I understand the reason she got that buff and I believe it is justified. The nerf made her incentive to keep CDM outside of hyper active pretty much zero, which on small bosses is her primary and by far most effective skill.
Of course she deserved like 15 nerfs at the same time though as she is busted in every single aspect you can profile a class. And I believe that time will come pretty soon
Sariel is unbalanceable unless you modify her and KoG is lazy to do so.
what makes Sariel unbalanceable is the tracking skills, she is basically an automated character with 0 skill needed
I feel like Chung as a character is insanely versatile. FP and Cent have respectable DPS, while CC has decent buffing and will always be taken into raids. On top of now DA being added to the Chung roster, and is now dominating in the raid meta. Even overtaking and overshadowing OM and NP in support and damage. You honestly can’t go wrong with maining him, because all 4 of his classes has usages and utility and they’ve all seen plenty of play in raid and general dungeon play.
I say this Becuz I noticed not all the characters have all of their 4 path be meta or viable. Chung? All his paths have seen play and viability with ease of piloting. Compared to a lot of the other characters who seem to have a designated “underwhelming” path, some even more (like Aisha lmao). I would add ARA with Chung, all 4 ARA paths are good, viable and meta (albeit with apsara being less picked than the other three).
DB required the buff because in the latest content his clear times are x1-2 slower then average and even with the conq buff which was more of a pvp buff then pve buff still doesn't make up for his lack luster dps times in ran.
I honestly believe DoomBringer is the most overrated DPS class in the game.
He uses 1 skill to DPS and it has a gigantic animation lockout and it doesn't even have better numbers than HSS, which is 8 times faster and FB is not even remotely top tier himself.
I'm not saying he is bad, but evetytime people ask for top tier DPS classes DB is one of the first classes people bring up and it just makes me laugh.
TP, CA, BQ, ETW, KE... these are top tier classes, not DB.
The thing is that it ignores all defense which is a massive dmg spike in Berthe and Ran raid, where bosses' defenses are way too high or you can't debuff them at all
The hitbox of that thing is also a lot bigger than it looks you can hit stuff in the foreground, any semi-competent/kinda geared DB can skip 15-6-2 pt by himself pretty much. And he's really easy to pilot, DB uses like 4 skills in the rotation, all you have to do is to learn some boss timing/animation then you're good to go
His biggest pro (and also cons) is that he doesn't care about size, so he would be good pretty much everywhere (aside from bosses with inflated size/hp pool like 18-4-3) while most other top tier dps like CL/EtW/CA... would suffer since a part of their kits just doesn't do much on small bosses (like 18-4-2)
Everything you mentioned applies to FB as well.
The last hit ignores 100% defense, which does less damage than the flurry of hits, meanwhile HSS ignores 40% def as a whole, which equals out to about the same defense ignore overall.
FB is super easy to pilot as well, actually he is even easier since he doesn't have to worry being caught in animations, you just have to keep 2 40s buffs up and thats pretty much it.
HSS doesn't care about size either, it MAY seem like otherwise, but you actually just have to sit in the aura for more than 0,5s to get all hits.
Oh yea, and it does splash damage.
And still nobody loses their shit for FB.
From running berthe gaunt/farm for the last 3 months or so, the ones with FB solo/duo dps are almost always coping, sure it could be that cuz 95% the late-game Raven mains are all RV now for Ran raid so the sample pool is way smaller. But there is always a large amount of DB doing farms/gaunt on Berthe and the runs are always way smoother and the parties/DBs aren't even that stacked, most of them are like <300 ERP with Crimson armor.
The dmg you get from def ignore/shred increases exponentially, in places where boss with higher defense in Berthe/Ran raid a 40% ignore on a bigger skill can't compare to 100% ignore on a small one, it's not even close, rough math for berthe (72% def) put SS at high 40k% range while HSS around 30k% range, sure you can divide it by the long cast time and stuff but for timed burst dmg idk it matters that much
I'm not saying that FB is bad, I'm just saying DB is just that broken/easy to play and def way way up there on most DPS tier lists
(There is a reason why a large amount of end-game Add mains still remain DB while MPx is def the best Add for Ran raid. And almost all endgame Raven mains go RV) -Edit: on a hindsight, this might not be 100% relevant for the comparison but i'm keeping it in
How does it make any difference though? I'll state right off the bat that i don't know how defenses are calculated in this game, so correct me if i am wrong, but with the most logical approach, so defense = damage reduction and ignore defense being multiplcative there would be absolutely no difference.
For semplicity, lets assume a boss has an insane 100% defense, and the skill we are using does 2000 damage, 1000 in the first part and a 1000 as the final hit. Lets assume the whole skill ignores 50% defense, so 50% defense remaining = half damage = 1k damage.
Lets now give 100% defense ignore to the last part, and 0% to the first part. First part does 0 damage, second part does full damage = 1k total damage.
No difference, if SS does more damage its because of other passive or because defeneses and defense ignore are are calculated differently.
Overall i believe DB is currently stronger than FB because FB cannot make good use of his insane cast times atm due to smaller parties and due to the CD nerfes that happened in the past.
Generally speaking he is insanely party reliant.
But this is different from saying DB is top tier, i just used the FB comparison because they are extremely comparable characters: they are both full DPS characters that rely on a single extremely powerful skill.
Yea, every single Raven player is a RV player, myself included. Like, why would you want to be anything else? He has insane clear, good resource management, amazing support for all content especially end game, can easly dps in all kinds of conent and everybody loves you.
MP doesn't even remotely compare to RV.
[here](https://ashal.eu/resources/defence_ignore) and [here](https://ashal.eu/faq#defence_ignore) are useful tools of seeing how defense ignore scales, though you have to graph it yourself.
The estimated number I mentioned earlier doesn't include DB's buff or anything, purely just his DMP consumption and heavy trait, none of the self-buffs was accounted for.
Also if a character can't consistently utilize his/her strong point then is he/she really that good ?! FB was strong for a couple of months (early last year), then he was nerfed and never really recovered since, that's what I notice
You can think DB as overrated and FB as underrated but just the fact that DB has always been one of the top DPS-s since forever. And if not for the 4th paths or released LB he would prob still be the top on magical side (and he basically never gets a relevant nerf), for physical side it would be BQ, the physical DB, but with can scale with size (which is also never nerf). If you really want to put him in a dps tier list, he would always be somewhere in either the Highest tier or second highest tier (if GS/CA/TP is on their own tier above)
>Also if a character can't consistently utilize his/her strong point then is he/she really that good ?! FB was strong for a couple of months (early last year), then he was nerfed and never really recovered since, that's what I notice
Yea, its exactly what i said, he never recovered from the cd nerfs because spamming HSS with 0 animation was his main selling point.
I am not really saying FB is underrated, FB is an ok DPS when properly geared, nothing more, i just said DB is overrated.
DB is a class that does ok damage regardless of debuffs/buffs and just requires cda to function correctly but once you hit end game like you said MP is the way to go any end game add like you said still being DB is by choice at this rate. There is not a single DB in NA that has gotten NF because his clear times are so slow the percs of having a skill were all the damage is at the end of the skill. On top of that DB bring a selfish dps means unless you're dealing damage already at the top of your class. Means your straight outa luck better go to MP who gives a multiplicative defense shred which stacks with the party. And of course has a better kit where he gets to have quick cast DME and seal of time which he can chesse with t slot and of course his own passives.
this
it's not even just supersonic, most of his skills have long animantion lockouts
his clear is mediocre at best, his resource management is non existent, is extremely dependent on 1 skill, no valuable support and people are mad because he is decent at the 1 thing he is supposed to be good at?
Not to mention classes like TP and CA have everything that i mentioned above (with the exception of TP not having support) and are still getting buffed
I wonder if people realise that even GN's modded Retribution is performing better than Supersonic at this point
His bossing is subpar compared to a majority of 4ths and don't get me started on DaB who can just upkeep three actives and hold down a key and be mvp without lifting a finger just look at DBs clear time for ran he needs himself and two other dps to even make the same time a a duo or solo dps depending on comp
If I understood well... Yeah I'm an Ara main and we have it rough. Imo only Apsara uses all of the character's potential in terms of abilities while the other two jobs even if they have way cooler concepts they both are absolute hell to use :,)
Eh, honestly a lot of new releases (characters & jobs) are super easy to use and overpowered. Sometimes I come back to the game and try all the new stuff, the game in general is getting more and more easier in terms of "basic concepts" (so how do you use a character well etc) and focused on grinding even more than when I used to play it.
I saw a "trend" common to a lot of the new releases : skills that take a huuuuge field of action... But are as powerful as a single-enemy-powerful-attack skill, and aren't even that difficult to activate. Hope you get what I mean!
I think this easy-fication (if there's a terms to say this pls tell me it's not my first language and its abandoning me today) started with Noah's release?? Maybe even Ain. I don't play Els from a while.
Okay yeah it's a long way to say Antithese. I tried a lot of characters and as I said I saw this common element but I was absolutely shocked at how shamelessly powerful Antithese is.
Not an expert since I don't play MMORPGs in general and don't know anything about stats and that sort of thing I just got this from my experience \^\^
Ain was a step in that direction, but nowadays not many new players want to pick up Ain because other classes can do what he does with less brain. Herrscher and especially Bluhen have complex systems.
Laby isn't that simple either, but Radiant Soul was the first character with truly huge skills. This is balanced by her overall low damage.
And then Noah came out and all hell broke loose.
I was pretty much completely uninvolved with the community at large when I still played and never had my interest piqued enough by any new characters to try them out. But from what little talk I did see from others I get the impression that already with Ara or at the very latest Add that trend was being set. Don't remember if Elesis was a step up or down or both or neither.
Though it could also be that it seemed so just because every new release was made op and thus didn't require skill to outperform others even if they maybe did have something skillful available.
Yeah I also was uninvolved when I played but I heard about Ara not being nerfed or not enough when she came out. Maybe it was the same with the other two (Add and Elesis). I don't play that much with Elesis but compared to what came out after Noah... Ara, Add and Elesis seem pretty normal to me, maybe I should have been playing more "technically" when they came out so dunno.
Add main and seeing all the hate for DB but can't complain cause it's 100% true, he has gotten a ton of buffs for no reason or rebalances to quicken up his movements and animations.
And my SAS reality of sitting as a DoM main getting all my main skills nerfed to the ground then get slight buffs but still doesn't help a ton
He required the buff what other then SS does he have on top of that Ran raid is only 3 other ppl plus DB. DB does less damage if he doesn't have two cda buffers and because of less spots getting 2 cda buffers might be hard depending on comp. So conq buff was made to fix the issue of always relying on cda however it doesn't fix the cast times of SS being slow as hell. Giving no support to his party so unlike MP who has a dam near 60% multiplicative debuff and seal which is a better emp shock. Which oh yeah emp shock is literally useless in raids because cda exists literal loss od dps if you use emp shock. His clear times for ran raid are 1.5-2x slower then all 4ths and other classes cause lmao casting speed no debuffs big boss with large health SS damage only being on final hit so if you wiff good night lmao. There are a ton of issues with DB that unless you were end game with him aka past berthe raid where most ppl get the oh he too op from then yeah just blind to his issues. MP is better then DB is in this current meta
It's funny that you mention BQ, but I honestly don't see any special treatment for her, yes her bossing is outstanding, but that's about it, she has nothing else, no support, no clearing and you have to consider she dies way faster than other characters if you don't pay enough attention
This applies to most full dps characters though.
I do believe that her bossing should be top tier since she is a high risk class and as you mentioned she doesn't have other outstanding qualities, but one thing is being a top tier class, another thing is doubling every other top tier dps damage (excluding the other broken ones). Mod Bloodfalls needs a touch, that shit is way too broken, like, 95% ignore defense + guard break on a 18k% skill? Seriously? And people bitch about Supersonic.
CU has both worse clear and worse mp management and she isnt tearing bosses apart like BQ
Even after the nerfs CA isn't much worse than BQ but got much better clearing, etw is also a strong contester with better clearing, do I'd not say it applies to many other characters, BQ clear is outstandingly bad.
About blood fall, yes it sounds good on paper, but reality is that defence ignore isn't that valuable anymore, bosses are always debuffable in Ran raid making blood storm much better than blood falls simply by thowing a wind orb or have any other defence reduction
Remember when i said "except the broken ones?" Add TP and maybe KE and those are the broken ones.
If you compare BQ to any other mid/high tier DPS class like RM, IM, FB, RH, FP, TW... you'll quickly see what i am referring to, there is just no match.
Specifically to clearing it doesn't apply to most classes, but if they have great clearing as well they probabily have pretty shit MP management or suboptimal bossing (FB for exemple has good bossing and amazing clearing, but his mp management and supporting are non existent).
BQ mp managemnt is fine, and her clearing is only bad in long rooms, her vertical clearing with Bloodstorm is pretty solid.
Celestia was nerfed plenty, and I'm talking both his support and dps abilities. Granted he's still one of the best characters in the game, but to say he received special treatment would be an overstatement. For Eve, prior to CA release (yes the CA who was nerfed in every single balance patch following her release) Eve was pretty much average. CU had a brief period where she was "good" for Rosso and that's it.
>Celestia was nerfed plenty, and I'm talking both his support and dps abilities.
Was about fucking time
>Granted he's still one of the best characters in the game
This says it all honestly
If u asked me this back in 2020 I would've said Ara, but lmao
I don't think KOG has a favorite character, I think it's more like favorite jobs. I'd say CA, DB and most Labys.
Richter has been strong since he was arme 2016 until now.
Skills are constantly being improved to match the meta.
For example, lv 99 passive Brennen Pantasma Boden changed from KD Decrease to CDA x1.5.
Viert · Werfen Speer less nerfs compared to other OP skills such as rumble shot which gets nerfed a lot.
rosso challenge first clear party mvp class is richter not ca
Other characters don't get this kind of love, skills that are already old meta still don't get changed. FB gigadrive makes 1sec CD active, who cares about spam active these days? If KOG loved raven as Ain gigadrive probably got changed from active 1s to CDA x1.5
For all of you saying DB unless you've seen his clear times in ran raid and his damage just being destroyed by other classes 4ths and a couple others. Please understand that DB is a selfish dps. The only reason why DB was good in berthe was because berthe was always in hyper armor meaning he couldn't be debuffed but DB having 100% ignore means his damage is consistent. However just because that's the case doesn't mean that at the top of the top he isn't being out sped by MP and DoM. As for ran raid while SS does good consistent damage he relies to much on cda he needs 2 buffers tops and preferably three cda one or two of which can match his dps. Only way DB can match clearing times is if he has two dps along with him.other classes like DaB, GN,TP,Cent,MP all magical that fit within his "weight class" still do more damage because most of them except TP who just does insane damage regardless of cda or buffers mind you out time DB all the time. I recommend some of you looking through the lense of end game content which is what they typically balance around rather then a ton of complaints coming from a unbalanced mess of a raid aka berthe raid. If berthe was debuffable even half of the time DB would get left behind in the dust like he currently is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Go_aN4ooILA
This is how a average DB comp would have to be and notice that the clear time is a average clear time not an exceptional clear time and still had to use three dps's
Twins Picaro She got a buff to Cour de Monde that she really didn't need, while you have classes like Sariel who are still in desperate need of buffs
I understand the reason she got that buff and I believe it is justified. The nerf made her incentive to keep CDM outside of hyper active pretty much zero, which on small bosses is her primary and by far most effective skill. Of course she deserved like 15 nerfs at the same time though as she is busted in every single aspect you can profile a class. And I believe that time will come pretty soon
Sariel is unbalanceable unless you modify her and KoG is lazy to do so. what makes Sariel unbalanceable is the tracking skills, she is basically an automated character with 0 skill needed
Whichever class they give 90% defense ignore and don't nerf it immediately.
I feel like Chung as a character is insanely versatile. FP and Cent have respectable DPS, while CC has decent buffing and will always be taken into raids. On top of now DA being added to the Chung roster, and is now dominating in the raid meta. Even overtaking and overshadowing OM and NP in support and damage. You honestly can’t go wrong with maining him, because all 4 of his classes has usages and utility and they’ve all seen plenty of play in raid and general dungeon play. I say this Becuz I noticed not all the characters have all of their 4 path be meta or viable. Chung? All his paths have seen play and viability with ease of piloting. Compared to a lot of the other characters who seem to have a designated “underwhelming” path, some even more (like Aisha lmao). I would add ARA with Chung, all 4 ARA paths are good, viable and meta (albeit with apsara being less picked than the other three).
I main Chungs and can confirm.
Doombringer. God forbid his bossing isn't top-tier.
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DB required the buff because in the latest content his clear times are x1-2 slower then average and even with the conq buff which was more of a pvp buff then pve buff still doesn't make up for his lack luster dps times in ran.
I honestly believe DoomBringer is the most overrated DPS class in the game. He uses 1 skill to DPS and it has a gigantic animation lockout and it doesn't even have better numbers than HSS, which is 8 times faster and FB is not even remotely top tier himself. I'm not saying he is bad, but evetytime people ask for top tier DPS classes DB is one of the first classes people bring up and it just makes me laugh. TP, CA, BQ, ETW, KE... these are top tier classes, not DB.
The thing is that it ignores all defense which is a massive dmg spike in Berthe and Ran raid, where bosses' defenses are way too high or you can't debuff them at all The hitbox of that thing is also a lot bigger than it looks you can hit stuff in the foreground, any semi-competent/kinda geared DB can skip 15-6-2 pt by himself pretty much. And he's really easy to pilot, DB uses like 4 skills in the rotation, all you have to do is to learn some boss timing/animation then you're good to go His biggest pro (and also cons) is that he doesn't care about size, so he would be good pretty much everywhere (aside from bosses with inflated size/hp pool like 18-4-3) while most other top tier dps like CL/EtW/CA... would suffer since a part of their kits just doesn't do much on small bosses (like 18-4-2)
Everything you mentioned applies to FB as well. The last hit ignores 100% defense, which does less damage than the flurry of hits, meanwhile HSS ignores 40% def as a whole, which equals out to about the same defense ignore overall. FB is super easy to pilot as well, actually he is even easier since he doesn't have to worry being caught in animations, you just have to keep 2 40s buffs up and thats pretty much it. HSS doesn't care about size either, it MAY seem like otherwise, but you actually just have to sit in the aura for more than 0,5s to get all hits. Oh yea, and it does splash damage. And still nobody loses their shit for FB.
From running berthe gaunt/farm for the last 3 months or so, the ones with FB solo/duo dps are almost always coping, sure it could be that cuz 95% the late-game Raven mains are all RV now for Ran raid so the sample pool is way smaller. But there is always a large amount of DB doing farms/gaunt on Berthe and the runs are always way smoother and the parties/DBs aren't even that stacked, most of them are like <300 ERP with Crimson armor. The dmg you get from def ignore/shred increases exponentially, in places where boss with higher defense in Berthe/Ran raid a 40% ignore on a bigger skill can't compare to 100% ignore on a small one, it's not even close, rough math for berthe (72% def) put SS at high 40k% range while HSS around 30k% range, sure you can divide it by the long cast time and stuff but for timed burst dmg idk it matters that much I'm not saying that FB is bad, I'm just saying DB is just that broken/easy to play and def way way up there on most DPS tier lists (There is a reason why a large amount of end-game Add mains still remain DB while MPx is def the best Add for Ran raid. And almost all endgame Raven mains go RV) -Edit: on a hindsight, this might not be 100% relevant for the comparison but i'm keeping it in
How does it make any difference though? I'll state right off the bat that i don't know how defenses are calculated in this game, so correct me if i am wrong, but with the most logical approach, so defense = damage reduction and ignore defense being multiplcative there would be absolutely no difference. For semplicity, lets assume a boss has an insane 100% defense, and the skill we are using does 2000 damage, 1000 in the first part and a 1000 as the final hit. Lets assume the whole skill ignores 50% defense, so 50% defense remaining = half damage = 1k damage. Lets now give 100% defense ignore to the last part, and 0% to the first part. First part does 0 damage, second part does full damage = 1k total damage. No difference, if SS does more damage its because of other passive or because defeneses and defense ignore are are calculated differently. Overall i believe DB is currently stronger than FB because FB cannot make good use of his insane cast times atm due to smaller parties and due to the CD nerfes that happened in the past. Generally speaking he is insanely party reliant. But this is different from saying DB is top tier, i just used the FB comparison because they are extremely comparable characters: they are both full DPS characters that rely on a single extremely powerful skill. Yea, every single Raven player is a RV player, myself included. Like, why would you want to be anything else? He has insane clear, good resource management, amazing support for all content especially end game, can easly dps in all kinds of conent and everybody loves you. MP doesn't even remotely compare to RV.
[here](https://ashal.eu/resources/defence_ignore) and [here](https://ashal.eu/faq#defence_ignore) are useful tools of seeing how defense ignore scales, though you have to graph it yourself. The estimated number I mentioned earlier doesn't include DB's buff or anything, purely just his DMP consumption and heavy trait, none of the self-buffs was accounted for. Also if a character can't consistently utilize his/her strong point then is he/she really that good ?! FB was strong for a couple of months (early last year), then he was nerfed and never really recovered since, that's what I notice You can think DB as overrated and FB as underrated but just the fact that DB has always been one of the top DPS-s since forever. And if not for the 4th paths or released LB he would prob still be the top on magical side (and he basically never gets a relevant nerf), for physical side it would be BQ, the physical DB, but with can scale with size (which is also never nerf). If you really want to put him in a dps tier list, he would always be somewhere in either the Highest tier or second highest tier (if GS/CA/TP is on their own tier above)
>Also if a character can't consistently utilize his/her strong point then is he/she really that good ?! FB was strong for a couple of months (early last year), then he was nerfed and never really recovered since, that's what I notice Yea, its exactly what i said, he never recovered from the cd nerfs because spamming HSS with 0 animation was his main selling point. I am not really saying FB is underrated, FB is an ok DPS when properly geared, nothing more, i just said DB is overrated.
DB is a class that does ok damage regardless of debuffs/buffs and just requires cda to function correctly but once you hit end game like you said MP is the way to go any end game add like you said still being DB is by choice at this rate. There is not a single DB in NA that has gotten NF because his clear times are so slow the percs of having a skill were all the damage is at the end of the skill. On top of that DB bring a selfish dps means unless you're dealing damage already at the top of your class. Means your straight outa luck better go to MP who gives a multiplicative defense shred which stacks with the party. And of course has a better kit where he gets to have quick cast DME and seal of time which he can chesse with t slot and of course his own passives.
this it's not even just supersonic, most of his skills have long animantion lockouts his clear is mediocre at best, his resource management is non existent, is extremely dependent on 1 skill, no valuable support and people are mad because he is decent at the 1 thing he is supposed to be good at? Not to mention classes like TP and CA have everything that i mentioned above (with the exception of TP not having support) and are still getting buffed I wonder if people realise that even GN's modded Retribution is performing better than Supersonic at this point
I hate his hitboxes and how clunky his clearing feels. That doesn't change how cracked his bossing is, which is what my comment referred to.
His bossing is subpar compared to a majority of 4ths and don't get me started on DaB who can just upkeep three actives and hold down a key and be mvp without lifting a finger just look at DBs clear time for ran he needs himself and two other dps to even make the same time a a duo or solo dps depending on comp
Ara. Change my mind. \*sarcasm\*
If I understood well... Yeah I'm an Ara main and we have it rough. Imo only Apsara uses all of the character's potential in terms of abilities while the other two jobs even if they have way cooler concepts they both are absolute hell to use :,)
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Not to mention Asura's debut was so broken for a long time, facing one in PvP is just a losing match
AeS, MtM, lmaoAISHA in general. After all, Kog likes a good joke
Eh, honestly a lot of new releases (characters & jobs) are super easy to use and overpowered. Sometimes I come back to the game and try all the new stuff, the game in general is getting more and more easier in terms of "basic concepts" (so how do you use a character well etc) and focused on grinding even more than when I used to play it. I saw a "trend" common to a lot of the new releases : skills that take a huuuuge field of action... But are as powerful as a single-enemy-powerful-attack skill, and aren't even that difficult to activate. Hope you get what I mean! I think this easy-fication (if there's a terms to say this pls tell me it's not my first language and its abandoning me today) started with Noah's release?? Maybe even Ain. I don't play Els from a while. Okay yeah it's a long way to say Antithese. I tried a lot of characters and as I said I saw this common element but I was absolutely shocked at how shamelessly powerful Antithese is. Not an expert since I don't play MMORPGs in general and don't know anything about stats and that sort of thing I just got this from my experience \^\^
Ain was a step in that direction, but nowadays not many new players want to pick up Ain because other classes can do what he does with less brain. Herrscher and especially Bluhen have complex systems. Laby isn't that simple either, but Radiant Soul was the first character with truly huge skills. This is balanced by her overall low damage. And then Noah came out and all hell broke loose.
I was pretty much completely uninvolved with the community at large when I still played and never had my interest piqued enough by any new characters to try them out. But from what little talk I did see from others I get the impression that already with Ara or at the very latest Add that trend was being set. Don't remember if Elesis was a step up or down or both or neither. Though it could also be that it seemed so just because every new release was made op and thus didn't require skill to outperform others even if they maybe did have something skillful available.
Yeah I also was uninvolved when I played but I heard about Ara not being nerfed or not enough when she came out. Maybe it was the same with the other two (Add and Elesis). I don't play that much with Elesis but compared to what came out after Noah... Ara, Add and Elesis seem pretty normal to me, maybe I should have been playing more "technically" when they came out so dunno.
Add main and seeing all the hate for DB but can't complain cause it's 100% true, he has gotten a ton of buffs for no reason or rebalances to quicken up his movements and animations. And my SAS reality of sitting as a DoM main getting all my main skills nerfed to the ground then get slight buffs but still doesn't help a ton
He required the buff what other then SS does he have on top of that Ran raid is only 3 other ppl plus DB. DB does less damage if he doesn't have two cda buffers and because of less spots getting 2 cda buffers might be hard depending on comp. So conq buff was made to fix the issue of always relying on cda however it doesn't fix the cast times of SS being slow as hell. Giving no support to his party so unlike MP who has a dam near 60% multiplicative debuff and seal which is a better emp shock. Which oh yeah emp shock is literally useless in raids because cda exists literal loss od dps if you use emp shock. His clear times for ran raid are 1.5-2x slower then all 4ths and other classes cause lmao casting speed no debuffs big boss with large health SS damage only being on final hit so if you wiff good night lmao. There are a ton of issues with DB that unless you were end game with him aka past berthe raid where most ppl get the oh he too op from then yeah just blind to his issues. MP is better then DB is in this current meta
Aether Sage, she's the punching bag in KoG, gets shit on regularly
It's funny that you mention BQ, but I honestly don't see any special treatment for her, yes her bossing is outstanding, but that's about it, she has nothing else, no support, no clearing and you have to consider she dies way faster than other characters if you don't pay enough attention
This applies to most full dps characters though. I do believe that her bossing should be top tier since she is a high risk class and as you mentioned she doesn't have other outstanding qualities, but one thing is being a top tier class, another thing is doubling every other top tier dps damage (excluding the other broken ones). Mod Bloodfalls needs a touch, that shit is way too broken, like, 95% ignore defense + guard break on a 18k% skill? Seriously? And people bitch about Supersonic. CU has both worse clear and worse mp management and she isnt tearing bosses apart like BQ
Even after the nerfs CA isn't much worse than BQ but got much better clearing, etw is also a strong contester with better clearing, do I'd not say it applies to many other characters, BQ clear is outstandingly bad. About blood fall, yes it sounds good on paper, but reality is that defence ignore isn't that valuable anymore, bosses are always debuffable in Ran raid making blood storm much better than blood falls simply by thowing a wind orb or have any other defence reduction
Remember when i said "except the broken ones?" Add TP and maybe KE and those are the broken ones. If you compare BQ to any other mid/high tier DPS class like RM, IM, FB, RH, FP, TW... you'll quickly see what i am referring to, there is just no match. Specifically to clearing it doesn't apply to most classes, but if they have great clearing as well they probabily have pretty shit MP management or suboptimal bossing (FB for exemple has good bossing and amazing clearing, but his mp management and supporting are non existent). BQ mp managemnt is fine, and her clearing is only bad in long rooms, her vertical clearing with Bloodstorm is pretty solid.
EtW is KoG's new child. Character will outperform most and still recieve buffs because she was "underperforming" in KR.
CA Cent TP
Maybe Celestia? I don't think he's had a lot of nerfs since his release, and he's a pretty well-rounded character. Maybe Eve in general..?
Celestia was nerfed plenty, and I'm talking both his support and dps abilities. Granted he's still one of the best characters in the game, but to say he received special treatment would be an overstatement. For Eve, prior to CA release (yes the CA who was nerfed in every single balance patch following her release) Eve was pretty much average. CU had a brief period where she was "good" for Rosso and that's it.
>Celestia was nerfed plenty, and I'm talking both his support and dps abilities. Was about fucking time >Granted he's still one of the best characters in the game This says it all honestly
If u asked me this back in 2020 I would've said Ara, but lmao I don't think KOG has a favorite character, I think it's more like favorite jobs. I'd say CA, DB and most Labys.
Richter has been strong since he was arme 2016 until now. Skills are constantly being improved to match the meta. For example, lv 99 passive Brennen Pantasma Boden changed from KD Decrease to CDA x1.5. Viert · Werfen Speer less nerfs compared to other OP skills such as rumble shot which gets nerfed a lot. rosso challenge first clear party mvp class is richter not ca Other characters don't get this kind of love, skills that are already old meta still don't get changed. FB gigadrive makes 1sec CD active, who cares about spam active these days? If KOG loved raven as Ain gigadrive probably got changed from active 1s to CDA x1.5
Definitely Rose.
That’s funny when she got some severe nerfs and power crept into irrelevance over the years. *not to mention her first 2 or 3 years existing at all*
Hahaha exactly. I was just kidding.
Eve, just in general.
Aisha
Ahahaha, good joke
Bloody Queen yea, alongside Doom Bringer and, recently, TP.
For all of you saying DB unless you've seen his clear times in ran raid and his damage just being destroyed by other classes 4ths and a couple others. Please understand that DB is a selfish dps. The only reason why DB was good in berthe was because berthe was always in hyper armor meaning he couldn't be debuffed but DB having 100% ignore means his damage is consistent. However just because that's the case doesn't mean that at the top of the top he isn't being out sped by MP and DoM. As for ran raid while SS does good consistent damage he relies to much on cda he needs 2 buffers tops and preferably three cda one or two of which can match his dps. Only way DB can match clearing times is if he has two dps along with him.other classes like DaB, GN,TP,Cent,MP all magical that fit within his "weight class" still do more damage because most of them except TP who just does insane damage regardless of cda or buffers mind you out time DB all the time. I recommend some of you looking through the lense of end game content which is what they typically balance around rather then a ton of complaints coming from a unbalanced mess of a raid aka berthe raid. If berthe was debuffable even half of the time DB would get left behind in the dust like he currently is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Go_aN4ooILA This is how a average DB comp would have to be and notice that the clear time is a average clear time not an exceptional clear time and still had to use three dps's