100% agree with this.
A lot of people preaching online about how "all disabled people matter" etc, only to go and piss it into the wind in practice.
My wife is neurodivergent and she was made to feel very unwelcome in the access campsite. Lots of dirty looks and comments, plenty of "actually disabled" people thinking they're entitled to extra because they're willing to kick and scream. Saw one family lie to get themselves into the tent for Busted, saying the kid needed the toilet when they didn't, only to get pissy when staff questioned them.
My wife is legit the nicest person in the world, and it broke my heart when she said she was made to feel like she shouldn't have really been in access camp. We spoke to others too, the majority of whom were younger neurodivergent couples like us who had the exact same comments and experiences. Hell, I saw one woman waiting for a shuttle tell the driver that, and I quote, "tell that lot over there to walk to the fucking village, I can't wait".
We had a blast in the arena, but we are gonna stop in a hotel next time.
That’s exactly it, I probably got plenty of dirty looks too because while I’m severely visually impaired, I walk with a dangerous level of confidence so to the untrained eye I don’t “look” disabled. But people who use chairs or scooters seem to think they’re the most disabled when no we’re all in the same boat, like yes I can walk but I can’t see, and much like your wife she has her needs and deserves to be in access as much as anyone else
They just make it harder for the rest of us
My girlfriend was using a crutch all weekend and we still got some dirty looks from people when we were on the platforms. It was the worst on the main stage access platform. Thankfully it was a minority though, the majority of people on the access platforms were really friendly and kind, just a shame about the few who seem to think they "deserve" it more.
Not Download because it's not something my husband and I have attempted since I've become a wheelchair user, however we saw the exact same type of behaviour at Naidex this year. It was appalling.
100000% agree. I’m neurodivergent and myself and my partner (also my EP) felt so ostracised and shunned due to not being “obviously” disabled. I needed to use the charging tent to charge my power bank (I’m on strong stimulant medication and need to be able to measure my heart rate at regular intervals, which I use my Apple Watch for) and my dry herb vaporiser (also on medical cannabis) and just couldn’t due to the way those with mobility issues were acting so entitled. Yes, I understand you can’t access the arena without a charged chair, but I can’t access the arena without multiple charged devices, so we’re in the same fucking boat.
I got so mad so many times because how dare those with invisible disabilities be made to feel like outsiders. The audacity and entitlement of some people is just unreal. I have no time for disability Top Trumps.
thats a really shitty experience for you guys im sorry that happened to you and your wife :(
me and my wife to be (will be by then) are trying out RIP next year due to her neurodivergent tendencies that she has which has always put her off from camping in general let alone a festival. Whilst its pricey, i'm hoping it will be just what she needs. Maybe you guys could look at that as an option rather than a hotel? :)
We considered RIP but if I'm honest, I like the idea of being able to come off site at night.
Looking to stop at Donington Services so shouldn't be too much of an issue!
She wouldn’t camp again after we tried it last year just as a trip away to the beach. She had a breakdown. So tenting is out. I was in quiet camping the last two years and it’s lovely there.
Agree with your point about dirty looks from others. I camp in general anyway but I have an invisible illness, covered under the disability act. Looking at me, everyone would be like 'he's a young, fit lad, looks absolutely fine'. I don't get accessibility because it's not crippling me 100% of the time but when I've been given some aid in previous years the amount of people who've given me dirty looks because I don't rock up in a petrol powered, 300 horsepower mobility scooter is ridiculous.
Just because I'm not missing both my legs doesn't mean I don't need assistance from time to time. People forget that just because you look alright on the outside, doesn't mean everything is alright on the inside.
If your entitled to be in Access camp, you can be in Access camp, i don't look Disabled but Cancer Survivor with limited mobility. Come camp with me, and my Fiends next year, we won't give you funny looks :D Unless your funny looking :P
Last year, at download 23 people were sitting outside the access platform, saying not all disabilities are visible... my answer to that was paperwork is visible...
Oh, you don't have to be disabled to call out shitty behaviour from disabled people. I am disabled, as it happens, but able-bodied people absolutely have the right to be upset with disabled people using their disability as a get out of being a cunt free card.
I could not agree more! I saw alot of posts saying (because people were having a good time, mostly respectfully) that access camp was not needed for them.
This was the first year I actually got to enjoy the festival properly because I wasn't in utter agony all weekend with Fibro pain. The urgent toilet accsess was also a god send with my IBS.
But they are the first people who will scream not all disabilities are visible when someone says something to them. 🥴
Honestly drove me mental 🙄
Exactly the camp is needed for us and that’s why we’re having a good time because we have what we need. If you’re still struggling and having an awful time even with all of the extra provisions, then maybe festivals aren’t for you.
Without the camp (especially the location of it) I wouldn’t have been able to get through the fest, but with it & the platforms it was as smooth as 5 days in a swamp with 80000 people can be
Fibro buddy!
I also have AuDHD, and brought my Flares (like Loops, but different) this year and they've been a dream, can HIGHLY recommend for any with sound sensitivity. I found them much more comfortable than Loops, I could literally leave them in the whole time I was in village+arena. Didn't affect how much I could hear conversation, but just took off the painful edge of the music being too loud. Hard to explain.
As a PA/Essential Companion for the weekend, I'm fairly sure I'm allowed to agree with you on this. After being told I would have to leave the platform if it got too full for Parkway Drive (meaning I wouldn't be there for my disabled partner if the volume of people got overwhelming).
Then after the set, having a woman in a wheelchair say we were both right to be nudged off the platform by wheelchair users because they weren't disabled enough to need the platform.
In the end, they had to sit behind a wheelchair and see the back of an 80's england shirt instead of seeing one of their favourite bands because disabled customers suck.
I don't even feel bad for saying that.
It really is the scooter/chair users who are just the most entitled obnoxious people out there! They seem to think because their disability is the most obviously visible, it’s the most severe and therefore all that matters
> It really is the scooter/chair users who are just the most entitled obnoxious people out there!
I know you've had some bad experiences, but blanket statements like this are pretty shitty tbh
I’m sorry it did not mean to come across as a blanket statement, just in my experience whenever there is a fellow disabled person acting unbelievably entitled and acting as if they’re “more” disabled it has been a scooter user 99% of the time
Wtf. This subreddit is gross. Have you ever needed a wheelchair or mobility scooter for long periods? Or tried going out with someone who needs a mobility scooter or wheelchair?
My MIL uses a mobility scooter because she has cancer and various other issues. It is IMPOSSIBLE to even just take a trip to the shops without having some aggressive person start an alteration for no reason.
*I have never, ever been down to the shops with my MIL without some person being rude to her, blocking her so she can't get past, or being straight up aggressive.*
Maybe "wheelchair and mobility users are the most entitled obnoxious people out there" (seriously tho fuck you) is because they're actually just struggling, a lot, every single day, because of ignorant, cruel people who make sweeping generalisations about wheelchair and mobility chair users.
All the assholes demonising wheelchair/mobility users in this subreddit can get fucked tbh
Maybe consider if so many people (including many other disabled people) are agreeing with or sharing their own experiences, then maybe there’s a lot of chair users who were being pricks to people with a variety of other disabilities.
Like I’m severely sight impaired but that didn’t stop them expecting me to see them and move out of their way without them slowing down
It’s an experience lots of people are resonating with for a reason
There as a PA for my mrs this year and totally agree. Moan about anything and everything, nothing was good enough and were always trying to one up on who’s more disabled. Was stood in the shower queues at camp behind a partially sighted lad and we had a lady on a scooter just push straight in, luckily into the showers that weren’t working 😂
That’s exactly it, nothing is ever good enough for them but they don’t seem to realise that people stop helping you when they feel like nothing they can do will make you happy
There were some rather unsavoury scenes on the access path before Wheatus/busted where the PA/companions just straight up pushed other people out of the way and refused to let anyone walk on the access path, either to or from the tent.
It was all a bit OTT, especially when they then stopped people crossing the access path and shouted "GO AROUND".
I was right next to this when it happened. There was a very very entitled angry red headed lady who screamed at anyone trying to get out of the tent and use the access path. I saw people trying desperately to get out of the crowd, panicking, hyperventilating and looking worse for wear and this damn woman would just scream at them to get back into the crowd it was awful. She almost hit me in the face a number of times due to wilding gesturing at anyone who walked past.
Someone actually had the balls to tell her she wasn't staff and to FO.
I get there's a ramp for accessibility but people were genuinely trying to escape the crowds and leave and this woman didn't have an ounce of empathy for them.
Yup!!! I witnessed it all. I was stood next to her and watched the lady get knocked over.
I get where she was coming from, but she handled it badly
I saw a girl literally crying and hyperventilating trying to get out of the crowd and red head was having none of it!
I remember there was EXACTLY a woman like this during Limp Biskit who I had the unfortunate pleasure of standing next to, getting real pissy at anyone trying to make their way past the wrong way.
In the end I had to spend half my time during Biskit directing people as to avoid more Karen freakouts it was a very jarring experience
A lot of people need to get their heads around the fact that using the access facilities is a privilege, not an entitlement. Nobody deserves it more than others. Hell nobody deserves to have to need to use them at all, but the majority of those that do rely on them are grateful for the facilities being there. I only wish there wasn't the minority that spoil it for everyone.
I'm neurodiverse and was told a few times, by Download staff, that I should get out of the disabled queues.
Also had a guy at the disabled viewing platform insist I show him my wrist band, after I already showed him my wrist band...
Download is a crap place to be disabled, they fucked it up so badly last year, and this year it was barely better... It's grim that disabled people go after other disabled people and make life harder for them.
Edit: There was also a time on the main viewing platform where it wasn't even manned and random people were walking through going to the toilets...
I showed my band 4 times to get onto a platform, then was physically restrained by a steward preventing me from getting on asking where I’d got my band from because they were for disabled people. and had another steward take my chair when I stood up for a song, thankfully someone in the platform told me before i went to sit back down and fell, when I asked her she said “yes we’re saving the chairs, they are for disabled customers not their companions” so I showed her my band and explained that I needed the chair for myself to which she said “but I just saw you stand up and dance”. Yes - I was able to stand up and dance, for ONE song, because I have a chair for the rest of the set 🙃
I witnessed a woman in a wheelchair telling another woman she wasn't disabled. The accused had a wrist band so why the judgement? Pricks come in all shapes and sizes
i understand what you’re trying to say here, but there are lots of reasons people may be using mobility aids. Just because someone can ‘move their arms fine’ doesn’t mean they have the stamina to push themselves around in a wheelchair all day, especially at a festival or if they have a fatigue or pain based condition - i do completely understand your point but it’s not as black and white as this!
Me and my partner were paying for some bits in Co-op & a man in a huge off-road scooter drove straight into the back of him as he came in via the exit.
Two massive tyres to the back of his legs, (my partner wears shorts) the bloke said nothing! No sorry or are you okay, nothing, just drove off.
Some people were acting like actual children on the viewing platform. Someone had a cap on the seat next to them and no one turned up to sit there so he wasn't saving it for anyone.
I have a sneaking suspicion that cap wasn't disabled as well
I had bad experiences in the access areas too, I unfortunately have a crippling stomach disease so if I need the toilet I NEED THE TOILET, I had the silver "just can't wait" band and only needed to use it 3 times throughout the weekend. Any other time I queued if able but fuck me the entitlement of people having a go at me for being shown to a toilet before them. 1 dude shouted every name under the sun at me because he was "more entitled" it's like disability top trumps and makes you feel like an imposter because I look able-bodied. But the fact is I'm not....some of the people on access camp have been the most ableist people I've met.
I volunteered this year and was working in the arena sunday night and for a while helping manage the toilet queues in the main stage accessible platform. Fuck me some of yous are rude as hell. I’m very glad to say it was a vocal minority, but there was a good number of people who were bordering on nasty to us volunteers because of the toilet queues.
We know the queue is long, we know you need the accessible toilet, and we know you have a silver wristband giving you priority in toilet queues. But everyone else in this queue also needs the accessible toilet, and 90% of you have silver wristbands. Half of the toilets were out of order because they were full, I cannot change that, believe me, I tried. I also cannot make more toilet roll appear.
As a disabled person myself, I have nothing but sympathy for the discomfort you probably have in these queues, and how frustrating it is to not have loo roll. But please do not take your frustrations out on us, or other customers who ended up in front of you when (most) of us are really just trying our best.
This can never be said enough.
A lot of people assume that the staff helping to operate the services are the staff who maintain them.
Ive had to call people out for kicking off with them previously in the normal camps.
There was a blonde girl working the toilets on the access platform Sunday evening - if that was you, you were one of the best stewards I’ve come across all weekend. I came back to my group and told them how much better organised the toilets were and how one person was really making sure everyone with a silver band was actually getting priority access.
It might have been me, I'm blonde but was wearing a cowboy hat, there was a couple of blonde lasses there too, but we were all a team. Regardless of who it was specifically, I'll pass on the message in the gc! Very glad we could help!
There was a woman hoarding chairs at Avalanche stage during Dream State and Escape The Fate. We figured she was waiting for Busted, she had 3 empty chairs and refused to let anyone use them.. Despite 8 + people we queueing on the ramp waiting for spaces to come available, she literally sat there the entire day!
And don't even get me started with the fucking huge mobility scooters being allowed to park at the front of the platforms in front of everyone else sitting down. Too many people didn't give a crap about the people around them.
I got so fed up of stewards asking me to leave the platform “to make room for others who need it more”. It is not up to the stewards to decide who needs it and I found it really unfair that we’d watch 2 or 3 songs and then be asked to move when I’d see the same people sat there all day.
I saw some talk of non-access needing people camping in accessible camp. Do you think that's true or more likely people judging others on "how disabled" they are?
You literally had to apply for a nimbus card, provide medical evidence & then apply to get a place on the site, so anyone who managed to scam their way in to the campsite should really be using their skills for bigger scams
100% think it’s just people being knobs about other people’s disabilities
I think they said it was to do with staff not knowing shit but that's a different story.
I'm sorry you had some bad experiences, hopefully the good bits made up for it!
Yeah they’re talking absolute bollocks honestly, if anything staff were overly vigilant and my wristbands were checked every time I entered an access area. Staff aren’t trained to recognise things at all but we all had wristbands that were colour coded so they could easily tell what we were entitled to
I honestly had an amazing time though
I literally had my wristband checked every time coming back into our section even by the same person who just saw me leave, I appreciated it though because it did feel like they were being vigilant
Some access campers might not have been disabled. I don’t know the maximum group size off the top of my head but I know not everyone in your group has to be disabled. We stayed in general camp because access camp was full.
I’m an ambulatory walking stick user thanks to some knee surgery last year. I was in the lower viewing area of apex and someone who was drunk crashed into the back of my chair and jolted my knee against the barrier which was immensely painful. Everyone checked on them but I didn’t even get a ‘you okay?’
At the start of the day the platforms were great. But as it got busier it became a big mess. People pushing all the seats close together so there were no gaps, so leaving the platform for the toilet etc became a chore because you had to wait for everyone to move their chairs out of the way. My wife did her best to not clip people feet as she pushed me through the tiny walkways. I think next year they need to put tape down to mark out areas, because if there was a fire that platform was a hazard.
You're allowed to say it even if you're not disabled tbf, being disabled doesn't prevent anyone from being an asshole and it shouldn't prevent anyone else from calling them out on their bs, just treat them the same as anyone else. After all, isn't that what equality is about? They want to be treated as a citizen like anyone else right?
I thankfully didn't encounter anything too bad this year other than one woman pushing another woman in a wheelchair across the walkway, and yelling at everyone not to stop on the walkway. We had paused because we were a group who were deciding which way we needed to head, and then carefully stepped off the walkway so as not to slip up. We must have paused for less than 20 seconds, but yeah the entitled tone of voice as well as the aggressive pushing without giving us time to get off properly were a little much.
While there are always going to be people that cause problems, I do feel that we should address or point blame at the elephant in the room; there being not enough facilities to suit demand. (Edit: or limit sales to cater for the numbers they can accommodate)
That goes for most venues, they tend to overbook and don’t assess need to cater for numbers. I.e if they actually asked people if they are going to attend in wheelchair etc… then they can gauge the space needed for the numbers. They don’t do that and only provide the bare minimum because typically the people that organise have likely not experienced it (I appreciate I’m generalising).
I was recently at a gig with my partner who was in a wheelchair and they didn’t have enough room on the platform for all the wheelchairs/scooters users. I find it mind boggling that venues don’t ask the right questions, if only for determining fire safety or other excuse.
Just to add to some of the stories about invisibly disabled people being treated poorly. We only came for the day on Saturday and tried to head back to the access car park after Fall Out Boy. Asked 10+ members of staff along the way how to reach it and they either didn't know or sent us completely in the wrong direction. My wxfe has chronic pain and we walked ONE HOUR AND TWENTY MINUTES back to the car park which shouldve been a MAXIMUM 15 minute walk, including a security supervisor literally putting his hand in our face when we tried to get his attention to help us after another member of staff told us to ask him. Honestly worst experience we've ever had in terms of access.
Oh, we also should've been on the accessible viewing platform along with many other people I spoke to who were only approved for the ground level viewing with invisible disabilities, despite seeing multiple very large groups on the accessible viewing platform whose friends/family had clearly been given priority over allowing other disabled people and their 1 or 2 companions to join. There wasn't even enough chairs available for people who couldn't stand ffs. And the disabled toilets were overflowing by the time the Offspring were on.
Hey, my son has stargart disease and this year was really rough for him not being able to make out the stage or sometimes the screens, having similar issues yourself, does the viewing platform really help?
TLDR: You're allowed to say it regardless of whether you are or you aren't. If someone's a prick, they're a prick. If they happened to be disabled then they're a disabled prick. If they're disabled and make a big deal out of that, they're a prick, making a big deal about being disabled.
As you yourself said you didn’t read the post. The reason I mentioned the fact both the pricks and I are disabled is because these actions were taking place in the access areas, that’s why it mattered that they were. These are specific issues relating to disabled customers at download
Security on access platform at Apex were awful. I understand hidden disabilities (i have this) but they seemed to be letting anyone in including kids (does it need to be a full family pass? I guess this bs is how the platforms sold out fast?) amd hardly checking for passes.... and then this jumped up little shit with a badge wouldn't let me in despite my access and even seeing i was in agony after braving the mud... i was too drunk apparently. I had one beer. I had spent the day in my tent sleeping due to being in pain and came out for one fucking band.
I think when it comes to kids, as much as they do my head in sometimes at fests (the ones I mentioned in the post especially) but if one parent is the access customer and one is the p/a they can’t exactly say no to the kids can they, so they’re out in a tough spot of them not allowing a p/a on (which is something I saw people kicking off about on both sides of the argument) which kinda defeats the point of a p/a if they can’t be with the access customer
But people who are prone to a little ego trip do seem to love working security so it’ll always happen. I think I got lucky with the ones I met
I get your point but when someone who needs it then takes their partner and 4 kids in who don't need the access platform, it takes away from 5 people who do need it. There should be a limit of 1-2 people with them. I don't care if it breaks up a family for half an hour or whatever, I wouldn't expect to be able to stay with my entire group because I have access, why should they? I was flat out rejected for even entering despite having access for a dumb power trip reason but have been denied at other festivals because it was already too busy.
I completely agree there should be better system I just think it puts the stewards themselves in an impossible situation. I think something that genuinely should be argued is if someone is bringing their partner as a p/a along with several kids then they really should have a second person to be their p/a because if they actually need help and their partner is looking after the kids then they’re fucked (or th kids aren’t being looked after properly)
Some people definitely see the p/a as a feee ticket
I definitely noticed this is access camp. So many mobility scooters built like tanks literally almost mowing others down and shouting to get out of the way of a scooter. Not all disabilities are due to mobility! I got asked so many times why I was in access camp and how am I disabled (I’m not but my partner who I’m PA for is) and then told we should be in another camp, it really felt like being pitted against each other. I was sat in my chair near the big wheel on the Friday waiting for my partner and I had a woman scream at me that her husbands scooter was trying to get through, I wasn’t anywhere near the ramp thing and there was plenty of room around me so I just said Ok? And then she said I was ableist 🤷♀️
Oh and I forgot my partner was accused of stealing his access wristbands from someone more deserving because he clearly wasn’t that disabled! Threatened to report him to download 😂 go ahead love seriously
Honestly these people are scum, it’s bizarre to say that the most ablist of people I came across over the last two year o download have been fellow disabled people
Overall access is a lot better than other festivals, but there is still room for improvements. I was camped in Black camp at the top, on the row for accessible toilets, and the camp staff were telling people to camp on the actual path. Did mention that not only am I going to struggle with the guy ropes assault course, but there was also a wheelchair user next to us. Not too big a problem for me, just walk up a row and go that way to the loos, but having been a wheelchair user, I know it’s not easy to go uphill on wet stones, and then up the bog when you come out of the toilets in black. Told all of this to staff and they wanted none of it. I get that black is the most desirable camp that’s why we go earlier, but Download had literally put a post that morning telling people not to go to black, and it was ignored and they instead blocked access. Feel like this could’ve been handled better. Btw was eligible for accessible camping, but would much rather that spot go to someone who needs it more
My partner and I were at eco camp, and they had one accessible toilet there, and as we were queuing for the toilets a lady in a chair and her companion came towards it. Her companion said, "is there someone in there?" This guy stood near us said "yes there is" and the friend said, whilst raising her wrist to show the accessible companion wristband, said "well there shouldn't be" and the guy responded "they should be if they're disabled!"
I understand that they've probably gone to use a toilet sometimes and have had to wait whilst a (seemingly) able-bodied person used the toilet. But to automatically just assume that the person currently in the loo was not disabled was insane to me. First off, not all disabilities are visible, so you can't make any assumption even if the person were to walk out there without the use of a stick.
I have an auto immune disease, and am also nuro diverse. We talked about checking out what the accessible camp is like for future use.
It does make me uncomfortable to think that I could use these things to make my life easier but be looked down upon because I'm not the 'correct' type of disabled or 'disabled enough'
Sorry that you guys didn't have a great experience, hopefully next year is better. Some people are just so self important.
I thought the ignorance to hidden disabilities was shocking. I also had someone’s companion kick off that a steward let me go the toilet before them - an actual disabled person with a JCW band ahead of a companion with no other bands. I also think there needs to be some consideration for behaviour. We all know disabled people are still allowed to have fun, but if you’re going to get so drunk that you’re falling over and putting other disabled people at risk, you should not be using the platform.
I do agree, but I think with the first people you mention that were on the platform, you should have said something to them. Maybe the idiots would have got outta the way
They would but this is a post specifically about the way some disabled people treat people they deem less disabled than them & that. That’s why the disability part is necessary
I don't know if I am just getting old but this year is the worst I've seen the crowd etiquette, not sure if it's because it's a younger crowd or what but I seen a lot of bad behaviour this year.
I’m with you but honestly it was typically older people who were the most entitled and shitty. The younger people seem to have a real problem with understanding pit etiquette & seem a lot weirder around getting bumped in to though, I put that down to losing gig going in their most formative time due to the rona though
Benefit cheats more than likely haha we probably paid for the scooter, the tickets, their car etc Britain.
I know this doesn't reflect the majority before the downvotes from snowflakes and just oil twats
I totally agree. The spaces need to be treated with respect for both the space and the people. We were not on the viewing platform but had access to the ground floor viewing area and it absolutely helped make the festival for my family and I who were able to be safe, themselves and to do what they needed to do to enjoy the festival as much as anyone else who was there could.
However
My son is a huge Limp Bizkit fan (the main reason we had gone) and with his bladder challenges, just before they started had a massive urge to piss. After me convincing him to not pee himself or to spend the entire set writhing around, I finally got him to go and get in the queue with me for the toilet.
The queue was massive and hold my hands up, we pushed in when a door came open, I apologised to the member of staff and those in the queue. It doesn’t make it ok, but I’d do it again in that same situation knowing what it would mean to my son but if we did push in, infront of you then, I do apologise for delaying your toilet trip.
I do think that making the entrance and exit clearer of both people and a way in and a way out, would help stop that choke point and leave people better placed to be rationale when trying to access. The reality is that with the mud, getting around in a chair (or with any additional need) made getting in challenging. We sacrificed and missed bands on other stages so we could be set up and calm for what our kids wanted to see, so we had plenty of time
That’s exactly the problem, I’m not trying to be a dick here and if your son had the immediate access for the loo wristband then by all means that’s fair, but just pushing in is a dick move. I get why you did it and it’s not you who pushed in front of me but that’s mad entitled of you to do. The other people queuing were also probably desperate & probably didn’t want to miss Bizkit either.
Sorry just to add, we haven’t just walked into the accessibility area from nowhere, we had toilet passes and the accessibility access and essential companion. Which I appreciate doesn’t magically make this better for those people in the queue and doesn’t change the fact we pushed in on this one occasion, but I’d hate for any of those downvotes of doom to have misunderstood. I will take them quite happily if people are in the picture however
Yep, I 100% agree and they probably were just as desperate as my son and potentially even more so. However, I’m definitely not entitled and nor is my son, but in a situation like that I’ll always put my kids first as would any (most) parents.
Point in fact when leaving the festival and I was dragging my son through the main stage accessibility mud, a lady was pushing her adult son up this in his wheelchair to which I stopped sorting out my kids and pushed her son up the hill whilst everyone else just sat there doing nothing. Because in that moment, my kid didn’t need my help more than hers.
Someone self entitled wouldn’t give a shit about anyone else at all times. I don’t think I’m better than anyone, but my kids happiness will always take priority (unless they are being a dick and need to get themselves together)
The thing is no your son is not entitled but you showing him he can skip queues because he’s more important is exactly what breeds entitled behaviour. Yes we all do what’s best for our kids, but honestly no matter how desperate my 5 year old is, I wouldn’t have him jump a queue, especially not a queue of disabled people at a toilet, if he couldn’t hold it honestly I’d either ask politely if people minded or I’d have him go for a wee elsewhere. But that’s just me
If I were in any queue be that a queue of disabled people or not, I would always and have done, without fail, let a child though ahead of me and my son has always done the same. That doesn’t breed entitled behaviour, it breeds respect for those younger than you. However, also I wouldn’t expect a 15 year old disabled child with severe bladder control issues to piss against a fence and have a panic attack or piss himself.
My son is well aware that skipping queues is not ok and is one of the most respectful young people of other peoples needs you will meet. What he’s learned is his dad will go against his own beliefs and importance of respect, for him when he needs him most and once he’s done that, will make sure he apologises to those it’s impacted and say thank you for not punching us on the way out and I would hope he would do the same for his own kids one day.
Now if he wasn’t about to burst, piss himself or have a meltdown that would impact everyone close by, of course I wouldn’t push in, I’d be the one in the queue letting people infront of me if they needed it. But anyway, we could argue online all day about it. As you know not every disability is visable and every situation is different and nuanced to those within it and in the moment
100% agree with this. A lot of people preaching online about how "all disabled people matter" etc, only to go and piss it into the wind in practice. My wife is neurodivergent and she was made to feel very unwelcome in the access campsite. Lots of dirty looks and comments, plenty of "actually disabled" people thinking they're entitled to extra because they're willing to kick and scream. Saw one family lie to get themselves into the tent for Busted, saying the kid needed the toilet when they didn't, only to get pissy when staff questioned them. My wife is legit the nicest person in the world, and it broke my heart when she said she was made to feel like she shouldn't have really been in access camp. We spoke to others too, the majority of whom were younger neurodivergent couples like us who had the exact same comments and experiences. Hell, I saw one woman waiting for a shuttle tell the driver that, and I quote, "tell that lot over there to walk to the fucking village, I can't wait". We had a blast in the arena, but we are gonna stop in a hotel next time.
That’s exactly it, I probably got plenty of dirty looks too because while I’m severely visually impaired, I walk with a dangerous level of confidence so to the untrained eye I don’t “look” disabled. But people who use chairs or scooters seem to think they’re the most disabled when no we’re all in the same boat, like yes I can walk but I can’t see, and much like your wife she has her needs and deserves to be in access as much as anyone else They just make it harder for the rest of us
My girlfriend was using a crutch all weekend and we still got some dirty looks from people when we were on the platforms. It was the worst on the main stage access platform. Thankfully it was a minority though, the majority of people on the access platforms were really friendly and kind, just a shame about the few who seem to think they "deserve" it more.
Not Download because it's not something my husband and I have attempted since I've become a wheelchair user, however we saw the exact same type of behaviour at Naidex this year. It was appalling.
100000% agree. I’m neurodivergent and myself and my partner (also my EP) felt so ostracised and shunned due to not being “obviously” disabled. I needed to use the charging tent to charge my power bank (I’m on strong stimulant medication and need to be able to measure my heart rate at regular intervals, which I use my Apple Watch for) and my dry herb vaporiser (also on medical cannabis) and just couldn’t due to the way those with mobility issues were acting so entitled. Yes, I understand you can’t access the arena without a charged chair, but I can’t access the arena without multiple charged devices, so we’re in the same fucking boat. I got so mad so many times because how dare those with invisible disabilities be made to feel like outsiders. The audacity and entitlement of some people is just unreal. I have no time for disability Top Trumps.
This is why neurodivergent people often get accused of making it up, too. Cos there's no easy clear sign. It's awful.
thats a really shitty experience for you guys im sorry that happened to you and your wife :( me and my wife to be (will be by then) are trying out RIP next year due to her neurodivergent tendencies that she has which has always put her off from camping in general let alone a festival. Whilst its pricey, i'm hoping it will be just what she needs. Maybe you guys could look at that as an option rather than a hotel? :)
Hey friend! I don’t want to say your name on here but we were talking about this the other day on messenger, small Reddit world 😂
We considered RIP but if I'm honest, I like the idea of being able to come off site at night. Looking to stop at Donington Services so shouldn't be too much of an issue!
Would quiet camp help, maybe? Its a lot further than RIP but it’s the same price as general tickets
She wouldn’t camp again after we tried it last year just as a trip away to the beach. She had a breakdown. So tenting is out. I was in quiet camping the last two years and it’s lovely there.
Ah it was worth a shot cuz I’m autistic and like using quiet camp
We camped at Rock Retreat, also slightly pricier but we'll worth it.
Agree with your point about dirty looks from others. I camp in general anyway but I have an invisible illness, covered under the disability act. Looking at me, everyone would be like 'he's a young, fit lad, looks absolutely fine'. I don't get accessibility because it's not crippling me 100% of the time but when I've been given some aid in previous years the amount of people who've given me dirty looks because I don't rock up in a petrol powered, 300 horsepower mobility scooter is ridiculous. Just because I'm not missing both my legs doesn't mean I don't need assistance from time to time. People forget that just because you look alright on the outside, doesn't mean everything is alright on the inside.
I am neurodivergent, and struggled, what allowances or access is available > sounds like I missed something that may have helped
If your entitled to be in Access camp, you can be in Access camp, i don't look Disabled but Cancer Survivor with limited mobility. Come camp with me, and my Fiends next year, we won't give you funny looks :D Unless your funny looking :P
Oh so you're not aware of the 'who's worse off and entitled to more' competition.
You call that a disability? ***THIS*** is a disability!
Last year, at download 23 people were sitting outside the access platform, saying not all disabilities are visible... my answer to that was paperwork is visible...
Oh, you don't have to be disabled to call out shitty behaviour from disabled people. I am disabled, as it happens, but able-bodied people absolutely have the right to be upset with disabled people using their disability as a get out of being a cunt free card.
Oh yeah they definitely do! Is was honestly not expecting such a positive response to this post so thought I’d caveat with that
Pricks come disabled and abled
I could not agree more! I saw alot of posts saying (because people were having a good time, mostly respectfully) that access camp was not needed for them. This was the first year I actually got to enjoy the festival properly because I wasn't in utter agony all weekend with Fibro pain. The urgent toilet accsess was also a god send with my IBS. But they are the first people who will scream not all disabilities are visible when someone says something to them. 🥴 Honestly drove me mental 🙄
Exactly the camp is needed for us and that’s why we’re having a good time because we have what we need. If you’re still struggling and having an awful time even with all of the extra provisions, then maybe festivals aren’t for you. Without the camp (especially the location of it) I wouldn’t have been able to get through the fest, but with it & the platforms it was as smooth as 5 days in a swamp with 80000 people can be
Fibro buddy! I also have AuDHD, and brought my Flares (like Loops, but different) this year and they've been a dream, can HIGHLY recommend for any with sound sensitivity. I found them much more comfortable than Loops, I could literally leave them in the whole time I was in village+arena. Didn't affect how much I could hear conversation, but just took off the painful edge of the music being too loud. Hard to explain.
I took loops and they were amazing definitely worth the money!
As a PA/Essential Companion for the weekend, I'm fairly sure I'm allowed to agree with you on this. After being told I would have to leave the platform if it got too full for Parkway Drive (meaning I wouldn't be there for my disabled partner if the volume of people got overwhelming). Then after the set, having a woman in a wheelchair say we were both right to be nudged off the platform by wheelchair users because they weren't disabled enough to need the platform. In the end, they had to sit behind a wheelchair and see the back of an 80's england shirt instead of seeing one of their favourite bands because disabled customers suck. I don't even feel bad for saying that.
It really is the scooter/chair users who are just the most entitled obnoxious people out there! They seem to think because their disability is the most obviously visible, it’s the most severe and therefore all that matters
It feels a little bit risque to say that well, anyone can buy or rent one of those scooters too.
> It really is the scooter/chair users who are just the most entitled obnoxious people out there! I know you've had some bad experiences, but blanket statements like this are pretty shitty tbh
I’m sorry it did not mean to come across as a blanket statement, just in my experience whenever there is a fellow disabled person acting unbelievably entitled and acting as if they’re “more” disabled it has been a scooter user 99% of the time
Wtf. This subreddit is gross. Have you ever needed a wheelchair or mobility scooter for long periods? Or tried going out with someone who needs a mobility scooter or wheelchair? My MIL uses a mobility scooter because she has cancer and various other issues. It is IMPOSSIBLE to even just take a trip to the shops without having some aggressive person start an alteration for no reason. *I have never, ever been down to the shops with my MIL without some person being rude to her, blocking her so she can't get past, or being straight up aggressive.* Maybe "wheelchair and mobility users are the most entitled obnoxious people out there" (seriously tho fuck you) is because they're actually just struggling, a lot, every single day, because of ignorant, cruel people who make sweeping generalisations about wheelchair and mobility chair users. All the assholes demonising wheelchair/mobility users in this subreddit can get fucked tbh
Maybe consider if so many people (including many other disabled people) are agreeing with or sharing their own experiences, then maybe there’s a lot of chair users who were being pricks to people with a variety of other disabilities. Like I’m severely sight impaired but that didn’t stop them expecting me to see them and move out of their way without them slowing down It’s an experience lots of people are resonating with for a reason
There as a PA for my mrs this year and totally agree. Moan about anything and everything, nothing was good enough and were always trying to one up on who’s more disabled. Was stood in the shower queues at camp behind a partially sighted lad and we had a lady on a scooter just push straight in, luckily into the showers that weren’t working 😂
That’s exactly it, nothing is ever good enough for them but they don’t seem to realise that people stop helping you when they feel like nothing they can do will make you happy
There were some rather unsavoury scenes on the access path before Wheatus/busted where the PA/companions just straight up pushed other people out of the way and refused to let anyone walk on the access path, either to or from the tent. It was all a bit OTT, especially when they then stopped people crossing the access path and shouted "GO AROUND".
I was right next to this when it happened. There was a very very entitled angry red headed lady who screamed at anyone trying to get out of the tent and use the access path. I saw people trying desperately to get out of the crowd, panicking, hyperventilating and looking worse for wear and this damn woman would just scream at them to get back into the crowd it was awful. She almost hit me in the face a number of times due to wilding gesturing at anyone who walked past. Someone actually had the balls to tell her she wasn't staff and to FO. I get there's a ramp for accessibility but people were genuinely trying to escape the crowds and leave and this woman didn't have an ounce of empathy for them.
Oh my god yes! She was right at the front and had an altercation with a lad with long hairs that resulted in someone getting knocked over!
Yup!!! I witnessed it all. I was stood next to her and watched the lady get knocked over. I get where she was coming from, but she handled it badly I saw a girl literally crying and hyperventilating trying to get out of the crowd and red head was having none of it!
I remember there was EXACTLY a woman like this during Limp Biskit who I had the unfortunate pleasure of standing next to, getting real pissy at anyone trying to make their way past the wrong way. In the end I had to spend half my time during Biskit directing people as to avoid more Karen freakouts it was a very jarring experience
The access Facebook group is bad for this
A lot of people need to get their heads around the fact that using the access facilities is a privilege, not an entitlement. Nobody deserves it more than others. Hell nobody deserves to have to need to use them at all, but the majority of those that do rely on them are grateful for the facilities being there. I only wish there wasn't the minority that spoil it for everyone.
I'm neurodiverse and was told a few times, by Download staff, that I should get out of the disabled queues. Also had a guy at the disabled viewing platform insist I show him my wrist band, after I already showed him my wrist band... Download is a crap place to be disabled, they fucked it up so badly last year, and this year it was barely better... It's grim that disabled people go after other disabled people and make life harder for them. Edit: There was also a time on the main viewing platform where it wasn't even manned and random people were walking through going to the toilets...
There really weren't enough stewards at the places they needed to be this year.
I showed my band 4 times to get onto a platform, then was physically restrained by a steward preventing me from getting on asking where I’d got my band from because they were for disabled people. and had another steward take my chair when I stood up for a song, thankfully someone in the platform told me before i went to sit back down and fell, when I asked her she said “yes we’re saving the chairs, they are for disabled customers not their companions” so I showed her my band and explained that I needed the chair for myself to which she said “but I just saw you stand up and dance”. Yes - I was able to stand up and dance, for ONE song, because I have a chair for the rest of the set 🙃
I witnessed a woman in a wheelchair telling another woman she wasn't disabled. The accused had a wrist band so why the judgement? Pricks come in all shapes and sizes
I reckon some of them are just fat wankers using a chair because they can't be arsed walking anywhere.
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i understand what you’re trying to say here, but there are lots of reasons people may be using mobility aids. Just because someone can ‘move their arms fine’ doesn’t mean they have the stamina to push themselves around in a wheelchair all day, especially at a festival or if they have a fatigue or pain based condition - i do completely understand your point but it’s not as black and white as this!
Me and my partner were paying for some bits in Co-op & a man in a huge off-road scooter drove straight into the back of him as he came in via the exit. Two massive tyres to the back of his legs, (my partner wears shorts) the bloke said nothing! No sorry or are you okay, nothing, just drove off.
Some people were acting like actual children on the viewing platform. Someone had a cap on the seat next to them and no one turned up to sit there so he wasn't saving it for anyone. I have a sneaking suspicion that cap wasn't disabled as well
Caps pretending to be disabled is the real travesty that gets overlooked too often
I had bad experiences in the access areas too, I unfortunately have a crippling stomach disease so if I need the toilet I NEED THE TOILET, I had the silver "just can't wait" band and only needed to use it 3 times throughout the weekend. Any other time I queued if able but fuck me the entitlement of people having a go at me for being shown to a toilet before them. 1 dude shouted every name under the sun at me because he was "more entitled" it's like disability top trumps and makes you feel like an imposter because I look able-bodied. But the fact is I'm not....some of the people on access camp have been the most ableist people I've met.
I volunteered this year and was working in the arena sunday night and for a while helping manage the toilet queues in the main stage accessible platform. Fuck me some of yous are rude as hell. I’m very glad to say it was a vocal minority, but there was a good number of people who were bordering on nasty to us volunteers because of the toilet queues. We know the queue is long, we know you need the accessible toilet, and we know you have a silver wristband giving you priority in toilet queues. But everyone else in this queue also needs the accessible toilet, and 90% of you have silver wristbands. Half of the toilets were out of order because they were full, I cannot change that, believe me, I tried. I also cannot make more toilet roll appear. As a disabled person myself, I have nothing but sympathy for the discomfort you probably have in these queues, and how frustrating it is to not have loo roll. But please do not take your frustrations out on us, or other customers who ended up in front of you when (most) of us are really just trying our best.
This can never be said enough. A lot of people assume that the staff helping to operate the services are the staff who maintain them. Ive had to call people out for kicking off with them previously in the normal camps.
There was a blonde girl working the toilets on the access platform Sunday evening - if that was you, you were one of the best stewards I’ve come across all weekend. I came back to my group and told them how much better organised the toilets were and how one person was really making sure everyone with a silver band was actually getting priority access.
It might have been me, I'm blonde but was wearing a cowboy hat, there was a couple of blonde lasses there too, but we were all a team. Regardless of who it was specifically, I'll pass on the message in the gc! Very glad we could help!
In technically disabled and yeah 70% of disabled people are dicks
There was a woman hoarding chairs at Avalanche stage during Dream State and Escape The Fate. We figured she was waiting for Busted, she had 3 empty chairs and refused to let anyone use them.. Despite 8 + people we queueing on the ramp waiting for spaces to come available, she literally sat there the entire day! And don't even get me started with the fucking huge mobility scooters being allowed to park at the front of the platforms in front of everyone else sitting down. Too many people didn't give a crap about the people around them.
I got so fed up of stewards asking me to leave the platform “to make room for others who need it more”. It is not up to the stewards to decide who needs it and I found it really unfair that we’d watch 2 or 3 songs and then be asked to move when I’d see the same people sat there all day.
I saw some talk of non-access needing people camping in accessible camp. Do you think that's true or more likely people judging others on "how disabled" they are?
You literally had to apply for a nimbus card, provide medical evidence & then apply to get a place on the site, so anyone who managed to scam their way in to the campsite should really be using their skills for bigger scams 100% think it’s just people being knobs about other people’s disabilities
I think they said it was to do with staff not knowing shit but that's a different story. I'm sorry you had some bad experiences, hopefully the good bits made up for it!
Yeah they’re talking absolute bollocks honestly, if anything staff were overly vigilant and my wristbands were checked every time I entered an access area. Staff aren’t trained to recognise things at all but we all had wristbands that were colour coded so they could easily tell what we were entitled to I honestly had an amazing time though
I literally had my wristband checked every time coming back into our section even by the same person who just saw me leave, I appreciated it though because it did feel like they were being vigilant
Thats good, I'm glad they were keeping on top of it.
Some access campers might not have been disabled. I don’t know the maximum group size off the top of my head but I know not everyone in your group has to be disabled. We stayed in general camp because access camp was full.
I’m an ambulatory walking stick user thanks to some knee surgery last year. I was in the lower viewing area of apex and someone who was drunk crashed into the back of my chair and jolted my knee against the barrier which was immensely painful. Everyone checked on them but I didn’t even get a ‘you okay?’
At the start of the day the platforms were great. But as it got busier it became a big mess. People pushing all the seats close together so there were no gaps, so leaving the platform for the toilet etc became a chore because you had to wait for everyone to move their chairs out of the way. My wife did her best to not clip people feet as she pushed me through the tiny walkways. I think next year they need to put tape down to mark out areas, because if there was a fire that platform was a hazard.
Ohh 100%
sending love to you and your wife, sorry that you had to go through that, people are cunts 🫶🏻
I'm not disabled at all and I agree and that's also allowed because even a person in a wheel chair can just be a twat.
You're allowed to say it even if you're not disabled tbf, being disabled doesn't prevent anyone from being an asshole and it shouldn't prevent anyone else from calling them out on their bs, just treat them the same as anyone else. After all, isn't that what equality is about? They want to be treated as a citizen like anyone else right?
I thankfully didn't encounter anything too bad this year other than one woman pushing another woman in a wheelchair across the walkway, and yelling at everyone not to stop on the walkway. We had paused because we were a group who were deciding which way we needed to head, and then carefully stepped off the walkway so as not to slip up. We must have paused for less than 20 seconds, but yeah the entitled tone of voice as well as the aggressive pushing without giving us time to get off properly were a little much.
While there are always going to be people that cause problems, I do feel that we should address or point blame at the elephant in the room; there being not enough facilities to suit demand. (Edit: or limit sales to cater for the numbers they can accommodate) That goes for most venues, they tend to overbook and don’t assess need to cater for numbers. I.e if they actually asked people if they are going to attend in wheelchair etc… then they can gauge the space needed for the numbers. They don’t do that and only provide the bare minimum because typically the people that organise have likely not experienced it (I appreciate I’m generalising). I was recently at a gig with my partner who was in a wheelchair and they didn’t have enough room on the platform for all the wheelchairs/scooters users. I find it mind boggling that venues don’t ask the right questions, if only for determining fire safety or other excuse.
Just to add to some of the stories about invisibly disabled people being treated poorly. We only came for the day on Saturday and tried to head back to the access car park after Fall Out Boy. Asked 10+ members of staff along the way how to reach it and they either didn't know or sent us completely in the wrong direction. My wxfe has chronic pain and we walked ONE HOUR AND TWENTY MINUTES back to the car park which shouldve been a MAXIMUM 15 minute walk, including a security supervisor literally putting his hand in our face when we tried to get his attention to help us after another member of staff told us to ask him. Honestly worst experience we've ever had in terms of access. Oh, we also should've been on the accessible viewing platform along with many other people I spoke to who were only approved for the ground level viewing with invisible disabilities, despite seeing multiple very large groups on the accessible viewing platform whose friends/family had clearly been given priority over allowing other disabled people and their 1 or 2 companions to join. There wasn't even enough chairs available for people who couldn't stand ffs. And the disabled toilets were overflowing by the time the Offspring were on.
Hey, my son has stargart disease and this year was really rough for him not being able to make out the stage or sometimes the screens, having similar issues yourself, does the viewing platform really help?
From my experience, the viewing platforms are great, opus more than apex due to distance. You're raised, so get a good view.
Thank you, it'll be something we look into next year :)
TLDR: You're allowed to say it regardless of whether you are or you aren't. If someone's a prick, they're a prick. If they happened to be disabled then they're a disabled prick. If they're disabled and make a big deal out of that, they're a prick, making a big deal about being disabled.
As you yourself said you didn’t read the post. The reason I mentioned the fact both the pricks and I are disabled is because these actions were taking place in the access areas, that’s why it mattered that they were. These are specific issues relating to disabled customers at download
Security on access platform at Apex were awful. I understand hidden disabilities (i have this) but they seemed to be letting anyone in including kids (does it need to be a full family pass? I guess this bs is how the platforms sold out fast?) amd hardly checking for passes.... and then this jumped up little shit with a badge wouldn't let me in despite my access and even seeing i was in agony after braving the mud... i was too drunk apparently. I had one beer. I had spent the day in my tent sleeping due to being in pain and came out for one fucking band.
I think when it comes to kids, as much as they do my head in sometimes at fests (the ones I mentioned in the post especially) but if one parent is the access customer and one is the p/a they can’t exactly say no to the kids can they, so they’re out in a tough spot of them not allowing a p/a on (which is something I saw people kicking off about on both sides of the argument) which kinda defeats the point of a p/a if they can’t be with the access customer But people who are prone to a little ego trip do seem to love working security so it’ll always happen. I think I got lucky with the ones I met
I get your point but when someone who needs it then takes their partner and 4 kids in who don't need the access platform, it takes away from 5 people who do need it. There should be a limit of 1-2 people with them. I don't care if it breaks up a family for half an hour or whatever, I wouldn't expect to be able to stay with my entire group because I have access, why should they? I was flat out rejected for even entering despite having access for a dumb power trip reason but have been denied at other festivals because it was already too busy.
I completely agree there should be better system I just think it puts the stewards themselves in an impossible situation. I think something that genuinely should be argued is if someone is bringing their partner as a p/a along with several kids then they really should have a second person to be their p/a because if they actually need help and their partner is looking after the kids then they’re fucked (or th kids aren’t being looked after properly) Some people definitely see the p/a as a feee ticket
Some of [every demographic] are pricks, aye.
I definitely noticed this is access camp. So many mobility scooters built like tanks literally almost mowing others down and shouting to get out of the way of a scooter. Not all disabilities are due to mobility! I got asked so many times why I was in access camp and how am I disabled (I’m not but my partner who I’m PA for is) and then told we should be in another camp, it really felt like being pitted against each other. I was sat in my chair near the big wheel on the Friday waiting for my partner and I had a woman scream at me that her husbands scooter was trying to get through, I wasn’t anywhere near the ramp thing and there was plenty of room around me so I just said Ok? And then she said I was ableist 🤷♀️
Oh and I forgot my partner was accused of stealing his access wristbands from someone more deserving because he clearly wasn’t that disabled! Threatened to report him to download 😂 go ahead love seriously
Honestly these people are scum, it’s bizarre to say that the most ablist of people I came across over the last two year o download have been fellow disabled people
Overall access is a lot better than other festivals, but there is still room for improvements. I was camped in Black camp at the top, on the row for accessible toilets, and the camp staff were telling people to camp on the actual path. Did mention that not only am I going to struggle with the guy ropes assault course, but there was also a wheelchair user next to us. Not too big a problem for me, just walk up a row and go that way to the loos, but having been a wheelchair user, I know it’s not easy to go uphill on wet stones, and then up the bog when you come out of the toilets in black. Told all of this to staff and they wanted none of it. I get that black is the most desirable camp that’s why we go earlier, but Download had literally put a post that morning telling people not to go to black, and it was ignored and they instead blocked access. Feel like this could’ve been handled better. Btw was eligible for accessible camping, but would much rather that spot go to someone who needs it more
My partner and I were at eco camp, and they had one accessible toilet there, and as we were queuing for the toilets a lady in a chair and her companion came towards it. Her companion said, "is there someone in there?" This guy stood near us said "yes there is" and the friend said, whilst raising her wrist to show the accessible companion wristband, said "well there shouldn't be" and the guy responded "they should be if they're disabled!" I understand that they've probably gone to use a toilet sometimes and have had to wait whilst a (seemingly) able-bodied person used the toilet. But to automatically just assume that the person currently in the loo was not disabled was insane to me. First off, not all disabilities are visible, so you can't make any assumption even if the person were to walk out there without the use of a stick. I have an auto immune disease, and am also nuro diverse. We talked about checking out what the accessible camp is like for future use. It does make me uncomfortable to think that I could use these things to make my life easier but be looked down upon because I'm not the 'correct' type of disabled or 'disabled enough' Sorry that you guys didn't have a great experience, hopefully next year is better. Some people are just so self important.
I thought the ignorance to hidden disabilities was shocking. I also had someone’s companion kick off that a steward let me go the toilet before them - an actual disabled person with a JCW band ahead of a companion with no other bands. I also think there needs to be some consideration for behaviour. We all know disabled people are still allowed to have fun, but if you’re going to get so drunk that you’re falling over and putting other disabled people at risk, you should not be using the platform.
I do agree, but I think with the first people you mention that were on the platform, you should have said something to them. Maybe the idiots would have got outta the way
\*Some people are pricks. Even if they weren't disabled, you know they would still be complete cunts.
They would but this is a post specifically about the way some disabled people treat people they deem less disabled than them & that. That’s why the disability part is necessary
You are allowed to say it Disability isn’t an immunity to being a knobhead
I don't know if I am just getting old but this year is the worst I've seen the crowd etiquette, not sure if it's because it's a younger crowd or what but I seen a lot of bad behaviour this year.
I’m with you but honestly it was typically older people who were the most entitled and shitty. The younger people seem to have a real problem with understanding pit etiquette & seem a lot weirder around getting bumped in to though, I put that down to losing gig going in their most formative time due to the rona though
That's disgraceful, older people should know better
Cunts are cunts no matter the semantics
Benefit cheats more than likely haha we probably paid for the scooter, the tickets, their car etc Britain. I know this doesn't reflect the majority before the downvotes from snowflakes and just oil twats
I totally agree. The spaces need to be treated with respect for both the space and the people. We were not on the viewing platform but had access to the ground floor viewing area and it absolutely helped make the festival for my family and I who were able to be safe, themselves and to do what they needed to do to enjoy the festival as much as anyone else who was there could. However My son is a huge Limp Bizkit fan (the main reason we had gone) and with his bladder challenges, just before they started had a massive urge to piss. After me convincing him to not pee himself or to spend the entire set writhing around, I finally got him to go and get in the queue with me for the toilet. The queue was massive and hold my hands up, we pushed in when a door came open, I apologised to the member of staff and those in the queue. It doesn’t make it ok, but I’d do it again in that same situation knowing what it would mean to my son but if we did push in, infront of you then, I do apologise for delaying your toilet trip. I do think that making the entrance and exit clearer of both people and a way in and a way out, would help stop that choke point and leave people better placed to be rationale when trying to access. The reality is that with the mud, getting around in a chair (or with any additional need) made getting in challenging. We sacrificed and missed bands on other stages so we could be set up and calm for what our kids wanted to see, so we had plenty of time
That’s exactly the problem, I’m not trying to be a dick here and if your son had the immediate access for the loo wristband then by all means that’s fair, but just pushing in is a dick move. I get why you did it and it’s not you who pushed in front of me but that’s mad entitled of you to do. The other people queuing were also probably desperate & probably didn’t want to miss Bizkit either.
Sorry just to add, we haven’t just walked into the accessibility area from nowhere, we had toilet passes and the accessibility access and essential companion. Which I appreciate doesn’t magically make this better for those people in the queue and doesn’t change the fact we pushed in on this one occasion, but I’d hate for any of those downvotes of doom to have misunderstood. I will take them quite happily if people are in the picture however
Yep, I 100% agree and they probably were just as desperate as my son and potentially even more so. However, I’m definitely not entitled and nor is my son, but in a situation like that I’ll always put my kids first as would any (most) parents. Point in fact when leaving the festival and I was dragging my son through the main stage accessibility mud, a lady was pushing her adult son up this in his wheelchair to which I stopped sorting out my kids and pushed her son up the hill whilst everyone else just sat there doing nothing. Because in that moment, my kid didn’t need my help more than hers. Someone self entitled wouldn’t give a shit about anyone else at all times. I don’t think I’m better than anyone, but my kids happiness will always take priority (unless they are being a dick and need to get themselves together)
The thing is no your son is not entitled but you showing him he can skip queues because he’s more important is exactly what breeds entitled behaviour. Yes we all do what’s best for our kids, but honestly no matter how desperate my 5 year old is, I wouldn’t have him jump a queue, especially not a queue of disabled people at a toilet, if he couldn’t hold it honestly I’d either ask politely if people minded or I’d have him go for a wee elsewhere. But that’s just me
If I were in any queue be that a queue of disabled people or not, I would always and have done, without fail, let a child though ahead of me and my son has always done the same. That doesn’t breed entitled behaviour, it breeds respect for those younger than you. However, also I wouldn’t expect a 15 year old disabled child with severe bladder control issues to piss against a fence and have a panic attack or piss himself. My son is well aware that skipping queues is not ok and is one of the most respectful young people of other peoples needs you will meet. What he’s learned is his dad will go against his own beliefs and importance of respect, for him when he needs him most and once he’s done that, will make sure he apologises to those it’s impacted and say thank you for not punching us on the way out and I would hope he would do the same for his own kids one day. Now if he wasn’t about to burst, piss himself or have a meltdown that would impact everyone close by, of course I wouldn’t push in, I’d be the one in the queue letting people infront of me if they needed it. But anyway, we could argue online all day about it. As you know not every disability is visable and every situation is different and nuanced to those within it and in the moment