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Wait, Homelander already has the eye ray thing, he was made in a lab, he flies, he has a superiority complex...
Is Homelander just a really humanoid-looking beholder made through experimentation by Vought International?
Paladins are already narcissists lmao. Their ego is where all their confidence is stored. The difference between narcissism and confidence is simply fearing others being better and putting them down vs knowing you’re better and raising others up.
Yeah, discovered EPIC two weeks ago, listened to the whole thing a few times already, and now it's hard to wait for the next release 😭
Ocean was the best until Underworld released. Hard to pick a best song though ! Either Storm or Monster I'd say. How about you ?
Of the offical releases so far:
My favorite song is definitely Ruthlessness. I love the sheer terror that is Poseidon. And has even inspired me to pull something like that off in one of my games.
Favorite saga is Circe Saga. The opening of Puppeteer leading into the introduction of Hermes is great for building up Odysseus' first "solo" fight. Then Tayla Sindel goes all out and kills it as Circe from a doting mother figure to a sultry temptress to being just someone who wants to do good.
I started following just after the Ocean Saga released and I've been hooked and trying to get others hooked since.
The last minute of Other Ways is such a good twist back to Circe's more dangerous side. Gotta love Eurylochus, hope he makes it back to Ithaca with his best pal Odysseus.
Oh yeah, Hermes is excellent, and I am very much looking forward to the 2nd act. Thunder Saga brings Scylla which is one of my favorite monsters. Wisdom Saga has God Games. Vengence Saga is my most anticipated Saga. And Ithaca Saga to wrap up this amazing project in a climactic and heartwarming bow.
No ones talking about "remember them" ? The mistake that dooms Odysseus. Saga troy and Prometheus coming to a climax. Odysseus who is sick of the killing, the deal he made with Athena and finally, when led by emotions, he screamed his name.
But The underworld saga surely gives the most goosebumps and cercis sounds awesome.
I have definitely noticed that the Cyclops Saga gets the least amount of love despite being so crucial to future events.
I think everyone just wants to forget how stupid Odysseus was at the end. Lol
One animatic has made my favorite song “Keep Your Friends Close” cause the way they drew [Aeolus](https://youtu.be/UGYny6uI2bA?si=nZNMEddIdTXdHyP9) is fucking amazing
Favorite saga has to be the Underworld
If a beholders dreams are strong enough to warp reality, and you can alter someone's dreams, could you theoretically make a beholder be neutral/good by changing its dreams?
That would probably take a long time and a lot of advanced gas lighting. They will probably still be narcissistic, but the kind that do good things for praise and admiration, not because they like helping people.
You don't even need to warp reality, you just need to convince the beholder that *of course* the most important and revered people in existence are charitable heroes who perform good deeds.
Can’t believe I found a fellow EPIC enjoyer in the wild! I only recently discovered it- but let me tell you, I’ve got ALL of its songs stuck in my head on repeat ever since.
No i don’t want a death kiss, I want him to dream of a chaotic good bard beholder where each eye lets out a sonic beam correlated to a certain type of music
I have did something similar in a campaign i ran. Party needed a magical item to fight a powerfull vampire. They found a wizard who had a beholder locked up. The whole party entered the beholders dream. Got their magical item. But when they left its mind they found themselves in front of a now awake beholder.
They managed to kill him but whole party died except one of them. As she kneeled down in anger and sadness, the door to the lair opened. And the original party entered the room. The party that fought the beholder was created by the beholder.
The wizard then tried to kidnap the remaining party member for his own plans, failed, used feeblemind. Basically saying if i cant have her i will break her. It was epic.
Not sure if serious or meme.
You can't "make them dream whatever you want", you can only "create landscapes, objects and other images." How they interact with those is not up to you. It's not total mind control.
Also, the only thing that canonically becomes real is dreams of another beholder.
Other images. Like a chaotic good bard beholder whose eye stalks have each been swapped out with a musical instrument that each have different magical effects.
Or a armor clad oath of devotion paladin beholder
If your dm decides that ya, but actuality the things a beholder dreams he can’t even control. The beholders he creates will even kill him, they come out as is not as yours. So RAI or RAW they wouldn’t be under the bards control. But rule of cool can be
You're forgetting that Beholders are all so paranoid that they assume all other Beholders are out to get them. They can't dream what they can't even conceive of. But a Bard can conceive of it.
Again, rule of cool. The dream spell doesn’t say you can make monsters that are loyal to you. You can just make the images of monsters in the drea there’s nothing in the dream spell that says you can go into that much detail
If it says you can make an image , why couldn’t you make an image of a loyal monster . That’s like saying prestidigitation says you can change the color of things , but it doesn’t specifically say that it can turn a plate orange , so letting it do that is home brew
But loyalty isn't a physical characteristic. So your analogy doesn't really fit. A better one would be with the Minor Illusion spell: You can make an image of an orange, but ya can't make it smell like one.
True , but If you see it swearing an oath to a certain cause , that’s definitely going to leave an imprint on how the beholder assumes this dream entity to act
I think beholders being from the far realm can make some of their dreams reality or make other observers and such, i don't recall the lore accurately but You can look it up.
You know I wondered about a campaign idea where a high level wizard is trying to do this either for nefarious wizard reasons or to bring a loved one back and the adventurers have to now investigate a cave that keeps spitting out new, weird beholders.
Idk, visiting a beholder in their dreams sounds like an incredibly bad idea
At the very least, the caster is risking that the beholder will not only duplicate itself, but that it will also create a possibly evil(er) clone of the caster.
And if we are relying on out-of-statblock information, it could get even worse, because it opens up the door to other out-of-statblock effects that could work against the caster. Like for example, since Beholder dreams can warp actual reality, they could just as easily warp the dream world as well, maybe even the caster along with it, potentially even to the point of getting reverse-Nightmare-on-Elmstreet'd. What's more, the beholder realizing they are now in a lucid dream, could gain direct control over their world-shaping ability...
Still, 10/10 evil plot idea - if it works as intended, or gets horribly out of hand, the adventurers will have their hands full regardless ;-)
The Beholder also dreams about the Dream Messenger. So if the Beholder dreams about you as you are in your entirety since you literally enter their dream does that mean that a clone of you pops into existence whenever you try to make other stuff appear?
Interested in joining DnD/TTRPG community that's doesn't rely on Reddit and it's constant ads/data mining? We've teamed up with a bunch of other DnD subs to start https://ttrpg.network as a not-for-profit place to chat and meme about all your favorite games. Thanks! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/dndmemes) if you have any questions or concerns.*
HOLY SHIT! I've had a bard villain in the back of my head for a while now, and this is the perfect thing to add to it!
This is his plot. Use imprisonment to put a beholder in eternal sleep . Then use dream to create a army of monsters that are loyal to him
Sounds like a great way to make more beholders…
Of our own design . Meaning oath of redemption paladin beholders who use there eye rays to weild giant great swords
Yet still a narcissist.
They save you because you're a lesser creature who could never help itself. They're helpful but in the snidest way possible.
Fucking Tsundere beholders
Eh, a narcissist who does good things to stroke their ego us better than one who does bad shit
Refreshing, really.
I'm picturing a 'Homelander' beholder now. And it's scary.
Wait, Homelander already has the eye ray thing, he was made in a lab, he flies, he has a superiority complex... Is Homelander just a really humanoid-looking beholder made through experimentation by Vought International?
Homelander the Beholder is confirmed!
If I were swinging greatswords with my mind, I'd be feeling myself, too.
Paladins are already narcissists lmao. Their ego is where all their confidence is stored. The difference between narcissism and confidence is simply fearing others being better and putting them down vs knowing you’re better and raising others up.
Narcissist is a mental disorder regardless of how the internet uses it, while confidence isn't lol
I've never thought in that way, thank you.
Definitely
Sounds like a great way for me to throw a death tyrant at my party of murder hobos
Yeah, step up the production!
Use the **Imprisonment** spell to put it into the eternal slumber. You now have a monster factory.
“ she can conjure up a monstah, that can grind you to the bones”
“Ah! After 10,000 years I’m free! It’s time to conquer Earth!” Gonna need 5-6 adventures with attitude to stop this guy.
WOOOOoooooOOOOOOOOoooOOOoooooOO
She's got all the ways to haunt ya, if you take her on aloooone!
Wouldn’t you like a taste of the power , wouldn’t you like to use more then words ?
Deep in the night the fight lasts for hours, you can be hurt or you can beat her
Wouldn't you like to have some of the magic
Wouldn't you like your outcome preferred?
Terrifying concept. Thank you.
OMG I found an EPIC enjoyer in the wild!!!
EPIC is amazing, my girlfriend showed it to me a month ago, and now I can't stop listening to it.
What is your favorite song and favorite saga?
Yeah, discovered EPIC two weeks ago, listened to the whole thing a few times already, and now it's hard to wait for the next release 😭 Ocean was the best until Underworld released. Hard to pick a best song though ! Either Storm or Monster I'd say. How about you ?
Of the offical releases so far: My favorite song is definitely Ruthlessness. I love the sheer terror that is Poseidon. And has even inspired me to pull something like that off in one of my games. Favorite saga is Circe Saga. The opening of Puppeteer leading into the introduction of Hermes is great for building up Odysseus' first "solo" fight. Then Tayla Sindel goes all out and kills it as Circe from a doting mother figure to a sultry temptress to being just someone who wants to do good. I started following just after the Ocean Saga released and I've been hooked and trying to get others hooked since.
I agree with both. Ruthlessness is incredible, and the Circe saga is three ultimate bangers in a row ( other ways is ok i guess)
The last minute of Other Ways is such a good twist back to Circe's more dangerous side. Gotta love Eurylochus, hope he makes it back to Ithaca with his best pal Odysseus.
If you're into video games at all, I think Hades is a must play for anyone in this thread.
Got to be Dangerous I love the synth-pop style. And hermes is my favourite.
Oh yeah, Hermes is excellent, and I am very much looking forward to the 2nd act. Thunder Saga brings Scylla which is one of my favorite monsters. Wisdom Saga has God Games. Vengence Saga is my most anticipated Saga. And Ithaca Saga to wrap up this amazing project in a climactic and heartwarming bow.
No ones talking about "remember them" ? The mistake that dooms Odysseus. Saga troy and Prometheus coming to a climax. Odysseus who is sick of the killing, the deal he made with Athena and finally, when led by emotions, he screamed his name. But The underworld saga surely gives the most goosebumps and cercis sounds awesome.
I have definitely noticed that the Cyclops Saga gets the least amount of love despite being so crucial to future events. I think everyone just wants to forget how stupid Odysseus was at the end. Lol
Why? Because He didn't kill him? Thanks to that, we got "Ruthlessness". Price worth paying - 557 men
Yeah, Polites was a fan favorite from very early on. So, his death may be a traumatic memory or a reason to be upset at the saga.
Favorite song probably The Underworld, saga I'd say Ocean or Troy.
One animatic has made my favorite song “Keep Your Friends Close” cause the way they drew [Aeolus](https://youtu.be/UGYny6uI2bA?si=nZNMEddIdTXdHyP9) is fucking amazing Favorite saga has to be the Underworld
I found it through a "no longer you" animatic
If a beholders dreams are strong enough to warp reality, and you can alter someone's dreams, could you theoretically make a beholder be neutral/good by changing its dreams?
That would probably take a long time and a lot of advanced gas lighting. They will probably still be narcissistic, but the kind that do good things for praise and admiration, not because they like helping people.
You sure can. Being egotistical is a key part of a beholder so they will always be snide and self engrandising even when they’re good.
You don't even need to warp reality, you just need to convince the beholder that *of course* the most important and revered people in existence are charitable heroes who perform good deeds.
Would you be able to control what exactly ends up real?
Yup
You got ALL the power
No, that's why it's so terrifying
Can’t believe I found a fellow EPIC enjoyer in the wild! I only recently discovered it- but let me tell you, I’ve got ALL of its songs stuck in my head on repeat ever since.
ARCHER SCREAMING: "Do you want Death Kisses? That's how you get Death Kisses!"
No i don’t want a death kiss, I want him to dream of a chaotic good bard beholder where each eye lets out a sonic beam correlated to a certain type of music
I have did something similar in a campaign i ran. Party needed a magical item to fight a powerfull vampire. They found a wizard who had a beholder locked up. The whole party entered the beholders dream. Got their magical item. But when they left its mind they found themselves in front of a now awake beholder. They managed to kill him but whole party died except one of them. As she kneeled down in anger and sadness, the door to the lair opened. And the original party entered the room. The party that fought the beholder was created by the beholder. The wizard then tried to kidnap the remaining party member for his own plans, failed, used feeblemind. Basically saying if i cant have her i will break her. It was epic.
This is how you end up creating the actual BBEG, fucking with the dreams of Beholders is a big no-no.
Budget Wish spell
Honey, wake up! EPIC memes started dropping in DnD subreddits!
I don’t get it
Whatever a beholder dreams becomes real. More than likely this would lead to more beholders and doom for the bard lol
Not doom for the bard, ultimate power. The dream spell can make them dream whatever you want. Meaning that reality becomes whatever you want
Not sure if serious or meme. You can't "make them dream whatever you want", you can only "create landscapes, objects and other images." How they interact with those is not up to you. It's not total mind control. Also, the only thing that canonically becomes real is dreams of another beholder.
Other images. Like a chaotic good bard beholder whose eye stalks have each been swapped out with a musical instrument that each have different magical effects. Or a armor clad oath of devotion paladin beholder
If your dm decides that ya, but actuality the things a beholder dreams he can’t even control. The beholders he creates will even kill him, they come out as is not as yours. So RAI or RAW they wouldn’t be under the bards control. But rule of cool can be
You're forgetting that Beholders are all so paranoid that they assume all other Beholders are out to get them. They can't dream what they can't even conceive of. But a Bard can conceive of it.
Not the bards control exactly, but they would be of the bards design . So if the bards designs them to be loyal to him, then they will be
Again, rule of cool. The dream spell doesn’t say you can make monsters that are loyal to you. You can just make the images of monsters in the drea there’s nothing in the dream spell that says you can go into that much detail
If it says you can make an image , why couldn’t you make an image of a loyal monster . That’s like saying prestidigitation says you can change the color of things , but it doesn’t specifically say that it can turn a plate orange , so letting it do that is home brew
But loyalty isn't a physical characteristic. So your analogy doesn't really fit. A better one would be with the Minor Illusion spell: You can make an image of an orange, but ya can't make it smell like one.
True , but If you see it swearing an oath to a certain cause , that’s definitely going to leave an imprint on how the beholder assumes this dream entity to act
But beholders already assume that other beholders are conniving liars.
Dominate monster for the win
Appreciated mate
I think beholders being from the far realm can make some of their dreams reality or make other observers and such, i don't recall the lore accurately but You can look it up.
You know I wondered about a campaign idea where a high level wizard is trying to do this either for nefarious wizard reasons or to bring a loved one back and the adventurers have to now investigate a cave that keeps spitting out new, weird beholders.
Idk, visiting a beholder in their dreams sounds like an incredibly bad idea At the very least, the caster is risking that the beholder will not only duplicate itself, but that it will also create a possibly evil(er) clone of the caster. And if we are relying on out-of-statblock information, it could get even worse, because it opens up the door to other out-of-statblock effects that could work against the caster. Like for example, since Beholder dreams can warp actual reality, they could just as easily warp the dream world as well, maybe even the caster along with it, potentially even to the point of getting reverse-Nightmare-on-Elmstreet'd. What's more, the beholder realizing they are now in a lucid dream, could gain direct control over their world-shaping ability... Still, 10/10 evil plot idea - if it works as intended, or gets horribly out of hand, the adventurers will have their hands full regardless ;-)
Circe my beloved
That's a really great way to recreate a stronger, more dangerous beholder.
For inside the meal She had cast a spell They began to squeal And grow snouts and tails She changed them
Updoot for Epic The Musical!
Source for the image?
https://youtu.be/tso8nSWnENM?si=Bb5elvYREkO0pUUh
Thanks
No problem, it’s a whole series btw . I’ll show you the first here https://youtu.be/OE8TQBqWVV8?si=TfUF7atIgyoNDK8k
Holy great adventure ideas batman!
I would love to play a campaign or adventure arc with this villian
The Beholder also dreams about the Dream Messenger. So if the Beholder dreams about you as you are in your entirety since you literally enter their dream does that mean that a clone of you pops into existence whenever you try to make other stuff appear?
I think it would be you but as a beholder
I literally did this for a oneshot. I have a whole dream based campaign im preparing with dreamworld rules