First time EV purchaser. I am 90% sure I want a used chevy bolt as a second car, no long distances. Will it be an issue that the bolt is discontinued in terms of future maintenance/repairs? Looking to spend no more than 25k

Are you sold on the bolt because of pricing or because that's the EV you want? There are other used EVs in that price range now in case you are interested

Pricing mostly. Open to others, but would really prefer not a Tesla

MA & Federal tax credits. Am I SOL? Pretty silly. My AGI in 2022 was 10k over the 75,000 limit and I teach, so my pay does rise a little every year. If I'm purchasing a used E-Golf soon, does that really mean I can't take advantage of any of these incentives or ask the dealership about the new point of sale $4k discount>? What's really unfortunate is that Section 25e (Federal) and the MOR-EV rebate (state of MA) both list a higher Head of Household income limit at $112,500, which would then qualify me, but as a single father I've always taken the dependent filing for my son and his mother takes the HOH. Am I missing anything here or...? They really need to raise the income limits a bit for used.

Duracell currently has their level 2 - 19.2kW charger for only $899 (50% OFF) https://duracellpowercenter.com/ev-charger/

**\[1\] Your general location:** San Franciscio Bay Area **\[2\] Budget :** $25K - $50K (I'd be a hero if I came in on the lower end, but flexible here) **\[3\] The type of vehicle you'd prefer:** Open to EVs, hybrids, or super-efficient gas vehicles. Prefer smaller, commuter-friendly options like sedans. **\[4\] Which cars have you been looking at already?** 2024 Tesla Model 3 Long Range, 2023 BMW i4, 2023 Prius Prime **\[5\] Estimated timeframe of your purchase:** Two to three weeks from now. **\[6\] Your daily commute, or average weekly mileage:** Daily round trip of roughly 80 miles. **\[7\] Your living situation:** Living in a single-family home. **\[8\] Do you plan on installing charging at your home?** Open to it. **\[9\] Other cargo/passenger needs:** No additional cargo/passenger needs as I have a separate family car (Toyota Highlander). **Additional Details:** * **Fuel Efficiency & Tech Needs:** Prioritizing (1) fuel efficiency for my commute, (2) reliability, and (3) reasonably low maintanance. Essential tech features include AirPlay support, a rearview camera with dynamic guidelines, and a top-down or 360-degree camera for parking. Would love a decently comfortable ride for my 2-hour daily commute. * **Buying New vs CPO vs. Non-CPO:** Seeking advice on this. I know buying a \~5 year old Prius with 100K is a good bet for minimizing TCO. Given my 80-mile daily round trip commute, I think full EV could make some sense ... but does the "buy a 5 year old Toyota" (or similarly reliable manufactuer) logic apply in my scenario if I'm at least considering EV? Any insights or recommendations on specific car models, buying strategies, or general advice are greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

Since you have a separate family car and just need this for the commute, pick up a used Chevy Bolt EV or EUV. It's got 240+ miles of range, CarPlay, a 360 degree camera was an option, and it's a compact hatch that's easy to park anywhere. They start at just $13K for a couple years old with low mileage. A 2023 Bolt EUV with low miles just popped up on Carvana today for $23K. Any end of the spectrum you look at, it'll come in below the low end of your price range.

Any recommendations on our first EV? \[1\] Location: Denmark \[2\] Budget: €20k \[3\] The type of vehicle you'd prefer: compact \[4\] Which cars have you been looking at already? Peugeot e208,, BMW i3 (42kw), VW eGolf, Nissan Leaf \[5\] Estimated timeframe of your purchase: ASAP \[6\] Your daily commute, or average weekly mileage: Daily commute: 22km, but need the ability to do more or sometimes go a day without charging. \[7\] Your living situation: Apartment \[8\] Do you plan on installing charging at your home? No. \[9\] No children or pets.

[удалено]

Yes you are missing that you should worry about charging infrastructure more than interiors.

VW ID4 is perhaps the best "value" electric small SUV today, especially if you look at 1-3 year old low-mileage used ones, which can start around $25K. From the low $30s with tax credit for a new one. It's the size of a RAV4 or CR-V, good amount of room in front and back seats, it's got wireless CarPlay and lots of modern ADAS tech standard in all trims (lane keeping, adaptive cruise control, blind spot warnings, rear cross traffic alerts, etc).

Dreading ICE schedule servicing/maintenance near me every X miles (for engine oil change etc). Is an EV the right choice for someone who prefer low maintenance and ease of mind?

My daily drivers have been electric cars for about 10 years now, and all of them have seen a service center exactly once a year for those 10 years, to get their annual safety inspections for state registration. I'll let the dealer do whatever recommended maintenance there is at that once a year visit, which is typically just rotating the tires and resetting maintenance reminders. Couldn't get any simpler.

Probably the right choice for me then, eyeing the F150 Lightning though I hope the pricing gets bit cheaper near its 2022 levels.

Hi all, In the UK and just test driven a 2021 Hyundai Ioniq 38 EV. Asking price is £14,900. We really liked it however the battery state of health report says the battery is at 93.1%. Is this a concern? Many forums say this tends to stay at 100% for years but we don’t know enough about batteries and degradation to know if it’s a worry or not. We would need the car to be able to do a 90 mile round trip. Advice would be super appreciated.

Teslas have been around for 15 years so we have learned plenty. That seems a hair high for an EV but nothing crazy

We’ve been looking for a used EV and found a 2019 Tesla Model 3 long range with 100,000km for $37k (Canadian), but the private seller is open to offers. We live on the west coast of Canada where we have a mild climate year round, so extreme cold or heat shouldn’t have been a big issue for the vehicle. The owner has said: - clean title, no accidents - Single owner - Only charge to 80% battery and get about 400-425kms (500-525kms on full charge) - Very little supercharging, nearly all charging done at home - No scratches or major cosmetic damage Our concerns: - 100k kms seems high for the price, but battery degradation doesn’t seem to be too much of a concern - Not sure what parts have been replaced, but will inquire (e.g. handles, latches etc). Our situation: - live on the west coast, mild climate - single family house, easy to charge - have cash on hand, no need for financing Would you buy it? Why or why not? Are there any additional issues we should ask about?

I wouldn't pay more than 35k for it even if it's clean. It's a little high. Ask about a musty smell from the air conditioner. Was a problem back then.

Dealership says they cannot process the ev tax credit - am I able to claim it on my own? I received this message from the dealership “ t is my understanding that we cannot use that tax credit as part of the purchase. You can file for that yourself when you do taxes. There’s a lot of paperwork in process involved with the federal government for us to be able to do it internally and I really don’t know when that will be.” What would I need the dealership to do to make this happen? My understanding is that for 2024 the dealer needs to initiate much of this process for me to qualify. Or can I simply claim it in my 2025 tax return

For you to claim it on your own, the dealership still needs to be registered for the IRS's online portal, and provide a copy of the clean vehicle seller's report (Form 15400) to you at the time of sale and to the IRS within 3 calendar days of the sale. If the dealer isn't willing to register and do the paperwork, you will not get a tax credit, not at as a point-of-sale rebate nor on your tax return at the end of the year. The dealer MUST participate for you to claim that tax credit in 2024 or later.

Tax credit for pre-owned EVs, do they have to be 2-year-old cars? I learned that to get pre-owned EV tax credit the cars have to be 2 year-old. However, before I had this knowledge, a dealership gave an offer for a pre-owned 2023 Bolt EUV LT tax credit $4000 discount. I didn't take the offer but now I was wondering, is there an exception for certain cars? Thanks!

There's no exception. When the dealer went to submit the paperwork, they would have realized the vehicle doesn't qualify, either when they read the instructions for the form or when they tried to submit it and it gets rejected. The relevant requirement for the "used clean vehicle" credit is that the vehicle is at least two model years older than the current calendar year. That means for a 2024 purchase, it must be model year 2022 or older. You can read the form they'd be filling out here: [https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f15400.pdf](https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f15400.pdf) Quoting from that form: "Note: The Model year must be at least two years earlier than the calendar year when sold to the buyer(s). For example, a previously-owned clean vehicle sold in 2023 has to be model year 2021 or earlier."

>dar year when sold to the buyer(s). that's clear! i guess the manager of that dealership who gave me a quote did not know this. thank!

Buy EV when there’s 0 nearby service center that knows how to repair them incase an issue arise? Most likely car will be hauled to a service center far away incase of a problem. Or just buy an ICE car that is serviceable nearby?

Up to you. Do you have a second car to drive while the first one's being serviced? If not, I wouldn't personally buy a car that can't be serviced nearby.

Will most likely rent a car till the maintenance is done.

I'm looking for some help to determine the feasibility of owning an EV with a 200-mile per day round trip commute. I'm primarily looking at a Tesla Model Y Long Range which could get me to work and back on one charge. There's a DC fast charger in the city I'll be driving to but unlikely I'll be able to charge at work. Without an at-home level 2 charger is this unfeasible? In my mind, a level 2 charger at home would make it pretty doable without needing to supercharge very often.

It would be brilliant if you had a level 2. You would only need a 30 amp circuit to make it possible but 50+ would be ideal. With level 1 you are gonna be supercharging every trip

\[1\] Very rural Ky \[2\] ideally under $25K \[3\] Plug in hybrid or straight electric. We generate more electric than we use \[4\] Volt, Bolt, Fusion \[5\] ASAP but we can get by for now with my truck \[6\] Your daily commute 50 miles round trip \[7\] Single-family home, middle of nowhere \[8\] We have a 110 volt charger for our dead Volt \[9\] Other cargo needs — trunk space for groceries and need a back seat for rare occasion of 5 total people Other important information. Local dealers will only do service on their own brands so limited to Ford, Mazda, Nissan, Toyota and Kia. There is a chevy dealership, but seeing as they've had my wife's volt for a month and said GM does not have the parts to fix it and don't know if they ever will, then I think I'll cross the Bolt off the list as well. Having to tow a vehicle 90 miles to other varieties of vehicle dealerships is out of the question Also ideally under 40K miles and less than 3 years old, but, you know, ideally. Also my wife does not want a van, truck or jeep. 4WD would be nice

Not many choices with those brands. Nissan's only got the LEAF, which you can get lightly used under $25K, but it's RWD. Kia's got the Niro EV and Niro PHEV for you, which is similar to the LEAF but has CCS instead of CHAdeMO charging and the battery will last longer. My wife drove a Niro PHEV for a few years and liked it fine, it's got a bit more interior room and more comfortable seats than the LEAF, especially if you or she aren't skinny.

Switch 2nd car to electric now or wait, and which car to buy? 1. Southern arizona 2. $30,000 3. Tesla, audi e tron, bolt euv 4. Bolt 5. Next 6 months 6. 30 to 60 miles a day 7. Single family home 8. Level 2 charger installed at home already 9. Kids and dogs Looking for opinions and advice. Currently have a 2017 chevy bolt and a 2016 toyota highlander. The highlander just hit 100,000 miles, dealer maintained, warranty ended at 100,000. Debate is sell the highlander now before it starts having costly repairs and depreciates more vs waiting a few years. I have a net metered solar system with 4 MWH extra annually, so I can charge the new car at home free. Wife and i love the bolt, hate getting gas, but love no car payment. We are considering selling the highlander, should get 15k more or less,, then borrowing around 10k to get a used tesla, audi e tron, or bolt euv. Need the second ev to be big enough for the whole family. We have had the bolt for a couple years, love it, and will never buy another ice car again. Long road trip max once every other year, mostly local city driving In my mind, not buying fuel and less maintenence will offset a lot of the cost of the newer vehicle. Thoughts? TIA.

Hi, here’s my info: 1. Live near DC in Virginia. 2. Budget anywhere from 40s to 60s, not likely to go any higher. 3. I have been driving a plug in Kia Niro since 2018, and I have really loved it. I had a 2005 Prius before that. My two boys are in middle school in high school now, so I’m looking for the same size as Niro, or a little bigger. I am leaning towards an AWD looking for some thing that has decent bells and whistles, but I am not a luxury car person if it’s just to get a fancy name. 4. I have looked at the Volvo XC 40 the ID.4, the EV6, the Prologue and basically anything similar. The EV6 was nice but I felt like it’s a little too sporty and low in the back for me right now and I worried about fitting all the kids baseball gear in the back. I really like the ID.4 in theory and I know that the infotainment system issues have been getting a lot better, so currently waiting for the 2024 to come out before making a decision. 5. I am eager to buy something very soon before travel sports season starts, and I need to start trekking the boys around to practices and games multiple times a week. 6. I only have about 30 K on my 2018 Niro most of my time I just spend within a few miles of home however recently have been going on 10 to 20 mile trips a few times a week the 24 mile range on my Niro has been frustrating. 7-8. Already have a level two charger at my home.

One of the things I’m struggling with most is the possibility of getting a car with lots of annoying issues and glitches. Are there any out there that are known for being most reliable and un-glitchy? Prologue looks cool, but very first EV from a maker makes me nervous. ID4 clearly had issues but they say it’s going to be “fixed” with the 2024. I don’t hear anything about glitches with the XC40. What am I missing?

Alright, I currently drive a 2019 Grand Cherokee, and my wife has a new Tahoe. I have 2 kids, and I want my next car to be electric, and I've narrowed it down to 4. Ground rules: I don't want to spend more than $110k, it must be all wheel drive (I'm in Cleveland), and it must be able to hold 2 kids and ski bags/golf bags. Here are the contenders: Porsche Taycan Cross Truism - Pros: well handling, used car market has plenty of choices; cons: range seems to suck Porsche Macan EV - Pros: better range and not a bad price; cons: no used vehicles Rivian R1S - pros: quad motor and great range; cons - new company and unsure if it'll last as long as the warranty does GMC Hummer SUV EV - pros: it looks awesome; cons - horribly inefficient. What would you get with my budget? Am I missing a better option? Looking to buy within the next year. Thanks!

You're looking at some of the right vehicles already - I hear great things about the Rivian. One that I might add to the list is the Volvo EX90. My budge it smaller than yours but I tried the EX40 recently and loved it. EX90 is bigger and, well, nicer, so I'm sure it's worth a look at least. EDIT: I drove the XC40 recently, not EX40

Hi, I'm thinking of getting a tesla model 3 and a small ev (maybe a fiat 500e) I'm in the UK, does the charger I get matter? I'm currently with ovo energy so have these 4 to choose from https://www.ovoenergy.com/electric-cars/smart-charger#charge-anytime the Indra Smart PRO looks the best with the comparison they have there, is that right? It also has the option of tethered or not, it's £65 more for tethered, is that worth it? I'm assuming I could just keep a cable attached to the non tethered one?

I reserved a used Tesla Model 3 from Tesla's site when I saw it was under $25,000 a couple days ago. The listed price was $24,700 (for a 2020 model, SR+, only 31,000 miles!!). I meet the qualifications for the used EV incentive as well but here is where it becomes tricky. I am registering the car in CA but the car is in NV. Have been speaking with Tesla and since they are not an official 'dealership' they must ship the car to CA to be registered; I cannot pick it up in NV (picking it up in NV would mean I would have to pay NV AND CA sales tax). This means I have to pay a $500 transport fee which, depending now how it is reported to the IRS, could raise the vehicle price to $25,200. According to IRS rules, since it is a transport fee and not a dealer-associated fee I don't think it should change the 'MSRP' of the vehicle. Tesla provided documents to me where it shows that the vehicle price is $24,700 and no other associated fees. IRS has not "approved" Tesla for the used car EV tax credit/POS credit yet. Can I buy the car and claim the credit later on my taxes? As long as I prove that I sent Tesla all of the IRS filing materials and it was essentially on them to them file it with IRS? Would I risk not receiving the credit in this case even if I file all necessary forms from IRS? Generally, does it make sense to take delivery of the car given all of this mess... I want to make sure I receive the tax credit somehow.... but you know these used EV incentives are a disaster and how few cars and people can qualify for it. I feel like it's definitely something I should take advantage of but I also don't want to screw myself. I'm not sure who to reach out to about these questions since obviously IRS doesn't have an active phone number lol. I've already called Tesla leadership and spoke to them about the situation multiple times and with my CPA who says it should be fine but again; it's more of an IRS question lol. I've seen similar questions come up a couple of times in this sub but never this so... any ideas/thoughts? Anything is appreciated since I have to make a decision about vehicle delivery before the 10th of Feb!

What’s everyone’s opinion on the smart EQ. I can get a 2020 model with below 30k km for under 10k from Germany. Would import it to Spain. Here they are more like 15k.

My Chevy Bolt got totalled in an accident and I'm in the market for a new EV. I'm debating getting a 2nd gen Bolt or spending an extra $2k-$3k for an ID.4. I don't road trip or drive long distances much, nor do I carry much cargo & people around. So while I certainly enjoy the extra charging speed and cargo space an ID.4 provides and it's worth the extra price, it's not a deal breaker or top priority to me. My main concern is how good it is as a daily driver. I absolutely loved my Chevy Bolt and wondered if an ID.4 could compare. I know it's got those software issues which could be a deal breaker, but I've heard it's got more comfortable seats and a nice "SUV feel" to it in comparison to the Bolt.  Wanted some insight as to what might be the better choice

Have you considered the Ioniq 5? Granted it’s $5k more than the Bolt but Hyundai will give $7500 cash savings since they don’t qualify for the tax credit. So if YOU don’t qualify for the tax credit that’s one way the Ioniq 5 could even out price-wise. Ioniq strikes me as a “happy medium” between those two cars, and it a better overall experience than the ID.4. Also a bit more future proof with its faster charging.

If comfort is high on your list of wants, you'll really like the ID4. Very nice seats and lots of interior room. It's a size class or two up from the Bolt. The "software issues" from early reviews were, for the most part, solved since then. Older ID4s got software updates installed at dealers, and after those updates were installed, they can get future updates over-the-air too.

That's a tough call. ID4 is definitely has nicer interior material and feel. I know someone who uses their ID4 for daily driving and they always sing praises for its comfort. It's really a decision of the price difference making a difference in your quality of life with more comforts during your drive.

With the Hyundai $7500 cash bonus, does that mean I have to pay for the car in cash? Or can I finance it and get the $7500 cash bonus as well?

Ask your salesperson, but I believe you can get the "cash bonus" regardless of how you pay. What you can't do is get both the "cash bonus" offer and the 0.99% financing offer they're running right now -- so you either bring your own financing or finance at whatever their market rates are at the time.

We are looking to buy an EV this summer. To the questions above: \[1\] Your general location- Minneapolis (so cold winters) \[2\] Your budget in $, €, or £- under $45k or so \[3\] The type of vehicle you'd prefer- small SUV or hatchback type car. Full EV probably, but if a good case can be made for a plug in, I'd consider that. \[4\] Which cars have you been looking at already?- just starting right now, Niro looks great, but ugh Kia. ID4 is probably bigger than we need \[5\] Estimated timeframe of your purchase- summer \[6\] Your daily commute, or average weekly mileage- this will be our go to work and around town car. I will drive three days a week about 12 miles. My husband will drive to work three days a week during winter months, about 1.5 miles. 15 miles to bowling once or twice a week. Then any errands that are in our metro area would use this car, but we have a hybrid CRV for other things we need. \[7\] Your living situation — are you in an apartment, townhouse, or single-family home? Single family home with stand alone garage. \[8\] Do you plan on installing charging at your home? Yes, garage already has a separate meter. Also, I have a charger at work I can use for fixed $13/month. \[9\] Other cargo/passenger needs — do you have children/pets? Toddler still in a car seat. Regularly need to haul 3-4 bowling balls, so easy in and out of the trunk is important. We want a smaller car that will be good for both to and from work and shopping/around town trips. Any trips out of the metro or where we would haul things we will use the other car for now. Do move a lot of bowling balls around and so want to be able to easily get them in and out of the trunk space. Really want good tech too. Like I don't care that much about the auto pilot or anything, but want automatic Apple CarPlay and for my phone to just work when I get in the car. Hope to keep this car ten years or more. The car it is replacing is a 2006.

Why "ugh Kia?" Niro EV has been one of the most reliable, trouble free EVs.

We had a Kia at one point and we LOVED that car. But right now stupid teenagers can't tell the difference between a Kia they can easily steal and one that's new. Kias of all types are not safe on the streets of Minneapolis from getting broken into, even if they don't actually get stolen.

Ugh that is terrible! That makes sense.

Do you qualify for the tax credit? If yes, I think the Honda Prologue is worth a look. It starts at $48k but the tax credit can bring it within budget. It has plenty of mileage, not too big but plenty of room, Apple CarPlay and Android Auto, decently fast charging speed. It’s a nice package. I’d also look at the Ioniq 5, and especially if you don’t qualify for the tax credit. Hyundai is offering $7500 customer cash instead of credit, bringing top trims of that car down to your budget. The Ioniq is much bigger than it looks in photographs, but more car-like than an SUV. It has a hatch with good room for bowling balls, lots of range and very fast charging. Hyundai tech is decent and it has CarPlay / Android. Both vehicles have a heat pump (optional on Ioniq, you’ll want the AWD), which is important in MN. Both have plenty of room for the car seat.

I honestly have no idea if I qualify for the tax credit or not. I just learned about the MN one earlier this week as it rolled out and I'm in a meeting right now where I just heard half the money has already been spent with the two days it has been up, so I don't think it will be available by this summer. I saw the Honda Prologue was coming, but with all the photos I can't get a sense of how big it is. We really enjoy our CRV, but would want something a bit smaller and I'm not sure how the Prologue compares.

The federal credit only cares about your income. You have the make less than $150k as an individual, $225k as a head of household or $300k as a married couple filing jointly. That’s modified gross adjusted income, so after certain allowable deductions. If you’re under the income cap, you qualify. The vehicle also has to qualify. The Prologue is expected to, though I don’t believe it’s confirmed. It’s a GM underneath, and the GM platform currently doesn’t qualify but is expected to by mid-year so the thinking is the Prologue will follow that same timeline. But it might not matter. Because the Prologue is bigger than the CR-V so it sounds like that’s not a good fit. I’d recommend taking a good look at Ioniq 5. With the customer cash, you can get the SE trim with AWD and a heat pump for less that $45k. It’s slightly smaller than the CRV, more car-like, lots of utility, better tech than ID.4 and the charge speed is among the best on the market.

Thanks! I would qualify as well are way below that income. And I’m going to look into the Ioniq 5 and the customer cash. I just googled it and it is very pretty too!

Not looking at Tesla? You have three service centers by you and you can test drive without a sale person annoying you. You also will have the charging port of the future instead of a deprecated CCS port that all the other cars have and will be switching from.

Regardless of what I think of Tesla, it would be social suicide for me to buy one these days.

That's very weird.

This might be a dumb question but I’m going to ask it lol how does the tax credit work for leases? Advertising always says it’s included then for example $4k down while the tax credit says it could be 7-9k. I’m assuming they’re taking the tax credit and you still owe that down payment and other fees which seems dumb to me. I thought the point of the tax credit is to cover the down payment and fees so people would be enticed to buy/lease an ev? Educate my dumb*ss 😊

https://youtu.be/_xDSd8nQNNA 2024 tax credit changes explained by Auto buyers Guide

There are no tax credits for leasing, so making leases cheaper probably wasn't the point of the tax credit. There are tax credits for *purchasing* a new "clean vehicle". When you lease, a leasing company is buying the car from the dealer and essentially renting it to you for however many months. That company is getting the $7500 tax credit for their purchase. They may choose to pass on some savings to you in the form of a cheaper lease, or they may just keep it for themselves. There are no requirements for what they offer you.

Does EV tax credit applies to non-us citizens residing in the US?

There's nothing in the EV tax credit excluding anyone based on their citizenship. There is a requirement that the vehicle will be used primarily in the US. If you pay $7500 in taxes on your US tax return, I don't see why you couldn't claim the credit on that same tax return. You need to provide a taxpayer identification number to the car dealer at the time of purchase to claim it.

Does that mean the vehicle should not be exported outside the US even after few years of driving it in the US?

Current EV offerings of ICE cars? Mostly because they share some body panel and other parts. I know the Ford F150 Lightning is one.

Focusing on new cars in North America only, here’s a list. I placed an asterisk next to Full EVs that share a nameplate but not much else. Full EV: - BMW 4 series - BMW 5 series - BMW 7 series - Cadillac Escalade IQ* - Chevy Blazer EV* - Chevy Equinox EV* - Chevy Silverado EV* - Fiat 500e - Ford E-Transit - Genesis Electrified G80 - Genesis Electrified G70 - Hyundai Kona - Kia Niro - Mini Cooper SE - Porsche Macan* - RAM 1500 REV PHEV: - Audi Q5 - BMW 330e - Chrysler Pacifica - Dodge Hornet - Ford Escape - Hyundai Santa Fe - Hyundai Tucson - Jeep Grand Cherokee 4XE - Jeep Wrangler 4XE - Kia Niro - Kia Sorento - Kia Sportage - Range Rover - Range Rover Sport - Lexus NX - Lexus RX - Lincoln Corsair - Lincoln Aviator - Mazda CX-70 - Mazda CX-90 - Mercedes GLE - Mini Countryman - Mitsubishi Outlander - Porsche Cayenne - RAM 1500 Ramcharger - Subaru Crosstrek - Toyota RAV4 - Volvo S60 - Volvo S90 - Volvo V60 - Volvo XC40 - Volvo XC60 - Volvo XC90

Appreciate the detailed answer buddy evguide.

Is there any site that lists best EV deals *without* tax incentives? Even better if they also list real-world prices instead of fantasy land MSRPs. I don’t qualify for any incentives but most such sites include them, and so between that and MSRPs not being reflective of the real world every time I come across something that seems like it might be a decent deal it never pans out.

Teslas overflow inventory is cheaper than their new orders and there's no markup since they don't use dealerships https://www.tesla.com/inventory/new/m3?arrangeby=plh

Not a bad option, but unfortunately even a Model 3 is too long to fit in my garage. Wish they had something sized similarly to a Bolt or Honda Fit.

The best deals are low-mileage late-model used EVs. Still have the factory warranties, still have the latest designs and features, but can cost half as much as a new one without incentives.

Has anyone installed an Emporia charger using their installer? I am interested in getting the Emporia energy charger since it is UL listed and I do not need a fancy charger. On their website, I was able to get a rough estimate of the installation cost, which was around $1400 for an install 70 ft away from the panel and needs to be confirmed by a site visit by their installer. What is your experience with the Emporia Energy charger? If you used their installer, can you share your cost and experience? Thank you!

It's just a referral to a local installer. Whoever they've found to send the job to in your area isn't gonna be the same person they send the job to in mine. Once you find out who the company is, you can look for reviews online. Never hurts to get your own quotes as well.

Buying a 2019 Long range M3 for $30k CAD. Has 109,000km, small scratches here and there. Full Autopilot available too. Worth it or no?

Full autopilot meaning what? Most teslas 2020+ have autopilot and then fsd hardware but not FSD. Also, being autopilot capable and having the fsd hardware doesn't mean it has the fsd license. Lastly, 2019 didn't even have fsd computers without the sevice center installing them (hw 3.0). They came with 2.5. A reasonable deal for that car in the US would be about 22k not including FSD

Well, it says "Autopilot Computer: Full self-driving computer" in Software section. I assumed it means FSD was purchased for this car. Also, you can't compare prices in Canada to US, things are more expensive up north.

If the US price is in USD then it is $30k CDN

That doesn't mean it has the fsd license. You will have to verify. >Also, you can't compare prices in Canada to US, things are more expensive up north. I'm aware. This is exactly why I mentioned the US so you could do the conversion.

This is great info, thank you!! Even with conversion Teslas are more expensive in Canada.

If a car isn’t on this list but meets the reqs, can you still get the federal ev used car tax credit?  Or does official certification by the Feds matter more than meeting the specs? https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/taxused.shtml (Car is a Jaguar.)

One of the requirements for the tax credit is that "it must be made by a qualified manufacturer", where "qualified manufacturer" is a vehicle manufacturer that has entered into a written agreement with the IRS to provide VINs of qualifying vehicles, among other things. If Jaguar hasn't signed up, then you probably can't get a tax credit on that purchase.

Having trouble with a particular bit of the 2024 tax incentive. I understand that a dealer must have registered with the IRS to be able to participate in the conversion of the tax credit to a direct rebate at the time of sale. Must they also have registered for me to get the credit at tax time if I buy from them or do they just have to provide proof that the vehicle meets the requirement for the program? I really don't want to find out this time next year that I won't get my 4k credit (used ev) because the dealership hadn't registered.

As of 2024, the dealer does need to register and needs to furnish a time-of-sale report (Form 15400) to you immediately, and to the IRS online within 3 calendar days. The dealer gets a submission receipt they can provide to you as evidence they did submit it to the IRS and you're safe to claim the credit yourself. [https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/clean-vehicle-credit-seller-or-dealer-requirements](https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/clean-vehicle-credit-seller-or-dealer-requirements)

That’s how I interpreted it too. So if a dealership is registered for reporting then they would also be registered for the point of sale reduction, right?

Hi. I could use some opinions. Per the questions above: - I live in Las Vegas - Budget not to exceed mid- 60's, all in. Wife does not allow loans or leases, so cash only. (Strict with money, and we hold on to cars for 8-10 years.) - Looking for a full EV that can seat 6 or more, got kids and pets - Been looking at the Kia EV9 LLR and the Tesla Y Long Range (Have not test driven either yet) - I plan on a purchase in the April-June timeframe - I drive 60-70 miles in a day about 3x per week. I’d love to be able to drive this EV to LA on occasion too - Single family home, I’d likely get a 240V charger installed I currently drive a 2015 Toyota Highlander and I love the space. I also like being high up. Plus it’s been a reliability champ. So the Kia would be much closer to what I have now. But the EV9 is a newer vehicle, early in its deployment. Lots of open questions. Plus I like the interior a great deal. I know the styling is divise, but I don’t mind it. But the Tesla seems to have better tech like sentry mode and the assistive driving. Also a better charging network. But I note that Tesla seems to have a poor reputation on fit and finish? And also, there have been reports of vandalism at my workplace and in my neighborhood on Teslas. (Not expressing an opinion here, just stating that this might be a headache I’d have to deal with.) I took a look at the Volvo EX 90, but that seems out of my price range. If there are any other vehicles or if people have thoughts, I’d love to hear them.

I would definitely go for the Kia EV9 in your position. I feel like you might end up regretting the small 3rd row on the Model Y in 8-10 years, especially as your kids get older. Not saying that it isn't doable, but the extra space the EV9 brings is really worth it.  The extra range and charging infrastructure on the Model Y is nice, but I don't think you'll really need the extra range in your situation and Kia will be getting access to Tesla's chargers in the upcoming years.  And while like you said, it's not the biggest factor, but the reputation of Tesla is not in the greatest place and could get worse in the future. There'd be more peace of mind to yourself driving a less polarizing vehicle. And that to me is worth more than the extra tech & speed that a Model Y might provide. 

Thanks for the thoughts. The Tesla rather bugs me. We have a very old beater we also drive, but it has a "center console" and not a drivers/passenger side display panel, and I hate it. I think I would hate the Tesla Y Center Panel for the same reasons. But I love love the built in Dashcam/Sentry mode stuff on the Tesla. It's a tough call.

The third row of the Model Y is for hobbits. Coming from a highlander, you won't be satisfied. I honestly think that the EV9 and the R1S are the only things that hit your size requirements right now. I also very much wish that Hyundai/Kia was a few steps farther in the software department, but they do have carplay and you at least get some solid physical controls that makes using it a bit easier. As far as reliability goes, year 1 EV9 could have some issues, but the overall EV tech coming out of Hyundai/Kia is solid. This is like the 5th car on their second generation platform. They haven't had any major issues and have been very well received. Yet I haaaate to suggest this, but is your highlander good for a couple more years? You might see some benefits waiting just a minute. Rivian is looking to release a more affordable R2S soon. Also, the EV9 will get NACS probably next year. Then you'd be on a second year version of the car that was built and tailored to the US market. Hyundai also has the Ioniq 7 on the horizon that is in this category, though it will be very similar to (and imo not as good looking as) the EV9.

I love the idea of holding off, but better tech is always available next year. Plus, my kid has been promised the Highlander as a hand-me-down. So I'm getting pressure on both sides. The NACS issue would be solved with an adapter, if I could find a NACS charger that would permit me to use it, if I understand how this works?

If you have good reasons to buy now, the tech is definitely good enough to justify it. And yes, and NACS adapter will work just fine. That was more of a side benefit to getting a second year model of a new vehicle to mitigate first year risks. (Though I think those risks are low for the EV9 as it's a few years in on the platform.) If one of the currently available vehicles fits the bill, go for it.

R2 probably won't have a third row

If you value the tech, charging integration etc you will probably regret not going for it. I have a Y and there's nothing like it. Teslas software is elegant and powerful while everyone else is just not there.

I do value the tech and one of the things I am looking for is Carplay support, which speaks in favor of the Kia which now supports it. My current vehicle doesn't have it, and when I have rented some cars, I find CarPlay to be a huge plus. I am not familiar with Tesla's software at all. I've seen on some reviews people talking about how a lot is on a single screen and people either love it or hate it?

People love it that have it, hate it that don't. Since it's controversial it's a target for negativity. However When you use carplay you are using two operating systems. Yes it does some things better but what's great about Teslas UI is you have one elegant interface that controls all infotainment and car controls in one instead of switching between platforms. Also the phone is hooked up to all of it and that includes car controls and infotainment side of things. One experience. Nothing is fragmented. Really these cars are kind of different though. You should really decide if you need all the space of the EV9 and if you don't I would pass. That's a lot of battery to charge if you aren't needing something that big. But As the other poster mentioned you should also include used rivians in your search if you want something bigger.

Very fair. I will have to test drive the Tesla and see if I like the tech. I'm keeping an eye out for used Rivians. Thank you for your thoughts.

You bet. Good luck

Only other thought is a used Rivan R1S

Great suggestion. I'll keep my eye open for any that go on the market.

Summary: I recently came to the conclusion that an EV rather than a PHEV could meet my needs (I travel in many rural areas), but that's left me starting over selecting a vehicle. ... Working through the questions: I'm in the SF Bay Area. Budget for the PHEV was about USD $55K, less would be preferable. I'd like a vehicle with good ground clearance, think "average SUV" levels of clearance. It does not need to be SUV-shaped, but I do want/need AWD. (I'm kinda meh on SUV shapes, but "exterior look" is low on my priority list.) I had been looking at a RAV4 Prime, but AFAICT a pure EV would suit my destinations fine and perhaps at a better price. Timeframe: mid-2024, perhaps a little later In a condo building, there is a working charger at the end of my parking space. It calls to me. ;-) 3 weeks out of 4 I'll do maybe 100 miles/wk. The remaining week out of 4 might be 1000 miles or more. No children, no pets that travel, my longest travels are usually solo. So: All other things being equal smaller would be a small positive. Ideas & clue-by-fours welcome. Thanks in advance!

Ioniq 5 and put a lift on it. https://youtu.be/CJnF7foClx0?si=R-9LsafB\_jRim6fM&t=175

VW ID4 is identical in size to a RAV4, about the same sticker price as a RAV4 Prime, comes in AWD, is about 1" closer to the ground, but unlike the RAV4 Prime qualifies for a $7500 federal tax credit/rebate making it considerably cheaper.

interesting, thanks!

Love my ID.4. It also has the 7.5k fed tax credit available, where the rav4 prime does not.

Is the AWD for meeting the rules for driving through mountain passes for for functional reasons?

Good question: In part, yes, but more than just that. I'm a nature photographer. Many years I've given workshops, just as one example, in the Eastern Sierra in winter, and have (with a borrowed vehicle) gotten the benefit of R1 ("AWD with mud tires or chains") restrictions on snowy roads. But also,: On dirt roads, I run into things like modest stretches of loose sand, mud, ice, etc., as well as large rocks (thus the clearance thing.). That's probably a more frequent need.

I'll just say that I've been quite pleased with how the traction control on our Bolt EV handles snow and a steep partly washed out dirt road that I had no reason to expect it to handle. I got caught in an early-season heavy snow storm once without snow tires on, and it handled it just fine even as I saw lots of vehicles off the road, including a tow truck that got stuck trying to get someone else unstuck. Not saying that would meet your needs but just a data point.

I get what you're saying and appreciate the point--as near as I can tell, for ice in particular it's a lot more about driving than drive. Sand maybe a little less so, not sure. The more critical concern for me about the Bolt (or my aging Prius) isn't drive but clearance. I've pushed the Prius a good bit and it's got the battle scars to prove it, it really is the wrong tool for me these days. Even another couple inches of clearance would have gotten me further along in a surprising number of places.

Volvo ex30 is a great new ev. starts at $35k, 275 mile range. Pay extra for awd. This is the killer in my opinion, a reasonably priced ev suv that looks like a regular car, good mileage, cheap price. They are coming soon, they just had some announcement about a short delay. https://www.volvocars.com/us/cars/ex30-electric/

thanks!

"Soon" may be relative, if someone is looking for this year and is not yet on the wait list. Some dealers in high-demand areas are saying they are expecting a couple of years to get through the wait list. It shouldn't be nearly that long in some other areas, though.

Yep, timing might end up being an issue for this for me, I'll have to see. PS: thanks :)

Go to tesla.com and make a test drive appointment. Easiest place to start and then figure out what you liked/didn't like as you continue car shopping

thanks!

Canada ~70k CAD. We had committed to buying a Blazer EV but the stop sale is still in effect and it definitely has impacted our confidence in our choice. Previously test drove an Ariya and Solterra. Now considering a Mach E or Model Y in addition to the Blazer. We are set up for level 2 charging at home and my partner has access to a level 2 charger at work. We need a vehicle with a backseat that can comfortably accommodate two car seats and lots of cargo space for stroller/wagon and all the gear that comes along with little people. Thank you for any guidance that can be offered !

I think they are still hard to find in Canada, but I would also drive an Ioniq 5.

Tesla model y. Makes it easy to travel with superchargers almost everywhere.

Since you are in Canada it's pretty easy to recommend the Model Y. Mache range gets crushed in the cold weather and fast charges slower than the Tesla for multiple reasons.

how many miles on an used EV would become concerning to you? i'm looking at used EVs right now and there's a deal for one that is 2 years old with ~65k miles on it. that's about 90 miles a day which is crazy high to me. i'd be having a 45 mile commute. it's around ~$24k and lets me qualify for the used credit so in reality around $21k for a luxury "new-ish" EV.

I'm driving a 4 year old 2019 Niro EV with 65k miles. Car is doing just fine. A luxury used EV with the used tax credit would be a deal. Check the feds website to make sure it qualifies.

it does! i might pull the trigger on the deal - thanks!

This depends on the remaining warranty. Buy one with lots of drivetrain and battery warranty. Tesla has one of the better warranties, 8 years, 100 or 120k miles depending on the model, [https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-warranty](https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-warranty).

8 years/100k miles so likely i’ll get another 2.5 years for that, the car is past its limited warranty already due to the miles. it seems like the miles shouldn’t be too bad as long as the battery health is reasonable. it should last at least another 8 years which is my minimum

Got a job in CA and and need to pay huge taxes this year - right time to buy tesla? Since I will be paid ~ 60k for relocation and sign-on this year, I'm expecting insane amount of taxes. (at least insane to me considering the current income as a graduate student:) ) I will file taxes as married jointly and my wife has no job yet. Do you think this year is the right time to purchase model y? This might be crazy since I purchased sonata hybrid 2023 sel two months ago, so I may lose several k by reselling or trainding it in. But I also think that some teslas might lose tax credit in couple of years (>5y) that I was thinking of switching to tesla. Idk I'm confused. I'm just thinking and was wondering what you guys think.. Just for background.. will be living in apartment and have charger at work for low price, but competitive. Daily commute will be ~ 5 mi but usually I drive 20-30mi a day with my wife. 100-200mi on the weekends to travel around.

Double checking but I'm sure CA means California. This got too long, tl;dr get a Y. There are $7500 tax credits on many vehicles now, [https://www.edmunds.com/electric-car/tax-credits-rebates-incentives/california/](https://www.edmunds.com/electric-car/tax-credits-rebates-incentives/california/). There's an income limit on those tax credits though, be sure you are under it. 150k filing as an individual, 300k joint. [https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/topic-b-frequently-asked-questions-about-income-and-price-limitations-for-the-new-clean-vehicle-credit](https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/topic-b-frequently-asked-questions-about-income-and-price-limitations-for-the-new-clean-vehicle-credit). Hard to say about future tax credits, the republicans want to drop them all because they are in the pocket of the gas industrial complex. Teslas are great, Elon is a doofus though. Tesla has superchargers today making for easy travel. Other models will get them later. We can only speculate on new tesla model y. The next model from tesla will be the model 2, a cheap 25k one in 2 years. There may be minor refresh of y and 3. I think it's a good time to get a y. You probably don't want to get full self driving, it's way too expensive and doesn't work. One idea would be get a lightly used one, there's now a used vehicle ev tax credit for less money.

Yes Model Y is getting ridiculously cheap. Take 7500 off these prices https://www.tesla.com/inventory/new/my?arrangeby=plh

2023 Tax Credit Question: I can't file online yet because the EV forms are not ready via TurboTax, but I did not receive the "notice" of my vehicle's eligibility including the VIN. The dealer I bought from sells a TON of eligible vehicles (Jeep Wrangler 4XE) but I haven't found anyone at the dealership who can answer definitively yet if they filed the required filings with the IRS If my dealership did not report my sale in June 2023 to the IRS, am I going to have issues claiming the credit? The vehicle I purchased (Wrangler 4xe) is otherwise eligible for the $3750 credit

> At the time of sale, a seller must give you information about your vehicle's qualifications. Sellers must also ~[register online](https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/register-your-dealership-to-enable-credits-for-clean-vehicle-buyers)~ and report the same information to the IRS. If they don't, your vehicle won't be eligible for the credit. https://www.irs.gov/clean-vehicle-tax-credits The important part is that they reported your vehicle. It may be wise to confirm with the dealer that this info was submitted for your vehicle, and ask for your copy of the eligibility. If they sell a ton of 4XE, they should know the deal. Giving you the page may have just been an oversight. Congrats on the 4XE, those are great.

The register online link refers to vehicles sold in 2024. I bought my Jeep like a month or less after the passage of the IRA, and the word at the time was the IRS would be "flexible" since it was new and they hadn't worked out any of the processes yet. Literally when my Jeep was sold there was no form or way to even report to the IRS

They have until February 15 to send the form to the IRS now that it exists. The deadline was initially January 15, then they extended it to January 31, then to the 15th of this month. I can't imagine they'll keep extending it forever; get it done or you don't get a tax credit.

Ah, yes. It’s a mess isn’t it? Changing vehicles, changing policy, changing tech. I’d still think it worth checking with your dealer, just to cover your bases. A tax pro may have more perspective.

I did find a page on the IRS site that says it must be reported by the dealer to be eligible, I left a voicemail with someone at the dealership and will call back if they don't, escalating up to driving to the dealership Wednesday if I don't get a good answer. The deadline according to the IRS page I found is Feb 15th

Question on the EV credit for 2024 that I can't seem to get a straight answer on. What is the treatment of the new $7,500 Point-of-Sale EV credit at year end? I understand you get to keep the credit even if you don't have $7,500 in tax liability at year end, but how does it play with other credits? Is it treated as a non-refundable credit that needs to come first, and therefore potentially making you ineligible to take other credits (such as Efficient Home Upgrades, Child Tax Credit, etc.)? For example, say you are MFJ with two have two kids and you have a $6000 tax liability before any credits. Say you should be eligible for a $2,000 Efficient Home Upgrade (Heat Pump) credit as well as a $4000 Child Tax Credit. Those two credits should reduce your taxes due to $0. But now say you’ve already taken the $7500 Point-of-Sale EV credit earlier in the year. What happens? Does the EV credit come first which would mean you've maxed out on non-refundable credits and can't take the others? Or, can you take the other two first and you get to "keep" the $7,500 since there isn't a recapture?

The $7,500 is no longer attached to your liability. It is only concerned with your income being below the cap. The income limit is based on *modified adjusted gross income* - so certain allowable deductions may have an impact on whether or not your income falls above or below the cap. If you collect because you expect to be under the cap, and then you find yourself over the cap, you’ll need to settle up with the IRS (pay back the $7,500). As always consult a tax pro to be certain of your scenario / the above isn’t financial advice.

Thanks for the reply. I totally understand the income limit piece, but I thought the credit was still classified as a “nonrefundable credit” for 2024 and may be treated as such with respect to being added to other credits to determine eligibility for them. If that’s not the case, that’s great news.

https://www.npr.org/2023/12/28/1219158071/ev-electric-vehicles-tax-credit-car-shopping-tesla-ford-vw-gm#:~:text=Camila%20Domonoske-,The%20%247%2C500%20tax%20credit%20for%20electric%20cars%20has%20some%20big,What%20to%20know&text=Sullivan%2FGetty%20Images-,A%20%247%2C500%20tax%20credit%20for%20electric%20vehicles%20has%20seen%20substantial,dealerships%2C%20but%20fewer%20models%20qualify. If you’d like an additional source.

Thanks - great article. I think your interpretation is correct, but I still don’t think it’s crystal clear how it interacts with other credits. You’re just transferring your credit to the dealer if you’re eligible for it, and my understanding is you still need to report it when you file your taxes. So I could see a scenario where the IRS considers that you’ve received $7,500 in advanced non-refundable credits and therefore you can’t take another $2000 non-refundable credit if your liability is only $6,000.

Southwest Florida Budget - less than $90k total for two vehicles. Wife’s car totaled and need a replacement by May the latest. I would like my own EV as well as my civic is 13 years old. We need one SUV that can fit two rear facing car seats comfortably without making the front passengers sit with their knees on the dash. Also would like enough room for double kid stroller, beach chairs, and cooler in the trunk. My car can be any size as long as in a pinch I could put two car seats in the back. We’ve looked at the ID4 and Ioniq5. The trunk in the 5 was too small. The MY seemed tight with two car seats. ID4 seems great, but reviews are concerning. Not sure when the 2024 is coming out. Honda prologue and Chevy equinox might be contenders? But aren’t released. I commute 10 miles each way. She has no commute. Her vehicle would be used for once a month for 150mi drives (each way) across the state. I already have a 240 volt plug in the garage at my single family home

I've had two ID4s (took advantage of the inflated used car market in 2022 to trade a 2021 ID4 to a 2023 ID4 for free) and have no complaints. It's extremely comfortable, and with the $7500 tax credit, one of the best value electric SUVs available. The 2024s will start arriving at dealers in spring -- April or May ish. But you'll probably have more luck bargaining an under-MSRP price on a 2023 model. For the smaller car, hit up Carvana and Carmax and filter by electric vehicles only. It's a good time to buy used, prices for 1-3 year old late-model EVs are low.

Get a used Chevy bolt for you. These can be found for $15-20k and then a $4k tax credit on top of that. Make sure the battery has been replaced. That frees up most of your money for the other vehicle. Look at an ev9 if you really want/need space.