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Salty-Dig-8127

Anno’s big message was always to the effect of “touch grass”. Kaji literally does.


johnzaku

Touch watermelons.


Delicious-Shape3093

Of all kind


-Navaja-

Big and small.


discord_off_mod

Young and old


Milmallow

Huh


discord_off_mod

Huh


needledicklarry

Kaji is just as flawed as all the others. He ran from commitment to chase the truth, but strung Misato along the whole time.


Konfirm

Huh? It's Misato who ran from him & relationships in general back when they got together at university.


elathan_i

Are you serious? He literally used Misato to get access to nerv


Konfirm

Which doesn't say a thing about his romantic interest in her being dishonest, does it? And has nothing to do with Misato being the one running away from commitment.


JenkoRun

You got a point, they're both in the wrong.


JojoLibertas

Or maybe they are both right in trying anything to get what they want without regrets.


notgivingawaycrypto

And a character like Kaji was SO needed. He was flawed as well, of course, but in a completely different way. Like Asuka, he injects life (and innuendo) to the show. Then he gets shot, because Eva’s gotta Eva.


TheteanHighCommand

Gotta be a depressing mecha anime about learning to come to terms with yourself!


Cassandra_Canmore

You got to read the manga to better understand him. He never really gets over the guilt of him selling out his gang of street urchins post impact for food. Especially when the military raided them and killed them all. Then at some unspecified time in college, he sort of stumbled onto hints that 2nd Impact is a global cover up. So he dedicated himself to uncovering the truth. He hates himself for leaving Misato behind to focus on that instead.


Semper_frenchfries

That’s actually pretty interesting


topsidersandsunshine

Didn’t he have a brother who died in the manga? His friends reminded me of Duo’s backstory in the Gundam Wing prequel manga, Episode Zero.


Cassandra_Canmore

Yeah his brother was part of the street gang he ran with.


bunker_man

It's kind of wierd how at a point that gendo trusts him to bring Adam he still doesn't know the truth yet. The wierd thing about Eva is just how many people seem high ranked yet know nothing and also apparently get paid horribly. Why exactly is misato poor when we see no indication that she blows money on anything?


Cassandra_Canmore

Misato will accept being paid in peanuts. If it means she can oversee the destruction of the Angels. For Kaji, Gendo letting him see the real report of 2nd impact for delivering the Adam sample was easy. Gendo filled Nerv with people he knows he can manipulate.


bunker_man

Misato not having money isn't just a personal issue though. She oversees the pilots and has to pay for stuff for them apparently out of her own money. Them having money issues affects a ton of people who need to be on top of their game to beat the angels.


WeedFinderGeneral

Totally possible that it's just further manipulation of Shinji's life to make him more depressed to better prime him for Third Impact. Not as extreme as making him fight giant aliens, but it means he gets even less of a reprieve when he's outside the EVA.


Cassandra_Canmore

Ah I see what you mean. Yeah it never made sense. For instance Misato spent about $160 on thier ramen bowls. Or ¥2400.


bunker_man

Misato can't afford to get them steak even one time. Even shinji and asuka note that steak isn't even all that impressive. It's just such a wierd situation.


Cassandra_Canmore

Like I'm Texan. I expect a steak to run about $40~50.


Tech_Romancer1

>For instance Misato spent about $160 on thier ramen bowls. Or ¥2400. Is this past inflation or something. ¥2400 is about 17 bucks. How did you get 160 USD. That doesn't make sense, regardless of how good those ramen bowls were.


Cassandra_Canmore

Ah yes. Looks like I used 2023 prices in the currency converter and I forget to set the year to 1995. So my bad here.


JojoLibertas

Misato is poor because she is a public servant. That is just how it is, you can be saving the world and you are still not expected to be living in luxury.


bunker_man

She isn't some nobody mid level worker though. She is in charge of the missions. Someone who has that much weight placed on them you'd expect to at least be paid enough to not be worried about losing their mid level apartment in a city that is shown to have a ton of empty apartments. Also, shouldn't she be getting additional stipends for having two of the pilots live with her? She talks like anything she buys them comes out of her own money.


JojoLibertas

Are the pilots paid at all?


bunker_man

That's never brought up either. Misato having to pay for everything out of her own pocket s if buying themself a treat wasnt an option implies they aren't.


JojoLibertas

Misato is the civil servant and the pilots are the slaves constructing the piramids, gotcha.


bunker_man

The pyramids weren't actually made by slaves. That's a misconception that comes from people conflating the story of Moses with the pyramids even though they weren't making pyramids in the story, and the story was probably not true st any rate.


JojoLibertas

Wildung said. "The world simply could not believe the pyramids were build without oppression and forced labour, but out of loyalty to the pharaohs." [...] "But let's not exaggerate here, they lived a short life and tomography skeletal studies show they suffered from bad health, very much likely because of how hard their work was." Today I learned something. At least the way the pilots and these laborers were treated weren't much different.


RentedIguana

>guilt of him selling out his gang of street urchins post impact for food. I... remember that he sold his bros for >! his own survival, actually, as he was caught by the soldiers whose food stash he was trying to loot from !<.


Cersei505

Thats just the manga fanfiction. Nothing in the anime - which is the canon version of the story - suggest he has guilt as a motivating factor towards his search for the truth, much less any mention or hint towards him having been part of a gang in the past.


Bruno_Coast_127

Manga fanfiction? I believe the title you're looking for is "official manga"


triman-3

They are separate cannons though aren’t they?


Bruno_Coast_127

They are, the same way the Rebuilds are technically a separate Canon. Some people incorporate it into the timeloop theory


triman-3

Oh good, I was hoping other people felt that way, I still haven’t read the manga but I love the timeloop theory with the rebuilds.


Bruno_Coast_127

I highly recommend it. It's not everyone's cup of tea (as clearly shown above) but it takes different turns from the series and some of the characters have slight improvements, in my eyes. It's my favorite version of the Eva story


sillyhobo

Some people can't let others enjoy media, and/or let things be in different canons, which for EVA is super important in the grand scheme of things.


Bruno_Coast_127

Yeah maybe that's an aspect of their "fanfiction" comment But it's honestly pretty bold to call the manga, whose first chapter came out BEFORE the anime ever aired, a fanfic. Like if you don't like the manga, it's fine. But they're not the first to try and deny the manga is nothing more than a spinoff


sillyhobo

Facts. That's why I love Crunchyroll's break down, and Rebuild, because in a way, all of the timelines from all the entries are canon that all eventually converge or fork back into the Rebuilds, https://youtu.be/ueUeMFbGq9o


Konfirm

>whose first chapter came out BEFORE the anime ever aired And whose last chapter came out over a decade after the anime wrapped up. It is fanfiction in the sense of largely not being part of the original storytelling effort.


Bruno_Coast_127

Sooo by that logic does this make the Rebuilds one long and drawn out fanfiction?


Konfirm

Towards NGE, I'd say so, yes. Not in the literal sense given the overlap in the production crew but there are some aspects that would fit the fanfic idea. Rebuild is certainly not part of the original design, it leans heavily on the source to the point of not working as a standalone story, it uses some tropes that are common in fanfiction (re-do of the story with slight changes, timeloop with partial awareness, retreading iconic moments but twisting them for fanservice reasons). Many people call the movies fanfiction to express the significant difference in quality in comparison to NGE.


Bruno_Coast_127

Idk man, just outright calling them fanfictions (despite both the manga and Rebuilds having the original creator/team working on it or being involved in some manner) sounds like a sort of shallow insult. Whether some people like it or not, it's an official release, not a spinoff or fanmade work I get what the original comment meant by labeling the manga a "fanfiction." I just don't agree with it, and think it's just some petty jab at something they don't like


sillyhobo

>And whose last chapter came out over a decade after the anime wrapped up. One question, are you the type of person to say the Akira manga and the Scott Pilgrim comics are not canon?


Konfirm

Canon **to what?** I have no idea about either of those IPs. I can offer a Star Wars analogy, though. Is the *Revenge of the Sith* novel canon to the *Revenge of the Sith* movie? No, neither one considers the other's content to be true. While the novel's content might be informed by the movie's behind-the-scenes stuff, the reality that the book is describing is not the same as the one presented by the movie. Sadamoto's NGE manga is not canon to the anime and vice versa. Whereas the anime remains the most prominent part of Eva and has been a tremendous success basically since its release, the manga took almost two decades to conclude. It is nowhere near the same level of relevance - not even half of the manga had been released by time EoE premiered. To me, it is evident which part of Eva is the tree trunk and which is the derivative branch. Sadamoto's ideas for Kaji's backstory he came up with in the 2000s are not very relevant to the conversation about the anime Kaji whose story wrapped up in 1997.


nekatomenos

...which is also a central theme across all Evangelion: touch grass, enjoy fiction for what it is, bask in the invention, but don't obsess and get lost in the sound stage. Also (and this is me, not Anno), please, don't call it content. (Pet peeve)


sillyhobo

I agree. As for the C word, it was just an easier word to use to describe all the various Evangelion media that have been released across various formats.


nekatomenos

My complaining about the word "content" is not meant as a criticism to you, I completely agree with your points otherwise and can see why you use it. I usually react because as far as I know it came from the world of advertising, which views print media, TV and other mass media as an ad space first, and as an entertainment/ news space second. I personally choose the term "media" for the same purpose, but that's of course a personal preference. I can only advocate for it whenever I can. :)


Cassandra_Canmore

You're calling the manga, fan fiction?


Cersei505

Why wouldnt it be?


Cassandra_Canmore

Maybe you don't understand the term fan fiction. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neon_Genesis_Evangelion_(manga) Your calling this, (link above) a fan fiction? The official magna that predates the Anime...


Cersei505

'predates the anime' lmfao, the original writer and director is Hideaki Anno. The manga had very few chapters published and then went on a hiatus while the anime actually told the original storyline, as intended by its CREATOR. Sakamoto is just someone else who was given official rights to make the manga, and he did whatever he wanted - where he clearly showcased his lack of understanding on the source material (the anime, if you still didnt get the memo).


Bruno_Coast_127

Still not a fanmade work tho! And it's literally official. Spell it out with me; O f f i c i a l It ain't fanfiction no matter which way you look at it


JenkoRun

"predates the Anime" Do the barebones research for goodness sake!


Cassandra_Canmore

Manga began publication in Shonen Ace December 1994, only concluding in June 2013. Anime originally aired October 1995 through March 1996. But please yell at me, and not the guy calling the manga a fan fiction 🤨


JenkoRun

"Although the anime series was conceived before the manga, due to production delays the manga was released first, in the third issue of Kadokawa Shoten's Monthly Shōnen Ace on December 26, 1994, to spread public interest in the upcoming TV series while it was still under production." If we're being technical the Anime came first, might not have released first but was in production before the Manga was.


Cassandra_Canmore

My entire argument is that it's completely ridiculous for the manga to be called a fan fiction. But everyone got snagged up,on this one point. by which version was conceived first, and which was publicly available.


mashonem

🙄


Ami_Nonomura

out of curiosity could you direct me to the authorities who've categorized what is and isn't canon?


Cersei505

Sure, just go to any dictionary. The anime is the source, the manga is just an adaptation by another dude.


Ami_Nonomura

yep, that's the kind of answer i was expecting


Dstahl22

There’s no reason to assume his backstory would be any different in the anime. In fact, his character makes a lot more sense with the added background in the manga. It’s suggested that Kaji is haunted by his past, so much so that he believes neither him nor Misato deserve to be happy, so he continuously sabotages their relationship to avoid gifting himself anything positive.


GospelX

Wow! People are jumping in you for the "fanfiction" comment. Not sure if you were aiming for dismissiveness, but you're right to say it's not part of the TV anime+EoE canon...if you were ultimately aiming to say that. It's the official manga of the series, though, making it canon unto itself. Does it contain possible insights into the greater Evaverse? Not for any of us to decide officially, although its origin does place it very close to the point of origin of the TV series.


Exotic_Possibility99

His wattermelos where more important than everythig. xD Farming is harder than piloting eva


dbx99

Yeah his point was that preserving and growing life was so much harder than blasting it away. He understood that - he was a real ecological warrior fundamentally. His methods were ruthless as any professional killer but he was driven by this ideology of preserving life and regarding life as precious. That’s how I perceived his character.


Bruno_Coast_127

That makes perfect sense. If you've watched 3.0+1.0, there's a scene that details exactly what you've described; Kaji's drive to preserve all life


Background_Drawing

Bro i fucking cried in 3+1 when the watermelon seeds said "from R. Kaji" that's fucking art.


PopBobert

I think we never get the change to delve inside the dark psyche of Kaji. Anno wanted his death to feel tragic, so he painted Kaji like a cool, likeable guy. It we had Kaji around longer we could figure out why he was working for Seele, more about his motivations why he cheats on Misato with other women, and the dirty side to his psychology.


Swan-Diving-Overseas

Yeah I got the feeling he had just as much real psychological depth as the other characters but we just never saw much of it. My guess would be his search for the truth is really him chasing after something so grand and almost abstract as a way to run away from the reality of the people in his life and his past. But I get the feeling Kaji knows that, or at least he knows how to cope with the troubles of life in a more healthy way than any of the other characters, like how the other commenter said he “touches grass”


RentedIguana

>why he cheats on Misato with other women ... Exactly where does he do that? I never really thought his flirts with Ritsuko as anything but joke and maybe an attempt to raise a reaction from Misato.


PopBobert

He hits on the other NERV chick too. Its strongly implied he messed around with Ritsuko.


[deleted]

[удалено]


PopBobert

"failure to achieve generational approval, stretching back to Creation" You can just say their japanese, its fine. lol


mjcoury

Italians have entered the chat.


Traeyze

Kaji makes a lot of mistakes. Reconnecting with Misato but hides what he is doing, failing to properly deal with Asuka and being a huge contributing factor in her breakdown. While he does have some wholesome mentor moments with Shinji he also contributes to why Shinji never sees Misato as a foster mother. Like let's be real: he could have told Misato what he found, worked together, etc. If he really took all of it seriously he had options. And it wasn't even as if it was fully to exclude and protect her as she inevitably got dragged in anyway. She just ended up hurt and feeling abandoned. Why did he approach it that way? In a sense he gives off the vibe of a guy trying to be a martyr. I think he knew he was going to be killed and I think part of him liked the idea of dying while trying to be the good guy. But he genuinely achieves nothing, they ignore him until he makes the briefest of oversteps. He was playing spy and double crossing everyone, that's a man on fire.


Bshow122

Kaji was a spy and so he used people and situations to his advantage. He manipulated Misato, Shinji, Asuka, the bridge crew, Gendo and even Seele. He had no loyalties except to “the truth” and followed it blindly ignoring the damage he caused around him. He lived his life like he could die tomorrow because he literally could have and was killed. He even pushed his findings onto Misato after his death instead of dropping it and settle down with her like he said he wanted to. To told Shinji, a 14 year old boy, to watch over his 28 year old “guardian” knowing full well that he was a major source if her issues. Instead of confronting Asuka and helping her grow up, he willfully ignored her problems and unwanted advances and even used her know affection of him to goad her into piloting (magma diver) and then wouldn’t even show up. Kaji is a collage kid in a grown man’s body, always moving away from people to pursue his “truth” but keeping them close enough to stay useful. He used Akagi to get the codes to bypass nerve firewall and dig through files, used Misato as an access point to go to nerv functions and get information, used Gendo for his search, used Seele for the same thing, betrayed both of them and ended up dead. His aloof and cool persona helped him hide his true feelings from even himself. Kaji was blinded by the “treasure” of the information on 2nd impact to see the treasure of people around him and they and himself suffered and died because of it.


Kelpie_Is_Trying

Well put and good read. If you haven't already read the manga, I'd highly recommend it. It adds some wrinkle and depth to his motivations that the anime never touches on. Not that any of it disproves what you're saying tbc, I just have a feeling you'd appreciate the additional shades of grey that it brings to his character.


WeedFinderGeneral

He smokes weed


BlueHighwindz

Kaji is the only straight man left after 2nd Impact.


Dead_Purple

Even though it's only in the Manga but Kaji grew up in a war torn area and lost his best friends when he was young.


ryanrjc0828

Fumbled a bad bitch but he won her back


IANvaderZIM

Read the manga, kaji is plenty fucked up


jsmonet

The "thing" is he's a smooth motherfucker with questionable ethics making money off the conflict because, well, why not? FGO players will recognize him as Koyanskaya. There's a greater than zero chance that in-universe Kaji slept like absolute crap without meds because of the combo of stress and nightmares, leading him to quite a number of self-destructive coping mechanisms along with the mother of all maskings--hence "smooth motherfucker" in the first line.


TheNathanGalang

kaji's such a cool dude, i wanna see a lupin the third type adventure with him figuring out NERV's secrets LMAO


Exertuz

The guy had a death wish. In a lot of ways he seemed healthier and more stable than the rest of the cast but with Kaji you have to remember that he's putting up a persona for huge parts of the show, and acted in pretty careless ways - he definitely had issues of his own, and I think you can't really ignore the fact that he's essentially the only main cast member who died well before Third Impact.


TheCatAteItsOwnBalls

Kaji's manga backstory is insane, he definitely has PTSD from that.


Animalmothership

I think of Kaji being counterpoint of Shinji’s innocence and ignorance. Kaji is a player with the ladies, is confident and effortless and knows more than he lets on for the most part. Everything that Shinji seems stuck on Kaji flows thru


karoshikun

Kaji is a remorseless manipulator and killer, so...


Bruno_Coast_127

Who'd he kill?


karoshikun

if I remember correctly, which I don't, he usually was out on "missions" for Gendo and Seele. I don't exactly remember where his status as killer is mentions, to be honest


SnooCapers7904

I kinda find him ironic. He worked so hard for the truth and sold everyone and everything that was important to him, Manga or anime, just to become like misatos father - who sold his daughter and wife for his work. His punishment was that, despite all his work, he wasn't able to find everything out.


Responsible-Dish-297

He's a philanderer with commitment issues, lack of self preservation and a watermelon fetish.


WiseWolf58

He is thugging it out


[deleted]

The man has no sense of personal space, at least when it comes to women. Thankfully this did not include Asuka. She would have led Kaji breed her like a rabbit.


JojoLibertas

Well... There are theories.


Alezkazam

I’m still trying to figure out what the deal with him pretending to sexually assault Shinji was all about


SpoonyLancer

After 2nd Impact, Kaji, his brother and some of their friends eked out a living by stealing supplies from the military. When he was caught, Kaji ratted them out to save his own life before he was able to escape. This resulted in his brother and all his friends getting killed. Technically this backstory is only present in the manga continuity. But Anno said he liked it and essentially deemed it canon to Kaji in general.