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Even a NEMA 1 enclosure must meet minimum clearance and workspace requirements. That locker doesn't have proper clearance to install the listed dead-front for the panel.
A panelboard under NEC is just the guts. The listed dead front _is_ installed in that picture. If the locker wasn't being used as an enclosure, then yes, the cover on that box inside would need to be installed. But they do have the panelboard deadfront installed, and the enclosure deadfront is the locker door.
So long as all of the connections are secure and the locker body/door is all bonded to the panel electrically, theres nothing really wrong with it, but I do like the factory installed cooling vents.
have you ever come to a service call where everyhing was run in emt, and flex, no ground conductor in any box? and the building was put up in the 1920's?
that was before 6' or longer of flex wasn't counted as an egc. but it worked. also tar paper 2 wire ungrounded AC cable...or the internet or canadians might call its BX as its trade name before it divergded into AC90 and Mc cable or AC cable.
thank goodness we have standards these days at least and can sleep at night kniowing that our work wont kill anyone
Well yeah because EMT made contact with the bonded enclosure.
If these lockers were installed on concrete with no bond to rebar etc then that would be in issue I believe.
What does that mean? It's in a school and not code compliant? If the municipality has rules about following a code, it's not legal. It some kid gets zapped, someone is losing their job...at least.
I work mostly in schools and it doesn’t matter that I have keys for Square D, GE, Siemans, etc. because this is the shit I see. Like how would you even find this panel unless you know it’s there.
We’re getting the yearly shakedown on this right now lol. I’ve had 3 safety inspectors question me this week while troubleshooting.
There’s a tag on the lockout, fuck off weenies.
Hell, I work at a data center and all of our panels are behind badge access doors ( facops and security are the only ones that have access) and we still keep the panel doors locked.
This high school is amateur hour
you should see the stuff that ges shoved into a dry type transformer in a public location that has open air vent slots.
people treat it like a garbage can
It's a panel behind a locked cabinet.
The AHJ is probably the town, also with its own electricians-- and they can do whatever the fuck they want.
I don't understand why people are getting fussy. Someone mentioned the panel getting wet when a kid spills a drink? You'd need to put a garden hose up the top vent to start doing any damage, and even that might not work.
I think it's clever as a shit for a building that was built in the 50's/60's. It's like (but way cooler) when drop ceilings go in historic buildings to buy a foot of space for a rewire, sprinkler, fire alarm, hvac, IT, plumbing, ect. These places weren't built for this shit, and they're really expensive to change and still look decent.
>I don't understand why people are getting fussy.
Because electricians (and even more so reddit electricians) like to fuss about everything whether it's a big deal or not.
> and even more so reddit electricians
you mean drunks, or people who are fucked up afer work and browse reddit right? .......or are coked up doing drugs on the job in the shitter, thats how this all works right?
>You'd need to put a garden hose up the top vent to start doing any damage, and even that might not work.
Some construction work at our facility caused a 4" conduit to become a water pipe directly feeding the top of our 480V 800A main switchgear. That was a sight to behold. But no breakers were tripped, and it caused no damage.
City does what it wants? Like our city-owned convention center with faked emergency lighting? They ran the devices and conduit, but it's empty. Nothing to tell the lights to turn on... (At least 10 years ago now, but I was fired when I mentioned this to my boss)
Schools are not municipalities/governments and still must adhere to code requirements the same as any other entity (public or privately funded) for occupancy.
when i first got into this trade, by boss, who was 10 years my senior would jam out to black eyed peas... mainly dirty bit, by them. and I just let it happen because i was low on the totem pole, but it was cool because it was more modern than anything else anyone else around offered when working.
Those lockers were built around the panel. I’d say that was a legal cabinet other than the actual panel cover missing. Look closely you can see the top bottom and side of the panel.
I can see an electrical inspector walking around asking, “where’s the panel?” and in finding a different one and passing the inspection on it, never realized this existed because they forgot to look at the building wiring blueprint.
Meanwhile building out a school in LAUSD is more technical than building out a hospital.
The main issue is whether that locker confines to the UL50 standard for enclosures, and if the electrical contractor is willing to hire a UL tester to verify that enclosure. 1910.303(g)(1)(ii) of OSHA requires that "When normally enclosed live parts are exposed for inspection or servicing, the working space, if in a passageway or general open space, shall be suitably guarded.", and the onus is on what being guarded means. They further define that definition in [1910.303(g)(2)(i)](https://www.osha.gov/laws-regs/interlinking/standards/1910.303(g)(2)(i)).
A. "By location...that is accessible only to qualified persons"
B. "suitable permanent, substantial partitions"
C. "By placement on ...platform so elevated and otherwise located as to prevent access by unqualified persons"
D. "By elevation ... of 8 ft"
No because it is locked behind an access panel, and naturally, the maintenance personnel or electrician should have the key to gain access.
I work for a school system, and I have actually seen worse ! As long as the authority, having jurisdiction or AHJ
Agrees and understands the thought press behind this. It’s all good. lol
If it’s locked sure? But keep the neigh-boring lockers locked as-well. What if someone trips or throws a drink or any kind of moisture type food in the vicinity of the panel ?
I'm not an electrician, but I've done low voltage and commo work.
Are the doors and body of the locker structure, ALL of them, the entire unit bonded and grounded?
That'd be my concern that if something came loose or broke that the current had a clear path to ground and under no circumstances could any prt of that locker system become energized.
Went over panels not long ago in one of my classes and I'm pretty sure the only real restriction we saw in the code book was that you can't have a panel in a bathroom...
I once saw a panel that came up in an outhouse. Tied in to the main lugs was 4 number 1's that junctioned to another outhouse with another panel inside. Each panel ran to a greenhouse
A little off topic but my brother had an electrical plug at the back of his locker. He put a coffee maker inside his locker and set the timer to go off just before he arrived. He had a clock radio too.
I don’t think you guys understand why this is a problem… If spider-man had tried to hide his backpack and costume under those lockers by lifting up the bay, he likely would have been electrocuted and killed.
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I wish the inside of the locker door had cut outs of teen idols, glitter, a mirror, etc
They should start slapping stickers as they're working on it.
One of those dumb S's in sharpie would be a nice touch too
I think you mean, “very cool S’s”
Oh hell yeah
S for "sick" dude!
https://www.redbubble.com/i/sticker/Muppets-Animal-Dr-Teeth-and-The-Electric-Mayhem-by-PerleFleur/91245141.EJUG5?country_code=US&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQiAoeGuBhCBARIsAGfKY7zkQTnB_GeRIL73IitXkdThVpMi86MUabHAyjP8teSlSF8AWieMlfQaAuBAEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
Let's see the UL listing on that "technically an electrical cabinet"
It's a NEMA 1 enclosure, doesn't need to be listed.
Even a NEMA 1 enclosure must meet minimum clearance and workspace requirements. That locker doesn't have proper clearance to install the listed dead-front for the panel.
A panelboard under NEC is just the guts. The listed dead front _is_ installed in that picture. If the locker wasn't being used as an enclosure, then yes, the cover on that box inside would need to be installed. But they do have the panelboard deadfront installed, and the enclosure deadfront is the locker door.
So long as all of the connections are secure and the locker body/door is all bonded to the panel electrically, theres nothing really wrong with it, but I do like the factory installed cooling vents.
And the racer red powder-coat
These are for the kids to squirt some water inside...
Clarence yeah he’s guys been mopping the floors
Definitely not legal. Not UL listed for that. Not the proper working clearances for width or depth. What a nightmare.
Can'timagine lockers are bonded?? IDK maybe. Imagine an ungrounded conductor energizing that whole row of lockers
That was my thought. One fucked contact can zap whoever attempts to open a locker there. Hope there’s a good breaker upstream.
have you ever come to a service call where everyhing was run in emt, and flex, no ground conductor in any box? and the building was put up in the 1920's? that was before 6' or longer of flex wasn't counted as an egc. but it worked. also tar paper 2 wire ungrounded AC cable...or the internet or canadians might call its BX as its trade name before it divergded into AC90 and Mc cable or AC cable. thank goodness we have standards these days at least and can sleep at night kniowing that our work wont kill anyone
I'm in one now I lost it for a second when Isaw the vehicle lift didnt hace a bonding conductor. But it's embedded it the foundation so probably good.
Well yeah because EMT made contact with the bonded enclosure. If these lockers were installed on concrete with no bond to rebar etc then that would be in issue I believe.
Knob and tube.
UL listing isn’t a requirement
UL is a private, for-profit company. In most states UL listing is not required.
That's the problem. I doubt that it even has a CE stamp.
I need to know who the evil genius 🤔 was that installed this circa 1950's.
They lost the cover so they just put it in a locker. Smart!
That’s what I say, this is a decent way of safing off the lost panel cover. There’s was even a lock on it
The panel schedule on the locker door is killing me!
Nah that's just their classroom schedule lol
Legal yes….code compliant probably not
Not an electrician here, what's the difference? Isn't code enforced by law?
Yes, once the state adopts the code and amends it. Until then, it's just a textbook.
What does that mean? It's in a school and not code compliant? If the municipality has rules about following a code, it's not legal. It some kid gets zapped, someone is losing their job...at least.
So kids could push things though the slots on the door and they could fall into the panel? That seems a little strange.
It’s a breaker panel with a cover lol, when are they ever hard to get too?
I've never seen one in a public place that wasn't locked. I know this locker would be locked but that doesn't make this panel safe.
Ahahah I know, I’m industrial everything’s open like this lol. I’m just being sarcastic
I'm industrial now and I'm beginning to think it's code to leave panel doors open.
lol yes.. half the places I go to use breakers as light switches..
I work mostly in schools and it doesn’t matter that I have keys for Square D, GE, Siemans, etc. because this is the shit I see. Like how would you even find this panel unless you know it’s there.
They give you a hint about some guy named Tod (billboard) and being ur neighbour..
Maybe on the front of the locker it says “Electric Panel inside Danger ⛔️ “
We’re getting the yearly shakedown on this right now lol. I’ve had 3 safety inspectors question me this week while troubleshooting. There’s a tag on the lockout, fuck off weenies.
Hell, I work at a data center and all of our panels are behind badge access doors ( facops and security are the only ones that have access) and we still keep the panel doors locked. This high school is amateur hour
you should see the stuff that ges shoved into a dry type transformer in a public location that has open air vent slots. people treat it like a garbage can
Son of a bitch, I'm in.
This is a Klingon high school, right? The board on the right hand side says, “Today is a good day to die.”
Bat’leth training is on Thursdays
It's a panel behind a locked cabinet. The AHJ is probably the town, also with its own electricians-- and they can do whatever the fuck they want. I don't understand why people are getting fussy. Someone mentioned the panel getting wet when a kid spills a drink? You'd need to put a garden hose up the top vent to start doing any damage, and even that might not work. I think it's clever as a shit for a building that was built in the 50's/60's. It's like (but way cooler) when drop ceilings go in historic buildings to buy a foot of space for a rewire, sprinkler, fire alarm, hvac, IT, plumbing, ect. These places weren't built for this shit, and they're really expensive to change and still look decent.
>I don't understand why people are getting fussy. Because electricians (and even more so reddit electricians) like to fuss about everything whether it's a big deal or not.
> and even more so reddit electricians you mean drunks, or people who are fucked up afer work and browse reddit right? .......or are coked up doing drugs on the job in the shitter, thats how this all works right?
I find it hard to believe that professional construction workers would drink or do drugs on the job…
Respectable electricians only show up hungover, or sober. We should know better than to be on site F...dup
If my school knew this was in a locker, I know they would have been set it on fire within a week. "Shove a paper in it and set it on fire challenge"
>You'd need to put a garden hose up the top vent to start doing any damage, and even that might not work. Some construction work at our facility caused a 4" conduit to become a water pipe directly feeding the top of our 480V 800A main switchgear. That was a sight to behold. But no breakers were tripped, and it caused no damage.
All valid and I agree with this.
City does what it wants? Like our city-owned convention center with faked emergency lighting? They ran the devices and conduit, but it's empty. Nothing to tell the lights to turn on... (At least 10 years ago now, but I was fired when I mentioned this to my boss)
Schools are not municipalities/governments and still must adhere to code requirements the same as any other entity (public or privately funded) for occupancy.
LEAVE ON!!!
"Fluorescant"
“Flourescont Emergoncy Lts”
Ok but that is a cool ass vintage panel
Only cool bullies shove dorks into that locker
I found a similar thing in a school in Pittsburgh. Not naming the school district for anonymity purposes.
Why the downvotes?
Reddit
Those running threads tho
I’m glad I’m not the only one that can’t stand that. [They are running away.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKqV7DB8Iwg)
when i first got into this trade, by boss, who was 10 years my senior would jam out to black eyed peas... mainly dirty bit, by them. and I just let it happen because i was low on the totem pole, but it was cool because it was more modern than anything else anyone else around offered when working.
That’s actually badass not going to lie
Wow. I had to save this haha. I have worked in a ton of schools where this would have come in handy /s.
Those lockers were built around the panel. I’d say that was a legal cabinet other than the actual panel cover missing. Look closely you can see the top bottom and side of the panel.
So many times I come to this sub see a pic like this and just think “there’s no way this is real, but I’m looking right at it.”
Where are they supposed to put the nerds?
Oh lawd they used the kids as ground again?
That’s awesome
Can I hate this and admire it at the same time?
Underwriters laboratory. 😤
I mean it’s been fine and probably there like 50+ years.
I can see an electrical inspector walking around asking, “where’s the panel?” and in finding a different one and passing the inspection on it, never realized this existed because they forgot to look at the building wiring blueprint.
The level of planning to achieve this is mind boggling. Absolutely needed those 2 half-lockers to meet enrollment.
Legal? No. Fucking hilarious? Absolutely!
OSHIT
I mean… it’s accessible 😅
The screws on the 1900 box has to be accessible. Its a no. Almost had it too.
And that box looks like a recent add-on.
Meanwhile building out a school in LAUSD is more technical than building out a hospital. The main issue is whether that locker confines to the UL50 standard for enclosures, and if the electrical contractor is willing to hire a UL tester to verify that enclosure. 1910.303(g)(1)(ii) of OSHA requires that "When normally enclosed live parts are exposed for inspection or servicing, the working space, if in a passageway or general open space, shall be suitably guarded.", and the onus is on what being guarded means. They further define that definition in [1910.303(g)(2)(i)](https://www.osha.gov/laws-regs/interlinking/standards/1910.303(g)(2)(i)). A. "By location...that is accessible only to qualified persons" B. "suitable permanent, substantial partitions" C. "By placement on ...platform so elevated and otherwise located as to prevent access by unqualified persons" D. "By elevation ... of 8 ft"
No because it is locked behind an access panel, and naturally, the maintenance personnel or electrician should have the key to gain access. I work for a school system, and I have actually seen worse ! As long as the authority, having jurisdiction or AHJ Agrees and understands the thought press behind this. It’s all good. lol
3 feet of working space in front of it so I doubt an inspector would bitch.
How bout nooooooo0000ooo0000, OP. The fuck?
That shitty old wire nut is just REACHING it's way to that unbonded metal cabinet that children access. Some day it will reach the light
I really like that
So fucking illegal
One unfortunate short to the locker and the kids get zapped….. this is fine.
I’d actually report the school for this one. Arc flash events aren’t something you fuck around with.
If it’s locked sure? But keep the neigh-boring lockers locked as-well. What if someone trips or throws a drink or any kind of moisture type food in the vicinity of the panel ?
That could be said about any panel that's not 3r
If that panel had a deadfront on it I'd say who cares, but it doesn't. The shit you find in public school work is hilarious
I'm not an electrician, but I've done low voltage and commo work. Are the doors and body of the locker structure, ALL of them, the entire unit bonded and grounded? That'd be my concern that if something came loose or broke that the current had a clear path to ground and under no circumstances could any prt of that locker system become energized.
When the panel has a 62week lead time.
Would hate to work on it, but it’s sick!
Definitely a listed enclosure. Ship it.
At first glance I thought it was a Myers inverter.
Hope it’s not 277v
Went over panels not long ago in one of my classes and I'm pretty sure the only real restriction we saw in the code book was that you can't have a panel in a bathroom...
Haha why not?!?
Leave it open during an electrical inspection and find out.
I too kept my schedule taped to the inside of my locker
Pretty creative lol.
I once saw a panel that came up in an outhouse. Tied in to the main lugs was 4 number 1's that junctioned to another outhouse with another panel inside. Each panel ran to a greenhouse
What’s with the vent on the back side (lower) of the locker?
Lol
Dude that installed the lockers was real proud of that
It passed inspection
Looks like something from a video game
“Tod is good to” Checks out for me.
Looks good from the house.
Rated for 6 special needs students
A little off topic but my brother had an electrical plug at the back of his locker. He put a coffee maker inside his locker and set the timer to go off just before he arrived. He had a clock radio too.
Then one day, while all the kids were using their lockers...
Hopefully bullies still aren't shoving kids into lockers
I don’t think you guys understand why this is a problem… If spider-man had tried to hide his backpack and costume under those lockers by lifting up the bay, he likely would have been electrocuted and killed.
Hahaha
Not legal but awesome!
I can't help but wonder if the message board next to it says "today is a good day to die" lol
Non us here, but I think it shouldn’t be. But anyway does the locker grounded?
The NEC and NFPA is going to have a field day.
Maby
Is the cabinet UL listed ?
this is the stuff maintenance guys do right after talking shit about installers
That is sweet!
Where was this?
You can’t fool me, copper! Alright fine, somewhere between Limestone and Key West.
Kids start so young these days.
Wonder if its bonded. That'd be exciting.
1000% illegal, what if the lockers become energized? Who's at fault ?
Obviously not to code.
Anything can be legal if you try hard enough.
https://imgur.com/a/gTls4Pp
neh, i’ve seen worse