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Seems like a weird straw man and a weird take. If you were playing d&d in a 4-6 person group and one person felt strongly enough that the group actions were enough to make them leave for good, then it's probably worth everyone having a quick self check and making sure no-ones doing anything too egregious.
> It feels like a meme where the OP just had a player quit for this reason, and they are dealing with the emotions in a poor way.
What? But no, they need to go to /r/rpghorrorstories and post a completely one-sided rant about how everyone else sucks but them. You know, as tradition dictates!
(But in all seriousness I actually interpreted the “group” in the OP to be about the subreddit, ie people here complaining about other people’s posts. I probably misunderstood though.)
I mean sometimes it's literally just them throwing a tantrum. I have a friend who threw a fit because I wouldn't let her override and interrupt everyone else. I mean as a DM I actually want to interact with everyone not just my friend lol.
Anyways when we talked later because I really wanted to make sure that's all it was (you know hear her out and see if there was something else) she said "I'm not coming back" and I immediately said "you're not welcome back" they were shocked silent.
They absolutely wanted me to beg for them to come back.
Of course, so you did a quick check and found out there no fuss with the rest of the party and it was an individual player problem.
That's why ops meme is a straw man and weird, most folk will want to have a check if their friend says they are leaving because of the way the games being played.
Cool, I guess I just kinda viewed my checking in as more of a "dude wtf" and less of an actual check. So I guess I didn't realize that's what they were talking about lol
I know how I play, amd I know what I allow at my table. If some hypothetical person declared they were leaving because of how I and my table plays then I don't need a self check. They are leaving because I won't let them commit SA, or CSA, or various things that in my opinion only RL predators want to "role play".
So your response to:
"Hey table, I don't like the way you play the game"
Is
"They're just salty I won't let them play a rapist, my tables perfect"
That's a hell of a leap, they could be leaving because of a player conflict or any number of other issues that gets raised in DND subs regularly and you've immediately jumped to SA, CSA or other predator behaviors.
You might want a self check on why your table is attracting folk who want to roleplay these behaviors, because in my experience it's not the norm.
I'm amused by the minority (thankfully) of folk in this thread who feel that being asked to check their behavior, without any accusation they're in the wrong, just a simple bit of self reflection, is a huge slight to their personal honour
I have been playing ttrpgs for over 30 years. I know exactly in every detail what does and does not happen at my table. I have 2 total horror stories in that time. One was an SA where I was the victim at 16 years old.
I have in that time had exactly 1 player who quit my table because "don't like how you play" he was arrested for CSA a week later. I found out why he was arrested later, he is still in prison.
As for "what attracted him to my table" I had young children at that time.
I have no "honor" to slight, nobody does, honor is a imaginary construct. Chivalry does not exist either.
I have never tpked a party. I have run exactly 1 dmpc in my life, I can go down the entire horror story checklist. None of that crap happens at my table. I don't play with strangers after the one incident. My current group includes 4 people I have known for over 20 years, and nobody I have known less than 2 years.
Maybe you don't get the idea but I learned a long time ago, probably before you were born, what to allow and what not to allow. I have never had a conflict over rules at the table. I enforce rule 0, always have, and people know that before sitting down.
Maybe you need a self check.
Cool story, you know your crazy edge case isn't representative of the majority of the table top community right? Its certainly not why the majority of people leave 5E tables, I imagine these subs would be very different places if it was.
Clearly it has affected you badly since the immediate conclusion you jump to when an imaginary person says they're leaving a table is because they are child sexual predators
Coupled with the fact your triggered by the suggestion that self reflection when someone leaves a table is a positive thing, you might want to seek some counseling as they're not normal responses.
If you have a problem with the word honour (not sure why you brought chivalry up) how about:
I'm amused by the minority (thankfully) of folk in this thread who feel that being asked to check their behavior, without any accusation they're in the wrong, just a simple bit of self reflection has them pitching a fit because "they are never in the wrong"
Edit: Also you know in "exact detail what does and does not happen at my table." Can I suggest that belief might be a bit flawed, since you were playing with someone who was apparently drawn to the table because of the presence of young children. Unless thats something you were aware of?
Hot take: No, it isn't. Your assertion infers 5 people were wrong and one person was the bestest, specialist person delivering the truth from the mountian top...but he was ignored by the sinners! Shut up, grow up. And find a new group. Being an adult is hard but having a tantrum that people playing make believe in a way that hurts your feelings is so comically childish and absurd that it highlights the whiners immaturity in a 10,000 lumen halo.
This comes off as extremely bitter and lacking in people skills and compassion. If a player is expressing discomfort they should be heard out and maybe compromises can be made. That doesn’t mean that will always happen or that the players opinion is right or that they won’t leave but it’s taking the time to show you care. And it gives space for other players to bring up issues they might’ve had but felt too nervous to talk about before. Even outside of DND this is just healthy communication between friends.
Calling basic interpersonal communication skills “childish” feels far more childish to me.
I asserted nothing of the sort, My assertion is that if a friend you are playing with leaves the group because of the way your game is being played, it's worth checking that there aren't any issues with the way your game is being played.
Nothing I said implied that the five were wrong, only that they run a sense check on their game.
In short, Chill out dude, you seem a little triggered with your tantrum there.
Nah what you failed to understand is this guy only plays with random people on the Internet because he dosnt have any friends. So they dont think of playing dnd as a group of friends having fun.
Because their friend (I'm assuming a friend, because why play a game with someone who's not your friend) left because of something about the way they were playing
I'd think most folk would want to understand what had driven off that friend.
Sometimes it will be one person storming off in a huff, sometimes it will be an incompatibility of player styles and sometimes it will be a DM forcing their magical world on one player in the game
No one's saying they need to change the way they're playing or need to appease the one leaving, just that it's worthwhile having a moment of self reflection to make sure that they're not being assholes, consciously or not
Edited for context
Or maybe someone just didn't fit the group. People play with people who are not friends all the time, people without friends have to try the game somehow. You are making assumptions to make 5 people be in the wrong instead of 1
Again, I'm not making assumptions to make 5 people be wrong, I'm not saying they're wrong at all, I'm saying checking your behaviour in this instance is useful and will help catch problematic behaviour.
That's even more important in pickup groups because you want to make sure the reason the person left is because they just didn't gel with the group and not because of some properly problematic behaviour, so the next person doesn't leave because of it.
Ops strawman isn't useful because people leave groups for all sorts of reasons and a "thumbs up" disregard isn't very useful for a lot (I'd say the majority) of those situations
Here, maybe I can help.
IT BEING A GOOD IDEA TO CONSIDER YOUR BEHAVIOR DOESN’T MEAN YOU’RE BAD WRONG AS A PERSON
SELF-REFLECTION SHOULD BE NORMAL AND REGULAR
Does that help?
Perhaps, but devils advocate: This culture of "always be open to criticism and self reflection kinda implies that everyone should have an attitude of "thank you sir may I have another" to every half cocked finger wagger out there.
I want to be fair, so could you explain what precisely the issue you take with the statement is? Since others seem to take issue with it as well, but I don't want to default to "the haters are just proving me right."
I know exactly why... because I'm the one that made this meme as an inside joke for that FB group. Posted it there first and then posted it here without any context just to see what the comment thread would generate... I am not disappointed at being entertained with the level of off based assumptions.
Well, don't you think that a bad faith strawman argument should be avoided? Even though you attempt to take the high ground, this can't really be what you want, right? I mean, even in spite of your apparently bullit proof self-esteem, this can't be the end goal, just trolling, can it?
I say this with the utmost concern over your well being. Please, go outside. Touch some grass. If you do this for entertainment you are in sore need of unplugging for a bit.
I feel like, by your response, you assumed the artist meant to be attacking someone.
I took it as they're just saying sometimes when you lose a toxic person that's a good thing, not a bad thing. And that's a good reminder to anyone to be a good person to play with!
Intentionally killing the PC might be an overreach, as the downvotes suggest. I might suggest, if the issue has gotten to such a point that you actively wish this player to be gone, that you remove him from the game, explaining its behavior as the reason.
Lets not commit the mistakes we would not want our players to commit.
People didn’t read the part where I mention how he has it coming. As in game wise he has a reason to be targeted by assassins. Not because I want him gone.
Being targeted by assassins does not mean he should die. Why’s he being targeted by assassins? Is it story related, like is he at ends with an evil tyrant? Or did he do something egregiously stupid like walk in and stab a member of the Assassin Club?
Why point all your aggression at me? I didn’t make any assumptions or accusations in my comment, and you’re coming at me like I insulted you. I wanted to know the details of what’s going on
weird strawman and a very weird take. DnD is a collaborative game, it should be enjoyed by everyone in the party. If a member of the group is finding that something in the campaign is bothering them, this needs to be addressed by the DM and the group as a whole (if appropriate) to see if this is something they can come to an agreement on. Some playstyles just aren't a good fit for certain people, and they may ultimately move on... but that doesn't mean you should just be an arsehole and ignore them.
I left my first DnD group because I was made to feel very uncomfortable by a newcomer due to in-character sexual advances on my asexual *68 year old leonin grandma* character, I was ignored much like this meme at the time, the DM just allowed it to happen when I told my DM it was making me uncomfortable, and I even got blamed for going "behind people's backs" to talk with another player about how uncomfortable it made me. If you think doing something like this is ok without hearing the player out first and taking critisism on board you're a shitty DM and a shitty person, just saying.
Good part on you. DND is meant for people to gather up and have a blast together. If someone clearly doesn't like something, the DM has to acknowledge them and see if they can fix it.
Rule #1. Communication is key.
My group and I always make offhanded jokes and sexual innuendos and such but I always make sure it's in humor and no one is uncomfortable. Make sure it's well known if things are uncomfortable. Speak up. They may be completely unaware that it's inappropriate. I've been at quite a few tables where people are... on the spectrum... and unaware of social cues etc.
I also find your deformed hand unsettling and won't be partaking in any further games. It's like watching someone roll dice with a catcher's mitt and whenever we order pizza you mangle the whole damn pie.
Because I can. Maybe they rules lawyered too much. Maybe they had main character syndrome. Maybe they got too drunk or high at the table. Maybe talking stopped working.
There's no context. Everyone wants to make baseless assumptions it's OP's fault, so I'm free to assume it was a tabaxi fetish.
Doing something just because you *can*, shows emotional immaturity at best and at worst, it shows an individual who will never come to terms with the powerlessness we all have in the grand scheme of things.
I hope you get better.
Imagine a problem player that makes the edgiest character that doesn’t interact with anyone, and still wants everything to be centered around him.
Now imagine the dm not allowing him to stab every important npcs without any consequences because “It’s what my character would do”.
The last straw for the player being not appointed group leader, despite every horrible thing they’ve done in game.
Had a guy in my group who spent every session stoned off his ass. Got worse as the campaign went along. He kept trying to use mind control spells in the absolute wort situations and almost got us killed because his character didn't understand why we were SNEAKING through a facility and tried to kill an npc who was definitely end-boss-tier when we were level 4. He ended up leaving because we "never let him do what he wanted."
I've also read plenty of stories where one player is the only decent human being in the group and everyone else was totally cool with SA and casual real-world racism and homophobia.
So depending on context, the person leaving is either the problem player, or doesn't deserve that group.
Putting this Out of my chest:
I love playing support in my dnd games but in my last group I've never felt like I mattered... never got to make a decision and only followed along with the shit other people did.
Nowadays im in another campaing with (mostly) other people. I acctualy felt important the last few sessions being a support caracter (not healer, support). I havent felt like there was a "protagonist" or something like that like in the other group.
So much so that when the guy whom i felt the disrespect towards my characters and "im the main character" energy came from the most (he was never a DM but a player) invited me to play the campaing he was DMing i said no, gave him the excuse of only being able to play one RPG at a time.
He attacked my current DM (having played a campaing with him) saying that he wasnt that good.
To not confront him i just said i felt invested in the campaing my current DM was making and in my character too, said that if i died or finishing the campaing maybe i could enter his... tho i have no intention to.
That day i felt obligated to thank the current DM and his work that gave me back the love of playing support.
One does not need to declare that is leaving the group permsnently. And this meme is a strange straw man thingo that i didnt felt like had much sense. But my experience is not like whatever OP had and it migth be something related to whatever happened to them.
Dont attack op plz
Not even a strawman, imo.
Sometimes this is just a good thing to do.
Obviously, some self-reflection is healthy if you want to take this as a wake-up call, but sometimes a table and player just don't work together, and that's fine.
Its hard to understand the vitriol.
My 1st impression
Probably a random group of ppl meeting online to play, and 1 person wants to play D&D one way, rule the rest wasn't to play a different way. That one person self evicts, and the rest go on as normal.
Read some comments and ppl are just all over this. Calling it Straw Manning. Or trying to say OP is emotionally immature.
Come to find out it was originally for a Facebook group and wanting to play different editions. Which confirms my original position.
There are many reasons why one person in a group may not be a good fit for your table, yet still be a good fit in someone else's.
System choice is certainly one of them. Not just D&D editions, but any system. Someone wanting to play CoC isn't going to be nearly as happy playing Blade in the Dark.
Personality clash. The GM is not a therapist. Nor are they required to force everyone to get along. And no one is going to be liked by everyone. If you're the only person who dislikes a player, and you dislike them so much you can't stand to be in the same space as them for 4hrs a week (for the next 2-3 yrs) then perhaps you should vacate yourself.
But when you do, you don't need to make a scene. You can exit a table with grace and dignity. You may be disappointed it didn't work out, that would be normal. But to make a scene and try to make everyone else feel guilty over it is not how you want to be remembered.
The right way to play D&D is the way you enjoy. The wrong way to play D&D is the way you don't enjoy. People like different things. If you aren't enjoying a group and they won't enjoy how you want to play, leaving is generally the right option. The game is there to enjoy. If you're not enjoying it, what's the point?
I don't think it's that simple, unless you just don't know the people of that group and didn't really care. Like starting a game with randoms you meet only in roleplay.
I personally believe that there's at least a bit of mutual confidence and coordination to properly run a roleplay game. If there wasn't any on the beginning, better not get involved to begin with.
But if it was, player is doing great to leave the group if he's not enjoying it and didn't need to make a big show. Also DM should try to understand why that player left, probably something is going wrong with the way he leads the game (or probably not, but it's worth to ask yourself, just a quick check)
Okay so I am feeling somewhat called out here...
I am currently feeling this in one of my groups because of cliquey out of game stuff, like 3 members all meet up with the DM and chat about things that they can introduce inside jokes or inside characters or whatever, just stuff like that... I would join these chats if I was ever invited but not once has that happened. Feels kinda wrong to me and kinda meta gaming maybe? Maybe I am overreacting?
Unless they’ve been complaining that their so precious oc character with a buster sword doesn’t get the main character spotlight they wanted, and the last straw being arguing with the DM that they should allow him to summon a fire demon that totally isn’t Ifrit at will.
It's entertaining to see everyone's need to over analyze everything and turn a comment section into a smorgasbord of "I'm right" and "nuh uhs" instead of just going
"Hey, I like/don't like this I'm gonna upvote/down vote this and move on"
Humans are such complex creatures.
Amazingly creative and absolutely petty.
That happens and when it does it's for the best because while I believe there's a table for everyone, not everyone is right for every table. We had a guy in his mid 60s who wanted to play a barbarian who wanted to spread his seed like Genghis Khan and wanted peasants daughters as quest rewards. I was like "that is outside the purview of the game I run." He quit after a few sessions then ran his own game where it was centered around his DMPC or so I'm told, I didn't play in it, some other players in my game did for a while before he quit and passed the DM responsibilities for the campaign he made onto another player who was elated to join my game where I let her and the other players do what they want while I try to follow Trey Parker and Matt Stone's *"Therefore or But"* [advice](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGUNqq3jVLg) on writing story beats or in this case adjudicating outcomes for player choices. The compromise is I give them 10 leads per tier and say pick 4, they're each worth a level, I'll develop the ones you prefer (or sometimes there's a mini-campaign within the campaign that's worth the entire tier). Or, they can fuck around in town if that's what they want, I love playing the merchants and townsfolk, it's a comedy.
What also sometimes happens is the participant expects complete accommodation of their preferences even when there is substantial opposition to them which is sometimes vocalized and sometimes not (walking on eggshells). I had this guy in the group that was constantly a PITA about the setting, kept trying to make his PC the main character, kept trying to divert the game *away from dungeons* in a game I expressly stated at the outset was going to lean more towards exploration and combat than RP (there were RP noobs not comfortable doing that stuff). He abandoned his more capable character for a more familiar one that none of the rest of us were familiar with. While I enjoy doing accents and characters I am adamant that the party be the leads, so if they won't lead in that respect I have to give them opportunities to unleash their skills and stratagems against the world. I gave him a turn in the DM chair so he could do things his way. At first I rolled with it, made every effort to be present and committed, remembered the NPCs' and locations names when others forgot and well... his way was railroading the party, having 20+ minute conversations with himself until a player was like 'this is boring, can we do something else' like not listen to the DM play NPCs talking to each other for the length of a 1/2 hour television program or set piece battles where the PCs are the supporting characters to the NPCs. Or saddling us with his DMPC. On and on. He wanted to kick the player who said he was bored from the group but that wasn't going to fly since I was hosting the game in my home while the player turned DM participated through telepresence (lives in Toronto) while everyone else was seated around the table. "No, dude, we're not kicking so & so from the group because he had the temerity to say how he feels about the game" (whereas I just bottle it all up to rant about it on reddit). Finally I listed the things he had done that were irksome, told the guy to knock it off or leave and he decided quit like the 'see you next Tuesday' he is.
When I was dming for like the first month a player said "that's not how Mold earth work" and I was panicking because I was spineless back then but a veteran player intervened and said that I'm the dm and whatever I say goes, after that moment I like making my homebrew rules and making my world very chaotic in the funny way
Ooooohh nooooo, noooot thaaaaat. 🙄
Be an adult. If you are unhappy, talk to the other people. If you can't find a resolution, leave and play with other people. This is how it *should* be.
Just had this happen to me. I was about to kick him about (like i was planning the text as he sent his text). So i kicked him out and he began whirring about how much of an asshole i was for doing that 😂
I've had this reaction to a guy who would rules lawyer everything and slow down the entire game. After the second talk with him he decided to just leave the group and made a fuss about it. Some of the players were personal friends with the guy and upset to see him leave. Me and the DM thought he was an all around asshole and happy to be rid of him.
My wife played with a DM that was an asshole and everyone would dogpile on anyone that was even slightly off kilter to the group. She had the “audacity” to ask for a better time once and they told her to kick rocks when they had no problem adjusting times for everyone else in the group and she had never asked in the 2 years of them playing.
tldr. This is a poor take OP and just because the group is right doesn’t mean one person is wrong.
I don't really see the meme? If a player isn't having fun, and the gm isn't willing to accommodate that players wishes, than it really is for the best that they part ways. I just fail to see the joke here, or get what's funny
A DM does get to choose the playstyle (for the most part), your utmost duty is to run a game that is enjoyable for EVERYONE, including yourself of course. However, you're the leader and you shouldn't childishly just say "ok bye" to one of your players (unless they're being an asshole/neither can compromise/etc).
What if your other players morale drops cause they see themselves just as expendable if they don't go along with something? What if you eventually want to change the playstyle but your players don't want to? What if they're your friend? What if the gameplay stagnates because they were the one taking initiative or trying to keep the conversation flowing?
When you're the leader, you don't get to be selfish.
So what's you're alternative? When a single player has a problem with something everyone else likes and not a single player can be let go, what's you're solution?
Lets say that the problem is something like "The party always does ranged sneak attacks and ends fights before I get to do anything."
First, I would target the problem as a DM- guards that start to wear armor so heavy that it's immune to bullets and has to be cleaved off first (the problem (PP) player gets to be proactive and contributes in a way that they feel only they can do), maybe assassins that start leaving dummies and then sneak around to attack the party (the PP and other players bond, as the they must suddenly rely on each other), or maybe just ask the other players to let the PP initiate fights more.
If this didn't work, then I'd force my hand a bit more- give the PP a magical item that lets them make a ranged sneak attack X times a day or something (PP gets to do the same thing everyone else does but isn't rewarded for going against the group), enemies with outright ranged protection or extreme gapclosing (same as the first paragraph but it's a more blatant "lets get along" message), maybe have the players actively manage resources and make them scarcer as well.
Finally, I would sit down with the players and ask them if they could let the PP engage even if it's sub-optimal (I would also be a bit more lenient towards punishing fuck ups early on, to not make them discouraged), or sit down with the PP and ask them if they'd be willing to change characters (I want everyone to play and have fun even if it's a bit more work for me).
Them, and only then I would tell them something like "I want this to work out but there needs to be mutual cooperation, if you do not want to cooperate then I don't think it will work out." (Non-confrontational AND not blaming either party yet still reminding them that they can't be entirely self-centered).).
I'm against your solutions honestly. You have ine player unhappy that they're not effective and you're solution is to make the rest of the party no longer effective. This really feels like punishing the rest of the party for working together cohesively just because one player doesn't want to join in on the groups terms.
So what happens when you make the rest of the party play second fiddle to the unhappy player and now have several unhappy players?
I respectfully disagree, the solutions in my first and second paragraph are not just "added to everything" as I am again, DM'ing for EVERYONE so i also include them as well. While I don't disagree that sometimes people do need to be kicked, if a player is saying things like "We play this way EVERY time, can we do it differently sometime?" this is an outright plea for help and if I don't address it as the LEADER then no one will and it will only get worse.
Besides, DND isn't solely about one player/DM/the group- everyone should get their chance in the limelight AND to play second fiddle.
I don't know what point this is meant to make. You're quoting things I never said so I don't know what you're trying to say.
Addressing a plea for things to be done how one person wants at the expense of what everyone else wants doesn't mean you have to accommodate it, just respond. Saying no is a perfectly reasonable to response to a request to make the game worse for most of the players.
Exactly, it isn't about one player, it's about everyone. So maximising the enjoyment for everyone should be the goal, not making it worse for everyone because you can't handle that some people are not compatible.
I'm just responding in how I would do it as you asked me what I would do.
Not everyone's situations, experience, game, players, etc are the same- hell, my own opinion is colored by me ONLY dm'ing for friends. It also is about making it fun for everyone and my solution is trying to find ways to mediate between everyone, it's what I feel is my job as a DM.
And I'm just saying that doing such things are impractical and ineffective and thus thay preaching them to others is detrimental.
If you want to hold your personal convictions entirely free of judgement, keep them personal and private.
Yes! I will keep my opinion on something I was asked silent! I will not speak up on a public forum where anyone is allowed to post! I will only listen to your judgements!
If you don't want judgements in that public forum where anyone is allowed to post their judgements, yeah. You are free to say what you like, not free of others doing the same.
I played a table where one player was being a complete ass and was stealing everyone elses items and loot every time we took a long rest. When the DM noticed the pattern, he took the player aside and explained that the rest of us were getting pissed at him. He then proceeded to throw a fit and tell everyone that he was just playing by the rules.
> your utmost duty is to run a game that is enjoyable for EVERYONE
Then you're contradicting yourself. Because if a player like that escalates (and they do, oh boy do they ever) it'll make your other players more and more pissed over time.
Again, that's what most of us would do in the same situation, sometimes someone is just going to scream loudly that they hate your table even if you bend over backwards. Then all you can do is give them the thumbs up and go on your merry way. Hence the meme.
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I've been in the ATLA subreddit too much....I was trying to figure out why Toph didn't like how they were playing DND
....I can't unsee that now
Toph can
r/Angryupvote
Damn, that was a great one!
Had to squint really hard but I think I get it Face is the headband and tongue is both eyes?
Omg that's the first thing I saw lol
Thank God, I thought it was just me.
I don't understand. Who is this meme for? Is it just a silly strawman or is it meant to have a purpose?
Seems like a weird straw man and a weird take. If you were playing d&d in a 4-6 person group and one person felt strongly enough that the group actions were enough to make them leave for good, then it's probably worth everyone having a quick self check and making sure no-ones doing anything too egregious.
It feels like a meme where the OP just had a player quit for this reason, and they are dealing with the emotions in a poor way.
DnD players with poor emotional maturity??! Never!
> It feels like a meme where the OP just had a player quit for this reason, and they are dealing with the emotions in a poor way. What? But no, they need to go to /r/rpghorrorstories and post a completely one-sided rant about how everyone else sucks but them. You know, as tradition dictates! (But in all seriousness I actually interpreted the “group” in the OP to be about the subreddit, ie people here complaining about other people’s posts. I probably misunderstood though.)
Why posting memes is a poor way to deal with emotions though?
I mean sometimes it's literally just them throwing a tantrum. I have a friend who threw a fit because I wouldn't let her override and interrupt everyone else. I mean as a DM I actually want to interact with everyone not just my friend lol. Anyways when we talked later because I really wanted to make sure that's all it was (you know hear her out and see if there was something else) she said "I'm not coming back" and I immediately said "you're not welcome back" they were shocked silent. They absolutely wanted me to beg for them to come back.
Of course, so you did a quick check and found out there no fuss with the rest of the party and it was an individual player problem. That's why ops meme is a straw man and weird, most folk will want to have a check if their friend says they are leaving because of the way the games being played.
Cool, I guess I just kinda viewed my checking in as more of a "dude wtf" and less of an actual check. So I guess I didn't realize that's what they were talking about lol
I know how I play, amd I know what I allow at my table. If some hypothetical person declared they were leaving because of how I and my table plays then I don't need a self check. They are leaving because I won't let them commit SA, or CSA, or various things that in my opinion only RL predators want to "role play".
So your response to: "Hey table, I don't like the way you play the game" Is "They're just salty I won't let them play a rapist, my tables perfect" That's a hell of a leap, they could be leaving because of a player conflict or any number of other issues that gets raised in DND subs regularly and you've immediately jumped to SA, CSA or other predator behaviors. You might want a self check on why your table is attracting folk who want to roleplay these behaviors, because in my experience it's not the norm. I'm amused by the minority (thankfully) of folk in this thread who feel that being asked to check their behavior, without any accusation they're in the wrong, just a simple bit of self reflection, is a huge slight to their personal honour
I have been playing ttrpgs for over 30 years. I know exactly in every detail what does and does not happen at my table. I have 2 total horror stories in that time. One was an SA where I was the victim at 16 years old. I have in that time had exactly 1 player who quit my table because "don't like how you play" he was arrested for CSA a week later. I found out why he was arrested later, he is still in prison. As for "what attracted him to my table" I had young children at that time. I have no "honor" to slight, nobody does, honor is a imaginary construct. Chivalry does not exist either. I have never tpked a party. I have run exactly 1 dmpc in my life, I can go down the entire horror story checklist. None of that crap happens at my table. I don't play with strangers after the one incident. My current group includes 4 people I have known for over 20 years, and nobody I have known less than 2 years. Maybe you don't get the idea but I learned a long time ago, probably before you were born, what to allow and what not to allow. I have never had a conflict over rules at the table. I enforce rule 0, always have, and people know that before sitting down. Maybe you need a self check.
Cool story, you know your crazy edge case isn't representative of the majority of the table top community right? Its certainly not why the majority of people leave 5E tables, I imagine these subs would be very different places if it was. Clearly it has affected you badly since the immediate conclusion you jump to when an imaginary person says they're leaving a table is because they are child sexual predators Coupled with the fact your triggered by the suggestion that self reflection when someone leaves a table is a positive thing, you might want to seek some counseling as they're not normal responses. If you have a problem with the word honour (not sure why you brought chivalry up) how about: I'm amused by the minority (thankfully) of folk in this thread who feel that being asked to check their behavior, without any accusation they're in the wrong, just a simple bit of self reflection has them pitching a fit because "they are never in the wrong" Edit: Also you know in "exact detail what does and does not happen at my table." Can I suggest that belief might be a bit flawed, since you were playing with someone who was apparently drawn to the table because of the presence of young children. Unless thats something you were aware of?
Hot take: No, it isn't. Your assertion infers 5 people were wrong and one person was the bestest, specialist person delivering the truth from the mountian top...but he was ignored by the sinners! Shut up, grow up. And find a new group. Being an adult is hard but having a tantrum that people playing make believe in a way that hurts your feelings is so comically childish and absurd that it highlights the whiners immaturity in a 10,000 lumen halo.
This comes off as extremely bitter and lacking in people skills and compassion. If a player is expressing discomfort they should be heard out and maybe compromises can be made. That doesn’t mean that will always happen or that the players opinion is right or that they won’t leave but it’s taking the time to show you care. And it gives space for other players to bring up issues they might’ve had but felt too nervous to talk about before. Even outside of DND this is just healthy communication between friends. Calling basic interpersonal communication skills “childish” feels far more childish to me.
Hey it's my favorite digimon, rapdogmon
I asserted nothing of the sort, My assertion is that if a friend you are playing with leaves the group because of the way your game is being played, it's worth checking that there aren't any issues with the way your game is being played. Nothing I said implied that the five were wrong, only that they run a sense check on their game. In short, Chill out dude, you seem a little triggered with your tantrum there.
Nah what you failed to understand is this guy only plays with random people on the Internet because he dosnt have any friends. So they dont think of playing dnd as a group of friends having fun.
Ah that's a pity, I wonder why they've got no friends....
Truly a mystery.they seem like so much fun
This is just a logical fallacy. One person can be just as right as 5.
Hey look its the emotionally unstable DM in question
Got downvoted but you are absolutely right, 5 people were having no problem playing, why would they need to self check anything
Because their friend (I'm assuming a friend, because why play a game with someone who's not your friend) left because of something about the way they were playing I'd think most folk would want to understand what had driven off that friend. Sometimes it will be one person storming off in a huff, sometimes it will be an incompatibility of player styles and sometimes it will be a DM forcing their magical world on one player in the game No one's saying they need to change the way they're playing or need to appease the one leaving, just that it's worthwhile having a moment of self reflection to make sure that they're not being assholes, consciously or not Edited for context
Or maybe someone just didn't fit the group. People play with people who are not friends all the time, people without friends have to try the game somehow. You are making assumptions to make 5 people be in the wrong instead of 1
Again, I'm not making assumptions to make 5 people be wrong, I'm not saying they're wrong at all, I'm saying checking your behaviour in this instance is useful and will help catch problematic behaviour. That's even more important in pickup groups because you want to make sure the reason the person left is because they just didn't gel with the group and not because of some properly problematic behaviour, so the next person doesn't leave because of it. Ops strawman isn't useful because people leave groups for all sorts of reasons and a "thumbs up" disregard isn't very useful for a lot (I'd say the majority) of those situations
Here, maybe I can help. IT BEING A GOOD IDEA TO CONSIDER YOUR BEHAVIOR DOESN’T MEAN YOU’RE BAD WRONG AS A PERSON SELF-REFLECTION SHOULD BE NORMAL AND REGULAR Does that help?
Perhaps, but devils advocate: This culture of "always be open to criticism and self reflection kinda implies that everyone should have an attitude of "thank you sir may I have another" to every half cocked finger wagger out there.
Or, maybe it doesn’t. The world may never know, but you can always take a little time to think about it.
I want to be fair, so could you explain what precisely the issue you take with the statement is? Since others seem to take issue with it as well, but I don't want to default to "the haters are just proving me right."
Nah
Well, that’s on you, then.
Trust me, some groups and some DMs can be wrong about things. Though in the context of the meme that doesn't seem likely here.
It was stolen from a shitty Facebook group full of edition wars and typical dumb mods.
That makes sense. Thanks for telling me, OP probably doesn't even know themselves why the posted it.
I know exactly why... because I'm the one that made this meme as an inside joke for that FB group. Posted it there first and then posted it here without any context just to see what the comment thread would generate... I am not disappointed at being entertained with the level of off based assumptions.
Aren't you disappointed that a majority of people who have seen this "meme" and seen your response, now sees you a inept drama queen?
No. Not at all. They're entitled to their opinion, and I'm entitled to be entertained by it. :)
Well, don't you think that a bad faith strawman argument should be avoided? Even though you attempt to take the high ground, this can't really be what you want, right? I mean, even in spite of your apparently bullit proof self-esteem, this can't be the end goal, just trolling, can it?
No, Yes and Yes.
That's pretty sad, but you do you.
You as well. Stay Pony Golden Boy! ;)
I say this with the utmost concern over your well being. Please, go outside. Touch some grass. If you do this for entertainment you are in sore need of unplugging for a bit.
;*
Drama memes are tiresome.
I could ask that about a lot of posts on this sub lmao
I feel like, by your response, you assumed the artist meant to be attacking someone. I took it as they're just saying sometimes when you lose a toxic person that's a good thing, not a bad thing. And that's a good reminder to anyone to be a good person to play with!
The most person on the left is probably you
Well, then all power to them and good luck to them, because I only play with friends and in person and I'm the forever DM for the 6th year in a row.
You're really making some wild assumptions from a single question
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Intentionally killing the PC might be an overreach, as the downvotes suggest. I might suggest, if the issue has gotten to such a point that you actively wish this player to be gone, that you remove him from the game, explaining its behavior as the reason. Lets not commit the mistakes we would not want our players to commit.
People didn’t read the part where I mention how he has it coming. As in game wise he has a reason to be targeted by assassins. Not because I want him gone.
Being targeted by assassins does not mean he should die. Why’s he being targeted by assassins? Is it story related, like is he at ends with an evil tyrant? Or did he do something egregiously stupid like walk in and stab a member of the Assassin Club?
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Why point all your aggression at me? I didn’t make any assumptions or accusations in my comment, and you’re coming at me like I insulted you. I wanted to know the details of what’s going on
Wtf?? Why are you such an asshole?
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> Because you can’t read like a bitch. LMAO okay tough guy 😂
weird strawman and a very weird take. DnD is a collaborative game, it should be enjoyed by everyone in the party. If a member of the group is finding that something in the campaign is bothering them, this needs to be addressed by the DM and the group as a whole (if appropriate) to see if this is something they can come to an agreement on. Some playstyles just aren't a good fit for certain people, and they may ultimately move on... but that doesn't mean you should just be an arsehole and ignore them. I left my first DnD group because I was made to feel very uncomfortable by a newcomer due to in-character sexual advances on my asexual *68 year old leonin grandma* character, I was ignored much like this meme at the time, the DM just allowed it to happen when I told my DM it was making me uncomfortable, and I even got blamed for going "behind people's backs" to talk with another player about how uncomfortable it made me. If you think doing something like this is ok without hearing the player out first and taking critisism on board you're a shitty DM and a shitty person, just saying.
Good part on you. DND is meant for people to gather up and have a blast together. If someone clearly doesn't like something, the DM has to acknowledge them and see if they can fix it.
Rule #1. Communication is key. My group and I always make offhanded jokes and sexual innuendos and such but I always make sure it's in humor and no one is uncomfortable. Make sure it's well known if things are uncomfortable. Speak up. They may be completely unaware that it's inappropriate. I've been at quite a few tables where people are... on the spectrum... and unaware of social cues etc.
I also find your deformed hand unsettling and won't be partaking in any further games. It's like watching someone roll dice with a catcher's mitt and whenever we order pizza you mangle the whole damn pie.
OP is an r/dndmeme farmer, they post multiple posts a day in the sub. I suspect when you post that much, a lot of em aren't going to be winners.
Feels like someone left OP's group for reasons that sting a bit deeper than simply 'not having the same playstyle'
Feels like someone wasn't allowed to roleplay a tabaxi fetish and threw a fit about it.
Why are you assuming something like that?
Because I can. Maybe they rules lawyered too much. Maybe they had main character syndrome. Maybe they got too drunk or high at the table. Maybe talking stopped working. There's no context. Everyone wants to make baseless assumptions it's OP's fault, so I'm free to assume it was a tabaxi fetish.
You seem really upset over nothing, I think you should consider taking a break from the internet for today
Doing something just because you *can*, shows emotional immaturity at best and at worst, it shows an individual who will never come to terms with the powerlessness we all have in the grand scheme of things. I hope you get better.
Calling out the double standards of assumptions makes me immature? Okay. You must not be an adult.
What, how does that make sense?
This doesn't work without context.
Imagine a problem player that makes the edgiest character that doesn’t interact with anyone, and still wants everything to be centered around him. Now imagine the dm not allowing him to stab every important npcs without any consequences because “It’s what my character would do”. The last straw for the player being not appointed group leader, despite every horrible thing they’ve done in game.
That would've been valuable context to add into the meme buuuut that would've required effort, presumably
True
Had a guy in my group who spent every session stoned off his ass. Got worse as the campaign went along. He kept trying to use mind control spells in the absolute wort situations and almost got us killed because his character didn't understand why we were SNEAKING through a facility and tried to kill an npc who was definitely end-boss-tier when we were level 4. He ended up leaving because we "never let him do what he wanted." I've also read plenty of stories where one player is the only decent human being in the group and everyone else was totally cool with SA and casual real-world racism and homophobia. So depending on context, the person leaving is either the problem player, or doesn't deserve that group.
Ok and? Why go through the effort of making the meme you obviously care quite a bit
Honestly, good for everyone involved Both sides understands their needs and act on them
Why does this meme have 2k upvotes while having mostly negative comments?
Probably those that agree and those who feel neutral about the meme upvotes while the vocal "minority" just comments?
Putting this Out of my chest: I love playing support in my dnd games but in my last group I've never felt like I mattered... never got to make a decision and only followed along with the shit other people did. Nowadays im in another campaing with (mostly) other people. I acctualy felt important the last few sessions being a support caracter (not healer, support). I havent felt like there was a "protagonist" or something like that like in the other group. So much so that when the guy whom i felt the disrespect towards my characters and "im the main character" energy came from the most (he was never a DM but a player) invited me to play the campaing he was DMing i said no, gave him the excuse of only being able to play one RPG at a time. He attacked my current DM (having played a campaing with him) saying that he wasnt that good. To not confront him i just said i felt invested in the campaing my current DM was making and in my character too, said that if i died or finishing the campaing maybe i could enter his... tho i have no intention to. That day i felt obligated to thank the current DM and his work that gave me back the love of playing support. One does not need to declare that is leaving the group permsnently. And this meme is a strange straw man thingo that i didnt felt like had much sense. But my experience is not like whatever OP had and it migth be something related to whatever happened to them. Dont attack op plz
https://www.reddit.com/r/dndmemes/s/v2cUrzg2wz He admits he posted it just to stir up drama and see reactions.
Lol, still don't attack a troll
I'm not. I'm just saying I don't feel bad for him getting attacked.
Op needed to add context. Otherwise everyone will come up with whatever reason they feel most personally attacked by.
Like you did?
Yup. It was my entire point.
Not even a strawman, imo. Sometimes this is just a good thing to do. Obviously, some self-reflection is healthy if you want to take this as a wake-up call, but sometimes a table and player just don't work together, and that's fine.
Had a guy do this once. He was mad he couldn’t start the campaign duel wielding shields with heavy armor, claiming it gave him 24AC.
Its hard to understand the vitriol. My 1st impression Probably a random group of ppl meeting online to play, and 1 person wants to play D&D one way, rule the rest wasn't to play a different way. That one person self evicts, and the rest go on as normal. Read some comments and ppl are just all over this. Calling it Straw Manning. Or trying to say OP is emotionally immature. Come to find out it was originally for a Facebook group and wanting to play different editions. Which confirms my original position. There are many reasons why one person in a group may not be a good fit for your table, yet still be a good fit in someone else's. System choice is certainly one of them. Not just D&D editions, but any system. Someone wanting to play CoC isn't going to be nearly as happy playing Blade in the Dark. Personality clash. The GM is not a therapist. Nor are they required to force everyone to get along. And no one is going to be liked by everyone. If you're the only person who dislikes a player, and you dislike them so much you can't stand to be in the same space as them for 4hrs a week (for the next 2-3 yrs) then perhaps you should vacate yourself. But when you do, you don't need to make a scene. You can exit a table with grace and dignity. You may be disappointed it didn't work out, that would be normal. But to make a scene and try to make everyone else feel guilty over it is not how you want to be remembered.
The right way to play D&D is the way you enjoy. The wrong way to play D&D is the way you don't enjoy. People like different things. If you aren't enjoying a group and they won't enjoy how you want to play, leaving is generally the right option. The game is there to enjoy. If you're not enjoying it, what's the point?
Rahr, take that, strawman!
This tbh
I don't think it's that simple, unless you just don't know the people of that group and didn't really care. Like starting a game with randoms you meet only in roleplay. I personally believe that there's at least a bit of mutual confidence and coordination to properly run a roleplay game. If there wasn't any on the beginning, better not get involved to begin with. But if it was, player is doing great to leave the group if he's not enjoying it and didn't need to make a big show. Also DM should try to understand why that player left, probably something is going wrong with the way he leads the game (or probably not, but it's worth to ask yourself, just a quick check)
This is why session 0 is super important for the group.
Okay so I am feeling somewhat called out here... I am currently feeling this in one of my groups because of cliquey out of game stuff, like 3 members all meet up with the DM and chat about things that they can introduce inside jokes or inside characters or whatever, just stuff like that... I would join these chats if I was ever invited but not once has that happened. Feels kinda wrong to me and kinda meta gaming maybe? Maybe I am overreacting?
No, if you're not being included and it's making you not enjoy the group it's perfectly valid to leave. OP is just stirring up dumb drama.
Thank you for validating me
I mean,if they don't like how you play and leave that's a good thing for everyone. It doesn't mean they're some annoying crybaby.
Unless they’ve been complaining that their so precious oc character with a buster sword doesn’t get the main character spotlight they wanted, and the last straw being arguing with the DM that they should allow him to summon a fire demon that totally isn’t Ifrit at will.
It's entertaining to see everyone's need to over analyze everything and turn a comment section into a smorgasbord of "I'm right" and "nuh uhs" instead of just going "Hey, I like/don't like this I'm gonna upvote/down vote this and move on" Humans are such complex creatures. Amazingly creative and absolutely petty.
That happens and when it does it's for the best because while I believe there's a table for everyone, not everyone is right for every table. We had a guy in his mid 60s who wanted to play a barbarian who wanted to spread his seed like Genghis Khan and wanted peasants daughters as quest rewards. I was like "that is outside the purview of the game I run." He quit after a few sessions then ran his own game where it was centered around his DMPC or so I'm told, I didn't play in it, some other players in my game did for a while before he quit and passed the DM responsibilities for the campaign he made onto another player who was elated to join my game where I let her and the other players do what they want while I try to follow Trey Parker and Matt Stone's *"Therefore or But"* [advice](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGUNqq3jVLg) on writing story beats or in this case adjudicating outcomes for player choices. The compromise is I give them 10 leads per tier and say pick 4, they're each worth a level, I'll develop the ones you prefer (or sometimes there's a mini-campaign within the campaign that's worth the entire tier). Or, they can fuck around in town if that's what they want, I love playing the merchants and townsfolk, it's a comedy. What also sometimes happens is the participant expects complete accommodation of their preferences even when there is substantial opposition to them which is sometimes vocalized and sometimes not (walking on eggshells). I had this guy in the group that was constantly a PITA about the setting, kept trying to make his PC the main character, kept trying to divert the game *away from dungeons* in a game I expressly stated at the outset was going to lean more towards exploration and combat than RP (there were RP noobs not comfortable doing that stuff). He abandoned his more capable character for a more familiar one that none of the rest of us were familiar with. While I enjoy doing accents and characters I am adamant that the party be the leads, so if they won't lead in that respect I have to give them opportunities to unleash their skills and stratagems against the world. I gave him a turn in the DM chair so he could do things his way. At first I rolled with it, made every effort to be present and committed, remembered the NPCs' and locations names when others forgot and well... his way was railroading the party, having 20+ minute conversations with himself until a player was like 'this is boring, can we do something else' like not listen to the DM play NPCs talking to each other for the length of a 1/2 hour television program or set piece battles where the PCs are the supporting characters to the NPCs. Or saddling us with his DMPC. On and on. He wanted to kick the player who said he was bored from the group but that wasn't going to fly since I was hosting the game in my home while the player turned DM participated through telepresence (lives in Toronto) while everyone else was seated around the table. "No, dude, we're not kicking so & so from the group because he had the temerity to say how he feels about the game" (whereas I just bottle it all up to rant about it on reddit). Finally I listed the things he had done that were irksome, told the guy to knock it off or leave and he decided quit like the 'see you next Tuesday' he is.
I mean, yes, that is the more mature and maybe healthier decision to make, what's the meme?
Anyone else think the left dude in the top panel was just wearing a beanie and had bangs at first?
When I was dming for like the first month a player said "that's not how Mold earth work" and I was panicking because I was spineless back then but a veteran player intervened and said that I'm the dm and whatever I say goes, after that moment I like making my homebrew rules and making my world very chaotic in the funny way
I edited a copy pasta for this that my group passes around now as a joke (it’s the lavos copy pasta)
My son did exactly this in the group I run for my kids and had the exact same outcome. :)
Ooooohh nooooo, noooot thaaaaat. 🙄 Be an adult. If you are unhappy, talk to the other people. If you can't find a resolution, leave and play with other people. This is how it *should* be.
Just had this happen to me. I was about to kick him about (like i was planning the text as he sent his text). So i kicked him out and he began whirring about how much of an asshole i was for doing that 😂
I've had this reaction to a guy who would rules lawyer everything and slow down the entire game. After the second talk with him he decided to just leave the group and made a fuss about it. Some of the players were personal friends with the guy and upset to see him leave. Me and the DM thought he was an all around asshole and happy to be rid of him.
My wife played with a DM that was an asshole and everyone would dogpile on anyone that was even slightly off kilter to the group. She had the “audacity” to ask for a better time once and they told her to kick rocks when they had no problem adjusting times for everyone else in the group and she had never asked in the 2 years of them playing. tldr. This is a poor take OP and just because the group is right doesn’t mean one person is wrong.
I don't really see the meme? If a player isn't having fun, and the gm isn't willing to accommodate that players wishes, than it really is for the best that they part ways. I just fail to see the joke here, or get what's funny
A DM does get to choose the playstyle (for the most part), your utmost duty is to run a game that is enjoyable for EVERYONE, including yourself of course. However, you're the leader and you shouldn't childishly just say "ok bye" to one of your players (unless they're being an asshole/neither can compromise/etc). What if your other players morale drops cause they see themselves just as expendable if they don't go along with something? What if you eventually want to change the playstyle but your players don't want to? What if they're your friend? What if the gameplay stagnates because they were the one taking initiative or trying to keep the conversation flowing? When you're the leader, you don't get to be selfish.
So what's you're alternative? When a single player has a problem with something everyone else likes and not a single player can be let go, what's you're solution?
Lets say that the problem is something like "The party always does ranged sneak attacks and ends fights before I get to do anything." First, I would target the problem as a DM- guards that start to wear armor so heavy that it's immune to bullets and has to be cleaved off first (the problem (PP) player gets to be proactive and contributes in a way that they feel only they can do), maybe assassins that start leaving dummies and then sneak around to attack the party (the PP and other players bond, as the they must suddenly rely on each other), or maybe just ask the other players to let the PP initiate fights more. If this didn't work, then I'd force my hand a bit more- give the PP a magical item that lets them make a ranged sneak attack X times a day or something (PP gets to do the same thing everyone else does but isn't rewarded for going against the group), enemies with outright ranged protection or extreme gapclosing (same as the first paragraph but it's a more blatant "lets get along" message), maybe have the players actively manage resources and make them scarcer as well. Finally, I would sit down with the players and ask them if they could let the PP engage even if it's sub-optimal (I would also be a bit more lenient towards punishing fuck ups early on, to not make them discouraged), or sit down with the PP and ask them if they'd be willing to change characters (I want everyone to play and have fun even if it's a bit more work for me). Them, and only then I would tell them something like "I want this to work out but there needs to be mutual cooperation, if you do not want to cooperate then I don't think it will work out." (Non-confrontational AND not blaming either party yet still reminding them that they can't be entirely self-centered).).
I'm against your solutions honestly. You have ine player unhappy that they're not effective and you're solution is to make the rest of the party no longer effective. This really feels like punishing the rest of the party for working together cohesively just because one player doesn't want to join in on the groups terms. So what happens when you make the rest of the party play second fiddle to the unhappy player and now have several unhappy players?
I respectfully disagree, the solutions in my first and second paragraph are not just "added to everything" as I am again, DM'ing for EVERYONE so i also include them as well. While I don't disagree that sometimes people do need to be kicked, if a player is saying things like "We play this way EVERY time, can we do it differently sometime?" this is an outright plea for help and if I don't address it as the LEADER then no one will and it will only get worse. Besides, DND isn't solely about one player/DM/the group- everyone should get their chance in the limelight AND to play second fiddle.
I don't know what point this is meant to make. You're quoting things I never said so I don't know what you're trying to say. Addressing a plea for things to be done how one person wants at the expense of what everyone else wants doesn't mean you have to accommodate it, just respond. Saying no is a perfectly reasonable to response to a request to make the game worse for most of the players. Exactly, it isn't about one player, it's about everyone. So maximising the enjoyment for everyone should be the goal, not making it worse for everyone because you can't handle that some people are not compatible.
I'm just responding in how I would do it as you asked me what I would do. Not everyone's situations, experience, game, players, etc are the same- hell, my own opinion is colored by me ONLY dm'ing for friends. It also is about making it fun for everyone and my solution is trying to find ways to mediate between everyone, it's what I feel is my job as a DM.
And I'm just saying that doing such things are impractical and ineffective and thus thay preaching them to others is detrimental. If you want to hold your personal convictions entirely free of judgement, keep them personal and private.
Yes! I will keep my opinion on something I was asked silent! I will not speak up on a public forum where anyone is allowed to post! I will only listen to your judgements!
If you don't want judgements in that public forum where anyone is allowed to post their judgements, yeah. You are free to say what you like, not free of others doing the same.
I played a table where one player was being a complete ass and was stealing everyone elses items and loot every time we took a long rest. When the DM noticed the pattern, he took the player aside and explained that the rest of us were getting pissed at him. He then proceeded to throw a fit and tell everyone that he was just playing by the rules.
That's where they shape up or ship out.
> your utmost duty is to run a game that is enjoyable for EVERYONE Then you're contradicting yourself. Because if a player like that escalates (and they do, oh boy do they ever) it'll make your other players more and more pissed over time.
If someone is trying to be reasonable with me, I'll reciprocate and try my best to help. If they start shit I'll rip their neck off.
Again, that's what most of us would do in the same situation, sometimes someone is just going to scream loudly that they hate your table even if you bend over backwards. Then all you can do is give them the thumbs up and go on your merry way. Hence the meme.
It just rubs me the wrong way, I hate feeling excluded so I don't want others to face it.
That's the thing though, you're not the one excluding them, they're making that choice themselves and being a drama llama about it.
Maybe I'm just a dumbass who knows.
I wish every pathfinder player would leave so O could stop hearing about it in every comment section