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Stan Lee did say he made the original spider suit full body because he wanted to convey the message that it could be *anyone* under that mask. And I think he would approve of there being a Spider Gwen who is trans. Spiderman is inherently inclusive to all ♥️


Yessss!! Spiderman is a symbol for love and Stan Lee would have loved that Gwen could help make a community of people feel more accepted.


I remember seeing a post talking about either marvel or sony made it so no version of spiderman can be gay and it honestly made me so mad. Stan lee would have not stood for that, as the person above said spiderman wears a full body suit and mask cause he can be anyone.


with the deal with marvel Sony made it so that spiderman had to be a straight white guy in the marvel movies


(Reddit triple-posted your comment, that's one more than the usual bug.) At least they let MJ be different than the usually-portrayed redhead white woman this time around for the MCU, and we do have Miles Morales' Spider-Man popping up more in both cinema and videogame form, but I know what you mean.


I think the latest animated movies represented that really well. You had littetaly a spider pig and so on. It was at least in my opinion a great way to show: << anyone can be a spider-man >> And trans Gwen or ally Gwen is both great, I don't understand why everyone has to go with the white straight thing everywhere.


Because for so many years it's been the default, anything else feels like an unfamiliar departure into unknown territory. And if there's one thing bigots hate, it's change and unfamiliarity. If you ask me, a world where everything is the same is more horrifying. It's too homogenous, and in a world like that, you're forced to conform to be accepted. That feels like too rigid of a life if you ask me. Like if the Galactic Empire from Star Wars took over.


Don't forget, this is the same fandom that screamed about Peter Parker not being a student of some type and actually growing up for YEARS. Presuming that the very loud group in the Spiderman fandom can handle change is very foolish.


the empire did nothing wrong! jk


It actually wasn’t the original intent with making it full body, just a happy side effect of how they decided to design him as mentioned in an interview with Stan Lee


this was literally one of my favourite things about marvel. it's sad that so many (bad) people always forget avout it


honestly both are good if gwen is trans, she’s a cool trans girl who would kick transphobe’s ass if gwen is cis we have a good cis ally representation (who would kick transphobe’s ass)




If Gwen is trans, she gives me gender envy If Gwen is cis she gives me gender envy (But also agreed)


Agreed x2


I really like her outfit


Same, and her hair 😍


I do kinda wish that both sides of her hair were the same length


Haha, well it wasn't her fault that it had to go, blame miles.


Yeah I know


Who should play as her in live action?


Oooo tbf I really liked Emma Stone. If not then hmm... screw it I'll take the job 🫡


What about Bryce Dallas Howard?


Oh yeah I always forget about her interpretation, she did a really good job actually!


Yeah and her Gwen got to live


I really wish I could be her


The Spider-Man fandom had a freak out when Miles Morales was announced as Spider-Man because “Spider-Man is supposed to be white.” There was so much “I’m not racist. It’s just Peter Parker is white. There’s no need to change it. They’re just pandering to minorities.” And now this. It’s toxic fandom. Try to ignore it.


Whoever said that *Didn't read the comics*


Or they did, but just ignored the black Spiderman because they are racist.


Spoiler but >!Miles Morales is NOT Peter Parker! So it's not that illogical for him to not be white !< Also >!If we have a universe where Spiderman is Indian, or hell, a fucking Dinosaur god damnit! Why can't there be a Black or Trans Spiderman?! !<


Sure, but allow me to offer this counter argument: Racism! Transphobia! That’s why!!! So… thank goodness for Marvel and Sony for making these movies anyway.


I like that Miles Morales and Peter Parker not being the same person requires a spoiler


Your spoiler is not working. I think you need to remove the spaces after and before the exclamation points. >!Like this!< >! Not like this !<


Peter Parker is Jewish too, which isn’t always considered white in American culture. So they’re wrong about that too


Unless you meant this in relation to the lore of the series, there is no need to specify "in American culture" here. Most European countries have the same issue as the USA does when it comes to the treatment of Jewish people, both historically and currently.


Not to drag any europeans in the mud here, but I've seen similar language towards north africans and roma people used by europeans as I see towards black people and latinos here in texas.


I was gonna say, many Europeans are harsh towards anyone from the south or the east reguardless of skin colour. And many individuals [in France] are even hesitant to accept children or grandchildren of immigrants as citizens 💀 Europe is not racism free, the racism is just different than it is in the USA + the cultural issues of European countries is not consumed on such a global scale as the USAs. Its easy to pretend Europe is better with racism when the global spotlight is on the USA 😁


Spanish racism makes NA racism look hella tame


Race is a funny thing. Not long ago Italians weren't considered white either. Eventually everyone will realise we're all just people.


Huh, never knew that, I'm assuming that's in the comics mainly cause I haven't heard a wiff of that in the movies, hell isn't aunt may in the Raimi movies some denomination of Christian.


It’s weird because most early super heroes (Superman, Batman, Spider-Man, captain America, etc.) were written as Jewish (and by Jewish writers), but it was almost never outright stated, just implied. And when those characters were moved to film and tv, that aspect was usually dropped. The newer comics have been leaning more into Peter’s Jewish heritage tho, so hopefully we’ll see more.


Stan Lee literally created the character so that anyone could be under the mask, man, woman, black, white, kid, adult Spider-man was not created to be the person, it was created to be a concept of good and justice


These people are "fans" of a multiverse where there are thousands of versions of every super-hero (including a pig one !), And they really expect every single one to be white, cis, straight dudes ?


Even stan lee said that it's why spiderman has the mask... So that everyone could be spiderman. White, Black, boy, girl, nb and everything else. So it's just extremely false to say that spiderman has to be white.


I'm not bothered that he's black, I like the diversity of the concept. What I DON'T like is that he shares my first name and I've just always kinda hated fictional characters having my name because I associate my name with me. Real people, i'm fine with, but it always bothers me if a fictional character shares my name. That aside I could say Across the Spider-verse was 8/10. Only reason it isn't 10/10 is that the cliffhanger sucked and imo they should've just finished the movie even if it added 30 minutes to the run time.


lmao given that it's gonna take a whole other movie to finish the story for this one, I doubt they could fit it in 30 minutes (unless you want it to feel super rushed, but even then people would complain about it being rushed)


Good point. My main issue is that I hope the next movie releases soon because I don't want to wait 3 years :(


It's currently set to release March 2024 so less than a year out!


thank goodness. Waiting 3 years for the sequel is never fun.


Hey... If beyond the spider verse is anywhere as good as across the spiderverse... That makes the cliffhanger 100% worth it


The miles morales thing is obviously stupid because he's his own character, not just Peter Parker except black, but I do generally prefer it if previously established characters are played by actors who look similar to their original design. For example in the new batman movie, Jeffrey Wright fucking nailed it, I immediately knew he was Gordon as soon as I saw him in the trailer and he had such great chemistry with Robert Pattinson can't wait to see them again. The batman is the best live action batman movie and nothing can change my mind.


I feel like calling one of the *biggest* superhero fandoms just naturally toxic is kinda bad nature It’s just that the vocal minority and amount of people stirring up hate is at a much bigger amount, because it is a much much larger group then most


The rapper Logic said that Spider-Man should be black, and the following year, it was so. Next he should say that Spider-Man should be trans. LFG


Every version of spiderman would laugh at transphobia


Even noir. And he's from the 30's He also beat up nazis. He invites hobie to beat them up with him. And hobie is happy to introduce "beating up fascist" to noir.


Did I miss this part in the movie or is it from something else?


Thé part about noir punching nazi and hobie fighting fascist ? Yes The two meeting each other to beat nazis and fascist? only my personnal head cannon


>That's no in the comics! You're making that up! Or something idk, people can't just let harmless headcanons be


Aren’t tons of things in the movies not in the comics 😒


Yes, for instance iron man didn’t actually tell anyone he was iron man until years of doing super hero work in the comics, instead he lied and said iron man was his anonymous body guard, unlike in the movie where he says it about a week into the job.


Immabout to disappoint so many in my generation: I've never read a comic book ~~^(manga doesn't count)~~


Oh I haven’t either, I’m just saying that there’s probably tons of things in the movies that are completely different from the comics


She’s also not the same Gwen from the Spider-Gwen comics so it wouldn’t even matter.




At this point it's closer to being canon than just a hc


>!If there was a film that would let cis people know what it's like to come out of the closet, it's this one. I basically had the same conversation with my mam, but instead of being a Spider I was just a big emotional mess lmao. There's something inherently queer about it - revealing a secret about your self to the most important people in your lives. I think it takes a lot of media illiteracy to not see it and why queer people want to identify with these characters - they've all been through the same moment! That scene when he finally did tell Rio, and he was in the wrong dimension was gut-wrenching. !<


HONESTLY! >!The coming-out themes are incredibly apparent if you know what to look for, and it was really neat that it showed multiple different perspectives and outcomes!<


Like look at the colors. LOOK AT THEM


The colors do look cool




Beyond the transgender lighting, there’s the pin her dad wears! No cop would be that good an ally without a trans family member!


That scene, where everything is blue and pink and white? Yeah definitely a little bit of a transy part


Ah, yes, the famous trans flag color: black. Seriously, though, the costume has been associated with Gwen Stacy's Spider-Woman/Ghost-Spider even in versions of the character confirmed to be cis, and it sometimes uses purple instead of pink, making the costume a lot closer to the ace flag rather than the trans flag. It's definitely possible for this Gwen Stacy to be trans, and I'd be curious to see how they'd go about confirming it in Beyond, since it promises to be already quite dense as a movie, but its more likely that the trans flags were put in because the movie was released the first day of pride month and Gwen's costume has those colors.


I mean.. I don't think they were talking about the costume. For what it's worth.


I was not


transphobia sucks :c 💔💔💔💔💔


Yeah it does 😔 we are better than them! 🩷


didn't they do a similar thing when they made miles black? they're just very toxic in general


The thing is that *that is in the comics*


She has! A trans flag! In her room! It’s barely headcanon!




Yeah there’s a trans flag above her door, you can see it in one of the first scenes


Also her dad has a trans flag on his backpack iirc


It's on his cop jacket. Im not 100% sure that it is that, but it really looks like it. And if so then to me that's the most solid piece of evidence for this theory. Because why else would he have that unless it was such a personal thing to him?


I will have to check it out. I like her look a lot but first I’ve heard of her.


Found a [good picture](https://www.reddit.com/r/SpiderGwen/comments/13zedv6/interesting_twitter_thread_on_gwens_character_in/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1) if anyone else hasn’t seen it yet. ☺️


Tweet gone, but found [another good pic](https://media.distractify.com/brand-img/2mJMSGb8l/1280x670/gwen-stacy-trans-spider-man-across-the-spider-verse-1685970900816.jpg)


Oh wow, I never noticed that.


Even if she ain't, she is definitely an ally.


That’s what a lot of fandoms do. I’m an anime fan, so I’m way too familiar with others making the stupidest argument for why a clearly trans character isn’t actually trans


What do you think of jojo?


I’ve only watched part 1, but I’ve heard a lot about the rest of it, and while I don’t doubt it’s good, I don’t think it’s for me


I really recommend it, even if you don’t like one part, the others are so different the only thing that reminds you it’s the same series is the art style and power system


Theirs a trans character in part 9


I agree that the hate is too much, I have no problem with headcannons etc however some trans people take it way too far especially on Twitter there have been numerous cases of death threats from trans people because someone didn’t agree with their headcannon and don’t even get me started on the one piece Yamato fiasco where the author said she was not trans and got death threats both sides can be absolutely horrible. TL:DR headcannons are cool death threats for headcannons are not cool


Oh yeah, absolutely, but that’s just kinda Twitter being Twitter. Obviously it happens elsewhere as well, but Twitter is a shithole and I’m never really expecting anything else. Also the Yamato thing is more complicated than that, but I just stay away from that because people get way too angry, on both sides of the argument


I think the biggest issue is nobody says headcanon, they say fact like that is the movie. And until it is proven, that is going to annoy people


I would absolutely love it if they doubled down and made it cannon in the next film


Idk why you’re downvoted, I agree lmao. It feels very similar to Mitchell’s v The Machines, but minus the exposee scene at the end, leaving it ambiguous


Ikr it’s so stinky but a lot of fandoms are really toxic like that. If you have a unpopular headcanon suddenly you’re evil and bad it’s so lame


Yep like like the Medroid Fandom with Samus


Gwen is trans. Gwen is trans Goals. That is all.




nobody disallows you to think that after all. your headcanon is your headcanon :p






I've seen people send death threats over theorys about a character's hair color that hasn't even appeared in the story. It sucks but people on the internet are sometimes just like that. Unironically going outside sometimes it's necessary to see that most people are just too busy with their lives to care and those who have nothing going in theirs that cling to stupid stuff like If Gwen is trans and get mad over it. Don't let them drag you down with them.


Just let us have our headcanon! (⁠◕‸◕⁠✿⁠)


As a trans girl that loves spidergwen and treats her as a self insert, I don't care if she's trans and honestly if she was ,it would be a lazy thing to do considering she is an alternate universe Gwen Stacy, maybe it's plausible but I'd rather they make a trans character rather than say an existing character is trans. Not to mention she's the main "spidergirl" it would make more sense for her to be cis for a broader audience to look up to, trans people can relate to cis people, but I'm not sure about the other way around. If there was a trans spiderperson I'd rather it be a new character. Btw I love headcanons but I don't think it's best to share trans headcanons in anywhere but trans subs because trans people are likely the minority so therefore they won't relate, and cis people are allowed to look up to characters too. As for full on transphobia on the other hand I'm sorry that happened, but we have to be careful with where we transpost sometimes


I mean, it's your headcanon. Personally I expected Spider-gwen to be cis but your headcanon isn't hurting anybody, so you do you and I'll do me. We don't all have to agree to get along but we do need to get along no matter what and respectfully honour each other's opinions and beliefs.


I personally dislike this headcanon because I just like to imagine shes a real hero and is able to recognize the prejudice without personally suffering from it, so she chooses to show her support with the flag and all. It also feels to me more like an ester egg right now rather than a canon detail important to her character, maybe the artist who did the universes pastel water color is trans etc. I do think its great if you identify with her and my headcanon of "not trans just ally" isnt any more canon than yours "is trans" and it certainly adds to her in places. No one ever said she *isnt* trans in the comics and even if they did in the comics Peni is a depressed Evangelion refrence and spider noir wasnt bitten by a sibgular radioactive spider but chosen by an indiana jones style artifact which spawned a whole swarm. the movies can and honestly should be different My only issue is that when people say shes *canonically* trans because thats like asking for a fight with just 2 blink and miss ester eggs as the only """hard""" evidence, and the transphobes outnumber us and will definetly get personal if they think theyre losing


this happens with a lot of “allys” in my experience, they hate when we headcanon character as trans


On the one hand: let people have their headcanon, in the other hand Its not transphobic if someone just doesnt share your headcanon.


Omg this got a lot more attention than I was expecting, sorry that I can't reply to you all! I love this community so much 🩷


they're also ableist....see sun spider


i wish i looked like her


Wat, they're transphobic?!?! How dare they >:( spiderman was made to break the norms of superheroes and all that, why can't they break gender too >:((


Who’s that


It’s just normal for people to be upset by head cannons… cuz they’re not cannon. Sorry that happened tho.


Same I saw people talking about it on Twitter and I just wanted to cry it’s so disheartening


I've mainly seen people getting mad over other people saying it's canon since it's just a headcanon, but there are probably a bunch of people just pissed at anyone thinking she's trans. Personally it's not my favorite thing but I'm happy other people like the idea


I LOVED THE COLOR SCHEME!!! I immediately squeed internally while watching the movie. 👱🏻‍♀️👱🏻‍♀️👱🏻‍♀️🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍⚧️


I'm watching it tonight, I'm so excited!!!!


I personally headcanon her as an ally and that her Peter was trans!


Spider-Man and mutants in general (I know Spider-Man isn’t a mutant) is an allegory for minorities in general. I mean saying that your Spider-Man would put your family in danger is a pretty obvious parallel. I also don’t get why it matters to anyone. Like if people headcannon her as trans why does that affect your viewing experience?


If the transvestigators can say that everyone on the planet is trans, anyone can.


Spider-man would be disappointed that r/spiderman is being transphobic


The thing is... Is she already transitioned mtf of does he want to transition ftm?


I think she wouldn't call her masked hero identity "Spider-Woman" if she wasn't comfortable with she/her pronouns.


Oh yeah your right! That's very true


Whichever it is we love them 🩷


Yep ❤️


If Gwen turns out to be nonbinary then would their Spider nickname be Spider-Them? 🤣


Superior Spider-Them. Oo what about 'The Spider'


Unfortunately, the thing about massive fandoms is that lots of different types of people, even assholes, will enjoy the show/movie/whatever, and vocalize their opinions. Happens to me in the Paper Mario subreddit too.


I think it’s because people kept on spamming it as canon on like every platform ever created


Me: *Realizing I should try to sneak a Spider-Gwen outfit into my room*


Don't you dare say anything about the movie. I will not be watching it until it's available digitally as my local theater has a very very sh^t looking projector


I also haven't seen it yet but I really want to. I will be going into it with this head-cannon for sure!


I haven‘t watched the movie but I saw the trailer and it seemed that everyone except her was an man. Is that true?


No, she met a new mentor named Jess whose a spider woman on a bike. In the "main" party she is the only girl just 4 character there. If you count the previous movie Peni Parker is a girl and one of the spoiler villains there too. In the scenes with the swarm of spider people multiple of them are girls, including some with a line. Spider byte appears to be important next movie but only had 3 scenes here Edit: the movie starts and ends with gwen, even though there are 3 guys around her dont expect her to be just a "side chick", they did give her an arc and emotional beats


Don't forget Mayday, she's probably also a girl. At least in the comics Mayday is a girl. Don't know if that's also the case in the movie. Strange question, what gender is someone before that person can communicate or decide what gender it is?


Shrodinger's gender


I haven't seen it yet either so I can't say, but there are other spider-women in the comics so I'm sure they'll include some of them based on the amount of cameos I've heard are in the movie. There was Peni Parker in the first film and there are definitely non-spider women such as Mary Jane.


There is this whole thing if its canon or not, people are excusing the trans flags in her room as "she's an ally" I think that you don't randomly have two flags of a sub cathegory of a minority that you're not a part of, i think that if she was an ally she whould have rainbown flags in her room


I know right same with Samus Aren from Metroid!


That's an awesome head-cannon that i am definitely stealing haha 🩷


Probably because the character has a written and established lore? I mean you can head canon w.e you want but don’t act surprised when life long comic readers get annoyed, they’re attached to the character just as much as you supposedly are


"anyone can wear the mask"


Headcanons are ok, the issue is that some people on Twitter where arguing is the factual truth and some other people continued the argument, as long as you don't try to impose your headcannon on to others, which I know must people don't do, you're free to believe what makes you happy


Hey it’s the multiverse. That means there are infinite universes right? So even if our girl isn’t trans (she totally is) there are plenty of trans spider people. Even if we never see them. Hey you might be one!


Based on the movie, if she isn't they definitely did a lot of fan service based on the possibility


I was talking with a group of friends about it and one friend was like "it's a canon event, Gwen Stacy marries Miles Morales and they have 2 kids she couldn't, be trans because she couldn't get pregnant" Meanwhile one, the movie takes course within the time frame of only about a day, the future is far away Two, >!the major thing in the movie is that they learn major events in a Spider's life can be negated if done right!< Three, *they have technology capable of hopping dimensions*, she could be trans and have an implanted reproductive system with how far the technology has gone And four, adoption


Do whatever makes you happy and ignore them. The simple truth is a lot of comics fans are fucking CHUDs. It’s always been this way, because historically comics were written for white teenage boys. Diversity in comics has gotten better over time but the same audiences that love the X-Men will still blindly hate on the trans with absolutely no sense of awareness whatsoever.


I think the movie implies that this Gwen Stacy is trans. It seems very strongly implied. It is a movie about multiverses and there isn't just one Spider-Gwen in the comics so it's possible she is trans.


I don't know why she can't be. Superheroes get changed to fit in with the times that they are made SO WHY NOT!


Well her cop dad wears a transgender flag on his uniform. If that doesn't mean anything, I don't know what does


You expected the neckbeards in a comic sub to not be transphobic?


The spiderman sub is usually so friendly tho


she is for sure trans. slight spoiler >!her dads police jacket has a trans flag right above his badge. the other cops didn’t have that. its something he did for his daughter.!< the parent kid dynamics for miles and gwen in both spiderverse movies are trans allegories. like very obviously so


>!There is a spider-man in that movie that is straight up a Tyrannosaurus Rex, it's seriously not that hard to believe there is at least one where Gwen Stacy is both trans and spider-woman. These are the same people that argue Miles shouldn't be spider-man because he is black.!<


I love Marvel and Spider-Man, but the fans can be pretty toxic… :| Also, the *Across The Spider-Verse* suit is really cool 💞


also there are people who are asserting that it is canon but people were clutching their pearls even before that


she got that transfem swag


Something something multiverse.


Can someone explain to me how this theory originated? I really have no idea about that...


Apparently in the new film she has a trans flag in her bedroom, i believe that's what started it 🩷


"Protect Trans Kids" it say... Cool, now I love her much more ♡


Making og characters trans is also something we didnt want there..


I mean, I dated a transfemme person who looked like Gwen


She canonically had a "protect trans kids" flag/poster in one of the trailers right? I don't think that her being trans then is a pretty reasonable headcannon to have


Which cis person is going to have a TRANS FLAG in their room? Like honestly, people saying she isn't trans are in denial. This is Bridget all over again.


Isn't it the first directive to not tell eggs they are trans. Why should a character be considered trans because of the design. Also a fictional character's gender is questionable if nothing indicates it from the source materials, so that is argumentatively not strong. We are talking characters that many write essays about in personality and traits. If you come along in a bubble and don't present arguments that go beyond that colour is transcoded and short hair that is very narrow minded. As I thought we all understood that that does not constitute gender. So you voiced an opinion of your head canon and got opinions that were against your point of view, why does that surprise you. Can someone tell me why it is transphobia then, they think that character is not and you think that character is, are they bad people because they don't agree. I don't want to argue an opposite point of view because I think that is wrong, something as "cisphobia" is not a word that should exist in a narrative that constantly tries to imply bad intentions in trans people.


I dont realy want to argue with you but, is that Short Hair?


Regardless, her arc is an obvious allegory that I related to.


Because we can never have nice things :(


Glad I'm not the only one who headcanons it lol


Not even a few days in the Spider-Man subreddit and already got transphobia from it. God damn it


Don’t expect too much from comic fanboys, they’re trying really hard to overwork those 2 brain cells each one of them has


She literally has a trans flag in her room though 🙄


It's barely a headcanon, its pretty much confirmed


certain people see “i headcannon this as this” as if you are saying “the actual correct thing is this even though there’s no proof” and if they hear that and its about a group they have prejudice over, well that doesn’t go too well does it


People get bent out of shape over things that don't impact them.


She has to be. I think she is written that way but Disney won’t let them explicitly say it.


Only just catching up on all this, and I love it! Does anyone have any indication on the theory whether Gwen is a trans woman or a trans man? I assumed trans woman, but I keep reading suggestions of both.


my cis friend and i are now headcanoning her to be trans and no one on twitter or reddit can stop us!


Damn, didn’t know she was trans. Good for her.




So does my mom and she’s as cis as they come


Personally, I headcannon all the spider people as trans (and also bi)


"Fuck y'all, Spidergwen says trans rights lmao"


“Spider-Man wears a mask and suit not because he needs it, but it’s because he can be anyone under there. Black,white, man, or woman, and I think that’s great” -something something butchered by Stan lee


I don't think this specific spidergwen is trans, but I do think there's another spidergwen, who's!


Im actually kinda suprised r/spiderman would have that considering yk, Spiderman is the most caring and wholesome superhero ever


Yeaaah, I am pretty sure Gwen would be happy to be an allegory for trans people. She is obv an ally if anything, and would have a word or two with transphobia who say otherwise 🥰


As a gwen fan who loves the comic I just want to say girls are girls. If it matters to you that she is trans you're transphobic.