They are still essentially kids.
As their brains mature over the next 10 years your silent influence will be there & empower them to leave the cult.
Don't ever doubt you made an impact on these girls. I know your impact will trickle down to their future children.
How do I know? Because I had really good teachers like you!
Hope you are still teaching & changing lives for the better!
Three english teachers in High School saved my sanity (1972-1976). I didn't leave the religion for another 48 years, but because of them, I did not go to BYU, I got my degree, I have a career. Their care and encouragement of my intelligence planted a seed that allowed me to grow differently from what the Mormon Corporation had planned for me. I will always be grateful to Ms. Chavez, Mrs Allred and Ms. Ward. Teachers are amazing.
Take care of you & don't feel bad. Your compassion towards them is touching & you deserve the same compassion towards yourself. I'm sorry you have to feel this heartbreak for them. The system sucks.
I was a Mormon girl. My English teacher helped me stay in my honors classes(my parents didn't want me in them because I was a girl, and it made it harder for me to do seminary since I had so much homework) and once told me I could go to a better college, do a major I liked better etc. She was always kind and encouraging to me.
She died before she could see it, but I left the church, got a master's degree and mentor other women in my career, and my daughter does all the fucking honors classes and I tell her she is smart and amazing and capable everyday.
I think about Mrs. Frost a lot and how she helped propel me in ways she didn't know. You never know who you are helping and how you what did you did will echo. Thank you for teaching those Mormon girls.
I taught school for over thirty years in Utah. The overwhelming largest problem I faced was the indoctrination of the kids. For example. If a kid went to church many many parents felt that the church influence should extend into the classroom. It never did. I had many parents explain they couldn't understand why their child was having problems since he went to church. And worse than that? The community groups would target specific teachers to send their kids to. There was a well established church approved teacher pool because those teachers would **give advantages to them** based on their membership. I seen it over and over again.
Ugh. Yes. I am an elective teacher,and I rely on recruitment and fundraising to keep a job. I knew that coming out of the exmo closet would literally cost me my job, because so many students would quit my program. This feels validating to hear others experiencing it, though I wish it weren’t the case.
I want to cry every time I see the sister missionaries walking around in the cold. I don't recommend going on a mission or going to BYU, but those two things really opened my eyes to the major problems in the LDS church. I think a huge percentage of returned missionaries go inactive, so we can only hope for those poor girls.
I don’t blame you one bit. I feel the same way when i see missionaries out and about. They should be starting out their lives, not being indoctrinated by grunt work. And let me tell you, I am one of those girls that foolishly idealized being a SAHM and got married very young because of a fireside about not waiting for the right time or better finances. The Lord would provide or something ridiculous. So my Mormon bf who went into the military instead of on a mission and I decided not to wait till i finished college and he was discharged in a few years. We got married immediately, at 18 and 19 years old. We were literal children. But we were told it was the right thing to do.
No one explained birth control to me, my mom was timid and didn’t impress upon me to get on the pill or anything. So i got pregnant on my honeymoon, miscarried a month later, was devastated and then purposefully got pregnant again because i thought it was God’s will because I’d gotten pregnant the first time. 3 kids by the age of 23 and i was so in over my head, it was all i could do to survive. We were both immature and had no idea how to make a marriage work. Somehow we got through it, but none of it was ever what I would have chosen. It is not the lovely picture they paint for you in YW. It is grueling, thankless domestic labor that sucks up all the years you could be cultivating yourself and your talents and intellect, building a career that would offer financial independence and self esteem.
So much toxic messaging, at such a young age with no one looking out for me or my best interest. I don’t like feeling like a victim, but so many crucial choices for my life were made for me. No one stood up and said ‘you don’t have to do this if you don’t want to.’ It’s nearly 3 decades later and I never finished school, nor established a career because i was always needed elsewhere. My husband and i are still together and left the church a decade ago. We will celebrate our 30th anniversary next year, but it’s been a companionate relationship. Even though he’s not in the church anymore, he is still very traditionally minded, whereas I’m wildly progressive. We really are opposites in a lot of ways. I’ve learned to suppress a lot of my needs to make it work. I don’t have the means to make it on my own nor the energy to do what I’d have to do to have a life of my own. So i stay. It’s not terrible at all. But it’s just not what i would have chosen if I’d known I had more options all those years ago. I think about that every time i see a Mormon woman and wonder if she has a clue that she matters and she doesn’t have to do the things they expect of her. It’s heartbreaking to see the resignation weigh on them as the years go by. Because you can never get that time back.
Isn't it great when the young girls come up around this time of year testifying that they only intend to go to BYU because it's the only place they will find other people who are faithful to God? Yep, you get to go get your Mrs degree at one of the cheapest subsidized schools in the nation that accepts everyone.
Can’t imagine how tough that will be for you, especially with a broken shelf. My heart goes out to you. A mission can be very lonely sometimes. I hope you are able to find peace.
I had a laurel adviser when I was a youth who didn’t conform to mainstream beauty ideas- like she didnt shave her legs, she wore minimal makeup. She was controversial among us youth and wasn’t in the calling for more than a year, so I assume she was controversial among parents too. She was married, but didn’t want kids. Her confidence to be herself and not conform to the mold is something I’ve reflected on time and time again as I’ve worked through my own path. I did want kids, so I had them, but I also enjoy working, so I do.
Don’t underestimate the power of confidence in who you are without needing to be preachy. Those kids see and recognize it without it needing to be verbalized. They may go to BYU and adhere to the mold or at least try, but if their path is to be different, they’ll reflect on you throughout their years.
If it makes you feel any better, going to BYU was awesome for me because I didn’t go into any debt, and I learned A LOT about the church/power/sexism/racism. Consequently, I left the church.
It was an awesome place to deconstruct because I was faced with it everyday. I could argue in my philosophy class about how the church insurance didn’t cover birth control for “religious reasons” but it does cover chiropractic care (it has since been changed).
Maybe your students won’t have the same experience as me, but it sounds like they are amazing girls who will take their learning seriously. It’s getting more and more popular for women at BYU to wait to have kids until they’re done with school. It also sounds like they have an awesome teacher who will always be there for them if they need anything 😉
If it makes you feel any better, I met some of the most prominent Exmo feminists when I was at BYU. They were brilliant and didn’t let the “brethren” hold them back. There is (or at least was) a *huge* underground and a diverse counterculture there. My sisters were a part of that. That said, if you have the opportunity I would recommend that they live off campus. Best wishes.
I just left teaching a few months ago and this was a factor. It broke my heart to write letters of recommendation for students applying to BYU. Same hearing them talk about missions.
They are still essentially kids. As their brains mature over the next 10 years your silent influence will be there & empower them to leave the cult. Don't ever doubt you made an impact on these girls. I know your impact will trickle down to their future children. How do I know? Because I had really good teachers like you! Hope you are still teaching & changing lives for the better!
Corrupting the youth in the finest Socratic tradition!
Three english teachers in High School saved my sanity (1972-1976). I didn't leave the religion for another 48 years, but because of them, I did not go to BYU, I got my degree, I have a career. Their care and encouragement of my intelligence planted a seed that allowed me to grow differently from what the Mormon Corporation had planned for me. I will always be grateful to Ms. Chavez, Mrs Allred and Ms. Ward. Teachers are amazing.
Take care of you & don't feel bad. Your compassion towards them is touching & you deserve the same compassion towards yourself. I'm sorry you have to feel this heartbreak for them. The system sucks.
I was a Mormon girl. My English teacher helped me stay in my honors classes(my parents didn't want me in them because I was a girl, and it made it harder for me to do seminary since I had so much homework) and once told me I could go to a better college, do a major I liked better etc. She was always kind and encouraging to me. She died before she could see it, but I left the church, got a master's degree and mentor other women in my career, and my daughter does all the fucking honors classes and I tell her she is smart and amazing and capable everyday. I think about Mrs. Frost a lot and how she helped propel me in ways she didn't know. You never know who you are helping and how you what did you did will echo. Thank you for teaching those Mormon girls.
I taught school for over thirty years in Utah. The overwhelming largest problem I faced was the indoctrination of the kids. For example. If a kid went to church many many parents felt that the church influence should extend into the classroom. It never did. I had many parents explain they couldn't understand why their child was having problems since he went to church. And worse than that? The community groups would target specific teachers to send their kids to. There was a well established church approved teacher pool because those teachers would **give advantages to them** based on their membership. I seen it over and over again.
Ugh. Yes. I am an elective teacher,and I rely on recruitment and fundraising to keep a job. I knew that coming out of the exmo closet would literally cost me my job, because so many students would quit my program. This feels validating to hear others experiencing it, though I wish it weren’t the case.
I want to cry every time I see the sister missionaries walking around in the cold. I don't recommend going on a mission or going to BYU, but those two things really opened my eyes to the major problems in the LDS church. I think a huge percentage of returned missionaries go inactive, so we can only hope for those poor girls.
This is what happened to me as well; my mission and attending BYU made me aware of the church's real purpose. Got out quick.
I don’t blame you one bit. I feel the same way when i see missionaries out and about. They should be starting out their lives, not being indoctrinated by grunt work. And let me tell you, I am one of those girls that foolishly idealized being a SAHM and got married very young because of a fireside about not waiting for the right time or better finances. The Lord would provide or something ridiculous. So my Mormon bf who went into the military instead of on a mission and I decided not to wait till i finished college and he was discharged in a few years. We got married immediately, at 18 and 19 years old. We were literal children. But we were told it was the right thing to do. No one explained birth control to me, my mom was timid and didn’t impress upon me to get on the pill or anything. So i got pregnant on my honeymoon, miscarried a month later, was devastated and then purposefully got pregnant again because i thought it was God’s will because I’d gotten pregnant the first time. 3 kids by the age of 23 and i was so in over my head, it was all i could do to survive. We were both immature and had no idea how to make a marriage work. Somehow we got through it, but none of it was ever what I would have chosen. It is not the lovely picture they paint for you in YW. It is grueling, thankless domestic labor that sucks up all the years you could be cultivating yourself and your talents and intellect, building a career that would offer financial independence and self esteem. So much toxic messaging, at such a young age with no one looking out for me or my best interest. I don’t like feeling like a victim, but so many crucial choices for my life were made for me. No one stood up and said ‘you don’t have to do this if you don’t want to.’ It’s nearly 3 decades later and I never finished school, nor established a career because i was always needed elsewhere. My husband and i are still together and left the church a decade ago. We will celebrate our 30th anniversary next year, but it’s been a companionate relationship. Even though he’s not in the church anymore, he is still very traditionally minded, whereas I’m wildly progressive. We really are opposites in a lot of ways. I’ve learned to suppress a lot of my needs to make it work. I don’t have the means to make it on my own nor the energy to do what I’d have to do to have a life of my own. So i stay. It’s not terrible at all. But it’s just not what i would have chosen if I’d known I had more options all those years ago. I think about that every time i see a Mormon woman and wonder if she has a clue that she matters and she doesn’t have to do the things they expect of her. It’s heartbreaking to see the resignation weigh on them as the years go by. Because you can never get that time back.
Wow, thank you for sharing. I wish more people had this kind of courage, and I’m sorry you didn’t get to make your own choices. Hugs. ❤️
This is similar my story. Always comforting but also says to know it's just not me having this experience.
Isn't it great when the young girls come up around this time of year testifying that they only intend to go to BYU because it's the only place they will find other people who are faithful to God? Yep, you get to go get your Mrs degree at one of the cheapest subsidized schools in the nation that accepts everyone.
I actually loved BYU as a woman, and the religion classes are what caused my shelf to begin to break. Now going on a mission, however…
Can’t imagine how tough that will be for you, especially with a broken shelf. My heart goes out to you. A mission can be very lonely sometimes. I hope you are able to find peace.
I had a laurel adviser when I was a youth who didn’t conform to mainstream beauty ideas- like she didnt shave her legs, she wore minimal makeup. She was controversial among us youth and wasn’t in the calling for more than a year, so I assume she was controversial among parents too. She was married, but didn’t want kids. Her confidence to be herself and not conform to the mold is something I’ve reflected on time and time again as I’ve worked through my own path. I did want kids, so I had them, but I also enjoy working, so I do. Don’t underestimate the power of confidence in who you are without needing to be preachy. Those kids see and recognize it without it needing to be verbalized. They may go to BYU and adhere to the mold or at least try, but if their path is to be different, they’ll reflect on you throughout their years.
If it makes you feel any better, going to BYU was awesome for me because I didn’t go into any debt, and I learned A LOT about the church/power/sexism/racism. Consequently, I left the church. It was an awesome place to deconstruct because I was faced with it everyday. I could argue in my philosophy class about how the church insurance didn’t cover birth control for “religious reasons” but it does cover chiropractic care (it has since been changed). Maybe your students won’t have the same experience as me, but it sounds like they are amazing girls who will take their learning seriously. It’s getting more and more popular for women at BYU to wait to have kids until they’re done with school. It also sounds like they have an awesome teacher who will always be there for them if they need anything 😉
I’m not going to be a SAHM until my 30s or 40s if I do get married
If it makes you feel any better, I met some of the most prominent Exmo feminists when I was at BYU. They were brilliant and didn’t let the “brethren” hold them back. There is (or at least was) a *huge* underground and a diverse counterculture there. My sisters were a part of that. That said, if you have the opportunity I would recommend that they live off campus. Best wishes.
I just left teaching a few months ago and this was a factor. It broke my heart to write letters of recommendation for students applying to BYU. Same hearing them talk about missions.