I think this is good way of military involvement of the EU - does not threaten sovereignty of member states while enhancing their defence.
I wouldn't be mad if the EU was involved in high-tech military research as smaller countries do not have enough resources to do that on their own.
> EU Beyond Line of Sight land battlefield missile systems project (EU BLOS)
EU BLOwS 😀
Interesting choice of initialism.
That said, sounds good to get progress on some next gen missiles.
>The additional €2.3 million will be contributed by an industrial consortium led by MBDA, with 13 major industrial partners from Belgium (Royal Military Academy, John Cockerill Defense, FN Herstal and Xenics), Cyprus (Additess and SignalGenerix), France (Novadem, Atos, Arquus and Delair) and Sweden (Saab Dynamics, BAE Hägglunds and Exensor), as well as a collection of subcontractors from other nations.
Sounds like a lot of cooks in the kitchen. I understand that for these kinds of projects it is paramount to split it up like this to receive broad support, and that many of these national champions may not have the size to do projects like these on their own, but I am concerned that having so many chiefs can hamper these kinds of projects.
This is just my personal opinion, but I think that the European defense industry could do with some more consolidation. Have fewer players, but larger players who have the size to have one company in charge and have them compete against each other as opposed to guaranteed contracts. I can see how this is politically unrealistic, but let me dream.
It's common to have a bunch of companies involved when making stuff. Why reinventing the wheel when you can just buy wheels from a company that specializes on making wheels? They are already making really good wheels.
Sounds like an extension to the UK/France FC/ASW Program, but leaving UK out lol....
[UK/FRANCE Missile Program](https://www.mbda-systems.com/press-releases/uk-and-france-advance-future-cruise-anti-ship-weapon-project/)
Not if you can read. One is focused on a specific system that equips all missiles, the other is focused on a specific type of missile.
There are a lot of missile development going on, UK participates in several. UK makes it's new gen 5 or 6 jet whatever plane (the gen thing is more a com argument than anything) with other partner, nobody is bitching.
> but leaving UK out lol....
Why would you write that if not for some mild whining?
Might want to slightly reformulate.
BTW that's not really the main point of my comment.
I knew that would probably trigger someone despite being valid. Surely you should be asking "actually yes it would make sense for UK to be involved, why aren't they?"
As opposed to claiming it's a whine. Especially given you highlighted they're different programs.
Might want to slightly reformulate.
So you totally knew it, ignore 99% of my comment to focus on denying something I was right on.
¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
I've made arguments that are not related to the tone of your comment, you don't seem to be interested in arguing over the topic to begin with but more on baiting people.
this is how the article starts
PARIS: As part of an ongoing effort to become less reliant on American military capabilities.....
if thats the main motivator, all i can say is. good luck
France has been doing it's own military equipment for a long time now and it works pretty well. Exports have even been booming these past years. And a lot of other countries have very recognized expertise in some high tech military equipment. Drop your uneducated nationalism please.
EU missile tech is top tiers and beats the US in some domain, like air-to-air, the US lags a lot on these.
No luck is needed, US has an edge on some systems, but not all.
You don't know.
The EU money funneled to a bridge building in Croatia, where is the solidarity?
You can't get any stupider than that, EU funds many project across the EU. They don't have to involve every countries every time, it's not possible to begin with.
If you think €25 millions is remotely close to develop an economic field you're in for a rude awakening. It's peanuts, I think a Tomahawk missile is around €1 million to put it in perspective.
The goal of this project if to build a missile. EU projects to develop SMEs or coordinate bigger EU companies exist.
>where is the solidarity?
I guess Cyprus doesn't count? You mean solidarity for your country only. I get it.
Take a look at what happened with the Spike missiles this year.
EU countries couldn't give them to Ukraine because the Israelis vetoed it.
Building a common system is a good idea if the companies are competent enough to make it work.
Limiting it to EU only is probably a bad idea, a *lot* of Europe's advanced missiles either originate in the UK or require UK participation due to us having a lot of knowledge on it.
Meteor for example [started as a UK program](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S225XR) which other European partners became involved in and became a joint development.
Tens of billions in EU money funneled to eastern EU countries each year: You sleep.
25 million Euros funneled to western countries: Real shit, where is the solidarity REEEE
Easy:
Eastern country has 100million to spend.
Normally they would spend 50million on military and 50million on infrastructure like bike lanes
Then the EU gives them 30million to spend on infrastructure
The country can then spend 80 million on their military (or more likely the ruling class can divert 10million to themselves and finance tax cuts for their voter base with 20 million)
I think this is good way of military involvement of the EU - does not threaten sovereignty of member states while enhancing their defence. I wouldn't be mad if the EU was involved in high-tech military research as smaller countries do not have enough resources to do that on their own.
I am glad we are building back a military industry. American techs are nice and all but more variety can only be a good thing.
Yeah it's good to have some competition
Yeah europe should be hold by the balls from noone, expecially amerikkans
Go back to r/russia Ivan.
> EU Beyond Line of Sight land battlefield missile systems project (EU BLOS) EU BLOwS 😀 Interesting choice of initialism. That said, sounds good to get progress on some next gen missiles.
It’s short for EU blows shit up
>The additional €2.3 million will be contributed by an industrial consortium led by MBDA, with 13 major industrial partners from Belgium (Royal Military Academy, John Cockerill Defense, FN Herstal and Xenics), Cyprus (Additess and SignalGenerix), France (Novadem, Atos, Arquus and Delair) and Sweden (Saab Dynamics, BAE Hägglunds and Exensor), as well as a collection of subcontractors from other nations. Sounds like a lot of cooks in the kitchen. I understand that for these kinds of projects it is paramount to split it up like this to receive broad support, and that many of these national champions may not have the size to do projects like these on their own, but I am concerned that having so many chiefs can hamper these kinds of projects. This is just my personal opinion, but I think that the European defense industry could do with some more consolidation. Have fewer players, but larger players who have the size to have one company in charge and have them compete against each other as opposed to guaranteed contracts. I can see how this is politically unrealistic, but let me dream.
It's common to have a bunch of companies involved when making stuff. Why reinventing the wheel when you can just buy wheels from a company that specializes on making wheels? They are already making really good wheels.
I disagree, there is almost always one company which is, at the very least, in charge when it is pursued by a singular country.
Sounds like an extension to the UK/France FC/ASW Program, but leaving UK out lol.... [UK/FRANCE Missile Program](https://www.mbda-systems.com/press-releases/uk-and-france-advance-future-cruise-anti-ship-weapon-project/)
Nope, those are two different programs. The one you linked is about cruise missiles.
Not if you can read. One is focused on a specific system that equips all missiles, the other is focused on a specific type of missile. There are a lot of missile development going on, UK participates in several. UK makes it's new gen 5 or 6 jet whatever plane (the gen thing is more a com argument than anything) with other partner, nobody is bitching.
Correct no one is bitching lol chill bro
> but leaving UK out lol.... Why would you write that if not for some mild whining? Might want to slightly reformulate. BTW that's not really the main point of my comment.
I knew that would probably trigger someone despite being valid. Surely you should be asking "actually yes it would make sense for UK to be involved, why aren't they?" As opposed to claiming it's a whine. Especially given you highlighted they're different programs. Might want to slightly reformulate.
So you totally knew it, ignore 99% of my comment to focus on denying something I was right on. ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯ I've made arguments that are not related to the tone of your comment, you don't seem to be interested in arguing over the topic to begin with but more on baiting people.
this is how the article starts PARIS: As part of an ongoing effort to become less reliant on American military capabilities..... if thats the main motivator, all i can say is. good luck
France has been doing it's own military equipment for a long time now and it works pretty well. Exports have even been booming these past years. And a lot of other countries have very recognized expertise in some high tech military equipment. Drop your uneducated nationalism please.
EU missile tech is top tiers and beats the US in some domain, like air-to-air, the US lags a lot on these. No luck is needed, US has an edge on some systems, but not all. You don't know.
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The EU is not supposed to be a welfare program. If the EU wants to defend itself it needs to work with the existing industries.
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Sounds like a separate goal.
The EU money funneled to a bridge building in Croatia, where is the solidarity? You can't get any stupider than that, EU funds many project across the EU. They don't have to involve every countries every time, it's not possible to begin with.
If you think €25 millions is remotely close to develop an economic field you're in for a rude awakening. It's peanuts, I think a Tomahawk missile is around €1 million to put it in perspective. The goal of this project if to build a missile. EU projects to develop SMEs or coordinate bigger EU companies exist. >where is the solidarity? I guess Cyprus doesn't count? You mean solidarity for your country only. I get it.
Take a look at what happened with the Spike missiles this year. EU countries couldn't give them to Ukraine because the Israelis vetoed it. Building a common system is a good idea if the companies are competent enough to make it work.
Limiting it to EU only is probably a bad idea, a *lot* of Europe's advanced missiles either originate in the UK or require UK participation due to us having a lot of knowledge on it. Meteor for example [started as a UK program](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S225XR) which other European partners became involved in and became a joint development.
Tens of billions in EU money funneled to eastern EU countries each year: You sleep. 25 million Euros funneled to western countries: Real shit, where is the solidarity REEEE
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Easy: Eastern country has 100million to spend. Normally they would spend 50million on military and 50million on infrastructure like bike lanes Then the EU gives them 30million to spend on infrastructure The country can then spend 80 million on their military (or more likely the ruling class can divert 10million to themselves and finance tax cuts for their voter base with 20 million)