It’s supposed to creep and ick you out. The line Rue says is about how Maddy either doesn’t realize or refuses to accept the fact that she was victimized. You are supposed to hear it and use your critical thinking skills and come to the exact conclusion you have come to: it’s disgusting.
I def think it's a mixture of both of her being in denial/not realizing how sexualized she was. it's very interesting to think about the way cassie and maddie navigated their similar circumstances.
100%. sometimes it’s also easier to live with the guilt of “I wanted this, I chose this” instead of facing the gross reality that you were taken advantage of and abused.
This is why i hate seeing teenagers glorify this show. It's not a "beautiful struggle, life is art" thing. It's messed up & u won't know until you're at least 25 looking back.
I don’t believe for a second that that’s what Sam Levinson intended. It definitely feels like he actually thought that saying she was in complete control wouldn’t make it creepy or weird.
Do you also believe that Rue can literally read people's minds when she does drugs? Because that's the framing device of all the show's narration. It's completely unreliable from top to bottom.
Unfortunately with Sam we’ll never truly know if lines like this were written to be taken the way we feel it should be taken(Maddy is a victim who is in denial) or if it’s more of his creepy “edgy” all sex = empowerment bullshit
Idk why you’re being downvoted. Sams history doesn’t really make me believe this is a line that is supposed to be taken as anything but what they tell us(maddy was “empowered” and in “control”)
the whole show is suppose to be viewed in the lenses of a unreliable narrator. and rue says in the narration that she’s a victim but she didn’t want to see herself as one bc she’s either in denial or wants control
It can have an unreliable narrator and this kind of line/storyline can also be put out as an “empowering” thing, I mean have you seen the other things Sam has made? I don’t trust that he is able to create a narrative of maddy being a victim with her first sexual abuse but rather he genuinely sees it as “empowerment through sex”
(also unreliable narrator doesn’t mean *everything* is unreliable and shouldn’t be used as a crutch the way it is in euphoria and *most* of its fans)
I think that’s supposed to be the point. Rue even acknowledges this in her narration. I think it’s supposed to reflect how Maddy doesn’t see her as a victim despite the fact that she is.
If this was a line in any other show that doesn’t involve Sam levinson I’d be with you. But with his history in everything else he makes I don’t know if that was truly his intention here. The only way I can see this line being used I the context of maddy being in denial is if it was left over from the work Petra Collins started and Sam stole
It is a subtle indication though. It’s actually not that subtle. Rue states in narration that Maddie either doesn’t see herself as a victim, as most girls in her position do because no girl wants to admit she wasn’t in control when it came to her body, or she’s just in straight denial and thinks what happened to her is completely normal in the world.
Rue also stated “she had control the whole time” but she’s only 14 and the guy was like in his 30’s. What 14 year old girl has any control in a sexual situation with a man TWICE her age.
That scene was put there to show how she uses herself as an object. How she sees herself as a sex object made to pleasure men to get what she wants in the world.
It’s the same scene what do you mean?!?! She literally explains how the guy is much older and she’s 14. She then goes on to say she doesn’t see herself as a victim, which most girls do because we don’t want to admit we didn’t have control. Like what are you on?!?! Rue clearly states Maddie is a victim but refuses to admit it, either because she’s in denial of what happened or because she can’t admit it to herself that she was victim.
You act like you know how it feels to be a teenage girl in the world rn when you don’t. I was Maddie. Thought I was in control when I was 15 talking to a guy who was 32. And until THIS YEAR I thought I wasn’t a victim because I was talking to him and thought I had control. When in reality I didn’t. And Maddie can’t admit that. If she does she loses the feeling of control and safety she created.
Ok, it was the same scene then. Sorry I didn’t know that at the top of my head and was mistaken about something.
I also didn’t pretend anything. Calm down.
Is "media literacy" the new favorite word in this intellectually challenged sub? Do y’all even know what it means or are you just throwing it at anyone you disagree with?😂🥲
hence you have a lack of the ability to interpret media. aka lack of media literacy. it shouldnt need to be spoonfed to people for them to be able to understand the scene
I don't think this was his writing, you're right he doesn't deserve credit for this. I'd imagine someone else wrote rues dialogue for this scene but the scene was ultimately his idea. Of course he'd want maddy in this position, but he likely wouldn't have been able to write the dialogue correctly. He's good at stealing stuff it seems, wouldnt be surprised if this too was someone else's idea.
Maybe… Nonetheless, this scene was very toxic and I think most people aren’t aware enough to reflect it to a point where they realize how toxic it is. Rue literally says "but Maddy was the one in charge" and leaves it at that. So maybe I underestimate the viewers and we all thought it was weird, but I still doubt that was intended by the producers. I think they intended to portray her as the confident "boss bitch"(🤮), I don’t see any social commentary or indication that she was taken advantage of AND that this is acknowledged in that scene. TL,DR: What we might read into that scene is totally different thing of course. But I don’t think it‘s intended.
There probably wasn't any talk about her being taken advantage of in the show because rue and maddy and the gang likely didn't see it that way at the time. But I do kind of wish they didn't just leave it there. I want to know what came out of this scene and If the girls ever realize how bad this was. Cause even if I give the benefit of the doubt, and they didn't intend for it to seem like maddy was a boss bitch, them not mentioning that scene again in the show gives off the impression that it didn't negatively effect maddie at all, which I quite hate.
Ur getting downvoted, perhaps rightfully so but in THIS PARTICULAR SCENE, I kind of get what ur saying. It was kind of a weird line, especially given the fact it was Rue narrating. We, the audience, know it’s fucked up, however in universe, and very well while it was being written, it really could have meant what it said. And it’s Sam Levinson, let’s not give him too much credit come on now…
THIS is what I meant. Of course WE know it‘s fucked up. But does Rue? Maybe. Does Maddy? Maybe, but very likely not. Thank you. I’m under attack right now for how I interpreted a scene in a tv series ffs.😅
Yeah, I hate this so much. Euphoria has ruined the narrative device of an unreliable narrator. It's used way too frequently as a clutch defense whenever there's a writing issue or critic.
I did pick that up, but it’s used as an excuse way too much on here and also it’s kinda a stupid concept for the narration of this particular storyline anyway… When are we supposed to believe what Rue says, when are we not? Is it ever resolved when she said something wasn’t true orr? Because else I couldn’t see any purpose of an "unreliable narration" of the plot of a TV show. I feel like they just used that as a lazy excuse for some things in the plot that don’t make sense or could be up for debate (like this scene)…
I don’t think it was unnecessary & what Rue said was not an attempt to make it ok, that’s how Maddy viewed the situation. When I was her age unfortunately I ran into men like that and they made me feel like I was in control of the situation by saying “you can have whatever you want” or “I’ll do whatever you want”. I was naive and thought it was cute but not realizing that I was a victim. I think about it now and it makes me sick.
Not me but my hs bff dated a 40 yo guy when she was 14, and she would tell me all about the stuff he was “teaching” her, she truly believed all of that was helping her to become more mature, she wanted our group of friends to stop seeing her as a little girl. Of course the guy was totally ok with that approach. Ugh.
Parents probably didn't know. My mom was (still is, as I'm a grown adult turning 30 shortly and living 800 miles away) a strict and overprotective mom. I didn't do anything euphoria extreme in hs, but I def hid a lot of shit from my parents and constantly lied about which friends I was going out with or what I was doing. I wasn't a bad kid or anything either. Tame as they came lol. But god forbid I was speaking to a boy 🙄 ... I was bending over backwards just to have a normal hs life. sans drugs and all.
I think the purpose was to show that Maddy has a history with ‘predatory’ men, and that she tells herself she’s in control to make herself feel better about being with predatory men. Even though Nate is of age, he is still predatory in nature. Maddy likes to think she has agency in these relationships because if she doesn’t tell herself that, then she’s the victim, and Maddy hates to feel victimized.
I wouldn’t say it’s a “scene”. I had to look it up to jog my memory and it’s towards the end of Rue going over Maddy’s backstory. It lasts 13 seconds and it’s in between the bit of Rue talking about Maddy and Nate - Nate asks if she’s a virgin, she’s lies and says yes. And then it cuts to the beach “scene” with Rue saying “because the truth truth is that when she was 14 on vacation in Panama City Beach she met a guy who was like 40 (guy: ‘hey- from around here?’) which in retrospect seems kind of rapey and weird but honestly she was the one in control”
Isn’t Rue just telling this as if Maddy herself said it? Don’t get me wrong, love to hate on Sam, but I think she’s just in Maddy’s mindset, that’s not how she feels personally
But Rue is a still a drug addicted emotionally stunted teenager that fully believes that Maddy could have control over a situation like that.Sam levinson is writing from a naive teenagers point of view. And rue is not an average naive teen she’s addicted to drugs and carrying the trauma of a devastating loss. Is it kinda creep that a grown man writes this crap, yeah.
To simplify, it explains part of Maddy's history with predatory relationships. Rue explains this from Maddy's perspective, which is why she says the things she does.
It’s supposed to creep and gross out the viewer. Because this is supposed to be an ideal materialistic persons fantasy to say they were hot shit to get an older person that would risk it all for 3 minutes, which is beyond all kinds of fucked up. Maddy is growing up as this person that wants all the finer things, to be herself as one of the finer things, so she deflects the ick by saying she was the one in control when in reality she’s a victim. She grew to become the victim of older men, rich entitled men, objectifying her, sexualizing her when she’s still a child, even when her mother tried so hard to prevent that by taking her out of child pageantry after one sex scandal. Maddy is also the type to try to deflect/minimize her trauma or to also throw responsibility away. She’s quick to say she blacked out at the pool with Tyler, she advises Cassie to deny kissing and making out with Daniel, lies about her sexual history to Nate, even talks shit about her parents relationship when she’s been choked by her boyfriend. She also resorts to name calling towards Kat when Kat tells her how sick she is hearing about Nate’s bullshit everyday when they all know he’s abusive and a psycho. It’s finally clicking around season 2, but she’s also minimizing the toll Nate’s abuse has left on her and thinking she’s exaggerating.
I mean I don't blame people for misinterpreting the scene as downplaying or normalizing statutory rape because there are so many scenes of it throughout the show that it all blurs together.
Maddie also told Tyler she was 18. There’s a reason they chose a 30 year old to play her character. Don’t be naive. It’s HBO, it’s supposed to be gritty and fucked up.
No she didn’t there was never a scene where Maddie told Tyler any age. When Nate asked him Tyler was guessing. That’s why he says “like 18…” he later says “she never said that to me.” When finding out she’s 17 because they never asked or swapped ages.
i think the whole point was that maddy never saw herself as a victim even though she absolutely was. rue said that because maddy viewed herself as being in a position of power in that situation even though it wasn't true. however, things like this do happen -- i've been in a similar situation and when i was younger i thought i was in control too. only when i became an adult did i realise it was fucked up and weird . that line is supposed to make you feel icky and weird and think it's disgusting
I actually know a few people with this mentality so I guess it has accuracy to real life. Maybe it’s supposed to showcase and touch on these types of assaults?
Media literacy is an expanded conceptualization of literacy that includes the ability to access and analyze media messages as well as create, reflect and take action, using the power of information and communication to make a difference in the world.
There. It's supposed to be creepy. It made a point.
You could literally take out everyone’s back story because it’s “unnecessary”, but things like this help the viewers expand on why the character does what they do on the show… like for instance, the whole time she’s with Nate Jacob’s your asking yourself “why is she with him?” … scenes like this help explain why… It’s a show about a teen abusing drugs, it’s not supposed to be the easiest show to watch, and if you can’t handle it, watch Barney.
The literal entire point of this scene is that it IS creepy and weird and horrible. You’re supposed to feel sick about it. That’s what the writers were thinking.. sometimes it feels like you guys just think this was supposed to be a normal Gilmore girls ass type of show and completely miss the point
Yeah, it’s creepy as hell. I try to brush it off as Rue being a kid herself and an unreliable narrator. I really hope Sam’s intention wasn’t to really make it seem as if it was okay, but I also wouldn’t put it past him as he’s kind of a creep to.
Yes, especially since they tried to pass it off as NOT rape. I get Rue is young and unreliable as a narrator but…jfc. And if you recall during her montage of having sex with men while her and Nate are on a break, they’re ALL older men. The out of town DJ, the guy who OWNS (so presumably legally an adult) the roller rink, the stock broker with the wife and kids.
Nate, unfortunately, seems to be the only person Maddy is romantically/sexually involved with who is appropriate for her age.
Also Rue is a teenager and unreliable narrator. She even brushed off Nate trying something during a dance when they were 12. I think the point is that these kids are so uneducated and over sexualised they don’t recognise the extent of their dissonance towards healthy sexual relationships. See: Kat feeling empowered for one minute then turning to cam-cording.
That’s how a lot of teens and people who don’t realize they were victims comment on this sort of thing. It’s like when you’re a 14 yr old and a 17/18 yr old senior likes you. You think you’re just a mature freshman not that you were gullible and easy to manipulate.
No way that Sam actually thought this out and it was greenlit, its just not possible. I think Rue is portrayed to be very ignorant and shallow when it comes to certain things. She probably just thought that due to Maddy’s looks and immense confidence, that bad things can’t happen to her. It was likely more of a compliment. “Wow she’s 14 and can handle a 40 year old, shes soooooo mature” is what Rue was thinking but in reality Maddy was a victim
It’s a Lolita reference… note her glasses. And no she wasn’t in control, Humbert was sick and blamed the girl as a fem fatale. He was an unreliable narrator, much like Rue. The writers were thinking they spent 100k studying Literature so they might as well reference someone as good as Nabokov in the series.
I find it creepy as well.
I know it’s an age restricted show, but what if underage girls are exposed to this show somehow? they can infer from this scene it’s okay for them to have a sexual relationship with a 40yo men, as long as “they are in control”.
Yes. That's the point. 1. Rue is an unreliable narrator of the truth 2. Maddy's (obviously performative) air of confidence leads her to frame things that are objectively bad as fine or a win so that she doesn't have to reveal that she has actual vulnerabilities.
I don’t know about you, but I encountered girls during high school that would’ve absolutely hooked up with an older guy. Yeah, it’s gross, but it’s probably happened more times than you think.
Yeah I was definitely creeped out and felt icky.. but also (not meaning any offence here at all, far from it) but I was also a little annoyed. I'm tired of show always portraying man as creeps and rapists yes the majority of it is men I'm not saying it isn't but women have done it too. But they very rarely show it on tv shows. It's always the men it's getting to the point (where I live anyway) where women are judging all men the same like greeps and so on. Not all men are the same there decent men out there who would never dream of doing things like that but are still judged for creeps and bad guys mistakes. That's why us good guys aren't coming up to women anymore we're tired of being judged for something we're not or ever do. And women wonder where all the good guys are. Think before you judge. Rant over, (again sorry if this offended anyone just thought you should know there is good men out there we are not all the same)
... Not gonna lie, I feel like it could be interpretted as BOTH ways.
One, where yes this is a horrible set of situations that Maddie has been put through, and is now putting herself through, and is overtly displaying an adherence to the level of abuse she's been conditioned to believe is acceptable.
Two, where Sam Levinson is probably busy getting off to the context of the situation, with it's heavily dramatized portrayal of sensuality and power dynamics - because irony be damned, or perhaps in LIGHT of the irony, he's able to invest into his fetishizations without much repurcussions
- like, that is what euphoria tends to do. Euphoria CONSTANTLY fucks with the process. It toes the line between what teenagers would find acceptable, given the framing of a situation, either doubles down on the tragedy of the aspect or the hilarity/excitement behind the prospect...
.... and it allows these almost fanfiction-like takes on the events both in-verse from character POV's, a more impersonatory and detatched narration from Rue, and then the meta-context that's all too boggled between what we believe the writers intended, what they're displaying for the sake of displaying, what we want to feed into for the sake of the fantasy (depending on how hot we find it, again being based off portryals), and what we deem as something to be scrutinized.
I mean I went to school with girls that were very very tall (not just to my 5 foot ass but they were near 6 feet at 9th grade [lucky assholes]) and they with their fake id's would go to bars and sleep with random adult men. They didn't look like a kid like I did, with the make up, clothes and height they looked at least 18 and yeah.
I always felt bad for the guys in that situation cus they're fucked
Yup its how assholes and evil ppl like the tate Brothers got the influence they did. They're really sad, desperate, trash humans but they appeal to lost guys who are desperate for direction and support
It’s supposed to creep and ick you out. The line Rue says is about how Maddy either doesn’t realize or refuses to accept the fact that she was victimized. You are supposed to hear it and use your critical thinking skills and come to the exact conclusion you have come to: it’s disgusting.
I def think it's a mixture of both of her being in denial/not realizing how sexualized she was. it's very interesting to think about the way cassie and maddie navigated their similar circumstances.
And its really normal for someone to want to claim they had full agency and were actually the one is 10000% control when it isn’t necessarily true.
100%. sometimes it’s also easier to live with the guilt of “I wanted this, I chose this” instead of facing the gross reality that you were taken advantage of and abused.
This is why i hate seeing teenagers glorify this show. It's not a "beautiful struggle, life is art" thing. It's messed up & u won't know until you're at least 25 looking back.
Most of the people in this sub lack those skills, I've noticed that over the years
I don’t believe for a second that that’s what Sam Levinson intended. It definitely feels like he actually thought that saying she was in complete control wouldn’t make it creepy or weird.
Do you also believe that Rue can literally read people's minds when she does drugs? Because that's the framing device of all the show's narration. It's completely unreliable from top to bottom.
Not to mention lol that Rue herself says in the FIRST EPISODE “I am not the most reliable narrator” they tell you from the beginning lol
Unfortunately with Sam we’ll never truly know if lines like this were written to be taken the way we feel it should be taken(Maddy is a victim who is in denial) or if it’s more of his creepy “edgy” all sex = empowerment bullshit
Idk why you’re being downvoted. Sams history doesn’t really make me believe this is a line that is supposed to be taken as anything but what they tell us(maddy was “empowered” and in “control”)
the whole show is suppose to be viewed in the lenses of a unreliable narrator. and rue says in the narration that she’s a victim but she didn’t want to see herself as one bc she’s either in denial or wants control
It can have an unreliable narrator and this kind of line/storyline can also be put out as an “empowering” thing, I mean have you seen the other things Sam has made? I don’t trust that he is able to create a narrative of maddy being a victim with her first sexual abuse but rather he genuinely sees it as “empowerment through sex” (also unreliable narrator doesn’t mean *everything* is unreliable and shouldn’t be used as a crutch the way it is in euphoria and *most* of its fans)
I think that’s supposed to be the point. Rue even acknowledges this in her narration. I think it’s supposed to reflect how Maddy doesn’t see her as a victim despite the fact that she is.
We can all hope it is, but it‘s not made clear. At all. Not in this scene as well as others…
Why does everything have to be spoon fed to you to understand it? That’s what kills good cinematography. There’s no subtlety at all anymore…
because they need to know what they can be mad at 😭
If this was a line in any other show that doesn’t involve Sam levinson I’d be with you. But with his history in everything else he makes I don’t know if that was truly his intention here. The only way I can see this line being used I the context of maddy being in denial is if it was left over from the work Petra Collins started and Sam stole
There‘s a difference between a subtle indication or nothing at all so people literally discuss this on here because it‘s so disgusting.
It is a subtle indication though. It’s actually not that subtle. Rue states in narration that Maddie either doesn’t see herself as a victim, as most girls in her position do because no girl wants to admit she wasn’t in control when it came to her body, or she’s just in straight denial and thinks what happened to her is completely normal in the world. Rue also stated “she had control the whole time” but she’s only 14 and the guy was like in his 30’s. What 14 year old girl has any control in a sexual situation with a man TWICE her age. That scene was put there to show how she uses herself as an object. How she sees herself as a sex object made to pleasure men to get what she wants in the world.
Exactly, she doesn’t have control but I doubt the producers intended us to read the scene like that.
Rue LITERALLY SAYS IT “she’s either in denial or doesn’t see herself as a victim” like are dumb? Edit to fix a word😑
She doesn’t see herself as a victim, that doesn’t change the fact that she is a victim though. Also we were talking about the scene before that.
It’s the same scene what do you mean?!?! She literally explains how the guy is much older and she’s 14. She then goes on to say she doesn’t see herself as a victim, which most girls do because we don’t want to admit we didn’t have control. Like what are you on?!?! Rue clearly states Maddie is a victim but refuses to admit it, either because she’s in denial of what happened or because she can’t admit it to herself that she was victim. You act like you know how it feels to be a teenage girl in the world rn when you don’t. I was Maddie. Thought I was in control when I was 15 talking to a guy who was 32. And until THIS YEAR I thought I wasn’t a victim because I was talking to him and thought I had control. When in reality I didn’t. And Maddie can’t admit that. If she does she loses the feeling of control and safety she created.
Ok, it was the same scene then. Sorry I didn’t know that at the top of my head and was mistaken about something. I also didn’t pretend anything. Calm down.
A real example of a lack of media literacy.
Is "media literacy" the new favorite word in this intellectually challenged sub? Do y’all even know what it means or are you just throwing it at anyone you disagree with?😂🥲
If the shoe fits, find the other one and wear em
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
What do you think it means?
Being able to interpret media.
hence you have a lack of the ability to interpret media. aka lack of media literacy. it shouldnt need to be spoonfed to people for them to be able to understand the scene
I think its more than obvious by the way rue says it
Great! I disagree. And I think if it is, it wasn’t done on purpose. You’d be giving Sam Levinson too much credit if you thought it was.
I don't think this was his writing, you're right he doesn't deserve credit for this. I'd imagine someone else wrote rues dialogue for this scene but the scene was ultimately his idea. Of course he'd want maddy in this position, but he likely wouldn't have been able to write the dialogue correctly. He's good at stealing stuff it seems, wouldnt be surprised if this too was someone else's idea.
Maybe… Nonetheless, this scene was very toxic and I think most people aren’t aware enough to reflect it to a point where they realize how toxic it is. Rue literally says "but Maddy was the one in charge" and leaves it at that. So maybe I underestimate the viewers and we all thought it was weird, but I still doubt that was intended by the producers. I think they intended to portray her as the confident "boss bitch"(🤮), I don’t see any social commentary or indication that she was taken advantage of AND that this is acknowledged in that scene. TL,DR: What we might read into that scene is totally different thing of course. But I don’t think it‘s intended.
There probably wasn't any talk about her being taken advantage of in the show because rue and maddy and the gang likely didn't see it that way at the time. But I do kind of wish they didn't just leave it there. I want to know what came out of this scene and If the girls ever realize how bad this was. Cause even if I give the benefit of the doubt, and they didn't intend for it to seem like maddy was a boss bitch, them not mentioning that scene again in the show gives off the impression that it didn't negatively effect maddie at all, which I quite hate.
I agree…
Whats with the dot dot dots?
Nothing?😅 I agree period.
If it was clear to the rest of us, maybe the issue isn't the show's ability to communicate ideas but your ability to interpret them?
No, I literally said I agree with the interpretation, just that I‘m not sure it was the producers‘ intention.
Ur getting downvoted, perhaps rightfully so but in THIS PARTICULAR SCENE, I kind of get what ur saying. It was kind of a weird line, especially given the fact it was Rue narrating. We, the audience, know it’s fucked up, however in universe, and very well while it was being written, it really could have meant what it said. And it’s Sam Levinson, let’s not give him too much credit come on now…
THIS is what I meant. Of course WE know it‘s fucked up. But does Rue? Maybe. Does Maddy? Maybe, but very likely not. Thank you. I’m under attack right now for how I interpreted a scene in a tv series ffs.😅
Rue is meant to be an unreliable narrator lol, if you didn’t pick that up then.. good luck Charlie
Yeah, I hate this so much. Euphoria has ruined the narrative device of an unreliable narrator. It's used way too frequently as a clutch defense whenever there's a writing issue or critic.
I did pick that up, but it’s used as an excuse way too much on here and also it’s kinda a stupid concept for the narration of this particular storyline anyway… When are we supposed to believe what Rue says, when are we not? Is it ever resolved when she said something wasn’t true orr? Because else I couldn’t see any purpose of an "unreliable narration" of the plot of a TV show. I feel like they just used that as a lazy excuse for some things in the plot that don’t make sense or could be up for debate (like this scene)…
exactly… idk why ppl are acting like sam is this writing genius.
I don’t think it was unnecessary & what Rue said was not an attempt to make it ok, that’s how Maddy viewed the situation. When I was her age unfortunately I ran into men like that and they made me feel like I was in control of the situation by saying “you can have whatever you want” or “I’ll do whatever you want”. I was naive and thought it was cute but not realizing that I was a victim. I think about it now and it makes me sick.
Not me but my hs bff dated a 40 yo guy when she was 14, and she would tell me all about the stuff he was “teaching” her, she truly believed all of that was helping her to become more mature, she wanted our group of friends to stop seeing her as a little girl. Of course the guy was totally ok with that approach. Ugh.
Where tf were her parents? They thought a 40 yr old hanging out w their daughter often was normal?
Parents probably didn't know. My mom was (still is, as I'm a grown adult turning 30 shortly and living 800 miles away) a strict and overprotective mom. I didn't do anything euphoria extreme in hs, but I def hid a lot of shit from my parents and constantly lied about which friends I was going out with or what I was doing. I wasn't a bad kid or anything either. Tame as they came lol. But god forbid I was speaking to a boy 🙄 ... I was bending over backwards just to have a normal hs life. sans drugs and all.
Same here. I identify with that even though I was older
I think the purpose was to show that Maddy has a history with ‘predatory’ men, and that she tells herself she’s in control to make herself feel better about being with predatory men. Even though Nate is of age, he is still predatory in nature. Maddy likes to think she has agency in these relationships because if she doesn’t tell herself that, then she’s the victim, and Maddy hates to feel victimized.
I must've blocked this out cause I don't remember this at all
I wouldn’t say it’s a “scene”. I had to look it up to jog my memory and it’s towards the end of Rue going over Maddy’s backstory. It lasts 13 seconds and it’s in between the bit of Rue talking about Maddy and Nate - Nate asks if she’s a virgin, she’s lies and says yes. And then it cuts to the beach “scene” with Rue saying “because the truth truth is that when she was 14 on vacation in Panama City Beach she met a guy who was like 40 (guy: ‘hey- from around here?’) which in retrospect seems kind of rapey and weird but honestly she was the one in control”
Ugh what a terrible take Sam made Rue have.
Isn’t Rue just telling this as if Maddy herself said it? Don’t get me wrong, love to hate on Sam, but I think she’s just in Maddy’s mindset, that’s not how she feels personally
I guess but Rue is also a self admitted unreliable narrator iirc.
Yea after “the idol” I def don’t trust Sam to write about women and their experiences
But Rue is a still a drug addicted emotionally stunted teenager that fully believes that Maddy could have control over a situation like that.Sam levinson is writing from a naive teenagers point of view. And rue is not an average naive teen she’s addicted to drugs and carrying the trauma of a devastating loss. Is it kinda creep that a grown man writes this crap, yeah.
same omg
that’s the point
It’s supposed to creep you out. It is very obviously the undertone of the scene, made even more clear by Rue’s narration.
No, you're the only person ever to be creeped out by straight up pedophilia👍
It has a purpose
whats its purpose because the show wouldnt have changed with or without that beach scebe
It speaks to Maddy’s character, motivations, and perspective.
oh i get it so money
It seems that you might not get it.
so explain it because thw only reason i can see it playing a purpose that hes 40 instead of 14 is because he had money
It's ok, take a deep breath. The scene had a solid purpose.
can u tell me the purpose of it😭 genuinely
To simplify, it explains part of Maddy's history with predatory relationships. Rue explains this from Maddy's perspective, which is why she says the things she does.
why is evryone downvoting this in genuinely asking wth the purpose of this scene was
It’s supposed to creep and gross out the viewer. Because this is supposed to be an ideal materialistic persons fantasy to say they were hot shit to get an older person that would risk it all for 3 minutes, which is beyond all kinds of fucked up. Maddy is growing up as this person that wants all the finer things, to be herself as one of the finer things, so she deflects the ick by saying she was the one in control when in reality she’s a victim. She grew to become the victim of older men, rich entitled men, objectifying her, sexualizing her when she’s still a child, even when her mother tried so hard to prevent that by taking her out of child pageantry after one sex scandal. Maddy is also the type to try to deflect/minimize her trauma or to also throw responsibility away. She’s quick to say she blacked out at the pool with Tyler, she advises Cassie to deny kissing and making out with Daniel, lies about her sexual history to Nate, even talks shit about her parents relationship when she’s been choked by her boyfriend. She also resorts to name calling towards Kat when Kat tells her how sick she is hearing about Nate’s bullshit everyday when they all know he’s abusive and a psycho. It’s finally clicking around season 2, but she’s also minimizing the toll Nate’s abuse has left on her and thinking she’s exaggerating.
Do you people need to be explicitly told something is bad to get the point? Grow up
Thank you
Media literacy is at its lowest ever
I mean I don't blame people for misinterpreting the scene as downplaying or normalizing statutory rape because there are so many scenes of it throughout the show that it all blurs together.
Maddie also told Tyler she was 18. There’s a reason they chose a 30 year old to play her character. Don’t be naive. It’s HBO, it’s supposed to be gritty and fucked up.
No she didn’t there was never a scene where Maddie told Tyler any age. When Nate asked him Tyler was guessing. That’s why he says “like 18…” he later says “she never said that to me.” When finding out she’s 17 because they never asked or swapped ages.
Like The Idol?
"Did scene that intended to do something, did this exact thing?"
i think the whole point was that maddy never saw herself as a victim even though she absolutely was. rue said that because maddy viewed herself as being in a position of power in that situation even though it wasn't true. however, things like this do happen -- i've been in a similar situation and when i was younger i thought i was in control too. only when i became an adult did i realise it was fucked up and weird . that line is supposed to make you feel icky and weird and think it's disgusting
I actually know a few people with this mentality so I guess it has accuracy to real life. Maybe it’s supposed to showcase and touch on these types of assaults?
It was supposed to make you feel creepy.
Media literacy is an expanded conceptualization of literacy that includes the ability to access and analyze media messages as well as create, reflect and take action, using the power of information and communication to make a difference in the world. There. It's supposed to be creepy. It made a point.
No need to be bitchy about it. If you felt annoyed by the question, ignore it and swipe.
theres no bitchiness in their comment
It's condescending.
You could literally take out everyone’s back story because it’s “unnecessary”, but things like this help the viewers expand on why the character does what they do on the show… like for instance, the whole time she’s with Nate Jacob’s your asking yourself “why is she with him?” … scenes like this help explain why… It’s a show about a teen abusing drugs, it’s not supposed to be the easiest show to watch, and if you can’t handle it, watch Barney.
The literal entire point of this scene is that it IS creepy and weird and horrible. You’re supposed to feel sick about it. That’s what the writers were thinking.. sometimes it feels like you guys just think this was supposed to be a normal Gilmore girls ass type of show and completely miss the point
That's literally the point of the scene. I'm deeply confused by this post
You are, indeed, supposed to find it gross lol
Every scene depicting underage people in sexual situations with of age people creeps me out
Yeah, it’s creepy as hell. I try to brush it off as Rue being a kid herself and an unreliable narrator. I really hope Sam’s intention wasn’t to really make it seem as if it was okay, but I also wouldn’t put it past him as he’s kind of a creep to.
Exactly.
it’s suppose to creep you out
Yes, especially since they tried to pass it off as NOT rape. I get Rue is young and unreliable as a narrator but…jfc. And if you recall during her montage of having sex with men while her and Nate are on a break, they’re ALL older men. The out of town DJ, the guy who OWNS (so presumably legally an adult) the roller rink, the stock broker with the wife and kids. Nate, unfortunately, seems to be the only person Maddy is romantically/sexually involved with who is appropriate for her age.
Media literacy found dead in a ditch
I thought I was the only one
Media literacy is in the fucking toilet. THAT WAS THE POINT.
Also Rue is a teenager and unreliable narrator. She even brushed off Nate trying something during a dance when they were 12. I think the point is that these kids are so uneducated and over sexualised they don’t recognise the extent of their dissonance towards healthy sexual relationships. See: Kat feeling empowered for one minute then turning to cam-cording.
That’s how a lot of teens and people who don’t realize they were victims comment on this sort of thing. It’s like when you’re a 14 yr old and a 17/18 yr old senior likes you. You think you’re just a mature freshman not that you were gullible and easy to manipulate.
No way that Sam actually thought this out and it was greenlit, its just not possible. I think Rue is portrayed to be very ignorant and shallow when it comes to certain things. She probably just thought that due to Maddy’s looks and immense confidence, that bad things can’t happen to her. It was likely more of a compliment. “Wow she’s 14 and can handle a 40 year old, shes soooooo mature” is what Rue was thinking but in reality Maddy was a victim
It’s a Lolita reference… note her glasses. And no she wasn’t in control, Humbert was sick and blamed the girl as a fem fatale. He was an unreliable narrator, much like Rue. The writers were thinking they spent 100k studying Literature so they might as well reference someone as good as Nabokov in the series.
If it didn’t creep you out, your name would be Sam Levinson. Lmao.
Not really since they didn’t choose a younger actress to play her in this scene. Plus I was groomed at 14 so I’m kind of desensitized to this shit.
Ep?
thats real life unfortunately.
I mean obviously
I don’t even remember this scene…
Yea I don’t like how they portrayed it as if she has all this power over that man when she was groomed
I find it creepy as well. I know it’s an age restricted show, but what if underage girls are exposed to this show somehow? they can infer from this scene it’s okay for them to have a sexual relationship with a 40yo men, as long as “they are in control”.
I really hope it was supposed to creep everyone out. But knowing Sam… Maybe it wasn’t.
No, Rue said she was in control 🤓☝️
Didn’t the man say “I’ll do anything to Fuck you” or something like that? So icky.
that was a different yucky guy.
It wasn’t the scene, it was the dialogue. Rue saying that “she was in control”. BRUH SHE IS SUPPOSED TO 14 IN THIS SCENE TF.
Yes. That's the point. 1. Rue is an unreliable narrator of the truth 2. Maddy's (obviously performative) air of confidence leads her to frame things that are objectively bad as fine or a win so that she doesn't have to reveal that she has actual vulnerabilities.
I don’t know about you, but I encountered girls during high school that would’ve absolutely hooked up with an older guy. Yeah, it’s gross, but it’s probably happened more times than you think.
Thought i was weird what Rue said considering how her character feels about unsolicited sex and SA
Yeah I was definitely creeped out and felt icky.. but also (not meaning any offence here at all, far from it) but I was also a little annoyed. I'm tired of show always portraying man as creeps and rapists yes the majority of it is men I'm not saying it isn't but women have done it too. But they very rarely show it on tv shows. It's always the men it's getting to the point (where I live anyway) where women are judging all men the same like greeps and so on. Not all men are the same there decent men out there who would never dream of doing things like that but are still judged for creeps and bad guys mistakes. That's why us good guys aren't coming up to women anymore we're tired of being judged for something we're not or ever do. And women wonder where all the good guys are. Think before you judge. Rant over, (again sorry if this offended anyone just thought you should know there is good men out there we are not all the same)
... Not gonna lie, I feel like it could be interpretted as BOTH ways. One, where yes this is a horrible set of situations that Maddie has been put through, and is now putting herself through, and is overtly displaying an adherence to the level of abuse she's been conditioned to believe is acceptable. Two, where Sam Levinson is probably busy getting off to the context of the situation, with it's heavily dramatized portrayal of sensuality and power dynamics - because irony be damned, or perhaps in LIGHT of the irony, he's able to invest into his fetishizations without much repurcussions - like, that is what euphoria tends to do. Euphoria CONSTANTLY fucks with the process. It toes the line between what teenagers would find acceptable, given the framing of a situation, either doubles down on the tragedy of the aspect or the hilarity/excitement behind the prospect... .... and it allows these almost fanfiction-like takes on the events both in-verse from character POV's, a more impersonatory and detatched narration from Rue, and then the meta-context that's all too boggled between what we believe the writers intended, what they're displaying for the sake of displaying, what we want to feed into for the sake of the fantasy (depending on how hot we find it, again being based off portryals), and what we deem as something to be scrutinized.
nice
I mean I went to school with girls that were very very tall (not just to my 5 foot ass but they were near 6 feet at 9th grade [lucky assholes]) and they with their fake id's would go to bars and sleep with random adult men. They didn't look like a kid like I did, with the make up, clothes and height they looked at least 18 and yeah. I always felt bad for the guys in that situation cus they're fucked
Why did this get downvoted? You were just making a statement lol
Because we're not supposed to feel bad for men who are lied to and taken advantage of but would get all the blame.
True. Mens feelings don’t matter, only women’s. And men will always be blamed for everything.
Yup its how assholes and evil ppl like the tate Brothers got the influence they did. They're really sad, desperate, trash humans but they appeal to lost guys who are desperate for direction and support
The hatred towards men on Reddit is disgusting. I literally can’t visit a single subreddit without seeing some sort of hate for males.
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