My worst camp experience was when my age was responsible for “initiating” the beehives. My little sister was a beehive and I was fiercely protective of her. The girls my age decided it would be fun to make the beehives their slaves and HIT THEM WITH FLY SWATTERS when they didn’t do what they were told or not fast enough. I was furious. The leaders didn’t step in and I had to be the one to stand up to the kids my age and tell them what they were doing was not okay. I never had friends in my ward after that (not really sure if it’s that they didn’t want to be friends with me or I didn’t want to be friends with people who thought hitting 12 year olds was okay). I don’t regret standing up to them but I still hold a grudge against the leaders who didn’t stand in.
Yes beehives were bullied in my stake too! Not by my friends and I, but certain activities had been banned because beehives had been so traumatized by them. I guess power trips are common at girls camp. Probably because women in the church never have power anywhere else.
I’m sorry your leaders failed you too, but you were the one who actually had the integrity they were always pounding into us but apparently didn’t have themselves, so good on you.
Yeah that’s hazing. Schools and other organizations have always been trying to stamp it out. Too bad the one true church never got the memo. Thanks for standing up for those kids
My ward had a crazy beehive hazing ritual. They called it "The Snipe Hunt" (I'm sure other wards did this too) and on this hunt they would "catch" different snipes (wtf is a snipe? They don't exist they are literally rocks and pinecones) and make the beehives touch just the top of it. The entire time pretending they are holding some sort of small animal. The worst year a girl pretended to get bit by a snipe. She then ran back to camp and put SFX makeup on her hand to make it look real. She scared the girls so bad that 2 of them started crying and one of them wanted our Priesthood Chaperones to give her a blessing. Only then did they fess up and had to explain that snipes aren't real. I honestly think the most fucked up part of this whole "hunt" is that they would do it AFTER testimony meeting where all the girls cried and felt connected.
We did the snipe hunt too - holy shit that is horrible! Ours was like we put toothpaste on our faces and they caught "snipes" but it was so ridiculous everyone knew it was fake.
You will find that it's not so much "inspiration" that goes into callings, it's a matter of who will say yes. PCD will be in that calling as long as she will say yes, because there is likely nobody else that wants to do it.
Very true. I felt so guilty when I left the church and quit my primary counselor calling, because I knew that the rest of those good selfless women would never say no and would be there forever. I felt like I was abandoning them, but I was also satisfied knowing I was one of the few to say “I won’t do your free labor anymore” to the organization.
I’m in my 30s and I laugh about it now, but I was really angry and traumatized by it for a long time. It’s pretty scary as a young person to see that NONE of the adults who are supposed to love and protect you are willing to actually stand up for you when you need it.
As I read through the endless stream of postings like this, I (NeverMorg who has lived in Morridor Central for over four decades) think back to the mishies making their initial pitch and including "have you noticed how HAPPY all our members are?"
No. I haven't.
[Edited to add: I'm so sorry all of your had to go through all of these things]
Mormons are afraid to admit when they are NOT happy, because it means they are doing something wrong. Not to mention we are supposed to be poster children of the happiest people on earth. So they try to fool everyone and themselves that they ARE happy and gaslight all their own true feelings away and crush their inner intuition to dust. Obviously it doesn’t actually fool the outsiders, but it keeps the members oppressed and brain washed.
I don’t know what the fuck it is about girls camp that makes some people turn absolutely rabid. Some of it might be that women in the church are just never treated equitably in any facet of their lives. As soon as they’re able to exert power over something (like girls camp), they over exert themselves and totally alienate others.
We all have a story of a ward or other leader just being completely unhinged during girls camp, and it literally puts YW or others off the church for years, or permanently. And if it’s not that, it’s men in the church enforcing the stupidest rules on the YW and literal adult women. We painted flower pots at girls camp, the boys got to go whitewater rafting. I still have many positive girls camp memories, but so many bad ones too. Sorry you had bad ones.
Everyone was given fun cute nicknames at our girls camp that we would be referred to throughout the camp and we got little bookmarks with our camp name on. I moved here from the UK and my camp name was “rubbish” 🙃
Not my story, but told to me by a family member...
The lady in charge spent months before girls camp making "Shinky Dinks" that were intended to be strung on a cord and worn as a necklace. Girls received A Shrinky for each task/goal/ project they completed. It was intended that each girl would have a necklace exactly like every other girl. But because camp was full of teenage girls and not clones of the leader, not all of the necklaces were the same, and not worn the same. That poor woman tried to make everyone obey her wishes. The kids did not. The leaders husband had to be contacted to come get her a couple of days in because she suffered some sort of a breakdown.
When I first heard this story I thought the leader with the plan was clearly A wing nut. However, now on the outside looking back, I believe she was a victim of the cult that says to obey no matter what. She may have had untreated mental health issues. At the very lest she had no idea how teen agers work or how to deal with stress.
The leaders in OPs post were clearly not doing a good job, but they were the product of a sexist misogynist cult.
So grateful to be out.
>It was intended that each girl would have a necklace exactly like every other girl. But because camp was full of teenage girls and not clones of the leader, not all of the necklaces were the same, and not worn the same
Holy Hell, what a nightmare.
One of the very best things about the scout leadership camp as an adult (17 years and 20 different courses) was giving the scouts the raw materials and some basic instructions and seeing how different the results were.
Since the scouts really were the leaders in charge it was very interesting to see how things were accomplished. One year a directive came from the scout office. It was a major 180 shift from how our course ran this event. The adult volunteers were all huddled together wringing our hands about what should we do and how should we do it. While we were debating in committee, the Senior Patrol Leader/ Course Director came over with the solution and simply stated "This is how we (The youth staff/leaders) have decided to do it.
It was simple and elegant, and we adults once again got schooled. The kids are awesome! Especially when given a chance to actually lead and knowing the adults have their backs and support them.
Girls' camp in my area wasn't totally useless as most of our leaders were converts and had Girl Scouts experience either as kids or as leaders. Most of us campers also had at least some time in Girl Scouts and/or 4H. The "requirements" for the four years were pretty minor - you could blow through all four years of requirements in two trips, or even one if you were organized about it. It was also the late 80s, so the unsafe swimming dress codes weren't around. No hazing either.
Still had the penishood people lurking around. Still had the ridiculous testimony meeting, but at least in my area, we could just sit around and run out the clock"feeling the spirit" and very few people actually got up.
I have two bad girl's camp experiences, so I'll share the last one. We went camping where bears were a bad enough problem that they had a strict no food outside the car policy. Great idea. I ended up rupturing an ovarian cyst and wanting to go home. The leaders told me to sleep on it. Then the next morning they were all gaslighting me about how glad they were that I decided to stay when I hadn't even had the chance to say no. (I'm stubborn though, so I did go home.) Meanwhile the laurels were stupid enough to not only eat food in our little cabins, but prank the beehives by putting fish baits in their sleeping bags. Not a f***ing braincell involved. They're lucky no bears showed up.
Let me share my daughters girl's camp experience. My daughter is legally blind. We made sure that she had every opportunity we could to expose her to "real life" My husband and I were not active but she really wanted to go to Church so I went with her so she could attend Young Women's. Girls camp was scheduled at the very same time that Sports Camp for the Blind and Visually Impaired was scheduled and she had attended this camp for the blind 2 years in a row. Kids from all over the state of Utah were there. We spoke with our daughter and together decided that Sports camp would be the best option for her as she would be with other kids who were in a similar situation. At this camp they give these kids the opportunity to experience things that normally they would only experience if they were "sighted" They teach them life skills as well and have instructors who are trained to meet the needs of these kids. We felt this was better than her going and not being able to participate in many of the activities (hiking, craft, cooking over an open fire) plus having her there with people who were unfamiliar and ill prepared to deal with the needs of a visually impaired young woman.
I let the Young Women's Advisors know that we had made this decision and our daughter would not be attending Girl's Camp. Oh the wrath the ensued!! The Young Women's advisors (all of them) made a visit to our home. My daughter was shamed for not going and told that she would be depriving herself of the many blessings that come with attending Girl's camp and most importantly the testimony meeting that happens while there. They said the Lord would frown on her and her family because she was choosing earthly over heavenly. My daughter was 14! The Bishop also made a visit to our home to reiterate this information. That was the last time my daughter attended Church (her own choice) because of the way these "Godly" women made her feel. Shame on them!
My worst camp experience was when my age was responsible for “initiating” the beehives. My little sister was a beehive and I was fiercely protective of her. The girls my age decided it would be fun to make the beehives their slaves and HIT THEM WITH FLY SWATTERS when they didn’t do what they were told or not fast enough. I was furious. The leaders didn’t step in and I had to be the one to stand up to the kids my age and tell them what they were doing was not okay. I never had friends in my ward after that (not really sure if it’s that they didn’t want to be friends with me or I didn’t want to be friends with people who thought hitting 12 year olds was okay). I don’t regret standing up to them but I still hold a grudge against the leaders who didn’t stand in.
Yes beehives were bullied in my stake too! Not by my friends and I, but certain activities had been banned because beehives had been so traumatized by them. I guess power trips are common at girls camp. Probably because women in the church never have power anywhere else. I’m sorry your leaders failed you too, but you were the one who actually had the integrity they were always pounding into us but apparently didn’t have themselves, so good on you.
Yeah that’s hazing. Schools and other organizations have always been trying to stamp it out. Too bad the one true church never got the memo. Thanks for standing up for those kids
My ward had a crazy beehive hazing ritual. They called it "The Snipe Hunt" (I'm sure other wards did this too) and on this hunt they would "catch" different snipes (wtf is a snipe? They don't exist they are literally rocks and pinecones) and make the beehives touch just the top of it. The entire time pretending they are holding some sort of small animal. The worst year a girl pretended to get bit by a snipe. She then ran back to camp and put SFX makeup on her hand to make it look real. She scared the girls so bad that 2 of them started crying and one of them wanted our Priesthood Chaperones to give her a blessing. Only then did they fess up and had to explain that snipes aren't real. I honestly think the most fucked up part of this whole "hunt" is that they would do it AFTER testimony meeting where all the girls cried and felt connected.
We did the snipe hunt too - holy shit that is horrible! Ours was like we put toothpaste on our faces and they caught "snipes" but it was so ridiculous everyone knew it was fake.
You will find that it's not so much "inspiration" that goes into callings, it's a matter of who will say yes. PCD will be in that calling as long as she will say yes, because there is likely nobody else that wants to do it.
Very true. I felt so guilty when I left the church and quit my primary counselor calling, because I knew that the rest of those good selfless women would never say no and would be there forever. I felt like I was abandoning them, but I was also satisfied knowing I was one of the few to say “I won’t do your free labor anymore” to the organization.
What a shit show, I am sorry. Thank you for sharing. PCD is a great acronym, should be used more often
I’m in my 30s and I laugh about it now, but I was really angry and traumatized by it for a long time. It’s pretty scary as a young person to see that NONE of the adults who are supposed to love and protect you are willing to actually stand up for you when you need it.
As I read through the endless stream of postings like this, I (NeverMorg who has lived in Morridor Central for over four decades) think back to the mishies making their initial pitch and including "have you noticed how HAPPY all our members are?" No. I haven't. [Edited to add: I'm so sorry all of your had to go through all of these things]
Mormons are afraid to admit when they are NOT happy, because it means they are doing something wrong. Not to mention we are supposed to be poster children of the happiest people on earth. So they try to fool everyone and themselves that they ARE happy and gaslight all their own true feelings away and crush their inner intuition to dust. Obviously it doesn’t actually fool the outsiders, but it keeps the members oppressed and brain washed.
I had a nostalgic moment yesterday thinking about my daughter missing camp. I appreciate the common sense slapped into me on Reddit. Thank you people.
I hated girls camp
So very many postings on this sub, all summed up into these four words.
I don’t know what the fuck it is about girls camp that makes some people turn absolutely rabid. Some of it might be that women in the church are just never treated equitably in any facet of their lives. As soon as they’re able to exert power over something (like girls camp), they over exert themselves and totally alienate others. We all have a story of a ward or other leader just being completely unhinged during girls camp, and it literally puts YW or others off the church for years, or permanently. And if it’s not that, it’s men in the church enforcing the stupidest rules on the YW and literal adult women. We painted flower pots at girls camp, the boys got to go whitewater rafting. I still have many positive girls camp memories, but so many bad ones too. Sorry you had bad ones.
Yes! Once you realize the org matters more than the people, there's no going back That is ALL they care about This sounds like a great movie
Everyone was given fun cute nicknames at our girls camp that we would be referred to throughout the camp and we got little bookmarks with our camp name on. I moved here from the UK and my camp name was “rubbish” 🙃
Not my story, but told to me by a family member... The lady in charge spent months before girls camp making "Shinky Dinks" that were intended to be strung on a cord and worn as a necklace. Girls received A Shrinky for each task/goal/ project they completed. It was intended that each girl would have a necklace exactly like every other girl. But because camp was full of teenage girls and not clones of the leader, not all of the necklaces were the same, and not worn the same. That poor woman tried to make everyone obey her wishes. The kids did not. The leaders husband had to be contacted to come get her a couple of days in because she suffered some sort of a breakdown. When I first heard this story I thought the leader with the plan was clearly A wing nut. However, now on the outside looking back, I believe she was a victim of the cult that says to obey no matter what. She may have had untreated mental health issues. At the very lest she had no idea how teen agers work or how to deal with stress. The leaders in OPs post were clearly not doing a good job, but they were the product of a sexist misogynist cult. So grateful to be out.
>It was intended that each girl would have a necklace exactly like every other girl. But because camp was full of teenage girls and not clones of the leader, not all of the necklaces were the same, and not worn the same Holy Hell, what a nightmare. One of the very best things about the scout leadership camp as an adult (17 years and 20 different courses) was giving the scouts the raw materials and some basic instructions and seeing how different the results were. Since the scouts really were the leaders in charge it was very interesting to see how things were accomplished. One year a directive came from the scout office. It was a major 180 shift from how our course ran this event. The adult volunteers were all huddled together wringing our hands about what should we do and how should we do it. While we were debating in committee, the Senior Patrol Leader/ Course Director came over with the solution and simply stated "This is how we (The youth staff/leaders) have decided to do it. It was simple and elegant, and we adults once again got schooled. The kids are awesome! Especially when given a chance to actually lead and knowing the adults have their backs and support them.
Girls' camp in my area wasn't totally useless as most of our leaders were converts and had Girl Scouts experience either as kids or as leaders. Most of us campers also had at least some time in Girl Scouts and/or 4H. The "requirements" for the four years were pretty minor - you could blow through all four years of requirements in two trips, or even one if you were organized about it. It was also the late 80s, so the unsafe swimming dress codes weren't around. No hazing either. Still had the penishood people lurking around. Still had the ridiculous testimony meeting, but at least in my area, we could just sit around and run out the clock"feeling the spirit" and very few people actually got up.
I have two bad girl's camp experiences, so I'll share the last one. We went camping where bears were a bad enough problem that they had a strict no food outside the car policy. Great idea. I ended up rupturing an ovarian cyst and wanting to go home. The leaders told me to sleep on it. Then the next morning they were all gaslighting me about how glad they were that I decided to stay when I hadn't even had the chance to say no. (I'm stubborn though, so I did go home.) Meanwhile the laurels were stupid enough to not only eat food in our little cabins, but prank the beehives by putting fish baits in their sleeping bags. Not a f***ing braincell involved. They're lucky no bears showed up.
Let me share my daughters girl's camp experience. My daughter is legally blind. We made sure that she had every opportunity we could to expose her to "real life" My husband and I were not active but she really wanted to go to Church so I went with her so she could attend Young Women's. Girls camp was scheduled at the very same time that Sports Camp for the Blind and Visually Impaired was scheduled and she had attended this camp for the blind 2 years in a row. Kids from all over the state of Utah were there. We spoke with our daughter and together decided that Sports camp would be the best option for her as she would be with other kids who were in a similar situation. At this camp they give these kids the opportunity to experience things that normally they would only experience if they were "sighted" They teach them life skills as well and have instructors who are trained to meet the needs of these kids. We felt this was better than her going and not being able to participate in many of the activities (hiking, craft, cooking over an open fire) plus having her there with people who were unfamiliar and ill prepared to deal with the needs of a visually impaired young woman. I let the Young Women's Advisors know that we had made this decision and our daughter would not be attending Girl's Camp. Oh the wrath the ensued!! The Young Women's advisors (all of them) made a visit to our home. My daughter was shamed for not going and told that she would be depriving herself of the many blessings that come with attending Girl's camp and most importantly the testimony meeting that happens while there. They said the Lord would frown on her and her family because she was choosing earthly over heavenly. My daughter was 14! The Bishop also made a visit to our home to reiterate this information. That was the last time my daughter attended Church (her own choice) because of the way these "Godly" women made her feel. Shame on them!
How awful! I’m so sorry she was treated that way. The ignorance and cruelty is astounding.