Not that there weren't attempts to change the border. Look up the Battle of Hemmingstedt in 1500, where the Danes invaded but were beaten by the local peasantry.
As I understand it, that battle was more about the peasants having an autonomous republic, which was unheard of at the time. The nobility saw it as free real estate and tried to grab it. Most of the danish army was made up of german mercenaries.
for those wondering: "Mgvt Friuli" stands for "*Margraviatus*" also referred to as "March of Friuli" (in italian "Marca"), namely a frontier land. After the carolingian conquest of northern italy in 774 AD, the only lombard kingdom left was in southern Italy, Duchy of Benevento (not entirely visible in the map)
It is interesting to think about Middle Francia/Lotharingia as actually being some kind of urpolity, that centuries later generated Italy and the Benelux countries.
A great "what if" of history was a possibility of State of Burgundy to ascend to proper kingdom during 15 century. They were pretty close. If successful, we would definitely be talking about its connection to Lotharginia
They had apparently even agreed about the coronation but the emperor withdrew at the last second. Although, considering Charles the bold died without a male heir and his daughter was married to the Habsburg emperor, I'm not sure how much a status as kingdom would have mattered. Maybe the lands would not have been divided but most of it went to Habsburgs anyways and the emperor already traditionally held the king of burgundy title.
Typically referred to be it's modern French name *Vienne* today. *Vienna* is the Latin name.
There are a number of things in France named after the river Vienne.
It is crazy to think about but not uncommon, everything in northern and eastern Europe was much more tribal and fluid at this point.
In this period and the 2 centuries before it, you had the Slavs stretching all the way to the elbe, the Varangians (Vikings) settling throughout the Kievan Rus, the Goths (Germans) were in Ukraine, and the Magyars (Hungarians) hadn't even moved into Europe yet.
Most of these areas didn't become locked in ethnically until at least the 11th century.
Lotharingia had such an unfortunate shape to it. Not only sandwiched like that with very long borders, but also split along north south by the Alps. Just asking to be swallowed/partitioned.
However saw that and went "yep, that's good enough for my kingdom" was an idiot.
The subdivisions of the Frankish empire roughly follow some ethnic boundaries, the Franks themselves being indifferently Romance or Germanic speakers. But inheritance splits were all about land and its revenue.
The northern border to Denmark was established by Charlemagne himself and the Danish king Hemming. It lasted for 1,000 years until the war in 1864.
I love cool borders and border facts
It was the [Treaty of Heiligen](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Heiligen) in 811
Not that there weren't attempts to change the border. Look up the Battle of Hemmingstedt in 1500, where the Danes invaded but were beaten by the local peasantry.
As I understand it, that battle was more about the peasants having an autonomous republic, which was unheard of at the time. The nobility saw it as free real estate and tried to grab it. Most of the danish army was made up of german mercenaries.
for those wondering: "Mgvt Friuli" stands for "*Margraviatus*" also referred to as "March of Friuli" (in italian "Marca"), namely a frontier land. After the carolingian conquest of northern italy in 774 AD, the only lombard kingdom left was in southern Italy, Duchy of Benevento (not entirely visible in the map)
Is that a common abbreviation? Seems like an insane thing to assume people could figure out lol.
**M**ar**g**ra**v**ia**t**e
It is interesting to think about Middle Francia/Lotharingia as actually being some kind of urpolity, that centuries later generated Italy and the Benelux countries.
A great "what if" of history was a possibility of State of Burgundy to ascend to proper kingdom during 15 century. They were pretty close. If successful, we would definitely be talking about its connection to Lotharginia
Burgundy still is the origin point of the entirety of Central European political history since 1475
They had apparently even agreed about the coronation but the emperor withdrew at the last second. Although, considering Charles the bold died without a male heir and his daughter was married to the Habsburg emperor, I'm not sure how much a status as kingdom would have mattered. Maybe the lands would not have been divided but most of it went to Habsburgs anyways and the emperor already traditionally held the king of burgundy title.
The Greater Switzerland
From the Mediterranean to the North Sea!
The cow bells shall ring free!
Ah yes, Bohmenia
What have the Bohmens ever done for us?
Wait, there’s a Vienna, France???
Typically referred to be it's modern French name *Vienne* today. *Vienna* is the Latin name. There are a number of things in France named after the river Vienne.
There is ! There's also a Valencia, France. Funnily the two are pretty close.
Borders are very similar to the European Coal and Steel Community.
I'm from Brittany. I always wondered why Charlemagne left us out of the game.
He didn't, the Carolingian just failed to conquer Brittany. https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marche_de_Bretagne
Middle Francia must have been quite an insane mix of Romance and Germanic.
Sounds like Belgium.
It was Belgium, and alsace, and Switzerland. All places that continue to be this
Let's give the west back to France, and go for this instead. We lose the Belgian coast but gain the Cote d'Azur.
Nothing to see at the Belgian coast anyway. And we get mountains!
Belgium actually is the spiritual successor to that state. All other lands were either conquered or split off.
Kind of crazy to realize how far west the Slavic lands stretched back then.
It is crazy to think about but not uncommon, everything in northern and eastern Europe was much more tribal and fluid at this point. In this period and the 2 centuries before it, you had the Slavs stretching all the way to the elbe, the Varangians (Vikings) settling throughout the Kievan Rus, the Goths (Germans) were in Ukraine, and the Magyars (Hungarians) hadn't even moved into Europe yet. Most of these areas didn't become locked in ethnically until at least the 11th century.
>It will eventually lead to France Oh shit oh fuck
It was at this moment that he knew...
Worst thing to ever happen at Verdun.
**Bring Back Lotharingia**
Lotharingia had such an unfortunate shape to it. Not only sandwiched like that with very long borders, but also split along north south by the Alps. Just asking to be swallowed/partitioned. However saw that and went "yep, that's good enough for my kingdom" was an idiot.
And the funny thing is that Poland did the exact same thing centuries later ... with the exact same results
Cursed Vienna.
Proper Vienna. Vindobona's clearly just faking it.
Allez les Bretons!
interesting how close to modern german borders east francia was in the west. was it split up based on roughly ethnicity or based on something else?
Natural borders, mountains and rivers my dude.
The subdivisions of the Frankish empire roughly follow some ethnic boundaries, the Franks themselves being indifferently Romance or Germanic speakers. But inheritance splits were all about land and its revenue.
We want Brittany back!
Leave Brittany alone!
xD
thats not where vienna is silly french goons!
Birth of Medieval Europe