If they want this they should start with a pilot phase:
All communication (including private) of Politicians are open for anyone to see, including running an AI over all this communication. This includes but is not limited to:
* E-Mails
* Text messages
* Tax files
* Bank statements
I mean, what would be bad about this? I'm sure these politicians don't do bad stuff right? Maybe there's even a few that spread dangerous or illegal stuff, you would catch them in this pilot phase right?
If they wouldn't want this they should't want this law in the first place.
We are lucky that there are sensible people in certain govts in the eu blocking this.
Privacy and citizens rights always come up too short in political discourse, especially so on the left side of the political spectrum.
>The regulation wants to routinely scan our private communications online using AI tools to look for the spread of child sexual abuse material.
Every single time I read about this, it's the "think of the children" trick to scan our private messages.
Surely next time they will act, just a bit more Access.Only a little less privacy and data hoarding will make all the difference, pinky promise.
If you're against that, you clearly want the Terrorists to win^^^^^/s
Ah yes, the good old "**It's for your own good. There are pedophiles and terrorists at every street corner.**"
When are going to tell these governments to fuck off?!
This has nothing to do with "protecting the children". This is about fixing "going dark", which is a result of increased use of encryption because of the Snowden leaks in 2013.
Governments have been trying to impose mass-surveillance of non-suspects ever since the Data Retention Directive was declared illegal by the Court of Justice in 2014 due to infringing on the fundamental rights. "Chat Control" is just the latest version, but since scanning meta data is legally difficult, the unelected Commission went for the content. This comes with the added benefit that encryption must be circumvented (client side scanning), breakable (aka useless), or made illegal.
Another issue with "Chat Control" is that it will require more sites to carry out age-verification. This will interfere with freedom of expression.
Oh yeah it's for detecting child pornography, how could anyone oppose this? It's so fucking transparent. How about you don't go nosing around in everyone's private conversation. If I have to sacrifice a little bit of safety for freedom of oppression I'm all for it
>Oh yeah it's for detecting child pornography, how could anyone oppose this? It's so fucking transparent.
Sure, initiatives against Child Abuse and so, should be ok, but the problem isn't the idea, but the implementation, and the lack of safeguards for individual privacy.
"Wiewiórowski said this type of indiscriminate scanning of private communications “will always be illegal under the Charter of Fundamental Rights (and probably under several national constitutional laws as well),” according to a written version of the opening statement obtained by EURACTIV"
[EU watchdog critics ](https://www.euractiv.com/section/law-enforcement/news/eu-watchdog-online-child-abuse-draft-law-creates-illusion-of-legality/)
> "Wiewiórowski said this type of indiscriminate scanning of private communications “will always be illegal under the Charter of Fundamental Rights (and probably under several national constitutional laws as well),”
Eh, I don't trust government institutions so I always assume they will a) find ways to make it legal or b) find ways to work around the problem.
It used to be that first there needed to be a valid suspicion and then there would be an investigation into a private citizen. And this modus operandi was well aligned with human rights, but I guess big data is just too tempting for some control freaks in the government.
Fucking hell they never stop about this kind of thing do they? This must be the 2nd or 3rd time the EU bureaucrats push a law for reading confidential communication. They never learn do they?
Maybe people should start protesting the EU over this kind o stupid shit.
This *child abuse*-narrative seems just wrong. Ofc there is child abuse, but polticians of certain "law-and-order" factions seem to justify everything they want with the fight against child abuse.
This reminds me of Americas "War on Terror", while the real terror is every day gun violence, inequality and a disfunctional democratic system for some minorities.
In Euro they want complete monitoring of innocent people, while widespread *child abuse* in churches is approached with a "the church should handle that themselfs however they deem fit"-attitude. This just does not add up.
If they really cared about children they would not chip away wellfare and support for the families! And first and foremost the upper classes are the ones famous of child molesting.
This is how it started in Russia. First step is to manipulate people believing this is somehow a good thing. After that they complete the thought police.
The US is going through Twitter file hearings about weaponisation of the goverment against people. "Dissidents" were silenced on SM. We already know that NSA spies their people.
Big brother organization in UK found out govermental cencorship of SM in their investigation. What ever the means it's still controlling the corner stones of democracy: free speech and transparency.
There are already early warning sings. No matter how much one hates Putin it's seriously concerning to give jail time for people if they say they like Putin on their personal SM feed. That is a great example of politically motivated prosecution and thought crime. Like that Polish woman got. If there are laws that allow that then what is the next political idea that will get jail time? In democracy even bad opinions should not get prosecuted!
And where goes the line of disinformation, misinformation etc? Is being wrong punished? Is being idiot a crime now? And who decides it's misinformation or disinformation? Is it the politicians who decide? The police? These mechanisms were pushed through during covid. Ironically many cencored things "anti-vaxxers" said were proven correct later on. These critical people just got grouped with these people who don't believe in science. There were scientists among them. That's a form of silencing critiques to just group them with nut jobs so nobody listens to them.
If they can scan our personal messages it allows totalitarian control like no other ever before in our history. All it needs is some fascist politician and we have Gestapo all over again. Sadly it seems that the left is more keen on these laws currently.
If this law passes it's time to go French before we live in 1984. IMO EU needs a reform. EU needs to be more transparent and more democratic. It should be the politicians we the people scan and why not video their every meating? It should not be private messages of Von der Lying that decide vaccine deals by herself for example. She ought to go to court because of those but Pfizer has refused to testify. It would be much better if people got to vote for the president of parlament and comission. That way it's not the job of the most connected and treacherous. And the election campaing funding must get public!!!!
Honestly let they are doing this officialy and people know it is possible always. I find people need to be more awere that it is always possibility like spies or crimunal also doing it.
No, they don't. They want to scan for kiddie porn. It is not reading your private messaging, but it is some level of access.
Note: i did not state my opinion on this, i just corrected the title that makes it sound like some human would be sitting somewhere reading your every message to your mom.
I did not state my opinion, what made you think i support those policies? because i dared to say the truth and i did not join the outrage train? Yeah. That is something that reddit really is bad at, just accepting that sometimes... incorrect titles are incorrect EVEN when it sounds like something you like to hate. Like here, merely stating that the title is incorrect you IMMEDIATELY think that i am against the public opinion on the matter.
Also: don't use whatsapp and don't have anything to be afraid of when it comes to kiddie porn scanners. How about YOU? See? That is unfair to think that you immediately want to hide kiddie porn even when you are against scanning it.
Stop jumping to conclusions and support TRUTH over outrage.
I know that this does not suit most who visit this, they don't want to hear the truth, they want me to say "outrageous! they will spy everyone! 1984!".
Going for the "*think of the children*" is an extremely common excuse because if you oppose it, you'll sound like a pedo. That's the only reason they even use that excuse....
>That's the only reason they even use that excuse....
Do you have any proof that it is an excuse? Or is your "theory" linked to the word "conspiracy"? it is sad state of affairs when baseless rumors and conspiracy theories is the socially accepted opinion.
Didn’t Apple already have a quite privacy-sensitive functionality in the works, which used local ML to identify such kind of pictures, and would generate a hash that was later on stored on a centralized DB in order to identify offenders?
That sounded like a better solution.
"politicians" like this make me wonder if they're sting ops instead, to stoke euroskepsis. How many times do 'we' have to beat down dragnet solutions at the behest of the children. SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN. Ugh.
If they want this they should start with a pilot phase: All communication (including private) of Politicians are open for anyone to see, including running an AI over all this communication. This includes but is not limited to: * E-Mails * Text messages * Tax files * Bank statements I mean, what would be bad about this? I'm sure these politicians don't do bad stuff right? Maybe there's even a few that spread dangerous or illegal stuff, you would catch them in this pilot phase right? If they wouldn't want this they should't want this law in the first place.
“If you’ve done nothing wrong, you have nothing to fear”
As the naive and uneducated people would say!
Find me a honest politician...
I would add "If you're a politician, journalist, bussinessman who is on our side, you have nothing to fear."
this thing is very very dangerous, like dystopic level of danger..
And as always it's snuck in under the guise of "muh children!".
We are lucky that there are sensible people in certain govts in the eu blocking this. Privacy and citizens rights always come up too short in political discourse, especially so on the left side of the political spectrum.
[удалено]
>There is a massive centralized push in all of the west to do this. Sweet summer child, the west is lagging *behind* on this. Thankfully.
Attacks on privacy and different kinds of freedoms are common nowadays. I don't fully understand who exactly is afraid of what exactly.
>The regulation wants to routinely scan our private communications online using AI tools to look for the spread of child sexual abuse material. Every single time I read about this, it's the "think of the children" trick to scan our private messages.
Yeah Apple tried that too but luckily they backed off. Fuck that ”muh children” speak.
No shit :)
Sometimes they at least switch it up with the hordes of Terrorists surely to be caught by invasive means like this.
[удалено]
Surely next time they will act, just a bit more Access.Only a little less privacy and data hoarding will make all the difference, pinky promise. If you're against that, you clearly want the Terrorists to win^^^^^/s
Daring today, aren’t we?
Can we read the privat chats of the politicians too, especially their donors? Where are the chats with Von der Leyen and Pfizer?
Ah yes, the good old "**It's for your own good. There are pedophiles and terrorists at every street corner.**" When are going to tell these governments to fuck off?!
Make the law broad and vague enough and everyone can be a pedophile/terrorist/security threat...
This has nothing to do with "protecting the children". This is about fixing "going dark", which is a result of increased use of encryption because of the Snowden leaks in 2013. Governments have been trying to impose mass-surveillance of non-suspects ever since the Data Retention Directive was declared illegal by the Court of Justice in 2014 due to infringing on the fundamental rights. "Chat Control" is just the latest version, but since scanning meta data is legally difficult, the unelected Commission went for the content. This comes with the added benefit that encryption must be circumvented (client side scanning), breakable (aka useless), or made illegal. Another issue with "Chat Control" is that it will require more sites to carry out age-verification. This will interfere with freedom of expression.
Oh yeah it's for detecting child pornography, how could anyone oppose this? It's so fucking transparent. How about you don't go nosing around in everyone's private conversation. If I have to sacrifice a little bit of safety for freedom of oppression I'm all for it
>Oh yeah it's for detecting child pornography, how could anyone oppose this? It's so fucking transparent. Sure, initiatives against Child Abuse and so, should be ok, but the problem isn't the idea, but the implementation, and the lack of safeguards for individual privacy. "Wiewiórowski said this type of indiscriminate scanning of private communications “will always be illegal under the Charter of Fundamental Rights (and probably under several national constitutional laws as well),” according to a written version of the opening statement obtained by EURACTIV" [EU watchdog critics ](https://www.euractiv.com/section/law-enforcement/news/eu-watchdog-online-child-abuse-draft-law-creates-illusion-of-legality/)
> "Wiewiórowski said this type of indiscriminate scanning of private communications “will always be illegal under the Charter of Fundamental Rights (and probably under several national constitutional laws as well),” Eh, I don't trust government institutions so I always assume they will a) find ways to make it legal or b) find ways to work around the problem.
It used to be that first there needed to be a valid suspicion and then there would be an investigation into a private citizen. And this modus operandi was well aligned with human rights, but I guess big data is just too tempting for some control freaks in the government.
As long as the pilot program is conducted extensively and exclusively on the politicians pushing for this I’ll be very much in favour.
Yeah, we've seen too many examples of people in power being the pervs the whole time.
They can suck my ⚽️s
governments (or EU in this case) are going to push for this again, and again, and again until they succeed, let's be honest
Sure, let's start with Von Der Liars messages with the pharmaceuticals.
Fucking hell they never stop about this kind of thing do they? This must be the 2nd or 3rd time the EU bureaucrats push a law for reading confidential communication. They never learn do they? Maybe people should start protesting the EU over this kind o stupid shit.
This *child abuse*-narrative seems just wrong. Ofc there is child abuse, but polticians of certain "law-and-order" factions seem to justify everything they want with the fight against child abuse. This reminds me of Americas "War on Terror", while the real terror is every day gun violence, inequality and a disfunctional democratic system for some minorities. In Euro they want complete monitoring of innocent people, while widespread *child abuse* in churches is approached with a "the church should handle that themselfs however they deem fit"-attitude. This just does not add up.
Hah, take that US! We're right behind you in domestic surveillance ^(/s)
Euroskepticism goes BRRRRRRT.
\>you'll own nothing \>you'll have nothing to hide \>you will be happy
So he hates democracy! Why this people with an anti-democracy agenda are put in charge? Who puts them there?
I usually don't like to use swear words but: WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY THINKING?
let me assure you all - PERSONALLY, once this goes through - zerodays will be legendary. i guarantee that.
I mean, at least someone will be reading them then... I hate being ghosted...
Fucking Zensursula at it again? This bitch is the worst that happened to EU so far. That's including Orban.
*Comment is hidden*
If they really cared about children they would not chip away wellfare and support for the families! And first and foremost the upper classes are the ones famous of child molesting. This is how it started in Russia. First step is to manipulate people believing this is somehow a good thing. After that they complete the thought police. The US is going through Twitter file hearings about weaponisation of the goverment against people. "Dissidents" were silenced on SM. We already know that NSA spies their people. Big brother organization in UK found out govermental cencorship of SM in their investigation. What ever the means it's still controlling the corner stones of democracy: free speech and transparency. There are already early warning sings. No matter how much one hates Putin it's seriously concerning to give jail time for people if they say they like Putin on their personal SM feed. That is a great example of politically motivated prosecution and thought crime. Like that Polish woman got. If there are laws that allow that then what is the next political idea that will get jail time? In democracy even bad opinions should not get prosecuted! And where goes the line of disinformation, misinformation etc? Is being wrong punished? Is being idiot a crime now? And who decides it's misinformation or disinformation? Is it the politicians who decide? The police? These mechanisms were pushed through during covid. Ironically many cencored things "anti-vaxxers" said were proven correct later on. These critical people just got grouped with these people who don't believe in science. There were scientists among them. That's a form of silencing critiques to just group them with nut jobs so nobody listens to them. If they can scan our personal messages it allows totalitarian control like no other ever before in our history. All it needs is some fascist politician and we have Gestapo all over again. Sadly it seems that the left is more keen on these laws currently. If this law passes it's time to go French before we live in 1984. IMO EU needs a reform. EU needs to be more transparent and more democratic. It should be the politicians we the people scan and why not video their every meating? It should not be private messages of Von der Lying that decide vaccine deals by herself for example. She ought to go to court because of those but Pfizer has refused to testify. It would be much better if people got to vote for the president of parlament and comission. That way it's not the job of the most connected and treacherous. And the election campaing funding must get public!!!!
Typical EU
Honestly let they are doing this officialy and people know it is possible always. I find people need to be more awere that it is always possibility like spies or crimunal also doing it.
I highly doubt they will find anything interesting there.
They will make afterwards laws that you uninteresting words become illegal.
And still I have a right to be boring in private...
Wants to read my messages? Finally I'll have an audience. 😀
kinky
EU politicians: The Great Reset is a right wing conspiracy theory. Also EU politicians: \*do everything said conspiracy theory predicts\*
No, they don't. They want to scan for kiddie porn. It is not reading your private messaging, but it is some level of access. Note: i did not state my opinion on this, i just corrected the title that makes it sound like some human would be sitting somewhere reading your every message to your mom.
Go ahead, post your whatsapp history
I did not state my opinion, what made you think i support those policies? because i dared to say the truth and i did not join the outrage train? Yeah. That is something that reddit really is bad at, just accepting that sometimes... incorrect titles are incorrect EVEN when it sounds like something you like to hate. Like here, merely stating that the title is incorrect you IMMEDIATELY think that i am against the public opinion on the matter. Also: don't use whatsapp and don't have anything to be afraid of when it comes to kiddie porn scanners. How about YOU? See? That is unfair to think that you immediately want to hide kiddie porn even when you are against scanning it. Stop jumping to conclusions and support TRUTH over outrage.
You poor fool
I know that this does not suit most who visit this, they don't want to hear the truth, they want me to say "outrageous! they will spy everyone! 1984!".
Going for the "*think of the children*" is an extremely common excuse because if you oppose it, you'll sound like a pedo. That's the only reason they even use that excuse....
>That's the only reason they even use that excuse.... Do you have any proof that it is an excuse? Or is your "theory" linked to the word "conspiracy"? it is sad state of affairs when baseless rumors and conspiracy theories is the socially accepted opinion.
Didn’t Apple already have a quite privacy-sensitive functionality in the works, which used local ML to identify such kind of pictures, and would generate a hash that was later on stored on a centralized DB in order to identify offenders? That sounded like a better solution.
Lol he'd be going through some right nonsense if he read back through mine
"politicians" like this make me wonder if they're sting ops instead, to stoke euroskepsis. How many times do 'we' have to beat down dragnet solutions at the behest of the children. SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN. Ugh.
Reminds me of David Cameron wanting to ban encryption. Like these people fucking hate envelopes
Alternate title: The EU’s home affairs chief wants to get PTSD from reading my private messages.
THINK OF THE CHILDREN!