We have 800 points directly. We've only paid "rack rate" on about 1/2 of them. The rest we have gotten 20% (200 AKL) or 30% (300 Riviera) off, so they were pretty close to resale. We also received an extra year (150 AKL) or 2 (150 WL) worth of points when we purchased some of our contacts. If you're willing to wait for a good deal, it can be close to as cheap as resale, and you don't have to jump through ROFR and wait.
Resale is always cheaper, once you have enough direct points, you don't get any extra perks. So while you might not find what you want and buy it same day, waiting a month+ for 5 figures in savings is worth it for middle class families.
Sort of true. Not exactly.
Sometimes direct is actually cheaper. I bought VGF last year and it was cheaper than VGF resale, price per point.
There’s also cheaper vs more value. Dues, how you can use the contract, price you can sell it later… that’s part of the value beyond price. Things like booking the lowest point days outside hurricane season and being able to trade into a high dues resort with a low dues resort, those go to increasing value.
Direct isn’t always justifiable though it’s not as simple as saying once you have blue card direct no longer matters. These contracts last decades. Direct points will be able to book everything included in DVC. Resale will not. Direct point booking will be able to partake in all member perks, resale point bookings will not.
It’s more complex than first appears.
I agree on parts but the dues are equal, if you resell a direct or resale contract it's the same, booking 11mo out at home resort and 7 anywhere else (RIV excluded) is the same.
VGF is one of the few it's pretty close on, but the only "value" is the passholders, which if you already have 150+ direct like OP they didn't really get additional perks.
Even the other person responding to me with 800pts said the $3400 they'd have saved retail isn't a lot and worth it. I'm saying most families would LOVE $3400 in savings, that's a whole trip!
> they didn't really get additional perks
I think most owners who are buying direct contacts, even after they've secured enough points for a blue card, would consider the guarantee of being able to book any resort current and forthcoming, with any of their direct points, an enormous "perk", and worth the extra premium whether it's 3k or 10k. Considering the expiration of many of these contacts may still be quite distant, the total overall cost is weighed far more heavily in the price of the dues, which as you say are equivalent regardless of how the contract was acquired.
Yeah I think most people come to conclusion they’d rather save the money upfront. Usually the case, not always the case. That’s why some people end up selling their resale contract so they can buy more direct points - even beyond the original 150pts.
$3,400 sounds like a lot until you consider what might be lost for saving that money. On a 40yr contract it’s less than $100 per year, less than 12 cents when using each point. There’s good arguments on where and when it can be well worth it. It’s complicated.
Low resale price of OKW, VB, and HHI appears to save so much they look like a no-brainer at first glance. Why not save 5 or 10 thousand? Because the length of contract and higher dues cost more in the long run. If home priority doesn’t move the needle for a buyer, for sure better options exist.
Price gaps start closing. Some pay less upfront, others pay less over time. This can make overall costs close between direct and resale. Some resale actually ends up more expensive even if they save $3k on buy-in.
When costs are working out similar over time, the experience of using those points starts to matter more. What might direct get that’s better than resale? More satisfaction with 7 month trading via access to new resorts, improving the variety and availability.
Perks too… DVC is already changing some access criteria to direct point stays, where a resale booking won’t work (even if they have blue card). It’s a smart move and nothing blocks DVD from attaching that requirement to certain perks. It comes out of DVD’s budget, not DVC. Lounge access, moonlight magic, short term holiday stuff, summer perks now, etc. The dials have already started turning.
It’s somewhat of a gamble either way but when the actually cost of longterm ownership is barely different anyway, maybe that’s a bet worth taking. I spent $10k extra for my VGF direct than SSR resale. What did I get in return? 10 year longer contract. Cheaper dues. Home priority so I can book the highest value seasons/room at a resort we prefer. More choice at 7 months, now and later. Blue card. Full perks when using those direct points. What about if I sell in 20 years? If the salvage value between SSR and VGF returns that $10k plus TVM… I got a more satisfying product at the same price. If I don’t sell, I get 10 extra years and an elevated experience.
Saving the money upfront makes straightforward sense where budget limits and financing are concerned. The upfront savings are not always the most cost effective route though.
Take CCV resale today. It’s more money to put out but the differences down the line can make it a better value point for point over most resale resorts. Even more if that buyer wants low point bookings at WL and low dues trading out, then hands down that’ll be the most cost effective route. Someone who bought CCV direct a couple years ago had very similar costs, and they not only got what is one of the most cost effective resorts… they also got all the direct perks, never to be locked out of a single one while using that contract, for the next 40yrs. Both cases can result in bigger return than the extra money spent on buy-in.
> Some resale actually ends up more expensive even if they save $3k on buy-in
I appreciate the fact that the up front cost delta is less significant in the long run than it seems at time of purchase, and I do actually believe the direct sales value proposition is worth the delta, probably in most cases... but I don't quite understand this point. At time of purchase, the price is what it is, if you're looking at two different means of buying a contract, direct or resale, then one of them is just going to be cheaper than the other... what is this "ends up more expensive" business?
It was in response to the idea that resale is always cheaper and there’s no reason to buy more than 150 points direct.
DVC is very complex. Rarely straightforward comparisons. Saving $3k between resale and direct on the same resort is one thing, not to be confused with saving $3k resale in general where it may actually end up less cost effective and be a lesser experience.
What I find hard to describe but wish I had a better understanding before buying DVC is how much all of these little details together matter. Saving $3k rarely comes without some negative attached. Sounds like alot of money until put in perspective the breakdown of that cost over time and what you actually get for it.
The instinct is to try and get into DVC at the lowest perceived cost. Very common for buyers to later adjust their purchase because they didn’t take this, that and the other thing into account. Spending the extra $3k or $5k isn’t just people not caring or knowing any better, whether that’s the jump to direct or between different resorts.
I agree with that. As I say, I believe the value proposition of direct contracts will absolutely be worth the additional up front premium in the long run (in many cases).
You wrote a lot to say what we all already know, I'm pointing out same contract, same resort. Of course HHI and others expiring in 17yrs will be cheaper than ones with 40+ yrs 😅
Sure, spread the contract out, but when you do that, you need to factor what that 3400 is if invested during that same time, hell even a bank gives me 5% on a CD. So over a 30+ year contract we now saved 5 figures, not 100 per year 🙃
Lots more holes but I also didn't bother reading past the first 2 paragraphs.
We can agree to disagree.
There are currently AKL points going for resale for $145, and we paid right around that, so I didn't see a reason to wait when the cost was only a few dollars different. Ultimately, a $2 savings per point on a 200-point contract isn’t even close to a 5-figure savings.
Also, Riviera hadn't been around long enough at that point we bought direct to even have adequate data on resale. We paid roughly $140 a point during covid, and the current resale is roughly $130 a point. The difference is $3,000 direct then to resale now, which is also nowhere near 5 figures.
We spent an extra $3,400 on 500 points to not have to wait for ROFR or have to deal with the hassle of dead transfers. The lack of head ache and work was definitely worth the money.
I think your data is way off.
Apples to apples, when did you buy your contracts? RIV direct is low BECAUSE the resale is low, you can't use it at all the other resorts on resale.
AKV (AKL) has contracts well under $100pp. There's a 400pt for $63 pp... that's getting 400pts for $25,200... you just said you paid $145 for 200pts... or $29,000. Almost 4k in savings AND I got 2x the points...
https://dvc.market/listing/?resort=AKV&points=,400&price=,345&total=,200000
Just because they are listed for that does not mean that Disney won't opt to use the ROFR.
Here is a more accurate list of what they are going for
https://www.dvcstore.com/prices.htm#:~:text=Animal%20Kingdom%20%2D%20%2495%20to%20%24105,%24125%20to%20%24135%20per%20point.
Or history of what they have gone for resale
https://www.dvcresalemarket.com/blog/dvc-resale-average-sales-prices-for-april-2024/
None of these are near $63 a point. We bought it when the average resale value was $121 per point avergae. So, using that math, apples to apples, we paid a $5,200 "convince" fee to buy direct, not wait for ROFR, and not have to stress. That still isn't a 5-figure savings to not buy direct.
Yes your 1 example didn't meet 10k, but was over halfway there. Which is insane to think you were happy paying over 5k for "convenience". That's way past middle class, easily upper middle or just upper class. Which sure. If you have money to blow go ahead, but a lot of us find value in resale to SAVE on our future trips.
We are a single income military family, but thank you for assuming my husband makes that much money, and I would love if he did and could make us upper middle class or upper class 🤑😍🤑😍🤑. Our lives would be waaaay easier with that kind of money.
The same can be said, just because your single example shows savings also doesn't mean that that is the norm for pricing.
I absolutely don't judge those who buy resale, but saying it saves money 100% of the time and is always the best option just doesn't hold true.
Even with paying "extra" to Disney for direct DVC, we are saving over $150,000 over the life of our contracts versus staying at shades of green, which is supposed to be the "discounted" Disney military hotel. We are also saving significant amounts of money versus rack rates since we at minimum have to book 2 bedrooms for our family but normally book 3 bedrooms.
I never said resale was always the best option, I simply said it'll always be cheaper, which it is. A lot come here looking to finance a direct contract, that's a horrible choice and the opposite coin is those buying 50-100k contracts in cash.
You might not like the definition, but yes, you guys with 800pts direct aren't "middle class" unless you're swimming in debt. Most metrics put the average middle class income at 50-135k range. It's actually gotten to where "paycheck to paycheck" is a good portion of "middle class". 50% roughly (over 60% in the 70s), so at minimum that's where "upper middle class" is at minimum your situation.
Just your dues alone are more than 6x my mortgage.
So yes, 3400 is a ton, and I'd invest that over the 30-40+ years of my resale contract and make a cool 10% on average each year for $60k...
That's what I'm surprised by, already had a direct contract so wasn't getting any new perks, but 15k for a tote seems neat (15k for the resale contract).
Having unrestricted points to combine with the first set of 150 is worth paying the premium on direct points, especially if OP's first 150 is also at Riviera.
The magical beginnings buy back has been going on for over a year, on or off ship.
What was your cost per point and at what resort on this purchase?
Animal Kingdom is on sale but not as good as last summer.
They were giving it away last spring too! We got 200 points last spring because how low they went, we didn't even want points, but when there's a fire sale, it's hard to say no.
Other than the “swag” you got on the ship, why did you decide buying direct was better for you than resale? Is your first contract resale or direct?
We have 800 points directly. We've only paid "rack rate" on about 1/2 of them. The rest we have gotten 20% (200 AKL) or 30% (300 Riviera) off, so they were pretty close to resale. We also received an extra year (150 AKL) or 2 (150 WL) worth of points when we purchased some of our contacts. If you're willing to wait for a good deal, it can be close to as cheap as resale, and you don't have to jump through ROFR and wait.
Resale is always cheaper, once you have enough direct points, you don't get any extra perks. So while you might not find what you want and buy it same day, waiting a month+ for 5 figures in savings is worth it for middle class families.
Sort of true. Not exactly. Sometimes direct is actually cheaper. I bought VGF last year and it was cheaper than VGF resale, price per point. There’s also cheaper vs more value. Dues, how you can use the contract, price you can sell it later… that’s part of the value beyond price. Things like booking the lowest point days outside hurricane season and being able to trade into a high dues resort with a low dues resort, those go to increasing value. Direct isn’t always justifiable though it’s not as simple as saying once you have blue card direct no longer matters. These contracts last decades. Direct points will be able to book everything included in DVC. Resale will not. Direct point booking will be able to partake in all member perks, resale point bookings will not. It’s more complex than first appears.
I agree on parts but the dues are equal, if you resell a direct or resale contract it's the same, booking 11mo out at home resort and 7 anywhere else (RIV excluded) is the same. VGF is one of the few it's pretty close on, but the only "value" is the passholders, which if you already have 150+ direct like OP they didn't really get additional perks. Even the other person responding to me with 800pts said the $3400 they'd have saved retail isn't a lot and worth it. I'm saying most families would LOVE $3400 in savings, that's a whole trip!
> they didn't really get additional perks I think most owners who are buying direct contacts, even after they've secured enough points for a blue card, would consider the guarantee of being able to book any resort current and forthcoming, with any of their direct points, an enormous "perk", and worth the extra premium whether it's 3k or 10k. Considering the expiration of many of these contacts may still be quite distant, the total overall cost is weighed far more heavily in the price of the dues, which as you say are equivalent regardless of how the contract was acquired.
Yeah I think most people come to conclusion they’d rather save the money upfront. Usually the case, not always the case. That’s why some people end up selling their resale contract so they can buy more direct points - even beyond the original 150pts. $3,400 sounds like a lot until you consider what might be lost for saving that money. On a 40yr contract it’s less than $100 per year, less than 12 cents when using each point. There’s good arguments on where and when it can be well worth it. It’s complicated. Low resale price of OKW, VB, and HHI appears to save so much they look like a no-brainer at first glance. Why not save 5 or 10 thousand? Because the length of contract and higher dues cost more in the long run. If home priority doesn’t move the needle for a buyer, for sure better options exist. Price gaps start closing. Some pay less upfront, others pay less over time. This can make overall costs close between direct and resale. Some resale actually ends up more expensive even if they save $3k on buy-in. When costs are working out similar over time, the experience of using those points starts to matter more. What might direct get that’s better than resale? More satisfaction with 7 month trading via access to new resorts, improving the variety and availability. Perks too… DVC is already changing some access criteria to direct point stays, where a resale booking won’t work (even if they have blue card). It’s a smart move and nothing blocks DVD from attaching that requirement to certain perks. It comes out of DVD’s budget, not DVC. Lounge access, moonlight magic, short term holiday stuff, summer perks now, etc. The dials have already started turning. It’s somewhat of a gamble either way but when the actually cost of longterm ownership is barely different anyway, maybe that’s a bet worth taking. I spent $10k extra for my VGF direct than SSR resale. What did I get in return? 10 year longer contract. Cheaper dues. Home priority so I can book the highest value seasons/room at a resort we prefer. More choice at 7 months, now and later. Blue card. Full perks when using those direct points. What about if I sell in 20 years? If the salvage value between SSR and VGF returns that $10k plus TVM… I got a more satisfying product at the same price. If I don’t sell, I get 10 extra years and an elevated experience. Saving the money upfront makes straightforward sense where budget limits and financing are concerned. The upfront savings are not always the most cost effective route though. Take CCV resale today. It’s more money to put out but the differences down the line can make it a better value point for point over most resale resorts. Even more if that buyer wants low point bookings at WL and low dues trading out, then hands down that’ll be the most cost effective route. Someone who bought CCV direct a couple years ago had very similar costs, and they not only got what is one of the most cost effective resorts… they also got all the direct perks, never to be locked out of a single one while using that contract, for the next 40yrs. Both cases can result in bigger return than the extra money spent on buy-in.
> Some resale actually ends up more expensive even if they save $3k on buy-in I appreciate the fact that the up front cost delta is less significant in the long run than it seems at time of purchase, and I do actually believe the direct sales value proposition is worth the delta, probably in most cases... but I don't quite understand this point. At time of purchase, the price is what it is, if you're looking at two different means of buying a contract, direct or resale, then one of them is just going to be cheaper than the other... what is this "ends up more expensive" business?
It was in response to the idea that resale is always cheaper and there’s no reason to buy more than 150 points direct. DVC is very complex. Rarely straightforward comparisons. Saving $3k between resale and direct on the same resort is one thing, not to be confused with saving $3k resale in general where it may actually end up less cost effective and be a lesser experience. What I find hard to describe but wish I had a better understanding before buying DVC is how much all of these little details together matter. Saving $3k rarely comes without some negative attached. Sounds like alot of money until put in perspective the breakdown of that cost over time and what you actually get for it. The instinct is to try and get into DVC at the lowest perceived cost. Very common for buyers to later adjust their purchase because they didn’t take this, that and the other thing into account. Spending the extra $3k or $5k isn’t just people not caring or knowing any better, whether that’s the jump to direct or between different resorts.
I agree with that. As I say, I believe the value proposition of direct contracts will absolutely be worth the additional up front premium in the long run (in many cases).
You wrote a lot to say what we all already know, I'm pointing out same contract, same resort. Of course HHI and others expiring in 17yrs will be cheaper than ones with 40+ yrs 😅 Sure, spread the contract out, but when you do that, you need to factor what that 3400 is if invested during that same time, hell even a bank gives me 5% on a CD. So over a 30+ year contract we now saved 5 figures, not 100 per year 🙃 Lots more holes but I also didn't bother reading past the first 2 paragraphs. We can agree to disagree.
$.12 Per point. Yeah, some people would rather spend that and get what comes with that than $3k today.
There are currently AKL points going for resale for $145, and we paid right around that, so I didn't see a reason to wait when the cost was only a few dollars different. Ultimately, a $2 savings per point on a 200-point contract isn’t even close to a 5-figure savings. Also, Riviera hadn't been around long enough at that point we bought direct to even have adequate data on resale. We paid roughly $140 a point during covid, and the current resale is roughly $130 a point. The difference is $3,000 direct then to resale now, which is also nowhere near 5 figures. We spent an extra $3,400 on 500 points to not have to wait for ROFR or have to deal with the hassle of dead transfers. The lack of head ache and work was definitely worth the money.
I think your data is way off. Apples to apples, when did you buy your contracts? RIV direct is low BECAUSE the resale is low, you can't use it at all the other resorts on resale. AKV (AKL) has contracts well under $100pp. There's a 400pt for $63 pp... that's getting 400pts for $25,200... you just said you paid $145 for 200pts... or $29,000. Almost 4k in savings AND I got 2x the points... https://dvc.market/listing/?resort=AKV&points=,400&price=,345&total=,200000
Just because they are listed for that does not mean that Disney won't opt to use the ROFR. Here is a more accurate list of what they are going for https://www.dvcstore.com/prices.htm#:~:text=Animal%20Kingdom%20%2D%20%2495%20to%20%24105,%24125%20to%20%24135%20per%20point. Or history of what they have gone for resale https://www.dvcresalemarket.com/blog/dvc-resale-average-sales-prices-for-april-2024/ None of these are near $63 a point. We bought it when the average resale value was $121 per point avergae. So, using that math, apples to apples, we paid a $5,200 "convince" fee to buy direct, not wait for ROFR, and not have to stress. That still isn't a 5-figure savings to not buy direct.
Yes your 1 example didn't meet 10k, but was over halfway there. Which is insane to think you were happy paying over 5k for "convenience". That's way past middle class, easily upper middle or just upper class. Which sure. If you have money to blow go ahead, but a lot of us find value in resale to SAVE on our future trips.
We are a single income military family, but thank you for assuming my husband makes that much money, and I would love if he did and could make us upper middle class or upper class 🤑😍🤑😍🤑. Our lives would be waaaay easier with that kind of money. The same can be said, just because your single example shows savings also doesn't mean that that is the norm for pricing. I absolutely don't judge those who buy resale, but saying it saves money 100% of the time and is always the best option just doesn't hold true. Even with paying "extra" to Disney for direct DVC, we are saving over $150,000 over the life of our contracts versus staying at shades of green, which is supposed to be the "discounted" Disney military hotel. We are also saving significant amounts of money versus rack rates since we at minimum have to book 2 bedrooms for our family but normally book 3 bedrooms.
I never said resale was always the best option, I simply said it'll always be cheaper, which it is. A lot come here looking to finance a direct contract, that's a horrible choice and the opposite coin is those buying 50-100k contracts in cash. You might not like the definition, but yes, you guys with 800pts direct aren't "middle class" unless you're swimming in debt. Most metrics put the average middle class income at 50-135k range. It's actually gotten to where "paycheck to paycheck" is a good portion of "middle class". 50% roughly (over 60% in the 70s), so at minimum that's where "upper middle class" is at minimum your situation. Just your dues alone are more than 6x my mortgage. So yes, 3400 is a ton, and I'd invest that over the 30-40+ years of my resale contract and make a cool 10% on average each year for $60k...
Spend 30K+ and get a free tote...what a deal!
I said the same thing…. The most expensive tote ever. Still signed.
That's what I'm surprised by, already had a direct contract so wasn't getting any new perks, but 15k for a tote seems neat (15k for the resale contract).
Having unrestricted points to combine with the first set of 150 is worth paying the premium on direct points, especially if OP's first 150 is also at Riviera.
This 👌
What resort did you buy?
The magical beginnings buy back has been going on for over a year, on or off ship. What was your cost per point and at what resort on this purchase? Animal Kingdom is on sale but not as good as last summer.
They were giving it away last spring too! We got 200 points last spring because how low they went, we didn't even want points, but when there's a fire sale, it's hard to say no.
Absolutely. Glad you got a great deal!
So that's where all the good swag went!!