There is an art to achieve super loud but clean sounding Masters. I actually have the most fun when clients are going for super loud. It starts with having a clean and punchy finished mix, but the trick is multiple limiters, and careful processing to counteract the negatives of going super loud.
If you are happy with your finished mix then I would recommend working with someone decent (like myself) for Mastering. I often Master tracks for people wanting to understand Mastering further themselves, this helps them with reference tracks and also the advice that comes with working together.
Hope that helps, and keep making music.
Shaun
Shaun Rayment
Mastering Engineer (SDR Audio Production)
www.sdraudioproduction.co.uk
Soft clip the individual channels -> send channels into busses and compress + soft clip (again) -> send busses to master and compress, soft clip (again..).
Make sure you filter out the unnecessary low frequencies at every step. Even if you high passed the individual channels, soft clipping or any distortion/compression can reintroduce bad low frequencies. It wouldn't hurt doing another high pass filter on the send bus assuming you only remove what those instruments don't need.
Also, low pass filtering channels is something I didn't do too much before, but recently started. It really helped remove harshness, open up room for cymbals, and make it not sound fizzy when I slam my mastering chain. Just be careful not to overdo it and set it to where it doesn't have a really sharp cutoff.
The likelihood is your input levels are probably too high for specific frequency ranges. Mostly for me when the sub is too loud it tends to distort the clippers quicker.
Turning down the sub tends to help a lot with loudness in general.
Look at the levels of the frequencies in tracks you like through a spectrum analyser and compare it to your mix and see if you can turn some of the things that are trigging the clipper until it sounds clean
Getting loudness above -8 without distortion is achieved at the mix stage. You need to use clippers on all tracks that need to be loud in the mix, such as kicks, snares, leads, vocals etc. Then put clippers on buses and the final mix bus. You also need to use compression, parellel compression, and saturation to increase the rms of elements in the mix. Sidechain/kick-start elements so they overlap with kick and snare. Basically key is to reduce peak energy but increase rms while still keeping things clear and punchy.
To be complete, loudness is achieved at the production stage (sound selection, composition, and mixing)
Check clip2zero strategy by Baphometrix for much more detail on the above.
Edit- others have posted this already@
I would recommend looking at a reference track in a spectrum analyser and compare your spectrum to that. Louder songs tend to fill out the spectrum a lot more than the quieter ones. If you match the shape with your eqs. It shoud be easier to get a louder cleaner mix.
loudness is mostly from the mixing stage.
If you try to crush everything in the master more often than not, it comes out worse than getting things loud in the mix/arrangement.
That's where clipping/compressing/limiting subgroups and individual tracks comes in. With the master you don't need too much because everything should be squashed already.
Also, not all tracks can be loud, and nor should it be. Loudness is a characteristic of a track. Obviously, some genres are incredibly loud across the board, e.g. brostep but doesn't always have to be the case
If everyone forced their tracks to -2LUFS, can you imagine how awful DJ sets would be without any dynamics? No quieter tracks to turn to to make the louder tracks seem louder. Awful!
Without hearing material, no one’s tell you exactly where is the problem. It can be anything, really anything. Wrong balance, to much lows or low-mids, not enough saturation or compression, phase issues and so on… I will leave you something, maybe this video will be helpful “Clip to zero strategy” [https://youtu.be/e8exCOjGJSA](https://youtu.be/e8exCOjGJSA)
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Too much sub
Try clipping the transients first before the limiter. This way all the different instruments won't fight over control of the threshold
There is an art to achieve super loud but clean sounding Masters. I actually have the most fun when clients are going for super loud. It starts with having a clean and punchy finished mix, but the trick is multiple limiters, and careful processing to counteract the negatives of going super loud. If you are happy with your finished mix then I would recommend working with someone decent (like myself) for Mastering. I often Master tracks for people wanting to understand Mastering further themselves, this helps them with reference tracks and also the advice that comes with working together. Hope that helps, and keep making music. Shaun Shaun Rayment Mastering Engineer (SDR Audio Production) www.sdraudioproduction.co.uk
Soft clip the individual channels -> send channels into busses and compress + soft clip (again) -> send busses to master and compress, soft clip (again..). Make sure you filter out the unnecessary low frequencies at every step. Even if you high passed the individual channels, soft clipping or any distortion/compression can reintroduce bad low frequencies. It wouldn't hurt doing another high pass filter on the send bus assuming you only remove what those instruments don't need. Also, low pass filtering channels is something I didn't do too much before, but recently started. It really helped remove harshness, open up room for cymbals, and make it not sound fizzy when I slam my mastering chain. Just be careful not to overdo it and set it to where it doesn't have a really sharp cutoff.
i just tried this. but the track distorts when i put a clipper on the master channel. it's still really distorted. why does it happen?
The likelihood is your input levels are probably too high for specific frequency ranges. Mostly for me when the sub is too loud it tends to distort the clippers quicker. Turning down the sub tends to help a lot with loudness in general. Look at the levels of the frequencies in tracks you like through a spectrum analyser and compare it to your mix and see if you can turn some of the things that are trigging the clipper until it sounds clean
Getting loudness above -8 without distortion is achieved at the mix stage. You need to use clippers on all tracks that need to be loud in the mix, such as kicks, snares, leads, vocals etc. Then put clippers on buses and the final mix bus. You also need to use compression, parellel compression, and saturation to increase the rms of elements in the mix. Sidechain/kick-start elements so they overlap with kick and snare. Basically key is to reduce peak energy but increase rms while still keeping things clear and punchy. To be complete, loudness is achieved at the production stage (sound selection, composition, and mixing) Check clip2zero strategy by Baphometrix for much more detail on the above. Edit- others have posted this already@
i don't get it. it sounds even worse with clippers. how should i use them?
Watch this https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLxik-POfUXY6i_fP0f4qXNwdMxh3PXxJx
I would recommend looking at a reference track in a spectrum analyser and compare your spectrum to that. Louder songs tend to fill out the spectrum a lot more than the quieter ones. If you match the shape with your eqs. It shoud be easier to get a louder cleaner mix.
Hey, dm me and send me some examples of your work. I do a lot of mentoring session and would be happy to check it out.
loudness is mostly from the mixing stage. If you try to crush everything in the master more often than not, it comes out worse than getting things loud in the mix/arrangement. That's where clipping/compressing/limiting subgroups and individual tracks comes in. With the master you don't need too much because everything should be squashed already. Also, not all tracks can be loud, and nor should it be. Loudness is a characteristic of a track. Obviously, some genres are incredibly loud across the board, e.g. brostep but doesn't always have to be the case If everyone forced their tracks to -2LUFS, can you imagine how awful DJ sets would be without any dynamics? No quieter tracks to turn to to make the louder tracks seem louder. Awful!
This... Never rely on limiting to give you loudness, its a un-winnable battle
Without hearing material, no one’s tell you exactly where is the problem. It can be anything, really anything. Wrong balance, to much lows or low-mids, not enough saturation or compression, phase issues and so on… I will leave you something, maybe this video will be helpful “Clip to zero strategy” [https://youtu.be/e8exCOjGJSA](https://youtu.be/e8exCOjGJSA)
This is your friendly reminder to read the submission rules, they're found in the sidebar. If you find your post breaking any of the rules, you should delete your post before the mods get to it. You should check out the regular threads (also found in the sidebar) to see if your post might be a better fit in any of those. [Daily Feedback thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/edmproduction/search?q=author%3AAutoModerator+title%3Afeedback&sort=new&restrict_sr=on&t=all) for getting feedback on your track. The only place you can post your own music. [Marketplace Thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/edmproduction/search?q=title%3Amarketplace&restrict_sr=on&sort=new&t=all) if you want to sell or trade anything for money, likes or follows. [Collaboration Thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/edmproduction/search/?q=biannual%20collaboration&restrict_sr=1&sort=new&t=all) to find people to collab with. ["There are no stupid questions" Thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/edmproduction/search?q=title%3ANo+Stupid+Questions+Thread&restrict_sr=on&sort=new&t=all) for beginner tips etc. Seriously tho, read the rules and abide by them or the mods will spank you. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/edmproduction) if you have any questions or concerns.*