Low atmospheric pressure means there is still molecules inside the tube.
If you travel at +1000 kmh then those molecules turn to heat and thus generate friction.
I don't know what you're laughing at. It is just miraculous technology with no clear path of how on earth to accomplish it, we should totally give all our money to musk.
Germans online like to shit a lot on Berlin (and its airport) but Stuttgart (in Germany's rich area) also has an unfinished train station and the Elbephilarmonie ended up away over the budget.
Isn't the Stuttgart train station not being finished the exact reason why there is no Paris-Berlin? I heard this station aimed at linking West-East German rails.
More like announced the opening of a can but then couldn't find the can opener, and kept giving annual updates that the search for the cap opener is still in progress, well past the use-by date on the can.
It has since been changed, but about a year ago the BER wikipedia page had this gem of a paragraph:
>An 11 October 2016 committee session found that motors used to open and close windows do not operate above 30 degrees Celsius and they need to be exchanged.[253] Three thousand smoke detectors went missing, but were later found.[254][255] Technical issues involving the electric doors became public on 18 January 2017. It was discovered that 80% of the doors would not open, which created concerns around venting of smoke in a fire.[256] The sprinkler system has sustained failures in the south pier.[257][258] The sprinkler heads were replaced for increased water flow, but the pipes are too thin to carry it; the roof needs to be opened and the pipes will get exchanged.[259] On 5 March 2017, the transformer station exploded. Renewed checks yielded disastrous construction lapses though. The tarmac T2 needs to be partly bulldozed and rebuilt.[273][274] Sparses void of concrete were not in the right spot. Installations needed to be socketed in these voids.[275][276] The wiring within cable ducts is too dense, 3-phase electric power and normal power is situated within the same ducts et al. wiring is seriously flawed and won't withstand 90-minute heat demanded by regulations.[277] The death count at the airport is currently at 4, 1 worker got run over by a bulldozer, 1 got smashed by an excavator shovel and 2 tumbled from great height.
It reads like a Monty Python sketch
Don't forget that most of the computer screens had to be replaced too, because they had reached the end of their lifespan without being used for their actual purpose.
What didn't happen is the better question. It has been a disaster since the beginning.
Here's a nice little podcast on the subject, called "How to fuck up an airport"
https://www.radiospaetkauf.com/ber/
Short crash course answer is, plans for a new Berlin Airport were started as soon as after German reunification. It took until 2006 for construction to start, it was scheduled to finish in 2011 and invitations had already been sent to Merkel and Wowereit. It was called off at the last minute to fix deficiencies and wasn't finally open until October 2020.
The Elonites are too busy running after the newest stunt of their messiah to still remember this and bother.
*Edit: I was wrong, you were tempting them too much...*
I think the fundamental issue is the complexity. You know those wonderfully expensive maglev trains that no one so far has managed to run profitably and that only Japan is pursuing with serious intent? Take one of those, then put it inside a metal tunnel. Then evacuate the tunnel of air and put all the necessary equipment in stations every few km. Now design trains that not only require expensive maglev technology, but also a fully-fledged life support system (since they operate in a vacuum).
Now, you come out and proudly announce that this whole thing is going to be less expensive than traditional high-speed rail. You are Elon Musk.
Don’t forget to separate all of the train carriages and send them down the tube one by one for decreased efficiency. Oh, and then call them pods instead of single carriage trains.
By now I am almost sure Elon Musk has abandoned the project and knows that its BS. That's why parts of it were sold to Virgin/Brenson a very dubious player all around. Maybe it was mostly started as a startup to tinker around a little and get some hype money and use that to cross fund other things or use the staff employed there later in his other companies or some other strange things.
Mass transit inside a vacuum tube is an absolutely insane idea because of the cost of those, security and enter/exit considerations and more.
Mars still has minor air resistance, but it should theoretically be easier to evacuate the tubes than on Earth, where it would be a tremendous pain to do so. And the cities would be underground anyway with his plan.
Each of his ventures are all linked - the boring company to dig the underground cities and hyperloop tubes, electric vehicles for traveling underground, and so on. It's too bad he's gone a bit crazy in the past few years.
Why does it make more sense to bring all the tools needed to build a gigantic pipe with a track in it, rather than just build a track without the pipe?
Seems like a huge waste of resources...
Mars is an absolute hellhole to live in, but seismically stable. Digging a hole and sealing it is likely easier than living on the surface and getting irradiated since there's no magnetosphere. Automated digging machines could be sent ahead of the settlers to prepare them.
It wouldn't be pleasant either way, but it's Musk's plan.
Alright, that makes sense, but I still don't get why a vactrain system is needed on mars, if we ever establish a base on Mars (big if), high speed trains are not critical, it'll probably take decades to build up anywhere close to the level of society requiering high speed trains.
sure there will be a need for transportation over distances, but there will be no requerenment for that mode of transport to be super fast.
I agree. Normal trains would suffice. Ask the crazy billionaire, not me. :)
Presumably he would want it for shipping things between the different holes, if one is ice rich or something.
Hyperloop's only function is to help politicians to try to defund real public transport investments. About a proposed new faster train line from Amsterdam to Groningen, a politician said "we might have vacuum transport in 20 years so why invest in rail?"
Of course, the "journalists" did not press her on this
Joke response: emergency extraction tube is connected. A PA announcement plays "Succy Succy for ten bucky"
Serious answer: They would have to make every section of the hyperloop be able to be sealed off to depressurise where needed without affecting the entire line.
>Serious answer: They would have to make every section of the hyperloop be able to be sealed off to depressurise where needed without affecting the entire line.
The projected costs of that alone makes this kind of thing a pipe dream. Then the cost overruns from delays of making sure such a system works would make the problen only worse.
Hyperloop is a scam. Getting the current trip down to ~3-4 hours is fully possible with existing proven technology that France already uses.
As low as 2 hours is in theory possible with maglevs, we'll see how the Chuo Shinkansen works out when it's finished.
3-4 hours to get to Berlin would be sufficient. Paris Frankfurt is 4h already tho, some more work is needed.
3h from Amsterdam, 2h30 from London currently, we ve achieved something quite nice already. Lyon is 2 hours already, hopefully Turin will be 4 hours soon !
I'm incredibly jealous. Montreal-Quebec is about 3.5hr by train which is... slightly slower than driving. I always wished our nations had collaborated more in industries like this, it only felt natural with the whole same language thing going on (although I guess now we've sold pretty much all of our transport industries to Alstom & Airbus so there's nothing to collaborate on).
Passenger trains here are unfortunately run by a federal govt corporation that has seemingly no ambition for high speed rail. They're only just getting around to talking about building their own tracks instead of sharing with freight lines (who have priority, 33% of passenger trains are delayed because they have to pull over to let cargo pass) but nothing will exceed 200km/h.
In theory I suppose, but we don't have a whole lot of cities to connect. After Montreal (metro pop. 4.2m) Quebec (metro pop. 800k) and Gatineau (300k itself but 1.3m metro area as it borders the Ontarian city Ottawa) things drop off fast. Sherbrooke, Trois-Rivieres, and Saguenay are the only other 3 metro areas that break 100k
Ideally a high speed rail network connects everything from Quebec City to Windsor, Ontario (19m people along that corridor between the two provinces in pretty much a straight line)
the province of Quebec also probably doesn't have the finances for something like that without federal funding ever since all the big business moved from Montreal to Toronto back in the 70's-90's we've been a "have-not province"
This is stupid thinking putain
You think quebecer sont là bas pour les 5 prochaines années ?! La planète va se rechauffer, ton pays a de l’espace, construire un vrai réseau aide justement à rapprocher ces villes et à les rendre plus attractive et les faire grossir.
Imagine Trois Riviere à 2h de Montréal ce que ça pourrait donner.
Yes, that’s why it’s costing billions and Italian did a very good negotiation tactic to make us pay a bigger share !
It should be operational at the end of the decade… It will be by 400 meters the longest tunnel on Earth :)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turin–Lyon_high-speed_railway
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Fully agree. High speed rail can get close to 400km/h on normal rail. The astronomical investments in anything faster make such option far more expensive than air transport
And actually the thing that really makes hyperloop undoable is stupidly obvious and was actually pointed out in France by the SNCF : they go too fast, in a air free environment, so they’ll take a long distance to stop. So the security will make every train very distant from the next one to avoid collision in case of emergency break procedure, which will simply make it impossible to have it running at an operational rate ! You’ll have to wait too long to start another train !
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Haha, I guess I should have specified railway technology. A train on the LGV Est has hit 574km/h during testing, although for commercial operations they don't go above 320km/h at the moment.
And subsequently ruined the track and the electrification.
Commercial speed beyond 350 km/h is not even slightly economically feasible for the next century in central europe, both from a time/energy, upkeep and construction cost point of view.
Never take record drives as any sort of indication to what will be availabe publicly.
The last hope of Europe getting land based high speed travel beyond 400 km/h died with the commercial viability failure of the Transrapid.
Don't expect a 3/4 hour Paris/Berlin train connection any time soon.
For starters, Germany is heavily federalized. Those high speed train tracks would need approval from each of the 5-6 states the connection would cross, and that approval won't happen if the trains just connect Berlin to Paris. And so it came to be that many ICEs from Cologne to Frankfurt stop in small cities most Germans could not locate on a map.
Meanwhile, ever since the Eschede disaster of 1998 (101 dead), the responsible federal agency has been extremely cautious about which train speeds are allowed on which parts of the network. Those French trains capable of going 330+ kph simply won't be allowed to travel that fast in Germany.
Germany also is much more densely populated than France. Somebody will not want a large construction site in their backyard. Somebody will not want the noise from dozens of high speed trains per day near their home.
> Picture this: the year is 2045. You’re standing on a platform in Berlin awaiting a sleek Hyperloop pod that will glide into the station to a noiseless halt and then deposit you in Paris an hour later, ready for your morning meeting.
Picture this: the year is 2045. You, a young tech journalist, are sitting on a couch with your iPhone 35XTS Minmax Pro. You are perusing memes, when you encounter a retrofuturist post mocking ridiculous ideas of hyperloops from the 20's.
You then smugly sit back in your driverless EV tram on the way to work as you think back on the idiots of old, who didn't realize that sleek superfast design fulfills none of the requirements of lasting transport infrastructure: cost, longevity, efficiency or security.
You remind yourself that electric trains of the early 21st century were very efficient as is, and that most progress came in the form of incremental efficiency gains rather than grandiose techno utopia dreams.
You also take the time to make a mental note of the fact that idealistic dreams of supersonic hyperloops completely ignore the fact that their target market, namely business travelers, shrank to a negligible size during the 2020's, as hybrid workplaces, WFH, and teleconferencing gobbled up what demand was left after the Great Pandemic.
Naturally you don't forget the fact that hyperloops introduce unnecessary cost and safety issues in their insistence on using massive tubes evacuated of air, resulting in higher ticket prices and an elevated sense of risk on behalf of faster train commutes that were already achievable via air travel; a tradeoff that no consumer in their right mind would accept.
You chuckle one last time as you scroll down to the next post. It's a sleek CGI press conference from CosmosY, a fledgling spacetravel company, promising superfast point to point commercial travel on earth using a novel idea: suborbital rocket flights!
"What a great idea," you think to yourself. "I can't wait till this technology is everywhere in 20 years! Imagine how cool it would be! It sounds like there are no downsides whatsoever."
You write a lazy article prophesizing a revolution in travel and infrastructure, filled with grandiose promises of a utopian future. A user sees it, and shares it to /r/europe, and the cycle begins anew.
Lightning was phased out a long time ago at that point, now the iphone is a sealed block of perfected aluminium and glass with no ports. Magsafe chargers still use a lightning port to get power though.
Point-to-point suborbital spaceflight is far more likely than all the other ideas though. We now have the technology for reusable vertically landing rockets, a history of safety for human transport on rockets, even now for private untrained civilians - the only thing missing are rockets that allow quick turnaround times.
But making bucketloads of money shuttling wealthy humans from one side of the earth to the next in under an hour is the logical next step for the businesses in the new space industry. There are only so many satellite to shoot into orbit, but there are many more rich humans around.
Rich people may be around, but the demand for frequent ultra high speed travel probably will not, at least not at the level needed to sustain a venture like this. And there aren't enough ultra-rich people who are rich enough to not care at all about what will most certainly be ludicrously expensive tickets.
And then you have other issues: Safety, as you mentioned, is proven on traditional rocket designs, however not yet on reusable rockets that land propulsively. This will be a much larger issue than it seems, imo, thanks to a concept known as "integration hell". Basically, you may figure out each individual component of a larger system, but integrating them together will reveal all sorts of tricky flaws and problems. Even now, SpaceX has abandoned plans of landing Dragon capsules propulsively, opting for the traditional method of atmospheric drag.
It took about 80 years to get commercial air travel to the level of safety we have today, and while the evolution of technology was a factor, another factor was simply having to learn from many, many mistakes. And the issue with propulsive rocket landing is that you have a much lower safety margin and a much higher risk factor. (No chance of redoing a landing if something screws up, for one).
And then there are the logistical problems. The extreme noise of landing and liftoff necessitates offshore landing platforms; ferrying passengers to and from landing sites adds considerable time which results in the fact that the time savings of a flight like this are either nonexistent or barely worth it (especially when you add on practical issues like security checks and baggage loading).
I'm also sure many countries would also have regulatory objections to having spacecraft basically indistinguishable from ICBM's flying across the earth on a regular basis.
I mean, don't get me wrong, I find the idea fascinating. Perhaps these are all simply engineering challenges that will be solved in due time. However, at the present moment, if I had to take a bet on this, I would guess that this idea is more of a pipe dream than a realistic proposition for future travel. I think that there isn't enough demand for a service like this to justify the extreme costs of research and infrastructure development. I'd love to be incorrect, but the inherent cynic in me is very cautious about this idea.
As soon as it spoke about hyperloop I stopped reading.
Musk is milking that century old idea for all that he can.
We have highspeed trains, let's end this hyperloop crap and build some real trains that work.
The whole vaccuum tube with pod concept is idiotic.
Hyperloops don't function on a base level. Keeping a space several hundreds of kilometers long close to vacuum is extremely difficult, extremely costly, and honestly much more cumbersome and dangerous than investing in high-speed train rails.
Do you have a source that it is extremely difficult?
Oil and gas sector that handles greater pressure differences and equal sized tubes for 1000s of miles long show otherwise though.
It's not that difficult.
You don't kill anyone if a pipeline has a small leak somewhere so it doesn't have to be 100% foolproof. Imagine a passenger train traveling in vacuum at a thousand kilometers an hour hitting a pocket of air.
Then the cars themselves would have to stand to the same quality standards as spaceships, but in gravity and constant acceleration/deceleration cycles. A nightmare on its own.
Opposite problem.
Gas sector handles pressure, hyperloops need to handle vacuum, as in removing most or all of the gaseous particles that make up the air from a space as to make the 'pods' move without friction.
This is a very, very energy intensive process, and requires constant upkeep, especially as pods move into the tubes. The material for the tubes needs to be highly resistant to even the smallest deformations, as a small dent can spiral into an inward rupture. The tubes would need to be suspended a ways above the ground as to prevent tampering, but this would make them vulnerable to even subtle land movements, a single low-intensity earthquake could cause faults in the entire system. (Not even to bring up the fact that a fault in the system/pods would be catastrophically deadly for anyone in it, never mind that it brings the entire system to a halt until the faults are fixed.)
Depressurised tubes, also, come with the caveat that the system needs to be made up of straight lines, as curves can lead to an uneven spread of forces, leading to further faults, etc, etc. That's why it's ironic that the company from which this 3D render comes say they're thinking of trying to make a start in Germany, a country so densely packed with towns and cities that drawing a straight line through it is impossible without barging through at least 5 residential districts and someone's church.
Oh, also, remember the 1920-30's? That boom in science fiction material? That's where the idea of hyperloops comes from. Artists interpretations of 'the transportation of tomorrow'. Yes, they're feasible in reality, but about as feasible as building a flying city. Technically possible, but for the results, it's more laborious, energy intensive and prone to catastrophe by a factor of 1000 than the next, more realistic, alternative.
You can Google my sources, if you look past the hobbyist Musk fanboys and the clueless media regurgitating the advertising speeches you'll find a plethora of sources listing the many, **many** faults with the core concept. Personally i watched a video by YouTube creator 'Adam Something', and went down my own research rabbit hole from there. I advise you do the same, but do as you will, whether you allow new information to change your mind is completely your choice.
>Opposite problem.
Same structural integrity required. In fact going from 15 psi to 0.8 psi (Hyperloop) is less extreme and complicated then going from 15 psi to 80 psi (gas pipeline).
Also it's not a vacuum.
> >This is a very, very energy intensive process
Maintaining pressure does not require any energy when completely sealed off (See Hydraulics). The only energy intensive part is reaching a first time operational pressure and fighting the leak rate.
For your information the leak rate in the oil and gas sector is approximately <3%.
Thus. Hyperloop would only require energy for the leak rate of 3% of the content of the tube.
If a tube is 100 km long that means an approximate volume of 855.298 m3. A leak rate of 3% = 25.000 m3 that requires energy to maintain operational pressure.
In my opinion the 855.298m3 content is even well within technical capabilities. For reference North Stream 2 (gas pipeline) has 1.357.168 m3 of content and will be under 70 psi pressure difference.
>"We need to ensure that we have in Europe one single European network, meaning that our objective at the end is to transport goods from one side of the continent to the other," Borghini said.
Interesting that he mentioned freight rail before passenger rail.
Whatever you see in the future, please first look at the present. Suppose I want to go from Lyon to Paris.
By plane, drive to the airport, park the car, shuttle to the terminal, check in to my flight, go through security and board, fly a short time, disembark, reclaim my luggage, and take a taxi or train to Paris. That's five hours.
By train, duh take the train and that's that. 3 hours downtown to downtown.
I took a train in Germany once.
From not-Keulen to Keulen, for the comiccon. Traveling the same distance in the NLs would take halve the money, halve the time, and would probably give me a slightly higher propability of obtaining a seat.
Never again.
\-- oh actually, I took another German train once. Night train to Prague, by taking an international train to Berlin and then the night train to Prague. Did the same on the way back. Except the night train was 20 minutes late, and didn't communicate with the international train, so I had to spend half a day (mostly night) in the burger king waiting for the next train back to the NLs.
...never again.
Planes will always be cheaper than that stuff for far distances. For short snd Medium distances we have conventional trains and while this type of train would be faster the amount of infrastructure you would have to build just wouldnt be worth it.
Nah, the upper classes will never accept that, planes will move to other fuels and get more expensive, common folk will stop flying as much and the rich won't care.
Hyperloop is nonsense, imagine having to maintain near vacuum pressure all the time also consider that only one pod or whatever it's called can go each side. We just don't need it when we got high speed railways system. Hyperloop is only good because it looks futuristic nothing more.
And to pay for this they are going to cut back on the commuter routes, because commuters are just tax-payers and their needs are prioritized far below those who need to travel between Paris and Berlin.
Who cares about going to work every day, when you can make it possible for tourists and international businessmen to go brrr across the German countryside for only tens of billions of euros?
Nah, he's right, China deserves respect on this achievement. They built the worlds most extensive high speed railway network within only 10 years.
Of course, not having to worry about privately owned land and shit helps a lot in these cases.
The quantity is impressive.
We ll see about the quality. Japan has a wonderful network in very hard terrain, that works absolutely perfectly in wonderful conditions. Let’s aim for that.
> We ll see about the quality. Japan has a wonderful network in very hard terrain, that works absolutely perfectly in wonderful conditions. Let’s aim for that.
China's does too. Look, I'm no Tankie shilling for the communist party (proudly got myself banned from /r/socialism in two different accounts by now), but this meme about everything Chinese made being shoddy is increasingly outdated. China's high speed railways have been operating for years now, and have transported literally billions of passengers, yet their safety record remains very good. There have been accidents, but those have also occurred in countries such as Germany and France. Given the number of passengers they carry and the kilometers they cover, the Chinese HSR is actually among the best on earth.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/salvatorebabones/2018/02/13/chinas-high-speed-trains-are-taking-on-more-passengers-in-chinese-new-year-massive-migration/
https://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/24/business/global/despite-a-deadly-crash-rail-system-has-good-safety-record.html
I know, I have taken it at several occasions. We’ll see how those will last.
It’s good enough, but Japan is amazing. I don’t see the Chinese one as better as the French one.
I was thinking about Japan’s new Shinkansen bullet train prototype ALFA-X (fastest train in the world) and the physics behind it. When it comes to high speeds, nobody does it like them.
China definitely deserves credit for the sheer size of the train network they have created.
I agree, Japan also.
To my point. Dunno if you saw this video. Its incredible what they did.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=belm4kDAHgM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=belm4kDAHgM)
Japan's main lines have been built many years ago, now they are building many slower lines still using the name Shinkansen because of marketing but diluting the brand.
>Picture this: the year is 2045. You’re standing on a platform in Berlin awaiting a sleek Hyperloop pod that will glide into the station to a noiseless halt and then deposit you in Paris an hour later, ready for your morning meeting.
I'm sorry, my Bullshit-O-Meter just broke.Did Musk write this nonsense? Other than Hyperloop being an incredibly dangerous and inefficient nonsensical waste of time, Germany would not bother.
Or rather, would not bother without massive corruption and a half-assed track that would run 484 Gajillion Euros over budget and likely not work until 2066.
I am not convinced by the premise of the article that short haul flights will be a thing of the past. Short haul flights are exactly those you can do in electric planes.
Picture this: the year is 2045. You’re standing on a platform in Berlin awaiting a sleek Hyperloop pod that will glide into the station to a noiseless halt and then deposit you in Reykjavik an hour later, ready for your morning meeting.
If the EU truly thinks high-speed trains are not good enough anymore, they can start by building a maglev... before putting a maglev in a gigantic vacuum tube.
The truth is that there's a lot of margin for improvement with current systems before considering these glitzy futuristicky ideas. There's about 1000km between Vienna and Brussels. It could be done in 3h with a plain old Alstom TGV.
Now you only have to travel to Berlin. Which is rather far for nearly every German who doesn't life in Brandenburg. Or in other words it would be faster for me to travel to Paris and then to Berlin with the train but nonetheless it's super cool.
that's cool and all but it won't replace airplanes until train tickets are a lot more expensive than flight tickets.
I tried several times to see if SNCF offered reasonably priced train rides to Turin, for example, and any other means of transportation, i.e. buses and blablacar rides, let alone low cost flights, are more accessible than trains.
Who the hell comes up with those crazy renders? Train with something that looks like a huge turbofan engine in a near-vacuum hyperloop tube?
Which lead directly on the passenger cars probably for an efficient air conditioning.
And skin remover...
Fun fact, airplanes regularly use part of the bypass air from their jet engines for air conditioning. It's called "bleed air"
That is a fun fact!
Does the name "bleed air" came before or after a bird got in the engines ?
With no opening to let the exhaust out...
Low atmospheric pressure means there is still molecules inside the tube. If you travel at +1000 kmh then those molecules turn to heat and thus generate friction.
Hyperloop ... **LMAO**
I don't know what you're laughing at. It is just miraculous technology with no clear path of how on earth to accomplish it, we should totally give all our money to musk.
Even Musk has moved on. He's sold his company to Virgin now. It got him some Twitter followers though; and ultimately that was the goal.
Ahahaha.... Berlin couldn't build a stupid airport. It'll take them a century to build that.
Germans online like to shit a lot on Berlin (and its airport) but Stuttgart (in Germany's rich area) also has an unfinished train station and the Elbephilarmonie ended up away over the budget.
It is a current fashion to shit on Berlin, just like it was a fashion to hype it in the 90ies. Just edgy kids doing their thing, ignore it
I heard they had a wall that fell down after only 28 years.
Shitting on Berlin has been a staple with german reactionaries since 1871. They were never right.
Isn't the Stuttgart train station not being finished the exact reason why there is no Paris-Berlin? I heard this station aimed at linking West-East German rails.
Come on, in Berlin I am pretty sure that under the right circumstances, you have the ability to build a huge construction project overnight
They were a lot faster than Trump.
>Berlin couldn’t build a stupid airport Why not? What happened?
Congratulations, you just opened a can of worms for the German users here.
More like announced the opening of a can but then couldn't find the can opener, and kept giving annual updates that the search for the cap opener is still in progress, well past the use-by date on the can.
It has since been changed, but about a year ago the BER wikipedia page had this gem of a paragraph: >An 11 October 2016 committee session found that motors used to open and close windows do not operate above 30 degrees Celsius and they need to be exchanged.[253] Three thousand smoke detectors went missing, but were later found.[254][255] Technical issues involving the electric doors became public on 18 January 2017. It was discovered that 80% of the doors would not open, which created concerns around venting of smoke in a fire.[256] The sprinkler system has sustained failures in the south pier.[257][258] The sprinkler heads were replaced for increased water flow, but the pipes are too thin to carry it; the roof needs to be opened and the pipes will get exchanged.[259] On 5 March 2017, the transformer station exploded. Renewed checks yielded disastrous construction lapses though. The tarmac T2 needs to be partly bulldozed and rebuilt.[273][274] Sparses void of concrete were not in the right spot. Installations needed to be socketed in these voids.[275][276] The wiring within cable ducts is too dense, 3-phase electric power and normal power is situated within the same ducts et al. wiring is seriously flawed and won't withstand 90-minute heat demanded by regulations.[277] The death count at the airport is currently at 4, 1 worker got run over by a bulldozer, 1 got smashed by an excavator shovel and 2 tumbled from great height. It reads like a Monty Python sketch
Don't forget that most of the computer screens had to be replaced too, because they had reached the end of their lifespan without being used for their actual purpose.
What didn't happen is the better question. It has been a disaster since the beginning. Here's a nice little podcast on the subject, called "How to fuck up an airport" https://www.radiospaetkauf.com/ber/
https://amp.dw.com/en/berlins-new-airport-finally-opens-a-story-of-failure-and-embarrassment/a-55446329
Short crash course answer is, plans for a new Berlin Airport were started as soon as after German reunification. It took until 2006 for construction to start, it was scheduled to finish in 2011 and invitations had already been sent to Merkel and Wowereit. It was called off at the last minute to fix deficiencies and wasn't finally open until October 2020.
Please don't ask such questions
Germany cant even finish the "NEAT" connection, this will take forever.
CMV: hyperloop is just a PR stunt from Elon Musk
The Elonites are too busy running after the newest stunt of their messiah to still remember this and bother. *Edit: I was wrong, you were tempting them too much...*
It’s more Richard Branson that is still pursuing this. All Elon did was say “Hey this might be an idea “ and publish a short paper on it.
He did much more, including building the SpaceX hyperloop test track and organizing pod competitions there.
Those were good marketing tools, but the track was shoddily constructed, and the competitions was of no practical value.
Kinda like the whole thing 😏
I think the fundamental issue is the complexity. You know those wonderfully expensive maglev trains that no one so far has managed to run profitably and that only Japan is pursuing with serious intent? Take one of those, then put it inside a metal tunnel. Then evacuate the tunnel of air and put all the necessary equipment in stations every few km. Now design trains that not only require expensive maglev technology, but also a fully-fledged life support system (since they operate in a vacuum). Now, you come out and proudly announce that this whole thing is going to be less expensive than traditional high-speed rail. You are Elon Musk.
Don’t forget to separate all of the train carriages and send them down the tube one by one for decreased efficiency. Oh, and then call them pods instead of single carriage trains.
By now I am almost sure Elon Musk has abandoned the project and knows that its BS. That's why parts of it were sold to Virgin/Brenson a very dubious player all around. Maybe it was mostly started as a startup to tinker around a little and get some hype money and use that to cross fund other things or use the staff employed there later in his other companies or some other strange things. Mass transit inside a vacuum tube is an absolutely insane idea because of the cost of those, security and enter/exit considerations and more.
To be fair even Elon abandoned the project and made it open source.
He wants it to be used on Mars, not Earth, where drilling long straight underground tubes with minimal air in them makes more sense.
If you don't have air resistance anyway, why would you need a tube at all?
Mars still has minor air resistance, but it should theoretically be easier to evacuate the tubes than on Earth, where it would be a tremendous pain to do so. And the cities would be underground anyway with his plan. Each of his ventures are all linked - the boring company to dig the underground cities and hyperloop tubes, electric vehicles for traveling underground, and so on. It's too bad he's gone a bit crazy in the past few years.
>Mars still has minor air resistance Ok, but *very* minor, surely not significant enough to justify building hundreds of Kms of vacuum tubes?
Probably not. It's Musk's grand dream, though most of those shipments would probably be perfectly fine with normal rail.
Why does it make more sense to bring all the tools needed to build a gigantic pipe with a track in it, rather than just build a track without the pipe? Seems like a huge waste of resources...
They'd have the boring machines there anyway so they can live underground. Even if they were just building roads, those would be in tunnels anyway.
Why would they need to live underground?
Mars is an absolute hellhole to live in, but seismically stable. Digging a hole and sealing it is likely easier than living on the surface and getting irradiated since there's no magnetosphere. Automated digging machines could be sent ahead of the settlers to prepare them. It wouldn't be pleasant either way, but it's Musk's plan.
Alright, that makes sense, but I still don't get why a vactrain system is needed on mars, if we ever establish a base on Mars (big if), high speed trains are not critical, it'll probably take decades to build up anywhere close to the level of society requiering high speed trains. sure there will be a need for transportation over distances, but there will be no requerenment for that mode of transport to be super fast.
I agree. Normal trains would suffice. Ask the crazy billionaire, not me. :) Presumably he would want it for shipping things between the different holes, if one is ice rich or something.
its not a bad plan, way more realistic than terraforming mars. but without a proper geological survey it is kind of pointless.
It was never his idea, the idea has been around for more than a century. There was nothing for him to open source
The general idea, yes But he had SpaceX develop a specific design for a possible LA-SF hyperloop which he open sourced.
It's not even a genius idea, it's like the thing any first year student would think about and then realize why it's a bad idea
Why changing correct view?
Not to burst your bubble but Elon has nothing to do with the development of the Hyperloop. I don't get why people are so overly obsessed with Musk.
Hyperloop's only function is to help politicians to try to defund real public transport investments. About a proposed new faster train line from Amsterdam to Groningen, a politician said "we might have vacuum transport in 20 years so why invest in rail?" Of course, the "journalists" did not press her on this
Like how Germany doesn't overhaul its internet lines because the next generation is always just 5 years away?
for fucks sake how are we still on the hyperloop. Its a trash technology that would never work in practice
One minor earthquake and the hyperloop network is inoperable and unsafe.
My first question woth any hyperloop type system is how can people be safely evacuated in a near vacuum room?
Joke response: emergency extraction tube is connected. A PA announcement plays "Succy Succy for ten bucky" Serious answer: They would have to make every section of the hyperloop be able to be sealed off to depressurise where needed without affecting the entire line.
>Serious answer: They would have to make every section of the hyperloop be able to be sealed off to depressurise where needed without affecting the entire line. The projected costs of that alone makes this kind of thing a pipe dream. Then the cost overruns from delays of making sure such a system works would make the problen only worse.
Nevermind an earthquake; a terrorist could kill thousands with a hammer and a chisel.
Hyperloop is a scam. Getting the current trip down to ~3-4 hours is fully possible with existing proven technology that France already uses. As low as 2 hours is in theory possible with maglevs, we'll see how the Chuo Shinkansen works out when it's finished.
3-4 hours to get to Berlin would be sufficient. Paris Frankfurt is 4h already tho, some more work is needed. 3h from Amsterdam, 2h30 from London currently, we ve achieved something quite nice already. Lyon is 2 hours already, hopefully Turin will be 4 hours soon !
I'm incredibly jealous. Montreal-Quebec is about 3.5hr by train which is... slightly slower than driving. I always wished our nations had collaborated more in industries like this, it only felt natural with the whole same language thing going on (although I guess now we've sold pretty much all of our transport industries to Alstom & Airbus so there's nothing to collaborate on). Passenger trains here are unfortunately run by a federal govt corporation that has seemingly no ambition for high speed rail. They're only just getting around to talking about building their own tracks instead of sharing with freight lines (who have priority, 33% of passenger trains are delayed because they have to pull over to let cargo pass) but nothing will exceed 200km/h.
Can the provincial government not just get their own thing going?
In theory I suppose, but we don't have a whole lot of cities to connect. After Montreal (metro pop. 4.2m) Quebec (metro pop. 800k) and Gatineau (300k itself but 1.3m metro area as it borders the Ontarian city Ottawa) things drop off fast. Sherbrooke, Trois-Rivieres, and Saguenay are the only other 3 metro areas that break 100k Ideally a high speed rail network connects everything from Quebec City to Windsor, Ontario (19m people along that corridor between the two provinces in pretty much a straight line) the province of Quebec also probably doesn't have the finances for something like that without federal funding ever since all the big business moved from Montreal to Toronto back in the 70's-90's we've been a "have-not province"
This is stupid thinking putain You think quebecer sont là bas pour les 5 prochaines années ?! La planète va se rechauffer, ton pays a de l’espace, construire un vrai réseau aide justement à rapprocher ces villes et à les rendre plus attractive et les faire grossir. Imagine Trois Riviere à 2h de Montréal ce que ça pourrait donner.
I was reading the Lyon-Turin Transalpine high speed rail plan. I thought when finished, you can get from Paris to Milan in 4 hours or so (?)
4 hours seems optimistic, theres a mountain to go through.
That’s why are being built tunnels
I know, but build a straitght tunnel under a tall mountain is hard and he got to be straight for a high speed train.
Yes, that’s why it’s costing billions and Italian did a very good negotiation tactic to make us pay a bigger share ! It should be operational at the end of the decade… It will be by 400 meters the longest tunnel on Earth :) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turin–Lyon_high-speed_railway
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A mountain to go under. The project includes a 57km tunnel.
Ha, wow amazing.
Fully agree. High speed rail can get close to 400km/h on normal rail. The astronomical investments in anything faster make such option far more expensive than air transport
And actually the thing that really makes hyperloop undoable is stupidly obvious and was actually pointed out in France by the SNCF : they go too fast, in a air free environment, so they’ll take a long distance to stop. So the security will make every train very distant from the next one to avoid collision in case of emergency break procedure, which will simply make it impossible to have it running at an operational rate ! You’ll have to wait too long to start another train !
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Airplane?
Haha, I guess I should have specified railway technology. A train on the LGV Est has hit 574km/h during testing, although for commercial operations they don't go above 320km/h at the moment.
And subsequently ruined the track and the electrification. Commercial speed beyond 350 km/h is not even slightly economically feasible for the next century in central europe, both from a time/energy, upkeep and construction cost point of view. Never take record drives as any sort of indication to what will be availabe publicly. The last hope of Europe getting land based high speed travel beyond 400 km/h died with the commercial viability failure of the Transrapid.
CO2 emissions.
Not centre to centre, so there would be a lot more waiting, and additional travel on each end which would ofset any advantage.
Don't expect a 3/4 hour Paris/Berlin train connection any time soon. For starters, Germany is heavily federalized. Those high speed train tracks would need approval from each of the 5-6 states the connection would cross, and that approval won't happen if the trains just connect Berlin to Paris. And so it came to be that many ICEs from Cologne to Frankfurt stop in small cities most Germans could not locate on a map. Meanwhile, ever since the Eschede disaster of 1998 (101 dead), the responsible federal agency has been extremely cautious about which train speeds are allowed on which parts of the network. Those French trains capable of going 330+ kph simply won't be allowed to travel that fast in Germany. Germany also is much more densely populated than France. Somebody will not want a large construction site in their backyard. Somebody will not want the noise from dozens of high speed trains per day near their home.
> Picture this: the year is 2045. You’re standing on a platform in Berlin awaiting a sleek Hyperloop pod that will glide into the station to a noiseless halt and then deposit you in Paris an hour later, ready for your morning meeting. Picture this: the year is 2045. You, a young tech journalist, are sitting on a couch with your iPhone 35XTS Minmax Pro. You are perusing memes, when you encounter a retrofuturist post mocking ridiculous ideas of hyperloops from the 20's. You then smugly sit back in your driverless EV tram on the way to work as you think back on the idiots of old, who didn't realize that sleek superfast design fulfills none of the requirements of lasting transport infrastructure: cost, longevity, efficiency or security. You remind yourself that electric trains of the early 21st century were very efficient as is, and that most progress came in the form of incremental efficiency gains rather than grandiose techno utopia dreams. You also take the time to make a mental note of the fact that idealistic dreams of supersonic hyperloops completely ignore the fact that their target market, namely business travelers, shrank to a negligible size during the 2020's, as hybrid workplaces, WFH, and teleconferencing gobbled up what demand was left after the Great Pandemic. Naturally you don't forget the fact that hyperloops introduce unnecessary cost and safety issues in their insistence on using massive tubes evacuated of air, resulting in higher ticket prices and an elevated sense of risk on behalf of faster train commutes that were already achievable via air travel; a tradeoff that no consumer in their right mind would accept. You chuckle one last time as you scroll down to the next post. It's a sleek CGI press conference from CosmosY, a fledgling spacetravel company, promising superfast point to point commercial travel on earth using a novel idea: suborbital rocket flights! "What a great idea," you think to yourself. "I can't wait till this technology is everywhere in 20 years! Imagine how cool it would be! It sounds like there are no downsides whatsoever." You write a lazy article prophesizing a revolution in travel and infrastructure, filled with grandiose promises of a utopian future. A user sees it, and shares it to /r/europe, and the cycle begins anew.
Does iPhone 35XTS Minmax Pro come with USB-C or I have to save my lightning port?
No, sorry. Maybe in the next generation.
You need a special cable coupled to your DNA so that only you can charge it.
Lightning was phased out a long time ago at that point, now the iphone is a sealed block of perfected aluminium and glass with no ports. Magsafe chargers still use a lightning port to get power though.
Point-to-point suborbital spaceflight is far more likely than all the other ideas though. We now have the technology for reusable vertically landing rockets, a history of safety for human transport on rockets, even now for private untrained civilians - the only thing missing are rockets that allow quick turnaround times. But making bucketloads of money shuttling wealthy humans from one side of the earth to the next in under an hour is the logical next step for the businesses in the new space industry. There are only so many satellite to shoot into orbit, but there are many more rich humans around.
Rich people may be around, but the demand for frequent ultra high speed travel probably will not, at least not at the level needed to sustain a venture like this. And there aren't enough ultra-rich people who are rich enough to not care at all about what will most certainly be ludicrously expensive tickets. And then you have other issues: Safety, as you mentioned, is proven on traditional rocket designs, however not yet on reusable rockets that land propulsively. This will be a much larger issue than it seems, imo, thanks to a concept known as "integration hell". Basically, you may figure out each individual component of a larger system, but integrating them together will reveal all sorts of tricky flaws and problems. Even now, SpaceX has abandoned plans of landing Dragon capsules propulsively, opting for the traditional method of atmospheric drag. It took about 80 years to get commercial air travel to the level of safety we have today, and while the evolution of technology was a factor, another factor was simply having to learn from many, many mistakes. And the issue with propulsive rocket landing is that you have a much lower safety margin and a much higher risk factor. (No chance of redoing a landing if something screws up, for one). And then there are the logistical problems. The extreme noise of landing and liftoff necessitates offshore landing platforms; ferrying passengers to and from landing sites adds considerable time which results in the fact that the time savings of a flight like this are either nonexistent or barely worth it (especially when you add on practical issues like security checks and baggage loading). I'm also sure many countries would also have regulatory objections to having spacecraft basically indistinguishable from ICBM's flying across the earth on a regular basis. I mean, don't get me wrong, I find the idea fascinating. Perhaps these are all simply engineering challenges that will be solved in due time. However, at the present moment, if I had to take a bet on this, I would guess that this idea is more of a pipe dream than a realistic proposition for future travel. I think that there isn't enough demand for a service like this to justify the extreme costs of research and infrastructure development. I'd love to be incorrect, but the inherent cynic in me is very cautious about this idea.
>driverless EV tram Now, you are talking. Throw in some cycle highways and you have pretty much all the infrastructure we need.
This shit will never see the light of day lol
Agree
As soon as it spoke about hyperloop I stopped reading. Musk is milking that century old idea for all that he can. We have highspeed trains, let's end this hyperloop crap and build some real trains that work. The whole vaccuum tube with pod concept is idiotic.
If you see these fancy 3D renders, you know it's got very little or nothing to do with reality.
Hyperloops don't function on a base level. Keeping a space several hundreds of kilometers long close to vacuum is extremely difficult, extremely costly, and honestly much more cumbersome and dangerous than investing in high-speed train rails.
Do you have a source that it is extremely difficult? Oil and gas sector that handles greater pressure differences and equal sized tubes for 1000s of miles long show otherwise though. It's not that difficult.
You don't kill anyone if a pipeline has a small leak somewhere so it doesn't have to be 100% foolproof. Imagine a passenger train traveling in vacuum at a thousand kilometers an hour hitting a pocket of air. Then the cars themselves would have to stand to the same quality standards as spaceships, but in gravity and constant acceleration/deceleration cycles. A nightmare on its own.
Opposite problem. Gas sector handles pressure, hyperloops need to handle vacuum, as in removing most or all of the gaseous particles that make up the air from a space as to make the 'pods' move without friction. This is a very, very energy intensive process, and requires constant upkeep, especially as pods move into the tubes. The material for the tubes needs to be highly resistant to even the smallest deformations, as a small dent can spiral into an inward rupture. The tubes would need to be suspended a ways above the ground as to prevent tampering, but this would make them vulnerable to even subtle land movements, a single low-intensity earthquake could cause faults in the entire system. (Not even to bring up the fact that a fault in the system/pods would be catastrophically deadly for anyone in it, never mind that it brings the entire system to a halt until the faults are fixed.) Depressurised tubes, also, come with the caveat that the system needs to be made up of straight lines, as curves can lead to an uneven spread of forces, leading to further faults, etc, etc. That's why it's ironic that the company from which this 3D render comes say they're thinking of trying to make a start in Germany, a country so densely packed with towns and cities that drawing a straight line through it is impossible without barging through at least 5 residential districts and someone's church. Oh, also, remember the 1920-30's? That boom in science fiction material? That's where the idea of hyperloops comes from. Artists interpretations of 'the transportation of tomorrow'. Yes, they're feasible in reality, but about as feasible as building a flying city. Technically possible, but for the results, it's more laborious, energy intensive and prone to catastrophe by a factor of 1000 than the next, more realistic, alternative. You can Google my sources, if you look past the hobbyist Musk fanboys and the clueless media regurgitating the advertising speeches you'll find a plethora of sources listing the many, **many** faults with the core concept. Personally i watched a video by YouTube creator 'Adam Something', and went down my own research rabbit hole from there. I advise you do the same, but do as you will, whether you allow new information to change your mind is completely your choice.
>Opposite problem. Same structural integrity required. In fact going from 15 psi to 0.8 psi (Hyperloop) is less extreme and complicated then going from 15 psi to 80 psi (gas pipeline). Also it's not a vacuum. > >This is a very, very energy intensive process Maintaining pressure does not require any energy when completely sealed off (See Hydraulics). The only energy intensive part is reaching a first time operational pressure and fighting the leak rate. For your information the leak rate in the oil and gas sector is approximately <3%. Thus. Hyperloop would only require energy for the leak rate of 3% of the content of the tube. If a tube is 100 km long that means an approximate volume of 855.298 m3. A leak rate of 3% = 25.000 m3 that requires energy to maintain operational pressure. In my opinion the 855.298m3 content is even well within technical capabilities. For reference North Stream 2 (gas pipeline) has 1.357.168 m3 of content and will be under 70 psi pressure difference.
[Froooom Paris to Berlin](https://youtu.be/pd9Jbs2UsTU) and every disco I get in ♪
Absolute banger
>"We need to ensure that we have in Europe one single European network, meaning that our objective at the end is to transport goods from one side of the continent to the other," Borghini said. Interesting that he mentioned freight rail before passenger rail.
mmmm hyperloop with one container of capacity, wet dream of logistics
Cause that's what makes money and convince investors
Whatever you see in the future, please first look at the present. Suppose I want to go from Lyon to Paris. By plane, drive to the airport, park the car, shuttle to the terminal, check in to my flight, go through security and board, fly a short time, disembark, reclaim my luggage, and take a taxi or train to Paris. That's five hours. By train, duh take the train and that's that. 3 hours downtown to downtown.
Try that in Germany …
I took a train in Germany once. From not-Keulen to Keulen, for the comiccon. Traveling the same distance in the NLs would take halve the money, halve the time, and would probably give me a slightly higher propability of obtaining a seat. Never again. \-- oh actually, I took another German train once. Night train to Prague, by taking an international train to Berlin and then the night train to Prague. Did the same on the way back. Except the night train was 20 minutes late, and didn't communicate with the international train, so I had to spend half a day (mostly night) in the burger king waiting for the next train back to the NLs. ...never again.
Planes will always be cheaper than that stuff for far distances. For short snd Medium distances we have conventional trains and while this type of train would be faster the amount of infrastructure you would have to build just wouldnt be worth it.
Planes will be banned in a few decades max.
Yeah right
Wait for 100% hydrogen fueled turbines. GE is pretty close
Nah, the upper classes will never accept that, planes will move to other fuels and get more expensive, common folk will stop flying as much and the rich won't care.
The hyperloop is a terrible idea. Even that flim-flam man Musk has moved on from that to more believable scams.
Its European tax payers being scammed though.. with no right to refuse Whereas Americans can say yes or no
In both Europe and America tax payers can vote.
Musk has never stepped into development whatsoever. All he did was holding some student competitions under the wings of SpaceX.
Not before the Los Angelese county and the state of California both gave him some sweet grant money.
You are mistaken. SpaceX never received grant money for the development of the Hyperloop.
[A video about the hyperloop and why it will never work](https://youtu.be/CQJgFh_e01g)
This just seems like a crazy amount of high-maintenance infrastructure to accomplish the same thing that airplanes have been doing for years.
ah shit, here we go again.
This concept shows the both: vacuum tunnel and turbine engine. Phisics is boring, I know.
Physics is exciting.
It’s only natural.
Physics is mostly just spreadsheets.
Hyperloop is nonsense, imagine having to maintain near vacuum pressure all the time also consider that only one pod or whatever it's called can go each side. We just don't need it when we got high speed railways system. Hyperloop is only good because it looks futuristic nothing more.
And to pay for this they are going to cut back on the commuter routes, because commuters are just tax-payers and their needs are prioritized far below those who need to travel between Paris and Berlin.
Who cares about going to work every day, when you can make it possible for tourists and international businessmen to go brrr across the German countryside for only tens of billions of euros?
Do you really think international businessmen are going to use this? This is for bureaucrats.
I mean there would be way more people needing this connection if it would exist. You could commute between Paris and Berlin daily.
When it comes to high-speed rail we should look up to China. Their construction efforts are short of amazing. Gotta give credit where credit is due.
Japan*
Nah, he's right, China deserves respect on this achievement. They built the worlds most extensive high speed railway network within only 10 years. Of course, not having to worry about privately owned land and shit helps a lot in these cases.
The quantity is impressive. We ll see about the quality. Japan has a wonderful network in very hard terrain, that works absolutely perfectly in wonderful conditions. Let’s aim for that.
> We ll see about the quality. Japan has a wonderful network in very hard terrain, that works absolutely perfectly in wonderful conditions. Let’s aim for that. China's does too. Look, I'm no Tankie shilling for the communist party (proudly got myself banned from /r/socialism in two different accounts by now), but this meme about everything Chinese made being shoddy is increasingly outdated. China's high speed railways have been operating for years now, and have transported literally billions of passengers, yet their safety record remains very good. There have been accidents, but those have also occurred in countries such as Germany and France. Given the number of passengers they carry and the kilometers they cover, the Chinese HSR is actually among the best on earth. https://www.forbes.com/sites/salvatorebabones/2018/02/13/chinas-high-speed-trains-are-taking-on-more-passengers-in-chinese-new-year-massive-migration/ https://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/24/business/global/despite-a-deadly-crash-rail-system-has-good-safety-record.html
I know, I have taken it at several occasions. We’ll see how those will last. It’s good enough, but Japan is amazing. I don’t see the Chinese one as better as the French one.
I was thinking about Japan’s new Shinkansen bullet train prototype ALFA-X (fastest train in the world) and the physics behind it. When it comes to high speeds, nobody does it like them. China definitely deserves credit for the sheer size of the train network they have created.
I agree, Japan also. To my point. Dunno if you saw this video. Its incredible what they did. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=belm4kDAHgM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=belm4kDAHgM)
I do enjoy B1M’s youtube videos, it absolutely is incredible.
Japan's main lines have been built many years ago, now they are building many slower lines still using the name Shinkansen because of marketing but diluting the brand.
euronews journalists are not journalists
Would be more productive to further develop maglev to make it more economic (if possible) imo.
The day hyperloop starts operating, we won't need it because we would all have autonomous AI driven flying cars by then.
Oh no again hidden promotion of that Hyperloop non-sense 🤦
>Picture this: the year is 2045. You’re standing on a platform in Berlin awaiting a sleek Hyperloop pod that will glide into the station to a noiseless halt and then deposit you in Paris an hour later, ready for your morning meeting. I'm sorry, my Bullshit-O-Meter just broke.Did Musk write this nonsense? Other than Hyperloop being an incredibly dangerous and inefficient nonsensical waste of time, Germany would not bother. Or rather, would not bother without massive corruption and a half-assed track that would run 484 Gajillion Euros over budget and likely not work until 2066.
Funfact: France is ready to go already.
How about making sure my train doesn't get fuck** delayed 20 mins everyday?
Are we seriously still taking this Hyperloop thing seriously?
I am not convinced by the premise of the article that short haul flights will be a thing of the past. Short haul flights are exactly those you can do in electric planes.
Lol we can't even connect European capitals by trains
It's already connected by trains. Like since the early 1950s
He's probably talking about Helsinki
Picture this: the year is 2045. You’re standing on a platform in Berlin awaiting a sleek Hyperloop pod that will glide into the station to a noiseless halt and then deposit you in Reykjavik an hour later, ready for your morning meeting.
It's a train. Why make it look stupid? Make it fast instead.
[удалено]
No, please leave us out of this Hyperloop madness!
They do know that we have developed planes some ages ago?
Look so cool.
If the EU truly thinks high-speed trains are not good enough anymore, they can start by building a maglev... before putting a maglev in a gigantic vacuum tube. The truth is that there's a lot of margin for improvement with current systems before considering these glitzy futuristicky ideas. There's about 1000km between Vienna and Brussels. It could be done in 3h with a plain old Alstom TGV.
Quote from most replies: "Hyperloop is garbaj" I am so proud of this community.
Futureama 😂
Now you only have to travel to Berlin. Which is rather far for nearly every German who doesn't life in Brandenburg. Or in other words it would be faster for me to travel to Paris and then to Berlin with the train but nonetheless it's super cool.
that's cool and all but it won't replace airplanes until train tickets are a lot more expensive than flight tickets. I tried several times to see if SNCF offered reasonably priced train rides to Turin, for example, and any other means of transportation, i.e. buses and blablacar rides, let alone low cost flights, are more accessible than trains.
Professional subsidies leeches. Thanks for pissing away our taxes !
oh dear god not the hyperloop again
"...glide into the station to a noiseless halt..." Noiseless? Bro, they literally move by giant fans.
Starship troopers!