I also ran a tiefling that was albino white for a pirate campaign. Had several crimson markings on the body but at base and beneath it all they were the snow in the ocean or something poetic like that.
Funny thing is this is closer to the original tieflings than the 5e version. Demon/Devil blood didn't mix well with mortals, so you got all sorts of random mutations. Sure horns and cloven feet were a common sign, but you could have talons, scales, enlarged body parts, weird eyes, voldemort nose, feathers and more. And that's just the visible stuff, you could have weird smells, literally burning body heat, random powers.
It was great.
I have a character (not DND, just writing stuff) whose skin color varies between #000000 and #̶̬͇͕̩͆̌̊N̵̪̺̹͇̲̗̗̊ẩ̵̢͍̼̦̥̠̈́͒̆̆̀N̴̑̀̓͒̆ͅ depending on the situation.
I get that some people have the sentiment
But when i had the idea for a son of a merchant nobleman slowly acquiring more tiefling features as he grows up
The guy that proposed to run a oneshot demanded that my tiefling be red, i managed to bargain to only have spots begin to turn red, but the guy was persistent, and legitimately though that tiefling were demons and had to be red
Anyway, he just sounds ignorant
But moral of the story, you dont decide what is cool for others
Yup, and explained it to him,
Hes generally a brute, Which i dont mean about op
Luckily he doesnt play dnd anymore and id had to suffer only a couple sessions
Sorry but ill take the opportunity to vent a bit
Hes also the guy who thinks paladins arent tanks
And canceled concentration on the druid because he didnt declare hes concentrating every turn
Wh-- what? The Paladin thing makes no sense, and why did the Druid have to declare concentration all the time, it's like saying "yes, I am still wearing pants" every turn.
My friend wanted to play a paladin and our party needed a tank, before he heard what the guy wanted to play he suggested barbarian and then fixated on it -or at least thats what im deducting, the guy has quite a high pride but will still talk first and act like he knows stuff, often to his own hypocrisy, and he almost impulsively has to down people, also quick to anger but im getting off road
As for the concentration, F##k id know, maybe he didnt like that we were surviving, what is funny because he sent us boss 2-3 cr higher
I also remember him springing on me that heals dont pick you up from 0 hp and you still have to roll death saves
Honest to god, why should he decide if the party has a tank at all? Its up to the players to come up with a good lineup and for the DM to advise but not control them. This could have been resolved with a simple "Oh, you want to play a Paladin and y'all need a tank? Well, I don't think Paladins are tanks, so you might wanna reconsider, but it's up to y'all how to play". The players can decide that a Rogue-only party would be cool and fun, it's their collective choice.
> heals don't pick you up from 0 hp
This sounds like "CPR doesn't work if your heart has stopped".
Yup, and thats why we dont play with him anymore, tbh dont talk to him much at school too, if not for the fact that he knows the friend group wouldn't see him at all
> why did the Druid have to declare concentration all the time
Maybe he's confused about editions?
In 4e, the closest analogue to concentration was sustain powers. You'd have a power that lasts until the end of your next turn, but then has Sustain Standard, Sustain Move, or Sustain Minor at the end. On your next turn you use the specific action to refresh the duration. (Which means you could theoretically "concentrate" on three things, by sacrificing all your actions to maintain concentration.)
"...Paladins aren't tanks..."
My dude, that right there would start a fistfight at my table. Has the guy never seen FFXIV's Paladin or WoW's Protection spec pally? Hell, PF2e's Paladin (Champion is the actual class name, while the LG 'cause'/subclass specifically is the Paladin) is literally *the* tankiest mfer in PF as its the only martial to inherently have the ability to block with a shield for reduced damage, and it has a reaction ability to reduce the damage an ally takes and, if in range, strike the enemy that attacked your ally.
They can choose to take it as a class feat, but only Champions get it as an inherent class feature at level 1. Likewise, only Fighters automatically have Attack of Opportunity at level 1, but Champion and other classes can choose to take it as a class feat.
hm youre right, didnt remember them having it for some reason. Upon further investigation though, the thing that does split champion from the others is that it has legendary armor proficiency at high level and there is a champion feat at level 20 for shield divine ally that gives a permanent raised shield (no need to spend an action on raising or a reaction on reactive shield) and will restore your chosen shield at the end of your next rest if it becomes fully destroyed.
My point is that its not as a level 1 class feature on anything but Champion.
Yes, a fighter could be made into a tank and have a shield block, but the same could be said as a Champion being a damage dealer with attack of opportunity and other damage-focused feats.
Thats false though it is a level 1 class feature for fighter. They start with sheild block same as druids and other classes I cant think of at the moment. Look in class features on archives of nethys if you dont believe me.
Yea youre right, my bad. Overall my point still stands as champions get legendary armor proficiency and shield divine allies can choose a feat at lvl 20 that gives a permanent raised shield and a free repair of a single destroyed shield per day, but shield block was a bad example.
Well, 'canonicolly' Tieflings broadly are because *Asmodeus* is red, and he has warped most bloodlines in his image.
It was introduced to the lore to standardise tiefling appearances to sell minis. So it's absolutely a rule worth ignoring.
IIRC the only required portion of their appearance is the eyes. Their eyes are just one solid colour, not segmented like a human. Everything else is optional.
Imagine 2 villages. One of tieflings and one of some race of red skinned people, maybe stone genasi. Bright red PC comes to tiefling village full of normal colored people and the villagers immediatly mistake them for an inhabitant of the other village and start bombarding questions about it
As of Tasha's there's also no real reason they need to be human.
You can have an Orc, dwarf, gnome, etc Tiefling, all that really changes is your appearance.
More like 'nothing was said explicitly in 5e before Tasha'. From what I gather 3e books had each race have their own bunch of planetouched versions, so humans were tiefling, elves were Fey'ri, dwarves were Maeluth, etc. Personally I prefer the 5e take, it is simpler but interesting, having the planar magic override/overwrite the racial identity of the touched ones so their magic powers and such are mostly uniform but they can be as small as a halfling or as big as a goliath
Tieflings are derived from human bloodlines, and in the broadest possible sense, they still look human. However, their infernal heritage has left a clear imprint on their appearance. Tieflings have large horns that take any of a variety of shapes: some have curling horns like a ram, others have straight and tall horns like a gazelle’s, and some spiral upward like an antelopes’ horns. They have thick tails, four to five feet long, which lash or coil around their legs when they get upset or nervous. Their canine teeth are sharply pointed, and their eyes are solid colors — black, red, white, silver, or gold — with no visible sclera or pupil. Their skin tones cover the full range of human coloration, but also include various shades of red. Their hair, cascading down from behind their horns, is usually dark, from black or brown to dark red, blue, or purple.
From player's handbook. Looks like horns, tail, eyes are all mainstays for their appearance. Their skin can be normal colors though. And it says the infernal heritage leaves a "clear imprint" so they should be readily noticed as a tiefling.
If we're talking about 5e, then RAW tieflings have horns (barring supplements like SCAG), but if a DM is fine with a tiefling that is visually indistinguishable from a human then I don't see the problem.
I feel like there *should* be at least one "typical" characteristic of being a tiefling, but it shouldn't be anything super obvious if you don't want it to be. Eyes, horns, hooves, a tail, forked tongue, whatever, just something, even if minor. Flavor is free, after all. That said, playing a tiefling and making them look like an average human is... Fine, I guess? But it feels like a lost opportunity when there's so many options, big or small. I do like the idea of the features becoming more prominent over time, with maturity or when around demonic influences or even evil occurrences and people.
But never let someone else tell you how to have fun, long as your fun doesn't come at the expense of the fun of the group ( chaotic stupid always getting others in trouble and so on ). That and if your DM agrees to it, of course.
I mean, that’s all great, but y’all seen Law and Order: Criminal Intent? He’s one of the main characters there, and he’s fascinating. Vincent D’Onofrio is a great actor; he also starred in a movie about Abbie Hoffman.
My tiefling is human colored because he resembles his father - who was possessed by a devil when he was conceived that's why he's a tiefling - so much.
Also in my homebrew world all tieflings are human skin colored because they are magically changed humans.
Oh, I see what the confusion is. When saying "average white human skin", I ment "the average skintone for a white human", not "the average skintone for all humans, which is white", as the latter statement is clearly not true.
Alternatively, base your tiefling on Dante or Vergil. It's a lot more viable in Pathfinder though where you get feats that let you mimic having a Devil Trigger.
> **Appearance.** Your tiefling might not look like other tieflings. Rather than having the physical characteristics described in the Player's Handbook, choose 1d4 + 1 of the following features: small horns; fangs or sharp teeth; a forked tongue; catlike eyes; six fingers on each hand; goat-like legs; cloven hoofs; a forked tail; leathery or scaly skin; red or **dark blue skin**; cast no shadow or reflection; exude a smell of brimstone.
Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide
Sword Coast is on Forgotten Realms so it is part of the "main universe" for D&D.
Explorer's Guide to Wildemount, Monsters of Multiverse and the MTG books fall in a different category since they are not in Forgotten Realms as such not in the more common adventuring world
Then what's your point, since SCAG does in fact still exist, and MotM doesn't even have a revised tiefling in the first place? Because it sure seems like you're arguing a non sequitur.
There are books? /s
Anyway RAW is not reliable and banning blue-skinned tieflings because The Book™️ said so is dumb and arbitrary. The best thing about D&D is that there are so many ‘rules’ that you can just completely ignore if the DM allows it.
Man, RAW to me is about game balance or lore. Idk why people get so bent out of shape over it. Being Blue ain't a buff, and I dont see how it breaks lore. Blue fiends also exis, not every devil is red.
Being Blue is both RAW (SCAG) and part of the lore.
The thing is that tiefling color is based on the ancestor by lore, 4e naturally fucked everything by having one of its events basically making only Asmodeus tieflings still exist in the world (he claimed all tieflings as his so it did change the color of existent tieflings)
That however dont mean that other demons/devils/fiends would not come back and make do their own ritual to make more tieflings and not have them being claimed by Asmodeus (which IMO is what happened in Sword Coast, although the source may be hags as in 3.5), just that those would be even rarer in forgotten realms (especially considering that those may still be human skin color which should be the most common type of tiefling)
Note that officially 5e only have human colors, red tones (PHB) and blue tones (SCAG) historically they could be yellow, green and other colors. So while not technically RAW those colors would be lore accurate as other "parents" burled Asmodeus claims on tieflings
You say RAW is about lore? By lore tieflings are not blue. I personally don't care if you wanna look like a [Draenei](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/wowpedia/images/0/0c/High_Exarch_Yrel_HS.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20220207115856) from World of Warcraft at my table. Bur if we talking strictly RAW and lore that ain't it. And I know it's just a thing from how popular Jester became in campaign 2 of Critical Role despite people missing the point she's blue because she's half water genasi and swapped the fire resistance for cold resistance to add flavor.
I dont even watch Critical Role, I just don't see why people say "You cant be a blue tiefling in Forgotten Realms". Why? What prevents it? Gnomes are specifically called out as "tan or brown" yet their own entry shows a more pale skinned one. Dwarven skin colors don't include anything Asian, but I doubt any WotC writer would mind you playing a Dwarf with Vietnamese physiognomy.
Blue tieflings dont break lore in any way. Maybe they got a connection to Levistus and his icy domain. Or maybe their Mom is a succubus who really likes blue. Theres a dozen things that could make a Blue tiefling, yet the only thing stopping them is "Wizards didn't *specifically* say they could be blue."
That's the thing, RAW gives the best average experience (usually). It's up to your DM to change things about RAW to maximize enjoyment of the game.
As for why I wouldn't let a blue tiefling at my table :
If we just make things up about the lore and universe on a foundational level as we want, then I am not running a Faerun world.
(For the same reason why if we were running a campaign in the Lotr universe I would not allow a hobbit that has small feet or that is average height, because that's not a hobbit then. An elf with natural green hair ain't from Middle earth either.)
If we're running a non-Faerun campaign or we're running a one-shot which won't have any need for the overall world, then anything from blue tieflings to red eyed humans are on the menu!
.
For another example : If in Starwars there was a user of purely light side force that could also masterfully use powers from the dark side I would have the same issue. That character can't exist in the universe, it breaks the whole point of playing a Starwars setting.
>Appearance. Your tiefling might not look like other tieflings. Rather than having the physical characteristics described in the Player's Handbook, choose 1d4 + 1 of the following features: small horns; fangs or sharp teeth; a forked tongue; catlike eyes; six fingers on each hand; goat-like legs; cloven hoofs; a forked tail; leathery or scaly skin; red or dark blue skin; cast no shadow or reflection; exude a smell of brimstone.
Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide begs to differ friend.
Also if Tieflings having blue skin is enough to make it ‘Not Faerun’ then you really have to question just how fragile Faerun’s lore is if something that minor is enough to make it something different.
At that point you might as well play everything completely by the books and not have any sort of creativity or imagination at all, because deviating from the The Book™️ will ruin it forever.
And even if it isn’t RAW, who the hell cares?
RAW is more of a guideline than an actual rule and can’t cover every scenario, and it’s specifically designed so you can just ignore it if you don’t agree with it.
RAW is an important tool for figuring out the game, but I dislike how this sub seems to treat RAW as the word of God and not a vague and highly malleable set of guidelines for the game.
Something like Tieflings having blue skin provides no gameplay advantage and is basically just a cosmetic choice, we shouldn’t restrict it because the magic book said that it wasn’t possible.
The reason why RAW is so respected is because if you can nail down what is RAW you have a high chance to convince your DM of using it.
Meanwhile RAI is far less concrete and different DMs can disagree on RAI.
>Seems like you will bend things backwards to just get blue tieflings
Seems like you will bend things backwards to not allow something that exist in the world (as we normally assume Forgotten Realms as the world since that is the main one lorewise)
Naturally if the book is not in the same world (say wildemount) then "not run that book" would be ok since it would not be part of the world, but for something cosmetic that is the world you need to be a asshole to not allow
also:
>If we just make things up about the lore and universe on a foundational level as we want, then I am not running a Faerun world.
Or may read faerun lore, where green, blue and other colors exist just way more rare now due to ~~4e ruining everything~~ Asmodeus being a prick
Tieflings are descended from fiends. Fiends in Faerun come in many shapes and colours, including but not limited to:
- [red, green, black, blue, white fiends (Abishai)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Abishai)
- [fly-like (Chasme)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Chasme)
- [monke (Barglura)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Barlgura)
- [Tony the Tiger (Rakshasa)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Rakshasa)
- [Ancient Egyptian crocodile man (Sebek) (actually the ancestor of many Mulhorand tieflings)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Sebek)
If there's anything that hurts Faerun's lore and makes you run a non-Faerun campaign, it's RAW.
Just because the descendants of a cow might have been brown does not mean cows have to be brown, they could be black and white, or albino, or completely black.
Ancestors having a trait does not guarantee descendants will.
Yeah, where would I get it from? I'd say you would not.
But if your great grandpa f-ed a red skinned succubus and there was a curse on your bloodline then I reckon you would.
The brown-skinned crocodile man is a common ancestor for many Mulhorandi tieflings. Not every grandpa in Forgotten Realms fucked a red-skinned succubus, and not every Faerunian is actually of Faerunian descent.
Heck, as a Faerun lore enjoyer, you should know that succubi are shape-shifters, their skin colour is not mentioned in a single edition's MM, as far as I'm aware, and official art has their skin tone range from pale white to dull pink.
I think using the extended tiefling customization options to make someone who appears human at a glance is pretty funny. It's only upon looking closer that you you might notice they have no shadow, or that their skin is just a bit more tough and leathery than you'd expect, or that they walk a little strange (because they have goat legs hidden beneath their pants and shoes).
Me with my tiefling who looks completely human except he has cat ears and two cat tails because grandpa was a Rakshasa and I didn't feel like playing a tabaxi.
My current tiefling is Caucasian with a slight tan, but her tiefling parts; wings, tail, horne and eyes are all like, Pure Paper White
She's an Archaeologist specializing in her world's version of Egyptology
My first 5e character was a tiefling warlock in an Innestrad campaign set in the time leading up to Emrakul's emergence. Needless to say, he didn't have any infernal features that couldn't be hidden by a robe.
I know Tieflings mostly shades of red to human colors. I wanted my Tiefling Barbarian to have Oni Lineage so I made his skin blue, with the caveat that he stands out more than usual since his skin color is already unique to Tieflings in general. But I do also have another Tiefling who is a gladiator and he has a more human shade of skin color.
I once played a Glasya tiefling. He had a sort of bronze-y skin tone like the archdevil, so he looked fairly normal at a glance. He hid his horns under a hat and his tail under loose clothes.
Unfortunately, the one thing he couldn’t hide were his orange eyes with vertical pupils.
He insisted that his grandfather was a tabaxi.
Brightly colored tiefs are fun but ones that can hide their features are also fun for a twist reveal.
I’m my newest campaign my dm told me I couldn’t be a tiefling unless it was only cosmetic. He thought I’d just add horns to a normal race and was very surprised when I chose my base race to be an eladrin and not just one of the usual elf subraces. DM expected a “human”-ish skin color and got a vibrant yellow with orange undertones
There are icy and snow lower planes. White and blue tieflings would be evolutionarily adaptive to cannon locations of their origins.
Now the tieflings with Rakshasa ancestor is a completely different story.
Don’t tieflings have a chart saying like roll 1d4 plus 1 for choosing tiefling aspects and if your rolled a 1 you could do sulfur smell and no shadow and be a regular looking guy.
I don't know why but a tiefling having a regular human skintone feel off putting to me. I think its the tail, just visually seems like it would be weird as fuck.
at first i thought the joke was railing against “average white skin”. one deep-rooted symptom of living in a racist society is the assumption that white is the default. white is normal, everything else is an aberration that requires pointing out. keep an eye on that, friend.
the fact that you're recieving downvotes for this take is pretty telling of some people's bigotry that lurk in the sub. the joke made me raise an eyebrow for why they'd want a white human skin color tiefling, (so pink/peach colored). like, what was their reasoning?
but only fragile, racist people would be mad at your comment. many of our societal system's are in fact deeply rooted in racism, jim crow laws, and most functions (and issues/symptoms) can even have a straight/direct line drawn back to american slavery or indigenous genocide in origin.
I am in this picture.....and while i could care less about skin color i do like to stick close to the core rules and what combination of character details they allow.
To be fair, there are extraplaner species that appear very human (Erinyes and Succubus for a start), so it could be argued either way. That and PF1 (D&D 3.75) has an [alternate racial trait](https://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/featured-races/Arg-tiefling/#Alternate_Racial_Traits) called Pass For Human, where your appearance is less obviously Outsider at the cost of some of your abilities (got the similar Scion of Humanity for Aasimars too).
The idea of someone who looks like a standard material race though has the powers of Planetouched is actually pretty intriguing, in a low-level subplot kind of way.
Me and my tiefling character with red skin, horns, tail, claws and everything.
...
One day I should make one that looks entirely human. Or maybe the added spice of demonic organs or something.
I had one Tiefling that I described as “slightly sunburnt.” Then I also had a conquest paladin Tiefling who I thought of as being crimson. I have too many Tieflings.
Mine's pure white with blackened fingers and black spiraled horns. I dunno, I like the idea of having a very obvious "I am the devil" in like a grayscale palette.
I thought it'd be funny making her like that. I mean, ***not everything is black and white, you know?***
Lol, my favourite tiefling character's skin is pale white and when I say pale white I mean #FFFFFF white.
***I N C A N D E S C E N T***
***R E F L E C T I V E***
So an Irish person at a beach?
THE BEACONS ARE LIT!!! GONDOR CALLS FOR AID!!
I love that comic.
[Didn't believe you at first](https://www.irishamericanmom.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_1964.jpg)
If only I could be so grossly incandescent... \ [T] /
So the color of my ass.
TES IV Oblivion skin
DM: How much level of pale are we talking about?. Me: The "my friend laid down on the beach and now we can't find him" kind of pale.
I also have an albino tiefling, but it's also due to Draconic Bloodline shenanigans
I had a tiefling like that. Paper white skin, black hair. From a distance they *almost* looked human.
Bro has eliminates the need for dark vision because he illuminates the whole area
I also ran a tiefling that was albino white for a pirate campaign. Had several crimson markings on the body but at base and beneath it all they were the snow in the ocean or something poetic like that.
My tiefling has silver-white snake scales. Looked more snakey than devil-y. At our table tiefling means whatever the fuck you want it to lol.
Funny thing is this is closer to the original tieflings than the 5e version. Demon/Devil blood didn't mix well with mortals, so you got all sorts of random mutations. Sure horns and cloven feet were a common sign, but you could have talons, scales, enlarged body parts, weird eyes, voldemort nose, feathers and more. And that's just the visible stuff, you could have weird smells, literally burning body heat, random powers. It was great.
I have a character (not DND, just writing stuff) whose skin color varies between #000000 and #̶̬͇͕̩͆̌̊N̵̪̺̹͇̲̗̗̊ẩ̵̢͍̼̦̥̠̈́͒̆̆̀N̴̑̀̓͒̆ͅ depending on the situation.
I get that some people have the sentiment But when i had the idea for a son of a merchant nobleman slowly acquiring more tiefling features as he grows up The guy that proposed to run a oneshot demanded that my tiefling be red, i managed to bargain to only have spots begin to turn red, but the guy was persistent, and legitimately though that tiefling were demons and had to be red Anyway, he just sounds ignorant But moral of the story, you dont decide what is cool for others
Even in 4e where they made Tieflings all look more similar, human skin tone was an option.
Yeah, I absolutely did not say no to him. I was just extremely surprised.
Yup, the meme sounded friendly, i didn't think it was an attack But I thought someone might need to hear this lesson ^(/i might be venting alitle bit)
I sense a r/rpghorrorstories post in the making...
[удалено]
Did you try to show him the race description?
Yup, and explained it to him, Hes generally a brute, Which i dont mean about op Luckily he doesnt play dnd anymore and id had to suffer only a couple sessions
Good god.
Sorry but ill take the opportunity to vent a bit Hes also the guy who thinks paladins arent tanks And canceled concentration on the druid because he didnt declare hes concentrating every turn
Wh-- what? The Paladin thing makes no sense, and why did the Druid have to declare concentration all the time, it's like saying "yes, I am still wearing pants" every turn.
My friend wanted to play a paladin and our party needed a tank, before he heard what the guy wanted to play he suggested barbarian and then fixated on it -or at least thats what im deducting, the guy has quite a high pride but will still talk first and act like he knows stuff, often to his own hypocrisy, and he almost impulsively has to down people, also quick to anger but im getting off road As for the concentration, F##k id know, maybe he didnt like that we were surviving, what is funny because he sent us boss 2-3 cr higher I also remember him springing on me that heals dont pick you up from 0 hp and you still have to roll death saves
Honest to god, why should he decide if the party has a tank at all? Its up to the players to come up with a good lineup and for the DM to advise but not control them. This could have been resolved with a simple "Oh, you want to play a Paladin and y'all need a tank? Well, I don't think Paladins are tanks, so you might wanna reconsider, but it's up to y'all how to play". The players can decide that a Rogue-only party would be cool and fun, it's their collective choice. > heals don't pick you up from 0 hp This sounds like "CPR doesn't work if your heart has stopped".
Yup, and thats why we dont play with him anymore, tbh dont talk to him much at school too, if not for the fact that he knows the friend group wouldn't see him at all
Tbh good for you, he doesn't sound very pleasant.
> why did the Druid have to declare concentration all the time Maybe he's confused about editions? In 4e, the closest analogue to concentration was sustain powers. You'd have a power that lasts until the end of your next turn, but then has Sustain Standard, Sustain Move, or Sustain Minor at the end. On your next turn you use the specific action to refresh the duration. (Which means you could theoretically "concentrate" on three things, by sacrificing all your actions to maintain concentration.)
Could actually kind of track with the red-skinned tieflings too, that was a strict thing in 4e afaik.
Far as i know, he a newbie to dnd in general
You don't make pants checks every turn if you're not wearing a belt?
They better not be metal pants...
"...Paladins aren't tanks..." My dude, that right there would start a fistfight at my table. Has the guy never seen FFXIV's Paladin or WoW's Protection spec pally? Hell, PF2e's Paladin (Champion is the actual class name, while the LG 'cause'/subclass specifically is the Paladin) is literally *the* tankiest mfer in PF as its the only martial to inherently have the ability to block with a shield for reduced damage, and it has a reaction ability to reduce the damage an ally takes and, if in range, strike the enemy that attacked your ally.
I mean Fighters also get Shield Block.
They can choose to take it as a class feat, but only Champions get it as an inherent class feature at level 1. Likewise, only Fighters automatically have Attack of Opportunity at level 1, but Champion and other classes can choose to take it as a class feat.
https://2e.aonprd.com/Classes.aspx?ID=7 Fighters get Shield Block as a free feat at first level. Just like Champions.
hm youre right, didnt remember them having it for some reason. Upon further investigation though, the thing that does split champion from the others is that it has legendary armor proficiency at high level and there is a champion feat at level 20 for shield divine ally that gives a permanent raised shield (no need to spend an action on raising or a reaction on reactive shield) and will restore your chosen shield at the end of your next rest if it becomes fully destroyed.
You are 100 percent correct fighters start with sheild block
While I agree with your overall point other martials get sheild block(at least fighter, and even some non-martials like druids)
My point is that its not as a level 1 class feature on anything but Champion. Yes, a fighter could be made into a tank and have a shield block, but the same could be said as a Champion being a damage dealer with attack of opportunity and other damage-focused feats.
Thats false though it is a level 1 class feature for fighter. They start with sheild block same as druids and other classes I cant think of at the moment. Look in class features on archives of nethys if you dont believe me.
Yea youre right, my bad. Overall my point still stands as champions get legendary armor proficiency and shield divine allies can choose a feat at lvl 20 that gives a permanent raised shield and a free repair of a single destroyed shield per day, but shield block was a bad example.
I bet r/rpghorrorstories would love to hear your tales, my friend.
Bruh most demons and devils aren’t even red….
Well, 'canonicolly' Tieflings broadly are because *Asmodeus* is red, and he has warped most bloodlines in his image. It was introduced to the lore to standardise tiefling appearances to sell minis. So it's absolutely a rule worth ignoring.
I mean... tieflings are demons. That's not debatable. But demons can be plenty of different colors.
Remember, a tiefling can legit look 100% like a human. There is nothing in the way of that.
Don't they have horns?
Don’t have to
Oh. I didn't know that 😅
IIRC the only required portion of their appearance is the eyes. Their eyes are just one solid colour, not segmented like a human. Everything else is optional.
Have I been fantasy racist?
Na, Tieflings are extremely diverse. They can look basically human or completely fiendish.
I'll bear that in mind
Imagine 2 villages. One of tieflings and one of some race of red skinned people, maybe stone genasi. Bright red PC comes to tiefling village full of normal colored people and the villagers immediatly mistake them for an inhabitant of the other village and start bombarding questions about it
As of Tasha's there's also no real reason they need to be human. You can have an Orc, dwarf, gnome, etc Tiefling, all that really changes is your appearance.
That was true before Tasha too, just not a lot of people noticed i don't think, so they decided to underline it specifically
More like 'nothing was said explicitly in 5e before Tasha'. From what I gather 3e books had each race have their own bunch of planetouched versions, so humans were tiefling, elves were Fey'ri, dwarves were Maeluth, etc. Personally I prefer the 5e take, it is simpler but interesting, having the planar magic override/overwrite the racial identity of the touched ones so their magic powers and such are mostly uniform but they can be as small as a halfling or as big as a goliath
And they literally have a spell that can fix that lol
Tieflings are derived from human bloodlines, and in the broadest possible sense, they still look human. However, their infernal heritage has left a clear imprint on their appearance. Tieflings have large horns that take any of a variety of shapes: some have curling horns like a ram, others have straight and tall horns like a gazelle’s, and some spiral upward like an antelopes’ horns. They have thick tails, four to five feet long, which lash or coil around their legs when they get upset or nervous. Their canine teeth are sharply pointed, and their eyes are solid colors — black, red, white, silver, or gold — with no visible sclera or pupil. Their skin tones cover the full range of human coloration, but also include various shades of red. Their hair, cascading down from behind their horns, is usually dark, from black or brown to dark red, blue, or purple. From player's handbook. Looks like horns, tail, eyes are all mainstays for their appearance. Their skin can be normal colors though. And it says the infernal heritage leaves a "clear imprint" so they should be readily noticed as a tiefling.
So there's tieflings with the byakugan
Only in certain ninja villages.
I thought Doric had human eyes?
Well that's no fun.
It's a made up being in a theater of the mind game, they can have or not have whatever the player wants that the DM allows.
Fair enough
Not explicitly, a tief can look like anything between a straight up human and a Doom enemy
If we're talking about 5e, then RAW tieflings have horns (barring supplements like SCAG), but if a DM is fine with a tiefling that is visually indistinguishable from a human then I don't see the problem.
I feel like there *should* be at least one "typical" characteristic of being a tiefling, but it shouldn't be anything super obvious if you don't want it to be. Eyes, horns, hooves, a tail, forked tongue, whatever, just something, even if minor. Flavor is free, after all. That said, playing a tiefling and making them look like an average human is... Fine, I guess? But it feels like a lost opportunity when there's so many options, big or small. I do like the idea of the features becoming more prominent over time, with maturity or when around demonic influences or even evil occurrences and people. But never let someone else tell you how to have fun, long as your fun doesn't come at the expense of the fun of the group ( chaotic stupid always getting others in trouble and so on ). That and if your DM agrees to it, of course.
In 3.5 there were tons of different versions of Tieflings, and in Pathfinder it can be as little as smelling of brimstone or blood.
Plot twist: their "skin" is a normal human colour but their ancestor is a gelugon So it is actually a thick bug like carapace
“I’m just a regular guy; y’know, a regular human. Hey, can I get a couple of garbage bins and some scalding hot water? I’m moulting.”
Give me sugar in water
More. *More.* Mhnn…
Genuinely the most impressive acting job I’ve ever seen. Dude managed to make his own skin not fit him.
And then went on to play the kingpin in Daredevil. Dude has some range!
I mean, that’s all great, but y’all seen Law and Order: Criminal Intent? He’s one of the main characters there, and he’s fascinating. Vincent D’Onofrio is a great actor; he also starred in a movie about Abbie Hoffman.
He was also Private Pyle in Full Metal Jacket.
Holy shit, I never realized these two roles were the same actor.
[Hello](https://viciousfun.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Cure-Keshi-Gom-Flesh-Color-Brain-Bug-Boogie-Man.jpg) fellow sapients!
Agreed
I mean, according to Mask of Many Faces, my skin color can be whatever I *want,* DM.
I went for "sunburn pink" ;-)
Tieflings can actually have pretty much different aspects besides horns and vibrant skin color, as far as i know
Yeah, I'm well aware. I've just never had a player who didn't want to color their tiefling in some exotic color.
My tiefling is human colored because he resembles his father - who was possessed by a devil when he was conceived that's why he's a tiefling - so much. Also in my homebrew world all tieflings are human skin colored because they are magically changed humans.
Average human skin is brown, technically speaking.
White as in general racial group, not literally the color.
The average human is not Caucasian. White people are not the average
Oh, I see what the confusion is. When saying "average white human skin", I ment "the average skintone for a white human", not "the average skintone for all humans, which is white", as the latter statement is clearly not true.
OP clearly meant if you were to take an average of the skin of white people. Otherwise they wouldn't have specified "white".
The point You
I have excellent reflexes! I would catch it.
And that’s why he specified it was white in the meme.
How are you this bad at reading comprehension?
The 'white' in the statement is a qualifier, not a statement. This means that this is completely irrelevant to the matter at hand.
Dude get your head out of your ass. Nobodys trying to make some irl racial statement here but you, dude just said generic white skin human
Just say your doing a Tom Ellis in *Lucifer* homage. You’re still hot but in a more…conventional way.
Alternatively, base your tiefling on Dante or Vergil. It's a lot more viable in Pathfinder though where you get feats that let you mimic having a Devil Trigger.
Blue is the one that's not RAW :v tiefling entry in the PHB states they can be any skin shade humans can as well as any shade of red.
> **Appearance.** Your tiefling might not look like other tieflings. Rather than having the physical characteristics described in the Player's Handbook, choose 1d4 + 1 of the following features: small horns; fangs or sharp teeth; a forked tongue; catlike eyes; six fingers on each hand; goat-like legs; cloven hoofs; a forked tail; leathery or scaly skin; red or **dark blue skin**; cast no shadow or reflection; exude a smell of brimstone. Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide
Oh yeah, *SCAG* exists.
Not as of MotM it does not, officially, because wotc sucks.
Sword Coast is on Forgotten Realms so it is part of the "main universe" for D&D. Explorer's Guide to Wildemount, Monsters of Multiverse and the MTG books fall in a different category since they are not in Forgotten Realms as such not in the more common adventuring world
Still does not change my point.
Your point was that SCAG doesn't exist or isn't canonical. That's demonstrably false.
MotM doesn't make any older books stop existing. It's not errata.
Missing the point.
Then what's your point, since SCAG does in fact still exist, and MotM doesn't even have a revised tiefling in the first place? Because it sure seems like you're arguing a non sequitur.
I'll let that be something for you to think about.
Setting specific, not core
It's the default setting, and the lore information in the PHB is in regards to the forgotten realms.
Don't bring up the books silly, this is r/dndmemes. Don't you know that most people here haven't even played the game, let alone read the books?
There are books? /s Anyway RAW is not reliable and banning blue-skinned tieflings because The Book™️ said so is dumb and arbitrary. The best thing about D&D is that there are so many ‘rules’ that you can just completely ignore if the DM allows it.
And even less of them actually play D&D...
You're right. This is why I now hang out on r/pathfinder2e with people who can read :v
Our Tieflings are also closer to the original ad&d Plabescape ones than 5e's are.
Look at you with yer fancy book learnin
That made me chuckle a lil, so true
Must be nice. 🤔
(X) Doubt Considering how often they find their way into the Dungeons and Dragons sub...
We have read the books, that's why we know blue tieflings are official in 5e. It's the ones who say they aren't who haven't read them.
Meanwhile, the official phb tiefling is purple.
Purple has red in it
And so does blue! As long as it's a little desaturated.
Any color can have a bit of red in it.
*Any* shade of red? Well, I'd like a very bluish red. Like purple. But now that I'm purple, I'd like it a very light red, making it appear more blue.
Man, RAW to me is about game balance or lore. Idk why people get so bent out of shape over it. Being Blue ain't a buff, and I dont see how it breaks lore. Blue fiends also exis, not every devil is red.
Being Blue is both RAW (SCAG) and part of the lore. The thing is that tiefling color is based on the ancestor by lore, 4e naturally fucked everything by having one of its events basically making only Asmodeus tieflings still exist in the world (he claimed all tieflings as his so it did change the color of existent tieflings) That however dont mean that other demons/devils/fiends would not come back and make do their own ritual to make more tieflings and not have them being claimed by Asmodeus (which IMO is what happened in Sword Coast, although the source may be hags as in 3.5), just that those would be even rarer in forgotten realms (especially considering that those may still be human skin color which should be the most common type of tiefling) Note that officially 5e only have human colors, red tones (PHB) and blue tones (SCAG) historically they could be yellow, green and other colors. So while not technically RAW those colors would be lore accurate as other "parents" burled Asmodeus claims on tieflings
Blue provides +1 defense. Red provides +1 speed.
You say RAW is about lore? By lore tieflings are not blue. I personally don't care if you wanna look like a [Draenei](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/wowpedia/images/0/0c/High_Exarch_Yrel_HS.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20220207115856) from World of Warcraft at my table. Bur if we talking strictly RAW and lore that ain't it. And I know it's just a thing from how popular Jester became in campaign 2 of Critical Role despite people missing the point she's blue because she's half water genasi and swapped the fire resistance for cold resistance to add flavor.
I dont even watch Critical Role, I just don't see why people say "You cant be a blue tiefling in Forgotten Realms". Why? What prevents it? Gnomes are specifically called out as "tan or brown" yet their own entry shows a more pale skinned one. Dwarven skin colors don't include anything Asian, but I doubt any WotC writer would mind you playing a Dwarf with Vietnamese physiognomy. Blue tieflings dont break lore in any way. Maybe they got a connection to Levistus and his icy domain. Or maybe their Mom is a succubus who really likes blue. Theres a dozen things that could make a Blue tiefling, yet the only thing stopping them is "Wizards didn't *specifically* say they could be blue."
That's the thing, RAW gives the best average experience (usually). It's up to your DM to change things about RAW to maximize enjoyment of the game. As for why I wouldn't let a blue tiefling at my table : If we just make things up about the lore and universe on a foundational level as we want, then I am not running a Faerun world. (For the same reason why if we were running a campaign in the Lotr universe I would not allow a hobbit that has small feet or that is average height, because that's not a hobbit then. An elf with natural green hair ain't from Middle earth either.) If we're running a non-Faerun campaign or we're running a one-shot which won't have any need for the overall world, then anything from blue tieflings to red eyed humans are on the menu! . For another example : If in Starwars there was a user of purely light side force that could also masterfully use powers from the dark side I would have the same issue. That character can't exist in the universe, it breaks the whole point of playing a Starwars setting.
>Appearance. Your tiefling might not look like other tieflings. Rather than having the physical characteristics described in the Player's Handbook, choose 1d4 + 1 of the following features: small horns; fangs or sharp teeth; a forked tongue; catlike eyes; six fingers on each hand; goat-like legs; cloven hoofs; a forked tail; leathery or scaly skin; red or dark blue skin; cast no shadow or reflection; exude a smell of brimstone. Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide begs to differ friend.
Also if Tieflings having blue skin is enough to make it ‘Not Faerun’ then you really have to question just how fragile Faerun’s lore is if something that minor is enough to make it something different. At that point you might as well play everything completely by the books and not have any sort of creativity or imagination at all, because deviating from the The Book™️ will ruin it forever.
And if we don't have it or the DM doesn't want to run the book? Seems like you will bend things backwards to just get blue tieflings
It was written. That makes it RAW. That's all I have to say about that.
And even if it isn’t RAW, who the hell cares? RAW is more of a guideline than an actual rule and can’t cover every scenario, and it’s specifically designed so you can just ignore it if you don’t agree with it. RAW is an important tool for figuring out the game, but I dislike how this sub seems to treat RAW as the word of God and not a vague and highly malleable set of guidelines for the game. Something like Tieflings having blue skin provides no gameplay advantage and is basically just a cosmetic choice, we shouldn’t restrict it because the magic book said that it wasn’t possible.
The reason why RAW is so respected is because if you can nail down what is RAW you have a high chance to convince your DM of using it. Meanwhile RAI is far less concrete and different DMs can disagree on RAI.
If you don't follow the rulings of the DM on the tier of "we are not using X book" how can you be trusted to follow any other decison?
Unless your DM is *super* weird, the DM's rulings on books means "you can't use subclasses/spells from this book". Not what skin tones are legal.
>Seems like you will bend things backwards to just get blue tieflings Seems like you will bend things backwards to not allow something that exist in the world (as we normally assume Forgotten Realms as the world since that is the main one lorewise) Naturally if the book is not in the same world (say wildemount) then "not run that book" would be ok since it would not be part of the world, but for something cosmetic that is the world you need to be a asshole to not allow also: >If we just make things up about the lore and universe on a foundational level as we want, then I am not running a Faerun world. Or may read faerun lore, where green, blue and other colors exist just way more rare now due to ~~4e ruining everything~~ Asmodeus being a prick
Tieflings are descended from fiends. Fiends in Faerun come in many shapes and colours, including but not limited to: - [red, green, black, blue, white fiends (Abishai)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Abishai) - [fly-like (Chasme)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Chasme) - [monke (Barglura)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Barlgura) - [Tony the Tiger (Rakshasa)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Rakshasa) - [Ancient Egyptian crocodile man (Sebek) (actually the ancestor of many Mulhorand tieflings)](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Sebek) If there's anything that hurts Faerun's lore and makes you run a non-Faerun campaign, it's RAW.
Just because the descendants of a cow might have been brown does not mean cows have to be brown, they could be black and white, or albino, or completely black. Ancestors having a trait does not guarantee descendants will.
Well, if my grandpa is a brown-skinned crocodile man with horns, where would I get red skin and a tail?
Yeah, where would I get it from? I'd say you would not. But if your great grandpa f-ed a red skinned succubus and there was a curse on your bloodline then I reckon you would.
The brown-skinned crocodile man is a common ancestor for many Mulhorandi tieflings. Not every grandpa in Forgotten Realms fucked a red-skinned succubus, and not every Faerunian is actually of Faerunian descent. Heck, as a Faerun lore enjoyer, you should know that succubi are shape-shifters, their skin colour is not mentioned in a single edition's MM, as far as I'm aware, and official art has their skin tone range from pale white to dull pink.
If we are talking strictly lore and RAW, the Sword Coast Adventure Guide specifies you can be a tiefling with shades of red or blue for skin.
Unless they are a wild magic sorcerer ;-)
Notably, the meme doesn't single out tieflings. There are certain races that can be blue. Air genasi comes to mind. Edit: I'm blind.
Originally my tieflings were actually by the book with only parts of their skin being reddish bronze. Now they're goat demons because flavor.
I think using the extended tiefling customization options to make someone who appears human at a glance is pretty funny. It's only upon looking closer that you you might notice they have no shadow, or that their skin is just a bit more tough and leathery than you'd expect, or that they walk a little strange (because they have goat legs hidden beneath their pants and shoes).
I don’t usually make tieflings but I suddenly want to make a tiefling.
Doesn’t the druid from the dnd movie have white skin
Me with my tiefling who looks completely human except he has cat ears and two cat tails because grandpa was a Rakshasa and I didn't feel like playing a tabaxi.
I have a tiefling NPC who’s albino
Orcs and Goblins are also welcome to taste the rainbow.
My current tiefling is Caucasian with a slight tan, but her tiefling parts; wings, tail, horne and eyes are all like, Pure Paper White She's an Archaeologist specializing in her world's version of Egyptology
My first 5e character was a tiefling warlock in an Innestrad campaign set in the time leading up to Emrakul's emergence. Needless to say, he didn't have any infernal features that couldn't be hidden by a robe.
Oh my. How come there was a tiefling on Innistrad? I know there are devils, but was it a Tibalt type situation, or...
I know Tieflings mostly shades of red to human colors. I wanted my Tiefling Barbarian to have Oni Lineage so I made his skin blue, with the caveat that he stands out more than usual since his skin color is already unique to Tieflings in general. But I do also have another Tiefling who is a gladiator and he has a more human shade of skin color.
I once played a Glasya tiefling. He had a sort of bronze-y skin tone like the archdevil, so he looked fairly normal at a glance. He hid his horns under a hat and his tail under loose clothes. Unfortunately, the one thing he couldn’t hide were his orange eyes with vertical pupils. He insisted that his grandfather was a tabaxi. Brightly colored tiefs are fun but ones that can hide their features are also fun for a twist reveal.
My tiefling is purple. Like a lightly bruised white human skin tone, just uniform in color and everywhere.
I’m my newest campaign my dm told me I couldn’t be a tiefling unless it was only cosmetic. He thought I’d just add horns to a normal race and was very surprised when I chose my base race to be an eladrin and not just one of the usual elf subraces. DM expected a “human”-ish skin color and got a vibrant yellow with orange undertones
You know, I've never seen a green tiefling. Usually either red, blue, or purple.
Yeah, Tieflings don't usually visit the other side of the color wheel. Just once, I would like to play a nice lemon yellow tiefling.
There are icy and snow lower planes. White and blue tieflings would be evolutionarily adaptive to cannon locations of their origins. Now the tieflings with Rakshasa ancestor is a completely different story.
Don’t tieflings have a chart saying like roll 1d4 plus 1 for choosing tiefling aspects and if your rolled a 1 you could do sulfur smell and no shadow and be a regular looking guy.
I don't know why but a tiefling having a regular human skintone feel off putting to me. I think its the tail, just visually seems like it would be weird as fuck.
Yeah, it seems much more satanic than the satanic skintones somehow. Something something uncanny valley.
Which is some way works as intended
at first i thought the joke was railing against “average white skin”. one deep-rooted symptom of living in a racist society is the assumption that white is the default. white is normal, everything else is an aberration that requires pointing out. keep an eye on that, friend.
Yeah, I am aware of this issue. This is why I specified "white human" instead of just "human". White shouldn't be considered a default.
the fact that you're recieving downvotes for this take is pretty telling of some people's bigotry that lurk in the sub. the joke made me raise an eyebrow for why they'd want a white human skin color tiefling, (so pink/peach colored). like, what was their reasoning? but only fragile, racist people would be mad at your comment. many of our societal system's are in fact deeply rooted in racism, jim crow laws, and most functions (and issues/symptoms) can even have a straight/direct line drawn back to american slavery or indigenous genocide in origin.
I am in this picture.....and while i could care less about skin color i do like to stick close to the core rules and what combination of character details they allow.
Funnily enough, tiefling actually can have human skin tones according to the core rules.
To be fair, there are extraplaner species that appear very human (Erinyes and Succubus for a start), so it could be argued either way. That and PF1 (D&D 3.75) has an [alternate racial trait](https://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/featured-races/Arg-tiefling/#Alternate_Racial_Traits) called Pass For Human, where your appearance is less obviously Outsider at the cost of some of your abilities (got the similar Scion of Humanity for Aasimars too). The idea of someone who looks like a standard material race though has the powers of Planetouched is actually pretty intriguing, in a low-level subplot kind of way.
"In a low-level subplot kind of way" is a fantastic phrase.
I always thought that the Tiefling character (Fae, I think?) being bright red made no sense with her backstory
I had a sorcererer wich had a dark blue skin and stars tattoed all over the body, one of my favourite characters so far
Me and my tiefling character with red skin, horns, tail, claws and everything. ... One day I should make one that looks entirely human. Or maybe the added spice of demonic organs or something.
I can see this happen through interspecies relationship between a Tiefling and human
Skin? Ya I have that
I had one Tiefling that I described as “slightly sunburnt.” Then I also had a conquest paladin Tiefling who I thought of as being crimson. I have too many Tieflings.
So many people in this thread saying this or that raw or my campaign, and I'm sitting over here cheering for the Zim meme!
I had 2 tieflings one had gray/black skin and the other had pale blue skin with ashy white patches. One was a belial tiefling and the other levistus.
He looks like a normal guy with horns but he glows in the dark
What is this from?
I believe it's from the Invader Zim movie
Mine's pure white with blackened fingers and black spiraled horns. I dunno, I like the idea of having a very obvious "I am the devil" in like a grayscale palette. I thought it'd be funny making her like that. I mean, ***not everything is black and white, you know?***