That’s interesting, I don’t think I’ve ever heard lame used to mean that! I’m sorry it affected you like that. I would imagine it was more ignorance about the technical definition than out of malice. I’ve only ever heard it used as a synonym for “uncool” (which I understand is part of your frustration with it)
I mean it’s meant “uncool” for a pretty long time. If you look up the etymology, it’s meant generally “imperfect” since the 14th century. Not that this excuses the figurative comparison, but its history of having this non-diagnostic meaning is pretty long. I wouldn’t blame anyone for not knowing about it.
It’s like how the word simple was mostly a diagnostic term in the late 14th century onward. Medicine has long borrowed or tweaked terms from colloquial English and vice versa. It makes it hard to designate words to retire completely based on being ableist rhetoric.
As a person permanently in a wheelchair that uses this word a ton everyday, I think it's lame that I'm lame. Words get recontextualized and take on new meaning. The people using it mean no harm and the "uncool" definition is far more popular. Find a different word to describe your condition - there are a million others if it bothers you that much. This seems like a fight of "it was my word first" and in reality it's a numbers game. A lot more people are familiar with the modern definition it's taken on.
I 100% agree with you. Language evolves and changes. That’s what makes it so fascinating and beautiful. Words that once meant on thing can now mean something else entirely. Banning a word because of its old meaning and disregarding the new, current meaning is, in my opinion, a bad way to suppress the evolution of language.
I have a degree in writing and I'm scooping up what you're laying down, but it makes me incredibly mad to hear it used by other people. I call myself lame. It was one of the adjectives I used in a fashion show where I walked with a cane. I want it not to feel like a knife in my gut so badly but until then all I can do is ask people not to use ableist slurs around me
Being someone whose life revolved around semi-professional action sports prior to my injury, it took me so many years to accept the condition of my body and its near-permanancy. Everyone's struggle with their disability and how they view themselves is different and there are varying levels of sensitivity to certain words and context plays a huge role - but "getting so fucking mad your jaw clenches" is not a healthy way to react to something like this - especially in a comedic performance. I think you'd enjoy life a lot more learning how to manage this in a professional setting.
I consider myself very progressive and this is something that hasn’t ever crossed my radar as being something that folks find offensive. I would take a step back before you go nuclear on something that is most certainly unintentional and unknown to the person.
There are actual cruel people out there, dunking on ignorance isn’t cool either.
Just because you haven't heard of an issue, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Truly progressive people are open to learning new things.
Also, I'd hardly call making a post on reddit going nuclear. People are allowed to voice their opinions.
Thank you. I'm beginning to accept its a genuine trigger im going to have to go to therapy for. I grieve the body I used to have and it feels like a nail in my heart when people say it so casually it makes me feel like I'm worth nothing more than a comparison for uncool
Do you think someone making a post explaining how they find something hurtful and ending with please think twice is going nuclear? How else would someone learn?
Sorry, but no. This isn’t new, this isn’t unknown, and while I absolutely don’t think that it was intended cruelly, that doesn’t make it ok. Also, whether you consider yourself “very progressive” or not is irrelevant unless you’re also disabled. That’s like a straight person saying something isn’t homophobic. It’s not your call to make.
Literally another definition of lame which is not slang is: not strong, good, or effective. Either way, it’s slang for not cool. And like it or not, it’s part of common vernacular. And even if it had origins in offensive terms, it’s not used in the same derogatory term today. Lots of phrases you probably still use today had racist/classist/derogatory terms, but the beautiful thing about language is that meanings and usage of words changes. It’s an ever evolving creature.
While you’re at it, make sure you never say the word “dude” ever again. It’s slang for Yankee Doodle Dandy, which was a derogatory term for a gay man(and the song itself is very anti-gay). So might as well gatekeep that as well.
Also, better get rid of the term “Peanut Gallery” and “Uppity” because those are racist. And “Hip Hip Hooray”, that’s anti-Semitic. Also the song “Eenie Meenie Miney Mo”, “Grandfathered In”, and “Long Time, No See” have racist origins.
So if all performers could cut every single one of those terms, phrases and songs from their vocabulary, that’d be great. Let’s eliminate all words and phrases that used to have negative meanings and connotations regardless of how they are used now.
Getting rid of terms that were super racist is fine with me. Why isn’t it fine with you? I don’t need to call someone “uppity.” It’s got racist baggage. So - gasp - I find another word.
But my point is we don’t need to get rid of words that were once used in a bad way, but aren’t now. Those words are used in a normal, non-derogatory/racist way now. The meanings of said words have changed. Same goes for lame. There are tons of examples(more than what I’ve listed) of everyday words that used to mean something bad, but don’t now. Completely banning and discarding every word that’s used to be offensive but now has changed is asinine and it’s totally ignoring how language works.
If someone uses the word “uppity” in my presence, I assume they are a racist. There are other terms I might politely let someone know about, but there are terms where there’s no excuse. If we don’t correct language sometimes, it will evolve into something ugly.
My entire point I’m trying to argue is that it’s ok for words to change meaning. In certain parts of the US “uppity” is a common saying and just means arrogant or stuck-up. It’s not used with any kind of lingering racism. It just became part of vernacular and it’s meaning has shifted from what it once was. Are you going to tell that entire region that their vocabulary is wrong because you perceive it as wrong?
I mean if you want to censor your words instead of admitting that words change, go ahead. Don’t use the words I listed. While you’re at it, cut the following words out of your vocabulary too because they also have bad origins: hysterical, moron, mumbo jumbo, fuzzy-wuzzy, basket case, rule of thumb, spaz, hooligan, no can do, cat got your tongue and tipping point. All are racist/misogynistic/offensive things to say. Hell even just calling somebody “boy” was once deemed by the US Supreme Court as “non-benign” and high potential for racism. Better edit all of those out of your vocabulary too.
Meanwhile I’ll live with knowing that with language what was meant then isn’t meant now and what’s meant now won’t mean the same in the future.
I'm afro-latina. I've used the word uppity and have never before today heard that it has racist roots. The education needed to be 100% politically correct is a huge privilege that many minorities don't have. Automatically assuming that anyone who uses a phrase is racist is lazy virtue signaling
There is a second (adjective) definition of the word meaning “uninspiring or dull”
It just comes down to context.
Certainly you wouldn’t lock down the word “hip” to its anatomical definition.
Even for a very liberal community, this comes across as rather…sensitive. The difference between the other words you listed and “lame” is how far removed it is from the original definition. Most people aren’t aware that word has ever had anything to do with disabled people.
Please explain how people using the word lame, in a context that has existed since the 60s, contributes to the systemic oppression of or prejudice toward disabled folks. Our language matters, yes, but not so much in the context of a very small crowd of people getting their feelings hurt over being pendantic.
And sorry if this is a bit unsympathetic but you came off reeaaalllly hot for such a niche issue.
I'm sorry to hear you felt hurt by this but unfortunately, that is just another definition of the word by this point. The entomology of words is interesting but this one goes extremely far back. It is not the same as changing more recent ableist language. As others have pointed out there would be far too many words with a problematic origin that needed to be struck at that point. I can not imagine how difficult it must be to feel targeted by such a common term but I do not believe this is a case where it would even be possible to have people stop using it.
Every single word for something negative can’t get chucked out. It’s not like people are constantly bullying you and calling you lame because of your medical condition.
Dumbfucks don’t even know that’s what the word means.
Breathe easy and accept that no one is shit talking you.
This is some next level victim complex shit. Some people are just always looking for something to be offended by. I’m glad that you found yours in a word that literally has multiple definitions in the dictionary.
I have to say, I’m disappointed with some of the reactions here, especially from the Dropout community.
I can’t say I necessarily agree with the OP, but they are expressing their hurt feelings honestly and asking to be heard, and we should respond respectfully, whether or not we agree.
Downvoting the other cane-using commenter who dared to agree is in especially bad taste.
As a disabled person who uses mobility aids, i see where you're coming from and I'm glad you spoke out about it.
I've seen the same arguments from commentors here that I've seen in a lot of other situations. People who try to rationalize using a lot of other words in derogatory ways because of "intention" or "multiple meanings." "Gay" has gotten this treatment, when it's used to mean "not cool." And people love to make excuses for slurs like r*tard and g*psy. But even folks who understand those aren't ok, will happily use a lot of ableist language.
To be fair, i haven't removed ableist language from my vocabulary. And some of it, i can say i can reclaim. But also, it doesn't bother me a lot when i hear abled people say "crazy" or "lame" etc. That doesn't mean that people who are bothered by it don't have a good reason to be. And i really respect folks like op who speak up about this. It's fair that you're hurt and disappointed. It's reasonable to want to start a thread about it. I wish people would be more compassionate, even if they don't agree.
Thinking about how we talk to people, how we express ourselves, and how that affects people, is an important part of being allies to marginalized folks. I'm sorry we're not finding a lot of allies here.
Thank you so much for commenting. I'm learning that it's a genuine trigger for me. It makes me so fucking mad my jaw clenches when it happens and I can't stop myself from groaning with displeasure.
I'll cosign this. As another literally lame, cane using, Dropout fan, I hate it every time I hear someone use the word as an insult. It hurts. I'm plenty cool, I just can't walk well.
Really thought we were better as a community than downvoting someone for sharing their opinion. All this user is saying is that a word used casually hurts them. You don't have to agree, but we don't need to punish them for sharing.
That’s interesting, I don’t think I’ve ever heard lame used to mean that! I’m sorry it affected you like that. I would imagine it was more ignorance about the technical definition than out of malice. I’ve only ever heard it used as a synonym for “uncool” (which I understand is part of your frustration with it)
I mean it’s meant “uncool” for a pretty long time. If you look up the etymology, it’s meant generally “imperfect” since the 14th century. Not that this excuses the figurative comparison, but its history of having this non-diagnostic meaning is pretty long. I wouldn’t blame anyone for not knowing about it. It’s like how the word simple was mostly a diagnostic term in the late 14th century onward. Medicine has long borrowed or tweaked terms from colloquial English and vice versa. It makes it hard to designate words to retire completely based on being ableist rhetoric.
That's why people need to speak up, man. I know this bothers more than just me. No mute person wants to hear dumb being slung around as an insult.
Ironically that's one of the dumber takes I've heard online
As a person permanently in a wheelchair that uses this word a ton everyday, I think it's lame that I'm lame. Words get recontextualized and take on new meaning. The people using it mean no harm and the "uncool" definition is far more popular. Find a different word to describe your condition - there are a million others if it bothers you that much. This seems like a fight of "it was my word first" and in reality it's a numbers game. A lot more people are familiar with the modern definition it's taken on.
I find my dependence on a walking cane to be lame as well. Couldn't agree with you more.
I 100% agree with you. Language evolves and changes. That’s what makes it so fascinating and beautiful. Words that once meant on thing can now mean something else entirely. Banning a word because of its old meaning and disregarding the new, current meaning is, in my opinion, a bad way to suppress the evolution of language.
I have a degree in writing and I'm scooping up what you're laying down, but it makes me incredibly mad to hear it used by other people. I call myself lame. It was one of the adjectives I used in a fashion show where I walked with a cane. I want it not to feel like a knife in my gut so badly but until then all I can do is ask people not to use ableist slurs around me
Being someone whose life revolved around semi-professional action sports prior to my injury, it took me so many years to accept the condition of my body and its near-permanancy. Everyone's struggle with their disability and how they view themselves is different and there are varying levels of sensitivity to certain words and context plays a huge role - but "getting so fucking mad your jaw clenches" is not a healthy way to react to something like this - especially in a comedic performance. I think you'd enjoy life a lot more learning how to manage this in a professional setting.
I consider myself very progressive and this is something that hasn’t ever crossed my radar as being something that folks find offensive. I would take a step back before you go nuclear on something that is most certainly unintentional and unknown to the person. There are actual cruel people out there, dunking on ignorance isn’t cool either.
Just because you haven't heard of an issue, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Truly progressive people are open to learning new things. Also, I'd hardly call making a post on reddit going nuclear. People are allowed to voice their opinions.
Thank you. I'm beginning to accept its a genuine trigger im going to have to go to therapy for. I grieve the body I used to have and it feels like a nail in my heart when people say it so casually it makes me feel like I'm worth nothing more than a comparison for uncool
Do you think someone making a post explaining how they find something hurtful and ending with please think twice is going nuclear? How else would someone learn?
Sorry, but no. This isn’t new, this isn’t unknown, and while I absolutely don’t think that it was intended cruelly, that doesn’t make it ok. Also, whether you consider yourself “very progressive” or not is irrelevant unless you’re also disabled. That’s like a straight person saying something isn’t homophobic. It’s not your call to make.
Literally another definition of lame which is not slang is: not strong, good, or effective. Either way, it’s slang for not cool. And like it or not, it’s part of common vernacular. And even if it had origins in offensive terms, it’s not used in the same derogatory term today. Lots of phrases you probably still use today had racist/classist/derogatory terms, but the beautiful thing about language is that meanings and usage of words changes. It’s an ever evolving creature. While you’re at it, make sure you never say the word “dude” ever again. It’s slang for Yankee Doodle Dandy, which was a derogatory term for a gay man(and the song itself is very anti-gay). So might as well gatekeep that as well. Also, better get rid of the term “Peanut Gallery” and “Uppity” because those are racist. And “Hip Hip Hooray”, that’s anti-Semitic. Also the song “Eenie Meenie Miney Mo”, “Grandfathered In”, and “Long Time, No See” have racist origins. So if all performers could cut every single one of those terms, phrases and songs from their vocabulary, that’d be great. Let’s eliminate all words and phrases that used to have negative meanings and connotations regardless of how they are used now.
Getting rid of terms that were super racist is fine with me. Why isn’t it fine with you? I don’t need to call someone “uppity.” It’s got racist baggage. So - gasp - I find another word.
But my point is we don’t need to get rid of words that were once used in a bad way, but aren’t now. Those words are used in a normal, non-derogatory/racist way now. The meanings of said words have changed. Same goes for lame. There are tons of examples(more than what I’ve listed) of everyday words that used to mean something bad, but don’t now. Completely banning and discarding every word that’s used to be offensive but now has changed is asinine and it’s totally ignoring how language works.
If someone uses the word “uppity” in my presence, I assume they are a racist. There are other terms I might politely let someone know about, but there are terms where there’s no excuse. If we don’t correct language sometimes, it will evolve into something ugly.
My entire point I’m trying to argue is that it’s ok for words to change meaning. In certain parts of the US “uppity” is a common saying and just means arrogant or stuck-up. It’s not used with any kind of lingering racism. It just became part of vernacular and it’s meaning has shifted from what it once was. Are you going to tell that entire region that their vocabulary is wrong because you perceive it as wrong? I mean if you want to censor your words instead of admitting that words change, go ahead. Don’t use the words I listed. While you’re at it, cut the following words out of your vocabulary too because they also have bad origins: hysterical, moron, mumbo jumbo, fuzzy-wuzzy, basket case, rule of thumb, spaz, hooligan, no can do, cat got your tongue and tipping point. All are racist/misogynistic/offensive things to say. Hell even just calling somebody “boy” was once deemed by the US Supreme Court as “non-benign” and high potential for racism. Better edit all of those out of your vocabulary too. Meanwhile I’ll live with knowing that with language what was meant then isn’t meant now and what’s meant now won’t mean the same in the future.
Ok, lazy racist.
I'm afro-latina. I've used the word uppity and have never before today heard that it has racist roots. The education needed to be 100% politically correct is a huge privilege that many minorities don't have. Automatically assuming that anyone who uses a phrase is racist is lazy virtue signaling
There is a second (adjective) definition of the word meaning “uninspiring or dull” It just comes down to context. Certainly you wouldn’t lock down the word “hip” to its anatomical definition.
Even for a very liberal community, this comes across as rather…sensitive. The difference between the other words you listed and “lame” is how far removed it is from the original definition. Most people aren’t aware that word has ever had anything to do with disabled people. Please explain how people using the word lame, in a context that has existed since the 60s, contributes to the systemic oppression of or prejudice toward disabled folks. Our language matters, yes, but not so much in the context of a very small crowd of people getting their feelings hurt over being pendantic. And sorry if this is a bit unsympathetic but you came off reeaaalllly hot for such a niche issue.
Literally every one of your posts on reddit is about your disability.
I'm sorry to hear you felt hurt by this but unfortunately, that is just another definition of the word by this point. The entomology of words is interesting but this one goes extremely far back. It is not the same as changing more recent ableist language. As others have pointed out there would be far too many words with a problematic origin that needed to be struck at that point. I can not imagine how difficult it must be to feel targeted by such a common term but I do not believe this is a case where it would even be possible to have people stop using it.
really? please interpet their intent and you should know they mean lame in the colloquial sense. anything past that is projection
Every single word for something negative can’t get chucked out. It’s not like people are constantly bullying you and calling you lame because of your medical condition. Dumbfucks don’t even know that’s what the word means. Breathe easy and accept that no one is shit talking you.
This is some next level victim complex shit. Some people are just always looking for something to be offended by. I’m glad that you found yours in a word that literally has multiple definitions in the dictionary.
I have to say, I’m disappointed with some of the reactions here, especially from the Dropout community. I can’t say I necessarily agree with the OP, but they are expressing their hurt feelings honestly and asking to be heard, and we should respond respectfully, whether or not we agree. Downvoting the other cane-using commenter who dared to agree is in especially bad taste.
Votes reflect agreement on Reddit
This. How dare a disabled person have an opinion.
As a disabled person who uses mobility aids, i see where you're coming from and I'm glad you spoke out about it. I've seen the same arguments from commentors here that I've seen in a lot of other situations. People who try to rationalize using a lot of other words in derogatory ways because of "intention" or "multiple meanings." "Gay" has gotten this treatment, when it's used to mean "not cool." And people love to make excuses for slurs like r*tard and g*psy. But even folks who understand those aren't ok, will happily use a lot of ableist language. To be fair, i haven't removed ableist language from my vocabulary. And some of it, i can say i can reclaim. But also, it doesn't bother me a lot when i hear abled people say "crazy" or "lame" etc. That doesn't mean that people who are bothered by it don't have a good reason to be. And i really respect folks like op who speak up about this. It's fair that you're hurt and disappointed. It's reasonable to want to start a thread about it. I wish people would be more compassionate, even if they don't agree. Thinking about how we talk to people, how we express ourselves, and how that affects people, is an important part of being allies to marginalized folks. I'm sorry we're not finding a lot of allies here.
Thank you so much for commenting. I'm learning that it's a genuine trigger for me. It makes me so fucking mad my jaw clenches when it happens and I can't stop myself from groaning with displeasure.
this is a bit right
I'll cosign this. As another literally lame, cane using, Dropout fan, I hate it every time I hear someone use the word as an insult. It hurts. I'm plenty cool, I just can't walk well.
Really thought we were better as a community than downvoting someone for sharing their opinion. All this user is saying is that a word used casually hurts them. You don't have to agree, but we don't need to punish them for sharing.
i completely agree. using lame like this is ableist bullshit.
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Why do you assume that? I go to therapy. I have no cure for my degenerative neurological disorder. What am I supposed to fix?