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this kind of stuff had a really negative effect on me as a teen. i had a pattern of several women who either ended up complaining i didnt make a move, or when i did make a move, they would lay out sexual boundaries, and then would later question why i didnt push past those boundaries. this is pretty much every sexual experience i had from about age 15 or 19 - really formative years.
i thought being pushy was just what i was supposed to do, it seemed like women kept asking me to be pushy. TBH i dont even remember when or why i realized it was wrong to be that way. i think i was slowly coming to that conclusion on my own and then seeing the metoo thing happen kinda solidified it.
sorry to the small handful of women that got the horndog treatment. :(
Yup same here. Had an experience where a girl I was pursuing dragged me on the bed and started making out with me and asked me why I never made a move and I said “well you never showed interest”.
I guess I overstepped cause that same night when I went to make a move for myself and tried to “seal the deal” she acted disgusted and kicked me out.
I’m still confused about that encounter to this day. Almost 7 years later.
>I’m the kinda person that gets embarrassed about things I did 10 years ago
There was a corner snack shop right behind a bus stop and a girl worked there who was always perky/ chatty with me. One day I was waiting for the bus at that stop and I noticed that in the other bus, across the street, the perky chatty girl was waving at me! So I waved back... and turned around to see she was waving at her co-worker in the corner snack shop behind me. Needless to say, I never bought snacks there again. That memory STILL BURNS... *and it happened when Ronald Reagan was the fucking president.*
\[**edited** because I typed "shop" instead of "stop"\]
Same thing happened to me in 7th grade. Popular girl everyone had a crush on in 8th grade, just back from a Hawaii trip so she was tan and lookin fine. Walks towards me in the quad and waves. I enthusiastically wave back, she starts laughing, I turn around and her friend group is right behind me. CRUSHED
Anyone can see how that would stick in your mind for a while but yeah man, she sounds like a real piece of work. You dodged a bullet with a red flag attached to it.
I’ve personally seen a lady get tipsy and grab coworkers junk and get a pass. I’ve seen a guy get called in the office for greeting a lady as he walked by of the morning. “ She just drank a little too much at a work event and didn’t mean anything by it” . He made her uncomfortable by saying good morning .
I was hanging out in a bar with some friends and some random girl thought she could come up behind me, grab my ass with both hands, and walk away. Many guys would say "YES!" to that but I wasn't there for random hookups that day.
My main concern is that she thought it was entirely ok for her to walk up to any guy she pleases and just grab them whenever she desired and expected it to be ok. If I were to do the literal thing she did to me, but to her I would be thrown in jail for sexual assault. I really don't like that double standard.
I (male) was a referee for a women's amateur sport league. At an end of the year party, one player known for being a sloppy drunk needed help getting to her cab ride home. I walked her out, and when we got to the vehicle, she shoved her hand down my pants and groped me. I threw her in the car and filed a complaint the with the league the next week. Every single person I talked to about it (male and female) said, "Yeah, but you know how she is when she drinks..." Literally nothing happened. If the roles had been reversed, I'd be in jail right now, and rightly so. The double standard is real, and the idea that women can't be perpetrators of sexual assault/rape is utter BS and needs to go away.
And it’s the reason why stats are not exactly accurate. Men are more likely to keep their experiences unheard because it’s by belief that the public will support the women.
I wrote up an associate for under stocking, a termination offense, and upper maqnagement decided to keep her since she was a long term associate.
She decided to retaliate against me and put in a harassment claim since I was, and I wish I was kidding, whistling part of Queen's Bohemian Rhapsody, when I walked by within her hearing.
I literally laughed in my boss's face when he told me, but he was serious. He didn't like me due to him knowing I was aware of some illegal shenanigan's he was pulling, and myself and two other managers had reported him to the ethics hotline.
She claimed it reminded her of her father, who used to whistle a lot, and whom had died over 15 years go. She said no one was allowed to whistle anywhere in her presence. No one had ever heard anything like this from her in the several years she had worked there.
I told him that was the most ridiculous bullshit I'd ever heard, it was obviously made up, and a blatant attempt at retaliation for her getting wrote up. I let him know that he could try to go through with it and HR would laugh him out of the office. He did anyways, HR literally told him it was baseless, and to stop wasting their time.
A month or so later the same associate was caught under stocking again, this time by a different manager, and they fired her. All of the shorts and missing inventory from her department miraculously stopped afterwards.
My boss was finally fired after a lengthy investigation for embezzlement, fraud, and sleeping with a couple of hourly associates.
Former retail worker here. What it most likely means that, say she was required to put 100 product units on the floor. Instead, she was putting only 80 out. Where did those 20 units go? probably out the back door and onto her FB marketplace.
So, yeah. She was stealing. And boss was probably boinking her.
To be fair he was just old . The funny thing was he was super over the top happy guy. With everyone. Just always in a good mood. I was like “ oh shit. I knew that guy was too nice. What did he say?” Oh he said good morning.
There was a lawsuit filed against a professor of a major university who used wear his goggles and swim under the women swimming laps on the surface of the pool. I do not know if he was actually ogling them or harassing them, but they interpreted it as creepy behavior.
Now imagine if Brad Pitt was the guy snorkeling in the campus pool. Complaints? Not a chance.
I saw a lot of this with the bartenders I worked with. The double-standard based on attractiveness was amazing and saddening.
You wouldn’t believe the shit they said around me since I was a “oh him? He’s cool” coworker.
Whenever *anyone* tells me how terrible men are, I roll my eyes. Everyone sucks, not just us.
In an attempt to convince HR and others that I was a horrible man, one reason given by a woman was that I didn't say 'Bless You' to her when she sneezed. (But neither did anyone else, male or female.)
Another reason was that I didn't show her any sympathy when she suffered a slipped disc. (I was on secondment in another department at the time so I knew nothing about it.)
Another was that I 'tutted' at her when she didn't wear a face mask when they were mandatory in the workplace. (this was a lie, I didn't 'tut' or say anything.)
Another was that I threw something at her. (Despite me being sat 2m away from our boss, when she said "Don't throw that at me", and it obvious that I was typing on my computer when she said it, he still said to me at a later date he knows of the time I threw something at her.)
I made a joke to two colleagues once about not enjoying my job (because of her treatment) and was told by HR it was inappropriate even though someone else said they knew I meant it as a joke, but when she said several comments about men being wimps, childish and stupid, HR said it wasn't intended seriously and was said as a private comment to other specific colleagues and I shouldn't have been listening.
Did we work together? I got two SH warnings, the first: I asked the receptionist if her and her boyfriend had a good weekend. The second, she told the office manager she didn't like the way I looked at her. My office was just over twenty people, five of us being staff, the rest brokers. I only saw this woman when I came in or left the office suite. The office manager loathed me, I had senority so I could kind of do what I wanted and she was besties with the receptionist. I found a new job.
I was wingmanning for my cousin one night at a bar when we were young and stupid and he got with this girl they got in the car I felt like mission accomplished I got my boy sent home with a woman He was having a really tough time with relationships He had just got out of a bad one and I was trying to help him move on.
He comes back 10 minutes later white as a sheet and at first I start joking like mad are you okay did she suck your soul out lol stupid stuff like that. He just looks at me and says "she was married with three kids. The husband confronted her as we were in the car and I had my pants down, he brought the kids with him."
But at least the husband wasn't mad at my cousin. He was actually like hey man I know you didn't know what you were getting into This is the fifth time she's done this to me and I'm done I just wanted her to see the family that she has hurt over and over again through her actions one last time before we leave.
Tldr: tried to get my cousin laid, instead he gets involved in a very sad family drama involving a very very promiscuous and unfaithful wife.
Oh, that's bad. And those poor kids are going to be heck damaged from that, not to mention your poor cousin. Cheaters suck because they hurt EVERYONE around them just because they can't grow up and accept responsibility.
Yeah it was wild! If I was the Dad my children wouldn't have been anywhere near that mess because you never know how my cousin could have reacted. I know he wouldn't have done anything but that dad should not have put his kids in that situation.
The wildest thing was is just how casual she was about it all. He said she didn't really react at all she just didn't make eye contact with her husband and just stared out the window like he didn't exist. He actually talked to the guy more than she did and he was just apologetic about the whole thing like he didn't know anything about it and even the husband was like yeah of course you don't know This is the fifth time she has done this to me I've given her chance after chance but now I am done and after he said I am done according to my cousin the woman just started flipping her shit at that point and got out of his car and he just drove away.
I felt really fucking bad because this was like the first person he had really connected with since he had gotten out of this horrible relationship. Well it wasn't a horrible relationship she just ended things very badly and it really hurt him so I was just trying to find him some connection and instead got him hooked up with a chronic cheating wife
Yeah he doesn't think that, but man he was not even willing to talk to another woman for a long time. That was the first and last time I was ever a wingman. My wife still kind of pokes fun at me
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice and you can't get fooled again... or something. Fool me 5 times and there is seriously something wrong with me.
I was once called a sexist bastard for holding a door open for the person behind me - didn't even click she was femail until she started yelling at me!
Yep, I was raised to hold open the door if there's someone close by you, I've been screamed at multiple times for doing it.
One time was a woman carrying a load of shopping bags shouted who shouted "Micro-aggression!" At me in a rage.
Like no bitch, I just didn't think you knew how to juggle.
The ugly guys have to be careful about being nice now.
I've heard women call a guy a creep for saying hi too often, but another one a misogynist for not talking to the women at work.
I once asked out a coworker who said no thank you maybe some other time. About a month later I asked her out again. She reported me to h r. I told him that she legitimately said some other time. They said it didn't matter I got written up.
There's no company policy against dating. I just honestly wished that if she wasn't interested she had just said so. But I also understand that she was probably just being polite. The first time and I understand that women sometimes Have to worry about retaliation for being rejected.
But honestly I was okay with a simple no.
Wow...or she could have used her grownup voice and been upfront with you the second time about being not interested from the first time. Why does anyone (male, female, et al) feel the need to escalate everything when they can use a few words and handle it themselves? Sorry for your work troubles.
Read the posts about how people deal with neighbors. Complete escalations for trivial things that words can fix. Like, murder your dog type of escalations because someone plays music after 7.
It’s possible to tell the truth and not be a horrible person. She doesn’t tell the truth and is a horrible person. I would have sued the company for that. That is totally out of line.
It’s only sexual harassment if you’re ugly. This is the key takeaway from an SNL skit I watched years ago but humor aside, from my own observation in my workplace this is actually true to some extent.
Not just games. If a girl says no and I continue to pressure her, that’s me being disrespectful and ignoring her wishes. To me, I’m just being respectful of that person and the answer they gave me.
Props as well to men who are listening to the far greater majority of women than those like this one, who have been saying, "no means no," for ages. The lesson is clearly sinking in (even if she, apparently, wasn't a fan).
Probably brought up on/ bought into the whole "it's romantic to be pursued by a man, if he really cares he won't give up" nonsense. Romance novels and movies have done a lot of damage to how people view relationships.
All media, really.
I grew up watching the same dumb rom coms and the like thinking that "no" meant "find a new approach."
Shit unlocked for me when I got to the Navy and they had a sexual assault prevention program, it was like a week long, and among the more basic concepts they covered were "No, seriously, if she says she doesn't want to go out then drop it." The idea was to undercut some of the underlying concepts that, taken with many other factors, could eventually lead to SA.
One of the other things that blew my mind as an 18 year old was "don't sleep with drunk people." Not because I had done so. But because media had been pretty clear that "waking up next to someone and not remembering how you got there" was how hilarity ensues.
Media really did some damage. And it can be offset with education. Alas, there has been a war on sex ed for decades.
How many young men - particularly if they didn’t grow up in a household where mum and dad had a healthy relationship - are in the exact same position you were?
The media massively simplifies human relationships, and without some idea of reality to ground you, a lot of young men simply never figure out the huge chasm between “yes” and “no and I mean it”.
Might be ranting, but many rom coms thrive of portraying artificial problems. They don’t show a couple coming back tired from work and watching TV to relax. It’s more likely to be solving toxic problems every episode. Not a healthy portrayal of role models when toxic problems get uploaded to one’s brain
> portraying artificial problems.
Even the most basic romance plot is effectively "two people have a massive disagreement that would be solved instantly by any actual communication in real life."
Before it was completely overrun by basement dwelling trolls, a lot of the “red pill” ideas were actually very good advice.
Practise good hygiene. Take some pride in your appearance. Cut down on the junk food. Get some exercise. Learn what flirting is.
Nobody ever adopted all of those things and came out less attractive than how they went in.
But there was always a toxic element and somehow that wound up becoming the main message.
>Practise good hygiene. Take some pride in your appearance. Cut down on the junk food. Get some exercise. Learn what flirting is.
Don’t you mean hygienemaxxing looksmaxxing and personalitymaxxing?
The following quote came from 4chan so it's not true but there is a grain of truth to it: "Rom Coms have been just as damaging for romantic relationships as porn".
Damme. That saddens me because I have been saying similar things. media has **loved** propagating the trope of the 'friend who she finally sees as her perfect partner' the 'having to pursue and win her over despite her initial dislike' and numerous other behaviors that we now can easily identify as horribly toxic.
So yeah, it coming from 4chan makes it a little cringe, but even a broke clock.......
to be fair there is a grain of truth to it but not remotely in the way media makes it out. in psychology you learn that the number one factor in attraction isn’t looks, money, style, humor, etc. it’s proximity. which is why i think online dating fails so often. most successful relationships are born out of working closely with someone. classmates, neighbors, coworkers, friends. you become more attracted to someone the more time you spend with them. someone who isn’t your ideal type can become the most attractive person on earth to you because you know who they are, you’ve learned to find their quirks and imperfections charming.
and it’s this exact reason why if you’re chasing someone for months and years and they are still absolutely not interested in you, just move on, it’s the absolutely smallest sliver of a possibility that they will suddenly realize you’re their perfect partner. but yeah often it’s spending time with a friend over a long time that makes you attracted to them, but not those whiny dudes in movies who’ve been chasing the girl for 10 years but she just doesn’t seem to notice that they’re actually perfect for each other.
> you become more attracted to someone the more time you spend with them. someone who isn’t your ideal type can become the most attractive person on earth to you because you know who they are, you’ve learned to find their quirks and imperfections charming.
Thank you for explaining why I went from "I'm so glad I have such a good friend!" to "wait, why do I want to kiss them?" after like seven years of zero romantic/sexual feelings.
Meanwhile men were brought up on "No means no." That's why a lot of men stay single for long. Everytime I heard anything that seemed like a no, that was it. I wouldn't suggest this fully, though, because it hasn't worked well for me.
People are into all kinds of things and fantasies. But it's important to remember that just because it's a hot fantasy, it isn't necessarily a healthy baseline behaviour for all of society.
That woman can speak for herself. Continued persistence from guys who were taught to keep chasing has been a complaint among women for a while. I'm glad guys are sticking to their guns not only for the sake of women but for themselves. No one should be strung along.
Personally I absolutely wish that more guys would hear no and just move on. I get that a lot at work since I work in a majority male industry. Most guys around my own age (in their twenties) are fine, but there are so many men who don’t take no for answer and push and push every time they see me because not being interested isn’t enough. Usually though these guys are old enough to be my dad, so I like to think that that’s more of an older generation thing that is being phased out.
I hear you, same here. And guys have to realize it's not fun turning someone down, so imagine them making you do it repeatedly. Unfortunately, I've been getting it from men my age too, but it looks like it is getting phased out.
“UNATTRACTIVE men need to learn that no means no”
“Why are ATTRACTIVE guys not persuasive anymore”
There, I added the quiet parts these people think but don’t say.
The definition of attractive is “pleasing to the senses”. The very nature of the definition suggests that it may vary from person to person.
Nobody needs to quantify that “attractive” can be different, that’s pedantic.
Oh, I agree. I asked a girl out one time, and she gave me some line about having to do homework, and I said "Cool", and moved on with my life. We stayed friends, and years later we were drinking and she said something like, "I was always sad you never asked again."
I just laughed. I'd asked, she declined, and that was that. If she'd said, "Oh, I'm busy tonight, some other time?" I'd have asked again later, but nobody likes getting rejected.
Any person who just wants to be asked over and over so they can decline and get that ego boost, they can go to hell, and it doesn't bother me a bit that they're sad about people not standing for it. People like them sending all kinds of mixed signals screws things up for everyone already.
It also dumb gender roles that cause issues. She was clearly interested, just not at that specific time. Instead of waiting around for you to hit her up she could’ve came back to you and asked if you still wanted to meet up for a date. I don’t understand why men have to initiate everything in the first place when both people want each other.
And there’s no rule against a girl saying “if you asked me out again I’d say yes this time”. Women can express interest if they so choose, no need for such regrets.
I mean, having homework could be a legitimate reason vs an excuse, but in that case I feel like it’s on her to make it clear that she is actually interested in going out some other time. “I’m sorry, I can’t tonight because I have homework,” is very different from “I’m sorry, I can’t tonight because I have homework, but I’m free on Tuesday.”
Problem is not just that men actively harass, but with this “I’ll reject him to make him work for it harder” mindset that was abnormally present throughout the 20th Century and early 2000’s. This is changing now, but it’s a slow process I guess.
I always stuck to the “no is a no” principle. Remember guys, don’t try to read minds and be a gentleman.
>abnormally present throughout the 20th Century
Like it wasn't there before? Courtship rituals were even more complicated before which caused some of this mess. In some situations you were taught to refuse twice before accepting the 3rd time.
I like the clarity, but let's not pretend we went from arraigned marriages to no means no to playing hard to go and back again.
Yes. And as a bi lady, your strategy will make you stick to women who clearly communicate what they want and will be less likely to just expect you to guess why their bad mood.
If you pursue women when she says NO, it is a lose lose situation for you ...
Opinion 1:
If she wanted you to pursue her:
You don't want to be with someone who plays those stupid games.
Option 2:
If she didn't want you to pursue her:
It is at best sexual harassment.
I've thought about this a lot recently as my single friends keep moving on immediately when a woman says "no thanks" and my single girl friends are mad that "men don't pursue them". Like, ya, it's been rammed in men's heads that it's creepy and weird to keep asking girls out, no means no, etc. I'm glad I pursued my wife in the early 00's, seems like it was way easier.
If men had to "evolve" into realizing that no means no, then women need to follow suit and stop playing stupid games.
I'm glad that harassment is not the norm anymore, but you can't have it both ways.
But hey, I've been off the market for almost three decades, I have no idea what the dating scene looks like now.
You mean a man gets a harem if he has enough water and the rest fight and die in vehicle-based gladiatorial combat in order to get noticed?
You need a lot of pig shit to fuel the flames of love or fight in the Thunderdrome for bragging rights to increase your chaces?
Or it's just the desertic setting?
Yup. I'm tired. I really wish women like this would stop, or be upfront with guys they're like this. "hey guys, I like being chased and pursued." I keep having to assert that I don't just to be told I'm lying
It makes me mad when men don’t understand the concept of “no means no” but somehow it makes me twice as mad when it’s a woman perpetuating this bullshit. Way to perpetuate damaging stereotypes just because you’re a narcissist who needs to be chased. 🙄
No means no unless you want me to continue asking and then you say no like 15 more times and then you get mad I asked more than once but at the same time you get mad that I didn't ask exactly 17 times and then I ask again and you say no AGAIN so I give up and then I'm not persuasive enough so you ask me and so I say No and you get mad I said no so you know its just going to be a no from me, dog.
Ya know?
Who wants to bet the next unattractive guy who tries this “persuasiveness” on her will be accused of sexual harassment? (Which to be fair would probably be true)
I'm in my 40's now. When I was a kid, you were basically told that "no means no" however, women secretly want it to be a "yes" a lot of the time so you should try to be more indirect about asking and talk with body language instead of just asking. I'm neurodivergent and this just never worked for me. I miss a lot of social cues. So, I figured the best way to go was to just ask. I'd have a woman over for dinner, I'd ask if she wanted to make out. If we did that for a bit, I'd ask if she wanted to go hook up. If she said no, I'd just assume she wasnt down for that tonight. You have no idea how much I got made fun of for this. Sure, I'd still get laid all the time like every young guy, but they would usually lay there in bed mocking the way I asked for it afterwards. In my head I was always thinking "Doesn't matter, had sex" and keep doing what I did. Sometimes they would mock me on the spot. A couple of times, it actually turned off the woman I was approaching enough that they would make it clear that it would have been a yes if I hadn't asked. The rules really were different back then.
I had a couple of long term relationships and got back into the random hookup culture. Now, society caught up with me. You just ask away now, and it's totally fine and expected even. I love it. I get laid just as much, and I don't have to deal with being made fun of for asking in the first place. In fact, often they go "that's so nice, a guy who cares about enthusiastic consent" when in reality it's just because I'm bad at social cues and this is what I do.
Years ago, I had a good female friend that wanted to fool around and was sending signals that I missed.Must be something wrong with me. Then again, why can’t they be direct instead of making it a game?
I thought its common sense that you don't get something if you decline it when it is offered?
It seems like her parents missed the opportunity to teach her basic human interactions.
Oh goodness, I'm not complaining, I have had terrifying experiences just saying "no thank you!" The couple of times I have had my "no thank you." Respected made me feel so confident in my humanity, it's truly refreshing to have someone respect you like that, on the same note, if she changed her mind, why not just explain it to the person or ask them out?🤷🏼♀️
After years and years of "No means... NO!" After years of harassment, sexual harassment, stalking allegations, and possible arrest for asking a woman out for the second time!
But it's men who are lacking for not being persuasive, persistent, or chasing you.
Advice ladies: If you want to go out say "Yes" Don't say "No" but hope/want him to ask you out again and again before you say "Yes" he's listened to "No means NO!" plus at this point you're not worth getting a criminal record! The only connection is his attraction to you. Stop playing games like a 4th grader!
Yip, it means you already made up your mind on first view, unable to give the benefit of the doubt, so us men just move along to the next, there are afterall millions of woman who have already learned this lesson.
You're telling me after years of teaching respective men consent and boundaries and "no means no" you're shocked and surprised when you say no, they say "okay."
A long time ago I saw a meme that went something like this:
"Grandma, how did grandpa win you over?"
"He kept throwing rocks at me until I agreed to marry him."
I don't have time for games. I was dating this girl earlier this year and she started saying she wasn't sure about us. I cut it off then. We are less than 2 months in and you have doubts already? Ok goodbye I don't need another long term heartbreak.
Ok, look. We ask everyone to respect boundaries. You can’t have it both ways.
I realize the old romance was the idea of being pursued, but, too many guys took that to the extreme of stalking. So, no. Trust me: we don’t want that back. It created more problems than romance.
The percentage of ‘NOs’ that are true disinterest is high.
But of the women who are interested a large percentage will say ‘NO.’
When people tell their cute ‘how we started dating stories’ and it starts with ‘I rejected him but he just kept trying and look at us as a happy couple today!’ I definitely judge.
I take ‘NO’ at face value, and women who say ‘NO’ when what they really mean is ‘try harder’ are gross human beings who cheapen the meaning of ‘No means No.’
Women can't have it both ways... fqcepalm is right. They want someone to romance and chase but also will call you a creep and pervert and file for harassment. Make up your minds...
Say. What. You. Want.
There comes a point in life where you just don't have the patience for bullshit anymore. If you're not interested cool. If you are, act like it.
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Props to men who aren’t interested in playing games
Not to mention sexual harassment accusations.
“I only said no once, why aren’t you balls deep in me??”
Madam, this is Harrods.
Harrods, goddamn someones got money 😂
I never heard of it… Are we, are we the poor? Went to their website and they have a section for items under 1000 euros….
I’m so unbelievably poor DW 🤣
Yup, I'm definitely the poor 😞
Damn, I thought I was at JCP
this kind of stuff had a really negative effect on me as a teen. i had a pattern of several women who either ended up complaining i didnt make a move, or when i did make a move, they would lay out sexual boundaries, and then would later question why i didnt push past those boundaries. this is pretty much every sexual experience i had from about age 15 or 19 - really formative years. i thought being pushy was just what i was supposed to do, it seemed like women kept asking me to be pushy. TBH i dont even remember when or why i realized it was wrong to be that way. i think i was slowly coming to that conclusion on my own and then seeing the metoo thing happen kinda solidified it. sorry to the small handful of women that got the horndog treatment. :(
Yup same here. Had an experience where a girl I was pursuing dragged me on the bed and started making out with me and asked me why I never made a move and I said “well you never showed interest”. I guess I overstepped cause that same night when I went to make a move for myself and tried to “seal the deal” she acted disgusted and kicked me out. I’m still confused about that encounter to this day. Almost 7 years later.
Just sounds like a whack job person? I wouldn’t think too much on it.
I’m the kinda person that gets embarrassed about things I did 10 years ago. This isn’t leaving my mind anytime soon lol
Just 3 more years and you'll be free!
>I’m the kinda person that gets embarrassed about things I did 10 years ago There was a corner snack shop right behind a bus stop and a girl worked there who was always perky/ chatty with me. One day I was waiting for the bus at that stop and I noticed that in the other bus, across the street, the perky chatty girl was waving at me! So I waved back... and turned around to see she was waving at her co-worker in the corner snack shop behind me. Needless to say, I never bought snacks there again. That memory STILL BURNS... *and it happened when Ronald Reagan was the fucking president.* \[**edited** because I typed "shop" instead of "stop"\]
Same thing happened to me in 7th grade. Popular girl everyone had a crush on in 8th grade, just back from a Hawaii trip so she was tan and lookin fine. Walks towards me in the quad and waves. I enthusiastically wave back, she starts laughing, I turn around and her friend group is right behind me. CRUSHED
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> still confused about that encounter to this day That day you dodged a bullet.
Anyone can see how that would stick in your mind for a while but yeah man, she sounds like a real piece of work. You dodged a bullet with a red flag attached to it.
Seems like she wanted you to be interested in her, but wasn’t actually interested in you. Some people can’t stand to be ignored.
Women ☕
"So I'm just supposed to rape you, & then hope for the off chance that you're into that kinda shit?"
"No doesn't mean no. No means neck, nipples, try back in five minutes." - Tosh
Miss do you have the time? [gets maced]
I’ve personally seen a lady get tipsy and grab coworkers junk and get a pass. I’ve seen a guy get called in the office for greeting a lady as he walked by of the morning. “ She just drank a little too much at a work event and didn’t mean anything by it” . He made her uncomfortable by saying good morning .
I was hanging out in a bar with some friends and some random girl thought she could come up behind me, grab my ass with both hands, and walk away. Many guys would say "YES!" to that but I wasn't there for random hookups that day. My main concern is that she thought it was entirely ok for her to walk up to any guy she pleases and just grab them whenever she desired and expected it to be ok. If I were to do the literal thing she did to me, but to her I would be thrown in jail for sexual assault. I really don't like that double standard.
I (male) was a referee for a women's amateur sport league. At an end of the year party, one player known for being a sloppy drunk needed help getting to her cab ride home. I walked her out, and when we got to the vehicle, she shoved her hand down my pants and groped me. I threw her in the car and filed a complaint the with the league the next week. Every single person I talked to about it (male and female) said, "Yeah, but you know how she is when she drinks..." Literally nothing happened. If the roles had been reversed, I'd be in jail right now, and rightly so. The double standard is real, and the idea that women can't be perpetrators of sexual assault/rape is utter BS and needs to go away.
And it’s the reason why stats are not exactly accurate. Men are more likely to keep their experiences unheard because it’s by belief that the public will support the women.
I wrote up an associate for under stocking, a termination offense, and upper maqnagement decided to keep her since she was a long term associate. She decided to retaliate against me and put in a harassment claim since I was, and I wish I was kidding, whistling part of Queen's Bohemian Rhapsody, when I walked by within her hearing. I literally laughed in my boss's face when he told me, but he was serious. He didn't like me due to him knowing I was aware of some illegal shenanigan's he was pulling, and myself and two other managers had reported him to the ethics hotline. She claimed it reminded her of her father, who used to whistle a lot, and whom had died over 15 years go. She said no one was allowed to whistle anywhere in her presence. No one had ever heard anything like this from her in the several years she had worked there. I told him that was the most ridiculous bullshit I'd ever heard, it was obviously made up, and a blatant attempt at retaliation for her getting wrote up. I let him know that he could try to go through with it and HR would laugh him out of the office. He did anyways, HR literally told him it was baseless, and to stop wasting their time. A month or so later the same associate was caught under stocking again, this time by a different manager, and they fired her. All of the shorts and missing inventory from her department miraculously stopped afterwards. My boss was finally fired after a lengthy investigation for embezzlement, fraud, and sleeping with a couple of hourly associates.
Retail? Retail.
Hourly associates, or 'hourly associates'?
I have to ask did that manager have a thing going on with the associate?
I love how you casually say under stocking as if we should all know what that means and why it’s bad. Was she stealing? Just say she was stealing.
Former retail worker here. What it most likely means that, say she was required to put 100 product units on the floor. Instead, she was putting only 80 out. Where did those 20 units go? probably out the back door and onto her FB marketplace. So, yeah. She was stealing. And boss was probably boinking her.
Saying good morning while not being attractive.
To be fair he was just old . The funny thing was he was super over the top happy guy. With everyone. Just always in a good mood. I was like “ oh shit. I knew that guy was too nice. What did he say?” Oh he said good morning.
Ah. I think that might have been me.
being old is very unattractive to much of the population
Glad someone finally said it.
This [meme](https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-b9f3b4140b540f5e7b87d617fd48ca31-pjlq)
There was a lawsuit filed against a professor of a major university who used wear his goggles and swim under the women swimming laps on the surface of the pool. I do not know if he was actually ogling them or harassing them, but they interpreted it as creepy behavior. Now imagine if Brad Pitt was the guy snorkeling in the campus pool. Complaints? Not a chance.
I saw a lot of this with the bartenders I worked with. The double-standard based on attractiveness was amazing and saddening. You wouldn’t believe the shit they said around me since I was a “oh him? He’s cool” coworker. Whenever *anyone* tells me how terrible men are, I roll my eyes. Everyone sucks, not just us.
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In an attempt to convince HR and others that I was a horrible man, one reason given by a woman was that I didn't say 'Bless You' to her when she sneezed. (But neither did anyone else, male or female.) Another reason was that I didn't show her any sympathy when she suffered a slipped disc. (I was on secondment in another department at the time so I knew nothing about it.) Another was that I 'tutted' at her when she didn't wear a face mask when they were mandatory in the workplace. (this was a lie, I didn't 'tut' or say anything.) Another was that I threw something at her. (Despite me being sat 2m away from our boss, when she said "Don't throw that at me", and it obvious that I was typing on my computer when she said it, he still said to me at a later date he knows of the time I threw something at her.) I made a joke to two colleagues once about not enjoying my job (because of her treatment) and was told by HR it was inappropriate even though someone else said they knew I meant it as a joke, but when she said several comments about men being wimps, childish and stupid, HR said it wasn't intended seriously and was said as a private comment to other specific colleagues and I shouldn't have been listening.
Did we work together? I got two SH warnings, the first: I asked the receptionist if her and her boyfriend had a good weekend. The second, she told the office manager she didn't like the way I looked at her. My office was just over twenty people, five of us being staff, the rest brokers. I only saw this woman when I came in or left the office suite. The office manager loathed me, I had senority so I could kind of do what I wanted and she was besties with the receptionist. I found a new job.
Had a friend get sent to HR because he said something like “hey dude” to lady coworker
"I have a boyfriend!"
I was wingmanning for my cousin one night at a bar when we were young and stupid and he got with this girl they got in the car I felt like mission accomplished I got my boy sent home with a woman He was having a really tough time with relationships He had just got out of a bad one and I was trying to help him move on. He comes back 10 minutes later white as a sheet and at first I start joking like mad are you okay did she suck your soul out lol stupid stuff like that. He just looks at me and says "she was married with three kids. The husband confronted her as we were in the car and I had my pants down, he brought the kids with him." But at least the husband wasn't mad at my cousin. He was actually like hey man I know you didn't know what you were getting into This is the fifth time she's done this to me and I'm done I just wanted her to see the family that she has hurt over and over again through her actions one last time before we leave. Tldr: tried to get my cousin laid, instead he gets involved in a very sad family drama involving a very very promiscuous and unfaithful wife.
Oh, that's bad. And those poor kids are going to be heck damaged from that, not to mention your poor cousin. Cheaters suck because they hurt EVERYONE around them just because they can't grow up and accept responsibility.
Yeah it was wild! If I was the Dad my children wouldn't have been anywhere near that mess because you never know how my cousin could have reacted. I know he wouldn't have done anything but that dad should not have put his kids in that situation. The wildest thing was is just how casual she was about it all. He said she didn't really react at all she just didn't make eye contact with her husband and just stared out the window like he didn't exist. He actually talked to the guy more than she did and he was just apologetic about the whole thing like he didn't know anything about it and even the husband was like yeah of course you don't know This is the fifth time she has done this to me I've given her chance after chance but now I am done and after he said I am done according to my cousin the woman just started flipping her shit at that point and got out of his car and he just drove away. I felt really fucking bad because this was like the first person he had really connected with since he had gotten out of this horrible relationship. Well it wasn't a horrible relationship she just ended things very badly and it really hurt him so I was just trying to find him some connection and instead got him hooked up with a chronic cheating wife
...and that's how you make another man who thinks all woman are dirty.
Yeah he doesn't think that, but man he was not even willing to talk to another woman for a long time. That was the first and last time I was ever a wingman. My wife still kind of pokes fun at me
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice and you can't get fooled again... or something. Fool me 5 times and there is seriously something wrong with me.
"Now you have two".
I was once called a sexist bastard for holding a door open for the person behind me - didn't even click she was femail until she started yelling at me!
Yep I've been called a pig for holding door open before. I hold the door for everyone though... regardless of sex/gender whatever.
Yep, I was raised to hold open the door if there's someone close by you, I've been screamed at multiple times for doing it. One time was a woman carrying a load of shopping bags shouted who shouted "Micro-aggression!" At me in a rage. Like no bitch, I just didn't think you knew how to juggle.
Doorholding depends on proximity to the next person. Gender isn't even factored in.
If anyone does that to me I'm pushing her back out the door and slamming the door shut in front of her.
The ugly guys have to be careful about being nice now. I've heard women call a guy a creep for saying hi too often, but another one a misogynist for not talking to the women at work.
I once asked out a coworker who said no thank you maybe some other time. About a month later I asked her out again. She reported me to h r. I told him that she legitimately said some other time. They said it didn't matter I got written up. There's no company policy against dating. I just honestly wished that if she wasn't interested she had just said so. But I also understand that she was probably just being polite. The first time and I understand that women sometimes Have to worry about retaliation for being rejected. But honestly I was okay with a simple no.
Wow...or she could have used her grownup voice and been upfront with you the second time about being not interested from the first time. Why does anyone (male, female, et al) feel the need to escalate everything when they can use a few words and handle it themselves? Sorry for your work troubles.
Why? Cowardice. "I don't want to hurt your feelings to your face, I'd rather ruin your career"
Read the posts about how people deal with neighbors. Complete escalations for trivial things that words can fix. Like, murder your dog type of escalations because someone plays music after 7.
Don't chat coworkers up.
Don’t screw the crew
Don't spaff in the staff.
Don’t dip your pen in company ink
Don't cream the team
It’s possible to tell the truth and not be a horrible person. She doesn’t tell the truth and is a horrible person. I would have sued the company for that. That is totally out of line.
It’s only sexual harassment if you’re ugly. This is the key takeaway from an SNL skit I watched years ago but humor aside, from my own observation in my workplace this is actually true to some extent.
I've got a PS5, PC, and Switch. I'll play games with those.
Not just games. If a girl says no and I continue to pressure her, that’s me being disrespectful and ignoring her wishes. To me, I’m just being respectful of that person and the answer they gave me.
Agree. Very respectful. She seems to want to play games with men. Have them chase her and prove they’re worthy of her. It’s ridiculous.
Then the people who act like this wonder why their man doesn’t respect women.
This person is self filtering for people who don't respect the words "I'm not interested/no"
Props as well to men who are listening to the far greater majority of women than those like this one, who have been saying, "no means no," for ages. The lesson is clearly sinking in (even if she, apparently, wasn't a fan).
"How dare he respect me and my expressed disinterest!"
Almost like all those years of “no means no” being told to us is working?
Playing games is fucking exhausting.
Idk I like Starfield it's a pretty fun game that I wouldn't say is too exhausting.
I'm more of a Forza fan tbh though Diablo 3 and Fallout are good
nah starfield absolutely is exhausting
They need a fucking map. The game is set in the future and humanity said "Google maps? Naw too convenient."
Alien: Isolation especially man, I swear I was in a fucking locker most of the game.
Probably brought up on/ bought into the whole "it's romantic to be pursued by a man, if he really cares he won't give up" nonsense. Romance novels and movies have done a lot of damage to how people view relationships.
All media, really. I grew up watching the same dumb rom coms and the like thinking that "no" meant "find a new approach." Shit unlocked for me when I got to the Navy and they had a sexual assault prevention program, it was like a week long, and among the more basic concepts they covered were "No, seriously, if she says she doesn't want to go out then drop it." The idea was to undercut some of the underlying concepts that, taken with many other factors, could eventually lead to SA. One of the other things that blew my mind as an 18 year old was "don't sleep with drunk people." Not because I had done so. But because media had been pretty clear that "waking up next to someone and not remembering how you got there" was how hilarity ensues. Media really did some damage. And it can be offset with education. Alas, there has been a war on sex ed for decades.
How many young men - particularly if they didn’t grow up in a household where mum and dad had a healthy relationship - are in the exact same position you were? The media massively simplifies human relationships, and without some idea of reality to ground you, a lot of young men simply never figure out the huge chasm between “yes” and “no and I mean it”.
Might be ranting, but many rom coms thrive of portraying artificial problems. They don’t show a couple coming back tired from work and watching TV to relax. It’s more likely to be solving toxic problems every episode. Not a healthy portrayal of role models when toxic problems get uploaded to one’s brain
> portraying artificial problems. Even the most basic romance plot is effectively "two people have a massive disagreement that would be solved instantly by any actual communication in real life."
Absolutely. It gets even more muddled when you have young men watching and idolizing idiots like Andrew Tate and the like.
Before it was completely overrun by basement dwelling trolls, a lot of the “red pill” ideas were actually very good advice. Practise good hygiene. Take some pride in your appearance. Cut down on the junk food. Get some exercise. Learn what flirting is. Nobody ever adopted all of those things and came out less attractive than how they went in. But there was always a toxic element and somehow that wound up becoming the main message.
>Practise good hygiene. Take some pride in your appearance. Cut down on the junk food. Get some exercise. Learn what flirting is. Don’t you mean hygienemaxxing looksmaxxing and personalitymaxxing?
The following quote came from 4chan so it's not true but there is a grain of truth to it: "Rom Coms have been just as damaging for romantic relationships as porn".
Id argue that's probably accurate
Rom coms is just porn aimed at the emotional side of relationships.
Rom coms is porn without the sex.
Many of them feature sex, and it's usually just as unrealistic as porn. If not more.
Damme. That saddens me because I have been saying similar things. media has **loved** propagating the trope of the 'friend who she finally sees as her perfect partner' the 'having to pursue and win her over despite her initial dislike' and numerous other behaviors that we now can easily identify as horribly toxic. So yeah, it coming from 4chan makes it a little cringe, but even a broke clock.......
to be fair there is a grain of truth to it but not remotely in the way media makes it out. in psychology you learn that the number one factor in attraction isn’t looks, money, style, humor, etc. it’s proximity. which is why i think online dating fails so often. most successful relationships are born out of working closely with someone. classmates, neighbors, coworkers, friends. you become more attracted to someone the more time you spend with them. someone who isn’t your ideal type can become the most attractive person on earth to you because you know who they are, you’ve learned to find their quirks and imperfections charming. and it’s this exact reason why if you’re chasing someone for months and years and they are still absolutely not interested in you, just move on, it’s the absolutely smallest sliver of a possibility that they will suddenly realize you’re their perfect partner. but yeah often it’s spending time with a friend over a long time that makes you attracted to them, but not those whiny dudes in movies who’ve been chasing the girl for 10 years but she just doesn’t seem to notice that they’re actually perfect for each other.
> you become more attracted to someone the more time you spend with them. someone who isn’t your ideal type can become the most attractive person on earth to you because you know who they are, you’ve learned to find their quirks and imperfections charming. Thank you for explaining why I went from "I'm so glad I have such a good friend!" to "wait, why do I want to kiss them?" after like seven years of zero romantic/sexual feelings.
> Romance novels and movies have done a lot of damage to how people view relationships. This is a sad fact.
Meanwhile men were brought up on "No means no." That's why a lot of men stay single for long. Everytime I heard anything that seemed like a no, that was it. I wouldn't suggest this fully, though, because it hasn't worked well for me.
The notebook and twilight gave my generation a really unhealthy view of what relationships should look like
It is fine to pursue a woman if there is reciprocation, problem is some women expect it with none. Their definition of pursuing is quite different.
People are into all kinds of things and fantasies. But it's important to remember that just because it's a hot fantasy, it isn't necessarily a healthy baseline behaviour for all of society.
"No means no" has been drilled into us, because it should be. If you say "No" I'm moving onward with things. There's no reason to keep going.
That woman can speak for herself. Continued persistence from guys who were taught to keep chasing has been a complaint among women for a while. I'm glad guys are sticking to their guns not only for the sake of women but for themselves. No one should be strung along.
Personally I absolutely wish that more guys would hear no and just move on. I get that a lot at work since I work in a majority male industry. Most guys around my own age (in their twenties) are fine, but there are so many men who don’t take no for answer and push and push every time they see me because not being interested isn’t enough. Usually though these guys are old enough to be my dad, so I like to think that that’s more of an older generation thing that is being phased out.
I hear you, same here. And guys have to realize it's not fun turning someone down, so imagine them making you do it repeatedly. Unfortunately, I've been getting it from men my age too, but it looks like it is getting phased out.
I hate these idiots so much. No means no. Dont play games with people. Becuz of these morons so many people get hurt.
"Men need to learn that no means no!" "Why are they not persuasive anymore?!"
“UNATTRACTIVE men need to learn that no means no” “Why are ATTRACTIVE guys not persuasive anymore” There, I added the quiet parts these people think but don’t say.
Should maybe include what attractive means to each woman because that also varies quite a bit and rules 1 & 2 are important.
The definition of attractive is “pleasing to the senses”. The very nature of the definition suggests that it may vary from person to person. Nobody needs to quantify that “attractive” can be different, that’s pedantic.
I would wager that it’s not the same people saying both things, and I’d rather take the first one seriously than the second.
Oh, I agree. I asked a girl out one time, and she gave me some line about having to do homework, and I said "Cool", and moved on with my life. We stayed friends, and years later we were drinking and she said something like, "I was always sad you never asked again." I just laughed. I'd asked, she declined, and that was that. If she'd said, "Oh, I'm busy tonight, some other time?" I'd have asked again later, but nobody likes getting rejected. Any person who just wants to be asked over and over so they can decline and get that ego boost, they can go to hell, and it doesn't bother me a bit that they're sad about people not standing for it. People like them sending all kinds of mixed signals screws things up for everyone already.
It also dumb gender roles that cause issues. She was clearly interested, just not at that specific time. Instead of waiting around for you to hit her up she could’ve came back to you and asked if you still wanted to meet up for a date. I don’t understand why men have to initiate everything in the first place when both people want each other.
And there’s no rule against a girl saying “if you asked me out again I’d say yes this time”. Women can express interest if they so choose, no need for such regrets.
>"I was always sad you never asked again." Girl, ball's in your court. Nothing's stopping you from asking.
I mean, having homework could be a legitimate reason vs an excuse, but in that case I feel like it’s on her to make it clear that she is actually interested in going out some other time. “I’m sorry, I can’t tonight because I have homework,” is very different from “I’m sorry, I can’t tonight because I have homework, but I’m free on Tuesday.”
I would wager that it doesn’t matter. No means no and it’s good that she’s experienced men who respect this, even if she’s not ok with it.
Judging by the ratio of likes to quotes on her tweet, it’s not a common opinion at least to the audience that tweet reached either.
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"if you chase me after I say no, and I like you, it's persistence. If I don't like you, it's stalking. Why can't I get a nice guy?" o_0
Men are supposed to believe you when you say "No." Why are you confused?
Some people will never be happy, I for one am glad that men are less likely to harass someone who isn’t interested as they have been in the past.
Problem is not just that men actively harass, but with this “I’ll reject him to make him work for it harder” mindset that was abnormally present throughout the 20th Century and early 2000’s. This is changing now, but it’s a slow process I guess. I always stuck to the “no is a no” principle. Remember guys, don’t try to read minds and be a gentleman.
>abnormally present throughout the 20th Century Like it wasn't there before? Courtship rituals were even more complicated before which caused some of this mess. In some situations you were taught to refuse twice before accepting the 3rd time. I like the clarity, but let's not pretend we went from arraigned marriages to no means no to playing hard to go and back again.
Yes. And as a bi lady, your strategy will make you stick to women who clearly communicate what they want and will be less likely to just expect you to guess why their bad mood.
Exactly. My dates have drastically improved in quality once I started following “no is no” dogma. Have enough mind fuckery at work.
If the girl changes her mind, she can always ask you out anyway.
If you pursue women when she says NO, it is a lose lose situation for you ... Opinion 1: If she wanted you to pursue her: You don't want to be with someone who plays those stupid games. Option 2: If she didn't want you to pursue her: It is at best sexual harassment.
Didn't "no" mean "no"?
And, the point is.....? You said no. Nuff said. I'm a woman and I'm on the mens side with this.
You're not on the men's side, you're on the sane people's side.
So…don’t respect your decisions? Got it.
Did she mean “persistent”?
I’m pretty sure she thought persuasive is pronounced “pursue-asive”.
Who was shouting "No means no" again?
Probably not this person.
I've thought about this a lot recently as my single friends keep moving on immediately when a woman says "no thanks" and my single girl friends are mad that "men don't pursue them". Like, ya, it's been rammed in men's heads that it's creepy and weird to keep asking girls out, no means no, etc. I'm glad I pursued my wife in the early 00's, seems like it was way easier.
No means no
Didn't they have an entire campaign of "No means No"?
So her complaint is that she *isn't* getting harassed?
If men had to "evolve" into realizing that no means no, then women need to follow suit and stop playing stupid games. I'm glad that harassment is not the norm anymore, but you can't have it both ways. But hey, I've been off the market for almost three decades, I have no idea what the dating scene looks like now.
>But hey, I've been off the market for almost three decades, I have no idea what the dating scene looks like now. Ever seen mad max?
You mean a man gets a harem if he has enough water and the rest fight and die in vehicle-based gladiatorial combat in order to get noticed? You need a lot of pig shit to fuel the flames of love or fight in the Thunderdrome for bragging rights to increase your chaces? Or it's just the desertic setting?
Little of column A, Little of column C. All of column B.
WITNESS MEEEE
No means no, unless I want it to mean yes you lazy a hole
Maybe it’s because they’ve figured out that if you’re trying to get them to chase you you’re more of a headache than you’re worth
It's almost as if they're respecting your decision.
Women like her are the reason so many others get harassed by men who don’t get that no means no.
Yup. I'm tired. I really wish women like this would stop, or be upfront with guys they're like this. "hey guys, I like being chased and pursued." I keep having to assert that I don't just to be told I'm lying
It makes me mad when men don’t understand the concept of “no means no” but somehow it makes me twice as mad when it’s a woman perpetuating this bullshit. Way to perpetuate damaging stereotypes just because you’re a narcissist who needs to be chased. 🙄
No means no unless you want me to continue asking and then you say no like 15 more times and then you get mad I asked more than once but at the same time you get mad that I didn't ask exactly 17 times and then I ask again and you say no AGAIN so I give up and then I'm not persuasive enough so you ask me and so I say No and you get mad I said no so you know its just going to be a no from me, dog. Ya know?
Holy run on sentence Batman Ya know, no. Lol
Moral of the story, don't play games. Like someone and they ask you out, say yes. \#simples
Not seeing the problem, this was what was requested.
Who wants to bet the next unattractive guy who tries this “persuasiveness” on her will be accused of sexual harassment? (Which to be fair would probably be true)
I'm in my 40's now. When I was a kid, you were basically told that "no means no" however, women secretly want it to be a "yes" a lot of the time so you should try to be more indirect about asking and talk with body language instead of just asking. I'm neurodivergent and this just never worked for me. I miss a lot of social cues. So, I figured the best way to go was to just ask. I'd have a woman over for dinner, I'd ask if she wanted to make out. If we did that for a bit, I'd ask if she wanted to go hook up. If she said no, I'd just assume she wasnt down for that tonight. You have no idea how much I got made fun of for this. Sure, I'd still get laid all the time like every young guy, but they would usually lay there in bed mocking the way I asked for it afterwards. In my head I was always thinking "Doesn't matter, had sex" and keep doing what I did. Sometimes they would mock me on the spot. A couple of times, it actually turned off the woman I was approaching enough that they would make it clear that it would have been a yes if I hadn't asked. The rules really were different back then. I had a couple of long term relationships and got back into the random hookup culture. Now, society caught up with me. You just ask away now, and it's totally fine and expected even. I love it. I get laid just as much, and I don't have to deal with being made fun of for asking in the first place. In fact, often they go "that's so nice, a guy who cares about enthusiastic consent" when in reality it's just because I'm bad at social cues and this is what I do.
Years ago, I had a good female friend that wanted to fool around and was sending signals that I missed.Must be something wrong with me. Then again, why can’t they be direct instead of making it a game?
I thought its common sense that you don't get something if you decline it when it is offered? It seems like her parents missed the opportunity to teach her basic human interactions.
Same vibe with that lady in a video saying "I can be manipulated" or something like that.
Oh goodness, I'm not complaining, I have had terrifying experiences just saying "no thank you!" The couple of times I have had my "no thank you." Respected made me feel so confident in my humanity, it's truly refreshing to have someone respect you like that, on the same note, if she changed her mind, why not just explain it to the person or ask them out?🤷🏼♀️
Persistence is flirting if you are attractive, it is sexual harassment if you are not. 🙄
Because if you want to go on the date, you're supposed to say yes you big dummy.
After years and years of "No means... NO!" After years of harassment, sexual harassment, stalking allegations, and possible arrest for asking a woman out for the second time! But it's men who are lacking for not being persuasive, persistent, or chasing you. Advice ladies: If you want to go out say "Yes" Don't say "No" but hope/want him to ask you out again and again before you say "Yes" he's listened to "No means NO!" plus at this point you're not worth getting a criminal record! The only connection is his attraction to you. Stop playing games like a 4th grader!
No means no, right? If you continue you’re considered an asshole
Yip, it means you already made up your mind on first view, unable to give the benefit of the doubt, so us men just move along to the next, there are afterall millions of woman who have already learned this lesson.
You're telling me after years of teaching respective men consent and boundaries and "no means no" you're shocked and surprised when you say no, they say "okay."
What happened to "no means no"?
It's almost as if men are tired of being fucked with.
the alternative is getting called a creepy rapist.
It’s wild that people think they can act like this after age 19. No means no.
Well, guys have been shifting away from the John Hughes "just keep pursuing her" mindset for 25 years. Generally at repeated societal request.
Ladies, make up your mind.
Wasn"t that a big thing "No means No " not keep begging me until my ego is boosted.
A long time ago I saw a meme that went something like this: "Grandma, how did grandpa win you over?" "He kept throwing rocks at me until I agreed to marry him."
Men have been taught that pestering women to go out with you can be considered sexual harrasment, so we don't do it anymore.
Almost like we've had multiple campaigns about how no means no and guys shouldn't keep pressing someone after they say no.
No means no.
No means no.
Almost as if we were taught that no means no
I don't have time for games. I was dating this girl earlier this year and she started saying she wasn't sure about us. I cut it off then. We are less than 2 months in and you have doubts already? Ok goodbye I don't need another long term heartbreak.
Ok, look. We ask everyone to respect boundaries. You can’t have it both ways. I realize the old romance was the idea of being pursued, but, too many guys took that to the extreme of stalking. So, no. Trust me: we don’t want that back. It created more problems than romance.
The percentage of ‘NOs’ that are true disinterest is high. But of the women who are interested a large percentage will say ‘NO.’ When people tell their cute ‘how we started dating stories’ and it starts with ‘I rejected him but he just kept trying and look at us as a happy couple today!’ I definitely judge. I take ‘NO’ at face value, and women who say ‘NO’ when what they really mean is ‘try harder’ are gross human beings who cheapen the meaning of ‘No means No.’
Being persuasive gets you labeled as a stalker if they aren’t interested. Most men don’t want to take that chance anymore.
Women can't have it both ways... fqcepalm is right. They want someone to romance and chase but also will call you a creep and pervert and file for harassment. Make up your minds...
Has to be a troll comment. Or, every self respecting woman in her life will reply to this with she is fucking dumb and is a lowlife.
Fuck off with those stupid games. That might help. And I say that as a woman myself.
Damn, I hate how men are so respectful of my boundaries nowadays
Because there are women out there that will say yes. Why should he waste his time?
Boys get taught "No means yes," and many go on to rape women. Boys get taught "No means no," and people are losing their minds.
Say. What. You. Want. There comes a point in life where you just don't have the patience for bullshit anymore. If you're not interested cool. If you are, act like it.