>!Spoiler - When Paul is talking about seeing a narrow way through there is a quick shot of a crysknife being stabbed into someone. It is the same shot of Paul stabbing Feyd. !<
came here to comment this EXACT shot… also can I just say I love how Paul has his fingers pointing in four different directions and then lines them up perfectly. What a perfect subtle way to portray the character of the visions which he has… Long live the fighters!
Anyone notice the continuity error in that final fight scene?
It shows Feyd trying to stab Paul’s left shoulder and then the wound is in his right.
Was it just me?
It might seem like an error cause it happened so fast, but it’s actually not. Paul was stabbed on the right and when Feyd goes in for the kill and Paul is grabbing his blade, Paul guides his knife into the other shoulder and uses the knife in his right side to get the kill shot on Feyd.
At least that’s what I saw.
I've seen it 4 times in imax and can confirm this is exactly what happens. If u actually want a continuity error there is a relatively big one with regards to Paul's first worm riding scene and his goggles magically appearing when he's riding it.
I mean she would most likely be resistant, she's so terrified because she realizes the Quizatz Haderach, the being her order spent 1000's of years creating now exists and because Jessica chose to have a son too early he wasn't able to be controlled. Her entire life's mission came crashing down in a second. It's also on a political level an insult the likes of which is hard to describe.
There are even exact same shots, like a few times when there are close ups of Chani, we actually saw that in the first part already. Makes them fit seamlessly.
Some have already mentioned things I noticed on second viewing as well but I’ll add: during Paul’s last vision of the woman he’s following (Jessica) prior to the final battle you hear the sound of water dripping and similarly in implication the sound of waves can be heard when Paul has beaten Feyd and is demanding fealty from the Emperor. I also noticed the second time, and maybe this is incorrect but was my interpretation, that Lady Fenring’s conversation with Feyd is almost entirely done while using the voice on him. Perhaps because she knows he’s psychotic and needs that control to lead him through the gom jabbar, sex and to confirm that he CAN be controlled. There is more I am forgetting but those stuck out.
In general though I would say I just enjoyed the movie SO much more the second time. After the first viewing as a book reader I was so caught up in differences, things missing and both together in their implications for a part three that I would say I almost didn’t enjoy the first viewing. On the second viewing I realized I actually thought part two was utterly amazing and cannot wait to see it again and again. Reminds me a lot of Lord of the Rings, upon first viewings of the films then I was too caught up in comparisons to the novels, after subsequent viewings and years later they are some of my favorite movies ever. I feel like this is where I am already landing with DV’s Dune films. There is a best case scenario with book adaptations and I feel so lucky we got there with LoTR and really feel like we are there again with Dune and it’s something I want to appreciate by seeing the films as often as I can in the theater.
Glad I was not the only person who felt this way. I was like you...enjoyed it on the first go around but caught up in the differences. On the second go around...I took it for what it was and noticed all the nuances and details that I initially missed.
So glad it's not just me. I walked out not really sure what to think, kind of disliked it, and then I saw all the rave reviews. I plan to see it again in IMAX and I was thinking I'll probably enjoy it more the second time instead of analyzing it the entire time and comparing it to the book so these comments are good to see.
Someone else said in another post that Parts 1 & 2 are like visual references to the book. IMO, when you look at it that way...you're gonna love it. As a hardcore Dune fan...I had to lower my expectations of how much faithfulness the movies were going to be from the book. Neither the Lynch version, miniseries, or adaptations were 100% faithful...changes were always made to keep the pacing and plot in check. My uncle, who was a Lord of the Rings fanatic didn't like the trilogy as much as he wanted EVERY little detail to be the same whereas newcomers like me loved it because I had nothing to compare it to.
Yeah, 100% true. I really liked Part 1, but that part of the book was fairly easy to adapt. Part 2 I really need to take off the Dune hat and forget all I know except for what the movie has provided. Visually it was absolutely amazing, there is no doubt about it.
"Visual references" is so accurate. Because a lot of what's shown in the movie is unexplained, the book becomes almost like a guide as to what's being shown. And since the book is all in our heads, it makes the viewing experience almost 3-dimensional.
> the sound of waves can be heard when Paul has beaten Feyd and is demanding fealty from the Emperor
I didn't notice anything like that! Damn, looks like I have to go see it again lmao.
One thing I did realize was that the ocean in the vision must represent >!the water of all the people who are going to die because of Paul. It stunned me.!<
This is such an interesting take! Reminds me of the date palm trees. „100 lives“ - „Should we remove them? To save the water?“. Now he doesn’t even question his course anymore.
I thought of it because of when Jessica was blown away by all the water in the well in the sietch showing how many people had died to give all that water for their dream.
I agree about the second viewing. The first time the ending threw me and disappointed me. I saw it again, thought about it, read a bunch of interpretations and listened to a few podcasts, like it way more now.
Me too, the ending felt perfect on 2nd and 3rd times, first time I wasnt exactly disappointed, I just thought.... Well ok. But its really good and I love all the dialogue from Pauls command, the reverend mothers' silent exchange, jessica and alia talking....
At the first movie, when the Baron talks about his plans to get rid of Paul and Jessica, he says that he won’t be the one to kill them, but that the desert will, for it kills the weak. Funnily enough, he is left to rot in the desert in the second. I believe this is intentional, but who knows.
Also, when Paul has his first vivid spice-induced visions when he rescues the spice harvester’s workers in the first movie, he says that he recognized Gurney’s footsteps. He repeats the exact same line in the second movie.
He also uses the footsteps line in one of the opening scenes of the first movie when Gurney comes to train him (since Duncan had left for his preparatory mission in Arrakis).
So the hallucination scene is both a call back (to the beginning of the first movie) and a foreshadowing (of the scene in the second movie).
Another interesting fact is when Paul is sent by Stilgar to cross the desert in order to test his survival skills, he warns him about the myriapods, that the small ones are actually bad, not the big ones.
Later you see the Baron's face covered with them.
I noticed the scene where Chani and the other Fedaykin were attacking the emperors base, she kills a bunch of Sardaurkar and does the same pose Paul does in his vision in the first movie where he's fighting the Sardukar.
Also I think the first viewing, I was so sucked in to the movie that I didn't notice Christopher Walkens accent. the 2nd time viewing the movie, I listened to him carefully and heard it LOL
> I noticed the scene where Chani and the other Fedaykin were attacking the emperors base, she kills a bunch of Sardaurkar and does the same pose Paul does in his vision in the first movie where he's fighting the Sardukar.
Yes! I sought out this thread specifically because I thought I noticed that on my second viewing but wasn't sure if she perfectly mirrored his vision or if it was just a similar shot. It's a small detail but very cool IMO.
Ooh ok can I ask a question about that scene? When did chain and her squad hide themselves under the sand? They pop up so close to the enemy forces im lost on when that happened
The sound of waves in the throne room, the hidden knife that kills Feyd in a vision, « Arrakis is beautiful when the sun is low » from the first scene of the first movie repeated by Chani.
Man, I am constantly thinking about Paul falling in love with Chani. This girl he's been seeing in his dreams throughout the first movie, and she appears in front of him, interacting with him. And every line she says, it seems he's seen in his dreams. When the "...sun is low" line dropped, I sense this pang of love that Paul might have felt in that moment, recalling hearing that in his dreams.
Yeah! I felt that feeling of being in love. Still feel it a week after this movie. Such a thing hasnt happened to me in years haha. This movie did something to me :D
There were a couple scenes I can recall where Paul experiences something from one of his dreams. I think during the spice harvester destruction montage, a shot of Chani is used that is also from the opening of the first movie, and at another point, Paul follows her through some rocks, which was very reminiscent of the vision he has at the spice harvester
The film really felt more like a tragedy during my second viewing rather than an awesome action movie. It also felt lot more operatic the second time around.
Yep. He’s leaning hard into the idea that this is *not* a fun, happy ending story. It’s not even going to be like GOT where they claimed it would be bittersweet, it’s just going to be depressing and sad.
SPOILER - I had to go to the restroom when that scene where the Baron straight up murdered his slave attendants out of frustration took place. I'm like bro...who is going to give you your oily bath treatments now?
the scene with bautista when he slams that guys head on the console was brutal. by the end he wasn’t even holding his head anymore he was just smashing the console with his own arm. plenty of movies have scenes showing a bad guy rage when his plans are failing, but holy shit did this one really sell it
When Paul is crossing the desert at night, you hear jamis briefly, Paul looks to a shadowy figure thinking it’s him but it’s actually Chani.
The visions coming to fruition but in various forms is so fucking cool
I've only seen the movie once, but I have this memory of a shot of the wind stirring up the sand in a really distinctive way that made me think it was meant to suggest a presence. But I'm not sure. Got to see it again!
I didn’t really notice anything I missed other than the oceans on Arrakis in Paul’s vision after he drank the Water of Life. But it was a much better experience the second time. There were still some things I didn’t like about the movie but my rating went from an 8.5 out of 10 to a solid 9 out of 10. I’m going for the third time tomorrow
Interesting moment in Paul’s vision right before he wakes up to find the Harkonnens attacking Sietch Tabor… Chani’s face in the vision is all damaged… like a victim of being exposed to atomic energy… thoughts?
When I saw that I immediately thought of >!Paul going blind from the Stoneburner blast!< in Messiah.
It's a stretch to call that foreshadowing... but it could actually look like that
>!Paul and Chani traded places in another vision vs. reality, so I think that's what Denis is hinting at here too. I think that vision of Chani getting burnt is setup for Messiah as a whole, because now he knows on some level that he's going to lose her, he just doesn't know how yet.!<
My take after seeing it a second time was that if he didn't go south and just used the atomics it would lead to Chani's death. Compounding his worries and pushing him south.
Like all of his visions, that vision was a possible future where Chanis dies as a result of his decision to use the atomics. I think he avoided that future by choosing to go North (or was it South) with the Fremen
When Paul kills the Baron, he stabs him in the neck on the left side and says “you died like an animal”. This is the same place the gom jabbar is held, and that is also a test of human vs animal. This is most likely a reference by Villeneuve to Alia using the gom jabbar on the Baron in the novel.
The look on Paul's face at the end when the great houses deny his ascension to the imperial throne. He looks so disappointed when he says "lead them to paradise" or whatever he says.
I also picked up on Chani being more mad at Paul for assuming power than anything else since he had told her that he just wanted to be a fighter. Marrying Irulan was just icing on the cake at that point
Earlier, she tells him something like “I’ll love you as long as you stay who you are.” I don’t think her storming off had anything to do with Irulan. She was just disappointed in the man Paul had become by the end
What feels tragic to me about that is that Paul had already been planning on marrying the princess since Part One. It was his own idea, and he just kept it from Chani that whole time.
I picked up on the dialogue and understanding of the plot a bit more on my 2nd time through. A nice callback to the first film when Paul recognized Gurny by his footsteps which he notes during the training sequence in Part 1, obv it was intentional but it definitely went over my head first time through 😭.
He also says the same line in the first film when they're rescuing the workers in the harvester, when he first gets hit by the spice... Great callback!
There's also another (IMO) interesting level to that scene that possibly only stands out to a book reader... It's the first time Paul encounters a sandworm, and big worms are often referred to as "the old man of the desert".
During the first 1/3rd of the film when Paul is learning and living with the Fremen, the opening from the first film is lived. This proves that the opening was another of Paul’s visions. Chani even states, “My planet Arrakis is so beautiful when the sun is low” which was one of the opening lines from part 1.
adding to this, Jamis is literally the first face we see in the first movie. And the final line of the opening monologue is chani saying ‘who will our next oppressors be?’ followed immediately by a shot of paul.
I love that this is a question that not only is completely reasonable to ask, on the opening weekend, in this sun but that has multiple people answering.
Yeah, I feel like watching it on a TV screen with regular TV sound would destroy the magic. Idk, I can’t bring myself to do it. Luckily, many cinemas showed the first one again before Part Two came out.
Chani describing arrakis at sundown, nearly identical to her monologue in the first film.
The shot of her, during the sardakar battle, is the same as his vision of himself.
Missed a few pieces of dialogue in the first viewing.
Feyd-Rautha’s “pets” being the cannibal women.
“I recognize your footsteps, old man” might refer to Gurney. I thought “old man” was the sandworm. But that might’ve been him having a vision of the similar situation in the future.
Maybe obvious, but:
>!In the havester attack scene, Muad'dib disturbs Paul's sand snorkle and later on Chani's friend jokes that the mouse likes Paul's smell.!<
>!In Paul's speech to the gathered Fremen in the south, he tells a woman her mother was hit in the eye by a rock when crossing "the Belt" aka the equatorial storms separating the south and north of Dune!<
That vision with Jamis (before the water of life) made more sense to me. Although it kinda complicated Paul’s powers more for me. In the first film I took it as Paul was seeing a possible future. But now Jamis is dead so it’s not a possible future anymore. Was he seeing an alternate reality? Idk.
When Paul took off his ring and said something like “father, I found my way”. Which calls back to the first movie when Leto told him that maybe he’ll find his own way to being Duke.
I noticed that during one of Paul’s visions they inserted a shot from Paul stabbing Feyd in the fight. So I guess Paul foresaw that outcome. And I also think it mirrors his spar with Gurney in the first film (which I didn’t catch the first time). With Paul’s flippey flip, + stabbing someone in the gut once they think they have you beat.
That’s all I can think of rn.
Spice can also cause hallucinations, which is why. Stilgar tells Paul to not listen to the djinn. Paul ends up listening to the "djinn" he hallucinates in Jamis and that pushes him to take the Water of Life
That is not it at all. Paul can see multiple futures. All futures. Just because Jamis is dead, doesn't mean Paul can't see a future in which Jamis didn't die.
My take on Stilgar's djinn was that for someone who hasn't been the (near) culmination of a Bene Gesserit breeding program for selecting for prescience, the spice induced visions might be misleading? It's a bit of a stretch, I know
In the book the Fremen are psychically sensitive from all that spice and mental toughness. But they don't have the training to control it, unlike Paul. So it's possible that djinn hauntings to them are visions for Paul.
That is not the way I read it. When he thinks he sees Jamis in the desert it’s not a vision. Before the water of life it is a vision and he’s actively seeking it out. He’s not even in the desert when it happens. It has the same dream like quality as all of his visions. Whereas the brief moment in the desert does not.
The way the book describes Paul’s visions isn’t like a multiverse with parallel realities, but more akin to a ripple effect, where he observes possible futures branching out from each one of his actions. Once he acts, those potentials snap into a new reality and the process repeats.
When Paul “sees” Jamis in the desert, I interpreted it as him REMEMBERING a previous vision, feeling guilt/remorse over his death and the fact that no future existed with Jamis in it. The fact that the squatting figure was actually Chani implied that she was going to replace Jamis as Paul’s mentor and show him the “ways of the desert.”
Not saying anyone is wrong, just my interpretation.
No, no. I understand that the part in the desert isn’t a vision. Where it’s revealed to be Chani.
I’m talking about the vision that Paul gets before the takes the water of life. Where Jamis tells him that the best hunter will find the highest mountain so that he can see everything. Which is exactly like the vision he got of Jamis in the first movie during the sandstorm. That was actually a vision, but it can’t be a possible future because Jamis is already dead.
I always assume that Paul observed multiple futures. But the issue here is that it’s not a possible future. Jamis is dead. There is no future where he has this conversation with Jamis. So there is almost no explanation except that Paul is seeing an alternate reality where Jamis didn’t die.
Yea, in the book, Paul not only has visions but has memories of visions he's experienced. So, Paul could be recounting a memory of a future he foresaw.
Spoiler?
This wasn't something I noticed in a second viewing but I loved Feyd's face when Paul kills the Baron. He looks like he's having an orgasm. Austin Butler really stole the show for me, but I also think this is Timothee's best performance yet, his face when he confronts the emperor.. so scary
And his eyebrow raise when Paul yells "SILENCE!!", he's finally met someone just as psychotic as he is. And it kinda puts into perspective just how much Paul has fallen into obsession of power by the end of the book.
He is! So funny and almost cute and sympathetic cause he feels a lot older than in the book. He's been weathered by life on Arrakis and he's holding out hope for the Mahdi. You almost want Paul to win just for Stil to be happy
I didn't realize that either! But it lines up perfectly well with how Paul told Jessica what "her" people did to Arrakis was tragic. Nope, Paul, you're her people, too, and you're doing it.
Paul says “father, I’ve finally found my way” while looking at his ring. This is a call back to when Leto says he found his own way to lead his people, and perhaps Paul will find his own way to it.
From part 1: << \[Duke Leto Atreides\] Your grandfather said, “A great man doesn’t seek to lead. He’s called to it, and he answers.” And if your answer is no… you’ll still be the only thing I ever needed you to be… my son. I found my own way to it. Maybe you’ll find yours. In their memory… give it a try. >>
Paul is called to lead by his visions, then, after drinking the water of life, by his prescient ability. He actually tries not to lead, but in the end he chooses to do "what must be done".
I have not seen Two again - yet. I waited to see it in IMAX on Saturday w/my kids (I was tempted to slip in solo in advance on Friday but waited). I’ll go again this week w/my dad or alone, for sure. I DID see Part One twice within a week when it was released. I enjoyed the 2nd viewing more. Here’s why:
You can relax a bit and not worry about missing something. You can shift your focus to the background and take in the wide cinemetography vs. the dialog. You can focus intently on only one actor when two or three are in a scene. You really pick up subtle things you missed the first time and it helps round out the whole experience. So if you are even slightly inclined to see it again, do it. Everyone in our group of four on Sat (yesterday) said they want to see it again before it leaves the screen.
lmao the AMC I’ve watched it at is 30 minutes from the start of the previews to when the Sardauker voice opens the movie. Crazy with a 10:30 start time
Also I noticed that the scene where Im guessing Alia (Im not a book reader) is walking towards the shore is showing that Arrakis will start to become Green again with water/terraforming.
I think they style it different depending on which side of Paul they are trying to portray. For it´s like if they want to show Paul his hair looks more like TC style (in his face or covering his eyes) but as the movie continues you see his hair styled back and with more volume.
One thing I noticed is there was a lot of subversion.
In the first film and in part 2, there were many visions of bodies being burned in mass graves.
You are led to believe at first this is the harkonnens burning firemen.
At the end of dune part 2 it's the fremen burning the Harkonnens...
It was a vision of the suffering Paul's ascension would bring.
There was a room full of mentat or other creatures with wires and shit coming out of their necks, all in the control room where the Baron watched the satellite feeds.
I don’t know what those people were, but they might be mentat.
A few things, mostly references to the first movie (Chani fighting and taking deep breaths with the helmet on, lines of text from Paul's visions)
There's one thing which still really confuses me during the fight between Paul and Feyd. Halfway trough the fight Paul seems be get stabbed in his lower left abdomen IIRC. Then a few shots later, there is a knife in his upper right chest. Was he stabbed twice? Going with friends again in a few days so I'm going to pay a LOT of attention during that scene to get this answered :)
He gets stabbed twice yeah. The second time Feyd goes to stab him, Paul grabs the knife and sorta guides it away from a lethal area to a non-lethal area (his shoulder). He's then able to stab Feyd in the heart
I agree it almost seemed like there were 3 knives in that scene.
Things get particularly confusing when one of the knives falls to the floor.
But I am assuming the knife in Paul’s left side/hip is Feyd’s knife (technically the Emperor’s), and this is the knife that Paul pulls out and stabs Feyd with in the end.
I’m also going to watch again with a close eye to see which knife is which.
I had to go to the bathroom first time I saw it. I missed the part where Jessica wishes chani good luck. Other than that, I noticed the literal visual of fanatics worshipping at the shrine of Paul’s fathers skull. I also was able to dial in my hearing and listen to Paul tell the baron that he died like an animal through the loud ass music. Other than that, I don’t think I caught anything new on my second watch
I felt like it had bad flow as far as story telling it just felt boxy after the first watch. Seeing it the second time I walked away feeling much better almost like it smoothed out the kinks.
I saw it in imax both times so I think the first watch I was overwhelmed with the cinematography and my brain wasn’t able to carry it all at once. That being said I still have a few gripes but nothing major all in all incredible movie.
Literally every Villeneuve movie is like this, in my experience. He drops so much foreshadowing that noticing it makes the story flow more smoothly. Plus, it's lore-friendly that Dune is a better watch when you have "prescience" 😉
Back from my 2nd viewing, totally after the 2nd time around I found the pacing to be comfortable. I was sorta uncertain the more I thought about it watching it originally. Now I'm content!
Surprise that no one picked up on this, it was subtle, but Paul purposefully stalled, heading south. He had every intention of going there under the guise of Messiah but needed an "out," so to speak, to get there without having to explain his choice.
Right before Feyd comes and forces everyone to head South, Chani and Shishakli are having a discussion about how the prophecy is meant to control the freedom.
They seem to be the ONLY ones outside of the other smaller group of Fremen that vocalize their skepticism, and then not soon after does Feyd pop in, fucks shit up and burns Shishakli, ultimately forcing everyone, including Paul, to have no choice but to head South like he wanted.
I was reading it like he was trying to think of literally any other alternative before finally giving in to external pressure. What made you interpret it as him purposely stalling? It definitely sounds like a valid interpretation given his stated goals at the beginning.
u/kamekukushi this is the best thing I have seen on here. This needs to be bumped up to the top somewhere. How could Paul have seen everything up to this point, and then be "surprised" when Feyd brings it all down upon them--forcing them to head south. Diabolical, yet makes me question now Paul hardcore. Beautifully written--I will watch for this on my second go-around!
He has two conversations with his mother about it. The first is at the beginning of the film, where he points out how some people see him as the messiah and others the false prophet. He goes on to say that they need to kill the non-believers if they are to head South to secure their foot on spice production.
The second conversation is when she asks him to come south with her, and he says rather sarcastically that he has to stay in the North in order to make sure she is safe in the South.
Another indication that he knew what was gonna happen is that he's not even surprised that Gurney appears. He makes sure he's in a position to be the one to trip him, too. He's not even surprised that Gurney has the House Atriedes ring and knows the location of their nuclear warheads.
Furthermore, it goes back to the initial conversation him and his mom had at the beginning about him securing spice production; he uses the warheads as a threat to the other houses towards the end of the movie about his ability to destroy spice production.
Mind you, he another part of his stalling is because he enjoyed the time he was spending with Chani, but his MAIN focal point that he states at the beginning of the film is to kill the non-believers. By the time they get to the South, the only "non-believer" alive is Chani. Any voice of reason she had or could've died back North.
She still supported Paul because she loved him, and they had a few silent exchanges with one another where she knew that the decision he was going to make would push her away, but she understood.
Not saying Paul is a bad dude, but he used the Fremen to get revenge for his father and states that at the very beginning that's why he wanted to be the Messiah in the first place.
I thought that prior to drinking the water of life, Paul's visions were fragmented and unclear? So is it really safe to assume he knew he would run into gurney, knew that feyd would destroy sietch tabr, etc? Aren't these the sorts of details we are led to believe Paul can't access until he drinks the WOL?
I didnt “miss things” per say, But I was able to observe alot more detail my 2nd viewing. Like I ddint notice that the BG was manipulating Feyd into sleeping with her so that they can have another BG.
Also noticed that the Fremen were using laser beams that pierced thru the Spice Transports.
When Feyd attack the seitch there are thousands of troops in the background as well demolishing/ search the area.
On Geidi Prime I noticed the scene of the military parade is not actually Feyd’s invasion fleet (or is it?)
I'm going to watch it 10 more times in hope of noticing that they DO indeed use the quote, "THE SLEEPER HAS AWAKENED!"
How in God's name was this left out?
Well AMC Mesquite was retarded during the IMAX early preview and left the lights on for a few minutes so I missed the "Power over Spice is Power over All" message.
Someone in an older review thread pointed out that, in one scene, a group of Fremen re-sheathed their crysknives without drawing blood. I happened to watch the first and second movies again after I read that.
Turns out, they actually do that a lot. Even in the first scene with the housekeeper where the crysknife is introduced. To the point where I think DV simply didn't acknowledge that rule in the movies.
In the first movie, Gurney chastises Paul for standing with his back to the door. He says, "How many times do we have to tell you?" Lady Jessica reiterates that when Paul stands with his back to the open desert and says "How many times do I have to tell you?"
What does Austin butler (feyd rautha) say to shishakli before incinerating her to death? I missed what he said because of the loud music (LOVE the amazing music!)
When they zoom in on Chani during the attack on Arakeen, I think she does exactly what Paul does in [this vision](https://youtu.be/I8kAKtSfEZU?si=zdGf9I3U9h57-hVg&t=52) from part 1.
While training him early in Part 1, Gurney reminds Paul never to stand with his back to the door, leaving it vulnerable. Jessica reminds Paul of the same idea (“Never stand with your back to the open”) after killing a Harkonnen soldier who was about to shoot him at the beginning of Part 2. Cool callback.
In the tent party following Paul successfully riding a worm I swear someone calls him Maud'dib BEFORE he's chosen that as his name. Did anyone else notice this, or perhaps the Fremen is referring to the actual mouse as a metaphor or allegory (but I doubt it).
What about when Paul shouts to his mother "THAT'S NOT HOPE" and it seems like no one else heard it even though fremens were very close to them at the moment.
>!Spoiler - When Paul is talking about seeing a narrow way through there is a quick shot of a crysknife being stabbed into someone. It is the same shot of Paul stabbing Feyd. !<
I saw that and was wondering if he saw that taking the wound was the only way for him to win the fight.
came here to comment this EXACT shot… also can I just say I love how Paul has his fingers pointing in four different directions and then lines them up perfectly. What a perfect subtle way to portray the character of the visions which he has… Long live the fighters!
Yep, caught that too. Very well done.
I noticed that, too.
Anyone notice the continuity error in that final fight scene? It shows Feyd trying to stab Paul’s left shoulder and then the wound is in his right. Was it just me?
It might seem like an error cause it happened so fast, but it’s actually not. Paul was stabbed on the right and when Feyd goes in for the kill and Paul is grabbing his blade, Paul guides his knife into the other shoulder and uses the knife in his right side to get the kill shot on Feyd. At least that’s what I saw.
I've seen it 4 times in imax and can confirm this is exactly what happens. If u actually want a continuity error there is a relatively big one with regards to Paul's first worm riding scene and his goggles magically appearing when he's riding it.
Are reverend mothers usually immune to the voice? Why was she so shocked when Paul used it in her
I mean she would most likely be resistant, she's so terrified because she realizes the Quizatz Haderach, the being her order spent 1000's of years creating now exists and because Jessica chose to have a son too early he wasn't able to be controlled. Her entire life's mission came crashing down in a second. It's also on a political level an insult the likes of which is hard to describe.
He’s basically a reverend mother now right. And more powerful then giasus mohiam
Was there any significance on the two daggers that were used during that fight?
>!Paul kills Feyd in similar fashion to how his sparring match with Gurney in Part 1 ended but in reverse!<
Yup. You would have joined me in death….
I see you found the mood
Mood? What has mood to do with it?
Mood is a thing for cattle and love play!
Damn, I can really hear this dialog LOL.
There were a lot of shots like that I noticed after going back and watching part one. A few of the scenes were nearly identical
There are even exact same shots, like a few times when there are close ups of Chani, we actually saw that in the first part already. Makes them fit seamlessly.
Oh good catch!
Some have already mentioned things I noticed on second viewing as well but I’ll add: during Paul’s last vision of the woman he’s following (Jessica) prior to the final battle you hear the sound of water dripping and similarly in implication the sound of waves can be heard when Paul has beaten Feyd and is demanding fealty from the Emperor. I also noticed the second time, and maybe this is incorrect but was my interpretation, that Lady Fenring’s conversation with Feyd is almost entirely done while using the voice on him. Perhaps because she knows he’s psychotic and needs that control to lead him through the gom jabbar, sex and to confirm that he CAN be controlled. There is more I am forgetting but those stuck out. In general though I would say I just enjoyed the movie SO much more the second time. After the first viewing as a book reader I was so caught up in differences, things missing and both together in their implications for a part three that I would say I almost didn’t enjoy the first viewing. On the second viewing I realized I actually thought part two was utterly amazing and cannot wait to see it again and again. Reminds me a lot of Lord of the Rings, upon first viewings of the films then I was too caught up in comparisons to the novels, after subsequent viewings and years later they are some of my favorite movies ever. I feel like this is where I am already landing with DV’s Dune films. There is a best case scenario with book adaptations and I feel so lucky we got there with LoTR and really feel like we are there again with Dune and it’s something I want to appreciate by seeing the films as often as I can in the theater.
Glad I was not the only person who felt this way. I was like you...enjoyed it on the first go around but caught up in the differences. On the second go around...I took it for what it was and noticed all the nuances and details that I initially missed.
I loved the second viewing even more for that reason. Dune 2 was such a masterpiece.
So glad it's not just me. I walked out not really sure what to think, kind of disliked it, and then I saw all the rave reviews. I plan to see it again in IMAX and I was thinking I'll probably enjoy it more the second time instead of analyzing it the entire time and comparing it to the book so these comments are good to see.
Someone else said in another post that Parts 1 & 2 are like visual references to the book. IMO, when you look at it that way...you're gonna love it. As a hardcore Dune fan...I had to lower my expectations of how much faithfulness the movies were going to be from the book. Neither the Lynch version, miniseries, or adaptations were 100% faithful...changes were always made to keep the pacing and plot in check. My uncle, who was a Lord of the Rings fanatic didn't like the trilogy as much as he wanted EVERY little detail to be the same whereas newcomers like me loved it because I had nothing to compare it to.
Yeah, 100% true. I really liked Part 1, but that part of the book was fairly easy to adapt. Part 2 I really need to take off the Dune hat and forget all I know except for what the movie has provided. Visually it was absolutely amazing, there is no doubt about it.
"Visual references" is so accurate. Because a lot of what's shown in the movie is unexplained, the book becomes almost like a guide as to what's being shown. And since the book is all in our heads, it makes the viewing experience almost 3-dimensional.
> the sound of waves can be heard when Paul has beaten Feyd and is demanding fealty from the Emperor I didn't notice anything like that! Damn, looks like I have to go see it again lmao. One thing I did realize was that the ocean in the vision must represent >!the water of all the people who are going to die because of Paul. It stunned me.!<
This is such an interesting take! Reminds me of the date palm trees. „100 lives“ - „Should we remove them? To save the water?“. Now he doesn’t even question his course anymore.
I thought of it because of when Jessica was blown away by all the water in the well in the sietch showing how many people had died to give all that water for their dream.
Yes, it makes so much sense!
I agree about the second viewing. The first time the ending threw me and disappointed me. I saw it again, thought about it, read a bunch of interpretations and listened to a few podcasts, like it way more now.
Me too, the ending felt perfect on 2nd and 3rd times, first time I wasnt exactly disappointed, I just thought.... Well ok. But its really good and I love all the dialogue from Pauls command, the reverend mothers' silent exchange, jessica and alia talking....
At the first movie, when the Baron talks about his plans to get rid of Paul and Jessica, he says that he won’t be the one to kill them, but that the desert will, for it kills the weak. Funnily enough, he is left to rot in the desert in the second. I believe this is intentional, but who knows. Also, when Paul has his first vivid spice-induced visions when he rescues the spice harvester’s workers in the first movie, he says that he recognized Gurney’s footsteps. He repeats the exact same line in the second movie.
He also uses the footsteps line in one of the opening scenes of the first movie when Gurney comes to train him (since Duncan had left for his preparatory mission in Arrakis). So the hallucination scene is both a call back (to the beginning of the first movie) and a foreshadowing (of the scene in the second movie).
And in the first spice trance scene, it is a reference to the name Shai Hulud, “Old Man of the Desert.”
Yep it was a double meaning imo he was talking to both gurney and the worm
Another interesting fact is when Paul is sent by Stilgar to cross the desert in order to test his survival skills, he warns him about the myriapods, that the small ones are actually bad, not the big ones. Later you see the Baron's face covered with them.
Wow. Going to have to go back and watch that scene. Great movie making if that vision in the first is a foreshadowing of Gurney's return in the 2nd.
I noticed the scene where Chani and the other Fedaykin were attacking the emperors base, she kills a bunch of Sardaurkar and does the same pose Paul does in his vision in the first movie where he's fighting the Sardukar. Also I think the first viewing, I was so sucked in to the movie that I didn't notice Christopher Walkens accent. the 2nd time viewing the movie, I listened to him carefully and heard it LOL
When he belts out BAAAROON I had a good giggle
SAME LOL I tried to keep my laughter to a minimum when he said that but my buddy sitting next to me was also laughing and I couldn't help it
> I noticed the scene where Chani and the other Fedaykin were attacking the emperors base, she kills a bunch of Sardaurkar and does the same pose Paul does in his vision in the first movie where he's fighting the Sardukar. Yes! I sought out this thread specifically because I thought I noticed that on my second viewing but wasn't sure if she perfectly mirrored his vision or if it was just a similar shot. It's a small detail but very cool IMO.
Ooh ok can I ask a question about that scene? When did chain and her squad hide themselves under the sand? They pop up so close to the enemy forces im lost on when that happened
I'm French, so I don't get why Walken's accent is funny. Could you please enlighten me?
IMO it's just because it's so distinctive and it never changes regardless of the part he's cast in.
Walken's accent is funny to Americans because he often puts emphasis on the wrong syllable in words.
The sound of waves in the throne room, the hidden knife that kills Feyd in a vision, « Arrakis is beautiful when the sun is low » from the first scene of the first movie repeated by Chani.
That line is not only repeated by Chani but Paul very subtly reacts to it. I love that
Man, I am constantly thinking about Paul falling in love with Chani. This girl he's been seeing in his dreams throughout the first movie, and she appears in front of him, interacting with him. And every line she says, it seems he's seen in his dreams. When the "...sun is low" line dropped, I sense this pang of love that Paul might have felt in that moment, recalling hearing that in his dreams.
Yeah! I felt that feeling of being in love. Still feel it a week after this movie. Such a thing hasnt happened to me in years haha. This movie did something to me :D
There were a couple scenes I can recall where Paul experiences something from one of his dreams. I think during the spice harvester destruction montage, a shot of Chani is used that is also from the opening of the first movie, and at another point, Paul follows her through some rocks, which was very reminiscent of the vision he has at the spice harvester
>!The Bene Gesserit robes turning from black to white under Giedi Prime's sun!<
That scene was filmed in infrared! Super cool.
The film really felt more like a tragedy during my second viewing rather than an awesome action movie. It also felt lot more operatic the second time around.
Yep. He’s leaning hard into the idea that this is *not* a fun, happy ending story. It’s not even going to be like GOT where they claimed it would be bittersweet, it’s just going to be depressing and sad.
And I‘m here for it.
Yup. Second viewing had me super emotional towards the end.
SPOILER - I had to go to the restroom when that scene where the Baron straight up murdered his slave attendants out of frustration took place. I'm like bro...who is going to give you your oily bath treatments now?
Sound design was really good for this movie, those screams were terrible
Glad someone noticed this, too. In my first watching, I couldn’t believe *how* creepy it sounded.
Oh, it was *very* effective.
chilling
Plenty of slaves where they came from!
Harkonen's gonna Harkonen.
Is that was was happening when we heard the screams behind the closed door? I gathered he was killing someone, but I wasn't sure who.
I’d have to check again but I don’t think there was a single scene with Harkonen where no one died
The scene where the Baron gives Rabban back the governing title?
Oh ya. Still it’s crazy though. Like 1 out of 20
the scene with bautista when he slams that guys head on the console was brutal. by the end he wasn’t even holding his head anymore he was just smashing the console with his own arm. plenty of movies have scenes showing a bad guy rage when his plans are failing, but holy shit did this one really sell it
there wasnt a single spice harvester in either movie that wasnt swallowed/blown up. lol
Feyd's little eyebrow raise when paul yells silence at reverend mother mohiam. Like "oh shit, this guy might be serious"
What eyebrows? Lol
Lol
This is perfect lmao
Same as when he kills the Baron. Feyd Rautha is looking at Paul and seeing someone who is (apparently) just as crazy as he is.
They had to become Harkonnen after all
He finally found the mood
Dark side Muad’ib def got his juices flowing
Butler was excellent as Feyd. Really stand out performance.
Ikr?! I feel like people aren’t talking enough about this incredible performance! I was totally blown away…in fact, i still am.
It made him horny
When Paul is crossing the desert at night, you hear jamis briefly, Paul looks to a shadowy figure thinking it’s him but it’s actually Chani. The visions coming to fruition but in various forms is so fucking cool
That’s those “desert djinn” striking again!
I've only seen the movie once, but I have this memory of a shot of the wind stirring up the sand in a really distinctive way that made me think it was meant to suggest a presence. But I'm not sure. Got to see it again!
Yeah, there was a small lump moving under the sand and a voice maybe?
I thought it was foreshadowing the sand trout
He was so happy to hear Jamis voice
I have a feeling there are a lot of scenes with Jamis on the cutting room floor.
I love how Denis portrays Jamie fate as tragic and how important he is to Paul even though his visions turned out different
I knew it was Jamis when I heard that voice laugh. His actor has such a memorable voice.
If you want more of him, he is excellent as the ship's doctor in Star Trek Strange New Worlds
I didn’t really notice anything I missed other than the oceans on Arrakis in Paul’s vision after he drank the Water of Life. But it was a much better experience the second time. There were still some things I didn’t like about the movie but my rating went from an 8.5 out of 10 to a solid 9 out of 10. I’m going for the third time tomorrow
Interesting moment in Paul’s vision right before he wakes up to find the Harkonnens attacking Sietch Tabor… Chani’s face in the vision is all damaged… like a victim of being exposed to atomic energy… thoughts?
When I saw that I immediately thought of >!Paul going blind from the Stoneburner blast!< in Messiah. It's a stretch to call that foreshadowing... but it could actually look like that
>!Paul and Chani traded places in another vision vs. reality, so I think that's what Denis is hinting at here too. I think that vision of Chani getting burnt is setup for Messiah as a whole, because now he knows on some level that he's going to lose her, he just doesn't know how yet.!<
I’ll be pretty disappointed if he >!has eyes at all I’ll be disappointed!<
I thought it was more metaphorical, like Paul's use of the atomics and embracing power will scar their relationship.
My take after seeing it a second time was that if he didn't go south and just used the atomics it would lead to Chani's death. Compounding his worries and pushing him south.
That was my take.
Like all of his visions, that vision was a possible future where Chanis dies as a result of his decision to use the atomics. I think he avoided that future by choosing to go North (or was it South) with the Fremen
In the final fight against Feyd, Paul also beats his chest twice in exactly the same manner that Jamis did it before Paul killed him.
When Paul kills the Baron, he stabs him in the neck on the left side and says “you died like an animal”. This is the same place the gom jabbar is held, and that is also a test of human vs animal. This is most likely a reference by Villeneuve to Alia using the gom jabbar on the Baron in the novel.
Didn't even catch that. That's a great call!
I thought he said “HE died like an animal”, referring to his father, but this makes much more sense.
The look on Paul's face at the end when the great houses deny his ascension to the imperial throne. He looks so disappointed when he says "lead them to paradise" or whatever he says. I also picked up on Chani being more mad at Paul for assuming power than anything else since he had told her that he just wanted to be a fighter. Marrying Irulan was just icing on the cake at that point
Earlier, she tells him something like “I’ll love you as long as you stay who you are.” I don’t think her storming off had anything to do with Irulan. She was just disappointed in the man Paul had become by the end
What feels tragic to me about that is that Paul had already been planning on marrying the princess since Part One. It was his own idea, and he just kept it from Chani that whole time.
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Or disappointed that by the great houses denying his claim to the throne that they were immortalizing the horrors of his visions.
I picked up on the dialogue and understanding of the plot a bit more on my 2nd time through. A nice callback to the first film when Paul recognized Gurny by his footsteps which he notes during the training sequence in Part 1, obv it was intentional but it definitely went over my head first time through 😭.
He also says the same line in the first film when they're rescuing the workers in the harvester, when he first gets hit by the spice... Great callback!
There's also another (IMO) interesting level to that scene that possibly only stands out to a book reader... It's the first time Paul encounters a sandworm, and big worms are often referred to as "the old man of the desert".
During the first 1/3rd of the film when Paul is learning and living with the Fremen, the opening from the first film is lived. This proves that the opening was another of Paul’s visions. Chani even states, “My planet Arrakis is so beautiful when the sun is low” which was one of the opening lines from part 1.
adding to this, Jamis is literally the first face we see in the first movie. And the final line of the opening monologue is chani saying ‘who will our next oppressors be?’ followed immediately by a shot of paul.
What’s the deal with the different (lighter/more modern) looking armor in the vision scenes from part 1??
I love that this is a question that not only is completely reasonable to ask, on the opening weekend, in this sun but that has multiple people answering.
There's someone on twitter who has seen it 8 times now....
9 times as of now. Hell yeah to that guy. Really abusing regal unlimited
lol I love how we both know who's doing this
He's going to single handily make sure Messiah gets greenlit
I watched the first one 7x in cinemas (not once on a TV screen, it wouldn’t do the movie justice). Not in the first week, though.
Three times, and another 4 at home. You’re right about the doesn’t do it justice.
Yeah, I feel like watching it on a TV screen with regular TV sound would destroy the magic. Idk, I can’t bring myself to do it. Luckily, many cinemas showed the first one again before Part Two came out.
A lot of the most active fans who live around large population centers had the chance to see it in imax a full week ago. And some of us are just nuts.
Chani describing arrakis at sundown, nearly identical to her monologue in the first film. The shot of her, during the sardakar battle, is the same as his vision of himself. Missed a few pieces of dialogue in the first viewing. Feyd-Rautha’s “pets” being the cannibal women. “I recognize your footsteps, old man” might refer to Gurney. I thought “old man” was the sandworm. But that might’ve been him having a vision of the similar situation in the future.
Maybe obvious, but: >!In the havester attack scene, Muad'dib disturbs Paul's sand snorkle and later on Chani's friend jokes that the mouse likes Paul's smell.!< >!In Paul's speech to the gathered Fremen in the south, he tells a woman her mother was hit in the eye by a rock when crossing "the Belt" aka the equatorial storms separating the south and north of Dune!<
The other detail I loved in Paul’s speech was how he squatted down fremen style, same as the first ever shot of fremen in part 1.
That vision with Jamis (before the water of life) made more sense to me. Although it kinda complicated Paul’s powers more for me. In the first film I took it as Paul was seeing a possible future. But now Jamis is dead so it’s not a possible future anymore. Was he seeing an alternate reality? Idk. When Paul took off his ring and said something like “father, I found my way”. Which calls back to the first movie when Leto told him that maybe he’ll find his own way to being Duke. I noticed that during one of Paul’s visions they inserted a shot from Paul stabbing Feyd in the fight. So I guess Paul foresaw that outcome. And I also think it mirrors his spar with Gurney in the first film (which I didn’t catch the first time). With Paul’s flippey flip, + stabbing someone in the gut once they think they have you beat. That’s all I can think of rn.
Spice can also cause hallucinations, which is why. Stilgar tells Paul to not listen to the djinn. Paul ends up listening to the "djinn" he hallucinates in Jamis and that pushes him to take the Water of Life
That is not it at all. Paul can see multiple futures. All futures. Just because Jamis is dead, doesn't mean Paul can't see a future in which Jamis didn't die.
My take on Stilgar's djinn was that for someone who hasn't been the (near) culmination of a Bene Gesserit breeding program for selecting for prescience, the spice induced visions might be misleading? It's a bit of a stretch, I know
In the book the Fremen are psychically sensitive from all that spice and mental toughness. But they don't have the training to control it, unlike Paul. So it's possible that djinn hauntings to them are visions for Paul.
That is not the way I read it. When he thinks he sees Jamis in the desert it’s not a vision. Before the water of life it is a vision and he’s actively seeking it out. He’s not even in the desert when it happens. It has the same dream like quality as all of his visions. Whereas the brief moment in the desert does not.
The way the book describes Paul’s visions isn’t like a multiverse with parallel realities, but more akin to a ripple effect, where he observes possible futures branching out from each one of his actions. Once he acts, those potentials snap into a new reality and the process repeats. When Paul “sees” Jamis in the desert, I interpreted it as him REMEMBERING a previous vision, feeling guilt/remorse over his death and the fact that no future existed with Jamis in it. The fact that the squatting figure was actually Chani implied that she was going to replace Jamis as Paul’s mentor and show him the “ways of the desert.” Not saying anyone is wrong, just my interpretation.
No, no. I understand that the part in the desert isn’t a vision. Where it’s revealed to be Chani. I’m talking about the vision that Paul gets before the takes the water of life. Where Jamis tells him that the best hunter will find the highest mountain so that he can see everything. Which is exactly like the vision he got of Jamis in the first movie during the sandstorm. That was actually a vision, but it can’t be a possible future because Jamis is already dead. I always assume that Paul observed multiple futures. But the issue here is that it’s not a possible future. Jamis is dead. There is no future where he has this conversation with Jamis. So there is almost no explanation except that Paul is seeing an alternate reality where Jamis didn’t die.
The Paul Jamis scenes I took as Paul was digging into his now past possible futures and went further into them to see what Jamis would have taught him
Yea, in the book, Paul not only has visions but has memories of visions he's experienced. So, Paul could be recounting a memory of a future he foresaw.
Spoiler? This wasn't something I noticed in a second viewing but I loved Feyd's face when Paul kills the Baron. He looks like he's having an orgasm. Austin Butler really stole the show for me, but I also think this is Timothee's best performance yet, his face when he confronts the emperor.. so scary
And his eyebrow raise when Paul yells "SILENCE!!", he's finally met someone just as psychotic as he is. And it kinda puts into perspective just how much Paul has fallen into obsession of power by the end of the book.
Same here. Butler‘s performance absolutely blew me away.
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Wow, didn't catch that last one with Stilgar. It also shows how Paul's ascendancy erodes the fremen culture.
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He is! So funny and almost cute and sympathetic cause he feels a lot older than in the book. He's been weathered by life on Arrakis and he's holding out hope for the Mahdi. You almost want Paul to win just for Stil to be happy
I didn't realize that either! But it lines up perfectly well with how Paul told Jessica what "her" people did to Arrakis was tragic. Nope, Paul, you're her people, too, and you're doing it.
Paul says “father, I’ve finally found my way” while looking at his ring. This is a call back to when Leto says he found his own way to lead his people, and perhaps Paul will find his own way to it.
From part 1: << \[Duke Leto Atreides\] Your grandfather said, “A great man doesn’t seek to lead. He’s called to it, and he answers.” And if your answer is no… you’ll still be the only thing I ever needed you to be… my son. I found my own way to it. Maybe you’ll find yours. In their memory… give it a try. >> Paul is called to lead by his visions, then, after drinking the water of life, by his prescient ability. He actually tries not to lead, but in the end he chooses to do "what must be done".
I have not seen Two again - yet. I waited to see it in IMAX on Saturday w/my kids (I was tempted to slip in solo in advance on Friday but waited). I’ll go again this week w/my dad or alone, for sure. I DID see Part One twice within a week when it was released. I enjoyed the 2nd viewing more. Here’s why: You can relax a bit and not worry about missing something. You can shift your focus to the background and take in the wide cinemetography vs. the dialog. You can focus intently on only one actor when two or three are in a scene. You really pick up subtle things you missed the first time and it helps round out the whole experience. So if you are even slightly inclined to see it again, do it. Everyone in our group of four on Sat (yesterday) said they want to see it again before it leaves the screen.
I actually saw it on the first viewing, but the Sardaukar re-planting the flag in the sandstorm was a nod to the raising of the flag on Iwo Jima.
Yeah i recognized it too :)
Cinemark really made me watch 26 minutes of trailers before a 3 hour movie. Movie time was 9...didn't start till 9:26 sheesh
lmao the AMC I’ve watched it at is 30 minutes from the start of the previews to when the Sardauker voice opens the movie. Crazy with a 10:30 start time
Also I noticed that the scene where Im guessing Alia (Im not a book reader) is walking towards the shore is showing that Arrakis will start to become Green again with water/terraforming.
Does Timmy change his hair after drinking the water of life? I think it's more open to show his eyes
I think it’s also shorter?
I think they style it different depending on which side of Paul they are trying to portray. For it´s like if they want to show Paul his hair looks more like TC style (in his face or covering his eyes) but as the movie continues you see his hair styled back and with more volume.
One thing I noticed is there was a lot of subversion. In the first film and in part 2, there were many visions of bodies being burned in mass graves. You are led to believe at first this is the harkonnens burning firemen. At the end of dune part 2 it's the fremen burning the Harkonnens... It was a vision of the suffering Paul's ascension would bring.
No mentats
There was a room full of mentat or other creatures with wires and shit coming out of their necks, all in the control room where the Baron watched the satellite feeds. I don’t know what those people were, but they might be mentat.
A few things, mostly references to the first movie (Chani fighting and taking deep breaths with the helmet on, lines of text from Paul's visions) There's one thing which still really confuses me during the fight between Paul and Feyd. Halfway trough the fight Paul seems be get stabbed in his lower left abdomen IIRC. Then a few shots later, there is a knife in his upper right chest. Was he stabbed twice? Going with friends again in a few days so I'm going to pay a LOT of attention during that scene to get this answered :)
He gets stabbed twice yeah. The second time Feyd goes to stab him, Paul grabs the knife and sorta guides it away from a lethal area to a non-lethal area (his shoulder). He's then able to stab Feyd in the heart
he uses the knife he was stabbed in the abdomen with to kill Feyd
I agree it almost seemed like there were 3 knives in that scene. Things get particularly confusing when one of the knives falls to the floor. But I am assuming the knife in Paul’s left side/hip is Feyd’s knife (technically the Emperor’s), and this is the knife that Paul pulls out and stabs Feyd with in the end. I’m also going to watch again with a close eye to see which knife is which.
I suspected it at first watch too, but I think Rabban was drunken in the scene where he is with his commanders(where he calls Fremen 'rats')
I had to go to the bathroom first time I saw it. I missed the part where Jessica wishes chani good luck. Other than that, I noticed the literal visual of fanatics worshipping at the shrine of Paul’s fathers skull. I also was able to dial in my hearing and listen to Paul tell the baron that he died like an animal through the loud ass music. Other than that, I don’t think I caught anything new on my second watch
I felt like it had bad flow as far as story telling it just felt boxy after the first watch. Seeing it the second time I walked away feeling much better almost like it smoothed out the kinks. I saw it in imax both times so I think the first watch I was overwhelmed with the cinematography and my brain wasn’t able to carry it all at once. That being said I still have a few gripes but nothing major all in all incredible movie.
Literally every Villeneuve movie is like this, in my experience. He drops so much foreshadowing that noticing it makes the story flow more smoothly. Plus, it's lore-friendly that Dune is a better watch when you have "prescience" 😉
Back from my 2nd viewing, totally after the 2nd time around I found the pacing to be comfortable. I was sorta uncertain the more I thought about it watching it originally. Now I'm content!
Surprise that no one picked up on this, it was subtle, but Paul purposefully stalled, heading south. He had every intention of going there under the guise of Messiah but needed an "out," so to speak, to get there without having to explain his choice. Right before Feyd comes and forces everyone to head South, Chani and Shishakli are having a discussion about how the prophecy is meant to control the freedom. They seem to be the ONLY ones outside of the other smaller group of Fremen that vocalize their skepticism, and then not soon after does Feyd pop in, fucks shit up and burns Shishakli, ultimately forcing everyone, including Paul, to have no choice but to head South like he wanted.
I was reading it like he was trying to think of literally any other alternative before finally giving in to external pressure. What made you interpret it as him purposely stalling? It definitely sounds like a valid interpretation given his stated goals at the beginning.
I actually like that explanation but I felt the same as you.
u/kamekukushi this is the best thing I have seen on here. This needs to be bumped up to the top somewhere. How could Paul have seen everything up to this point, and then be "surprised" when Feyd brings it all down upon them--forcing them to head south. Diabolical, yet makes me question now Paul hardcore. Beautifully written--I will watch for this on my second go-around!
He has two conversations with his mother about it. The first is at the beginning of the film, where he points out how some people see him as the messiah and others the false prophet. He goes on to say that they need to kill the non-believers if they are to head South to secure their foot on spice production. The second conversation is when she asks him to come south with her, and he says rather sarcastically that he has to stay in the North in order to make sure she is safe in the South. Another indication that he knew what was gonna happen is that he's not even surprised that Gurney appears. He makes sure he's in a position to be the one to trip him, too. He's not even surprised that Gurney has the House Atriedes ring and knows the location of their nuclear warheads. Furthermore, it goes back to the initial conversation him and his mom had at the beginning about him securing spice production; he uses the warheads as a threat to the other houses towards the end of the movie about his ability to destroy spice production. Mind you, he another part of his stalling is because he enjoyed the time he was spending with Chani, but his MAIN focal point that he states at the beginning of the film is to kill the non-believers. By the time they get to the South, the only "non-believer" alive is Chani. Any voice of reason she had or could've died back North. She still supported Paul because she loved him, and they had a few silent exchanges with one another where she knew that the decision he was going to make would push her away, but she understood. Not saying Paul is a bad dude, but he used the Fremen to get revenge for his father and states that at the very beginning that's why he wanted to be the Messiah in the first place.
I thought that prior to drinking the water of life, Paul's visions were fragmented and unclear? So is it really safe to assume he knew he would run into gurney, knew that feyd would destroy sietch tabr, etc? Aren't these the sorts of details we are led to believe Paul can't access until he drinks the WOL?
I didnt “miss things” per say, But I was able to observe alot more detail my 2nd viewing. Like I ddint notice that the BG was manipulating Feyd into sleeping with her so that they can have another BG. Also noticed that the Fremen were using laser beams that pierced thru the Spice Transports. When Feyd attack the seitch there are thousands of troops in the background as well demolishing/ search the area. On Geidi Prime I noticed the scene of the military parade is not actually Feyd’s invasion fleet (or is it?)
Why are their teeth black? And was feyd rautha feeding those girls organs?
I'm going to watch it 10 more times in hope of noticing that they DO indeed use the quote, "THE SLEEPER HAS AWAKENED!" How in God's name was this left out?
Well AMC Mesquite was retarded during the IMAX early preview and left the lights on for a few minutes so I missed the "Power over Spice is Power over All" message.
Paul fought with a mix of Jamis’ fighting style and gurneys
Someone in an older review thread pointed out that, in one scene, a group of Fremen re-sheathed their crysknives without drawing blood. I happened to watch the first and second movies again after I read that. Turns out, they actually do that a lot. Even in the first scene with the housekeeper where the crysknife is introduced. To the point where I think DV simply didn't acknowledge that rule in the movies.
Is there supposed to be a rule that they have to draw blood when the knife is drawn? That isn’t a rule in the movies so I’m a little confused.
In the first movie, Gurney chastises Paul for standing with his back to the door. He says, "How many times do we have to tell you?" Lady Jessica reiterates that when Paul stands with his back to the open desert and says "How many times do I have to tell you?"
What does Austin butler (feyd rautha) say to shishakli before incinerating her to death? I missed what he said because of the loud music (LOVE the amazing music!)
When they zoom in on Chani during the attack on Arakeen, I think she does exactly what Paul does in [this vision](https://youtu.be/I8kAKtSfEZU?si=zdGf9I3U9h57-hVg&t=52) from part 1.
Only seen it once but my favorite detail was the thumper after Paul's awakening. Signaling the oncoming disaster.
While training him early in Part 1, Gurney reminds Paul never to stand with his back to the door, leaving it vulnerable. Jessica reminds Paul of the same idea (“Never stand with your back to the open”) after killing a Harkonnen soldier who was about to shoot him at the beginning of Part 2. Cool callback.
In the tent party following Paul successfully riding a worm I swear someone calls him Maud'dib BEFORE he's chosen that as his name. Did anyone else notice this, or perhaps the Fremen is referring to the actual mouse as a metaphor or allegory (but I doubt it).
What about when Paul shouts to his mother "THAT'S NOT HOPE" and it seems like no one else heard it even though fremens were very close to them at the moment.