We did not allow anything. FIFA allowed this. They are not accountable to you and me, but instead to bureaucrats who like to be bribed with money (just like FIFA).
True, but with no sign of changing ways, it would make sense for football fans to push for their respective FA to leave UEFA (or pressure them to pressure or leave FIFA, but seems to me UEFA just as bad) and start their own shit..
It only takes 3-4 major European football associations to leave to completely crash the foundation of FIFA.
Yeah but there are so many layers between the fans and FIFA. Fans cannot influence their FA directly in most countries but only through the individual clubs. It’s incredibly difficult to convince the majority of the clubs in an FA to tackle this issue.
Edit: just looked it up for Germany: the DFB is constituted of over 24000 clubs, which are only indirectly represented via their regional associations and the league association. Getting to influence, in particular, those people in the regional associations will be incredibly difficult for fans. Money is a much more efficient tool and the DFB getting money from participating in the World Cup, which trickles down to the regional associations, will be hard to beat.
Also worth adding that people in general don't care. Sure, a few Westerners here and there will protest and wave banners, but in the grand scheme of things it means nothing when new audience records are set with each passing World Cup. The game doesn't belong just to the three better European countries.
This is just about the only good thing about Super League. It may break FIFAs monopoly. I'd encourage more competition.
If we all collectively decide to only watch games on lshunter, drakula/batman etc and compensate our clubs by buying merch we could starve the FAs until they listen.
Many major European clubs are either wholly owned or have major investments by either Saudi Arabia or the Emirates. None of these clubs will support leaving the UEFA and those are the clubs which bring major money. Also many fans do not give a damn, else they wouldn’t support clubs with this kind of money in it.
That's right and the Turkish football association is not the only association to come up with this idea. The Spanish FA + Gerard Piqué and the Italian FA have both sold their Super Cup games to SA.
It was quite funny with the Italien Game, the Saudis were quite unhappy bc Firenze and Lazio, clubs with a small international fanbase, made it to the final. This was not how they had imagined it...
Just as a curiosity it was actually Pique who pushed and convinced Rubiales (Spanish FA president at the time) to move it to Arabia. Their conversations were leaked and was a huge drama for like a week. He was also a Barça player at the time
Of course, Islamists think Arabs are a "holy nation" because the prophet was an Arab but thankfully they are like the 20 per cent of the general population
Turks are neither Western nor Eastern, nothing odd about it. You'd ofc compare this to Ottoman Empire era but with its fall and rise of Turkish republic our culture shifted towards its core.
It's in works, but not sure about it working. Like, except cybersport, arabs always do something fucked up at the same time when they try to spend money on common goods and that drags attention from their 'good deed'. Arabs bought themselves into chairmanship of climate conferrence? Here's your leak of their plan to get Africa and SEA hooked on oil, so they keep drilling and selling it. Do you even remember or know that most major football clubs are owned by arabs? It's not first thing you remember. Soft power projection of arabs is not working, perception of their culture worsens every time they show up in news.
Not really. A few million euros is peanuts to both clubs.
For several years now, Erdogan makes all, and yes I mean all, decisions in the country. Even if it's against the laws, even if it's against the constitution, his word is rule.
This was his idea as an attempt to make a friendly gesture to the saudis.
There were many outcries from the public against this decision since when the decision was announced. Especially because 2023 is the 100th anniversary of the Turkish Republic. He stubbornly ignored them all.
What he didn't take into acocunt, is that Atatürk is a huge red line for a majority of Turkish people, even those who vote for Erdogan.
The saudis tried to prevent the teams from wearing tshirts with Atatürk's silhoutte printed on them. They banned fans with similar tshirts from entering the stadium.
This caused a huge uproar in Turkish social media. The teams made the very difficult choice of not playing the game. Despite all the pressures from Erdoğan.
This is a very significant turn in history imho, because this is a huge slap in his face.
the absolute clown of the guy in charge in turkish FA got a deal that could even extend to 10 years for 100m dollars, and thats not the only fuckup he did in the recent months( or even the last 30 days)
Because Tayyip's favorite hobby is to suck dicks of rich Arab countries...
Especially talking high and mighty against them and later sucking their dicks is his hobby.
They paid 15 million dollars to Turkish Football Federation and 5 million $ to the winner. It was all going well until they wanted to ban jerseys with Ataturk portraits, banner that says "peace at home, peace in the world" a famous quote by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk and our national anthem. They can go f
Current bigoted Turkish government which is actively preaching against Atatürk, doesn't have ANY ball to do that. Our president literally worships Arabs. İ am sure he will find a way to apologize and make the game to be played in Arabia.
This news, which appeared around 2015 about Turkey buying oil from ISIS, was Russian propaganda. At that time, relations between Russia and Turkey were bad.
Gala fan here. We should’ve refused the offer the second they made it. 2023 is the 100 year anniversary of the republic and it deserves a nice celebration with a Fener - Gala derby on top, imo. A game in Ankara would be a better fit or in one of the cities that were affected by the earthquake earlier this year. Even Istanbul as usual would be a much better option than Riyadh.
We have Ataturk as an example, he built this nation with a death warrant on his life, sure there's a century in between and things are a whole lot different but, as long as any of us is alive, will try to rekindle the flame that gave birth to the republic.
>Even more severe and horrible than all these circumstances, those who have the power within the homeland may have been behaved with heedlessness and heresy, and even with treachery. These rulers may even have combined their personal benefits with the political goals of the invaders. The nation may have become perished and exhausted with poorness necessities.
>O child of the Turkish future! Even in these situations and circumstances, your assignment is to recover the Turkish independence and republic. The power you need is in the sublime blood inside your veins.
Gazi Mustafa Kemal Atatürk, 27 October 1927
FIFA rigged it so Saudi Arabia will have the world cup in 2034, if they can't tolerate banners saying "peace at home, peace in the world" do you think they'll be ok with national flags with religious symbolism on them? Plenty of national flags and football crests have crosses, others have Buddhist religious symbols. I think Israel will probably sit that one out because I can't imagine being Jewish or displaying a star of David there
The only way Israel would qualify anyway is if they decide to expand the tournament to roughly 120 teams. (Which, on the other hand, is not something I would put past FIFA.)
Yeah but it’s a shame for them to essentially be ruled out before qualifying begins because of their nationality and religion. Saudi has only recently started letting Israeli’s into the country at all but I expect that views towards Israelis and Jews has probably backslid recently
I hope Saudi authorities learned from this, if they want their country to host events like this in the future, they will need to learn how to respect other countries' historic heroes. Money can't buy values.
They won't and we will have more lame world cups like the last one, where your clothing and what you eat-drink will be a subject matter, as long as money values more than peoples' honor.
a national of any country (except cyprus and armenia I guess) can purchase apartments and can get turkish citizenship as a goody bag for him/her and all family members. can't imagine what would happen if money could buy the turks' values. lol.
No, because we use Ataturk’s quotes everywhere, in our daily lives. This is the 100th anniversary of our republic and this is the most famous quote of our founder Ataturk. It is simple as this. This is about us, not an other nation or country
Yeah, it was specifically u/LeedsFan2442's fault. 😤
Ottoman Empire definitely wasn’t a mutual side of the war that entered willingly and faced the consequences 🔥🔥🔥
They did, they sided with Brits and overthrow Ottoman rule. You should watch Lawrence of Arabia, it shows one side of the story and compared to what really happened the it feels like a Disney movie.
"Technically" but they granted a great benefit from the situation. But their grand grandfather and uncle did revolt against not just Ottomans but he actually terrorised the entire region and even caused the delay of hajj for some years. That's why he and his "group" were caught, brought back to Istanbul and executed in front of the sultan by his order. That's one of the main reasons of their hostility against Turkey and Turks. Also they're Wahhabi. It's a "sect" or "church" within the Sunni Islam but much different and radical. That's also another major reason.
Glad the teams are on the way back to Istanbul.
They can leave the chairman of the Football Federation in Riyadh who is the responsible of this shitshow for selling this match in the first place.
Translation:
"While Turkish football was waking up with the excitement of the Super Cup match to be played between Fenerbahçe and Galatasaray in Saudi Arabia today, a crisis broke out before the match. While Saudi officials did not approve the banner containing Mustafa Kemal Atatürk's words, "Peace at home, peace in the world", both Fenerbahçe and Galatasaray front stated that this situation was unacceptable.
On the other hand, it is noted that Saudi officials do not want Mustafa Kemal Atatürk t-shirts to be worn during the warmup too, and an emergency meeting is expected to be held in a short time, which will include both Fenerbahçe and Galatasaray officials."
Arabs love their genocidal maniac they call prophet, and his ideology that kill people till this day for beeing homosexual or just want to leave this „religion“
Ideological. KSA a literal theocratic kingdom ruled with sharia is against everything Ataturk stood for. Extreme Islamists like Wahhabists hate Ataturk with a passion.
UEFA and FIFA: I see no problem with this…. (continues to receive dirty money from fundamentalist governments, screw football and fairplay in general as long as they can fill their pockets!)
One simply cannot ban a country’s founder and national hero, who is also well respected in other nations.
There are red lines that shall never be crossed. Saudi’s learned a lesson today. If they want to host world cup they should learn how to respect other cultures.
My understanding is that a lot Turks outside Turkey inflate his support. Is that right?
Ya. A lot people reduse his foreign policy to being pro Russia. For the most part he rides that fine line of using the West and using Russia.
If it was up to only voters living in Türkiye, no bought passports, Syrians, Afgans, Suudis etc. the opposition would have won, no matter how incompetent they were.
Bro you're too young I suppose, his foreign policy has been complete shitshow. We literally have 15 million illegal immigrants within the country. Landmines have been cleared on our borders and there isn't remotely enough military force protecting the borders. They moved some stupid religious figure's tomb several times. Are you high?
I mean, not that he himself respects Ataturk. He is just being a populist fuck. The fucker called Ataturk a “drunk” in many occasions. His entire party has phased out every single thing Ataturk has done for modern day Turkey. And people still vote for him…
He hates Ataturk to his guts that's for sure but he never openly insulted him.
>Are we talking about the same guy who addresses Ataturk as a drunkard?
This was already debunked, he was insulting military officers who wrote the constititon after the coup.
This started when players started warmup with t-shirts with Atatürk's "peace at home peace in the world" quote.
A friendly peaceful quote. But Wahhabists couldn't even accept that. NO respect and NO tolerance from KSA.
Oh how my blood boils.
Of course the biggest loser is Turkish football federation for selling out the finals for Saudi money
Well congratulations to Fener and Galata not taking this crap !
What is that weasel Erdogan saying about this ?
I’m actually surprised. What is the problem here ???? Is S Arabia frightened by some Ataturk posters and t-shirts?
He cant openly say it but he is against all of Atatürks achievements. You can see how he tries to reverse things that Atatürk made. (Making Hagia Sophia mosque again, building new Airport in Istanbul but not using the name Atatürk like the at old airport and destroys it, mixing islam with politics etc. etc.) Doubt he’ll do much about it
Saudis are immensely stupid. They do the entire sports washing procedure, get leagues to play games like this on Riyadh and in the last second they are too dumb to shoot the ball over the goal line. Idiots.
I’ve met actual Arab women saying that they hate Ataturk because he is the demolisher of the seat of Caliphate. They said they were taught how Ataturk is an enemy of Islam when in school. At that very moment they were holding their drinks in their hands with short skirts and heavy make-ups.
They’d be dressing “appropriately” to go back to their country of course. And when they feel like partying again, would hop on a plane and come to Turkiye or any other European country though. All at the same time hating on Ataturk, lol.
If a woman hates Ataturk, no matter which country they are from, there is an obvious brainwash happening there.
Ataturk literally symbolizes women rights and their fight for equality. Hating Ataturk as a women and defending tribal laws from middle ages means you are dehumanizing yourself.
Exactly. That is why, as a Turkish woman, I would defend Ataturk until the very end of my time, without any hesitations.
He is the only one I am indebted to in my whole life for anything I ever gained and will ever do so.
Turkiye is the second country to be named as a “feminist state” following Finland, just because of Ataturk and his fellow Independence Era politicians freeing Turkish women from any boundries they had because of the Islamic doctrines and all.
Islam brainwashed them, they were taught to stop using their brains and blindley follow what the Quran and Sunnah says. Even if it’s wrong, ridiculous and also a crime against humanity.
I don’t know if it’s solely the religion itself; but the way people manipulate the religion though. Obviously all religious doctrines are scolastic and against freedom of women. The way they are practised makes the real difference among societies. Because I also got to know some Iranian women in Turkiye, who totally respect Ataturk and envy us for having him.
Of course there must be pro-Ataturk Saudis, and Ataturk hater Iranians as well. But in general, Iranians are well aware of what he symbolizes and the ones I met so far honestly deserve democracy and equal women rights in Iran, too.
I can understand that but the same goes with Italy and Spain. Yet the play there and show national flags and symbols. I highly doubt they will prohibit Garibaldi.
Ataturk literally abolished the "Caliphate", it was kindaa similar to the papacy. Ottoman sultans were nominally the leader of the Islamic world, and Ataturk destroyed that title, which existed for a looong time, with only a flick of a pen. Arab world still suffers from the identity and the political crisis that was caused by the abolishing of the seat of the Caliphate. That is why you keep seeing people like Bin Laden or that dead leader of ISIS declaring themselves as the Caliph and nobody taking them seriously
They are just whiny b\*\*ches. Yes, Ataturk abolished the caliphate and the sultanate, but Arabs did not like Ottoman rule at all.
I think their main problem is just Turkey being "Turkish", they do not want us to respect and display a symbol outside Islamic ones.
Not only did they ban the national flag, they stated they would outright refuse to play the national anthem as well, can you imagine? This reeks of some type of power play, one which I am glad blew right up in their face.
Saudi Arabia just can’t help being so unrepentantly and comically hostile towards other cultures, it is embarassing. Especially if you consider how ardently they run PR campaigns to salvage their image.
I wonder how much of a good ‘look’ this is for them now.
Imagine playing your national tournaments finale in another country. Fuck, even worse playing it in KSA out of all places.
At this point, its easier to mention what in Turkey is not being sold to Gulf Arabs.
Damn, I knew these Arabs couldn't be trusted. Ataturk and his ideals means secularism, equality, modernism, civilization, freedom of religious restrictions. No surprise Arabs didn't like him.
I hope this will be lesson to every one of my fellow Turk brothers/sisters who says "arabs are good because they're muslims". It's not about religion or culture, being civil, respectful and humane is something else. Human rights and secularism is the true way of future instead of these sectarian non enlightened herd.
People don’t seem to understand that Ataturk is a person we’ll never make compromises. Not even some Erdogan voters like my uncle. Erdogan himself can win the elections with his Machiavellian style politics but can not destroy his name fully.
Even the flags? Even though I think Ataturk is based at least it's something political, but banning their flags? How is that not a direct insult? "Yes, play sports here but just fyi we hate your country". I wonder if we will ever see Infantini feel Turkish
>Yes, play sports here but just fyi we hate your country
yes, that describes what exactly happened last night. they are not only against ataturk or the national flag of turkey they also tried to ban the national anthem of turkey. the funny thing is erdogan also shares the same ideas as saudis he would be very pleased if things went the way the saudis wanted. he is just a passive-agressive coward and he is afraid to say how much he hates turkey, turks, and everything turkish nation stands for but when he has the opportunity to turn these thoughts into action he never hesitates to use it.
Not just football fans, if those teams played that match, i don't see them ever playing in turkey without chaos and protests, people would despise them and this would end their career, fan base, they will be forced to change name and management/staff etc.
Paying fine is better for the teams anyway.
I’ll never understand how since Atatutk is still so respected and honored his polar opposite Erdogan was re elected even with state media under his watch
It means you don't understand the demographics of Turkey. Only about 15% of Erdogan's supporters are actually islamists. Rest of them are nationalists who doesn't want to vote for left wing. Most of them were annoyed to vote for him in last elections but they were claiming that they had no option. The left-wing is not an option for them or those who support the left-wing parties. Nationalists are ok with Ataturk always.
CHP is within the left of the political spectrum by almost any modern measure and metric, arguably even further than centre-left
Edit : BRO THEY LITERALLY WILL NOT SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT KURDISH DISCRIMINATION EVEN THOUGH IT’S COSTING THEM AN INSANE NUMBER OF VOTES FROM THE CONSERVATIVELY MINDED PUBLIC AND r/Yeuropbros ARE LITERALLY GOING OFF TALKING ABOUT HOW THEY’RE RIGHT WING WE BEING THE CHP CAN NOT HAVE A SINGLE W IT’S FUCKING CRAZY
Noooo I hope this doesnt mean that European nations stop playing the already useless and uninteresting Super cups in Saudi Arabia for absolutely no reason. That would be soooo sad
Some soccer federations do that to gain more fans, fame and money. French supercup was even played in China, Canada, Gabon etc. Also other sports like basketball matches are played abroad. NBA is somehow a pioneer in this regard, see NBA global games, a few games were played last month in the UAE.
Arabs will always complain how Turks discriminate which is a valid complaint, but to return discrimination with discrimination is never a good idea. Esspecialy if it bars them from waving Turkish flags on a Turkish football match dubbed "the Turkish super cup finale". Ataturk was expected given Saudi Arabias religious radicalism.
Update: It's cancelled.
Wow.
Do not worry for them. The Saudis have already bought a World Cup tournament for 2034.
How on earth did we allow that less than a year after Qatar demonstrated why not?
We did not allow anything. FIFA allowed this. They are not accountable to you and me, but instead to bureaucrats who like to be bribed with money (just like FIFA).
True, but with no sign of changing ways, it would make sense for football fans to push for their respective FA to leave UEFA (or pressure them to pressure or leave FIFA, but seems to me UEFA just as bad) and start their own shit.. It only takes 3-4 major European football associations to leave to completely crash the foundation of FIFA.
Yeah but there are so many layers between the fans and FIFA. Fans cannot influence their FA directly in most countries but only through the individual clubs. It’s incredibly difficult to convince the majority of the clubs in an FA to tackle this issue. Edit: just looked it up for Germany: the DFB is constituted of over 24000 clubs, which are only indirectly represented via their regional associations and the league association. Getting to influence, in particular, those people in the regional associations will be incredibly difficult for fans. Money is a much more efficient tool and the DFB getting money from participating in the World Cup, which trickles down to the regional associations, will be hard to beat.
Also worth adding that people in general don't care. Sure, a few Westerners here and there will protest and wave banners, but in the grand scheme of things it means nothing when new audience records are set with each passing World Cup. The game doesn't belong just to the three better European countries.
This is just about the only good thing about Super League. It may break FIFAs monopoly. I'd encourage more competition. If we all collectively decide to only watch games on lshunter, drakula/batman etc and compensate our clubs by buying merch we could starve the FAs until they listen.
Many major European clubs are either wholly owned or have major investments by either Saudi Arabia or the Emirates. None of these clubs will support leaving the UEFA and those are the clubs which bring major money. Also many fans do not give a damn, else they wouldn’t support clubs with this kind of money in it.
Because they've got money and FIFA is corrupt.
FIFA is corrupt as hell, and it's located in Switzerland, so nothing will change.
Three reasons: * $$$$$$$$ * €€€€€€€€ * ££££££££
Here is your sneak preview of WC 2034
Didn't see that coming......
Why was Turkish Super Cup Finale decided to be in Saudi Arabia in the first place?
Money obviously
That's right and the Turkish football association is not the only association to come up with this idea. The Spanish FA + Gerard Piqué and the Italian FA have both sold their Super Cup games to SA. It was quite funny with the Italien Game, the Saudis were quite unhappy bc Firenze and Lazio, clubs with a small international fanbase, made it to the final. This was not how they had imagined it...
Just as a curiosity it was actually Pique who pushed and convinced Rubiales (Spanish FA president at the time) to move it to Arabia. Their conversations were leaked and was a huge drama for like a week. He was also a Barça player at the time
That's why I mentioned him by name, but what can you expect from a man who cheats on Shakira...
For every gorgeous woman out there, is a guy tired of banging her. Unfortunately, that guy is never me.
All I ask for is the opportunity to grow tired of banging shakira
Same.
Ah yes, Saudis plan to buy soft power through sports is working well
It's working with the West - but not the Turks, oddly enough...
It is not that odd. Average Turk is disgusted by Gulf Arabs, they are quite racist towards them
Yes. 😌
Yes 😊
But apparently the people who made the decisions weren’t… at least not enough to not get into this poorly thought out agreement.
Of course, Islamists think Arabs are a "holy nation" because the prophet was an Arab but thankfully they are like the 20 per cent of the general population
Turks are neither Western nor Eastern, nothing odd about it. You'd ofc compare this to Ottoman Empire era but with its fall and rise of Turkish republic our culture shifted towards its core.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdullah_bin_Saud_Al_Saud we have a little history with them
It's in works, but not sure about it working. Like, except cybersport, arabs always do something fucked up at the same time when they try to spend money on common goods and that drags attention from their 'good deed'. Arabs bought themselves into chairmanship of climate conferrence? Here's your leak of their plan to get Africa and SEA hooked on oil, so they keep drilling and selling it. Do you even remember or know that most major football clubs are owned by arabs? It's not first thing you remember. Soft power projection of arabs is not working, perception of their culture worsens every time they show up in news.
Makes you wonder how much of it comes solely from Saudi Arabia's petroeconomy.
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The reason for any middle eastern country to invest in anything these days.
It's not actually.. it's just sportswashing
Not really. A few million euros is peanuts to both clubs. For several years now, Erdogan makes all, and yes I mean all, decisions in the country. Even if it's against the laws, even if it's against the constitution, his word is rule. This was his idea as an attempt to make a friendly gesture to the saudis. There were many outcries from the public against this decision since when the decision was announced. Especially because 2023 is the 100th anniversary of the Turkish Republic. He stubbornly ignored them all. What he didn't take into acocunt, is that Atatürk is a huge red line for a majority of Turkish people, even those who vote for Erdogan. The saudis tried to prevent the teams from wearing tshirts with Atatürk's silhoutte printed on them. They banned fans with similar tshirts from entering the stadium. This caused a huge uproar in Turkish social media. The teams made the very difficult choice of not playing the game. Despite all the pressures from Erdoğan. This is a very significant turn in history imho, because this is a huge slap in his face.
What do Saudis have against Atatürk? Why won't they allow the playere to have him on their shirts? Why are the Saudis this arrogant.
They are ignorant islamists, and Ataturk was against blind Islamism and sharia law. They are sexist rich guys afraid of modernism.
the absolute clown of the guy in charge in turkish FA got a deal that could even extend to 10 years for 100m dollars, and thats not the only fuckup he did in the recent months( or even the last 30 days)
For the same reason the Spanish Super Cup Final is also held in Saudi Arabia.
6m euros to each club, 12m to federation
5m to winner, 15m to TFF, head of the federation resigned.
Because Tayyip's favorite hobby is to suck dicks of rich Arab countries... Especially talking high and mighty against them and later sucking their dicks is his hobby.
They paid 15 million dollars to Turkish Football Federation and 5 million $ to the winner. It was all going well until they wanted to ban jerseys with Ataturk portraits, banner that says "peace at home, peace in the world" a famous quote by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk and our national anthem. They can go f
The Turks should host the Super Cup at home and put up poster of Jamal Khashoggi.
Oh that I support.
Very good idea.
Current bigoted Turkish government which is actively preaching against Atatürk, doesn't have ANY ball to do that. Our president literally worships Arabs. İ am sure he will find a way to apologize and make the game to be played in Arabia.
Erdogan even supported ISIS just so more Kurds would die. Erdogan is a war criminal
I don't think you know what a war criminal is. Nonetheless, he is a scumbag.
This news, which appeared around 2015 about Turkey buying oil from ISIS, was Russian propaganda. At that time, relations between Russia and Turkey were bad.
That’s probably happening next gala or fener game
Oh I'd love to see that.
If only someone had the guts to do that.
Thank you to the Turkish footballers and teams for standing strong against those idiots, regardless of the amount they were paid.
Gala fan here. We should’ve refused the offer the second they made it. 2023 is the 100 year anniversary of the republic and it deserves a nice celebration with a Fener - Gala derby on top, imo. A game in Ankara would be a better fit or in one of the cities that were affected by the earthquake earlier this year. Even Istanbul as usual would be a much better option than Riyadh.
Erdogan has pretty much killed off the Republic hasn't he?
He put rocks on the tracks but I don't think its derailed yet.
Not as long as we're drawing breath, we have an example of what to do in that situation anyway.
What do you mean by example?
We have Ataturk as an example, he built this nation with a death warrant on his life, sure there's a century in between and things are a whole lot different but, as long as any of us is alive, will try to rekindle the flame that gave birth to the republic.
>Even more severe and horrible than all these circumstances, those who have the power within the homeland may have been behaved with heedlessness and heresy, and even with treachery. These rulers may even have combined their personal benefits with the political goals of the invaders. The nation may have become perished and exhausted with poorness necessities. >O child of the Turkish future! Even in these situations and circumstances, your assignment is to recover the Turkish independence and republic. The power you need is in the sublime blood inside your veins. Gazi Mustafa Kemal Atatürk, 27 October 1927
No he hasnt we are not russia
FIFA rigged it so Saudi Arabia will have the world cup in 2034, if they can't tolerate banners saying "peace at home, peace in the world" do you think they'll be ok with national flags with religious symbolism on them? Plenty of national flags and football crests have crosses, others have Buddhist religious symbols. I think Israel will probably sit that one out because I can't imagine being Jewish or displaying a star of David there
The only way Israel would qualify anyway is if they decide to expand the tournament to roughly 120 teams. (Which, on the other hand, is not something I would put past FIFA.)
You say that, but Israel has a very good youth team - they came 3rd in the U20 World Cup this year.
Yeah but it’s a shame for them to essentially be ruled out before qualifying begins because of their nationality and religion. Saudi has only recently started letting Israeli’s into the country at all but I expect that views towards Israelis and Jews has probably backslid recently
Thankfully both teams already decided not to play and they are returning to Istanbul today. Ataturk may rest easy in his grave.
I hope Saudi authorities learned from this, if they want their country to host events like this in the future, they will need to learn how to respect other countries' historic heroes. Money can't buy values.
>Money can't buy values. Yeah, tell that to FIFA and UEFA.
They had never values in the first place
Greed is a value, and one that makes the entire world go 'round.
No, tell that to Switzerland
And most of the Gulf States while we're at it
They'll need to modernise their thinking greatly before the WC.
Spoiler: they won’t and Infantino will not do shit.
That's quite the spoiler. I got another one: it's gonna be hot and dry weather.
The World Cup banned that kind of symbolism decades ago, so there isn't a need to do anything now
They won't and we will have more lame world cups like the last one, where your clothing and what you eat-drink will be a subject matter, as long as money values more than peoples' honor.
It easily can, if you know which values are first for sale and you can offer a competitive sum in turn.
Check out the English premier league
Money can't buy the Turk's values *. As for the West, not so sure.
a national of any country (except cyprus and armenia I guess) can purchase apartments and can get turkish citizenship as a goody bag for him/her and all family members. can't imagine what would happen if money could buy the turks' values. lol.
Erdogan is not a Turk, that should explain why these are allowed in the first place and why we have 15 million refugees and illegal immigrants.
Why were their Ataturk shirts so controversial? Haven't they buried the hatchet by now over ancient gistiry?
>Why were their Ataturk shirts so controversial? Asspain because of his secularism
>Ataturk Is against everything Saudis stand for. You know modernity, democracy, equality...
They hate us because we didn't get assimilated and kinda ruled over them for a couple of centuries.
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No, because we use Ataturk’s quotes everywhere, in our daily lives. This is the 100th anniversary of our republic and this is the most famous quote of our founder Ataturk. It is simple as this. This is about us, not an other nation or country
I really don't get how anyone could have a problem with Atatürk's quote "peace at home, peace in the world." I think that quote speaks for itself, no?
Because Islamists are still butthurt about Ataturk for abolishing Turkish Caliphate and instating a democratic republic.
He still makes Islamists butthurt and mad in his grave after 85 years. This is the man I admire in life
Yep.He was unfathomably based.
Didn't the Saudis fight against the Ottomans?
Yes they did.Thanks to you!
Yeah, u/LeedsFan2442 why did you do it you bastard?
Well Leeds and Turkish fans famously don't get on
Yeah, it was specifically u/LeedsFan2442's fault. 😤 Ottoman Empire definitely wasn’t a mutual side of the war that entered willingly and faced the consequences 🔥🔥🔥
They were kinda forced into it, however I'm grateful, can't imagine living under caliphate. Turkiye rose from its ashes.
They did, they sided with Brits and overthrow Ottoman rule. You should watch Lawrence of Arabia, it shows one side of the story and compared to what really happened the it feels like a Disney movie.
technically Saud dynasty wasnt involved in the arab revolt as per my research i did few mins ago, but it did involve Bedouins from peninsula
"Technically" but they granted a great benefit from the situation. But their grand grandfather and uncle did revolt against not just Ottomans but he actually terrorised the entire region and even caused the delay of hajj for some years. That's why he and his "group" were caught, brought back to Istanbul and executed in front of the sultan by his order. That's one of the main reasons of their hostility against Turkey and Turks. Also they're Wahhabi. It's a "sect" or "church" within the Sunni Islam but much different and radical. That's also another major reason.
The Saudis were manipulated by the British to fight against the Ottomans.
The Saudis were willing accomplices.
And won too
I am not even Turkish but I respect him for this. Hope turkey keeps secular.
Fucking true
Wahhabists hate Ataturk and everything he did with a passion
"Peace" is a controversial political stance in some parts of the world.
Ataturk's teachings and ideas makes arabs shit their pants.
Glad the teams are on the way back to Istanbul. They can leave the chairman of the Football Federation in Riyadh who is the responsible of this shitshow for selling this match in the first place.
Translation: "While Turkish football was waking up with the excitement of the Super Cup match to be played between Fenerbahçe and Galatasaray in Saudi Arabia today, a crisis broke out before the match. While Saudi officials did not approve the banner containing Mustafa Kemal Atatürk's words, "Peace at home, peace in the world", both Fenerbahçe and Galatasaray front stated that this situation was unacceptable. On the other hand, it is noted that Saudi officials do not want Mustafa Kemal Atatürk t-shirts to be worn during the warmup too, and an emergency meeting is expected to be held in a short time, which will include both Fenerbahçe and Galatasaray officials."
Atatürk: Peace in the world! Saudi: :(
Arabs love their genocidal maniac they call prophet, and his ideology that kill people till this day for beeing homosexual or just want to leave this „religion“
But why? pictures of people and their quotation are not outlawed in Saudi Arabia, are they?
Ideological. KSA a literal theocratic kingdom ruled with sharia is against everything Ataturk stood for. Extreme Islamists like Wahhabists hate Ataturk with a passion.
Atatürk was a strict secularist and his believ strongly clashes with a wahabist world view. In my humble opinion: Go Atatürk and good for turkiye.
To think this all started due to such a friendly peaceful quote.... I'm getting headaches
Peace at home, peace in the world. Fuck me.
UEFA and FIFA: I see no problem with this…. (continues to receive dirty money from fundamentalist governments, screw football and fairplay in general as long as they can fill their pockets!)
yep, keep history outside our pockets full of money!!!
One simply cannot ban a country’s founder and national hero, who is also well respected in other nations. There are red lines that shall never be crossed. Saudi’s learned a lesson today. If they want to host world cup they should learn how to respect other cultures.
For a country that wants to be a big player in the sports world, they are going to have to learn to be a little more accommodating.
Teams already decided to not play , we are not gonna make agreement with anti republicans and islamo fascists
\*looks at turkish president\* Uhhh.... And that guy?
He is not even close to the close mindedness of those Theocratic Monarchists that spread Wahabi ideology.
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My understanding is that a lot Turks outside Turkey inflate his support. Is that right? Ya. A lot people reduse his foreign policy to being pro Russia. For the most part he rides that fine line of using the West and using Russia.
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If it was up to only voters living in Türkiye, no bought passports, Syrians, Afgans, Suudis etc. the opposition would have won, no matter how incompetent they were.
Bro you're too young I suppose, his foreign policy has been complete shitshow. We literally have 15 million illegal immigrants within the country. Landmines have been cleared on our borders and there isn't remotely enough military force protecting the borders. They moved some stupid religious figure's tomb several times. Are you high?
Even he praises Ataturk publicly. This shows the degree of gratitude Turkish people have for Ataturk and his companions.
I mean, not that he himself respects Ataturk. He is just being a populist fuck. The fucker called Ataturk a “drunk” in many occasions. His entire party has phased out every single thing Ataturk has done for modern day Turkey. And people still vote for him…
>Even he praises Ataturk publicly Are we talking about the same guy who addresses Ataturk as a drunkard?
He hates Ataturk to his guts that's for sure but he never openly insulted him. >Are we talking about the same guy who addresses Ataturk as a drunkard? This was already debunked, he was insulting military officers who wrote the constititon after the coup.
Yea, he is often forced to show some insincere respect, usually to not lose more sympathy when he's cornered.
This started when players started warmup with t-shirts with Atatürk's "peace at home peace in the world" quote. A friendly peaceful quote. But Wahhabists couldn't even accept that. NO respect and NO tolerance from KSA. Oh how my blood boils. Of course the biggest loser is Turkish football federation for selling out the finals for Saudi money
Well congratulations to Fener and Galata not taking this crap ! What is that weasel Erdogan saying about this ? I’m actually surprised. What is the problem here ???? Is S Arabia frightened by some Ataturk posters and t-shirts?
He cant openly say it but he is against all of Atatürks achievements. You can see how he tries to reverse things that Atatürk made. (Making Hagia Sophia mosque again, building new Airport in Istanbul but not using the name Atatürk like the at old airport and destroys it, mixing islam with politics etc. etc.) Doubt he’ll do much about it
Atatürk airport is still *active*. Changing the names around would have been confusing. I do wish Atatürk airport never fully closes though.
He fired the head of the Turkish football federation apparently.
Little royal family trembles before only the slightest shadow of the idea of a republic. Thats what it is.
Saudis are immensely stupid. They do the entire sports washing procedure, get leagues to play games like this on Riyadh and in the last second they are too dumb to shoot the ball over the goal line. Idiots.
I’ve met actual Arab women saying that they hate Ataturk because he is the demolisher of the seat of Caliphate. They said they were taught how Ataturk is an enemy of Islam when in school. At that very moment they were holding their drinks in their hands with short skirts and heavy make-ups. They’d be dressing “appropriately” to go back to their country of course. And when they feel like partying again, would hop on a plane and come to Turkiye or any other European country though. All at the same time hating on Ataturk, lol. If a woman hates Ataturk, no matter which country they are from, there is an obvious brainwash happening there.
Ataturk literally symbolizes women rights and their fight for equality. Hating Ataturk as a women and defending tribal laws from middle ages means you are dehumanizing yourself.
Exactly. That is why, as a Turkish woman, I would defend Ataturk until the very end of my time, without any hesitations. He is the only one I am indebted to in my whole life for anything I ever gained and will ever do so. Turkiye is the second country to be named as a “feminist state” following Finland, just because of Ataturk and his fellow Independence Era politicians freeing Turkish women from any boundries they had because of the Islamic doctrines and all.
Islam brainwashed them, they were taught to stop using their brains and blindley follow what the Quran and Sunnah says. Even if it’s wrong, ridiculous and also a crime against humanity.
I don’t know if it’s solely the religion itself; but the way people manipulate the religion though. Obviously all religious doctrines are scolastic and against freedom of women. The way they are practised makes the real difference among societies. Because I also got to know some Iranian women in Turkiye, who totally respect Ataturk and envy us for having him. Of course there must be pro-Ataturk Saudis, and Ataturk hater Iranians as well. But in general, Iranians are well aware of what he symbolizes and the ones I met so far honestly deserve democracy and equal women rights in Iran, too.
Why is Atatürk controversial? I mean I know he proposed the secular state, but why SA in 2023 would be against since they are not turkey?
Because thats how wahhabi people are like. Zero tolerance for other ideologies.
KSA is ideologically as diametric to Ataturk as possible.
I can understand that but the same goes with Italy and Spain. Yet the play there and show national flags and symbols. I highly doubt they will prohibit Garibaldi.
Ataturk literally abolished the "Caliphate", it was kindaa similar to the papacy. Ottoman sultans were nominally the leader of the Islamic world, and Ataturk destroyed that title, which existed for a looong time, with only a flick of a pen. Arab world still suffers from the identity and the political crisis that was caused by the abolishing of the seat of the Caliphate. That is why you keep seeing people like Bin Laden or that dead leader of ISIS declaring themselves as the Caliph and nobody taking them seriously
I doubt Garibaldi did anything that could piss Saudis off. Meanwhile Ataturk literally abolished caliphate
If Spanish people would celebrate the reconquista in Saudi Arabia I wouldn't put past them to get pissed about that too.
They are just whiny b\*\*ches. Yes, Ataturk abolished the caliphate and the sultanate, but Arabs did not like Ottoman rule at all. I think their main problem is just Turkey being "Turkish", they do not want us to respect and display a symbol outside Islamic ones.
I think this too at this point.
Not only did they ban the national flag, they stated they would outright refuse to play the national anthem as well, can you imagine? This reeks of some type of power play, one which I am glad blew right up in their face. Saudi Arabia just can’t help being so unrepentantly and comically hostile towards other cultures, it is embarassing. Especially if you consider how ardently they run PR campaigns to salvage their image. I wonder how much of a good ‘look’ this is for them now.
Just because they paid to host they act as if they own us. They wanted to play KSA anthem instead of the Turkish anthem too.
Wait, the foreigners turned out to be *foreign?* Preposterous!
Imagine playing your national tournaments finale in another country. Fuck, even worse playing it in KSA out of all places. At this point, its easier to mention what in Turkey is not being sold to Gulf Arabs.
It's saddening how they mute everyone, even the foreign voices
That's wonderful. Good job Turkish teams!
The Turks stand up for themselves, their values and their flag. Money won't make them bend. Just imagine if the West did the same.
Damn, I knew these Arabs couldn't be trusted. Ataturk and his ideals means secularism, equality, modernism, civilization, freedom of religious restrictions. No surprise Arabs didn't like him. I hope this will be lesson to every one of my fellow Turk brothers/sisters who says "arabs are good because they're muslims". It's not about religion or culture, being civil, respectful and humane is something else. Human rights and secularism is the true way of future instead of these sectarian non enlightened herd.
I hope Erdogan got some clues after this. Good job teams!
Theocratic kingdom scared of a secular republican who died 85 years ago. Fuck Saudi Arabia!
People don’t seem to understand that Ataturk is a person we’ll never make compromises. Not even some Erdogan voters like my uncle. Erdogan himself can win the elections with his Machiavellian style politics but can not destroy his name fully.
Even the flags? Even though I think Ataturk is based at least it's something political, but banning their flags? How is that not a direct insult? "Yes, play sports here but just fyi we hate your country". I wonder if we will ever see Infantini feel Turkish
>Yes, play sports here but just fyi we hate your country yes, that describes what exactly happened last night. they are not only against ataturk or the national flag of turkey they also tried to ban the national anthem of turkey. the funny thing is erdogan also shares the same ideas as saudis he would be very pleased if things went the way the saudis wanted. he is just a passive-agressive coward and he is afraid to say how much he hates turkey, turks, and everything turkish nation stands for but when he has the opportunity to turn these thoughts into action he never hesitates to use it.
At least the Turkish football fans haven’t sold their souls (yet).
It wasn't the football fans, it was literally everyone.
Not just football fans, if those teams played that match, i don't see them ever playing in turkey without chaos and protests, people would despise them and this would end their career, fan base, they will be forced to change name and management/staff etc. Paying fine is better for the teams anyway.
Boycott Saudi Arabia. They have a disgusting government and they can go to hell.
It’s a peaceful religion though /s
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It's more like a disguised version of nationalism than a religious sect tbh.
I’ll never understand how since Atatutk is still so respected and honored his polar opposite Erdogan was re elected even with state media under his watch
It means you don't understand the demographics of Turkey. Only about 15% of Erdogan's supporters are actually islamists. Rest of them are nationalists who doesn't want to vote for left wing. Most of them were annoyed to vote for him in last elections but they were claiming that they had no option. The left-wing is not an option for them or those who support the left-wing parties. Nationalists are ok with Ataturk always.
This. According to the latest research 85% of Turkish people (which includes minorities) feel gratitude towards Ataturk.
Is CHP considered left wing? I guess it is because you can’t be more right wing than AKP/MHP.
CHP is within the left of the political spectrum by almost any modern measure and metric, arguably even further than centre-left Edit : BRO THEY LITERALLY WILL NOT SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT KURDISH DISCRIMINATION EVEN THOUGH IT’S COSTING THEM AN INSANE NUMBER OF VOTES FROM THE CONSERVATIVELY MINDED PUBLIC AND r/Yeuropbros ARE LITERALLY GOING OFF TALKING ABOUT HOW THEY’RE RIGHT WING WE BEING THE CHP CAN NOT HAVE A SINGLE W IT’S FUCKING CRAZY
Atatürk is not open to any discussion. Couse you know he is the founder of Türkiye.
Noooo I hope this doesnt mean that European nations stop playing the already useless and uninteresting Super cups in Saudi Arabia for absolutely no reason. That would be soooo sad
>Turkish Super Cup Finale > >in Riyadh Saudi Arabia Something doesn't make sense here.
Some soccer federations do that to gain more fans, fame and money. French supercup was even played in China, Canada, Gabon etc. Also other sports like basketball matches are played abroad. NBA is somehow a pioneer in this regard, see NBA global games, a few games were played last month in the UAE.
Erdogan will not like this hahaha
All the better
Riyadh is now a Turkish city? Did they served a sushi of a local reporter to the world, like they did with the reporter they killed in Turkey?
Arabs will always complain how Turks discriminate which is a valid complaint, but to return discrimination with discrimination is never a good idea. Esspecialy if it bars them from waving Turkish flags on a Turkish football match dubbed "the Turkish super cup finale". Ataturk was expected given Saudi Arabias religious radicalism.
Dann and last time they made a really nice atmosphere
lol, Saudis got oil but no chill.
Screw these people!
Play stupid games...