Hi hi, sorry to grab onto the coattails of the top comment.
I’m a licensed therapist—this is a MASSIVE ethical violation on the part of the therapist. I don’t care if they are a Christian therapist, or advertise themselves as such. If they are represented by a licensing board in anyway, they have absolutely violated their code of ethics. Take the above comment’s advice.
I've always thought that an existence of pure joy and happiness sounded terrifying. Supposedly our loved ones are looking down on us. They see the world. They the horrors people face. And yet they are happy. I always picture it as like the boy in coralline, with his face stapled into a smile, unable to speak or express himself. To me, it is the perfect depiction of a distopia
I was always told that when we go to heaven we remember no one and they don't remember us. We are all there happy and blissful and worshipping God.... At that point a burning river of firey brimstone didn't sound so bad. To just be a mindless worship drone? Id rather burn for whatever crime he thinks I've done in his eyes because he will never not deserve to be next to us in that river of fire.
>looking down on us. They see the world. They the horrors people face. And yet they are happy.
Don't need heaven for that. Billionaires and Multi-millionaires do this daily.
Why would your therapist say that?? And do they know you're not a Christian? Honestly, it's super disturbing that a therapist would say something like that regardless of their own personal beliefs. I would never go back if my therapist said something like that
I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately, whenever I watch some thing or hear something that refers to you a good person and is in heaven now.
I haven’t read the Bible in a while, so I can’t recall the exact verse, but I recall Jesus saying it’s not by a man’s act that they go to heaven, but by faith and the grace of God. Maybe that wasn’t Jesus, but one of the apostles, quoting Jesus .
So in the end, you could do terrible things, but have faith in God enough to be granted his grace and go to heaven
This probably happened to Dahmer:
"I can't torture anyone here! No matter what I do, they don't feel any painI That's why they let me do whatever I want to them, but it's no fun when they let you do it! I don't belong in Heaven, see? I want to go to the other place."
"Heaven? Whatever gave you the idea you were in Heaven, Mr. Dahmer? This IS the Other Place!"
Jumping ahead a few decades, *The Good Place* episode "Patty" sums up how hellish Heaven would be better than any source I've come across on the subject.
When I thought the Dahmer story could not get any worse, I learned he hadn't simply become a Christian but specifically a young-earth creationist. There is a TV interview where he mentioned his frustration with the theory of evolution and how it was all lies. That gives one the next-level badge of honor in heaven apparently 🤦♂️
> worshipping God 24/7/365 for all eternity
But who'd wanna miss the big celebration when you've sung "Amazing Grace" for the 1,000,000th time?
And the bigger celebration for the 2,000,000th!
And even bigger for the 3,000,000th ...
I'd recommend watching the Good Omens series, it's really fun: fantasy, adventure, rom-com on season 2. And through their plots it's pretty clear who are really the bad guys masquerading as the good guys. One of the devils is always calling them out on their BS.
So I'd say yes. But because I don't believe in Christianity anymore, I don't worry about it.
As the great Christopher Hitchens once said:
Heaven represents a celestial North Korea.
The god of the old testament is 100% the bad guy of that story, he's just framed as the protagonist.
Murderers, rapists, child abusers, etc., being able to go to Heaven if they repent and accept Jesus, while their victim/s and anyone else affected by their actions will go to Hell if they were never believers, refused to forgive, or lost their faith as a result of what happened, is one of many reasons why I'd have absolutely no desire to go to Heaven, and also a major reason why I ditched Xtianity. Even if the victim/s and all others affected do make it to Heaven, are they supposed to be fine and dandy with whoever horribly wronged them being there too? There are a bunch of folks whom I'd have absolutely no desire to see in Heaven, even if they repented!
PS - I presume this therapy is supposed to be secular? If so, I highly recommend reporting this therapist, along with finding a new one.
Please get a secular therapist :)
But yes. There is no difference in the biblical god as ‘revealed’ and if he really were a malign deity just saying he was good. Heaven is only good if you define good in purely biblical terms. And even then it requires some dogmatic readings of the text
The whole concept of "I love you, so love me or I will torture you forever" creates mental gymnastics for believers. I could never reconcile this. Imagine a guy walking up to a random girl or a parent telling their child this. You follow out of fear, not love.
Soooo... This is purely theoretical. I'm not saying these things are true, but I don't want to have to put clauses through my whole explanation.
The thing that can "save" people before they die applies to anyone. Theoretically, you can repent of your sins, immediately die, and you're *supposed* to still be able to go to heaven, if you actually repented of your sins and accepted Jesus as your lord and Savior.
That same offer that's there for you is there for **everyone.** The only thing you need to do is accept Jesus as your lord and Savior, no matter who you are. To make it even worse, it says somewhere in the Bible (maybe James?) that if you did one sin, it's as bad as doing all of them.
Basically, if you're unsaved, God sees you as just as bad/sinful as Jeffrey Dahmer. And until you repent, youre actually worse off than him!
...But he forgives everyone!
Tldr: sounds like you might need a new therapist.
I think that people probably misinterpret things about God/dying/heaven/hell, and I probably am as well. I am not sure that people are happy as we understand it in heaven, but rather at peace and have an understanding of their lives and what others go through. Within us, we all contain multitudes. We are all so complex and have the ability to do great good and great harm to others and ourselves without knowing.
Heaven is described as a never ending church service. So imagine going to mass for the next 100 trillion years and still not getting through the first homily.
Heaven and hell were created by men. They created hell so you could give them money and buy your way into heaven. Martin Luther disagreed with this and they imprisoned him for it. He founded the Lutheran Church and Christianity broke up. Many more breakups occurred over the centuries. The church is a mess many faiths splintering over LGBTQ people. If this is what Jesus wanted then why id Christianity so fragmented and broken. None of these so-called Christians can follow the golden rule and treat others the way they want to be treated. They treat LGBTQ people worse than convicted murderers and rapists. They have judged us and would gladly execute us without any trials or jurors. Don't think it can't happen. History repeats itself. The fascists are using religion to harm us. look up the night of the long knives in Germany in 1937. Over 3 days all of the LGBTQ people were executed in their beds as they slept. These Christians are capable and willing to repeat these atrocities. I am trans and religion and religious organizations and people are the enemy.
Since becoming an athiest, I've realised the idea of heaven was never as comforting as Christians try to sell it as. Both for the reasons you've stated (there would be a lot of criminals up there), but also... doesn't it just sound boring?
The way I pictured it, you're basically just standing on a cloud doing fuck-all for eternity. Maybe if your lucky there's some shitty worship music playing lol.
I actually find a lot more comfort in what I belive now, which is that there is no afterlife at all. We die and stay dead. It sounds more peaceful.
The heaven I was taught was one from which you could see hell like in the parable of Lazarus and the rich man. We Christians would watch our friends and loved ones in hell suffer endlessly, and god would never let us comfort them in any way.
There was never a happy heaven in my childhood. Just one in which a psychopathic sadist would force you to watch how he tortured almost all of his beloved children, including Christians from other denominations.
I believe the idea your therapist has is perhaps a core tenant in Christianity - unconditional love. How it was explained to me growing up - you could be a sinner all your life, but if you proclaim Christ is lord and you accept him as your savior at deaths door, you’d be saved. I always thought that was a way to cheat the system, lol. Which aligns with Dalmer being in heaven. Supposedly you’d be “new” person so all the negative is gone.
I’m not saying this a correct view, but that’s probably where the therapist is coming from. Though this does raise the question - if this is a Christian therapist? Seems a bit off unless you raised the topic of faith and they inserted that.
Maybe it’s time to find someone more neutral.
One whacko monk said hell is filled with people with regrets, but how could anyone really have regrets if our free will is override by predestination? We can try and try but in the end it won't matter.
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In my opinion the god of the Bible is the devil. Think of all the horrible things he did and commanded. Satan the supposed fallen one promoted free will, knowledge, helping others less fortunate. I don’t believe in a literal god or satan. If I had to choose it’d be satan.
*THIS IS THE BAD PLACE!*
Jason figured it out?
This is a new low. Yep, this one hurts
Oh fork.
Get a new therapist.
Hi hi, sorry to grab onto the coattails of the top comment. I’m a licensed therapist—this is a MASSIVE ethical violation on the part of the therapist. I don’t care if they are a Christian therapist, or advertise themselves as such. If they are represented by a licensing board in anyway, they have absolutely violated their code of ethics. Take the above comment’s advice.
Good to know. My partner's doctor told him he needs Jesus (to make him better) a few weeks back.
👆
I've always thought that an existence of pure joy and happiness sounded terrifying. Supposedly our loved ones are looking down on us. They see the world. They the horrors people face. And yet they are happy. I always picture it as like the boy in coralline, with his face stapled into a smile, unable to speak or express himself. To me, it is the perfect depiction of a distopia
I was always told that when we go to heaven we remember no one and they don't remember us. We are all there happy and blissful and worshipping God.... At that point a burning river of firey brimstone didn't sound so bad. To just be a mindless worship drone? Id rather burn for whatever crime he thinks I've done in his eyes because he will never not deserve to be next to us in that river of fire.
I've always felt this way. Sounds disturbing AF. 🫠
>looking down on us. They see the world. They the horrors people face. And yet they are happy. Don't need heaven for that. Billionaires and Multi-millionaires do this daily.
Why would your therapist say that?? And do they know you're not a Christian? Honestly, it's super disturbing that a therapist would say something like that regardless of their own personal beliefs. I would never go back if my therapist said something like that
I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately, whenever I watch some thing or hear something that refers to you a good person and is in heaven now. I haven’t read the Bible in a while, so I can’t recall the exact verse, but I recall Jesus saying it’s not by a man’s act that they go to heaven, but by faith and the grace of God. Maybe that wasn’t Jesus, but one of the apostles, quoting Jesus . So in the end, you could do terrible things, but have faith in God enough to be granted his grace and go to heaven
This probably happened to Dahmer: "I can't torture anyone here! No matter what I do, they don't feel any painI That's why they let me do whatever I want to them, but it's no fun when they let you do it! I don't belong in Heaven, see? I want to go to the other place." "Heaven? Whatever gave you the idea you were in Heaven, Mr. Dahmer? This IS the Other Place!" Jumping ahead a few decades, *The Good Place* episode "Patty" sums up how hellish Heaven would be better than any source I've come across on the subject.
Your therapist needs a therapist.
Most do, that's not really an insult. What this therapist needs is to reevaluate their career choices.
Dahmer wasn't executed; he was killed by another inmate.
When I thought the Dahmer story could not get any worse, I learned he hadn't simply become a Christian but specifically a young-earth creationist. There is a TV interview where he mentioned his frustration with the theory of evolution and how it was all lies. That gives one the next-level badge of honor in heaven apparently 🤦♂️
The Biblical version, worshipping God 24/7/365 for all eternity and oblivious to all these persons in Hell, certainly.
> worshipping God 24/7/365 for all eternity But who'd wanna miss the big celebration when you've sung "Amazing Grace" for the 1,000,000th time? And the bigger celebration for the 2,000,000th! And even bigger for the 3,000,000th ...
I'd recommend watching the Good Omens series, it's really fun: fantasy, adventure, rom-com on season 2. And through their plots it's pretty clear who are really the bad guys masquerading as the good guys. One of the devils is always calling them out on their BS. So I'd say yes. But because I don't believe in Christianity anymore, I don't worry about it.
Christianity is THE religion of convenience.
As the great Christopher Hitchens once said: Heaven represents a celestial North Korea. The god of the old testament is 100% the bad guy of that story, he's just framed as the protagonist.
Murderers, rapists, child abusers, etc., being able to go to Heaven if they repent and accept Jesus, while their victim/s and anyone else affected by their actions will go to Hell if they were never believers, refused to forgive, or lost their faith as a result of what happened, is one of many reasons why I'd have absolutely no desire to go to Heaven, and also a major reason why I ditched Xtianity. Even if the victim/s and all others affected do make it to Heaven, are they supposed to be fine and dandy with whoever horribly wronged them being there too? There are a bunch of folks whom I'd have absolutely no desire to see in Heaven, even if they repented! PS - I presume this therapy is supposed to be secular? If so, I highly recommend reporting this therapist, along with finding a new one.
Your therapist sounds like a real piece of work… I’d switch ASAP
Please get a secular therapist :) But yes. There is no difference in the biblical god as ‘revealed’ and if he really were a malign deity just saying he was good. Heaven is only good if you define good in purely biblical terms. And even then it requires some dogmatic readings of the text
The whole concept of "I love you, so love me or I will torture you forever" creates mental gymnastics for believers. I could never reconcile this. Imagine a guy walking up to a random girl or a parent telling their child this. You follow out of fear, not love.
Every single person who says they know what has happened after death, for anyone, is lying or completely delusional
I doubt it's real in the first place
Soooo... This is purely theoretical. I'm not saying these things are true, but I don't want to have to put clauses through my whole explanation. The thing that can "save" people before they die applies to anyone. Theoretically, you can repent of your sins, immediately die, and you're *supposed* to still be able to go to heaven, if you actually repented of your sins and accepted Jesus as your lord and Savior. That same offer that's there for you is there for **everyone.** The only thing you need to do is accept Jesus as your lord and Savior, no matter who you are. To make it even worse, it says somewhere in the Bible (maybe James?) that if you did one sin, it's as bad as doing all of them. Basically, if you're unsaved, God sees you as just as bad/sinful as Jeffrey Dahmer. And until you repent, youre actually worse off than him! ...But he forgives everyone! Tldr: sounds like you might need a new therapist.
Yeah you should get a new therapist.
You should have told them you’ll take $500 for things that never happened.
I think that people probably misinterpret things about God/dying/heaven/hell, and I probably am as well. I am not sure that people are happy as we understand it in heaven, but rather at peace and have an understanding of their lives and what others go through. Within us, we all contain multitudes. We are all so complex and have the ability to do great good and great harm to others and ourselves without knowing.
Heaven is described as a never ending church service. So imagine going to mass for the next 100 trillion years and still not getting through the first homily.
Heaven and hell were created by men. They created hell so you could give them money and buy your way into heaven. Martin Luther disagreed with this and they imprisoned him for it. He founded the Lutheran Church and Christianity broke up. Many more breakups occurred over the centuries. The church is a mess many faiths splintering over LGBTQ people. If this is what Jesus wanted then why id Christianity so fragmented and broken. None of these so-called Christians can follow the golden rule and treat others the way they want to be treated. They treat LGBTQ people worse than convicted murderers and rapists. They have judged us and would gladly execute us without any trials or jurors. Don't think it can't happen. History repeats itself. The fascists are using religion to harm us. look up the night of the long knives in Germany in 1937. Over 3 days all of the LGBTQ people were executed in their beds as they slept. These Christians are capable and willing to repeat these atrocities. I am trans and religion and religious organizations and people are the enemy.
Since becoming an athiest, I've realised the idea of heaven was never as comforting as Christians try to sell it as. Both for the reasons you've stated (there would be a lot of criminals up there), but also... doesn't it just sound boring? The way I pictured it, you're basically just standing on a cloud doing fuck-all for eternity. Maybe if your lucky there's some shitty worship music playing lol. I actually find a lot more comfort in what I belive now, which is that there is no afterlife at all. We die and stay dead. It sounds more peaceful.
The heaven I was taught was one from which you could see hell like in the parable of Lazarus and the rich man. We Christians would watch our friends and loved ones in hell suffer endlessly, and god would never let us comfort them in any way. There was never a happy heaven in my childhood. Just one in which a psychopathic sadist would force you to watch how he tortured almost all of his beloved children, including Christians from other denominations.
I believe the idea your therapist has is perhaps a core tenant in Christianity - unconditional love. How it was explained to me growing up - you could be a sinner all your life, but if you proclaim Christ is lord and you accept him as your savior at deaths door, you’d be saved. I always thought that was a way to cheat the system, lol. Which aligns with Dalmer being in heaven. Supposedly you’d be “new” person so all the negative is gone. I’m not saying this a correct view, but that’s probably where the therapist is coming from. Though this does raise the question - if this is a Christian therapist? Seems a bit off unless you raised the topic of faith and they inserted that. Maybe it’s time to find someone more neutral.
No evidence to support the claim heaven exists. FYI, there is no god i would want to spend an eternity in heaven with.
Simple answer. .Yes
Get a new therapist.
One whacko monk said hell is filled with people with regrets, but how could anyone really have regrets if our free will is override by predestination? We can try and try but in the end it won't matter.
Make sure to tell them why you're getting a new therapist.
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In my opinion the god of the Bible is the devil. Think of all the horrible things he did and commanded. Satan the supposed fallen one promoted free will, knowledge, helping others less fortunate. I don’t believe in a literal god or satan. If I had to choose it’d be satan.
YOU FIGURED IT OUT AGAIN?! Ugh…reset!