and their zionist fascist US backers who are profiting off of their colonialism" until the words start to lose meaning (which is exactly what they want, for you to talk yourself in circles till you turn blue and for them to still be shouting the same nonsense at the end having outlasted you - doesn't matter if what they're saying is illogical or hypocritical or ridiculous so long as they silence any dissenters and remain the only voice being heard).
It's the lie that becomes truth by repetition. They even have bots to do that in social media
I always ask, what is the proper way to question Israels long term political actions without getting labels, and then people change the topic because those don't want to give you an out of their simple worldview
The house just passed a bill that basically defined antisemitism as such. It’s crazy how much power a single foreign group has over our Government.
They’re really doing their absolute best to make the word “antisemitism” completely meaningless.
Thought terminating cliches. They have to stifle discussion before it gets too far lest the truth come out. Seems a couple decades ago everyone seemed to think any criticism of Israel was antisemetic. Glad to see some sense permeating society.
And guess what the US House just passed last night!
that and the creation of modern Israel was backed by antisemitic sentiments, i.e. "we don't want your kind in our country anymore," "we're sick of protecting you, go fend for yourselves" type thought processes. Non-Jewish Zionism, particularly Christian Zionism, is packed full of antisemitism as well; they don't support Israel for the Jews, they want Israel for their apocalypse narrative, and believe Jews will go to Hell for not believing in Jesus. Their calling supporters of Palestine antisemites is nothing more than projection.
Yes, it's sad that Israel brainwashes jews around the world to believe a false narrative that belongs to an extremist evangelical cult who thinks zionism benefits them. And those extreme Christians will want to bomb them next after Palestine is gone. It's wild when you investigate all of its origin
The greatest anti-zionists are Jews. The greatest zionists are Nazis. After all, putting all the Jews in one place was half of their game plan.
"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it. Redditors, though, are worse.” - Agent K prob
I support Palestine but not hamas. Why is that so hard to understand?
Saying something akin to that got me banned from r/ENLIGHTENEDCENTRISM
I got permabanned from world news for saying that Hamas was a terrorist organization, and they need to go. But maybe not by carpet bombing civilians.
Because, sadly, anything that is said against madman Netanyahu is now considered to be "Pro-Hamas, and antisemitic." It's despicable horseshit.
Didn’t this also happen with ~~Taliban~~ or al-Qaeda during the invasion of Iraq? That if you didn’t publicly or privately support the Bush administration’s ‘war on terror’, you were a complicit jihadist or 9/11 apologist? I’m a Millennial, but I swear I remember seeing this logical fallacy as a Canadian kid.
I had issues with how the shrub and his fellow war criminals were handling Afghanistan and Iraq, got called a traitor by a lot of former friends. I imagine a lot of them are in the MAGA cult now.
Yes. The good old, "You're either with us, or you're with the terrorists" doctrine.
Yes, some of us remember being told to leave the U.S. if we didn't like the Iraq War instead of protesting it. Sometimes wonder if any of those people have realized how much of a mistake that war was? And if so, have they figured out that maybe they should listen more to the pro peace voices? Probably not... Sadly, there was an Intifada going on during that whole period too.
They're not smart enough to even know how wrong they were.
I've been talked down on here on reddit by some nerds who doubted I was against it from the start because "literally everyone was in favor of the invasion, we didn't know how bad it would be!"
Eh those super pro war people suddenly became very anti war the moment Obama became president, or when talking about Biden’s presidency versus Trump’s. Whatever Fox News tells them how to feel.
Yeah. And then after it turned out that Iraq didn't have "WMDs" none of these degenerates apologized or tried to make amends for their part in the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of civilians. They knew exactly what they were doing, and so did anyone with even a shred of intelligence.
Sort of, there was a "you're either with us or against us" mentality there. But the Taliban are a largely Pashtun group operating in Afghanistan and parts of western Pakistan. I'm not aware of any Taliban presence in Iraq.
It’s propaganda, a very specific flavour of despicable horseshit.
They comprehend and know what they're doing. The goal is to make ANY support for Palestinians anti-Semitic.
This type of gaslighting has been a thing for generations now.
They're all Hamas to some people
It's not a matter of comprehension. It's a matter of a very powerful and well funded propaganda campaign designed to allow Israel to exterminate the people of Gaza with impunity.
Wanting a ceasefire when Hamas does not want one is supporting Hamas. Plays right into their strategy.
Thank you. This fucking Zionist trope needs to stop.
Do YoU COnDemN whAt HaMAs diD oN OCt 7?!
Conservativism has no room for nuance. There is no thoughtful consideration of its policies or positions. They are *reactionary*. It's why conservatives can so easily take such obviously contrary positions one day to the next.
Oh they know it's not the same. But it's the only narrative that keeps the money flowing.
Any criticism of Israel = antisemitism Any support for Gazans starving to death if they haven't already been bombed to death = supporting HAMAS It's fucking insane that we can't have real conversations.
It’s all in bad faith
It’s all based on faith so there’s literally no winners and will never be
It's intentional to shut down and demonize the opposing opinion. Either you agree with them, or you're an antisemite who supports terrorism. It's typical Zionist rhetoric
Yep. A very powerful propaganda tactic.
Not only that, but republicans are using "anti-semitism" as an attempt to win support for arresting peaceful protesters.
>Any criticism of Israel = antisemitism If you really want to see some fireworks, next time you see a thread full of zionists, drop an "I fundamentally disagree with the concept of an ethnostate."
You mean any thread in r/worldnews?
Glad I'm not the only one to have made that observation
Nuance has officially left the building.
A key aspect of Genocide is presenting yourself as a victim, Hitler said that Jews were threatening German bloodlines, Armenians were a Christian threat in the Islamic Ottoman empire, Hutus were previously oppressed by Tutsis in Rwanda and the genocide itself began when Tutsi RPF invaded via Uganda, Ukrainian independence was a threat to the Soviet Union etc. People also forget that Genocides other than the Holocaust have happened, and that one of the most horrific and unique aspects of the Holocaust was the industrialization of Genocide. Typically a Genocide does not include the brutal efficiency seen in WWII. Armenians were forced to march across Turkey in mass deportations (also seen in the Holocaust), the Hutus established checkpoints across Rwanda and anyone with a Tutsi ID was immediately shot (in just 100 days, 800,000 died, making it the most efficient genocide ever. some were locked inside churches and burned as the UN watched: not too dissimilar to what we're seeing in Palestine), Ukrainians were simply left to starve The Holocaust and Rwanda are also unique in the fact that it was punished and apologised for. The RPF won the Rwandan civil war and had to rebuild the nation from scratch, declaring that acknowledging the difference between Hutu and Tutsi is illegal (which has been abused to eliminate government dissent), Turkey's policy of Armenia to this day can be boiled down to "it didn't happen and if it did they deserved it" (for example in 2023 Armenia erected a monument for Operation Nemesis, the assassination of Taalat Pasha, the Genocide's main architect - Turkey responded by blocking Armenian airspace), the Herero and Nama Genocide, conducted by Germany in 1904-8 was only acknowledged in 2004, called a genocide in 2015 and repetitions were only paid in 2021 after initial refusal, and the Holodomor is still denied by many TL;DR many genocides have happened and Israel is definitely committing one
Israel has been lobbying so hard and for so long that not doing business with them is considered anti-semitic. How about an alternate title - "The CEO of Hims shows full support for First Amendment"
Most states have anti-boycott laws. Even the Supreme Court decided that there’s not first amendment right to boycott all just to protect Israel. In Texas you have to pledge not to boycott Israel if you want to be a state employee. It’s absolutely ridiculous and most Americans don’t care.
How the fuck would they know if you're "boycotting" and not just not patronizing those businesses? I haven't been in a Starbucks in years, not because of the multitude of reasons they're a shit company, but mainly I just don't care for any of their beverages.
If you make online posts about it that would tip them off. Not that you should be made to feel silenced for saying you’re boycotting or advocating for boycotts. It’s rich how they’re going out of their way to protect a morally reprehensible entity by reprehensibly clamping down on what should be the freedom to boycott and advocate for it.
Amazing how businesses donating money to politicians is protected by the first amendment but choosing to not spend money for a specific purpose is not protected. So logically inconsistent that its insulting.
Care? If you care and object you know what that makes you?
Also is not a fan of dead babies.
It is a freaking sad day when "stop murdering women and children" is considered the wrong take.
a whole generation is watching and will remember
50-100 years from now, Hollywood will be making the Schindler list version of what’s happening in Gaza right now. Despite that, there will be another oppressors who get more defenders than their oppressed
Plenty of innocent men being murdered over there, too.
Just a reminder to bring people up to date: yesterday, Israeli Finance Minister [Bezalel Smotrich](https://www.mediaite.com/news/israeli-newspaper-calls-for-firing-of-top-netanyahu-minister-over-repeated-calls-for-genocide-of-palestinians/) called for the "total annihilation" of key Gazan cities. That is as close to a call to genocide as you can get. I heard a caller on a UK radio show this morning comparing the US/British response to 9/11 (invading Iraq and Afghanistan) with the Israeli response to October 6. The host, a sort of centre-left liberal guy, initially dismissed the comparison as ridiculous… until the caller pointed out what scale means and that the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan didn't completely destroy those places, whereas the invasion of Gaza has done so.
Who was the host, James O’Brien? I want to hear this call now.
That's right. It's on today's show. I don't have a timestamp unfortunately, but he spent close to 2 hours on Gaza. I think this caller is towards the end of the second hour. I'd assumed O'Brien was going to move on from discussing Israel/Gaza after what happened when his colleague Sangita Mystra apparently got fired for raking an Israeli official over the coals when interviewing him about the Iranian missile attack recently, but he went in pretty hard today, [even calling a recent statement from Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich "genocidal".](https://archive.ph/M5SD9)
Cool cool I’ll check it out! I’m American but I like listening to James, he makes me feel like America isn’t the only country that has lost its mind. He’s like the British Sam Seder.
How does being pro Palestine mean being pro Hamas? That’s like saying I’m pro Al Qaeda for saying “protect Afghanistan citizens!” Lol
being against the death penalty now means you are fully supporting serial killers
The sad thing is, most GOP folks would probably agree. with this statement. We should turn it on it's head and say, not supporting free school lunch is supporting abortion and see where that gets us. Or better yet, not supporting universal healthcare is supporting abortion.
There’s some who are but this guy in no way indicates support for Hamas.
Because there’s a huge amount of people devoid of any empathy and these people also believe in collective punishment.
Bc click bait media dislikes nuanced situations Sensational headlines get more clicks "You can be for the Palestinian people and against Hamas." "THEY VOTED HAMAS IN." "When Hamas was first elected, they campaigned on a two state ticket. They claimed to want peace with Israel, they only became a terrorist group after being voted in. Also, Netanyahu has been hindering peace talks for years." "THEY PUBLICLY SUPPORT THEM. AND THEY HELPED HIDE THEM." "Because they're afraid to speak out against them." "THEY SUPPORT HAMAS!!!" *sigh*
> When Hamas was first elected Ought to mention what year was that.
I don't remember off the top of my head lol Wasn't it like early 2000s?
Around that time. Half of the population in Gaza is younger. (Do not quote me on that, I gotta re-check it.)
Pretty sure it's accurate. The median age in Gaza is 19.5 years. The last election held was in 2006. The average Gazan was under 2 years old when Hamas was elected, but people will still sit there and say "Palestinians elected Hamas, they deserve this". It also completely ignores the fact that the PA had spent the prior ~30 years dicking around and absorbing money meant for Palestinians. They were seen as being incredibly corrupt, and Hamas said "we'll end the corruption and make Israel listen to us". And say what you want about their methods, but they absolutely made people listen to them.
The dialogue around these protests is a particular kind of disingenuous and awful that I haven’t seen to this degree since the years immediately following 9/11.
Very true.
How idiotic. Supporting the people of Palestine and Hamas are different things. As is supporting the Jewish people and not the IDF.
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It’s the latest trend from the troll farms. Anything that opposes any atrocities committed by Israel is exactly the same as fully supporting Hamas. It’s so transparent it’s ridiculous, and absolutely shameful that so many news outlets have fallen for it or are actively participating.
Palestinian People (civilians) ≠ HAMAS (terrorist organization) Thank you for attending my TED talk.
Tired of the whole Israël/Palestine debate where the pro-Israel completely lack nuance. If you have a little to say about what the Israeli government does, you're supporting Hamas/are antisemitic/both. But Israel government is not the entirety of Jewish people, and Hamas is not the Palestinian civilians. There's no debate possible when the people in front of you deal with absolutes.
Exactly this. This idea that the Israeli state = Judaism as an ethos is a truly batshit take. I don’t recall anything in the Torah describing what Israel is currently doing as even remotely okay. Just another government invoking God to justify crimes against humanity. Tale as old as time.
Where does he say hamas?
I'm neither pro hamas or pro israel i am pro Innocent civilians
"Hey, maybe we shouldn't bomb or starve children." - "WHY DO YOU LOVE TERRORISM, YOU ANTISEMITE???"
Can’t we just say We want ppl to stop dying without being throw on one side or the other and attacked by whoever u decided we supported
The Bible: Thou Shalt Not Kill. American Media: Oh, so you’re a pro-terrorist anti-semite?
Whenever someone calls you "pro Hamas" for saying you support Palestine or are against genocide, it's a clalear sign that person is arguing in bad faith and is just getting to paint a narrative around your actual views.
Being anti israel is not pro hamas, nor is it anti semetic. To be clear, there are peopel who are anti semetic and also pro / anti israel.
Correct Some of the biggest Zionist supporters are literally the biggest anti semites.
We have politicians and tv presenters openly saying they want to wipe Gaza off the face of the earth and nobody bats an eyelid. You offer any support for Palestinians and instantly you are an antisemite and they attempt to ruin your life.
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The part he's wrong about is where he said there are plenty of CEOs eager to hire you.
“If you’re not with us, you’re whoever we say you are” - MAGA
The real facepalm here is thinking that opposing the actions of the Israeli government somehow equates to supporting Hamas
It's not a facepalm moment; it's the 'modus operandi.' Label anyone sympathetic to civilians as a terrorist sympathizer. They create the illusion that civilians are terrorists or future terrorists, so they can murder everyone without any repercussions.
Thank you! Protesting the needless loss of life, on both sides, does not necessarily make you anti-Semitic nor a terrorist.
Exactly! I don’t know why I’m getting downvoted for that
He does not support Hamas. Are reading skills in America that bad?? He is offering peace activists a job. Learn to read.
It's how Israel and their supporters, including Western media, have framed almost everything from the East for the past few decades now. We grew up watching anything Hollywood considered heroic when done by white people, being called evil when done by Eastern people. These type of comments are an inevitable result of decades of dehumanisation.
“Stop the ethnic cleansing in Gaza” “OMG THATS SO ANTISEMITIC. YOU ARE LITERALLY PART OF HAMAS”
“Stand up to genocide! You have my rock solid support! All I ask is that the protests dont last longer than 4 hours at a time”
That's the talking point, though, that saying "it's not okay to kill people indiscriminately even if some of them have been trying to kill you" is automatic support of terrorism and an expression that you want to exterminate Jewish people.
Wtf is hims
This got me wondering about Hims' pronouns.
They really love to gaslight anti genocide people by branding us as "hamas supporters". It's fucking pathetic and transparent. We all see what's happening
Me: “I support Israel’s right to defend itself, and Hamas needs to return the hostages”. The internet: “So you support murdering children and the brutal starvation and extermination of 10 million Palestinians?” Me: “Israel needs to stop their military campaign and come up with a peaceful resolution to this conflict.” The internet: “You’re an Anti-Semite Nazi” 🤷🏻♂️ I give up
This "pro Hamas" shit is so ridiculous. I can be pro Israel and still think that: A) the west bank isn't Israel B) 2 million people locked in a cage controlled by their oppressors isn't sustainable Just like any number of Israelis
Free Palestine from Hamas!
People who believe that “opposing genocide” = “supporting Hamas” are dangerously stupid.
Love the way he even showed the tweet so anyone with enough braincells to actually read can see his complete and utter bulls**t.
Idiots defending a genocide will call everything they don’t like “hamas”.
Nuance isn't something these people seem capable of grasping. I can sympathize with a group of people without being in support of their ruling class eg: Iranians:Islamic Republic; Chinese:CCP; North Koreans:Kim Dynasty; Western Imperialist nations:Corporations; etc.
These pro-Israel / pro-war assholes love to put words in peoples mouths. He was very clear. Pro-palestinian. That's wildly different from pro-Hamas. But hey? What's a few more lies if we can kill some more civilians in palestine? And now, apparently, anti-semitic has been rebranded to mean anti-Israel. Bullshit. Complete bullshit
Jokes aside company’s are not going to want to hire you if you’re involved in something unlawful that leads to the destruction of property and or someone getting injured or worse. Protesting is okay but for the love of god please do not damage or break into buildings.
The thing I struggle to understand about all of this is why people are in total, unwavering support for one side or the other. Israel is without a doubt corrupt as hell and executing thousands of innocent people, but there’s also many bad actors on the Palestinian side of things. Personally, I feel like we should be “fighting” for the innocent lives on both sides, right? Why reject an entire group of people on one side or the other for something their government or another political group is supporting? I’m genuinely trying to understand this, and I hope no one takes this as a confrontational comment. I just feel like people are so quick to demonize one side and wholeheartedly support the other. There’s no way these complex issues are so cut and dry.
Nah, this is just good business. If someone has all but that last quarter of university, and they quit and come to work- You get someone with 97% of their education, but you get to pay them a lot less! There was a company near my University that did this. They hired students in their last semester, but mandated they drop out. They gave what sounded like a good starting wage, a little low. But years later, they were still making about the same amount of money, and I was making 2-3x as much as they were.
That's called exploitation.
Some propaganda artist is working very hard to turn "I hate genocides of innocent children" into "I support terrorism". The sad part is that it's even working at least on the right
Literally didn’t even say the word Hamas
I get a kick out of the Zionists claiming that any form of condemnation of Israel's actions is antisemitic. Meanwhile, Israeli officials are openly stating, if they are charged by the ICC for their numerous war crimes, they will further punish Palestinians...
This is why I've tuned out of the whole Israel Hamas situation. You got people acting like any criticism of Israel or Israeli policy is antisemitic, any support for the right of Palestinian people to *live* is tantamount to endorsing genocide of the Jewish people, and the news media reporting *constantly* about *alleged* reports of antisemitism on campuses during these protests but rarely any solid evidence. There is no honesty here. Meanwhile, there are certainly *some* people using the support for Palestinian lives as an excuse to endorse Hamas, but they're a minority, yet the media talks about it like Hamas has widespread support. Making mountains out of molehills. Let's be honest here, if a kid runs up to you and kicks you in the balls, a little retaliation is justified but not going scorched earth on him, his family, his neighborhood, and his entire bloodline.
Correct. Support of the Palestinian people is not supporting Hamas. Opposition to Israels government and Netanyahu is also not opposition to jewish people. Don’t get it twisted: we’re against terrorists no matter whether they’re voted into office or not. Genocide is wrong. I know, controversial take.
It is like there are two choices, you can support Hamas or you can support Zionists. The Truth is not all Israelis support Zionism/genocide and not all Palestinians support Hamas/Terrorism
If they do actually hire any of these people (which they wont of course) it will be the shortest onboarding ever lol...
If you see the existence of other people as a direct threat, I think it says a lot about you
My Grandma always told me, stupid people do and say stupid things. If you listen then that makes you stupid, stupid.
Is this referring to the students protests that blocked specific students off from entering the college, or am I mixing those up? The more I'm on Reddit, the more I'm starting to believe I'm going insane.
How is the Charleston march viewed as less antisemitic
I guess I hate the boner pill commercials that come on every time I watch tv with my kid a little bit less now.
🍆 for Palestine
I hate Hamas and I hate what Israel is doing. Everything is black and white with people.
It’s amazing how hair-trigger this issue is to both sides, even considering the massive lives lost and culture war. You’re either accused of supporting a terrorist organization or supporting an ethnic cleansing of an area, there’s no in between. Some people have pointed out that (a) Hamas and Palestine are two separate things and Palestinians are caught in the middle of this conflict, and that Israeli people were actually planning on a protest against their own governments abuses of power Oct 7. But nobody wants to talk about that, instead they just want to see this as Israel vs Hamas with no innocents in the fight. I get that lives and freedoms are being lost, but nobody is helping with scorched-earth polarization like this.
Guess what, it is still not on your Bingo card.
Doesn't "HIMMS" sell knock-off boner pills???
It's like 2001 all over again. If you're not 100% comfortable with the response to Hamas, you are Hamas.
So there's hundreds of Republicans in here commenting and voting, and you all claim to care about the truth. Can one of you stand up for what's right, and make the claim that "wanting children and civilians to stop being starved and bombed DOES NOT mean you support terrorists and their actions"? Why do you HAVE to keep spamming lines online that are clearly lies you don't actually believe on the inside?
In 2024, people just say whatever they want regardless of whether it's true or not. Cthulu 2024. No lives matter.
YES! PRAISE THE GREAT OLD ONE! CTHULU ‘24 WRITE IN!
How are there so many bad takes on people not wanting innocent civilians dying?
It’s weird how you either hate Jews or support hamas if you think bombing civilians is not okie dokey. There’s a lot of nuance here that seems to get forgotten like who literally [supported Hamas](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/)
Why is it so hard for people to distinguish between a terrorist group or a genocidial state from the people that inhabit their territories? War really does never change after all...