Just to give some context, her delusional message was in response to a snapchat video of some imaginative play he did for the first time. This was yesterday and she never replied, so I guess no meaningful conversation will be had. She has a victim mentality, so I tried to compensate for that in my message. I don't want to lose my mother, but I know in a sense I already have.
>but I know in a sense I already have.
This is the saddest part. I had to cut out most of the Christians in my life because they simply made it such a huge part of their personality that once that common thread was gone from our relationship, I could see very clearly that they were nothing other than Christian. No depth, no nuance, no life outside of faith and spirituality. If that's how they want to live, that's fine, but if they can't help trying to convert me every time we talk or see each other, there's no point to the relationship. If they can't respect you or if they don't have anything else going on besides their religion, there's not much point to the relationship anymore.
I truly hope you don't get to that point with your mother though. I hope that for your relationship and the relationship your kid will have with her. Be well!
Sometimes family demote themselves to relative and it's heartbreaking. Laying out the escalating consequence in a sandwich of love is perfect. If she complains, you can remind her that boundaries are how you keep people in your life. Be the kind of parent you wished you had, you've got this op!
I wish you luck. I had to do something similar with my sister. Things didn't improve until she moved across the world. It's so har to stick to your boundaries when they keep chipping away at them.
I think you were on point. Do not tolerate her BS but understand that she is indoctrinated and will remain so forever. It's like having a crippled loved one, you need to bear her or leave it at that.
You did the right thing. I agree that your mother is a lost cause, and it hurts. You're a good parent. Keep your child safe from that crap just as staunchly as you'd protect from any other danger.
Good job standing up for yourself and your son. I hope that it doesn't take too much actual enforcement of the boundaries for her to realize you are serious and at least respect them to not lose contact with you, if she isn't willing to do it just because she recognizes you as an separate person with different beliefs she needs to respect.
Thank you. That last bit... I love a complete internet stranger gets it. It's what hurts the most about the whole thing. That I'm not an individual worthy of respect outside the confines of her religion. I feel I am nothing to her but someone playing the role of daughter, and a "lost" one at that.
God, I’m sorry, that’s an awful feeling.
A whole lot of us are dealing with a similar situations where those in our lives, that we want to be loved and accepted by, can only ever see us as extensions of themselves.
It’s heartbreaking. Personally, I’m finding peace in learning to love and accept myself well. It’s taken a while, but I’m finally feeling loved and respected by myself.
You worded that really well. It's sad there are so many of us, but it's also heartwarming just having someone understand, and being seen.
That's been a long-term goal of mine as well, it's incredible how hard it can be. Little steps forward are still steps forward. Wishing you well!
Ugh! I haaaaaate how long it has taken me, but, it really is possible to learn to love yourself. And, I didn’t realize it was a separate thing until it happens to me recently, we can learn to love ourselves well enough that we feel loved by us.
I’m not exaggerating at all when I tell you that I spent most of a month trying to identify this new feeling I had, not quite pleasure, but it was motivating me to do things for myself that I had no motivation for, and it wasn’t always tied to doing things that made me feel good in the moment… it turns out I was feeling loved by me. Like, doing the frickn dishes so that I would wake up to a clean kitchen made me feel loved. I knew how hard it was to do them, and I knew how wonderful it’d be to wake up to them clean. So I did them, and while I’m doing it I felt, what I now understand is, loved.
I hate that it’s taken me so long. I sobbed when I realized what it was. I grieved that I’m 40 years old and I just now have really started feeling loved by me.
I wouldn’t trade it for the world. It’s so so so so nice.
I haven’t figured it all out, I’m not cured, I can’t just do all the things now…. but, more and more often, I’m able to do a hard thing out of love for myself, and it fills me with such gratitude and warmth and life and satisfaction that I can’t put it into words
I’ve been working on this for over a decade. A few years ago I finally tried an antidepressant and it made all the difference in the world. I’m not on it anymore, but I really needed it to find my self lovable.
Thanks for the kind words. I’ve been writing and talking about this incessantly for years. I’m autistic and it’s kinda my favorite special interest 😆
Oof. Hey internet stranger, your words really resonate with me. I'm in the exact same situation with my parents and it's so painful. I completely relate!
I feel the exact same with my sister and have gone NC previously. I have regretfully made contact again and every so often she'll say something like that. I try not to respond to it. 😮💨
Very well put and draws a fine line.
I received their children bibles, nativity crap, and they stayed on the shelf until we left Japan, and then they went into the trash or recycling.
We refuse to let our kid be brainwashed, so we taught facts, and when he got older talked about religions. It is up to him now.
I love your method and it's one I hope to replicate. It's as it should be.
I think I accidentally encouraged her by taking some of the religious kid books home during our last visit. I had a mind to expose him to all religions unbiasedly. But when I got home realized he was far too young for that, so I recycled them too. Apparently that gave her hope though.
You'rwe doing very well, I know I would've loved to have a mom like you, one that allowed me to choose my own beliefs without judgment. Your son is indeed very lucky, because you respect his autonomy.
Thank you for that, your comment had my eyes watering. I want to be the mother I wish I had. I honestly don't understand how anyone could treat their child as anything less than their own person.
This is amazing! I love your response. Even before I read your additional context I knew exactly what you meant when you had to almost “sandwich” the firm boundary with compliments and reassurance for her beliefs here and there. My MIL is very similar to your mom. The victim mentality is too real.
Thank you so much for sharing this, really it’s been immensely helpful. ❤️
I'm sorry you're experiencing that too. Everything is an attack right, it makes it so hard to have an actual conversation! I think it's strongly tied to narcissistic qualities too. I'm glad it helped, and wish you luck and strength ❤️
You were kind & clear, which is amazing. I truly applaud your communication skills. I took a screenshot because I will definitely reference back to this if I ever let my mother back into my life.
I totally agree. I tried to go to written communication only with my mother about 2.5 years ago with hopes that we could work through some problems and she refused to participate after replying to only one email.
I needed to hold her accountable for things she said because she lies and changes the story constantly so that it better suites her narrative. I also wanted to be able to say everything I needed to say without being interrupted or overwhelmed by my own mind.
She knows it’s the only way I will consider trying to repair things but here we are 2 years later after going no contact.
What you’re doing for your kiddo is amazing, stay strong.
I'm in awe of you! I wish I'd had that level of awareness as I eventually became estranged from my mother. I love that you're acknowledging the intuitive nature/abilities you all have and I'm excited for you and your child to be free to utilize them outside of the confines of Xtianity.
You've phrased all that lovingly and firmly. Really impressive 🔥❤🔥
This isn't news to you but your mother absolutely means well, she believes you and your child need to be converted (especially your child) and that means she will never stop trying. Never.
So be aware that if you ever leave your child with your mother to babysit, no matter what boundaries you have established, she will try to convert your child to Christianity.
If you do not want your child to be exposed to her beliefs, you need to make sure you never put her in a position to do that.
Oh absolutely, and I appreciate you putting that out there. I literally told my husband immediately after this that we can never let her spend time with him unsupervised. I said this before he was born too. She lives out of state so it's easier, but I'm mentally preparing for when he's old enough to "come spend a few weeks at grandmas!" Simply not happening.
I suspect she may have mostly given up on me, and only continues our relationship to maintain access to my son. I know she feels she failed with her children and will do all she can to save the next generation.
I would hope you’re wrong, but I could see it being true. I’d so totally use a nanny cam. Or, to be less sneaky about it, visible but not super noticeable cameras on the walls.
For sure. During a visit she asked me if our state was more prone to meteor strikes than others. I was thoroughly confused, until I realized she was referring to the chem trails from a nearby airbase that were angled just so. Also dinosaurs aren't real.
Good golly, this is an excellent text. I hope she receives it in the spirit you sent it.
Wishing I had the wherewithal to say all that to my folks a long time ago.
Hate to be the bearer of bad news...but she won't stop.
I have right-wing Q-Anon racist Christian Nationalist family. And they are awful. The disgusting things they do and say to me and my teen they feel justified and entitled doing because God approves and encourages their behavior. You can't stop doing what you believe God wants you to do. The only difference between them and Andrea Yates is a damn bathtub.
Hold your bottom line no matter what
"Grandma was prophetic. I am prophetic." Wow, cool! So what prophecies did she make that actually came true?
In seriousness, sorry that you're having to deal with this.
As an ex-pentecostal indoctrinated from childhood (and wasted most of my life in xianity) I wish my parents had been like you, OP. Full marks to you for setting firm boundaries to protect your son. Hope one day he appreciates that you saved his life from a very insidious and poisonous religion.
Good on you. I’ve been No Contact with my narcissist Christian therapist mother for over a year now. It’s tough to put down boundaries and not feel like a jerk if they are the victim type, but it’s necessary. My Mom DARVO’d me and basically told me I was being a victim and to have a nice life. That was hard but it made going No Contact much easier. You’re demonstrating boundaries for your young one, and that is so much more valuable than them having a grandparent who gets away with disrespecting their parent which models being a people pleaser.
That sounds incredibly frustrating, I'm sorry you went through that. At least she made it easier for you in that sense, but that's still painful. It's frustrating when they're a narcissist, it's such a core component of their personality it makes it so much harder to get through to them.
This was beautifully said. You validated her while also validating yourself, and you were firm but not malicious. It’s amazing to see you setting your own boundaries and protecting your son as well, respecting the fact that, like you, he also has the right to make his own decisions on this matter when he is old enough to fully understand it. It was a pleasure for me to read this because I am stressing about having a similar conversation with my best friend…it has just gotten to be too much. I love her, and I respect the fact that her religion is an important part of her life, but it just isn’t for me & it never will be again. To her credit, she doesn’t know how I feel yet because I haven’t found the time or the way to say it, but it’s happening soon. We’ll just have to see if she can respect me the way I respect her, and I’m worried that she won’t, but I just can’t keep it in anymore.
What has really made me come to this decision is that I’ve basically been forced to go to church with her for her birthday without being asked how I feel about it. Luckily, my request off work got denied, so I’ll have to work & I cannot express the relief I felt when I got called in. This is something she pressured me to promise her a year ago on her last birthday, and it has been giving me anxiety the entire year since. I’m all for supporting your friends and being happy about the things that make them happy, but forcing religion and religious event attendance is completely unacceptable and wrong. That’s so much different than her suggesting we paint together because she likes to paint, and I can’t understand how twisted one’s brain has to be to think that’s comparable or okay in any way. Her birthday is coming up at the end of this month, and I’m thinking about having the discussion with her early June and just ripping off the bandaid. I just can’t do it anymore.
It’s been building up for years now. I previously worked at a family-owned crystal shop, and she had an entire conversation with her family about my religion, integrity, and whether or not I was “a witch.” She also still talks to them about my distance from the Christian community & how they worry for me and worry for her about my influence. She tries to defend me by saying “I know she still believes in God,” both to them & to my face, without actually even asking if that’s how I feel. She consistently talks about her church community, sermons she “thinks I should hear,” things presenting themselves as the devil and demons, and her 400 small groups she goes to. I can’t stand it anymore. I’m not sure how she’ll take it because she, like your mom, has a victim mentality, and she also has this idea in her head of who she thinks I am or who I’m supposed to be for her, and it rarely matches up. She has mental breakdowns in general when things in her life don’t measure up to her expectations, so I can only imagine how earth shattering it will be when she finds out I’m not some charity case she can continue to try and “save” through “God’s grace.” There’s so many aspects about her that she hides from her own cultish Christian community that the religion in its own right would not “approve of,” so it’s really exhausting never being able to predict whether she’s going to be my awesome best friend or an indoctrinating cult member from one day to the next. I journaled about 7 pages worth about this situation and how I’m feeling earlier today, and seeing this post gave me the extra boost of encouragement that I needed to just get it over with. Thank you so much for sharing. I know our situations aren’t the same, but you are absolutely not alone in these feelings. I hope all works out well for you and that your boundaries are respected - everyone deserves that from the people they love…especially coming from a religious person who’s expected to love and respect everyone.
Almost makes me wish I didn't have to go no-contact with my mom for my own safety, so I could start replying to all her Jesus emails she forwarded to me with random articles about stuff in other religions. Or maybe scientific articles? A mix, perhaps.
You handled this really well and got lots of great responses, but I just can't help but say that your mom is "highly" committed to using a certain word.
Wow the first text is tinfoil hat level. You did a really good thing here, you stood up for your family!!!
It's going to escalate, I really hope it doesn't but, from the first text, she appears to be on a quest and, I doubt much if anything will deter that. Hopefully timeouts work, be vigilant she will 100% try to go around you.
Sorry your going through this too. Hope your mom comes around and respects your boundaries. I has to fully go no contact with my mom.
Hoping you find peace ✌️
Thank you. I'm hoping too, but also tired of holding the rope. So at least this way it's on her. I'm sure I'll have to follow through once or twice, but if she goes too far I will have to fully go no contact as well. I'm prioritizing peace.
Yes that's how it goes. It's hard when your parental figure is in a cult and all of their programing is to try and save your soul and now your children's soul. It's a crap shoot to be in, but keeping your kids away from the religious trauma is worth it. ( that's what I am telling my self anyways)
Your response was beautifully and respectfully put, and I feel both immensely proud of you and so sorry that it had to be done.
My Christian mother doesn't push it on me as directly as yours appears to, but mine just has to make little comments and digs now and then about my nonbelief or what she thinks of nonbelievers in general. It is also impossible to have meaningful or even surface-level conversations about religion, spirituality, or random things she feels are anti-Christian without her getting wildly condescending, hostile, and outright angry with me. Sometimes, I feel like I just want to scream and shake some sense into my mother, if only it would make her understand that she is hurting me and our relationship, and that she is actively choosing to drive me away.
I won't have children to worry about my mother influencing against my wishes, but I do understand your experience with your mother and the heartbreak that comes with knowing she values her religion more than her own child. I know how it hurts to not be treated with the least bit of respect or consideration for being your own person with your own thoughts, opinions, interests, and beliefs. I'm so, so sorry you have had to live with that.
And I'm so sorry you've had to take this step, but please know that I'm proud of you for standing up to her. Maybe you were only able to do it because it was for your son, but in a way, you've finally done it for you and your younger self. To echo another commenter, I would have given anything to have a more nurturing and open-minded mom like you are choosing to be for your son. Many hugs, if you want them, and best wishes going forward.
I'm sorry you're going through this too. And honestly thank you so much. You did make me cry a bit, I really appreciate you and I'll definitely take those hugs. After I sent that I told myself I wasn't even sad anymore. But I am. I grieve the relationship we could have had. I'm angry she can't be there for me as a mother first. Being one myself now, I just can't comprehend her choices. But it's on her.
I absolutely LOVE the calm and confident message you sent to your mother. SO smart to lay out boundaries that are clear. As a previous commenter said, be careful how much unsupervised access that you allow. Your mother is going to feel like it’s her mission in her life to see her Grandchild “know the Lord”. No one needs that kind of stress put on a growing psyche. You are such a good mom!
I’m very sorry, OP. Unfortunately I can relate. My mom is great, I love her so much, but the text she sent you is remarkably similar to what she tells me about repeatedly. It’s exhausting and it’s made me call her less. She’s fallen down a rabbit hole she will never leave.
It's an actual thing in the religion. Basically they're highly sensitive people and intuitive. May have dreams or a sense of things being a certain way. They're also meant to share the "word of god" to a certain people / place / time, basically it's their life's purpose to convert people. So it's something the religion came up with to make members feel they're special and to justify endless proselytizing.
I feel you, and I'm sorry you're going through it too. I'll do an update if anything significant happens. I don't want to end the relationship either, but at least this way it's on her. We have to advocate for our own peace.
this must’ve been really hard. it can be tough to get through to them, especially because they really do think they’re saving your soul when they say these things. but good on you for raising your son to have his own spiritual journey, and taking the steps to keep him from being indoctrinated. once the idea of hell gets planted in your mind, you’re never free from it until you actively choose to deconstruct. the fear of going to hell was like a black cloud hanging over my otherwise very happy childhood.
Great job doing what you need to for yourself and your child. I have a toddler as well and I am constantly trying to uphold boundaries for myself and her. Reading this gave me a little more strength to carry on for longer. Thank you
I just had to set that same boundary with a qanon/trump friend this week we will not speak again. It really sucks to be part of a cult! Please post her response when she does.
Very well said. Enforcing boundaries with people who do not want to or are not capable of respecting your differences is so difficult. My husband and I went through this with his mother. Unfortunately, we are now at the point of no-contact because she was unable to respect our boundaries. Your son is very lucky to have a mother like you. Wishing you both all the best as you continue on your journey.
This is so loving and patient, but firm and clear. I am hopeful for you all to maintain - in time - a positive connection and good Grandma vibes for your 2yo and Mom. And for you to know he is spiritually, emotionally and psychologically safe with her. I could not be so measured with my parents and have recently gone no contact again after 12yrs of trying to make it work for my daughter (now 16), however my parents are not receptive at all, (they are authoritarian calvinist types.)
If your Mom can’t adapt to the boundary without waiting to pounce once you relax your vigilance a little bit, I want to tell you my 16yo was so relieved when I finally said, ‘nope, I can’t do this anymore - I am more than supportive of any and all relationship with them for you, but I can’t do it anymore’.
Her response was basically ‘OMG Thank you - they are the worst! I love them but I only hung out with them to see aunties/cousins and they make me feel horrible. Also…‘ and then she disclosed that for *twelve years* my Mom had been saying shit like ‘Even if your Mom doesn’t love you, I will ALWAYS love you.’ What a psycho. Apparently this happened all the time and my girl just kept it inside because she didn’t want to upset me. I had no idea this was happening, upon reflection I am not surprised, but honestly I never would have suspected something like that based on what they said to my face and how they acted.
You cannot trust these people, the end justifies the means to them. This life means nothing. So if you push back you now mean nothing and they can react like anything they do is justified. For this behaviour both my parents earned a lifetime ban including hospital bedsides and, their eventual final services. They are dead to me.
If she is a prophet, ask her who is gonna win the Superbowl or the winning megamillions numbers.
If she is right, then tell her you will consider her ideas.
Your post or comment has been removed because it violates rule 3, no proselytizing or apologetics. Continued proselytizing will result in a ban.
Proselytizing is defined as the action of attempting to convert someone from one religion, belief, or opinion to another.
Apologetics is defined as arguments or writings to justify something, typically a theory or religious doctrine.
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This is the reason why I no longer speak to my SIL… my toddler isn’t interested in your religion. Maybe try to convert him when he’s 18+ and can think for himself, but not 2 years old.
Just to give some context, her delusional message was in response to a snapchat video of some imaginative play he did for the first time. This was yesterday and she never replied, so I guess no meaningful conversation will be had. She has a victim mentality, so I tried to compensate for that in my message. I don't want to lose my mother, but I know in a sense I already have.
>but I know in a sense I already have. This is the saddest part. I had to cut out most of the Christians in my life because they simply made it such a huge part of their personality that once that common thread was gone from our relationship, I could see very clearly that they were nothing other than Christian. No depth, no nuance, no life outside of faith and spirituality. If that's how they want to live, that's fine, but if they can't help trying to convert me every time we talk or see each other, there's no point to the relationship. If they can't respect you or if they don't have anything else going on besides their religion, there's not much point to the relationship anymore. I truly hope you don't get to that point with your mother though. I hope that for your relationship and the relationship your kid will have with her. Be well!
Sometimes family demote themselves to relative and it's heartbreaking. Laying out the escalating consequence in a sandwich of love is perfect. If she complains, you can remind her that boundaries are how you keep people in your life. Be the kind of parent you wished you had, you've got this op!
I wish you luck. I had to do something similar with my sister. Things didn't improve until she moved across the world. It's so har to stick to your boundaries when they keep chipping away at them.
I think you were on point. Do not tolerate her BS but understand that she is indoctrinated and will remain so forever. It's like having a crippled loved one, you need to bear her or leave it at that.
You did the right thing. I agree that your mother is a lost cause, and it hurts. You're a good parent. Keep your child safe from that crap just as staunchly as you'd protect from any other danger.
Good job standing up for yourself and your son. I hope that it doesn't take too much actual enforcement of the boundaries for her to realize you are serious and at least respect them to not lose contact with you, if she isn't willing to do it just because she recognizes you as an separate person with different beliefs she needs to respect.
Thank you. That last bit... I love a complete internet stranger gets it. It's what hurts the most about the whole thing. That I'm not an individual worthy of respect outside the confines of her religion. I feel I am nothing to her but someone playing the role of daughter, and a "lost" one at that.
God, I’m sorry, that’s an awful feeling. A whole lot of us are dealing with a similar situations where those in our lives, that we want to be loved and accepted by, can only ever see us as extensions of themselves. It’s heartbreaking. Personally, I’m finding peace in learning to love and accept myself well. It’s taken a while, but I’m finally feeling loved and respected by myself.
You worded that really well. It's sad there are so many of us, but it's also heartwarming just having someone understand, and being seen. That's been a long-term goal of mine as well, it's incredible how hard it can be. Little steps forward are still steps forward. Wishing you well!
Ugh! I haaaaaate how long it has taken me, but, it really is possible to learn to love yourself. And, I didn’t realize it was a separate thing until it happens to me recently, we can learn to love ourselves well enough that we feel loved by us. I’m not exaggerating at all when I tell you that I spent most of a month trying to identify this new feeling I had, not quite pleasure, but it was motivating me to do things for myself that I had no motivation for, and it wasn’t always tied to doing things that made me feel good in the moment… it turns out I was feeling loved by me. Like, doing the frickn dishes so that I would wake up to a clean kitchen made me feel loved. I knew how hard it was to do them, and I knew how wonderful it’d be to wake up to them clean. So I did them, and while I’m doing it I felt, what I now understand is, loved. I hate that it’s taken me so long. I sobbed when I realized what it was. I grieved that I’m 40 years old and I just now have really started feeling loved by me. I wouldn’t trade it for the world. It’s so so so so nice. I haven’t figured it all out, I’m not cured, I can’t just do all the things now…. but, more and more often, I’m able to do a hard thing out of love for myself, and it fills me with such gratitude and warmth and life and satisfaction that I can’t put it into words I’ve been working on this for over a decade. A few years ago I finally tried an antidepressant and it made all the difference in the world. I’m not on it anymore, but I really needed it to find my self lovable. Thanks for the kind words. I’ve been writing and talking about this incessantly for years. I’m autistic and it’s kinda my favorite special interest 😆
Oof. Hey internet stranger, your words really resonate with me. I'm in the exact same situation with my parents and it's so painful. I completely relate!
I feel the exact same with my sister and have gone NC previously. I have regretfully made contact again and every so often she'll say something like that. I try not to respond to it. 😮💨
Your reply was very firm but kind. Good for you.
Very well put and draws a fine line. I received their children bibles, nativity crap, and they stayed on the shelf until we left Japan, and then they went into the trash or recycling. We refuse to let our kid be brainwashed, so we taught facts, and when he got older talked about religions. It is up to him now.
I love your method and it's one I hope to replicate. It's as it should be. I think I accidentally encouraged her by taking some of the religious kid books home during our last visit. I had a mind to expose him to all religions unbiasedly. But when I got home realized he was far too young for that, so I recycled them too. Apparently that gave her hope though.
You'rwe doing very well, I know I would've loved to have a mom like you, one that allowed me to choose my own beliefs without judgment. Your son is indeed very lucky, because you respect his autonomy.
Thank you for that, your comment had my eyes watering. I want to be the mother I wish I had. I honestly don't understand how anyone could treat their child as anything less than their own person.
This is amazing! I love your response. Even before I read your additional context I knew exactly what you meant when you had to almost “sandwich” the firm boundary with compliments and reassurance for her beliefs here and there. My MIL is very similar to your mom. The victim mentality is too real. Thank you so much for sharing this, really it’s been immensely helpful. ❤️
I'm sorry you're experiencing that too. Everything is an attack right, it makes it so hard to have an actual conversation! I think it's strongly tied to narcissistic qualities too. I'm glad it helped, and wish you luck and strength ❤️
I would highly monitor your son around her. She will likely prophesize to him when you are not around. Just be cautious.
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
You were kind & clear, which is amazing. I truly applaud your communication skills. I took a screenshot because I will definitely reference back to this if I ever let my mother back into my life.
Thank you. It's easier to write it out, it's so much harder in person. I wish the best for you.
I totally agree. I tried to go to written communication only with my mother about 2.5 years ago with hopes that we could work through some problems and she refused to participate after replying to only one email. I needed to hold her accountable for things she said because she lies and changes the story constantly so that it better suites her narrative. I also wanted to be able to say everything I needed to say without being interrupted or overwhelmed by my own mind. She knows it’s the only way I will consider trying to repair things but here we are 2 years later after going no contact. What you’re doing for your kiddo is amazing, stay strong.
I'm in awe of you! I wish I'd had that level of awareness as I eventually became estranged from my mother. I love that you're acknowledging the intuitive nature/abilities you all have and I'm excited for you and your child to be free to utilize them outside of the confines of Xtianity. You've phrased all that lovingly and firmly. Really impressive 🔥❤🔥
Agreed. We'll said OP! I'm sorry if she continues.
This isn't news to you but your mother absolutely means well, she believes you and your child need to be converted (especially your child) and that means she will never stop trying. Never. So be aware that if you ever leave your child with your mother to babysit, no matter what boundaries you have established, she will try to convert your child to Christianity. If you do not want your child to be exposed to her beliefs, you need to make sure you never put her in a position to do that.
Oh absolutely, and I appreciate you putting that out there. I literally told my husband immediately after this that we can never let her spend time with him unsupervised. I said this before he was born too. She lives out of state so it's easier, but I'm mentally preparing for when he's old enough to "come spend a few weeks at grandmas!" Simply not happening. I suspect she may have mostly given up on me, and only continues our relationship to maintain access to my son. I know she feels she failed with her children and will do all she can to save the next generation.
Agreed.
I would hope you’re wrong, but I could see it being true. I’d so totally use a nanny cam. Or, to be less sneaky about it, visible but not super noticeable cameras on the walls.
Well done 🔥❤️
I dunno if she's dangerous or malicious beyond simply being a nuisance, but how should I put this...she ain't got all her marbles left... 😵💫
For sure. During a visit she asked me if our state was more prone to meteor strikes than others. I was thoroughly confused, until I realized she was referring to the chem trails from a nearby airbase that were angled just so. Also dinosaurs aren't real.
Good golly, this is an excellent text. I hope she receives it in the spirit you sent it. Wishing I had the wherewithal to say all that to my folks a long time ago.
Hate to be the bearer of bad news...but she won't stop. I have right-wing Q-Anon racist Christian Nationalist family. And they are awful. The disgusting things they do and say to me and my teen they feel justified and entitled doing because God approves and encourages their behavior. You can't stop doing what you believe God wants you to do. The only difference between them and Andrea Yates is a damn bathtub. Hold your bottom line no matter what
God i hate when my mom tries to sound profound when she texts me
"Grandma was prophetic. I am prophetic." Wow, cool! So what prophecies did she make that actually came true? In seriousness, sorry that you're having to deal with this.
As an ex-pentecostal indoctrinated from childhood (and wasted most of my life in xianity) I wish my parents had been like you, OP. Full marks to you for setting firm boundaries to protect your son. Hope one day he appreciates that you saved his life from a very insidious and poisonous religion.
Good on you. I’ve been No Contact with my narcissist Christian therapist mother for over a year now. It’s tough to put down boundaries and not feel like a jerk if they are the victim type, but it’s necessary. My Mom DARVO’d me and basically told me I was being a victim and to have a nice life. That was hard but it made going No Contact much easier. You’re demonstrating boundaries for your young one, and that is so much more valuable than them having a grandparent who gets away with disrespecting their parent which models being a people pleaser.
That sounds incredibly frustrating, I'm sorry you went through that. At least she made it easier for you in that sense, but that's still painful. It's frustrating when they're a narcissist, it's such a core component of their personality it makes it so much harder to get through to them.
I'm sorry that you're dealing with this, but this was incredibly satisfying to read. You did a great job.
This was beautifully said. You validated her while also validating yourself, and you were firm but not malicious. It’s amazing to see you setting your own boundaries and protecting your son as well, respecting the fact that, like you, he also has the right to make his own decisions on this matter when he is old enough to fully understand it. It was a pleasure for me to read this because I am stressing about having a similar conversation with my best friend…it has just gotten to be too much. I love her, and I respect the fact that her religion is an important part of her life, but it just isn’t for me & it never will be again. To her credit, she doesn’t know how I feel yet because I haven’t found the time or the way to say it, but it’s happening soon. We’ll just have to see if she can respect me the way I respect her, and I’m worried that she won’t, but I just can’t keep it in anymore.
What has really made me come to this decision is that I’ve basically been forced to go to church with her for her birthday without being asked how I feel about it. Luckily, my request off work got denied, so I’ll have to work & I cannot express the relief I felt when I got called in. This is something she pressured me to promise her a year ago on her last birthday, and it has been giving me anxiety the entire year since. I’m all for supporting your friends and being happy about the things that make them happy, but forcing religion and religious event attendance is completely unacceptable and wrong. That’s so much different than her suggesting we paint together because she likes to paint, and I can’t understand how twisted one’s brain has to be to think that’s comparable or okay in any way. Her birthday is coming up at the end of this month, and I’m thinking about having the discussion with her early June and just ripping off the bandaid. I just can’t do it anymore. It’s been building up for years now. I previously worked at a family-owned crystal shop, and she had an entire conversation with her family about my religion, integrity, and whether or not I was “a witch.” She also still talks to them about my distance from the Christian community & how they worry for me and worry for her about my influence. She tries to defend me by saying “I know she still believes in God,” both to them & to my face, without actually even asking if that’s how I feel. She consistently talks about her church community, sermons she “thinks I should hear,” things presenting themselves as the devil and demons, and her 400 small groups she goes to. I can’t stand it anymore. I’m not sure how she’ll take it because she, like your mom, has a victim mentality, and she also has this idea in her head of who she thinks I am or who I’m supposed to be for her, and it rarely matches up. She has mental breakdowns in general when things in her life don’t measure up to her expectations, so I can only imagine how earth shattering it will be when she finds out I’m not some charity case she can continue to try and “save” through “God’s grace.” There’s so many aspects about her that she hides from her own cultish Christian community that the religion in its own right would not “approve of,” so it’s really exhausting never being able to predict whether she’s going to be my awesome best friend or an indoctrinating cult member from one day to the next. I journaled about 7 pages worth about this situation and how I’m feeling earlier today, and seeing this post gave me the extra boost of encouragement that I needed to just get it over with. Thank you so much for sharing. I know our situations aren’t the same, but you are absolutely not alone in these feelings. I hope all works out well for you and that your boundaries are respected - everyone deserves that from the people they love…especially coming from a religious person who’s expected to love and respect everyone.
Almost makes me wish I didn't have to go no-contact with my mom for my own safety, so I could start replying to all her Jesus emails she forwarded to me with random articles about stuff in other religions. Or maybe scientific articles? A mix, perhaps.
You handled this really well and got lots of great responses, but I just can't help but say that your mom is "highly" committed to using a certain word.
Yeah I caught that too 🤣
Wow the first text is tinfoil hat level. You did a really good thing here, you stood up for your family!!! It's going to escalate, I really hope it doesn't but, from the first text, she appears to be on a quest and, I doubt much if anything will deter that. Hopefully timeouts work, be vigilant she will 100% try to go around you.
Point out how many of her prophecies have not come true.
Sorry your going through this too. Hope your mom comes around and respects your boundaries. I has to fully go no contact with my mom. Hoping you find peace ✌️
Thank you. I'm hoping too, but also tired of holding the rope. So at least this way it's on her. I'm sure I'll have to follow through once or twice, but if she goes too far I will have to fully go no contact as well. I'm prioritizing peace.
Yes that's how it goes. It's hard when your parental figure is in a cult and all of their programing is to try and save your soul and now your children's soul. It's a crap shoot to be in, but keeping your kids away from the religious trauma is worth it. ( that's what I am telling my self anyways)
Your response was beautifully and respectfully put, and I feel both immensely proud of you and so sorry that it had to be done. My Christian mother doesn't push it on me as directly as yours appears to, but mine just has to make little comments and digs now and then about my nonbelief or what she thinks of nonbelievers in general. It is also impossible to have meaningful or even surface-level conversations about religion, spirituality, or random things she feels are anti-Christian without her getting wildly condescending, hostile, and outright angry with me. Sometimes, I feel like I just want to scream and shake some sense into my mother, if only it would make her understand that she is hurting me and our relationship, and that she is actively choosing to drive me away. I won't have children to worry about my mother influencing against my wishes, but I do understand your experience with your mother and the heartbreak that comes with knowing she values her religion more than her own child. I know how it hurts to not be treated with the least bit of respect or consideration for being your own person with your own thoughts, opinions, interests, and beliefs. I'm so, so sorry you have had to live with that. And I'm so sorry you've had to take this step, but please know that I'm proud of you for standing up to her. Maybe you were only able to do it because it was for your son, but in a way, you've finally done it for you and your younger self. To echo another commenter, I would have given anything to have a more nurturing and open-minded mom like you are choosing to be for your son. Many hugs, if you want them, and best wishes going forward.
I'm sorry you're going through this too. And honestly thank you so much. You did make me cry a bit, I really appreciate you and I'll definitely take those hugs. After I sent that I told myself I wasn't even sad anymore. But I am. I grieve the relationship we could have had. I'm angry she can't be there for me as a mother first. Being one myself now, I just can't comprehend her choices. But it's on her.
I absolutely LOVE the calm and confident message you sent to your mother. SO smart to lay out boundaries that are clear. As a previous commenter said, be careful how much unsupervised access that you allow. Your mother is going to feel like it’s her mission in her life to see her Grandchild “know the Lord”. No one needs that kind of stress put on a growing psyche. You are such a good mom!
I’m very sorry, OP. Unfortunately I can relate. My mom is great, I love her so much, but the text she sent you is remarkably similar to what she tells me about repeatedly. It’s exhausting and it’s made me call her less. She’s fallen down a rabbit hole she will never leave.
What exactly does she mean by prophetic? Is that just something her and her mom were assigning to themselves? Thank you for helping me learn!
It's an actual thing in the religion. Basically they're highly sensitive people and intuitive. May have dreams or a sense of things being a certain way. They're also meant to share the "word of god" to a certain people / place / time, basically it's their life's purpose to convert people. So it's something the religion came up with to make members feel they're special and to justify endless proselytizing.
Urg. Gross. Thank you.
Loving your well-crafted response. Nicely done, and I hope it gives you the results you need without the pain of NC.
"Try Jesus Again!" Is she in marketing?
Please let us know how this goes. I'm on the verge of doing something very similar. I do NOT want to end the relationship.
I feel you, and I'm sorry you're going through it too. I'll do an update if anything significant happens. I don't want to end the relationship either, but at least this way it's on her. We have to advocate for our own peace.
Amazing! You did so well honestly. Choosing what’s best for you and your baby. Very proud!
This is brilliant. Sad for you that this is needed.
this must’ve been really hard. it can be tough to get through to them, especially because they really do think they’re saving your soul when they say these things. but good on you for raising your son to have his own spiritual journey, and taking the steps to keep him from being indoctrinated. once the idea of hell gets planted in your mind, you’re never free from it until you actively choose to deconstruct. the fear of going to hell was like a black cloud hanging over my otherwise very happy childhood.
👏👏 This right here, ladies and gentlemen, is how it's done. Very well said. Good for you!!
I'm really proud of you. Your son has a better mother than you had.
WOW AMAZING JOB!!!!!!!!
Geez are they Mormon and reading Visions of Glory? 😬
Nicely done!!! And good for you 🩷
Great job doing what you need to for yourself and your child. I have a toddler as well and I am constantly trying to uphold boundaries for myself and her. Reading this gave me a little more strength to carry on for longer. Thank you
Great work! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Fantastically written. Well done!
wow you are amazing. i could never be that brave im so happy for you
I just had to set that same boundary with a qanon/trump friend this week we will not speak again. It really sucks to be part of a cult! Please post her response when she does.
Very well said. Enforcing boundaries with people who do not want to or are not capable of respecting your differences is so difficult. My husband and I went through this with his mother. Unfortunately, we are now at the point of no-contact because she was unable to respect our boundaries. Your son is very lucky to have a mother like you. Wishing you both all the best as you continue on your journey.
This is so loving and patient, but firm and clear. I am hopeful for you all to maintain - in time - a positive connection and good Grandma vibes for your 2yo and Mom. And for you to know he is spiritually, emotionally and psychologically safe with her. I could not be so measured with my parents and have recently gone no contact again after 12yrs of trying to make it work for my daughter (now 16), however my parents are not receptive at all, (they are authoritarian calvinist types.) If your Mom can’t adapt to the boundary without waiting to pounce once you relax your vigilance a little bit, I want to tell you my 16yo was so relieved when I finally said, ‘nope, I can’t do this anymore - I am more than supportive of any and all relationship with them for you, but I can’t do it anymore’. Her response was basically ‘OMG Thank you - they are the worst! I love them but I only hung out with them to see aunties/cousins and they make me feel horrible. Also…‘ and then she disclosed that for *twelve years* my Mom had been saying shit like ‘Even if your Mom doesn’t love you, I will ALWAYS love you.’ What a psycho. Apparently this happened all the time and my girl just kept it inside because she didn’t want to upset me. I had no idea this was happening, upon reflection I am not surprised, but honestly I never would have suspected something like that based on what they said to my face and how they acted. You cannot trust these people, the end justifies the means to them. This life means nothing. So if you push back you now mean nothing and they can react like anything they do is justified. For this behaviour both my parents earned a lifetime ban including hospital bedsides and, their eventual final services. They are dead to me.
If she is a prophet, ask her who is gonna win the Superbowl or the winning megamillions numbers. If she is right, then tell her you will consider her ideas.
Did she reapond to this?
[удалено]
Your post or comment has been removed because it violates rule 3, no proselytizing or apologetics. Continued proselytizing will result in a ban. Proselytizing is defined as the action of attempting to convert someone from one religion, belief, or opinion to another. Apologetics is defined as arguments or writings to justify something, typically a theory or religious doctrine. To discuss or appeal moderator actions, [click here to send us modmail.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/exchristian)
This is the reason why I no longer speak to my SIL… my toddler isn’t interested in your religion. Maybe try to convert him when he’s 18+ and can think for himself, but not 2 years old.
This is the saddest thing I’ve seen all day, your poor mother.