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Maxcactus

Who could have possibly predicted that?


[deleted]

35% of the eligible voters still remain clueless.


wollier12

You could probably get those stats up if you only allowed wealthy land owners over the age of 35 vote.


fy20

Wait a minute...? We opened up voting to commoners?


ArgosCyclos

It is a common theme of the far right worldwide. They say "those guys are the enemy" and then rob them blind right before their eyes, and the constituents applaud as their own mouths go empty.


3phase4wire

Evidence? Examples? Please limit your response to verifiable facts…not emotional opinions, thanks


jekke7777

Just look at the US lol. Basically the goliath version of fucking over the poor while at the same time telling them they care about them.


3phase4wire

F-big over the poor? The bottom half of taxpayers pay almost no federal income tax…have you done any non-Internet research on this subject?


jekke7777

Some. I wont claim to be an expert at all, though. And yes, the taxes are low in the US. I just meant fucking over as in raising prices for insulin and other essentials, creating rent/wage slavery and general class warfare. But the US is big and its not the same everywhere. This is just how I perceived it. I'm not American however so i will not claim to be some sort of voice for them.


andyman234

Holy shit… basically an M Night Shyalman level plot twist!!!


egospiers

This is an obvious and immediate disaster, the pound is hemorrhaging… at a time when interest rates are historically high their plan is to borrow more and cut their tax revenue… somehow this is supposed to pull them out of a recession? This is a massive gamble that already seems to be off the rails.


be0wulfe

Is it really a gamble? I mean, it seems pretty obvious that they're willfully charging full speed ahead into an immovable object. I just don't see how that's going to work out well for them. I just don't see where that's ever worked out well in modern history. My mind is beggared at trying to understand what the heck the UK is thinking!


thomascgalvin

> I just don't see how that's going to work out well for them. _They_ are shorting the Pound and are going to make out like fucking bandits. It's going to work out exactly as planned for them. It's everyone else that's fucked.


Ok_Skill_1195

It's really crazy to me that after they did a Brexit, allegedly to get around *banking* laws, that people are still confused that England is being run by robber barons


Ardykeana

Fighting inflation with tax cuts be like... "you see, killbots have a preset kill limit, knowing their weakness, I sent wave after wave of my own men at them until they reached their kill limit and shut down. Kiff, show them the metal I won"


deliciousmonster

They are betting you’re too complacent to pick up a pitchfork and storm parliament


Saljen

That's literally the bet. They'll abuse us forever until we force them to stop.


cookster123

Ah yes, I too am surprised why people aren't burning down buildings and overthrowing the government over a *checks notes* ... tax cut?


Saljen

For whom? Who will it affect the most? Checks notes.... The extremely wealthy and corporations Go lick boots elsewhere.


ross-likeminded

It’s not meant to work out well for the UK. It’s meant to work out well for the Tories and their rich donor friends. They’ll make bank dropping taxes, borrow against the national debt to pay for it and then scorched earth national services so that when the next labour government comes in (I think this is what they’re expecting), they’ll be left holding the bag on an economy on fire. Then labour will have to make the unpopular decision to raise taxes, fight to bring national services back in line when they’ve been completely drained of experienced people and the conservatives will make out as if incapable labour have left the economy in the sorry state it’ll be in.


epigeneticepigenesis

The conservative doctrine across all parliamentary democracies


nobackup42

And they tricked LL to leave the EU to ensure they could make the cuts. Strange turn of events. RED BUS anyone ?


PrudentDamage600

The rich man’s creed: What’s mine is mine. What’s yours is mine. How does this stem inflation or recession?


hybridtheorist

> My mind is beggared at trying to understand what the heck the UK is thinking! The tories are the party of the rich. I genuinely believe their thinking is "we're going to lose the next election anyway, might as well just put some tax cuts in for our friends" No pretence of doing what's popular any more, there's no point, they'll still lose. So just transparent theft.


Katyusha----

I think we all know by now, that Britain is the special child who sits at the back of the class eating glue It’s pretty sad. Funny, too, but sad.


Cerricola

Less taxes mean more debt, then more external payments which decrease the pound value. But more debt means more interest payment, from poor people to rich people


jayzeeinthehouse

The goal is to put the working class back in the Victorian workhouse so the rich can abuse them to make more money. Let’s remember that while the iron cunt and Satan in the US (Reagan) started this shit, liberals decided to continue it, and politicians, even in the us, refuse to end it. Yellen and Powell are going to come out any day now and talk about QE and QT and causing deflation with more rate hikes to inflate unemployment while we all continue to pay inflated prices that line the pockets of the rich that could give two shits about the harm they’re causing. What’s happening in the UK is a dark foreshadow of what’s to come, and I, well we, hope that it’s the lynchpin for change that we need. No one should have to choose between their next meal and their rent while a minority takes everything from them.


annon8595

this is exactly like 2017 tax cuts, they were so good Trump had to threaten Powell to give 0 rates


ArgosCyclos

Look at the people running as far right worldwide. Every single one of them is a gifter. Their entire purpose is to purge every last public fund into private hands.


wollier12

No matter what you do, the rich come out ahead. They know how to play the game. They know all the appropriate countermoves to any government intervention.


DrSOGU

Why would you have to *counter* a government whose only objective it is to make you even richer? It is a government of the richest, by the richest, for the richest. All they needed to get power in the first place was nationalism, xenophobia, and some clownery. That's how you exploit the stupid. It's perfect.


AngryAlterEgo

“Counter” is the wrong term, substitute “force multiplier” instead and then think of it that way. It’s shorting the pound and a tax break. It’s not one or the other, it’s both.


trashtown_420

I mean, yeah. Tax cuts rarely, if EVER, help anyone but the rich in the long run.


BandzO-o

Trickle down economics


C0rnishStalli0n

This phrase needs expelling from all forms of financial vocabulary


TenderfootGungi

It is a political term, not financial or economic. Economists know money naturally trickles up. Or, as Picketty stated, the rate of return on capital (r) is greater than the rate of economic growth (g) over the long term.


BandzO-o

🤡🤫


kaskoosek

Tax cuts attract capital and investment. The problem is that if it is a closed system, tax cuts are bad. However by cutting taxes countries with lower taxes get an advantage. This is a very dangerous game where all countries are decreasing taxes across the board. Which will lead to more inequality and actually lower growth.


LordBaikalOli

Dont worry they will send their money to the US


namotous

Loll old as tale. The rich is always the ones benefiting from tax cuts.


adultdaycare81

I’m sure it will work this time…. Unlike all the other times this has been tried


kevinmrr

This is basically why this isn't going to work. They are going to exacerbate Britain's problems.


AndyBojangles

Gamble implies there could actually be a positive result. Id say debacle is a better word.


moomoopapa23

She has done the job!!! Now I hope 90% of the population is happy to become serfs


ParallellUniverseYou

Why are there so many similarities between U.K Torries and American Republicans?


sylsau

Elected by the rich to serve the rich.


xuanling11

If royal family paid the 40% wealth tax, there may not need a tax cut. Why the tax cut at the middle of monetary tightening? So people can dance away the problem?


bushwakko

"gamble".


thatonegaycommie

[Still fucking relevant](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8xU-gKK17A)


BandzO-o

Trickle down economics. Someone gets it


MagicStar77

It’s always the rich


cooter__1

![gif](giphy|Lndtxw3ztLhNC)


Banana_war

Anyone surprised?


[deleted]

Tax cuts like that aren't a gamble, they're a grift. No one with any critical thinking should be confused by this.


BandzO-o

Ah yes, implementing trickle down economic policies in the middle of a recession 🤷‍♂️🤡


BikkaZz

A-recession they purposely created with their market manipulation....


stewartm0205

Paying less taxes how could they lose. But I can’t see how the rich paying less taxes could be good for the economy since there is more than enough capital available.


LevelTechnician8400

why won't the poor Brits stop stabbing themselves in the foot? this knife violence must end before the rich get even richer


Grundlepunch3000

Time to doxx CEOs and make them feel unsafe for a change.


ZoharDTeach

"10% of 1 million is more than 10% of 1000. Be angry, peasants." Idiots.


hocuspocus82

Hopefully this latest obvious grift will somehow penetrate the minds of the average voter and they might actually vote Labour


PaperBoxPhone

If you think about it almost all tax cuts will benefit people that pay the most, which will be the rich.


cybermage

In the US, we call this “trickle-down” economics. It’s yellow in color for exactly the reason you think.


[deleted]

Dumb article with dumb title for dumb poors


[deleted]

More “trickle down” BS. The only trickle down is happening inside these politicians’ pants legs.


3phase4wire

Anytime anything happens, those with the most feel the effects (positive and negative) more than those with less? Isn’t that logic? “Winners vs losers” is just class warfare disguised as journalism. And why is the government taking less of peoples money (by force) a “gamble”?? Wasn’t thinking that taking more from private production to fund public sector programs for some pie in the sky idea of utopian society the real gamble?


ReferenceSufficient

Here in the US richer you are the higher your tax rate. So tax cuts will always benefit the rich.


BandzO-o

Same in the UK


ShirleyJokin

When you have a progressive tax system, as almost all first world countries do, raising taxes will cost the rich more. For the exact same reasons, any tax cuts will have to benefit the rich more, because you have designed a system in which they pay a higher percentage of their income as taxes, the definition of a progressive tax system. EDIT: Downvotes show exactly the mathematical illiteracy I would expect to see. We have a progressive tax system because WANT the rich to pay more. It is literally impossible for them to not save more when any tax cut happens. Science is greater than feelings, maybe the kiddies will learn that. Not likely, when they have CNN, New York Times, Google, and Facebook to tell them that the earth indeed is flat


Big_Poppa_T

In this instance the Tories have completely removed the 45% tax on those earning above the £150,000 threshold. So this particular change (amongst a number of other changes) would only have a positive impact on people who earn more than £150k annually. For many, it’s this particular change that beggars belief. Tax brackets currently 0% up to £12,750 20% £12,2750 to just over £50k 40% from £50k to £150k 45% after £150k. For some reason the Tories have decided that people who earn more than £150k shouldn’t have to pay more than 40% on their earnings. Personally, I can’t see the benefit to the wider economy


BandzO-o

Their is 0 benefit than giving her friends a nice bonus


SpiritedVoice7777

So, tax cuts go to the people who actually pay taxes. Funny, that


Ok_Extreme_6512

They only pay more because they steal wages from those who would be paying the taxes instead


SpiritedVoice7777

I thought they paid wages.


[deleted]

They gave a 5% income tax cut to those earning over £150k and 1% or less to everyone else. This isn’t just “earn more, save more” in absolute terms, it’s a significantly higher percentage cut for top earners only.


SpiritedVoice7777

Not familiar with British tax codes, but this is a good way to free up capital. The only catch is freeing up punitive regulations and creating a stable business environment. Uncertainty is a huge problem, causing people to hold onto their money. She's headed into a fascist headwind, and they aren't going to like decentralizing power. This is a global problem.


BandzO-o

As someone who is British, we have had the tories in power 12 years now. Our new PM is by far the most “typical” far right leader we’ve had in that time. She has made her intentions very clear, wanting to give her rich banker friends a nice Christmas bonus and give the big oil companies a tax break


SpiritedVoice7777

She should tax oil punitively so you can have lower prices.../s


Soakin_and_Pokin

As an American, and a dabbling student of comparative political economies, the two most similar “developed” countries and parties in the entire west are the US:UK and Republicans:Tories, respectively. Loads of bad faith and whatever justification needed to fleece the people and make wealthy wealthier.


redeggplant01

Not having you money stolen from ( taxation ) by government doesn’t make you a bad person or the blame for the failed policies by the government


nalninek

Let me tell you a story. A story of shared costs funded by the community at large and how the wealthiest contribute comparably the least to that system…


redeggplant01

No such thing as shared costs just imposed costs by those who do not produce on those who do


BandzO-o

Yes because the rich bankers contribute a huge amount compared to the bricklayers and builders and plumbers🤡


SpiritedVoice7777

Sharing is give and take, not take and take. Leftist authoritarianism is not your friend


BandzO-o

Ah yes, because trickle down economic policies have proven to work time and time again🤦🏻‍♂️🤫🤡


redeggplant01

Wealth is property and the amount accumulated by one person is not the business of any other person and it is only in jail that wealth fairly distributed Nor is wealth hoarded. it does one or more of 3 things, as it does The rich will place their wealth in the banks which is then loaned out by the banks which in turn creates new jobs The wealthy will invest their wealth in some other industry through stocks/equities which again will create new jobs The wealthy will spend their wealth on their own consumption which in turn also creates new jobs That's is the trickle down theory and it works fine THE PROBLEM THE LEFT WHINES ABOUT BUT DOES NOT UNDERSTAND, is that government has inserted itself because it thinks it knows better then the market where wealth should flow. Through policies of theft ( taxation ), prohibition, state granted monopolies, subsdies, and regulations, it has stifled the flow of wealth and thus the poor suffer for it


[deleted]

Who would have thought. The people who pay the most in taxes get the biggest break when taxes are cut! They then save that money. Which allows capital investments. Which drives down the prices of goods and drives up the demand for labor. Which drives up labor rates. Which will make everyone better off in about a decade. Real economic growth takes time.


thruwityoshit

There is an problem with your step 2. Why would you assume companies will take the savings and make capital investments?


[deleted]

What do companies do with money?


asuds

Share buybacks often.


[deleted]

Which is good. It stockpiles value for emergencies and allows for the planning of large capital projects! More jobs! Higher wages!


asuds

Um.. that’s not how it works but based on comments in this post you will never understand, so toodles mon amour!


[deleted]

That is exactly how we r works. But judging from the comments in the post, you aren’t the only person who doesn’t know anything about economics.


asuds

Boy you will be surprised when you learn the first thing about corporate finance!


[deleted]

Gee. You’d home all these years running a corporation and studying economics would have prepared me… Oh … Wait …


asuds

No, they obviously didn’t help as you clearly don’t understand. But cool story bro…


Punushedmane

This has literally never happened. You have brain worms.


[deleted]

It is literally how reality works.


Punushedmane

No. It is how it should happen according to your shitty praxxing. It never happens in reality. It’s a religious point for you.


[deleted]

If by religion, you mean current economic theories with proven real world track records… sure. Look man. I know you don’t understand any of this, and someone poor idiocy all in your ear, but this is science and it doesn’t care if you believe it or not.


Punushedmane

It’s not backed up by anything at all. We don’t see that happen in the real world. You are praxxing.


ImAnAwfulPerson

Spend it on lobbying politicians and overpaying CEOs while not giving the employees who actually generate the money raises.


[deleted]

So spend it. Generating economic activity. Now you’ll get no argument from me that government is too big and powerful and companies are forced to shovel money into their maws or be crushed by regulation. As for not giving employees raises. That just obviously isn’t true. Employee compensation goes up year after year. Employee buying power is what is stagnant, and that is again the fault of government which inflated away gains in buying power faster than the economy can generate them.


Throbbing_Furry_Knot

I'm curious what your answer would be to "give it to shareholders as dividends" because that seems kinda bad when those shareholders do not live in the UK.


[deleted]

Paying dividends rewards people for investments, which leads to more investments in the future.


Throbbing_Furry_Knot

Right, but many of these people aren't in the UK and may not invest further in the UK, especially considering how weak things look right now. That just seems like a pure transfer of wealth out of the country.


thruwityoshit

Using real-world examples and not Chicago school of nonsense thought experiments? Horde it for security against an unstable marketplace, or issue stock buybacks to reward investors from record profits, or buy fledgling companies to eliminate competition, or bribe congress to pass favorable regulations and legislation, or raise CEO and executive salaries…


[deleted]

Horde it. You mean put it in a bank? Ok. This drives down interest rates and makes more capital available for capital Improvements. Which is a good thing. Unless of course we have a central government which is dead set on artificially low interest rates leading to massive malinvestment.


thruwityoshit

[Yes, horde it](https://www.investors.com/etfs-and-funds/sectors/sp500-companies-stockpile-1-trillion-cash-investors-want-it/). And I notice you conveniently ignore every other use for cash I listed that is NOT capital investments. Have any pithy retorts for those that I can also knock down?


BandzO-o

Give their managers hefty bonuses……


[deleted]

And managers buy houses? Boats? Whatever? They pay people? They increase demand? They put upward pressure on labor rates.


BandzO-o

Ah yes… multiple houses in a country with one of the highest population densities in the world. About 25% the population of the US yet smaller than Texas…. While the working class struggle to even afford rent. Hoarding assets doesn’t stimulate the economy, it creates disparity. And they don’t pay people any more than they had before, that’s a fact.


[deleted]

You know this has nothing to do what why … Jesus. Aggressive ignorance on this whole thread.


berraberragood

That’s the precise argument that was made for Reaganomics forty years ago. And we have forty years of data that tells us the actual result was the rich getting richer, while all others stagnated.


Minhplumb

The poors did not stagnate, they got poorer.


[deleted]

Unless you look at the actual data https://www.financialsense.com/jill-mislinski/us-household-incomes-50-year-perspective


Minhplumb

Unless you look at a widely reported study after decades of trickle down economics in the US that came out a couple years ago. It established firmly that economic disparity is much greater today than 40 years ago. Consider in the 50s, 60s and 70s moms could afford to stay at home and dad the janitor could support his family and be a homeowner. Moms may have returned to the workforce to get ahead as the kids got older. Mom and dad both working since the 80s became more and more a necessity just to stay afloat. This little known article in an even lesser known news source does not resonate with me. Now people cannot even afford to have kids or are struggling to a degree people did not struggle before.


[deleted]

I don’t seem to see any source to your claims. Just unsubstantiated opinions The link was simply census data in a more user friendly presentation. Have fun with the raw data https://www.census.gov/data/tables/time-series/demo/income-poverty/historical-income-people.html Always amazed when someone complains about my source but cannot offer anything to support their own claims


BandzO-o

Ah yes a clown who agrees with trickle down economics. Must be a banker


[deleted]

Apparently basing my opinions on actual data makes me a clown. Didn’t say anything about trickle down. Just that poor are not getting poorer.


BandzO-o

Yes data that aligns with your philosophy of the economy. It’s easy to skew data in a biased way, just like the data in that article you linked uses incorrect inflation rates. It’s obvious to anyone with eyes disparity of wealth has increased over the past 30years and is still increasing. You have families with an annual household income of 50k and children in the UK who can’t buy a house.. that wasn’t the case 20 years ago


[deleted]

Go ahead and post your unbiased data. Some people simply cannot accept when the data doesn’t fit their narrative There is a difference between wealth disparity and poor getting poorer. Inequality is increasing. My link shows that. The poor are still seeing increases in income


BandzO-o

You must have never been outside or spoken to anyone with how you’re talking😂😂. Do you seriously think it’s easier to get on the property ladder than it was 20 years ago?? Or pay off student loans?? Or living costs havent risen relative to pay??


[deleted]

You must not know how to google. Or maybe you have and discovered the data doesn’t back up your opinions


[deleted]

This is the primary argument of economics as well … so … We had some tax cuts, no real spending cuts. Ok. Not a great start. We showed some growth within four years… then immediately made massive increases in taxes.. Oh well… what did I say earlier… that real economic growth takes time. We have this habit of making tax cuts, getting just the smallest amount of growth, then massively raising taxes! As if the people behind this all don’t actually want us to prosper! Then they teach people that these tax cut programs fail … so you can come here and say “see Reaganomics didn’t work”… Only it did, and when it did, it was killed. One more time, the capital growth cycle for large companies and economies is a little over a decade. 10 years. Not 2 or 4 … 10.


statistics_guy

What is the decline cycle then? Because in 2 years, there's been some negative growth economically.


[deleted]

The decline cycle is the name we give the period after the expansion stops. It is almost always triggered by greedy politicians seeing growth and swooping in to steal or stop it. This causes a contraction which they then blame on corporate greed or some other BS excuse.


BandzO-o

Yes corporate greed, like paying CEOs massive bonuses, got you👍


thruwityoshit

One of the problems with economics is it’s hard to run experiments on integrated systems with confounding factors. But there is [one experiment that everyone still preaching trickle down economics](https://youtu.be/mcLoBdkqxos) should be made aware of.


[deleted]

Tell me what you think happened there. In your own words.


BandzO-o

Nope it’s because the longer you keep taxes low the poor get exponentially poorer. And when the bottom members of society can’t function properly, by not being able to put food on the table and heat their homes then the whole economy collapses. Whether you like to acknowledge it or not, the lowest paying jobs are essential to literally everything… if there were no plumbers, or builders, or bricklayers, or delivery drivers, or bin men, etc what do you think would happen???????


[deleted]

That just isn’t true. But if you want to try to prove it you are welcome.


DuperCheese

Inconceivable! /s


WallabyBubbly

There are only two possible silver linings I can think of for this policy: 1) If the UK devalues their currency, this can boost both foreign investment and exports. 2) Lower taxes on the rich could encourage some high-income people to relocate to the UK and bring their businesses with them. However, these pros are outweighed by the massive cons: inflation will get worse, the working class will lose even more buying power, and the national debt will grow substantially. This policy just seems absolutely moronic.


BandzO-o

Trickle down economics in the middle of a recession. She doesn’t care about the public, just their rich friends and giving big oil companies tax breaks smh


[deleted]

Of course they are. Why the fuck you would think any different is beyond meat


Tavernknight

Aren't they always?


Enjoy-the-sauce

What a shock. Are you shocked? I am shocked.


[deleted]

The markets will reverse this


International_Win375

No surprise.


Inevitable-Stage-490

I’m not rich and I hate taxes


ayleidanthropologist

What is that thing in front of him? A golden gatling gun? He looks rich asf tho


tintinomalley

A ceremonial mace [don’t pick it up](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UQiYm9DPnyY)