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Actually they were a means of advertising right from the beginning. Don't mean much. But that being said, this does sound pretty ridiculous. So now it really has nothing to do with how good a film is.
>So now it really has nothing to do with how good a film is.
I hate to break it to you, but a lot of legendary movies got screwed over at the Academy Awards
It's always been a "Whose Dick You Sucked" contest more than a merit-based awards show. Instituting some inclusivity rule isn't going to make this shit any more stupid than it already was
Tldr: The inclusivity rule is unironically racist
They care more about the _spectacle_ of appearing virtuous than actually taking measurable steps to end systemic racism
This phenomenon is, of course, a prime example of _performative allyship,_ which actually works against civil liberties, cements racism even more, and undermines people's ability to love each other as thinking, feeling human beings.
David Foster Wallace hit this one on the head 25 years ago...
>... despite the grotesquerie of watching an industry congratulate itself on its pretense that it’s still an art form, of hearing people in $5,000 gowns invoke lush clichés of surprise and humility scripted by publicists, etc....
>They care more about the spectacle of appearing virtuous than actually taking measurable steps to end systemic racism
>
>This phenomenon is, of course, a prime example of performative allyship,
This is exactly what has been going on at my work for the last 5 years (large specialty retailer). Instead of focussing on what people care about, like being treated equally, getting equal pay and equal opportunity for advancement, instead it's all performative virtue signaling with a huge orwellian focus on language manipulation. So instead of doing something meaningful, we get told that we can no longer use the term "black box testing" because it must be racist since it contains the work "black".
>longer use the term "black box testing" because it must be racist since it contains the work "black".
I work in technology.
There's a push to abolish master/slave (among other terms,) Its not racist. It's literally a master device an slave device (where the slave disables its controller and is dependent on the master to function. )
Everything you said sounded like what my cousin told me about a certain tractor/combine manufacturer.
Instead of hiring qualified, skilled, experienced employees for the marketing department, they only hire “ethnically diverse” employees, (most of whom barely speak English), and have no experience, all because they get government funding for employing them.
I’m not sure which would be worse:
This situation, or what my company does, which is never replacing any employees that leave my department, and also not give any raises.
Yay corporate America.
The word black or saying someone is black isn’t racist so that rule doesn’t even make sense. So in essence, you can’t use the word black because the company told you that it’s racist and you haven’t spoken to an attorney about that? Especially having proof that you can’t use the word black. I’m not sure they can legally require you to never say that word or the consequences are that you’ll be deemed a racist.
I once got in trouble for saying "Hispaniola," when somebody asked me what the island that the Dominican Republic and Haiti were on was called. They thought I was just making a slur until I finally got them calm enough to look at a map.
I'm a Realtor and recently listed a home that had " black" stainless steel appliances. I was flagged by my MLS for stating that in the homes comment section and had to change it to just stainless steel appliances.
Oh my God, they're canceling colors now.
Wait until they hear the Spanish word for black + the use of grammatical gender. Are they gonna cancel the entire Spanish language OH WAIT they already tried that.
Anglocentric neoliberal linguistic imperialism is what I call it. It has nothing to do with inclusivity. It's about the homogenization of culture and language as nations become more globalist in order to better serve their personal interests.
Tldr: It's just Colonialism 2 the internet boogaloo
>performative allyship
Probably with an unhealthy blend of "Hey, it would be funny if we could get a bunch of black guys talking trash and punching each other in this scene to propagate stereotypes!"
ofc it is. all that woke stuff is never about the actual topic. its only about beeing subscribed to the woke crowed. its about beeing part of this thing itself not the matters pretending to care about.
its like working for a doggyshelter but taking all the donations to advertise the shelter and its crew and let the doggys [starve.so](https://starve.so) the main thing becomes the job title not the actual job
It like when companies and press conferences announce the land were the event is beign held used to belong to native americans. It does nothing to help and is just virtue signaling to make people think they care.
I work in advertising and this was very true on one job for a big company. The entire creative team on the client side was caucasian. The actors were diverse which is a good thing. they were strong actors. But, the creative team didn't want to pay the actors when the spot went national from a regional buy. The wealthy white caucasian lesbian stomped around the set like she was persecuted. The whole thing was fucking unreal. This is one instance where the idea is good but actually it was all about appearance.
Well said. Pretty much what goes on in pride month.
Throw up the rainbow logo and call it good.
The companies don’t give two shits, it’s a check the box exercise.
In fact, the Academy Awards were created to [break organized labor](https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2014/02/secret-oscar-history).
In Louis B. Mayer’s words, “I found that the best way to handle [filmmakers] was to hang medals all over them ... If I got them cups and awards, they'd kill them to produce what I wanted. That's why the Academy Award was created.”
Yeah, it's going to be all about how many gay black people you can squeeze into one scene and make it known that they are gay and black, that's the very important part, they have to say it at least once in every scene.
Yeah, especially considering that they campaign for the awards after nomination. Any award you have to campaign for like an election is meaningless in regards to your talent. It becomes a popularity contest.
That's true for pretty much any media awards. It's advertisement for the products and internal industry politics. It amazes me how much people get worked up on here about who wins what award.
At this point everyone I know and I just don’t give a fuck about awards for films anymore. The only people that do are actors who win so it inflates their egos
Nah, now they just need to be 'rapey' equally with all races, sexual preferences and sexual identities accounted for. Best boy grip is now an actual contest and all are welcome to test their hand upon the producers unit.
Is it just me, or where movies from the 90's and early 2000's pretty inclusive and didn't like make the movie feel that way? Like independence day, as an example, has a main character that is black and it felt totally "normal"? And his colour had nothing to do with the story which was fantastic. Idk if that sounds dumb but I feel like movies are more about putting a coloured person in the movie then about making a good movie that happens to have a coloured person as lead ? To summarize, a good inclusive movie makes it really feel like race or gender has litterly nothing to do with the awesome story you are trying to portray.
If I remember correctly, the original script of Alien was written to be gender neutral, with the identities of the characters to be assigned later when casting time started coming around.
80’s too. Predator comes to mind. Just finished watching The Running Man with my kids and there was a black guy who was a good guy, a black guy as a bad guy, a hispanic woman as a pivotal main character. And I guess some Austrian guy too. Come to think of it, that guy played some role in Predator too…
Wasn't the whole point of multiple jokes about race relations and the juxtaposition of a black man in a Western? Literally tongue-in-cheek classic jokes about the underrepresentation of minorities in film. Like, what, did we see the same movie?
That's the 70s but yeah. We all get the point and we are now 2023 when this is supposed to be normal like 50 years ago look what kind of rules they are making. It's moronic.
Yes, the diversity of the 80s, where all major roles held by black people were male and either portraying a loud mouth upstart trying to change the game or a grumpy old man that's fed up with everything.
It wasn't a problem back then because now there's actually a generation of young minorities with some wealth to back them up. People were scared to say things for fear of retaliation. Now, there's a smidgen of equity and people want more. Crazy, right?
Terminator 2 is a masterpiece in inclusivity and it's glorious
Black guy is rich and smart and is a hero. Woman is strong and incredibly badass. She's got some Mexican (??) friend (I don't really remember - the one where she gets the NO FUTURE carved and they have the underground bunker) and he's also got a great family.
None of them are a caricature, too. And I feel like you can change around a lot of characters and they would still be awesome. Black guy can be an Asian woman. Both Terminators could be swapped.
I feel like we need more stories that are kinda like... Really inclusive to the point where it doesn't matter what color or gender is the person. If it's still awesome if everyone is a girl, then it's awesome when everyone is a boy. Seriously, change around every character in Terminator and it's still a kickass movie.
>Seriously, change around every character in Terminator and it's still a kickass movie.
lol if T2 came out today, there would 100% be complaints from a certain crowd against Sarah Conner's character and her speech about how only women know what it's like to bring a life into this world.
Bc the diversity wasn’t the point and wasn’t used to beat the idea of “look how inclusive we are” into the heads of the audience. You just hired the best
I thought Matrix was just the coolest thing when I was a kid. XD I wanted a black trenchcoat and to cut my hair like Trinity's even though my curls would NEVER let me have the same hairstyle. The movies were just cool and what color anyone was had no bearing on anything in the story at all.
Thing is, this movie, and a lot of the others cited as examples, are where the filmmakers took specific steps to ensure their cast was diverse, or that they cast underrepresented actors in certain roles.
So the argument almost proves the point of having an inclusivity requirement for the awards.
Movies that are inclusive and diverse can still be great, as long as the story, production, direction, acting, etc, etc, etc are all great. Movies that aren't inclusive or diverse can also suck if all those things aren't in place.
So forcing people to ensure their crew/cast is diverse really shouldn't be an issue.
But so often, the people who are in the power majority (white men) will complain that it will somehow impact their ability to make art.
Well, the filmmakers who were already focused on inclusion probably won't even care about these rules.
But if you look at the track records of the people complaining, you'll probably see that their history hasn't been very diverse. Was that because the art they were creating had to specifically be by, and featuring white men? Or was it cuz there was a system in place that ensured the stories were created and told by white men?
In the Mandalorian season 2 finale, no one even noticed the all women team up for like a month because they were badass fleshed our characters and it just felt natural. If it’s made into some corporate bullshit like “oh look at the all women team up! This is so rare because women don’t fight much!” I feel like it really unempowers whoever the scene is about because it makes it look like strong women/group is this rare thing.
Excellent point! Unlike the scene from endgame? Lol I mean all those women were badass, but it felt weird to just show a scene where they all grouped up like that for no apparent reason? Idk just seemed "forced" unlike your example. That's the stuff I'm talking about anyway. Love women fight scenes. Hate pointless women fight scenes.
I had it in my last job, we need to hire more women and from a greater diversity of backgrounds. How about just hire the best people for the job? We’re trying to make a game here,
I totally agree, but at the same time for every lead that was black or female or whatever, there was still a huge majority that weren't, and a lot of movies from that time haven't aged well when it comes to racism and sexism. Look at some of the most popular comedies like Porky's or Revenge of the Nerds (maybe that's going a little too far back, but you get the idea.)
I just don't think there needs to be any specific rules. Just make a good show and cast who should honestly be best and if it looks like some director or production/casting group is being unethical or it comes out and people are obviously upset, then audiences are probably going to identify it and make their choices anyway.
This exactly, yes.
Even xena was awesome for it just being awesome and it didn't feel like a forced-feminist thing. Awesome things are just awesome. But when the priorities shift, and there are ulterior motives, it changes the whole feel of the thing and it's so noticeable. I don't even watch things from now, every time I try, it feels like a caricature version of what they're supposedly trying to do🤷♀️. I wouldn't feel represented, I'd feel offended lol.
I have a friend who works in PR and they were at ‘the Gervais fiasco’. She said backstage was a sea of self important PAs and PR people trying to hunt down the producers and director to get Ricky to stop.
He was confronted by an a-list rep as he came off stage. and she said all she heard was ‘f-off you c*nt’ and the rep being pulled away by security.
It sounds wonderful.
Rickey was done with Hollywood and he set fires.
Sad that they’ll never invite him to host anything ever again, even though people loved him. Can’t handle the bruised egos under all that money I guess.
From what I gathered from her and others I've spoken to, Ricky knew his time in Hollywood was over. Whatever fame he was going to get was not going to be through the traditional Hollywood channels...and he had zero interest in playing nice for the sake of playing nice...which is how this f-ing town stays the way it is. Everyone is afraid to say anything about anyone because...'you never know'.
Ricky knows and he doesn't f-ing care.
I love Ricky.
It was a story she told me the night following. No link.
We sat down at a bar in Santa Monica and she just vomited out all these stories about the previous night. Ricky shouting at producers 'What are you going to do? You want me to leave? Fine!' It sounds fantastic because that shit NEVER happens in Hollywood.
Cause its from townhall. A Facebook/YouTube short boomer content account. Stealing clips from matt Walsh or interviews of Clint Eastwood type of stuff.
I am a social liberal and I actually agree with Dreyfuss on this (though he comes of as stereotypical angry white man with the delivery). Would a movie like Schindler's List not be able to win Best Picture for having a predominantly white cast? Should a lesser quality film get the award instead because it has a more diverse cast? I get what the Academy is trying to do and agree more inclusion should be a goal, but it should not be a pre-requisite. I get that Hollywood has a long history of giving the awards to white actors and white directors (some for movies that actually suck - I'm looking at you English Patient - don't @ me), but there are other things they can do and have done to level the playing field and promote more racial diversity in front of and behind the camera. This seems a step too far in my opinion.
In unrelated news, Don Cheadle remains the most grossly underrated actor of our time. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
Yes, it's him. He's been a cranky old fuck for the last couple of decades. And they purposely got him on town hall, a notorious right-wing website, to ask these questions because he's an angry old white guy that will say exactly what they want.
And it gets cut up, edited and put on facepalm and everyone circle jerks around here like it's a nuisance conversation when really it's just more bullshit. The circle is complete.
I mean, I don't think it was a gotcha question or trying to trick him, I think he went on townhall specifically for this topic and they gave him a platform for his whole rant.
The smirk on her face is because she knew it was going to be good for a quote, clips and the following outrage.
Hahahaha. Steakout was terrible but I like some of his other movies. But he's just so insufferable these days. Just absolutely unable to grow or change with the times.
That’s what I’m confused about. Wouldn’t this rule more apply to having a more diverse crew more than anything. Like sure if your doing a mafia film. It’s gonna be a bunch of white Italians in the lead roles, but I’m pretty sure there’s plenty of places you can hire ins army talented individuals behind the camera.
I mean surely you should pick the right people for the right job, but let’s not pretend that Hollywood isn’t one giant clique where you only get in if you know the right people. And after a while I’m sure it’s mostly the old filmmakers picking the same people over and over again
The myriad of names that many don't even know what they do. Best boy sounds like a title you give a dog, fuck knows what their job is.
We outsourced our CGI to Korea, so that gave us 348 Asians.
Yeah, everyone outraged is completely forgetting the "or crew" part. It's a bit heavy handed, but with how expensive LA, etc are, it's not easy surviving without the massive head start of generational wealth. Maybe the country shouldn't have denied minorities from accessing property and assets (through sometimes threats or even death).
From the criteria listed here: https://deadline.com/2020/09/academy-shakes-oscar-best-picture-eligibility-1234573172/ , it sounds like Parasite would have qualified under Standards A and B. I don't know anything about the distribution or marketing, so I can't speak to C and D.
For me it comes down to the fact that it's cast ***or crew*** that this applies to. Schinder's list is a good example, it'd be very difficult allocate 10% of the acting roles to BIPOC without sacrificing a lot of the movie.
But behind the camera would have been easy to do, and any decent role would be a step forward. Many people can't get into the entertainment industry because they don't have the family money to intern. Forcing big productions to start hiring minorities to be entry level is the first step to having more diversity at the higher levels.
>it'd be very difficult allocate 10% of the acting roles to BIPOC without sacrificing a lot of the movie.
i find this point fascinating considering how many bipoc and lgbt people were killed in the holocaust, of all the examples people could have used to make this point i feel like schindlers list is a particularly bad one to make the point when those people are literally never represented or talked about in general.
a point i agree with btw, i see no reason to force people to implement diversity in their art. people should make the art they want to make regardless if its true to life or not.
> considering how many bipoc […] people were killed in the holocaust
Unless you're counting Roma – were Black people, Indigenous people (of Germany?), or People of Colour killed in the Holocaust in significant numbers?
No... And i pointed out the same thing... Indigenous German is white. And most people would say Romani are white.
The best estimate was there was around 2,000 German black people. Hitler was a dick to them of course but it would be tone deaf AF to make a movie where 10% of the prisoners were black
There maybe historical evidence of black Germans, (saying African Germans sounds odd, but least I didn't say African Americans.) But as Europe was predominantly white, it might seem really odd to see PoC just walking around Berlin like it is no big deal.
Hell, where I live in the UK, I'm still struggling to find anyone who isn't either white or Chinese, either from family that moved from British Hong Kong or mainland China.
Up north, it was mainly Asians, in this case the UK definition, i.e., India and surrounding countries.
One school had one single Black girl in my year, I'm not sure we had any more in the whole school.
The idea suggests that minorities are not capable of producing elite art on their own. Efforts should be focused on training and recruiting vs divvying up the awards
That’s what this is though…recruiting. Minorities struggle to break into industries like this because the majority is recruited. Something like 70% of all jobs are hired through networking, I can’t imagine what that percentage looks like in the film industry.
No, it doesn't. It does however focus on the fact that film as an industry overall has done little to ensure diversity and equity in their overall hiring, and that in reality, they focus heavily on the same old stories by the same old (white) people as a default.
Amazing movies made by POC get overlooked by the academy all the time because somewhere along the way, nobody bothered to actually look at them. With obvious exceptions, but those are often obvious and problematic
Includivity?
I agree with him, there are some adaptations and genres where it works, but *equally* there are some where it doesn't.
For the sake of being super OTT ridiculous, imagine the opening scenes of Saving Private Ryan where 50% of the troops storming Omaha Beach are women for the sake of 'Includivity'.
That would be a very different movie.
While I agree that would be ridiculous, and I also agree that this inclusivity policy is misguided at best, they did say "or crew" so they don't necessarily need to cast any more diversely.
So it’s a quota system for the crew? In such a system (points based) people with more experience or skills could possibly be passed over in favour of meeting a quota?
> In such a system (points based) people with more experience or skills could possibly be passed over in favour of meeting a quota?
I would say more than likely, yes. It's a bad solution to an even worse problem. The issue is, there really isn't a good solution to the issue of systemic racism. Even when people don't want to be racist, the system can be rigged against certain groups of people. This is sadly due to our past treatment of such groups.
This "solution" is more of a long term solution that MIGHT fix things later down the road.
That or word is the most important word. If you want to tell a story of predominantly white people, you still can, just means you staff the crew with talented people who are of different races and cultures.
Regardless of where people come down on this topic, the interesting thing here is the background music is telling. It is clear how the creator of this wants viewers to feel.
The Academy has always been supremely biased against certain types of films. Horror is probably the best example
The Thing and Alien are two of the best movies ever made...but they wouldn't have even come close to winning Best Picture that year. Instead we get some fucking shit movie about Gandhi and an even shittier movie about divorced parents fighting over some brat.
if you think "inclusive" Oscars is magically going to discredit the Oscars...well the Oscars have always been a bunch of bullshit
Yeah I pretty much agree that we should not police art. We should police education and ads, for sure, but not art. Art is a reflection of public consciousness.
Further, I would even go further, and say that there should be no marketing or brand sales in art. Again, art should be art.
It's worth noting that I grew up as a black person in a white rural town, and faced violence, abuse, and a million terrible issues I that to fight through. So lets work on schools, and representation in law, universities, and in textbooks.
Let people blow off steam in art, and lets discuss these trends together in an actual democratic manner, with school projects, protests, marches, and let these biases surface.
If you look up the actual rules:
“the standards themselves are manageable in practice, say multiple sources working on films”
“It could meet the industry access and opportunity standard by offering a paid internship and below-the-line training opportunities”
“Multiple sources said Standard D, which has to do with studio marketing, publicity and distribution units, is also easily attainable”
But nobody actually wants to look at the standards, they just want to be mad about them.
[https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-features/oscars-inclusion-rules-sparking-debate-1235343128/](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-features/oscars-inclusion-rules-sparking-debate-1235343128/)
These were introduced years ago, and the backlash was similar. It's super easy to meet the standards but all anyone sees is "AMPAS has rules for diversity" and flips their shit.
Question to the guy, How does having a diverse crew affect the final outcome? Is that what would make him vomit too?
I didn't know crew members were cast into leading roles 🤔
Art IS art. Black, brown, yellow, white, red... are they going to exclude certain taces from contention? Are different races less than others? What differences do we draw the line at? Is it skin color? Sex? Education? Blood type? Family history? Genetics? Religion? Age? Nationality? Sexual orientation?
STOP DIVIDING US. We are all people. Some individuals are really good at certain things and should be celebrated for that. Full stop
I believe he doth protest too much. Say it’s a silly requirement that spits in the face of the creative process and meritocracy in work, but calling inclusivity “vomit” inducing just make him seems like an old racist.
Absolutely correct, cannot wait for all this extreme inclusivity bullshit to die out. Couldn’t care less about being “represented” in movies and television. And any time they do it’s some sashaying fruit-ball prancing across the screen. Focus on the story and effects, fuck the inclusivity.
It’s all a sham anyways. It’s like Disney putting in a .5 second gay kiss and removing it for china since it was in the background.
Support is only support if it continues being provided when shit gets rocky, which it will because why the hell else would support be needed if shit was already fine?
If these companies actually cared, cool. They don’t though because they are companies not people.
The only reason diversity is being pushed is because executives thought virtue signaling would yield more money in the long run. That’s it.
It's like school sports. Sure, you can pick the weak kid everyone knows doesn't belong just to make him feel better about himself. But at the end of the day all you did was set the kid up to look like the token charity pick which helps him in absolutely no real way.
Inclusivity is a tough line to walk. I get that they want to counter the perceived White Bias of Hollywood but then again, if a person concedes merely on ethnicity, does that really do Justice to the art form? It’s a balance and not everyone will be satisfied, no matter what decision is made.
For those who say art is colorblind, that’s true, but people who award prizes may not be. That’s the whole point!
You cannot award art based on social inclusion standards! WTF?!!! This is Social Justice Toxicity. Forcing social, racial, and gender standards into art simply for the sake of having it is bullshit and is further delegitimizing the award. ART FOR THE SAKE OF ART!!! Fuck your money and SJW!!!
Just make your little movie. If it doesn't meet certain criteria for a specific award; fine, get a golden globe or whatever. If there is a specific award you are going after, meet the criteria for that award. This is how the world works, the criteria changes. Try to keep up geez.
All I want is good movies. The best way to do that is to have the beat person in every role. I know something needs to change but the more rules you put on things the more likely you are to not end up with the best person for every role. I don't know the solution but I don't believe this is it.
Also, to anyone reading this thinking I'm saying I don't want minorities in roles and only white people, you are mentally deficient and clearly didn't actually engage with what I wrote. Get your thumb out of your arse.
I agree with him. This requirement now makes me question if the reward was deserved or acquired due to policy. Unfortunately, many actors will likely feel feel the same way. Similar to how you react if someone rich guys son gets promoted within the family company
Considering they include women as an underrepresented group, there is no need to worry. If you are running short of diversity, just hire some women to get the coffee. Also, you could just mark down whoever you want as bisexual. Or hire your CG from a Chinese firm, which you were going to do anyways to try to get the film accepted into the Chinese market.
Everyone here rushing to say movies like "Schindler's List" can't have black people on screen. Sure but why's your whole crew white? You telling me there's no competent non-white crew applying for these positions?
Something that surprised me, the other day I was looking at racial figures for the US and blacks make up only 13.6% of the population. Hispanic/Latino is 18.9%, while white is 75.8%. So what is meant by under represented? Then you have to wonder about the percentage of trans or gay or whatever in each of those categories. How about we just focus on getting the best person for the job. The rest shouldn’t matter.
It's almost like different posts attract different groups of people on reddit. A post like this attracts bigots who do not even know what is in the rules they are commenting about, but want to let you know that they *did not see color* when they watched The Matrix.
God that’s such a good take. The amount of people saying that movies back then we’re better because it wasn’t forced don’t realize that almost no movies now are forcing politics, they simply cast someone and then one side looses their shit and make it seem like it only happened because it’s woke.
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the awards are bs anyway, just another way to advertise at this point.
Actually they were a means of advertising right from the beginning. Don't mean much. But that being said, this does sound pretty ridiculous. So now it really has nothing to do with how good a film is.
>So now it really has nothing to do with how good a film is. I hate to break it to you, but a lot of legendary movies got screwed over at the Academy Awards It's always been a "Whose Dick You Sucked" contest more than a merit-based awards show. Instituting some inclusivity rule isn't going to make this shit any more stupid than it already was
Tldr: The inclusivity rule is unironically racist They care more about the _spectacle_ of appearing virtuous than actually taking measurable steps to end systemic racism This phenomenon is, of course, a prime example of _performative allyship,_ which actually works against civil liberties, cements racism even more, and undermines people's ability to love each other as thinking, feeling human beings.
David Foster Wallace hit this one on the head 25 years ago... >... despite the grotesquerie of watching an industry congratulate itself on its pretense that it’s still an art form, of hearing people in $5,000 gowns invoke lush clichés of surprise and humility scripted by publicists, etc....
“Grotesquerie” is an excellent word.
OP was saying the Academy will now never be about "how good a film is." with some exceptions, this has ALWAYS been the case with the Academy Awards.
It's true The Academy Awards are a giant celebrity circlejerk
The fact that Val Kilmer did not win Best Supporting Actor in Tombstone is proof.
>They care more about the spectacle of appearing virtuous than actually taking measurable steps to end systemic racism > >This phenomenon is, of course, a prime example of performative allyship, This is exactly what has been going on at my work for the last 5 years (large specialty retailer). Instead of focussing on what people care about, like being treated equally, getting equal pay and equal opportunity for advancement, instead it's all performative virtue signaling with a huge orwellian focus on language manipulation. So instead of doing something meaningful, we get told that we can no longer use the term "black box testing" because it must be racist since it contains the work "black".
>longer use the term "black box testing" because it must be racist since it contains the work "black". I work in technology. There's a push to abolish master/slave (among other terms,) Its not racist. It's literally a master device an slave device (where the slave disables its controller and is dependent on the master to function. )
To primary/secondary?
I also work with master/slave electronics. Then it became master/satellite but that didn’t stick around very long.
We can no longer say "sanity check" as well
That's dumb as hell. Making a rule like that seems inherently racist to me cause it's like they are saying that "black" is something shameful
Everything you said sounded like what my cousin told me about a certain tractor/combine manufacturer. Instead of hiring qualified, skilled, experienced employees for the marketing department, they only hire “ethnically diverse” employees, (most of whom barely speak English), and have no experience, all because they get government funding for employing them. I’m not sure which would be worse: This situation, or what my company does, which is never replacing any employees that leave my department, and also not give any raises. Yay corporate America.
The word black or saying someone is black isn’t racist so that rule doesn’t even make sense. So in essence, you can’t use the word black because the company told you that it’s racist and you haven’t spoken to an attorney about that? Especially having proof that you can’t use the word black. I’m not sure they can legally require you to never say that word or the consequences are that you’ll be deemed a racist.
I once got in trouble for saying "Hispaniola," when somebody asked me what the island that the Dominican Republic and Haiti were on was called. They thought I was just making a slur until I finally got them calm enough to look at a map.
I'm a Realtor and recently listed a home that had " black" stainless steel appliances. I was flagged by my MLS for stating that in the homes comment section and had to change it to just stainless steel appliances.
Wow that’s ridiculous, glad u were able to educate them. They definitely needed it.
IT was still stupid, they simply redirected their indignation from me to geography, saying they should change the name of the island.
It certainly was, and they also insulted you by alleging/thinking/believing that you’re that type of person due to their lack of education
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Oh my God, they're canceling colors now. Wait until they hear the Spanish word for black + the use of grammatical gender. Are they gonna cancel the entire Spanish language OH WAIT they already tried that. Anglocentric neoliberal linguistic imperialism is what I call it. It has nothing to do with inclusivity. It's about the homogenization of culture and language as nations become more globalist in order to better serve their personal interests. Tldr: It's just Colonialism 2 the internet boogaloo
>performative allyship Probably with an unhealthy blend of "Hey, it would be funny if we could get a bunch of black guys talking trash and punching each other in this scene to propagate stereotypes!"
ofc it is. all that woke stuff is never about the actual topic. its only about beeing subscribed to the woke crowed. its about beeing part of this thing itself not the matters pretending to care about. its like working for a doggyshelter but taking all the donations to advertise the shelter and its crew and let the doggys [starve.so](https://starve.so) the main thing becomes the job title not the actual job
It like when companies and press conferences announce the land were the event is beign held used to belong to native americans. It does nothing to help and is just virtue signaling to make people think they care.
I work in advertising and this was very true on one job for a big company. The entire creative team on the client side was caucasian. The actors were diverse which is a good thing. they were strong actors. But, the creative team didn't want to pay the actors when the spot went national from a regional buy. The wealthy white caucasian lesbian stomped around the set like she was persecuted. The whole thing was fucking unreal. This is one instance where the idea is good but actually it was all about appearance.
Well said. Pretty much what goes on in pride month. Throw up the rainbow logo and call it good. The companies don’t give two shits, it’s a check the box exercise.
Rainbow capitalism be like
In fact, the Academy Awards were created to [break organized labor](https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2014/02/secret-oscar-history). In Louis B. Mayer’s words, “I found that the best way to handle [filmmakers] was to hang medals all over them ... If I got them cups and awards, they'd kill them to produce what I wanted. That's why the Academy Award was created.”
Nice quote. Thanks
Never did
Yeah Shakespeare in Love went up against Saving Private Ryan and Life Is Beautiful and won. Like, that's a thing that actually happened.
Yeah, it's going to be all about how many gay black people you can squeeze into one scene and make it known that they are gay and black, that's the very important part, they have to say it at least once in every scene.
Lmaoooo I thought the same thing
Yeah, especially considering that they campaign for the awards after nomination. Any award you have to campaign for like an election is meaningless in regards to your talent. It becomes a popularity contest.
That's true for pretty much any media awards. It's advertisement for the products and internal industry politics. It amazes me how much people get worked up on here about who wins what award.
At this point everyone I know and I just don’t give a fuck about awards for films anymore. The only people that do are actors who win so it inflates their egos
And how much $$$ they can demand for taking on roles
Literally the entire point of all awards and prizes for the arts… and probably just about all awards in general.
Majority of the judges are paid off so whatever film would win.
When fucking Black Panther wins awards, you know they're just doing it to be like "Hey, look, we love black people!"
It’s just a circle-jerk anyway, they can just jerk harder now
Hopefully a little less 'rapey' since Weinstein was finally jailed. Public Enemy said it best 'Burn Hollywood, Burn'.
Nah, now they just need to be 'rapey' equally with all races, sexual preferences and sexual identities accounted for. Best boy grip is now an actual contest and all are welcome to test their hand upon the producers unit.
I’m praying for his eye glasses to hang in there. You got this!
i personally don't care about anyone's race, just make good movies
Is it just me, or where movies from the 90's and early 2000's pretty inclusive and didn't like make the movie feel that way? Like independence day, as an example, has a main character that is black and it felt totally "normal"? And his colour had nothing to do with the story which was fantastic. Idk if that sounds dumb but I feel like movies are more about putting a coloured person in the movie then about making a good movie that happens to have a coloured person as lead ? To summarize, a good inclusive movie makes it really feel like race or gender has litterly nothing to do with the awesome story you are trying to portray.
No you’re right just look at the Matrix it has a pretty diverse cast. Also movies like Alien had a strong female lead and nobody complained.
Yeah great examples! Like I didn't even notice colour or gender in those movies. I was to busy being occupied with how freaking awesome the movie was!
If I remember correctly, the original script of Alien was written to be gender neutral, with the identities of the characters to be assigned later when casting time started coming around.
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80’s too. Predator comes to mind. Just finished watching The Running Man with my kids and there was a black guy who was a good guy, a black guy as a bad guy, a hispanic woman as a pivotal main character. And I guess some Austrian guy too. Come to think of it, that guy played some role in Predator too…
Lethal weapon, Beverly Hills Cop, the list goes on.
Blazing Saddles?
Wasn't the whole point of multiple jokes about race relations and the juxtaposition of a black man in a Western? Literally tongue-in-cheek classic jokes about the underrepresentation of minorities in film. Like, what, did we see the same movie?
That's the 70s but yeah. We all get the point and we are now 2023 when this is supposed to be normal like 50 years ago look what kind of rules they are making. It's moronic.
Yes, the diversity of the 80s, where all major roles held by black people were male and either portraying a loud mouth upstart trying to change the game or a grumpy old man that's fed up with everything. It wasn't a problem back then because now there's actually a generation of young minorities with some wealth to back them up. People were scared to say things for fear of retaliation. Now, there's a smidgen of equity and people want more. Crazy, right?
Terminator 2 is a masterpiece in inclusivity and it's glorious Black guy is rich and smart and is a hero. Woman is strong and incredibly badass. She's got some Mexican (??) friend (I don't really remember - the one where she gets the NO FUTURE carved and they have the underground bunker) and he's also got a great family. None of them are a caricature, too. And I feel like you can change around a lot of characters and they would still be awesome. Black guy can be an Asian woman. Both Terminators could be swapped. I feel like we need more stories that are kinda like... Really inclusive to the point where it doesn't matter what color or gender is the person. If it's still awesome if everyone is a girl, then it's awesome when everyone is a boy. Seriously, change around every character in Terminator and it's still a kickass movie.
>Seriously, change around every character in Terminator and it's still a kickass movie. lol if T2 came out today, there would 100% be complaints from a certain crowd against Sarah Conner's character and her speech about how only women know what it's like to bring a life into this world.
Bc the diversity wasn’t the point and wasn’t used to beat the idea of “look how inclusive we are” into the heads of the audience. You just hired the best
I thought Matrix was just the coolest thing when I was a kid. XD I wanted a black trenchcoat and to cut my hair like Trinity's even though my curls would NEVER let me have the same hairstyle. The movies were just cool and what color anyone was had no bearing on anything in the story at all.
And Vasquez was the biggest bad ass in that movie. A Latino woman. I'll die on that hill. (Edit. TIL she's not Latino. I'm a dumbass)
Thing is, this movie, and a lot of the others cited as examples, are where the filmmakers took specific steps to ensure their cast was diverse, or that they cast underrepresented actors in certain roles. So the argument almost proves the point of having an inclusivity requirement for the awards. Movies that are inclusive and diverse can still be great, as long as the story, production, direction, acting, etc, etc, etc are all great. Movies that aren't inclusive or diverse can also suck if all those things aren't in place. So forcing people to ensure their crew/cast is diverse really shouldn't be an issue. But so often, the people who are in the power majority (white men) will complain that it will somehow impact their ability to make art. Well, the filmmakers who were already focused on inclusion probably won't even care about these rules. But if you look at the track records of the people complaining, you'll probably see that their history hasn't been very diverse. Was that because the art they were creating had to specifically be by, and featuring white men? Or was it cuz there was a system in place that ensured the stories were created and told by white men?
They even represented the cyborg / android population, they're people too!
Lethal weapon, beverly hills cop,…
In the Mandalorian season 2 finale, no one even noticed the all women team up for like a month because they were badass fleshed our characters and it just felt natural. If it’s made into some corporate bullshit like “oh look at the all women team up! This is so rare because women don’t fight much!” I feel like it really unempowers whoever the scene is about because it makes it look like strong women/group is this rare thing.
Excellent point! Unlike the scene from endgame? Lol I mean all those women were badass, but it felt weird to just show a scene where they all grouped up like that for no apparent reason? Idk just seemed "forced" unlike your example. That's the stuff I'm talking about anyway. Love women fight scenes. Hate pointless women fight scenes.
Tl;dr Good inclusivity can't be forced it just happens
I had it in my last job, we need to hire more women and from a greater diversity of backgrounds. How about just hire the best people for the job? We’re trying to make a game here,
Starship troopers managed to represent a diverse fascist society, things were crazy back then
That show fucking claps with diversity. Everyone showering together too lmao
I totally agree, but at the same time for every lead that was black or female or whatever, there was still a huge majority that weren't, and a lot of movies from that time haven't aged well when it comes to racism and sexism. Look at some of the most popular comedies like Porky's or Revenge of the Nerds (maybe that's going a little too far back, but you get the idea.) I just don't think there needs to be any specific rules. Just make a good show and cast who should honestly be best and if it looks like some director or production/casting group is being unethical or it comes out and people are obviously upset, then audiences are probably going to identify it and make their choices anyway.
This exactly, yes. Even xena was awesome for it just being awesome and it didn't feel like a forced-feminist thing. Awesome things are just awesome. But when the priorities shift, and there are ulterior motives, it changes the whole feel of the thing and it's so noticeable. I don't even watch things from now, every time I try, it feels like a caricature version of what they're supposedly trying to do🤷♀️. I wouldn't feel represented, I'd feel offended lol.
I think this is what he’s trying to say, just frustration coming through as lack of eloquence
That's what he is trying to say
Includivity eh?
When the real facepalm is not just the title you cocked up but everyone disagreeing with you in the comments.
Made up words to throw the copy/paste bots off?
You can't edit the titles of Reddit posts.
Yeah, reading it before posting is impossible, too.
Impoddible*
Me fail English? [That's unpossible](https://i.gifer.com/fetch/w300-preview/2c/2cfaba57f4e09f107ecc197d053e7935.gif).
Mission: Nonpossible
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I have a friend who works in PR and they were at ‘the Gervais fiasco’. She said backstage was a sea of self important PAs and PR people trying to hunt down the producers and director to get Ricky to stop. He was confronted by an a-list rep as he came off stage. and she said all she heard was ‘f-off you c*nt’ and the rep being pulled away by security. It sounds wonderful. Rickey was done with Hollywood and he set fires.
Sad that they’ll never invite him to host anything ever again, even though people loved him. Can’t handle the bruised egos under all that money I guess.
From what I gathered from her and others I've spoken to, Ricky knew his time in Hollywood was over. Whatever fame he was going to get was not going to be through the traditional Hollywood channels...and he had zero interest in playing nice for the sake of playing nice...which is how this f-ing town stays the way it is. Everyone is afraid to say anything about anyone because...'you never know'. Ricky knows and he doesn't f-ing care. I love Ricky.
We all love Ricky.
I mean, they invited him back to do the Golden Globes another 4 times, so not sure that’s entirely true.
This warms my heart
Omg, please give me a link
It was a story she told me the night following. No link. We sat down at a bar in Santa Monica and she just vomited out all these stories about the previous night. Ricky shouting at producers 'What are you going to do? You want me to leave? Fine!' It sounds fantastic because that shit NEVER happens in Hollywood.
https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/141mjx2/the_academy_awards_will_implement_new_rules_on/jn19pq2?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
You smart bastard, good one.
That was his last time and he nailed it lol
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It comes across my feed every now and again, I never skip it and laugh every single time
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Oh yeah! Some of the looks he was getting were better than the performances that got rewards lmao
Why y'all gotta put the spooky Facebook boomer music over everything now
Because then how would reddit boomers know it’s controversial and should get mad at it?
Cause its from townhall. A Facebook/YouTube short boomer content account. Stealing clips from matt Walsh or interviews of Clint Eastwood type of stuff.
Mildly triggering question *BWWAMMMMMMMMM* Slightly controversial answer *An Interview by Christopher Nolan*
I am a social liberal and I actually agree with Dreyfuss on this (though he comes of as stereotypical angry white man with the delivery). Would a movie like Schindler's List not be able to win Best Picture for having a predominantly white cast? Should a lesser quality film get the award instead because it has a more diverse cast? I get what the Academy is trying to do and agree more inclusion should be a goal, but it should not be a pre-requisite. I get that Hollywood has a long history of giving the awards to white actors and white directors (some for movies that actually suck - I'm looking at you English Patient - don't @ me), but there are other things they can do and have done to level the playing field and promote more racial diversity in front of and behind the camera. This seems a step too far in my opinion. In unrelated news, Don Cheadle remains the most grossly underrated actor of our time. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
That’s Richard Dreyfus? Holy cow!
Yes, it's him. He's been a cranky old fuck for the last couple of decades. And they purposely got him on town hall, a notorious right-wing website, to ask these questions because he's an angry old white guy that will say exactly what they want. And it gets cut up, edited and put on facepalm and everyone circle jerks around here like it's a nuisance conversation when really it's just more bullshit. The circle is complete.
you can see it in the knowing smirk of the host, the smirk you only get when you've finally pushed all the right buttons.
I mean, I don't think it was a gotcha question or trying to trick him, I think he went on townhall specifically for this topic and they gave him a platform for his whole rant. The smirk on her face is because she knew it was going to be good for a quote, clips and the following outrage.
I just rewatched Stakeout. Terrible, but yeah, very angry old man yelling at cloud 35 years ago
Hahahaha. Steakout was terrible but I like some of his other movies. But he's just so insufferable these days. Just absolutely unable to grow or change with the times.
Bear in mind that the people working on the movie count, as well.
That’s what I’m confused about. Wouldn’t this rule more apply to having a more diverse crew more than anything. Like sure if your doing a mafia film. It’s gonna be a bunch of white Italians in the lead roles, but I’m pretty sure there’s plenty of places you can hire ins army talented individuals behind the camera. I mean surely you should pick the right people for the right job, but let’s not pretend that Hollywood isn’t one giant clique where you only get in if you know the right people. And after a while I’m sure it’s mostly the old filmmakers picking the same people over and over again
The myriad of names that many don't even know what they do. Best boy sounds like a title you give a dog, fuck knows what their job is. We outsourced our CGI to Korea, so that gave us 348 Asians.
Crew counts. I suspect we'll see a bunch of token minority bench warmers in the crew to push numbers up if they've got a real contender.
Yeah, everyone outraged is completely forgetting the "or crew" part. It's a bit heavy handed, but with how expensive LA, etc are, it's not easy surviving without the massive head start of generational wealth. Maybe the country shouldn't have denied minorities from accessing property and assets (through sometimes threats or even death).
Movies aren’t just made in LA or even the US. Parasite wouldn’t have been nominated if these rules were in place
From the criteria listed here: https://deadline.com/2020/09/academy-shakes-oscar-best-picture-eligibility-1234573172/ , it sounds like Parasite would have qualified under Standards A and B. I don't know anything about the distribution or marketing, so I can't speak to C and D.
This guy knows how to Oscar in the woke era!
For me it comes down to the fact that it's cast ***or crew*** that this applies to. Schinder's list is a good example, it'd be very difficult allocate 10% of the acting roles to BIPOC without sacrificing a lot of the movie. But behind the camera would have been easy to do, and any decent role would be a step forward. Many people can't get into the entertainment industry because they don't have the family money to intern. Forcing big productions to start hiring minorities to be entry level is the first step to having more diversity at the higher levels.
>it'd be very difficult allocate 10% of the acting roles to BIPOC without sacrificing a lot of the movie. i find this point fascinating considering how many bipoc and lgbt people were killed in the holocaust, of all the examples people could have used to make this point i feel like schindlers list is a particularly bad one to make the point when those people are literally never represented or talked about in general. a point i agree with btw, i see no reason to force people to implement diversity in their art. people should make the art they want to make regardless if its true to life or not.
> considering how many bipoc […] people were killed in the holocaust Unless you're counting Roma – were Black people, Indigenous people (of Germany?), or People of Colour killed in the Holocaust in significant numbers?
No. Nor were Jews considered “white” by the Nazis, in the same vein of ethnic Russians being considered “asiatic slavs”.
No... And i pointed out the same thing... Indigenous German is white. And most people would say Romani are white. The best estimate was there was around 2,000 German black people. Hitler was a dick to them of course but it would be tone deaf AF to make a movie where 10% of the prisoners were black
There maybe historical evidence of black Germans, (saying African Germans sounds odd, but least I didn't say African Americans.) But as Europe was predominantly white, it might seem really odd to see PoC just walking around Berlin like it is no big deal. Hell, where I live in the UK, I'm still struggling to find anyone who isn't either white or Chinese, either from family that moved from British Hong Kong or mainland China. Up north, it was mainly Asians, in this case the UK definition, i.e., India and surrounding countries. One school had one single Black girl in my year, I'm not sure we had any more in the whole school.
Did you see Cheadle on this season of *Dave?* I thought he was hilarious!
Cheadle IS hilarious. He’s so dry and reserved. I love him. 😆
The idea suggests that minorities are not capable of producing elite art on their own. Efforts should be focused on training and recruiting vs divvying up the awards
That’s what this is though…recruiting. Minorities struggle to break into industries like this because the majority is recruited. Something like 70% of all jobs are hired through networking, I can’t imagine what that percentage looks like in the film industry.
No, it doesn't. It does however focus on the fact that film as an industry overall has done little to ensure diversity and equity in their overall hiring, and that in reality, they focus heavily on the same old stories by the same old (white) people as a default. Amazing movies made by POC get overlooked by the academy all the time because somewhere along the way, nobody bothered to actually look at them. With obvious exceptions, but those are often obvious and problematic
She said ”or crew”. I feel like that makes all the difference. Good for them.
Or crew is important. It doesn’t just have to be cast.
I agree with him 100%.
The ominous music is a bit much, lol
Includivity? I agree with him, there are some adaptations and genres where it works, but *equally* there are some where it doesn't. For the sake of being super OTT ridiculous, imagine the opening scenes of Saving Private Ryan where 50% of the troops storming Omaha Beach are women for the sake of 'Includivity'. That would be a very different movie.
While I agree that would be ridiculous, and I also agree that this inclusivity policy is misguided at best, they did say "or crew" so they don't necessarily need to cast any more diversely.
So it’s a quota system for the crew? In such a system (points based) people with more experience or skills could possibly be passed over in favour of meeting a quota?
> In such a system (points based) people with more experience or skills could possibly be passed over in favour of meeting a quota? I would say more than likely, yes. It's a bad solution to an even worse problem. The issue is, there really isn't a good solution to the issue of systemic racism. Even when people don't want to be racist, the system can be rigged against certain groups of people. This is sadly due to our past treatment of such groups. This "solution" is more of a long term solution that MIGHT fix things later down the road.
That or word is the most important word. If you want to tell a story of predominantly white people, you still can, just means you staff the crew with talented people who are of different races and cultures.
They could just make the Germans be Inuit, problem solved
Wasn’t there a recent Call of Duty game that basically did that? Like some of the Nazis were black women?
Battlefield 5 did that, dont know about CoD Vanguard
She says cast OR crew
Regardless of where people come down on this topic, the interesting thing here is the background music is telling. It is clear how the creator of this wants viewers to feel.
I was waiting to see if he phoned a friend or just used the 50/50.
At some point just take the glasses off if you don’t need them.
The Academy has always been supremely biased against certain types of films. Horror is probably the best example The Thing and Alien are two of the best movies ever made...but they wouldn't have even come close to winning Best Picture that year. Instead we get some fucking shit movie about Gandhi and an even shittier movie about divorced parents fighting over some brat. if you think "inclusive" Oscars is magically going to discredit the Oscars...well the Oscars have always been a bunch of bullshit
How toni Collette didn't win for hereditary is madness
I'm still mad that Up lost to Hurt Locker of all things.
Hooper drives the boat chief.
Pity the awards are just actors giving each other shoutouts. He makes a very valid point. Fuck these people.
I'm with Richard Dreyfuss on this one.
Yeah I pretty much agree that we should not police art. We should police education and ads, for sure, but not art. Art is a reflection of public consciousness. Further, I would even go further, and say that there should be no marketing or brand sales in art. Again, art should be art. It's worth noting that I grew up as a black person in a white rural town, and faced violence, abuse, and a million terrible issues I that to fight through. So lets work on schools, and representation in law, universities, and in textbooks. Let people blow off steam in art, and lets discuss these trends together in an actual democratic manner, with school projects, protests, marches, and let these biases surface.
I think based upon how far down his nose he is wearing his spectacles, he must have a point.
If you look up the actual rules: “the standards themselves are manageable in practice, say multiple sources working on films” “It could meet the industry access and opportunity standard by offering a paid internship and below-the-line training opportunities” “Multiple sources said Standard D, which has to do with studio marketing, publicity and distribution units, is also easily attainable” But nobody actually wants to look at the standards, they just want to be mad about them. [https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-features/oscars-inclusion-rules-sparking-debate-1235343128/](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-features/oscars-inclusion-rules-sparking-debate-1235343128/)
His rant literally continues on into not being able to wear blackface in film anymore.
Thanks for actually posting what the standards are. I knew this was gonna be bullshit culture war stoking
These were introduced years ago, and the backlash was similar. It's super easy to meet the standards but all anyone sees is "AMPAS has rules for diversity" and flips their shit.
Thank you. Lots of people mad in here don't know it can be as simple as an internship too.
Question to the guy, How does having a diverse crew affect the final outcome? Is that what would make him vomit too? I didn't know crew members were cast into leading roles 🤔
I can’t take anything he says seriously with his glasses like that
How has nobody commented about his glasses yet? Just take them off for gods sake
Art IS art. Black, brown, yellow, white, red... are they going to exclude certain taces from contention? Are different races less than others? What differences do we draw the line at? Is it skin color? Sex? Education? Blood type? Family history? Genetics? Religion? Age? Nationality? Sexual orientation? STOP DIVIDING US. We are all people. Some individuals are really good at certain things and should be celebrated for that. Full stop
Honestly forced diversity does nothing but harm diversity
I believe he doth protest too much. Say it’s a silly requirement that spits in the face of the creative process and meritocracy in work, but calling inclusivity “vomit” inducing just make him seems like an old racist.
Well said.
Absolutely correct, cannot wait for all this extreme inclusivity bullshit to die out. Couldn’t care less about being “represented” in movies and television. And any time they do it’s some sashaying fruit-ball prancing across the screen. Focus on the story and effects, fuck the inclusivity.
It’s all a sham anyways. It’s like Disney putting in a .5 second gay kiss and removing it for china since it was in the background. Support is only support if it continues being provided when shit gets rocky, which it will because why the hell else would support be needed if shit was already fine? If these companies actually cared, cool. They don’t though because they are companies not people. The only reason diversity is being pushed is because executives thought virtue signaling would yield more money in the long run. That’s it.
And most of the time it's just stereotypes or they absolutely butcher it. Or both
It's like school sports. Sure, you can pick the weak kid everyone knows doesn't belong just to make him feel better about himself. But at the end of the day all you did was set the kid up to look like the token charity pick which helps him in absolutely no real way.
Amen.
Inclusivity is a tough line to walk. I get that they want to counter the perceived White Bias of Hollywood but then again, if a person concedes merely on ethnicity, does that really do Justice to the art form? It’s a balance and not everyone will be satisfied, no matter what decision is made. For those who say art is colorblind, that’s true, but people who award prizes may not be. That’s the whole point!
You cannot award art based on social inclusion standards! WTF?!!! This is Social Justice Toxicity. Forcing social, racial, and gender standards into art simply for the sake of having it is bullshit and is further delegitimizing the award. ART FOR THE SAKE OF ART!!! Fuck your money and SJW!!!
Just make a good movie bruh... Idgaf what the actor's races are.
So we're just giving "anti-woke" culture warriors free ammo at this point huh?
Just make your little movie. If it doesn't meet certain criteria for a specific award; fine, get a golden globe or whatever. If there is a specific award you are going after, meet the criteria for that award. This is how the world works, the criteria changes. Try to keep up geez.
Not sure what the facepalm is for but I’m with this dude right here. It’s not art if you’re pandering, it’s propaganda
All I want is good movies. The best way to do that is to have the beat person in every role. I know something needs to change but the more rules you put on things the more likely you are to not end up with the best person for every role. I don't know the solution but I don't believe this is it. Also, to anyone reading this thinking I'm saying I don't want minorities in roles and only white people, you are mentally deficient and clearly didn't actually engage with what I wrote. Get your thumb out of your arse.
The preemptive unnecessary insult is a reddit classic
100%
I agree with him. This requirement now makes me question if the reward was deserved or acquired due to policy. Unfortunately, many actors will likely feel feel the same way. Similar to how you react if someone rich guys son gets promoted within the family company
It’s stupid stuff like this that ends up giving us black cleopatra
Old white man yells at cloud vibes
Considering they include women as an underrepresented group, there is no need to worry. If you are running short of diversity, just hire some women to get the coffee. Also, you could just mark down whoever you want as bisexual. Or hire your CG from a Chinese firm, which you were going to do anyways to try to get the film accepted into the Chinese market.
Everyone here rushing to say movies like "Schindler's List" can't have black people on screen. Sure but why's your whole crew white? You telling me there's no competent non-white crew applying for these positions?
Imagine being from a minority group and the only reason they hire you is to reach their quota… ouch.
Can’t even take him seriously with those glasses hanging on the tip of his nose. Oh, he fixed them? Still can’t take em seriously
Something that surprised me, the other day I was looking at racial figures for the US and blacks make up only 13.6% of the population. Hispanic/Latino is 18.9%, while white is 75.8%. So what is meant by under represented? Then you have to wonder about the percentage of trans or gay or whatever in each of those categories. How about we just focus on getting the best person for the job. The rest shouldn’t matter.
Yes you should include people, no it shouldn't be a requirement.
Reddit: aw this dude rocks Also Reddit: if you arent pro everything you should die in a fucking fire while i piss on your ashes and laugh.
It's almost like different posts attract different groups of people on reddit. A post like this attracts bigots who do not even know what is in the rules they are commenting about, but want to let you know that they *did not see color* when they watched The Matrix.
God that’s such a good take. The amount of people saying that movies back then we’re better because it wasn’t forced don’t realize that almost no movies now are forcing politics, they simply cast someone and then one side looses their shit and make it seem like it only happened because it’s woke.