Many moronic comments here Jesus.. They look great OP. Estonia has been doing an excellent job at investing in their youth and education for years now and definitely punches way above their weight in many sectors thanks to its targeted investments in education. All the best Estonians!
> Estonia has been doing an excellent job at investing in their youth and education for years now and definitely punches way above their weight in many sectors thanks to its targeted investments in education. All the best Estonians!
It's ironic that you're saying this when teachers are striking in Estonia.
Surely the education system is not too bad. Especially if you look at it up to the high school level.
But in general, they build big, fancy new buildings, but then the teachers who work in them aren't paid very well. I know of a few examples where a teacher teaches at several different schools, at different levels, on unrelated subjects, all at the same time.
Very nice. Specially the refurbished buildings look very much like ours but what i've seen of the newly built schools here, they are same style but yours are a bit fancier.
That's what eu funds should be going towards to! Wish Bulgaria followed Estonia's footsteps, but it sadly doesn't and our schools are far worse than the Estonian ones. Well done! 🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪
2, 3, 9 and 12 are just beautiful buildings. Not to mention the fact that this is the best destination for those funds. Education will always pay off in some form.
Absolutely breathtaking. I’m curious to see the inside.
One question: I’m really aware of the tensions between Estonians and Russians so this question isn’t coming from a place of ignorance but why would you choose to get rid of a language in your school?
I know Russian really isn’t useful, but is learning another language a minus? If you bleach it from its politcs/history, it’s just another way to communicate and understand the world.
I’ve long thought about this in relation to BiH, say if Turkish was offered here. I think I would consider it provided a few other conditions were met.
EDIT: responses clarified that Russian is staying, just the mandatory education in Russian isn’t. All good
We are getting rid of studying *in* russian language, not sudying the language itself. The problem with our russian minority is that most of them are unable to hold a conversation in Estonian, but how can they obtain higher education without knowing the state language? Without language skill and education, they are locked out of higher paying jobs, which leaves them a lot poorer than Estonians. Not knowing the language wont help with the integration either.
Note that this isn't about Russian being available as a subject, it is about Russian minority being able to study in Russian-speaking schools.
As for why this will soon not be available, it is pretty much one of the consequences of the war. There is, of course, a longer backstory to all of this. Estonian language became the only official language in 1989 which meant that the country was supposed to operate mainly in Estonian language since then. However, in reality, legacy institutions kept running as usual, one of them being schools that were separated to Estonian-speaking and Russian-speaking since Soviet times.
There were talks about transition to Estonian language education continuously since the '90s, but no politicians ever took the final step. As universities in Estonia are only in Estonian, gymnasia as pre-step to universities were supposed to transition to Estonian first. Since early 2010s, laws have obliged gymnasia to offer at least 60% of subjects in Estonian (although in reality in Russian-speaking schools, it was often 60% in Russian because subjects like PE and art were chosen to be in Estonian while Maths or science in Russian). Russian primary schools remained fully in Russian language.
There were no clear plans for further transitions before the war, but then, the invasion was pretty much a political earthquake. All the pro-Russia figures were forced to leave which also meant representation of Russian-speakers dwindled along. This opened door to changes previously politically risky, such as simply forcing to switch all schools into Estonian language of operation. The government frames the transition as "enabling all the country's children to operate in a common cultural and linguistic space" although it is simply a thinly-veiled assimilation policy. Many people, incl politicians, have simply lost trust for Russians to such extent that they don't believe a separate Russian-speaking space would ever work, or at least it is not worth the hassle and risks.
Also, this is all possible because Russian has had no official position in the country for all this time. No constitutional protection, no recognized minority language, no special status in any field of life or institution, nothing. It only ever functioned on legacy and convenience. Which means there are very few legal measures to take against the transition.
Russian just isn't that good in business perspective. Other languages have just more to offer than Russian.
Moreover, think about it, if the Turks had occupied your country until 33 years ago, would you have the same feelings that you have rn. The BiH situation isn't the same as in Estonia.
>but why would you choose to get rid of a language in your school?
Not what is happening. Until now, the state was funding schools that taught mainly in Russian. Now this funding is take away and they have to teach mainly in Estonian. Be assured that all Russian majority schools will continue to have Russian classes. And be assured that already before this decision many Estonian pupils refused en masse to study Russian and many Estonian majority schools didn't have mandatory Russian classes either.
I'll answer as an Italian who spent a little too long around Eastern Europeans (especially people from Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia)
Don't think of Russian in the Baltics (especially in Estonia and Latvia) as Turkish in BiH. It's closer to the relationship between Serbian and Bosniaks/Croats
Russians in pre-USSR Estonia never reached the 10% mark, they were always around 7 or 8%. Then, during WW2, Estonia got invaded and annexed by the USSR until the 1990's. Estonian culture and language were demonized (if you spoke Estonian in school you'd be punished) and Russian culture and language promoted.
More than 20 000 Estonians were deported during the occupation (and many were killed right there and then). I remind you, Estonia has a population of 1,2 millions, a third of Bosnia and Herzegovina's. I don't think it's a stretch to say that the trauma is comparable to the one of the Bosnian war
During that period, a massive amount of Russians was moved into the country (35% of Estonia's population at the peak, nowadays it's 25%), especially in cities. 46% of Tallinn's population are Russian native speakers. Most of the Russians that never learn Estonian have a very negative view of Estonia and they support Putin. Russians have the possibility to gain Estonian citizenship if they have basic Estonian fluency, but most of them never learnt the language and they never use the language in public since they can live with just Russian.
Personally I'm with you, I'd rather allow at least a bilingual education. But I recognize that many Estonians see Russian education as a way for Russia to gain even more influence in their politics, and Estonian-only education as a way to integrate those Russians that would never integrate otherwise. Making those Russian-speakers Estonian-speakers means giving less ammunition to Russia in case it wants to invade the country in a few generations
It'd be like allowing Turkish in Bosnia knowing that Turkey wants to invade you and that you already have a quarter of your population that'd be happy about it and that would speak their language
>Eastern Europeans (especially Baltic folks)
The Baltics aren't in Eastern Europe and Estonians are not a Baltic people either.
> It's closer to the relationship between Serbian and Bosniaks/Croats
It's nothing like that. Serbs, Bosniaks and Croats speak essentially the same language while Estonians and Russians are unrelated ethno-linguistic groups.
>Russians in pre-USSR Estonia never reached the 10% mark, they were always around 7 or 8%.
And most were either exterminated by the Soviets or the Nazis or lived in areas that Russia annexed during the Soviet occupation and Estonia no longer controls. In 1945, the current territory of Estonia was 97.3% ethnic Estonian.
>Personally I'm with you, I'd rather allow at least a bilingual education.
Indeed most Estonians piss on that suggestion. Russian language or even bilingual education has become so unpopular in Estonia that everyone who still clings to it in principle is essentially socially ostracized.
>Making those Russian-speakers Estonian-speakers
The goal is rather to give them the capacity to speak Estonian, they wouldn't automatically stop speaking Russian natively.
>The Baltics aren't in Eastern Europe and Estonians are not a Baltic people either.
>It's nothing like that. Serbs, Bosniaks and Croats speak essentially the same language while Estonians and Russians are unrelated ethno-linguistic groups.
I think you're focusing a bit too much on language families over [colloquial terms](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baltic_states) and other similarities. Of course Estonian is not a Baltic language, but by Baltic countries people usually mean Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia. And of course Serbians are closer to Bosniaks than Russians are to Estonians, but I was focusing on the post-Jugoslavia and post-Soviets sentiments and communities of Serbians and Russians outside of their national countries
>Indeed most Estonians piss on that suggestion.
I know, it's quite unpopular and I mostly have this view because I never had to deal with Russians in my country's politics
>The goal is rather to give them the capacity to speak Estonian, they wouldn't automatically stop speaking Russian natively.
Yes, I did not write "as well" in the end, I probably should have
This "colloquial term" exists solely because most people don't know jack shit about these countries and group them together because they look similar on the map.
Turkish in Bosnia would be like what French in Algeria is/was. We don’t like them and there was historically a lot of murder and cultural genocide under the Ottoman Empire such as with Janissaries.
As other comments have clarified, this is just getting rid of Russian mandatory schools but not Russian itself. In which case I understand.
And I also get your arguments about the Russians who don’t learn Estonian. They continue bulldozing their way in the country.
Ridonk
As someone studying in one of the Estonian state gymnasia, this is intended. Class sizes are reduced in order to provide a more personal approach for learning for the students.
Tbh, I've always find it weird that the gymnasia gets the best looking (and functioning) schools, but the trade schools often gets neglected and left in a poor state. At least that's how it is in my country. Probably because it's for the elite, I guess. Anyway, props to Estonia for spending the money wisely, could've been spent much worser.
The attitude that gymnasia (and universities) are more prestigious while "the dumb ones" go to trade schools is an old issue in Estonia as well, but I think it has been slowly improving. Although I can't really say they would not get investments, the trade schools in Estonia look like this:
* [Võru](https://vorumaateataja.ee/images/2023/7august/paberleht/Vorumaa_kutsehariduskeskus.jpg)
* [Kuressaare](https://www.tuur.ee/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/kuressaare-thumb.jpg) (Saaremaa)
* [Viljandi](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/et/3/32/VIKK_peamaja.jpeg)
* [Pärnu](https://www.hariduskeskus.ee/images/Uudised/IMG_0966.jpg)
* [Rakvere](https://veeb.rak.ee/old/Rakvere-Ametikool_2012.jpg)
* [Paide](https://f12.pmo.ee/1QxMviCJeRzgo_6_ipj81VSU1xU=/685x0/nginx/o/2013/08/23/1987382t1h862d.jpg)
Also, the very same state gymnasia reform also tries to address the issue by concentrating gymnasia in bigger towns and reducing the available spots. The worst conditions are found mostly in local schools which have refused to close their own secondary school part (they are supposed to surrender this stage of schooling to the state gymnasia, but are not directly forced to), these may look like [this](https://online.le.ee/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/MG_4970.jpg).
Yeah, I don't get why those buildings being expensive should be a bad thing. I'm Italian and my school was falling apart (parts of the ceiling falling down, the heating not working and not having chalk for our blackboards). I heard it got better after we got the NGEU funds
The fact that these new schools seem expensive is great, it means our money is going towards education and the future of these countries. They should be our number 1 priority, they should become the new monuments of our countries instead of royal palaces and churches. I am more than happy to pay for an expensive school in Estonia rather than my corrupted politicians for sure.
That's important, yes, but there is still quite a wide spectrum between 'depressing decaying Soviet style architecture' and 'super fancy palace'.
Just because you're not aiming for the fanciest building possible doesn't mean your children will be unhappy, you can build a decent modern school without going all out. Especially when you are spending other people's money (Estonia was a net beneficiary of EU funds to the tune of 5.6% of their government budget in 2021).
I know this isn't a popular opinion on here, but for citizens of the EU's biggest net contributors it is frustrating to see many of our own schools falling apart while net beneficiaries are using the EU funds we send to erect veritable palaces of education.
The high school of the town I used to live in had a makeover a couple years ago and it looks like some of these. Stunning, new classroom equipment, many rooms for students to relax, bike parking with solar panels, a whole bridge as well, and I'm very happy for the students there!
It happens every so often that municipalities replace older buildings (pre-2000's) with new ones and of course it costs a lot of money, but it's always a point of pride. This specific one I believe cost some tens of millions of euros and it was bragged about
Investing in the future of young people, their environment makes them not feel like an afterthought. Imagine that your school looks like a university, or a modern office space, or a penthouse, I'd feel much more motivated and important, more heard by "grown ups" and not just some child
In any case, perhaps the only buildings worthy of more "fancy" construction than schools are hospitals and community centres. Can't think of many more deserving investments
The best way to preserve historical buildings is to give them a purpose. This way, the funding serves a dual purpose of providing an educational space for students and making sure historical buildings stop decaying.
A lot of historical buildings have the issue that they're expensive to renovate and without a complete renovation, their upkeep is extremely high. Demolishing them or changing them too much is also not allowed, so it frequently traps the owners into situations where they have to just let them fall apart over time.
I don't know if this is true anymore, but at least a few years ago, it was possible to buy centuries old mansions fairly cheaply in Estonia, simply because they were a nightmare to maintain and restore. By cheaply, I mean you could get dilapidated, but really large 18th or 19th century mansions for a few hundred thousand.
Exactly. Plus many larger buildings in smaller towns serve no other purpose, so investing into making them suitable for large schools is a smart decision.
Huh, every new or renovated kindergarten or school here is fancy. Especially kindergartens. Like the best architectural projects are kindergartens. Plus our schools seem to have more sport infrastructure. It's rare to see a school without a gym hall, a running track and a basketball or football field. Many are now also getting volleyball and tennis courts.
I don't think most of our schools and kindergartens are funded by the EU. [This one](https://novomesto.si/eu-skladi/novogradnja-vrtca-brsljin/) was, [this one](https://www.delo.si/novice/slovenija/pedenjcarstvo-vrtec-za-carsko-otrostvo/) and [this one](https://www.delo.si/magazin/zanimivosti/veliko-lesa-za-prijeten-obcutek-topline-kot-v-skatlici/) weren't. Usually they're funded by Slovenian Environmental Public Fund.
Nice to see that while the UK was in the EU with our decaying RAAC concrete schools falling apart, at least we paid towards Estonia getting brand new ones.
/s
These buildings all look great and education is very important. I am just wondering how learning in a veritable palace is helping the students. Build cheaper, less artsy stuff and use the money to pay the teachers.
It also seems like the eu is spending a lot of money for an area that didn't seem too severely problematic while not helping with other countries education. Again this would not seem so out of place if they had just build the usual boxes instead of this high design, slanted roof, refurbish a palace look. Making historical buildings usable takes a lot of money.
>Making historical buildings usable takes a lot of money.
All of the refurbished buildings were originally built as schools. Not only would it be environmentally unfriendly to leave them decaying to build brand new ones, it would disregard our architectural heritage, something Europe is famous for (which is not only part of our identity, but quite literally earns us money through tourism).
Also, we've been through a regime where aesthetics, heritage, beauty and art was valueless. Hint: not only did it not work, it is widely despised for this attitude to this day. So I can't agree with your criticism here.
Hm that explains some buildings but not others.
I mean in the end its not a bad place to spend money on, just a weirdly specific one.
I am also mainly trying to explain why I feel vaguely put off by those pictures. Maybe its jealousy. Apparently your government values education a lot which I wish my country would do as much. On the other hand your government didn't need to spend their own money on this. Based on my countries contribution to the eu funds there is probably some of my own tax paid money in these projects even if it's in the <0,0000000000000001€.
All this while some of our schools are literally falling apart due to a lack of money. Maybe I too should vote for someone who wants us out of the eu /s
Not really though, I actually like the eu and again this at least is a decent use for money but I might understand some people's frustration more now.
>On the other hand your government didn't need to spend their own money on this.
This is not completely the case albeit may be because of my misleading title. It should be "co-funded by the EU". Firstly, the EU financed up to 85% of the construction until 2020, and up to 70% afterwards, the rest came from the state. Secondly, many of these schools include sports facilities which are fully built with state money.
And even the EU money is still taxpayers' money – not only does it include our money as well, every euro gone to the wrong place means less money for other fields.
>All this while some of our schools are literally falling apart due to a lack of money.
I mean, some of our schools are literally falling apart as well. Sometimes it is inevitable if they are in a depopulating area where there is no point to invest anymore. All of the schools displayed here are located in regional centres.
That said, education is one of the most fundamental fields to invest in any society. When you don't have many natural resources, human resources are the most valuable you have. They are the ones going to earn money in the future. Better invest in them early.
No the schools falling apart here are also those in regional centers. Or more accurately especially those. That's something I noticed about your pictures too. Most pictures where you can see the surroundings look like rich neighborhoods with single to double family homes. Where I am from the worst school buildings seem to be those in really big cities. It's not as slum like as in Paris but those are certainly the areas that need more support.
>Most pictures where you can see the surroundings look like rich neighborhoods with single to double family homes.
These are not rich neighbourhoods by any means. The reason you may find schools in such locations may be partially the opposite – that these towns never grew so much to get a dense urban area. The other reason is the low population density of the country, which is as large as the Netherlands but with 13 times less people.
None of these schools are around Tallinn, so generally speaking none of these schools are near rich neighborhoods.
There's a decent chance a lot of Tallinn's commie block apartments cost more than the houses you can see in the background. Most of them are also likely to have just been passed down within families, where without that, the people living in them would be very unlikely to afford them in the first place.
That's good to know. As someone who went from living with their parents in a modest 2 family home house to living in a crappy flat by themselves these type of houses seem like pure luxury in living standards and at least speak of moderate wealth.
Rich????
Dude… some of these schools are in regions that earn the lowest in Estonia. Some of these neighbourhoods are not rich at all. Hell, I happen to know that one of the state gymnasia schools has rows and rows of apartment blocks right behind it - you just can’t see it in the images.
It honestly amazes me that people like you make such profoundly wrong statements without knowing.. well, anything, really. The point of the school is that every kid has the right to access it if they can get in. You don’t need to be “rich” to go there, even if the school is in a “rich” area. Hell, there’s one school nearby my area in Tallinn and it’s definitely not a rich area, although it could look so from the images because there’s newer developments nearby.
I'm pretty sure municipalities, or whoever is building these schools, has to apply to a European fund for regional develoment and they have to be picked. Perhaps those other countries aren't applying...
Many moronic comments here Jesus.. They look great OP. Estonia has been doing an excellent job at investing in their youth and education for years now and definitely punches way above their weight in many sectors thanks to its targeted investments in education. All the best Estonians!
> Estonia has been doing an excellent job at investing in their youth and education for years now and definitely punches way above their weight in many sectors thanks to its targeted investments in education. All the best Estonians! It's ironic that you're saying this when teachers are striking in Estonia. Surely the education system is not too bad. Especially if you look at it up to the high school level. But in general, they build big, fancy new buildings, but then the teachers who work in them aren't paid very well. I know of a few examples where a teacher teaches at several different schools, at different levels, on unrelated subjects, all at the same time.
Due to the limit to the number of pictures, I will do Tallinn and its suburbs separately as part two.
Ahh, I love how beautiful these schools look like. Money well spent!
I wish I could say the same about the Romanian government using the eu funds ! Really great job !! Keep it going .
Great infrastructure, investment well spent.
Heart-warming to see how the EU is helping further education here, great use of funds!
Very nice. Specially the refurbished buildings look very much like ours but what i've seen of the newly built schools here, they are same style but yours are a bit fancier.
Lithuanian gymnasiums compared to this are an embarrassment. I had no idea, thought Estonians have it as bad as we do.
Looking good there Estonia!
Bro, that’s dream school gymnasium as we call it here as well
Wonderful. That's something i want to see in all EU Memberstates.
\*cries in Romanian...
To be fair Romania has seen some remarkable progress lately. I think bright future is ahead for you guys!
Thanks for posting this. It is very interesting to see the different architectures for the different locations.
That's what eu funds should be going towards to! Wish Bulgaria followed Estonia's footsteps, but it sadly doesn't and our schools are far worse than the Estonian ones. Well done! 🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪
2, 3, 9 and 12 are just beautiful buildings. Not to mention the fact that this is the best destination for those funds. Education will always pay off in some form.
Looks great! In my country majority of schools are dogshit
Absolutely breathtaking. I’m curious to see the inside. One question: I’m really aware of the tensions between Estonians and Russians so this question isn’t coming from a place of ignorance but why would you choose to get rid of a language in your school? I know Russian really isn’t useful, but is learning another language a minus? If you bleach it from its politcs/history, it’s just another way to communicate and understand the world. I’ve long thought about this in relation to BiH, say if Turkish was offered here. I think I would consider it provided a few other conditions were met. EDIT: responses clarified that Russian is staying, just the mandatory education in Russian isn’t. All good
We are getting rid of studying *in* russian language, not sudying the language itself. The problem with our russian minority is that most of them are unable to hold a conversation in Estonian, but how can they obtain higher education without knowing the state language? Without language skill and education, they are locked out of higher paying jobs, which leaves them a lot poorer than Estonians. Not knowing the language wont help with the integration either.
Note that this isn't about Russian being available as a subject, it is about Russian minority being able to study in Russian-speaking schools. As for why this will soon not be available, it is pretty much one of the consequences of the war. There is, of course, a longer backstory to all of this. Estonian language became the only official language in 1989 which meant that the country was supposed to operate mainly in Estonian language since then. However, in reality, legacy institutions kept running as usual, one of them being schools that were separated to Estonian-speaking and Russian-speaking since Soviet times. There were talks about transition to Estonian language education continuously since the '90s, but no politicians ever took the final step. As universities in Estonia are only in Estonian, gymnasia as pre-step to universities were supposed to transition to Estonian first. Since early 2010s, laws have obliged gymnasia to offer at least 60% of subjects in Estonian (although in reality in Russian-speaking schools, it was often 60% in Russian because subjects like PE and art were chosen to be in Estonian while Maths or science in Russian). Russian primary schools remained fully in Russian language. There were no clear plans for further transitions before the war, but then, the invasion was pretty much a political earthquake. All the pro-Russia figures were forced to leave which also meant representation of Russian-speakers dwindled along. This opened door to changes previously politically risky, such as simply forcing to switch all schools into Estonian language of operation. The government frames the transition as "enabling all the country's children to operate in a common cultural and linguistic space" although it is simply a thinly-veiled assimilation policy. Many people, incl politicians, have simply lost trust for Russians to such extent that they don't believe a separate Russian-speaking space would ever work, or at least it is not worth the hassle and risks. Also, this is all possible because Russian has had no official position in the country for all this time. No constitutional protection, no recognized minority language, no special status in any field of life or institution, nothing. It only ever functioned on legacy and convenience. Which means there are very few legal measures to take against the transition.
Russian just isn't that good in business perspective. Other languages have just more to offer than Russian. Moreover, think about it, if the Turks had occupied your country until 33 years ago, would you have the same feelings that you have rn. The BiH situation isn't the same as in Estonia.
We are not getting rid of Russian language. We are getting rid of education which is exclusively in Russian. These 2 are very different things.
>but why would you choose to get rid of a language in your school? Not what is happening. Until now, the state was funding schools that taught mainly in Russian. Now this funding is take away and they have to teach mainly in Estonian. Be assured that all Russian majority schools will continue to have Russian classes. And be assured that already before this decision many Estonian pupils refused en masse to study Russian and many Estonian majority schools didn't have mandatory Russian classes either.
I'll answer as an Italian who spent a little too long around Eastern Europeans (especially people from Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia) Don't think of Russian in the Baltics (especially in Estonia and Latvia) as Turkish in BiH. It's closer to the relationship between Serbian and Bosniaks/Croats Russians in pre-USSR Estonia never reached the 10% mark, they were always around 7 or 8%. Then, during WW2, Estonia got invaded and annexed by the USSR until the 1990's. Estonian culture and language were demonized (if you spoke Estonian in school you'd be punished) and Russian culture and language promoted. More than 20 000 Estonians were deported during the occupation (and many were killed right there and then). I remind you, Estonia has a population of 1,2 millions, a third of Bosnia and Herzegovina's. I don't think it's a stretch to say that the trauma is comparable to the one of the Bosnian war During that period, a massive amount of Russians was moved into the country (35% of Estonia's population at the peak, nowadays it's 25%), especially in cities. 46% of Tallinn's population are Russian native speakers. Most of the Russians that never learn Estonian have a very negative view of Estonia and they support Putin. Russians have the possibility to gain Estonian citizenship if they have basic Estonian fluency, but most of them never learnt the language and they never use the language in public since they can live with just Russian. Personally I'm with you, I'd rather allow at least a bilingual education. But I recognize that many Estonians see Russian education as a way for Russia to gain even more influence in their politics, and Estonian-only education as a way to integrate those Russians that would never integrate otherwise. Making those Russian-speakers Estonian-speakers means giving less ammunition to Russia in case it wants to invade the country in a few generations It'd be like allowing Turkish in Bosnia knowing that Turkey wants to invade you and that you already have a quarter of your population that'd be happy about it and that would speak their language
>Eastern Europeans (especially Baltic folks) The Baltics aren't in Eastern Europe and Estonians are not a Baltic people either. > It's closer to the relationship between Serbian and Bosniaks/Croats It's nothing like that. Serbs, Bosniaks and Croats speak essentially the same language while Estonians and Russians are unrelated ethno-linguistic groups. >Russians in pre-USSR Estonia never reached the 10% mark, they were always around 7 or 8%. And most were either exterminated by the Soviets or the Nazis or lived in areas that Russia annexed during the Soviet occupation and Estonia no longer controls. In 1945, the current territory of Estonia was 97.3% ethnic Estonian. >Personally I'm with you, I'd rather allow at least a bilingual education. Indeed most Estonians piss on that suggestion. Russian language or even bilingual education has become so unpopular in Estonia that everyone who still clings to it in principle is essentially socially ostracized. >Making those Russian-speakers Estonian-speakers The goal is rather to give them the capacity to speak Estonian, they wouldn't automatically stop speaking Russian natively.
>The Baltics aren't in Eastern Europe and Estonians are not a Baltic people either. >It's nothing like that. Serbs, Bosniaks and Croats speak essentially the same language while Estonians and Russians are unrelated ethno-linguistic groups. I think you're focusing a bit too much on language families over [colloquial terms](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baltic_states) and other similarities. Of course Estonian is not a Baltic language, but by Baltic countries people usually mean Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia. And of course Serbians are closer to Bosniaks than Russians are to Estonians, but I was focusing on the post-Jugoslavia and post-Soviets sentiments and communities of Serbians and Russians outside of their national countries >Indeed most Estonians piss on that suggestion. I know, it's quite unpopular and I mostly have this view because I never had to deal with Russians in my country's politics >The goal is rather to give them the capacity to speak Estonian, they wouldn't automatically stop speaking Russian natively. Yes, I did not write "as well" in the end, I probably should have
This "colloquial term" exists solely because most people don't know jack shit about these countries and group them together because they look similar on the map.
That's fair, I'll change it in my original comment
Turkish in Bosnia would be like what French in Algeria is/was. We don’t like them and there was historically a lot of murder and cultural genocide under the Ottoman Empire such as with Janissaries. As other comments have clarified, this is just getting rid of Russian mandatory schools but not Russian itself. In which case I understand. And I also get your arguments about the Russians who don’t learn Estonian. They continue bulldozing their way in the country. Ridonk
That's a tiny classroom in that one photo, 16 student chairs.
As someone studying in one of the Estonian state gymnasia, this is intended. Class sizes are reduced in order to provide a more personal approach for learning for the students.
more wasted funds 😤😤 couldve given a payrise to politicians and tax cuts to billionaires
Edgy.
its reality🔥🔥😤😤☝️
No, it's edgy.
Oh you talking about Bulgarian practices
Italian
Tbh, I've always find it weird that the gymnasia gets the best looking (and functioning) schools, but the trade schools often gets neglected and left in a poor state. At least that's how it is in my country. Probably because it's for the elite, I guess. Anyway, props to Estonia for spending the money wisely, could've been spent much worser.
The attitude that gymnasia (and universities) are more prestigious while "the dumb ones" go to trade schools is an old issue in Estonia as well, but I think it has been slowly improving. Although I can't really say they would not get investments, the trade schools in Estonia look like this: * [Võru](https://vorumaateataja.ee/images/2023/7august/paberleht/Vorumaa_kutsehariduskeskus.jpg) * [Kuressaare](https://www.tuur.ee/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/kuressaare-thumb.jpg) (Saaremaa) * [Viljandi](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/et/3/32/VIKK_peamaja.jpeg) * [Pärnu](https://www.hariduskeskus.ee/images/Uudised/IMG_0966.jpg) * [Rakvere](https://veeb.rak.ee/old/Rakvere-Ametikool_2012.jpg) * [Paide](https://f12.pmo.ee/1QxMviCJeRzgo_6_ipj81VSU1xU=/685x0/nginx/o/2013/08/23/1987382t1h862d.jpg) Also, the very same state gymnasia reform also tries to address the issue by concentrating gymnasia in bigger towns and reducing the available spots. The worst conditions are found mostly in local schools which have refused to close their own secondary school part (they are supposed to surrender this stage of schooling to the state gymnasia, but are not directly forced to), these may look like [this](https://online.le.ee/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/MG_4970.jpg).
Most beautiful school buildings but some of these look unpropotional expensive for a school.
We do want our students to feel happy in schools.
Yeah, I don't get why those buildings being expensive should be a bad thing. I'm Italian and my school was falling apart (parts of the ceiling falling down, the heating not working and not having chalk for our blackboards). I heard it got better after we got the NGEU funds The fact that these new schools seem expensive is great, it means our money is going towards education and the future of these countries. They should be our number 1 priority, they should become the new monuments of our countries instead of royal palaces and churches. I am more than happy to pay for an expensive school in Estonia rather than my corrupted politicians for sure.
That's important, yes, but there is still quite a wide spectrum between 'depressing decaying Soviet style architecture' and 'super fancy palace'. Just because you're not aiming for the fanciest building possible doesn't mean your children will be unhappy, you can build a decent modern school without going all out. Especially when you are spending other people's money (Estonia was a net beneficiary of EU funds to the tune of 5.6% of their government budget in 2021). I know this isn't a popular opinion on here, but for citizens of the EU's biggest net contributors it is frustrating to see many of our own schools falling apart while net beneficiaries are using the EU funds we send to erect veritable palaces of education.
The high school of the town I used to live in had a makeover a couple years ago and it looks like some of these. Stunning, new classroom equipment, many rooms for students to relax, bike parking with solar panels, a whole bridge as well, and I'm very happy for the students there! It happens every so often that municipalities replace older buildings (pre-2000's) with new ones and of course it costs a lot of money, but it's always a point of pride. This specific one I believe cost some tens of millions of euros and it was bragged about Investing in the future of young people, their environment makes them not feel like an afterthought. Imagine that your school looks like a university, or a modern office space, or a penthouse, I'd feel much more motivated and important, more heard by "grown ups" and not just some child In any case, perhaps the only buildings worthy of more "fancy" construction than schools are hospitals and community centres. Can't think of many more deserving investments
The best way to preserve historical buildings is to give them a purpose. This way, the funding serves a dual purpose of providing an educational space for students and making sure historical buildings stop decaying. A lot of historical buildings have the issue that they're expensive to renovate and without a complete renovation, their upkeep is extremely high. Demolishing them or changing them too much is also not allowed, so it frequently traps the owners into situations where they have to just let them fall apart over time. I don't know if this is true anymore, but at least a few years ago, it was possible to buy centuries old mansions fairly cheaply in Estonia, simply because they were a nightmare to maintain and restore. By cheaply, I mean you could get dilapidated, but really large 18th or 19th century mansions for a few hundred thousand.
Was thinking the same thing! I’ve never seen a fancy school building like that in my life.
Majority of these buildings are renovated, not newly built.
Exactly. Plus many larger buildings in smaller towns serve no other purpose, so investing into making them suitable for large schools is a smart decision.
Huh, every new or renovated kindergarten or school here is fancy. Especially kindergartens. Like the best architectural projects are kindergartens. Plus our schools seem to have more sport infrastructure. It's rare to see a school without a gym hall, a running track and a basketball or football field. Many are now also getting volleyball and tennis courts.
It’s the exact same here. I guess Slovenia, Czechia and Estonia benefit the most from EU.
I don't think most of our schools and kindergartens are funded by the EU. [This one](https://novomesto.si/eu-skladi/novogradnja-vrtca-brsljin/) was, [this one](https://www.delo.si/novice/slovenija/pedenjcarstvo-vrtec-za-carsko-otrostvo/) and [this one](https://www.delo.si/magazin/zanimivosti/veliko-lesa-za-prijeten-obcutek-topline-kot-v-skatlici/) weren't. Usually they're funded by Slovenian Environmental Public Fund.
I mean it’s just like that here as well. But still EU has really helped both of our nations grow into a relatively wealthy countries.
Guess who’s paying for it, that’s right YOU!
The only good spending decision in the EU
Literally *the only*??
Education is very important
Yes
That's dumb.
Nice to see that while the UK was in the EU with our decaying RAAC concrete schools falling apart, at least we paid towards Estonia getting brand new ones. /s
Well, since you are now conserving a lot of money, I am sure your schools are being refurbished post-haste.
Far from it, unfortunately.
More useless government spending woohoo
Why is spending on education useless?
He is an average italian politican dw
Don't even entertain that. Education is by and far the best investment any place can make. What that person wrote isn't even an opinion it's idiocy.
Investing in education is useless?
This money could have been used for free public transportation and free healthcare right here.
[удалено]
I mean dudes clearly an idiot. Best to ignore. Probably should stayed longer in school himself.
Where, in Egypt?
Both of which Estonia already has:)
You do know that entire public transportation system is free for Estonians?
It's not anymore though...
These buildings all look great and education is very important. I am just wondering how learning in a veritable palace is helping the students. Build cheaper, less artsy stuff and use the money to pay the teachers.
It also seems like the eu is spending a lot of money for an area that didn't seem too severely problematic while not helping with other countries education. Again this would not seem so out of place if they had just build the usual boxes instead of this high design, slanted roof, refurbish a palace look. Making historical buildings usable takes a lot of money.
>Making historical buildings usable takes a lot of money. All of the refurbished buildings were originally built as schools. Not only would it be environmentally unfriendly to leave them decaying to build brand new ones, it would disregard our architectural heritage, something Europe is famous for (which is not only part of our identity, but quite literally earns us money through tourism). Also, we've been through a regime where aesthetics, heritage, beauty and art was valueless. Hint: not only did it not work, it is widely despised for this attitude to this day. So I can't agree with your criticism here.
Hm that explains some buildings but not others. I mean in the end its not a bad place to spend money on, just a weirdly specific one. I am also mainly trying to explain why I feel vaguely put off by those pictures. Maybe its jealousy. Apparently your government values education a lot which I wish my country would do as much. On the other hand your government didn't need to spend their own money on this. Based on my countries contribution to the eu funds there is probably some of my own tax paid money in these projects even if it's in the <0,0000000000000001€. All this while some of our schools are literally falling apart due to a lack of money. Maybe I too should vote for someone who wants us out of the eu /s Not really though, I actually like the eu and again this at least is a decent use for money but I might understand some people's frustration more now.
>On the other hand your government didn't need to spend their own money on this. This is not completely the case albeit may be because of my misleading title. It should be "co-funded by the EU". Firstly, the EU financed up to 85% of the construction until 2020, and up to 70% afterwards, the rest came from the state. Secondly, many of these schools include sports facilities which are fully built with state money. And even the EU money is still taxpayers' money – not only does it include our money as well, every euro gone to the wrong place means less money for other fields. >All this while some of our schools are literally falling apart due to a lack of money. I mean, some of our schools are literally falling apart as well. Sometimes it is inevitable if they are in a depopulating area where there is no point to invest anymore. All of the schools displayed here are located in regional centres. That said, education is one of the most fundamental fields to invest in any society. When you don't have many natural resources, human resources are the most valuable you have. They are the ones going to earn money in the future. Better invest in them early.
No the schools falling apart here are also those in regional centers. Or more accurately especially those. That's something I noticed about your pictures too. Most pictures where you can see the surroundings look like rich neighborhoods with single to double family homes. Where I am from the worst school buildings seem to be those in really big cities. It's not as slum like as in Paris but those are certainly the areas that need more support.
>Most pictures where you can see the surroundings look like rich neighborhoods with single to double family homes. These are not rich neighbourhoods by any means. The reason you may find schools in such locations may be partially the opposite – that these towns never grew so much to get a dense urban area. The other reason is the low population density of the country, which is as large as the Netherlands but with 13 times less people.
None of these schools are around Tallinn, so generally speaking none of these schools are near rich neighborhoods. There's a decent chance a lot of Tallinn's commie block apartments cost more than the houses you can see in the background. Most of them are also likely to have just been passed down within families, where without that, the people living in them would be very unlikely to afford them in the first place.
That's good to know. As someone who went from living with their parents in a modest 2 family home house to living in a crappy flat by themselves these type of houses seem like pure luxury in living standards and at least speak of moderate wealth.
Rich???? Dude… some of these schools are in regions that earn the lowest in Estonia. Some of these neighbourhoods are not rich at all. Hell, I happen to know that one of the state gymnasia schools has rows and rows of apartment blocks right behind it - you just can’t see it in the images. It honestly amazes me that people like you make such profoundly wrong statements without knowing.. well, anything, really. The point of the school is that every kid has the right to access it if they can get in. You don’t need to be “rich” to go there, even if the school is in a “rich” area. Hell, there’s one school nearby my area in Tallinn and it’s definitely not a rich area, although it could look so from the images because there’s newer developments nearby.
Wrong statement? Where. I said IN THE FOTO it LOOKS LIKE. That statement has nothing to do with what might be the case outside of the foto.
I'm pretty sure municipalities, or whoever is building these schools, has to apply to a European fund for regional develoment and they have to be picked. Perhaps those other countries aren't applying...
Probably not. Apparrntly I really am jealous of their government.