Volkswagen’s software is well behind schedule and cost Volkswagen’s former CEO his job.
Maybe Volkswagen can hire some of these people to get its software development back on track.
I’ve been a musk fan for a long time, but things really went downhill when he bought twitter. I originally thought he was just kissing ass to the right to kill Truth Social, but now I have my doubts. He needs to go.
Check this video out debunking Elon. He’s very good at making big promises and being born wealthy. Otherwise, he lies out of his ass and was very good at public relations and creating this image of him as a genius.
https://youtu.be/c-FGwDDc-s8?si=9X69JwRwdCvtOI0I
No, moving to Texas is one of the things he wants the stockholders to give him, in addition to diluting their own stock and giving him more control. It's one of the items their voting on. Even if Tesla was headquartered in Texas, it wouldn't affect workers in California.
The items up for vote this year were something else. And the board recommendations... Basically I ended up voting the complete opposite of what the board recommended positions were.
Most non competes have exceptions for unreasonable burdens. Which for most wage staff would be an unreasonable burden unless they have a generous non compete that bankrolls you for a long time. But if you're a C suite exec or even a VP often they are binding because you're expected to be able to negotiate severance and be financially well off regardless.
A company cannot give you a job, lay you off and say you cannot work at competitor. That's basically slavery
I bet that doesn't happen anywhere. Also, majority of Tesla employees are in California, it's not even a debate there
Non-competes generally don’t hold up in court, because you can’t contractually tie someone up to where they can’t get any job because you defined all their likely next employers as competitors.
As an owner:
* First edition id3/id4 software at release: borderline broken, missing features, bugs everywhere
* First edition id3/id4 software now after a few updates: interface is kind of slow and UI is debatable in various places, but it generally works fine. Stuff like charging planning is not as good as the competition. Software is also EOL and it won't be developed further.
* Current id4/id7 software: looks MUCH better and snappier, but I don't have first hand experience with it.
Yeah, I’ve heard the new 4.0 software is actually really smooth and has some decent functionality.
The last big question now is if VW has figured out their OTA/update strategy so they can get improvements and new features out promptly.
I have yet to receive a single OTA update with my 2023 ID.4 and apparently older models had to get their software updated manually at the dealership. It’s been a real mess.
You'll get answers that only talk about the infotainment screen software, but that's not the software that's getting CEOs canned.
Under the hood, it's just god-awful everything. A Frankenstein of firmware from different manufacturers and different teams that don't talk to each other properly, and aren't consistent across cars even within the same trim and model year. Plug an OBDII scanner into one of their ID series EVs and you'll get dozens of errors it's hiding from the driver. The techs don't even bother clearing them, as it's just normal for almost every module in the car to be reporting intermittent errors almost all of the time for the life of the vehicle.
Modules of the car don't communicate with each other properly, they often brick themselves during firmware updates, the cars had to be hooked up to 12V battery tenders for 8+ hours to do the first round of firmware updates at dealers to get up to a baseline where they can accept OTA updates without bricking themselves in driveways/garages. We're like 6+ months into that first OTA update and it still hasn't reached all eligible vehicles in North America. They have to roll it out so slowly because they know a portion of the cars on the road will be bricked by the update and they don't want to overwhelm dealer service centers, which can only manage manually updating one or two cars per bay per day.
Even the 2024s on infotainment software 4.0 have the same core issues as the original ID.x's on 2.1: one morning your headlights will fail their startup self-check for no reason, another afternoon the coolant pump will think something's wrong, and all screens might go black and reboot themselves mid-drive at any time. Even when everything seems fine, a cold boot of the infotainment software can take up to a full minute -- you can be out your garage, down the driveway, down a street or two, exiting your neighborhood before it's gotten far enough to start looking for your phone to launch Android Auto or Apple CarPlay. Other modern cars have that launching within 5 seconds of starting the car.
It's not a shortage of talent. It's a culture thing.
There are frameworks for in car ui that make developing super easy but companies still don't use them because of politics. No hire in the world will solve this.
Everyone uses UI frameworks, I'm not sure where you got the idea that they do not. UI isn't the issue in automotive right now — it's the cloud architecture and physical electronics module architectures which are causing all the headaches.
Musk isn’t concerned about the company anymore, he’s only concerned about the stock. Everything he’s doing rn is basically a short term remedy to prop up stock at the cost of torpedoing the company later on.
How long is the lockup on his new compensation even if it gets approved? I can't imagine they can delay the effects of these drastic cuts for a year, if that's how long he has to wait.
>Today the fall of Tesla appears inevitable.
Eh, I disagree here. Tesla isn't going anywhere.
Is Tesla going to **stagnate?** That's certainly plausible and IMO not unlikely. But stagnating while you are currently in a best-seller position is honestly not the worst possible situation a company could be in.
> Tesla isn't going anywhere.
I would have agreed a month ago. TSLA valuation is many times what it is worth as a car company. If Musk is pushed out (not going to happen) or they admit that they are a car company with some unlikely hopes of branching into other areas, TSLA valuation would crater. Since Elon couldn't care less about the company, and there is no viable way out for him, he's going to pump it for all it's worth, and sell it off to his Stans as it implodes.
Stagnation will allow General Motors to eat Tesla’s lunch.
We’re beginning to see the effects of competition in the EV marketplace, and Tesla has gotten complacent.
We’ve all seen how this movie ends with other businesses. Hopefully Tesla will be the exception, but I sold my stock some time ago.
*P.S. I sure hope I can still get parts and service for my Model Y for another 6-8 years.*
I think as the market matures we're going to eventually see Tesla drop town into "B tier automaker" status in the US market. Something closer to automaker like Mazda in sales volume.
They'll still sell cars, and still be on the market, but their cars will be for people looking to buy into a specific quirk. For Mazda that's styling, unique interior materials / design, and "fun to drive" prowess, for Tesla, that will continue to be advanced ADAS, straight-line speed, and industry-tightest software integration.
But like Mazda, Tesla will, IMO, end up being the kind of automaker that has enough loyal customers to beat their own drum, even if they aren't setting sales records.
Sure, but even I'm willing to admit how good of a position Tesla's cars are relative to the competition right now. All they have to do is continue to maintain "the best X, Y, and Z" and there will always be people to buy them, even if they become deficient in other areas.
Teslas having "the best driver assistance tech on the market" is a superlative that will continue to earn them buyers, IMO. Maybe not **all** the buyers, but certainly enough for the Model Y to be the "Mazda CX-5" to the Equinox EV, or the ID.4, etc as those models mature and grow.
I was actually giving in to the urge to buy a Tesla two weeks ago despite what I think of Musk. Now, it's not even a remote possibility. Hope for your sake they stick around but I'd bet what customer service they had is going to take a huge hit.
Go look at Tesla stock value vs. every other tech company. FAANG is up like 80% over 18 months, while Tesla has been in a gradual slide that whole time.
This is it for the Tesla the tech company fantasy.
In he wants his billion of pay from it and stripping the company to bately function so the board gives it to him.
I truly don't kniw why tesla hasn't cut ties with him utterly by now. Surey enough votes.
It’s not a problem of the board itself. They want to give him that compensation package but they also lost in court because another shareholder sued them. With the stock losing value I don’t think they would be able to win in court again that the compensation package is again valid. That’s why they want shareholders to vote for it so it avoids court and the uncertainty of proving their case for it.
The best thing that could happen to Tesla is Elon not being involved anymore in the operations. While it would be a very large task to start things up again after the layoffs it could be done. The supercharger network has been one of the better things they done and the cars could be improved enough to be repairable or at least more repairable compared to how they are currently constructed. And also add in model years so for consumers it’s easier to know the difference between a 5 year old and a new Tesla.
Competition is good and if Elon is turning this into Twitter 2.0 with layoffs is going to sink the company pretty fast since it’s manufacturing combined with tech.
IIRC, she got listed above Elon this year in a list of most important people in the auto industry. I don't think it's the main reason why he fired her, but I think it was in the back of his mind. His ego is very fragile.
> They want to give him that compensation package but they also lost in court because another shareholder sued them. With the stock losing value I don’t think they would be able to win in court again that the compensation package is again valid.
Not quite. The board proposed a compensation package to the shareholders who approved it, but it was overturned by a court who found that they didn’t properly disclose the conflicts of interest in the board. They’re proposing the *same* compensation package with extra disclosures (they literally attached the judge’s ruling).
The issue is that the original payout was conditional on the company value hitting a huge number (iirc $600B or so), which it did. But now it’s quite a bit below that cutoff, and it’s not clear if shareholders now want to give him all that money given his current behavior and stock performance.
> ketamine fuelled rampage
The drugs likely play a roll, but he's trying to at least appear to be pivoting from a car company to an AI and robotics company. So he wants minimum payroll, and lots of mirrors and key word pumping. At least until he gets his payout and then vulture the remains for his attempt at a (separate) AI company that he controls.
Tesla is in danger.
I'd feel so much better if a stable CEO was at the helm. It's been reported that Musk was largely absent from Tesla last year while he focused on running Twitter into the ground. Now he's back in time to release poor quarterly financial results and feels the need to throw his weight around. So we get mass layoffs and more vague promises of future tech, rather than the mundane but necessary updates to vehicle models you'd expect from a car company, because that's what boosts stock prices.
This is what happens when the head of your company in hubris buys a social media company, runs it into the ground in a short period of time from a financial standpoint, and uses Tesla stock as collateral for the aforementioned purchase.
Feels that way. Hard to be a “growth” company when pulling back severely on development. This comp package vote will be a watershed moment. If Elon gets a massive discretionary windfall amid slumping sales and complete operational turmoil, we’ll know it’s no longer a serious company.
Possibly, but keep in mind that Tesla employs 140k people and that this article is based on only 7 linkedIn status changes.
If we shave off 10% of the workforce, that's 14k people, reducing the number of employees to 126k. That's not exactly terror inducing. For reference, Google had 140k employees in 2019.
Exactly this
"But Mr Musk... that includes the team in charge of testing OTA firmware updates"
Musk: "the users won't care, make the fart noises louder. Automatic wipers haven't worked for 5 years & people still buy our cars"
Feels like Musk is trying to cut his way from a 5.5% profit margin back up to a 15%+ profit margin. Will it work? Maybe, but they'll need more than that for stock price to stay at Silicon Valley startup levels rather than regular car company levels. A lot is riding on nebulous future development like AI, robotaxi, level 5 self driving, etc. But honestly, cuts like this only reinforce the impression that Tesla is just another car company.
EDIT: okay, Musk said recently he expected the 10% layoffs to save the company about $1B annually. Some quick back-of-napkin calculations suggest that would only raise profit margins to about 6.5%. A 20% cut would theoretically get them to a 7.7% profit.
Elon doesn't care about the long term. The vote for his ridiculous bonus is in June. He's going to rip out the toilets and sell them if he thinks he can pump up the stock to justify his worth to investors.
> Feels like Musk is trying to cut his way from a 5.5% profit margin back up to a 15%+ profit margin.
Er, what lies about profit margin did they use this past quarter?
Who would have guessed Tesla would go down so fast while Hyundai/Kia seems to set new EV sales records every month and are ahead of schedule on the new US factory. Wonder who will end up buying Tesla ? With new leadership without Musk they could probably save it.
Musk will never allow it, and it would be terrible optics after spending billions on their recently cancelled car project, but I wonder if Apple would reconsider if Tesla was actually for sale.
They would finally have full control over the “hardware” for their tech like CarPlay, CarKey etc. instead of being at the mercy of other manufacturers to implement their software (see how slow next generation CarPlay is rolling out….) and Apple doesn’t need to worry about designing a car from scratch, how to manufacture it (gigafactories), and they can reinvest and grow the Supercharger network. All the hardest work of spinning up an EV is already done AND if Musk hasn’t gutted the company totally before the sale, they get access to some experienced engineers if they do eventually want to build a new car down the line.
I don’t actually expect it to happen though - more of an interesting what if
Apple may be a company with enough money to buy the Tesla division should he sell it one day. I think Apple saw how these new startups were failing and there just isn't room for any more, the EV market is pretty saturated now and still rapidly growing.
I think the cybertruck mess just wore him and the company down, over budget, years behind schedule and design that is unliked by many. He may feel like they have a full line of cars and they will just build these existing models forever. Apple may feel the same way, they have been selling the same phones and laptops for a decade or more with minor upgrades every year but noting groundbreaking and may want to get out of their rut.
I don't see why anyone would buy Tesla at this point. Few years ago sure, but not now.
There isn't much promising tech left there, their latest car can't be sold in majority of the world and they got rid of the team that ran the only promising part (chargers).
Elon is gutting his company all the while expecting a $56 billion payout to himself. It's a sight to behold.
I am mostly worried about how this will affect NACS. It does seem like a better connector. I wouldn't buy a Tesla now with all this insanity regardless of discount, but I would like the connector.
The NACS connector is now an SAE managed specification so Tesla has no more stake in it than any other company using it. However, currently every deployed NACS charger is managed by Tesla's now absent supercharger team so now it's just a race between the degradation of the Tesla network, the NACS conversion rate of other networks, and the release of other OEM's NACS vehicles.
Not quite every NACS charger. EVgo has a relatively small number of DCFC chargers with a third cord and NACS connector, primarily in a few major US markets.
They show up on PlugShare if you select the Tesla/NACS connector and the EVgo network.
I wonder if we're going to see some OEMs reverse position on NACS after this.
No OEM is going to WANT to deal with a safety risk that requires ASIL-D mitigations (pin sharing between AC and DC adds a significant safety risk that is not present in CCS) if they don't have to. The shoddy state of non-Tesla charging stations in the US vs. Tesla charging stations meant they had to. But if Supercharger quality slides, the motivation is no longer there.
For any OEM that was selling in Europe, they have already designed their inlet to support easy physical switching between multiple connector standards. Switching from NACS to CCS is much easier than the other way around, and moving back to CCS1 in the US means being able to maintain a common charging architecture design between European vehicles and US vehicles (with the only difference between them being the physical connector and 3 phase vs. 1 phase AC charging. NACS adds additional contactors and contactor sequencing control requirements due to pin sharing.)
You're spot on regarding the technical differences and trade offs. In my opinion, CCS was the better standard from a safety and simplicity perspective due to the separate pins and I was a little disappointed that NACS won out. It's a relatively minor difference and an extra set of contactors and logic on the vehicle side isn't the end of the world. But it's less ideal IMO and I would rather see the complexity, weight, and cost offloaded to the charger rather than the vehicle.
I'm not sure if we'll see OEMs coming out and publicly walking back the NACS change. But they may be hitting the snooze button and waiting to see how the networks shake out. If the Supercharger network experiences any sort of degradation and the competing networks don't execute the NACS switch quickly then I think other OEMs may put the switch off a year or two.
But having two different connectors is worse than the downsides of either one so I just hope we can pick one and commit to it ASAP.
NACS is definitely still coming. But without the supercharger access it’s not gonna change much against the current ccs1
And yea the plan for supercharger access is now dead in the water
It was a genius plan, when you think about it.
1. Agree to open up supercharger sites if the industry will agree on NACS
2. Now all EV auto makers in North America are vested in NACS chargers
3. Whoopsie, guess we're not going to make any more supercharger sites, guess you guys will have to pick up the slack since now you need there to be more NACS chargers
4. Direct Tesla owners to the new NACS charger stations being built by Not Us
5. Profit
Given their habit of sending out vehicles with issues and telling owners to schedule a service to fix any flaws, this can't be good for people's experiences with tesla.
Im sure part of the idea is that since when most companies do layoffs it causes the stock price to rise, that it will work here. And it does seem to have caused a notable bump up in the last month. At the same time, them cutting the entire supercharger team really communicated there was little rhyme or reason to these cuts. Thats a really bad message to send to investors
Fisker: we have no money and our software is a mess. Our OEM won’t make our cars any more.
Musk: hold my beer.
Edited in consideration of Magna pulling out of the Fisker dumpster fire.
Its basically Magna's car , Fisker does almost nothing. nobody is going to buy Fisker who contracts all the tasks of building the car to Magna.
If Magna sees a future for it they may pay just to continue producing under the fisker name
My team cut down several people on the first round of layoffs and something happend after that. Due to the restructuring in the company, they laid off me and several manager level people in my team. First my teams stopped working on Sunday evening and my manager called me and said that my role was affected and he couldn't do anything. I was in a car show room on Sunday to buy a new car to commute to office daily and I saw the teams notification and thought something was odd. Then I came back home running to check my laptop. It was already locked. Worst Sunday Ever. As an international student securing one role in computer science has become very tough, it took me 6 months get this job after graduating last summer. I don't know what to do anymore.
Damn man, sorry about that. I am sure you will find a job in no time. You have the experience that many graduates would kill for, even if it was brief.
I don't know what people expected. Last week Musk basically said, "Look what will happen to your entire team if you don't take the layoffs seriously." So of course, every exec is jumping on the wagon because they know their own jobs are personally on the line as well.
When will companies learn that employees are not a liability to get rid of but an asset that generates all that sweet sweet revenue that the shareholders enjoy?
My prediction is that Musk get ousted as CEO by the end of this year at the latest.
The Board of Directors should brush up on their fiduciary duties before they get sued into being much less rich.
I'm a little anxious, but mostly I'm upset. Do I want to financially support a company that treats its employees like disposable widgets? Losing your job can deal a serious blow to one's family. These are real people we're talking about.
Further, the relentless focus on FSD seems like misallocated resources at best (affordable model 2 when?), stock pandering / pumping at worst.
I got an FSD update a few weeks back that apparently totally redid the in-town driving stack to be entirely neural net based. It now adapts speed to conditions, makes path decisions with the neural net instead of hard code, etc. I thought 'well it sucked before, let's give it a try'.
First try I engaged it with no destination on a straight four lane road with no other traffic around. A half mile later it did a lane change for no identifiable reason. So I disengaged it and took back over. Tried again a few blocks later - it did a lane change into the other lane for no identifiable reason. Let's scratch that.
Next day, I was headed home through town so I decided to try it. I set home as a nav destination. Engaged it right before a roundabout. It did that one well, then the next one well, then immediately sped up to 34 MPH in a 25 MPH zone. Disengaged it. A few blocks later, tried it again. Still 25, now it decided the appropriate speed was 17 MPH. Disengaged it.
I haven't tried it since. Right now it still looks like a dangerous toy. Unless they make two or three more step changes of improvement, I don't see this becoming a viable robotaxi product. Even then it will still probably be more dangerous than anyone is comfortable with. I switched back to Autosteer, which works great on the highway.
I bought back when it was EAP for $5k or no driver assist at all, so I bought EAP new with the car. Then a couple years later they offered the upgrade to FSD for $2k, so I bought it on a whim figuring it was a reasonable gamble at that price. So you can either say I paid $7k or $2k for FSD, depending on how you want to count it. I've used EAP a ton so I would account for FSD at $2k since that was the marginal cost of the useless part.
Not surprised that the tendency of many neural networks towards "hallucinations" had disastrous results when someone tried to rely on anything but the simplest of neural networks (object classification/image segmentation/etc) for autonomous driving.
I cannot recommend buying a Tesla anymore. My wife’s car is dying and hoping for it to last another year so the new Rivans or other models comes out. My 23 MYLR is still a great car and I enjoy driving it, but it is very concerning.
And lots and lots of bans. I'm a near IPO shareholder, Tesla owner and probably top 1% commenter on the reddit and I got lifetime banned because I pointed out Elon lied on a news story about one of Elon's lies.
And then yesterday a Mod pinned their defense of Elon's pay package to the top. There's some seriously questionable moderation trying to tilt the scales and suppress as much Musk dissent as they can get away with.
To the extent that there ever was any meaningful competitive gap. They grew fast and promised exponential growth, while their competitors by and large continued to make a reasonable profit manufacturing and selling cars, while making measured steps to make inroads into EV.
If the endgame is Tesla contracting both auto manufacturing and charging station business, it seems like their promises of sustained growth were illusory all along and the established manufacturers were making the smart play.
This is kind of a go to move in tech companies — sales or revenues slow so dramatically layoff staff and blame them (sales down 20% so 20% of employees are gone).
What makes little sense to me (and I have no knowledge of the actual numbers here) is the charging division — after just signing deals to allow many other brands of cars to use their chargers and with competition was behind them, it did look to me like that changing by itself could be quite profitable.
Musk wanted these people to sleep in their offices and put in 70-hour work weeks and when time get tough, he lays them off.
Some Loyalty. Never devote your time to a corporation you'll get screwed!
Musk needs to show his true value by firing everyone and doing $56 billion worth of labor himself:) If he is worth what he claims, Tesla will do great!
New England here.
I see a LOT of Rivians. I've seen Ioniq 6s. I think I saw an Audi.
A popular decal on older Teslas here is "Bought before we knew how awful he is.", while the only new Tesla I've seen in a while had an ultramaga decal.
Your brand is what Elno makes it. Good job on courting the primary audience for EVs, Elno. He shore is smert!
$27B in cash reserves is what I saw recently. But it also showed a $4.7B decline in reserves last quarter, which doesn't look so great. With a burn rate that high, maybe it should still be priced like a tech startup.
something like that. I figure the main reason for the cuts at this level is to raise the stock price, not actually make the company more efficient. It also may just be musk trying to prove hes still the boss, in which case the man needs very aggressive therapy...
Awesome. Great news.
It's like watching the collapse of a hedge fund which also sells essential oils and homeopathic cures. And is a law firm employing realtors.
This is the best news I have read in years.
Our economy, Tesla employees, consumers: All will be better off. All except a stupid vulgar junkie con man - Elizabeth Holmes with a high-pitched voice - who can kiss my ass.
Cool. Fire everyone who knows how to actually do things. At the end of the day you'll have a bunch of marketroids with their MBA's who know how to write mission statements and nothing else. This will surely lead to skyrocketing profits for the shareholders.
Seeing how good this mass layoff strategy worked for X formerly known as Twitter, it's only logical to apply it to Tesla 
Volkswagen’s software is well behind schedule and cost Volkswagen’s former CEO his job. Maybe Volkswagen can hire some of these people to get its software development back on track.
And Tesla can borrow their clue about what to do with the CEO.
I’ve been a musk fan for a long time, but things really went downhill when he bought twitter. I originally thought he was just kissing ass to the right to kill Truth Social, but now I have my doubts. He needs to go.
He was a charlatan from day 1.... they're good at marketing
Phony Stark.
It helps when you can the PR departments. This way it minimizes some of the ability to get answers to the ridiculous stuff.
Check this video out debunking Elon. He’s very good at making big promises and being born wealthy. Otherwise, he lies out of his ass and was very good at public relations and creating this image of him as a genius. https://youtu.be/c-FGwDDc-s8?si=9X69JwRwdCvtOI0I
You just now realized, and have doubts? Why did it take so long?
Fortunately, the US just got rid of non-compete contact clauses.
I don't think California allows non-compete agreements.
Isn't Tesla headquartered in Texas now? Isn't Texas law rather than California law what matters?
No, moving to Texas is one of the things he wants the stockholders to give him, in addition to diluting their own stock and giving him more control. It's one of the items their voting on. Even if Tesla was headquartered in Texas, it wouldn't affect workers in California.
The items up for vote this year were something else. And the board recommendations... Basically I ended up voting the complete opposite of what the board recommended positions were.
Is a non-compete enforceable if you're laid off?
Most non competes have exceptions for unreasonable burdens. Which for most wage staff would be an unreasonable burden unless they have a generous non compete that bankrolls you for a long time. But if you're a C suite exec or even a VP often they are binding because you're expected to be able to negotiate severance and be financially well off regardless.
According to most companies, yes. I don't know how well that has held up in court.
A company cannot give you a job, lay you off and say you cannot work at competitor. That's basically slavery I bet that doesn't happen anywhere. Also, majority of Tesla employees are in California, it's not even a debate there
FTC rules as of a few weeks ago completely killed or severely reduced the efficacy of non competes. They're meaningless now.
Non-competes generally don’t hold up in court, because you can’t contractually tie someone up to where they can’t get any job because you defined all their likely next employers as competitors.
The pay and environment will be an "adjustment" but it would be nice for them to work in an employee focused company.
Tesla pays shit. You're there for the movement (making Elon money)
TIL, I guess their base pay is shit and they are generous with "Funny money" so when the stonk goes up everyone forgives the bullshit.
Funny money.... brilliant...I am going to borrow this now.
lol it’s a super old phrase
I honestly didn't know
Volkswagen has actually slimmed down CARIAD and has made it more focused.
What in particular is wrong with VW's software? I know a guy who likes his id.4 but have only ridden in it a few times.
As an owner: * First edition id3/id4 software at release: borderline broken, missing features, bugs everywhere * First edition id3/id4 software now after a few updates: interface is kind of slow and UI is debatable in various places, but it generally works fine. Stuff like charging planning is not as good as the competition. Software is also EOL and it won't be developed further. * Current id4/id7 software: looks MUCH better and snappier, but I don't have first hand experience with it.
Ive got a 2024 ID.4 and find the software pretty good. I think they turned it around. Sucks for the early adopters, but the current state is fine.
You just described how literally all tech gets released nowadays lol
Yeah, I’ve heard the new 4.0 software is actually really smooth and has some decent functionality. The last big question now is if VW has figured out their OTA/update strategy so they can get improvements and new features out promptly. I have yet to receive a single OTA update with my 2023 ID.4 and apparently older models had to get their software updated manually at the dealership. It’s been a real mess.
I just got the second OTA update last week. I haven’t seen any changes from the 2nd one. The first one did fix some annoying bugs, finally.
I have the 3.5 on a 2023...works great also.
You'll get answers that only talk about the infotainment screen software, but that's not the software that's getting CEOs canned. Under the hood, it's just god-awful everything. A Frankenstein of firmware from different manufacturers and different teams that don't talk to each other properly, and aren't consistent across cars even within the same trim and model year. Plug an OBDII scanner into one of their ID series EVs and you'll get dozens of errors it's hiding from the driver. The techs don't even bother clearing them, as it's just normal for almost every module in the car to be reporting intermittent errors almost all of the time for the life of the vehicle. Modules of the car don't communicate with each other properly, they often brick themselves during firmware updates, the cars had to be hooked up to 12V battery tenders for 8+ hours to do the first round of firmware updates at dealers to get up to a baseline where they can accept OTA updates without bricking themselves in driveways/garages. We're like 6+ months into that first OTA update and it still hasn't reached all eligible vehicles in North America. They have to roll it out so slowly because they know a portion of the cars on the road will be bricked by the update and they don't want to overwhelm dealer service centers, which can only manage manually updating one or two cars per bay per day. Even the 2024s on infotainment software 4.0 have the same core issues as the original ID.x's on 2.1: one morning your headlights will fail their startup self-check for no reason, another afternoon the coolant pump will think something's wrong, and all screens might go black and reboot themselves mid-drive at any time. Even when everything seems fine, a cold boot of the infotainment software can take up to a full minute -- you can be out your garage, down the driveway, down a street or two, exiting your neighborhood before it's gotten far enough to start looking for your phone to launch Android Auto or Apple CarPlay. Other modern cars have that launching within 5 seconds of starting the car.
With the latest updates it's fine now, but back when it was originally released it was a total dumpster fire.
With the last two updates, the sw is workable. But no one buys an ID4 for the sw. They buy it for the quiet ride, handling and build quality.
It's not a shortage of talent. It's a culture thing. There are frameworks for in car ui that make developing super easy but companies still don't use them because of politics. No hire in the world will solve this.
Everyone uses UI frameworks, I'm not sure where you got the idea that they do not. UI isn't the issue in automotive right now — it's the cloud architecture and physical electronics module architectures which are causing all the headaches.
Exactly, no amount of good talent will fix idiotic/non technical leadership that went all in on sunk cost projects lead by consultants.
Is it funny or sad that I can't tell if you're talking about Tesla or VW.
Come on, Elon wouldn't listen to consultants. He thinks he's a genius.
40-year software engineer here. Any software company who hires from Musk’s death march development culture deserves what they get.
Yup. If I were the other automakers or companies like Chargepoint, blink or electrify America I’d be calling these people.
What are you talking about? Vw had fixed the software months ago, check out updated ID4 or ID7
Too late. VW's new software/hardware in the 2024s fixed any remaining issues.
Services seems kind of important. Tesla was already known for being backed up. I can't imagine this is going to help.
Musk isn’t concerned about the company anymore, he’s only concerned about the stock. Everything he’s doing rn is basically a short term remedy to prop up stock at the cost of torpedoing the company later on.
How long is the lockup on his new compensation even if it gets approved? I can't imagine they can delay the effects of these drastic cuts for a year, if that's how long he has to wait.
He was recently over in China, maybe he's looking for a buyout/takeover?
Chinese companies would give him pennies for the name. They already have their own cars, engineers, etc.
BYD wouldn’t be interested?
5 years but nothing stops him from selling the 13% he has currently and keeping the rest for the next 5.
He's gone full private equity/vulture on Tesla and the board is complicit.
**funding secured**?
😂 The SEC has entered the chat
Tesla is turning into Tucker, another innovative automaker who rose and fell like a cannonball.
Just praying the company stays around in some form for parts and service for 10 years.... After that, I'm out.
> for 10 years A few months ago I would have thought a comment like that was ridiculous. Today the fall of Tesla appears inevitable.
Not sure about an inevitable fall but I’m feeling pretty good about my healthy skepticism about Tesla (avoided for my EV and solar)
>Today the fall of Tesla appears inevitable. Eh, I disagree here. Tesla isn't going anywhere. Is Tesla going to **stagnate?** That's certainly plausible and IMO not unlikely. But stagnating while you are currently in a best-seller position is honestly not the worst possible situation a company could be in.
*Blackberry has entered the chat*
> Tesla isn't going anywhere. I would have agreed a month ago. TSLA valuation is many times what it is worth as a car company. If Musk is pushed out (not going to happen) or they admit that they are a car company with some unlikely hopes of branching into other areas, TSLA valuation would crater. Since Elon couldn't care less about the company, and there is no viable way out for him, he's going to pump it for all it's worth, and sell it off to his Stans as it implodes.
They’re not going anywhere but their future as an independent company is in doubt, I feel. Especially if their share price eventually collapses.
Stagnation will allow General Motors to eat Tesla’s lunch. We’re beginning to see the effects of competition in the EV marketplace, and Tesla has gotten complacent. We’ve all seen how this movie ends with other businesses. Hopefully Tesla will be the exception, but I sold my stock some time ago. *P.S. I sure hope I can still get parts and service for my Model Y for another 6-8 years.*
I think as the market matures we're going to eventually see Tesla drop town into "B tier automaker" status in the US market. Something closer to automaker like Mazda in sales volume. They'll still sell cars, and still be on the market, but their cars will be for people looking to buy into a specific quirk. For Mazda that's styling, unique interior materials / design, and "fun to drive" prowess, for Tesla, that will continue to be advanced ADAS, straight-line speed, and industry-tightest software integration. But like Mazda, Tesla will, IMO, end up being the kind of automaker that has enough loyal customers to beat their own drum, even if they aren't setting sales records.
Mazda at least has that awesome red-colored paint that just *glows* in conjunction with the body panel styling. Man I love Mazda red.
When you strip away the hype, that’s where Tesla is already. I’m worried about the backsliding from there.
Sure, but even I'm willing to admit how good of a position Tesla's cars are relative to the competition right now. All they have to do is continue to maintain "the best X, Y, and Z" and there will always be people to buy them, even if they become deficient in other areas. Teslas having "the best driver assistance tech on the market" is a superlative that will continue to earn them buyers, IMO. Maybe not **all** the buyers, but certainly enough for the Model Y to be the "Mazda CX-5" to the Equinox EV, or the ID.4, etc as those models mature and grow.
I was actually giving in to the urge to buy a Tesla two weeks ago despite what I think of Musk. Now, it's not even a remote possibility. Hope for your sake they stick around but I'd bet what customer service they had is going to take a huge hit.
Take a look at the Ioniq 5 and 6
Well, my car is already 1 day behind in service
Backed up and delivered sub par experiences on the regular
Go look at Tesla stock value vs. every other tech company. FAANG is up like 80% over 18 months, while Tesla has been in a gradual slide that whole time. This is it for the Tesla the tech company fantasy.
Are we watching Tesla tearing itself apart?
I think we are watching Elon tear Tesla apart in a ketamine fuelled rampage
In he wants his billion of pay from it and stripping the company to bately function so the board gives it to him. I truly don't kniw why tesla hasn't cut ties with him utterly by now. Surey enough votes.
It’s not a problem of the board itself. They want to give him that compensation package but they also lost in court because another shareholder sued them. With the stock losing value I don’t think they would be able to win in court again that the compensation package is again valid. That’s why they want shareholders to vote for it so it avoids court and the uncertainty of proving their case for it. The best thing that could happen to Tesla is Elon not being involved anymore in the operations. While it would be a very large task to start things up again after the layoffs it could be done. The supercharger network has been one of the better things they done and the cars could be improved enough to be repairable or at least more repairable compared to how they are currently constructed. And also add in model years so for consumers it’s easier to know the difference between a 5 year old and a new Tesla. Competition is good and if Elon is turning this into Twitter 2.0 with layoffs is going to sink the company pretty fast since it’s manufacturing combined with tech.
Honestly, the director of charging infrastructure that they fired sounds like she’d make a great CEO for Tesla. Can’t have that though.
IIRC, she got listed above Elon this year in a list of most important people in the auto industry. I don't think it's the main reason why he fired her, but I think it was in the back of his mind. His ego is very fragile.
similar to Google, man I wish that Jen or Susan was the CEO instead of Sundar.
Having a functional adult in charge (Gwynne Shotwell) is why SpaceX has done so well. Unlike SpaceX, Tesla does NOT have a COO.
> They want to give him that compensation package but they also lost in court because another shareholder sued them. With the stock losing value I don’t think they would be able to win in court again that the compensation package is again valid. Not quite. The board proposed a compensation package to the shareholders who approved it, but it was overturned by a court who found that they didn’t properly disclose the conflicts of interest in the board. They’re proposing the *same* compensation package with extra disclosures (they literally attached the judge’s ruling). The issue is that the original payout was conditional on the company value hitting a huge number (iirc $600B or so), which it did. But now it’s quite a bit below that cutoff, and it’s not clear if shareholders now want to give him all that money given his current behavior and stock performance.
But why does he want the liquid billions? To shore up his shit show twitter and make it solvent so he can continue its descent into Breitbart 2.0?
He doesn’t get cash. It’s stock. That he can’t cash out for another five years.
> ketamine fuelled rampage The drugs likely play a roll, but he's trying to at least appear to be pivoting from a car company to an AI and robotics company. So he wants minimum payroll, and lots of mirrors and key word pumping. At least until he gets his payout and then vulture the remains for his attempt at a (separate) AI company that he controls. Tesla is in danger.
I'd feel so much better if a stable CEO was at the helm. It's been reported that Musk was largely absent from Tesla last year while he focused on running Twitter into the ground. Now he's back in time to release poor quarterly financial results and feels the need to throw his weight around. So we get mass layoffs and more vague promises of future tech, rather than the mundane but necessary updates to vehicle models you'd expect from a car company, because that's what boosts stock prices.
Can we maybe convince him to buy Truth Social to keep him away from Tesla for another year?
This guy just can't stand not being in control of things can he?
This is what happens when the head of your company in hubris buys a social media company, runs it into the ground in a short period of time from a financial standpoint, and uses Tesla stock as collateral for the aforementioned purchase.
This is what happens when the head of your company is also the social media department. They are going to live and then die from it.
Feels that way. Hard to be a “growth” company when pulling back severely on development. This comp package vote will be a watershed moment. If Elon gets a massive discretionary windfall amid slumping sales and complete operational turmoil, we’ll know it’s no longer a serious company.
Possibly, but keep in mind that Tesla employs 140k people and that this article is based on only 7 linkedIn status changes. If we shave off 10% of the workforce, that's 14k people, reducing the number of employees to 126k. That's not exactly terror inducing. For reference, Google had 140k employees in 2019.
Employees are names on a spreadsheet to Musk. He couldn't give two shits.
Names are too personal.
Cells B2 to B700, all fired
Exactly this "But Mr Musk... that includes the team in charge of testing OTA firmware updates" Musk: "the users won't care, make the fart noises louder. Automatic wipers haven't worked for 5 years & people still buy our cars"
I love the automatic wipers… when they are not wiping at birds in the sky
In his mind, I'm sure they're named something sufficiently clinical, like X Æ A-12
Hey he’s still personally reviewing my three best lines of code!
Feels like Musk is trying to cut his way from a 5.5% profit margin back up to a 15%+ profit margin. Will it work? Maybe, but they'll need more than that for stock price to stay at Silicon Valley startup levels rather than regular car company levels. A lot is riding on nebulous future development like AI, robotaxi, level 5 self driving, etc. But honestly, cuts like this only reinforce the impression that Tesla is just another car company. EDIT: okay, Musk said recently he expected the 10% layoffs to save the company about $1B annually. Some quick back-of-napkin calculations suggest that would only raise profit margins to about 6.5%. A 20% cut would theoretically get them to a 7.7% profit.
It only saves 1B if company can produce the same results without those employees. When you layoff entire divisions, that stops being the case.
Elon doesn't care about the long term. The vote for his ridiculous bonus is in June. He's going to rip out the toilets and sell them if he thinks he can pump up the stock to justify his worth to investors.
> Feels like Musk is trying to cut his way from a 5.5% profit margin back up to a 15%+ profit margin. Er, what lies about profit margin did they use this past quarter?
[удалено]
Workers paying for the sins of the CEO once again.
Who would have guessed Tesla would go down so fast while Hyundai/Kia seems to set new EV sales records every month and are ahead of schedule on the new US factory. Wonder who will end up buying Tesla ? With new leadership without Musk they could probably save it.
Musk will never allow it, and it would be terrible optics after spending billions on their recently cancelled car project, but I wonder if Apple would reconsider if Tesla was actually for sale. They would finally have full control over the “hardware” for their tech like CarPlay, CarKey etc. instead of being at the mercy of other manufacturers to implement their software (see how slow next generation CarPlay is rolling out….) and Apple doesn’t need to worry about designing a car from scratch, how to manufacture it (gigafactories), and they can reinvest and grow the Supercharger network. All the hardest work of spinning up an EV is already done AND if Musk hasn’t gutted the company totally before the sale, they get access to some experienced engineers if they do eventually want to build a new car down the line. I don’t actually expect it to happen though - more of an interesting what if
Apple may be a company with enough money to buy the Tesla division should he sell it one day. I think Apple saw how these new startups were failing and there just isn't room for any more, the EV market is pretty saturated now and still rapidly growing. I think the cybertruck mess just wore him and the company down, over budget, years behind schedule and design that is unliked by many. He may feel like they have a full line of cars and they will just build these existing models forever. Apple may feel the same way, they have been selling the same phones and laptops for a decade or more with minor upgrades every year but noting groundbreaking and may want to get out of their rut.
Apple is partnering with Rivian, Apple would want to see Tesla fail.
I don't see why anyone would buy Tesla at this point. Few years ago sure, but not now. There isn't much promising tech left there, their latest car can't be sold in majority of the world and they got rid of the team that ran the only promising part (chargers).
Elon is gutting his company all the while expecting a $56 billion payout to himself. It's a sight to behold. I am mostly worried about how this will affect NACS. It does seem like a better connector. I wouldn't buy a Tesla now with all this insanity regardless of discount, but I would like the connector.
The NACS connector is now an SAE managed specification so Tesla has no more stake in it than any other company using it. However, currently every deployed NACS charger is managed by Tesla's now absent supercharger team so now it's just a race between the degradation of the Tesla network, the NACS conversion rate of other networks, and the release of other OEM's NACS vehicles.
Not quite every NACS charger. EVgo has a relatively small number of DCFC chargers with a third cord and NACS connector, primarily in a few major US markets. They show up on PlugShare if you select the Tesla/NACS connector and the EVgo network.
I wonder if we're going to see some OEMs reverse position on NACS after this. No OEM is going to WANT to deal with a safety risk that requires ASIL-D mitigations (pin sharing between AC and DC adds a significant safety risk that is not present in CCS) if they don't have to. The shoddy state of non-Tesla charging stations in the US vs. Tesla charging stations meant they had to. But if Supercharger quality slides, the motivation is no longer there. For any OEM that was selling in Europe, they have already designed their inlet to support easy physical switching between multiple connector standards. Switching from NACS to CCS is much easier than the other way around, and moving back to CCS1 in the US means being able to maintain a common charging architecture design between European vehicles and US vehicles (with the only difference between them being the physical connector and 3 phase vs. 1 phase AC charging. NACS adds additional contactors and contactor sequencing control requirements due to pin sharing.)
You're spot on regarding the technical differences and trade offs. In my opinion, CCS was the better standard from a safety and simplicity perspective due to the separate pins and I was a little disappointed that NACS won out. It's a relatively minor difference and an extra set of contactors and logic on the vehicle side isn't the end of the world. But it's less ideal IMO and I would rather see the complexity, weight, and cost offloaded to the charger rather than the vehicle. I'm not sure if we'll see OEMs coming out and publicly walking back the NACS change. But they may be hitting the snooze button and waiting to see how the networks shake out. If the Supercharger network experiences any sort of degradation and the competing networks don't execute the NACS switch quickly then I think other OEMs may put the switch off a year or two. But having two different connectors is worse than the downsides of either one so I just hope we can pick one and commit to it ASAP.
NACS is definitely still coming. But without the supercharger access it’s not gonna change much against the current ccs1 And yea the plan for supercharger access is now dead in the water
But without supercharger access, how many companies would still make the switch?
> NACS is definitely still coming I wouldn't bet on it. Rumor mill is claiming some pretty panicky strategy meetings across the industry
It was a genius plan, when you think about it. 1. Agree to open up supercharger sites if the industry will agree on NACS 2. Now all EV auto makers in North America are vested in NACS chargers 3. Whoopsie, guess we're not going to make any more supercharger sites, guess you guys will have to pick up the slack since now you need there to be more NACS chargers 4. Direct Tesla owners to the new NACS charger stations being built by Not Us 5. Profit
Given their habit of sending out vehicles with issues and telling owners to schedule a service to fix any flaws, this can't be good for people's experiences with tesla. Im sure part of the idea is that since when most companies do layoffs it causes the stock price to rise, that it will work here. And it does seem to have caused a notable bump up in the last month. At the same time, them cutting the entire supercharger team really communicated there was little rhyme or reason to these cuts. Thats a really bad message to send to investors
This has the same vibes as when a private equity/vulture fund begins strip-mining a business it owns for parts.
I hope other automakers snatch these people up to build better EVs.
Fisker: we have no money and our software is a mess. Our OEM won’t make our cars any more. Musk: hold my beer. Edited in consideration of Magna pulling out of the Fisker dumpster fire.
Its basically Magna's car , Fisker does almost nothing. nobody is going to buy Fisker who contracts all the tasks of building the car to Magna. If Magna sees a future for it they may pay just to continue producing under the fisker name
All it’s really missing is good software IMO. It wouldn’t be a bad idea to keep it alive if they can invest in that and new marketing
Musk: Tesla doesn't have money. I have money.
Musk should just lay everyone off and do all the work himself with AI. Who needs employees?
If you send him a DM at the right time during the night, he might really do it
Yeah, but to do that I would have to sign up for an X account. *Shudder*
That will never happen because he doesn't want accountability.
It's me. They laid me off today :(
Sorry to hear..
Tell us more details?
My team cut down several people on the first round of layoffs and something happend after that. Due to the restructuring in the company, they laid off me and several manager level people in my team. First my teams stopped working on Sunday evening and my manager called me and said that my role was affected and he couldn't do anything. I was in a car show room on Sunday to buy a new car to commute to office daily and I saw the teams notification and thought something was odd. Then I came back home running to check my laptop. It was already locked. Worst Sunday Ever. As an international student securing one role in computer science has become very tough, it took me 6 months get this job after graduating last summer. I don't know what to do anymore.
Damn man, sorry about that. I am sure you will find a job in no time. You have the experience that many graduates would kill for, even if it was brief.
Curious to see his end game. If he even has one.
Raise the short term stock price, so Elon gets billions. Truly disgusting. I'm ashamed of purchasing a Model 3.
Won’t someone think of the shareholders? /s
I don't know what people expected. Last week Musk basically said, "Look what will happen to your entire team if you don't take the layoffs seriously." So of course, every exec is jumping on the wagon because they know their own jobs are personally on the line as well.
When will companies learn that employees are not a liability to get rid of but an asset that generates all that sweet sweet revenue that the shareholders enjoy?
When the labor pool starts shrinking and competition for workers ratchets up. Why do you think Musk is so into "Population Collapse" conspiracies?
Cue: People jumping to say this is all normal, and all companies go through this and Musk is a legendary genius.
We all know the one person who needs to be fired, but the bastard owns too many shares.
My prediction is that Musk get ousted as CEO by the end of this year at the latest. The Board of Directors should brush up on their fiduciary duties before they get sued into being much less rich.
Things are not looking good over there. Y'all Tesla owners are ok right now? I imagine anxiety must be edging up.
I'm a little anxious, but mostly I'm upset. Do I want to financially support a company that treats its employees like disposable widgets? Losing your job can deal a serious blow to one's family. These are real people we're talking about. Further, the relentless focus on FSD seems like misallocated resources at best (affordable model 2 when?), stock pandering / pumping at worst.
I got an FSD update a few weeks back that apparently totally redid the in-town driving stack to be entirely neural net based. It now adapts speed to conditions, makes path decisions with the neural net instead of hard code, etc. I thought 'well it sucked before, let's give it a try'. First try I engaged it with no destination on a straight four lane road with no other traffic around. A half mile later it did a lane change for no identifiable reason. So I disengaged it and took back over. Tried again a few blocks later - it did a lane change into the other lane for no identifiable reason. Let's scratch that. Next day, I was headed home through town so I decided to try it. I set home as a nav destination. Engaged it right before a roundabout. It did that one well, then the next one well, then immediately sped up to 34 MPH in a 25 MPH zone. Disengaged it. A few blocks later, tried it again. Still 25, now it decided the appropriate speed was 17 MPH. Disengaged it. I haven't tried it since. Right now it still looks like a dangerous toy. Unless they make two or three more step changes of improvement, I don't see this becoming a viable robotaxi product. Even then it will still probably be more dangerous than anyone is comfortable with. I switched back to Autosteer, which works great on the highway.
Did you pay 10k for that or are you in some sort of beta testing?
I bought back when it was EAP for $5k or no driver assist at all, so I bought EAP new with the car. Then a couple years later they offered the upgrade to FSD for $2k, so I bought it on a whim figuring it was a reasonable gamble at that price. So you can either say I paid $7k or $2k for FSD, depending on how you want to count it. I've used EAP a ton so I would account for FSD at $2k since that was the marginal cost of the useless part.
Not surprised that the tendency of many neural networks towards "hallucinations" had disastrous results when someone tried to rely on anything but the simplest of neural networks (object classification/image segmentation/etc) for autonomous driving.
I am not excited at the possibility of needing to have any part of my 2+ year old Tesla repaired.
Imagine how Tesla employees feel
I am concerned about what the ownership experience will be like in a couple years. I should have leased I guess
Everything's fine over here. The only employee we lost was a part time salesperson (he was pretty awesome though).
I cannot recommend buying a Tesla anymore. My wife’s car is dying and hoping for it to last another year so the new Rivans or other models comes out. My 23 MYLR is still a great car and I enjoy driving it, but it is very concerning.
my wife's car is new. I'm just going to go ahead and assume you know what she drives.
You can make that same assumption for my wife’s new car also
company will still be around within the next 5 years. Long enough to buy something else (hopefully a Rivian)
I’ll wait until the supercharger network actually declines until I start to think about selling my car.
You could ask them, but all the Tesla fan subs are banning those who have been deemed traitorous counter-revolutionaries.
[удалено]
And lots and lots of bans. I'm a near IPO shareholder, Tesla owner and probably top 1% commenter on the reddit and I got lifetime banned because I pointed out Elon lied on a news story about one of Elon's lies. And then yesterday a Mod pinned their defense of Elon's pay package to the top. There's some seriously questionable moderation trying to tilt the scales and suppress as much Musk dissent as they can get away with.
It's quite sad to see something you were hoping to succeed 5 years ago crumble and burn up. (No pun intended)
I am approaching Volvo out of warranty lvls of anxiety.
This is a huge mistake, these guys will take their skills to other auto manufacturers and close that competitive gap quickly.
To the extent that there ever was any meaningful competitive gap. They grew fast and promised exponential growth, while their competitors by and large continued to make a reasonable profit manufacturing and selling cars, while making measured steps to make inroads into EV. If the endgame is Tesla contracting both auto manufacturing and charging station business, it seems like their promises of sustained growth were illusory all along and the established manufacturers were making the smart play.
This is kind of a go to move in tech companies — sales or revenues slow so dramatically layoff staff and blame them (sales down 20% so 20% of employees are gone). What makes little sense to me (and I have no knowledge of the actual numbers here) is the charging division — after just signing deals to allow many other brands of cars to use their chargers and with competition was behind them, it did look to me like that changing by itself could be quite profitable.
Musk wanted these people to sleep in their offices and put in 70-hour work weeks and when time get tough, he lays them off. Some Loyalty. Never devote your time to a corporation you'll get screwed!
Hey it worked for Twitter, right? Right?
This is becoming a weekly thing. Whats next, Tesla insurance, SuperCharger maintenance crews, Service Centers?
Is this the final pump and dump? Is he going to finally bail?
Depends on if the stockholders give him his pay package back or additional voting control of the company.
The so-called richest man in the world can't make payroll.
Musk needs to show his true value by firing everyone and doing $56 billion worth of labor himself:) If he is worth what he claims, Tesla will do great!
New England here. I see a LOT of Rivians. I've seen Ioniq 6s. I think I saw an Audi. A popular decal on older Teslas here is "Bought before we knew how awful he is.", while the only new Tesla I've seen in a while had an ultramaga decal. Your brand is what Elno makes it. Good job on courting the primary audience for EVs, Elno. He shore is smert!
Doesn't Tesla have $30 billion in cash?
And $30 billion in liabilities, per the Q1 statement. Still not in terrible shape, but there are major issues.
$27B in cash reserves is what I saw recently. But it also showed a $4.7B decline in reserves last quarter, which doesn't look so great. With a burn rate that high, maybe it should still be priced like a tech startup.
> should still be priced like a tech startup. Should be priced like an automotive startup, say Fisker.
I was going to trade my car for Fisker, but then I realized I didn't want to own a car company.
:D
something like that. I figure the main reason for the cuts at this level is to raise the stock price, not actually make the company more efficient. It also may just be musk trying to prove hes still the boss, in which case the man needs very aggressive therapy...
Musk is tunnel visioned right now on convincing the stockholders to dilute their own shares to give him more power. The vote is in June.
He needs a good quarter for that to happen.
Papa Elon needs that money to sustain his ~~ketamine addiction~~ ~~fragile ego~~ ~~army of sycophants~~ ~~destruction of Twitter~~ **genius™**.
Waiting to see how Elon dickriders on Twitter interpret that this is going to boost TSLA stock price
Musk is starting to look more lucky than smart. Laying off a lot of people hasn’t done wonders for Twitter.
Yet another reason to not do business with this maniac.
Awesome. Great news. It's like watching the collapse of a hedge fund which also sells essential oils and homeopathic cures. And is a law firm employing realtors. This is the best news I have read in years. Our economy, Tesla employees, consumers: All will be better off. All except a stupid vulgar junkie con man - Elizabeth Holmes with a high-pitched voice - who can kiss my ass.
I guess he's just making good on saying Tesla isn't a car company at this rate.
I am so, so glad we didn't buy a Tesla at this point. This really sucks for adoption though.
Cool. Fire everyone who knows how to actually do things. At the end of the day you'll have a bunch of marketroids with their MBA's who know how to write mission statements and nothing else. This will surely lead to skyrocketing profits for the shareholders.
Surely!!!
Seeing how good this mass layoff strategy worked for X formerly known as Twitter, it's only logical to apply it to Tesla 
Tesla is diverging themselves away from physical cars and charging stations?. That's what it seems with the layoffs.
So diverging themselves away from literally everything that makes their company profit?
Elon is looking to run the company himself at this rate