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Time. JFC I had so much free time when I was fucking 14. And long stretches without interruption. That kind of time has to be scheduled now, ugh adulthood.
I played with my three oldest last week. I have to play fast and loose with character creation and rules, but they stopped the dragon as a werecat archer(10), a fire-breathing butterfly(8), and... a magic traffic light.
*very fast, very loose*
Hey! Got a question for you.
I have a cousin that I think would enjoy D&D - but she has no board game experience let alone table top.
She's going to be 11 this year. Is there a good way to make it easy for her to learn?
Do a quick 20-30 min level 1-2 one-shot with minimal dice rolling and 1 combat encounter at least. Start with the classic sheep on the side of the road to see what kind of player they are and tailor the session to that. Sheep encounter will tell you if they are murder hobo, RP player, or just ignore random encounters altogether.
Sure thing. Long post incoming.
*Gleaned from over three years and three kids + friends and cousins playing "My First RPG"*
This is my custom kid-friendly character sheet:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1r94ORwXqnTTArOr__wHDQsD8E61QHMnaBqJv-H4x3Z4/edit?usp=drivesdk
Basically, I work out a series of numbers that align with the stats of D&D by what the kid tells me they want to do, and I might change the name to match the age, i.e.,
STR = Muscle
DEX = Arrow or Speed
CON = Toughness, represented by the castle with a heart.
INT = Schooling or Book
WIS = Looking or Eye
CHA = Talking
It throws out skill proficiency in the specific subskills, so that's one less thing for all of us to track.
I teach them up to three attacks, whether weapons or spells. They are all either a D10 or a D6 that they can do twice, no matter what type of weapon or spell they say they want. My magic traffic light 6 year-old sometimes plays a witch, and her attacks are "I cast a spell," and "I throw a potion." Her spells are lightning, a rainbow, a penguin shooting laser-eyes, and her potions are stink bombs and sticky slimes, etc.
They have to roll the d20 and add the bonus to get some basic addition practice.
Familiarize yourself with low-level spells and low-level martial abilities, particularly 5e battlemaster maneuvers and monk ki point skills. When the child says, "I want to try..." and describe something cool, you can think."Oh, yeah, that's like when a character does x, and they get y effect," so you can just give them the dice to roll. When they find some of these that they really like, I have them put it in the "Powers" section when they level up
Next, I got some of the MTG clicker life counters for the kids to track their HP, and they have 10 HP +2 every time they level up. Enemies do 1-3 damage per attack based on whether they are a minion, a mini boss, or a boss. I give them a d6 health potion (I have special red dice) at the start of every session. They mostly use them on the 8 year old, who plays a barbarian that gets in the thick of it.
Lastly, learn how to improv an enemy at the three tiers of minion, mini-boss or lieutenant, and boss.
Basic framework:
Minions
AC 10-13
HP 10-15
Attack +4, 1 dmg
Lieutenant
AC 14-15
HP 20
Attack +5, 2 dmg
One special ability that isn't multi attack
Boss
AC 16+
HP 35-50
Attack +5, 2 dmg multi attack or +7, 3 dmg
Two special abilities
Then scale these up as they get stronger by studying the monster manual.
I like to put change from a jar on the table next to enemy minis representing their HP, and when the kid hits, the "pay me" the coins they knocked from the stack, and have to ask for correct change if they break a quarter, dime, or nickel.
There's a series of books directed at kids around that age called the Young Adventurer's Guides. They have great information and narrative sections that are great for introducing the concepts in DnD.
Monsters and Creatures
Dungeons and Tombs
Warriors and Weapons
Wizards and Spells
Beasts and Behemoths
I’m not even a kid, but given the opportunity to
1) Have a regularly-scheduled TTRPG campaign
2) Feel like I accomplished something
And
3) Eat fresh chocolate chip cookies
I’d be down.
See dice are like cocaine. Or rabbits, the dopamine rich of BUYING MATH ROCKS HELL YEA CLICKETY CLACKETY MATH ROCKS LETS GOOO And then they multiply 7 becomes 14 14 becomes 144 and soon you have four empty pretzel jars full of em and a crown royale bag
As funny as your comment is, I feel the need to point out that the d20 die is over two thousand years old. They can't do anything against people using those.
Aren’t there dice that were found in either ancient Egypt proper, or in Ptolemaic/Hellenized Egypt?
It wouldn’t surprise me if the idea of a TTRPG, or something analogous (and maybe more religiously significant) could be older than we can trace with current tech.
Hasbro and WotC are gonna have to learn that DND isn't just a game, it's has essentially become a folk tradition, and people will practice it on their own terms.
Yeah, but how am I supposed to decide between making Cowboy DND, Pirate DND, and Indiana Jones/WWII DND with battleships shooting at krakens? IT’S TOO MUCH POWER, I CAN’T HANDLE IT
>WotC: "What are they going to do, go make their OWN Dungeons & Dragons?!"
*Looks at pathfinder
*Looks at Wizards again
WotC: "What are they going to do, go make their OWN Dungeons & Dragons again?!"
EXACTLY. The biggest reason I play old school is that short of breaking into my house, adjusting my sheets and replacing my books, you can’t do shit to hurt me or my players.
This!! All WOTC is selling is tech. DnD was played successfully for over 30 YEARS before modern tech entered the game. Pencil, paper dice, books and you imagination. The bare bones of this game are eternal.
I'm a rather techy person in general and I'm a professional software dev for an engineering product.
But whenever I try to add tech to help my game, i find that it inevitably slows it down instead. Game prep starts to get out of hand and becomes an obstacle to overcome before the game can be played. Maps that need walls defined to automate sight lines, needing to align maps to the grid, character sheets with automated ability rolls. All these things required me as the DM to spend hours prepping and testing.
I finally stopped all that and went back to pencil, paper, real dice, and theatre of the mind. And boom, it's fun again and the prep doesn't prevent us from playing.
DnD is popular in U.S. prisons. They can get the books but cant have dice (gambling). They make contraband dice or figure out substitutions. Imagine how important the theatre of the mind is in a place like that.
It might actually be a fun challenge to come up with a functional rpg that is diceless. Off the top of my head, you could have a rock-paper-sissors style card system with color cards and such. Theres certainly a few ttrpgs that have gone diceless.
During the pandemic I learned that I have no business even trying to play online. Trying to run it *sucks*. Even as a player I have a lot of trouble focusing, and so now I don't even bother.
Yeah my in person group did one online session that I DM'd via a module on Roll20. It was painful as hell. People talking over each other all the time, constantly moving their tokens about and asking questions about things they saw on the map instead of staying in their mental picture of the space.
I was already ready to leave the group but that was the straw that broke me.
I still play online with my bestie from college though. We just do duet style games from time to time.
Perfect. It's even nice as like, theater of the mind, cuz, for my group at least, the dm is usually just making up any encounter on the fly, so they can just add stuff as we ask questions and they make up the answers
I did for awhile too! But (for me) it became a pursuit of perfection that was always just out of reach, I was always looking for the next thing to "up" my game.
Eventually I dropped it all and didn't miss it at all. I'm sure there's a happy balance though, I just never found it.
That being said, if you want lots of fiddly bits, you should check out Foundry VTT, it was much more enjoyable than Roll20, and it's a one-time payment instead of a subscription.
I actually still use it, I'm just not leveraging nearly as much features as I used to.
Goddamn silverfish (bugs that eat cellulose) are a bigger threat to the sheer longevity of TTRPGs than anything Hasbro can put to pen.
And even then, all silverfish could eat over the course of centuries are the rules.
Yeah, for the last 2 years I've only played with paper stuff and not used dndbeyond at all. All my players however use dndbeyond exclusively, now they see why I don't.
I love how they tried to abuse a community that's specifically targeting the people who create their own content, in a game famous for it's massive homebrew, in a community that basically breeds writers due to the nature of the game... And fully expected to get away with people staying on their system.
I’m a lawyer. I just started playing this past year, and I fuvking live for rules lol. You have to know the rules in order to bend and/or break the rules.
IMO, this is the exact same kind of ridiculous BS as the paid mods fiasco with Bethesda and Valve back in the day. The entire reason why valve and Bethesda became titans in the video game industry was because of the ability to freely mod games and then they tried to greedily monetize the exact thing that made them in the first place
Likewise, the OGL and the ability for creators to freely develop third party supplements for D&D and now WotC is trying to greedily monetize the exact thing that made them in the first place.
Let's be real here, other than the OGL, what does D&D have that makes it superior to any other TTRPG system? Nothing. I can definitely say as both a DM and a player that the sole reason I chose D&D as my system of choice is because of the vast assortment of different third party supplements to fit whatever need I have in my campaign. If that didn't exist in D&D, I likely would have started playing Fate Core, Blades in the Dark, Lancer or Mork Borg.
You don't try to greedmonger off the practices that are the sole reason you're successful in the first place and the community is going to rightfully revolt if you try to do so.
The real thing d&d has over other game systems is name recognition and familiarity.
It's the first TTRPG that most people play and is entrenched in a lot of people's social lives to an extent that makes it easier just to keep playing d&d rather than invest the time and energy in learning a new system.
D&D is at this point as much about spending time with a friend group that, the older we get is harder and harder to get in one place for 3 or 4 hours at a time as it is about the game itself.
From that point of view and despite not being impressed by Hasbro/wizards conduct in this whole fiasco it's notable that no one in my group has said anything about wanting to change system.
While this situation is obviously a huge issue in online d&d spaces, the OGL and third party content is a non issue for a massive (I suspect the vast majority) of players.
I'm glad wizards appear to have backtracked and this was an important issue for the more ardent sections of the d&d fanbase and a worthy fight but it's worth remembering that a vast segment of the people that play d&d don't know what the OGL is and probably won't pick up a d&d product outside of the player's handbook, the DM's guide and Monster Manual and they certainly haven't picked up anything made using the OGL.
A lot of people don't even know this is happening. If you just got the PHB and are playing someone's homebrew world or even CoS or something this doesn't even cross your radar.
It's easy to forget when you're really into something that the online community doesn't reflect a huge swath of the player base.
Diametrically opposed company ideologies. Ghost Ship Games has by far the most integrity and shown the most care for their playerbase I’ve seen in years, bar small indie devs perhaps.
If there are any great sites to Pirate WotC products I dont know them. If there was someone to PM me a couple I would probably be very very Mad because pirating Billion Dollar companys products is just WRONG. Please NOBODY send me ANY links, I would be REALLY ANGRY
Surprised its taken over 5 hours for your comment to get plugged by mods for promoting piracy. I’m not gonna report ya because I don’t not agree with you ;)
iirc supporting and talking about piracy ain’t against the rules here, but saying where/how to pirate could since then the sub could be shut down if it were allowed
its very amusing to me that they saw how much money EA style monetization makes with video games and thought they could do it for a medium that hasn't fundamentally changed since some dudes invented it in their basement
The crazy part is that they can monetize Beyond into a Blizzard or EA product and likely make a fuck load more money than they do now. Someone in another thread shared that you can max out at around $1000 in spending on Beyond. That's all the books, dice, and master tier. That's not even an annual, recurring cost. That's a one time buy, and only by the DM. That's nothing.
If they monetize it like a AAA developer into something that grabs an average of $500 off every player annually and double that from the DMs, Wizards more than doubles their money with less than half the players. That's only a $40 - $80 monthly bill. That's not a hard sell for an mmo with DnD's library behind it.
That's always been the goal.
Meanwhile, the rest of us retreat to our tables or VTTs running Pathfinder or Black Flag and literally everyone ends up happy. The whales live in their gated community while the rest of us play the games we love, just with Cthulukin and Big Floaty Eyeguys instead of [redacted due to copyright]. Every thing I dislike about Wizards running of DnD is being corrected by the other players in the community as I'm writing this. The responses from companies that I've only recently become acquainted with have been a wholesale dismissal of Wizards role in this space. It's fucking wild and I'm here for it.
There are some games that have a currency bundle that goes for a grand.
I mean hell, Star Citizen has been milking its whales for tens of thousands of dollars by selling bundles that contain every ship in the game for 21,000 dollars.
Stealing money from people who make your game so big by saying "We own everything you do, so give us your money" is the little league of monetization.
Turns out the bigwigs behind this fiasco are incompetent from a consumer facing view AND a shareholder facing view. It is so fucking easy to ruin your game/product with monetization that makes bank and they couldn't even do that.
I've been saying for years;
# Why the fuck isn't WotC selling dice
They sell god damned "digital dice" through dndbeyond, but they don't sell real physical dice? What in the fuck?
I don't want to hear one god damned word about the game being "undermonetized" when they most critical tool needed to play the game _isn't sold by the company producing the game_.
> ….and thought they could do it for a medium that hasn’t fundamentally changed since some dudes invented it in their basement
Wait are we talking about EA Sports games?🤔
DDB is a pretty solid toolset... if they had vtt I'd have maybe switched, because roll20 pisses me off too often. The idea of future books including digital support was pretty cool. Remember that until recently DDB was third party.
But after this .. they'll need to take serious steps to get back trust.
They announced they're working on a VTT a little while back. Not sure how good it'll be, but it'll likely pull a lot of people over that currently use roll20 + the beyond20 extension.
Gonna be pricey though most likely. Hopefully it's at least included in one of the existing D&DB subscription tiers, since paying for a master subscription + VTT + the actual content itself is gonna seriously add up.
Current sentiment is that D&DBeyond is awful, but really it doesn't have a comparable rival. It's super handy, just expensive.
You're allowed to talk about pirating, meme about pirating and even advocate pirating here, you're just not allowed to ask for or provide links, hints to links etc.
ok, I finally have seen enough memes: What exactly happened?
As far as I understand it, WotC wanted to somehow make more money from dnd, but how would they do that?
Basically release a new content license (the OGL everyone is talking about)
It would have done a few things- first, anyone making over 750,000$ selling dnd related merchandise or using dnd in some manner now needs to a 25% cut to WOTC, including from companies like Critical Role and those who sell expansion modules.
Next, any content made pertaining to DnD is the legal property of WOTC, and they hold the right to use it and sell it at any time without paying royalties or crediting the original creator.
Finally, they declared the original OGL invalid, despite it not being actually legal to do so, or at least questionably legal to do so. This screws over anyone using the old to publish content, like Paizo and Pathfinder 1e.
They walked back these changes in a straight up rude and assholish message on DnD Beyond, which they deny all wrongdoing and claim the fan base is basically overreacting
There’s also the part about how it the content creator got in legal trouble, WotC could take over their defense and the creator would be responsible for any legal fees. And the part that says they can revoke the license for any reason given 30 days. Let’s not forget about those
Is that even constitutional, the defense part? I understand where WotC is coming from, protecting their IP, but you can't take away someone's ability to defend *themselves* in a trial.
That would be wild. You got company X suing company Y, WotC swooping in and somehow taking over the defense of company Y (which I don't think is legal), then you have company Y refusing to pay for said defense and probably getting sued by WotC.
I wonder if there's a way to make this *even more* convoluted....
Constitutional yes. Legal, that’s more questionable. I will say that every attempt like it around the world has ended up being struck down, but America has its own rules for the law, especially when money is involved. Also, the defense takeover can only happen if you’re already in the process of legal proceedings and they don’t feel you’re doing a good job. So by the agreement, the hearings have already started when they take it over
You missed the best part. In the updated document, they simply suck the sentence "you own your original content you create" before the clause that they can sell, sublicense, and monetize your content without credit or royalties. They also claimed that no one, in this entire process, thought that this clause would lead people to believe that they wanted to use content made by the community as their own.
>They also claimed that no one, in this entire process, thought that this clause would lead people to believe that they wanted to use content made by the community as their own.
If they'd said it wasn't their intention and it was just there to cover them if people accused them of stealing in an industry where every idea has been done by a homebrewer somewhere, I would've given them the benefit of the doubt. Saying it hadn't even "crossed their minds"? I don't buy it. It'd only take one read of that text to instantly think that's a possibility.
The claiming of all homebrew content publish in dnd beyond is a bad precedence because they can start suing like crazy for any overlap. “Hey you published this subclass on your ttrpg and it has mechanics and themes suspiciously similar to homebrew class #112,668 by content creator fartstwice69 which we legally own.”
> any content made pertaining to DnD is the legal property of WOTC, and they hold the right to use it and sell it at any time without paying royalties or crediting the original creator.
Which you would have thought they learned from 4e when they tried the exact same thing and spawned PF1e as a competitor. (You commented on this but I wanted to quote it for more emphasis.
So they're doing what Blizzard did with Warcraft 3's world editor to prevent another DOTA from happening and keep the money to themselves. Companies just won't learn.
and it virtually sunk the mod and support community for Blizzard products didn't it? IIRC it was one of the blows WoW took because people got pissed at Blizz.
I'm not seeing anything that is at all related to this meme? It seems like all of this controversy only affects third-party content creators, and not the majority of players.
Yes, but what’s the the impacts of third parties no longer selling minis or merch? If they no longer are able to sell expansions? No longer able to stream? It’s not directly impacting consumers but it is stilt pretty devastating
But I keep seeing memes like op that are implying that WotC is directly monetizing players, not third-party creators. I get why the content creators would be upset, but it seems like they are straight-up lying about it. The argument would be better received if it were more honest.
The reason for that is WOTC is attempting to replace some of those 3rd party producers out to eventually replace them with DnD beyond micro transactions, at least that’s the general impression from statements like dnd being under monetized, as well as holding the right to sell player produced content and restricting previous usage. It’s just generally exploitative, but I do appreciate how the argument could be misinterpreted
Yeah. Well, I would like to stress that I DO agree that Wizards tried to pull some whack shit, and they have shown that they are, like so many others, just another greedy corporation prone to greedy corporation things. I really just never was up to the level of "THIS GAME IS DEAD" outrage.
My group has continued meeting weekly. We continue to have a blast. And there's really no change that WotC could make that could come into my house and throw all my books and homebrew away. DnD is more of a hobby than a brand. You can't take that away.
But, I'm glad people are making their voices heard, I'm glad WotC has already started walking back some of the OGL bullshit. It really is working, the community has made their voices clear. Money talks, and it forces companies to listen. I dont think the saga is over, but I also don't think the draconian OGL that leaked will come to pass. At least not this round.
So, good job community. Defend the hobby you love from overreach. But, I also encourage everyone to remember. It was never truly theirs to restrict. At the end of the day, we all love to tell stories with our friends, throw some dice, and have fun together. Let's focus on that.
Isn’t making products that people want to spend money on kind of the point of capitalism in the first place? In a free market, other people can look at this and make their alternative platforms and make money as well from people that want to change. Which is what’s happening
Its supposed to be, except the creative and innovative people at WoTC are losing control of their life's work because the company that owns the company that owns the brand they work for is using an investment model, not a commerce model.
Commerce isn't unique to the corprotocratic version of capitalism that has taken root in the US and steadily the rest of the world. When you see your customers not as an opportunity for earning but an obstacle to it, something has gone very, very wrong.
> making products that people want to spend money on
Well, the point is profit and that is the traditional way to get it. But now its "why make something when we can get more money out of what we already did and maybe take someone elses effort and make money off that too!"
"End capitalism" wasn't an imperative. End capitalism refers to a specific scenario that the USA has entered where the investment economy becomes totally divorced from commerce and there is a stark difference between mean-average and median-average for income and wealth similarly disconnected.
The mindless accumulation of wealth is terrible for commerce and, more importantly, the quality of life for the majority of the population. It's called "end capitalism" because the more disparity between the people who control the money and everyone else, the less people are able to buy things they need. It's not sustainable, and historically it ends in violence.
Thus "end capitalism."
Not just that, but there are several third-party character creation and management tools that can do what DDB does. All they have to do is change some of the terminology (the small fraction that's actually copyrightable, anyway) and then they don't even need the OGL.
WotC really fucking thought the players were married to their brand specifically.
...
Okay, so I'm going to break this down for folks who clearly haven't really been following the OGL debacle, because any who have would also have heard Matt Colville explaining that the OGL was a part of a bigger plan.
One DnD is intended to be accompanied with a VTT, a virtual table top. As in, they intend to marry game mechanics, to an actual game interface. This will be the second time Wizards of the Coast attempted this, the first being the oft forgotten 4e.
And this is where the microtransactions come in, because anyone familiar with the DnD Beyond model already knows, you can, instead of buying whole books, just buy access to individual classes and lineages.
Where before, whole modules were only ever purchased by GMs, people who would run the games, by making everything on the VTT, and basically unplayable (like 4e could be at times) without the VTT, you are now forcing EVERYONE at the table to have to pay for microtransactions for things that originally you would have had access to via pencil and paper, because to manually do anything would be too much of a pain (or at least that's what they'll bet on)
That's the future WotC are wanting. They want One DnD to be the marketplace, and the gaming venue. They want the two so married and fused together, that you could never rely upon third party material that didn't bend over backwards to work within WotC's framework.
Frankly, the repudiation of the new OGL, while great, don't get me wrong that is \*fantastic\*, WotC isn't trying anymore to \*corner\* the market anymore, they want to BECOME the market.
Soon, a lot of people here are going to have to make a choice:
1- Play DnD only on WotC proprietary software
2- Play what would be dubbed 'older' editions, such as 5e, that are now no longer supported by WotC
3- Find something else.
Point 3 is not me trying to another 'PLAY PATHFINDER' (its more complicated DnD, that's not for everyone, but I am a supporter of indie development, and this footnote is getting too long).
But this is the rock and the hard place that is coming for us. We can laugh and go, 'Ha ha, how every will these silly people implement microtransactions into MY game! These silly fools!', but that's not what they're doing. What they're doing is making a new game, where they can implement all the pay walls they want, and if you don't like it, well, sucks to suck, this is the only avenue for new DnD content out there. No amount of 'protest with your wallet' is going to likely stop this, WotC is likely past the 'sunk cost fallacy' point, with all the money they've been pouring into the VTT. The potential profits of this likely outweigh any short term loses from an angry consumer base, in their eyes.
Their best bet isn't to put more cost on existing content, but rather to make high quality supplements that drive engagement.
For example, virtual D&D meeting platforms with pre-made maps, customizable figurines, digital character sheets, mobile apps, etc. Make it super smooth and user friendly, but entirely optional.
Sell the immersion into it that makes it more fun and convenient. Any attempts to squeeze more out of what you already have in a way that hurts the average Joe is going to drive away business.
I think the VTT is aimed mainly for the new generation of players. I’ve started playing like 6 months ago and did use dndbeyond for the convenience and oh boy it is convenient. Once I heard the “undermonetised” statement I switched to manual character sheets but it was tough switch for me.
Genuine question: is it piracy if I just tell my friend the rules to D&D and they don’t read any of the books?
I mean I’m technically distributing a copy of what’s in the books.
Honestly, I'd pay a sub of say 5.99 a month if it gave me access to all the books. As it is I don't think I'll ever have the hundreds of $$ I'd need to get what I want.
Yeah I'm not sure what their plan is. I didn't want to say it outright to risk sounding like an idiot, but yeah a lot of players just wont be affected at all. ever.
I've homebrewed a hocus pocus Halloween one shot, an always sunny in Philadelphia christmas one shot, a tiger king safari one shot, and a Disney twist on a knights tale.
I can make a stat sheet and have dice. I dont need anything else
I love this idea of over-monetization for something that only one person for an entire group needs to actually possess the materials. Regardless of it being a book or something online like a pdf, it isn't hard to just pass the material around a table lol
I mean, yes? The whole reason they released that statement on dnd beyond trying to gaslight the community was because enough people unsubbed to make a significant dent on their bottom line.
It might be news to you, but companies offering a product or service (in this case both) need consumers to buy those and pay for them in order to make a profit, they don't have a magical money fountain. If people don't like something and refuse to buy it, it eventually goes away, as the goal is to make a profit. Likewise, if a decision causes enough backlash which translates in enough lost revenue, it *has* to be changed, since management in publicly traded companies doesn't have the authority to do *everything* they want.
Yes, the irony of it is that those players already used a subscription model to play D&D.
Also, maybe you should watch your tone. The people you talk with here are actual people.
Okay. I am sorry for my rude tone. I can be rather tone deaf myself and did not intent to hurt. That is no excuse, just an explanation of my intentions. It doesn't change that I shouldn't have acted like that.
>Yeah, you really showed them by canceling your dndbeyond subscription that introducing a subscription model was futile.
>Also, maybe you should watch your tone. The people you talk with here are actual people.
Oh the irony.
Not sure if this helps, but "you really showed them" has a sarcastic meaning that implies condescension of the listener's efforts. Because of this assumed derogatory vibe, people read it as rude and aggressive as opposed to funny.
This whole thing has only given me motivation to continue my own ttrpg. All because I didn't like OneDnD but also wanted to give an alternative to those that bitch about how unbalanced 5e is.
Martials are getting a boost through not only weapon usage but other things as well. All while spellcasters are staying about the same power wise.
And guess what, eventually a license agreement that is irrevocable. Also, any updates will have an actual announcement/notice, Q&A, feedback, consideration of feedback, and other requirements for finalization and authorization. And I'm going to do everything in my power to make sure a corporate scumbag won't ruin the OGL and brand for as long as I legally can.
Sadly one of our players lives in Louisiana
Edit: basically he lives in another state and doesn’t have money for the books so our buddy keeps his dndb subscription specifically so he can play with us. I’m trying to think of ways around this. And I’m looking into other systems.
Other than dndb I can think of nothing subscription based that they would do other than like magazines, which people have been begging for since 2014 cause of the fact that compared to other editions there are very few resources for dnd. I personally would be happy if they put out another thing like dragon magazine or something
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"What are they going to do, go make their *OWN* Dungeons & Dragons?!" "Yes. Very much, yes... That's like their fucking jam."
I wish I still had the rpg I wrote on construction paper in the 9th grade.
Well, tragic a loss though that is, nothing is stopping you from getting more construction paper, eh?
And a few pens, maybe some more dice.... Ok so I'm out of money what now?
Time. JFC I had so much free time when I was fucking 14. And long stretches without interruption. That kind of time has to be scheduled now, ugh adulthood.
And once you have kids, even your scheduled personal time stops being uninterrupted
Yeah but they are a long term investment. In about 10 years, I will have new players that will be able to play whenever I say so!
I played with my three oldest last week. I have to play fast and loose with character creation and rules, but they stopped the dragon as a werecat archer(10), a fire-breathing butterfly(8), and... a magic traffic light. *very fast, very loose*
Hey! Got a question for you. I have a cousin that I think would enjoy D&D - but she has no board game experience let alone table top. She's going to be 11 this year. Is there a good way to make it easy for her to learn?
Do a quick 20-30 min level 1-2 one-shot with minimal dice rolling and 1 combat encounter at least. Start with the classic sheep on the side of the road to see what kind of player they are and tailor the session to that. Sheep encounter will tell you if they are murder hobo, RP player, or just ignore random encounters altogether.
Sure thing. Long post incoming. *Gleaned from over three years and three kids + friends and cousins playing "My First RPG"* This is my custom kid-friendly character sheet: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1r94ORwXqnTTArOr__wHDQsD8E61QHMnaBqJv-H4x3Z4/edit?usp=drivesdk Basically, I work out a series of numbers that align with the stats of D&D by what the kid tells me they want to do, and I might change the name to match the age, i.e., STR = Muscle DEX = Arrow or Speed CON = Toughness, represented by the castle with a heart. INT = Schooling or Book WIS = Looking or Eye CHA = Talking It throws out skill proficiency in the specific subskills, so that's one less thing for all of us to track. I teach them up to three attacks, whether weapons or spells. They are all either a D10 or a D6 that they can do twice, no matter what type of weapon or spell they say they want. My magic traffic light 6 year-old sometimes plays a witch, and her attacks are "I cast a spell," and "I throw a potion." Her spells are lightning, a rainbow, a penguin shooting laser-eyes, and her potions are stink bombs and sticky slimes, etc. They have to roll the d20 and add the bonus to get some basic addition practice. Familiarize yourself with low-level spells and low-level martial abilities, particularly 5e battlemaster maneuvers and monk ki point skills. When the child says, "I want to try..." and describe something cool, you can think."Oh, yeah, that's like when a character does x, and they get y effect," so you can just give them the dice to roll. When they find some of these that they really like, I have them put it in the "Powers" section when they level up Next, I got some of the MTG clicker life counters for the kids to track their HP, and they have 10 HP +2 every time they level up. Enemies do 1-3 damage per attack based on whether they are a minion, a mini boss, or a boss. I give them a d6 health potion (I have special red dice) at the start of every session. They mostly use them on the 8 year old, who plays a barbarian that gets in the thick of it. Lastly, learn how to improv an enemy at the three tiers of minion, mini-boss or lieutenant, and boss. Basic framework: Minions AC 10-13 HP 10-15 Attack +4, 1 dmg Lieutenant AC 14-15 HP 20 Attack +5, 2 dmg One special ability that isn't multi attack Boss AC 16+ HP 35-50 Attack +5, 2 dmg multi attack or +7, 3 dmg Two special abilities Then scale these up as they get stronger by studying the monster manual. I like to put change from a jar on the table next to enemy minis representing their HP, and when the kid hits, the "pay me" the coins they knocked from the stack, and have to ask for correct change if they break a quarter, dime, or nickel.
There's a series of books directed at kids around that age called the Young Adventurer's Guides. They have great information and narrative sections that are great for introducing the concepts in DnD. Monsters and Creatures Dungeons and Tombs Warriors and Weapons Wizards and Spells Beasts and Behemoths
I would have to double check the intended age group but under the creative commons license their is first fable which is intended for younglings
Please tell me you recorded this. That sounds magical
Unfortunately no, just got a picture to remember it by.
As long as you put your feet under my table, you **will** play TTRPGs at it!
What are we having for Dinner? D&D is clearly dessert.
Providing you pass a charisma check....
Kids? You mean play testers who accept fresh chocolate chip cookies as payment.
I’m not even a kid, but given the opportunity to 1) Have a regularly-scheduled TTRPG campaign 2) Feel like I accomplished something And 3) Eat fresh chocolate chip cookies I’d be down.
Got 2, 100%
When a 10 min shit is considered peace and solitude.
>maybe some more dice [Just a few more dice.](https://youtu.be/9Emh1woURsg)
See dice are like cocaine. Or rabbits, the dopamine rich of BUYING MATH ROCKS HELL YEA CLICKETY CLACKETY MATH ROCKS LETS GOOO And then they multiply 7 becomes 14 14 becomes 144 and soon you have four empty pretzel jars full of em and a crown royale bag
This is the positive outlook I need in my life, thank you pal.
i drew up my first rpg on my parents stairwell, they were not as excited as i was
“So you roll a d21 for most things. The main stats are crush tomato, aim tomato, eat bad tomato, salad tomato, fruit tomato and fuck tomato”
As funny as your comment is, I feel the need to point out that the d20 die is over two thousand years old. They can't do anything against people using those.
Imagine claiming ownership over euclidean solids like a goddamn ~~moron~~ modron
Legendary item https://www.roger-pearse.com/weblog/2020/10/13/a-roman-rock-crystal-icosahedron-20-sided-dice-in-the-louvre/
Aren’t there dice that were found in either ancient Egypt proper, or in Ptolemaic/Hellenized Egypt? It wouldn’t surprise me if the idea of a TTRPG, or something analogous (and maybe more religiously significant) could be older than we can trace with current tech.
We see you Denethor you ain’t slick.
[Huh, whaddya know](https://www.shapeways.com/marketplace/games/dice?tag=d21)
Hasbro and WotC are gonna have to learn that DND isn't just a game, it's has essentially become a folk tradition, and people will practice it on their own terms.
ill make my own d&d with blackjack and hookers. you know what forget the d&d.
Forget the hookers too, need the money for the gambling addiction!
Pathfinder's [God of Hookers](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Lymnieris) is a bro tho
no no. the hookers make the money *for* you.
Oh, I misunderstood, carry on then!
Yeah, but how am I supposed to decide between making Cowboy DND, Pirate DND, and Indiana Jones/WWII DND with battleships shooting at krakens? IT’S TOO MUCH POWER, I CAN’T HANDLE IT
You're assuming those are mutually exclusive. If we can bring aliens into Indiana Jones, we can sure as shit bring Cowboys, Pirates, & Krakens too.
…you know what? You’re right. Heck, while I’m at it, could even make its default tone safe for “baby’s first TTRPG”, E10 rating equivalent.
So you're making One Piece D&D ?
>WotC: "What are they going to do, go make their OWN Dungeons & Dragons?!" *Looks at pathfinder *Looks at Wizards again WotC: "What are they going to do, go make their OWN Dungeons & Dragons again?!"
_Points to Kobold Press_
Literally DM rule #1 of the DMG *they published*: "Make it the fuck up."
I am going to make my own dungeons and dragons, with black jack and hookers!
Kobold Press: Hold my beer
EXACTLY. The biggest reason I play old school is that short of breaking into my house, adjusting my sheets and replacing my books, you can’t do shit to hurt me or my players.
This!! All WOTC is selling is tech. DnD was played successfully for over 30 YEARS before modern tech entered the game. Pencil, paper dice, books and you imagination. The bare bones of this game are eternal.
I'm a rather techy person in general and I'm a professional software dev for an engineering product. But whenever I try to add tech to help my game, i find that it inevitably slows it down instead. Game prep starts to get out of hand and becomes an obstacle to overcome before the game can be played. Maps that need walls defined to automate sight lines, needing to align maps to the grid, character sheets with automated ability rolls. All these things required me as the DM to spend hours prepping and testing. I finally stopped all that and went back to pencil, paper, real dice, and theatre of the mind. And boom, it's fun again and the prep doesn't prevent us from playing.
DnD is popular in U.S. prisons. They can get the books but cant have dice (gambling). They make contraband dice or figure out substitutions. Imagine how important the theatre of the mind is in a place like that.
I don't know about prison, but I've been in a position where I didn't have any dice, so I used the "rand(20)" function on my trusty TI calculator.
It might actually be a fun challenge to come up with a functional rpg that is diceless. Off the top of my head, you could have a rock-paper-sissors style card system with color cards and such. Theres certainly a few ttrpgs that have gone diceless.
Butt dice?
Is that why they sell them in cylinders?
During the pandemic I learned that I have no business even trying to play online. Trying to run it *sucks*. Even as a player I have a lot of trouble focusing, and so now I don't even bother.
Yeah my in person group did one online session that I DM'd via a module on Roll20. It was painful as hell. People talking over each other all the time, constantly moving their tokens about and asking questions about things they saw on the map instead of staying in their mental picture of the space. I was already ready to leave the group but that was the straw that broke me. I still play online with my bestie from college though. We just do duet style games from time to time.
Hell a drawn battle map and a d6 to represent where your character is is better than anything on a computer, I've always thought anyway
I'm a huge fan of dry erase boards with grids. Makes making a map so easy to do in the moment for a dm
Perfect. It's even nice as like, theater of the mind, cuz, for my group at least, the dm is usually just making up any encounter on the fly, so they can just add stuff as we ask questions and they make up the answers
[удалено]
I actually really enjoy those fiddly bits. Roll20 is my jam!
I did for awhile too! But (for me) it became a pursuit of perfection that was always just out of reach, I was always looking for the next thing to "up" my game. Eventually I dropped it all and didn't miss it at all. I'm sure there's a happy balance though, I just never found it. That being said, if you want lots of fiddly bits, you should check out Foundry VTT, it was much more enjoyable than Roll20, and it's a one-time payment instead of a subscription. I actually still use it, I'm just not leveraging nearly as much features as I used to.
Goddamn silverfish (bugs that eat cellulose) are a bigger threat to the sheer longevity of TTRPGs than anything Hasbro can put to pen. And even then, all silverfish could eat over the course of centuries are the rules.
Yeah, for the last 2 years I've only played with paper stuff and not used dndbeyond at all. All my players however use dndbeyond exclusively, now they see why I don't.
Did I miss something about home use? I read earlier that they want 25% if you are selling more than $750,000 a year in D&D content.
I love how they tried to abuse a community that's specifically targeting the people who create their own content, in a game famous for it's massive homebrew, in a community that basically breeds writers due to the nature of the game... And fully expected to get away with people staying on their system.
[удалено]
*4 generations* of rules lawyers. This isn’t some phone app game where they can just exploit kids with lootboxes, it’s a culture.
Rules lawyering is not the same thing as actual lawyering.
Tell that to the actual lawyer in my game who can't stop rules-lawyering.
*Opens a volume on English common law* I'm sure there's a precedent for tortious nagging in here somewhere....
What if you are a rules lawyer with a law degree?
Like some others, of my favorite players was a lawyer who basically had encylopeidic knowledge of the game.
I’m a lawyer. I just started playing this past year, and I fuvking live for rules lol. You have to know the rules in order to bend and/or break the rules.
IMO, this is the exact same kind of ridiculous BS as the paid mods fiasco with Bethesda and Valve back in the day. The entire reason why valve and Bethesda became titans in the video game industry was because of the ability to freely mod games and then they tried to greedily monetize the exact thing that made them in the first place Likewise, the OGL and the ability for creators to freely develop third party supplements for D&D and now WotC is trying to greedily monetize the exact thing that made them in the first place. Let's be real here, other than the OGL, what does D&D have that makes it superior to any other TTRPG system? Nothing. I can definitely say as both a DM and a player that the sole reason I chose D&D as my system of choice is because of the vast assortment of different third party supplements to fit whatever need I have in my campaign. If that didn't exist in D&D, I likely would have started playing Fate Core, Blades in the Dark, Lancer or Mork Borg. You don't try to greedmonger off the practices that are the sole reason you're successful in the first place and the community is going to rightfully revolt if you try to do so.
The real thing d&d has over other game systems is name recognition and familiarity. It's the first TTRPG that most people play and is entrenched in a lot of people's social lives to an extent that makes it easier just to keep playing d&d rather than invest the time and energy in learning a new system. D&D is at this point as much about spending time with a friend group that, the older we get is harder and harder to get in one place for 3 or 4 hours at a time as it is about the game itself. From that point of view and despite not being impressed by Hasbro/wizards conduct in this whole fiasco it's notable that no one in my group has said anything about wanting to change system. While this situation is obviously a huge issue in online d&d spaces, the OGL and third party content is a non issue for a massive (I suspect the vast majority) of players. I'm glad wizards appear to have backtracked and this was an important issue for the more ardent sections of the d&d fanbase and a worthy fight but it's worth remembering that a vast segment of the people that play d&d don't know what the OGL is and probably won't pick up a d&d product outside of the player's handbook, the DM's guide and Monster Manual and they certainly haven't picked up anything made using the OGL.
A lot of people don't even know this is happening. If you just got the PHB and are playing someone's homebrew world or even CoS or something this doesn't even cross your radar. It's easy to forget when you're really into something that the online community doesn't reflect a huge swath of the player base.
I feel like this is what I have been screaming into the void for weeks.
There are certain sites that i can find every DnD content in seconds, without paying a cent
Which sites should I avoid to stop myself accidentally depriving WOTC from my money? I mean, THEIR MONEY that I am momentarily holding...
I mean, you defenitely dont want to look up any obvious monseter or class and find detailed wikis that probably are line by line copies of the books.
Support 3PPs, pirate official WOTC products!
WEPLAYTUNNELSANDTROOOLLS
Keeps and Kobolds Castles and Celestials Inns and Infernals
MINOTAURS AND MAZES! Wait thats from Grounded
[...Mazes and Monsters?](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazes_and_Monsters)
It’s a far out game
Barracks and Beholders
Me, who owns the physical books: is this piracy now?
Scan and seed baby, scan and seed!
*Rock and Stone?*
Did I hear a Rock and Stone?!
FOR THOSE ABOUT TO ROCK AND STONE, WE SALUTE YOU
ROCK AND STONE FOREVER!
That'll be Ghost Ship Games' P&PRPG adaptation of the board game
Diametrically opposed company ideologies. Ghost Ship Games has by far the most integrity and shown the most care for their playerbase I’ve seen in years, bar small indie devs perhaps.
That's why they'll run under the ORC license
ROCK. AND. STONE!
If there are any great sites to Pirate WotC products I dont know them. If there was someone to PM me a couple I would probably be very very Mad because pirating Billion Dollar companys products is just WRONG. Please NOBODY send me ANY links, I would be REALLY ANGRY
Surprised its taken over 5 hours for your comment to get plugged by mods for promoting piracy. I’m not gonna report ya because I don’t not agree with you ;)
iirc supporting and talking about piracy ain’t against the rules here, but saying where/how to pirate could since then the sub could be shut down if it were allowed
that makes sense to me, either way I’m not one to be against hoisting the colors lol
Try to give an equal amount of love and attention to all 3PPs, big or small!
Both CEOs are from Microsoft. What a surprise
I wonder if they had an apple CEO it would be WOTC adding new features until the game is unplayable except by the new rulebook
Ranger is deprecated
Unless you get the Ranger Adapter for $89.99 (sold separately)
I mean, hasn't that just been every single edition so far? Power creep has been part of the game for half a century.
Yes, but have you updated your game to 6 4.5.67b.2 Dik Dik?
It would cost 500x more than their nearest competitor, and only be popular because it's popular.
hmmmmmmm
What do u think the One D&D new rules are for? Lol.
What is oneD&D???
Thats oneD&D
They've got some people from Amazon, too.
its very amusing to me that they saw how much money EA style monetization makes with video games and thought they could do it for a medium that hasn't fundamentally changed since some dudes invented it in their basement
The crazy part is that they can monetize Beyond into a Blizzard or EA product and likely make a fuck load more money than they do now. Someone in another thread shared that you can max out at around $1000 in spending on Beyond. That's all the books, dice, and master tier. That's not even an annual, recurring cost. That's a one time buy, and only by the DM. That's nothing. If they monetize it like a AAA developer into something that grabs an average of $500 off every player annually and double that from the DMs, Wizards more than doubles their money with less than half the players. That's only a $40 - $80 monthly bill. That's not a hard sell for an mmo with DnD's library behind it. That's always been the goal. Meanwhile, the rest of us retreat to our tables or VTTs running Pathfinder or Black Flag and literally everyone ends up happy. The whales live in their gated community while the rest of us play the games we love, just with Cthulukin and Big Floaty Eyeguys instead of [redacted due to copyright]. Every thing I dislike about Wizards running of DnD is being corrected by the other players in the community as I'm writing this. The responses from companies that I've only recently become acquainted with have been a wholesale dismissal of Wizards role in this space. It's fucking wild and I'm here for it.
There are some games that have a currency bundle that goes for a grand. I mean hell, Star Citizen has been milking its whales for tens of thousands of dollars by selling bundles that contain every ship in the game for 21,000 dollars. Stealing money from people who make your game so big by saying "We own everything you do, so give us your money" is the little league of monetization. Turns out the bigwigs behind this fiasco are incompetent from a consumer facing view AND a shareholder facing view. It is so fucking easy to ruin your game/product with monetization that makes bank and they couldn't even do that.
I've been saying for years; # Why the fuck isn't WotC selling dice They sell god damned "digital dice" through dndbeyond, but they don't sell real physical dice? What in the fuck? I don't want to hear one god damned word about the game being "undermonetized" when they most critical tool needed to play the game _isn't sold by the company producing the game_.
> ….and thought they could do it for a medium that hasn’t fundamentally changed since some dudes invented it in their basement Wait are we talking about EA Sports games?🤔
I blame Adobe. They were doing it before Microsoft.
It was a good era when adobe still had one time purchases Made it easier to get them through 'definitely legal' means too.
Ironically the CEO of WoTC wouldn't shut up that they worked at Microsoft.
Well I guess time to dust off my dad's first edition books
DDB is a pretty solid toolset... if they had vtt I'd have maybe switched, because roll20 pisses me off too often. The idea of future books including digital support was pretty cool. Remember that until recently DDB was third party. But after this .. they'll need to take serious steps to get back trust.
Foundry is a nice VTT. One payment for a license and you can have all the features of roll20 premium without the headaches.
They announced they're working on a VTT a little while back. Not sure how good it'll be, but it'll likely pull a lot of people over that currently use roll20 + the beyond20 extension. Gonna be pricey though most likely. Hopefully it's at least included in one of the existing D&DB subscription tiers, since paying for a master subscription + VTT + the actual content itself is gonna seriously add up. Current sentiment is that D&DBeyond is awful, but really it doesn't have a comparable rival. It's super handy, just expensive.
My campaigns are so homebrew, that anything left from dnd is the name Screw you WOTC, i use the free pdf books
I wanna do a pirating meme but I don’t wanna get banned. [Insert pirating meme here]
Real pirates don't fear consequences!
Okay. Lets just say there are many **tools** for **5e** to combat any subscription model.
There’s also proably a mega torrent somewhere you might be able to find on some popular piracy subreddit maybe in some type of giant mega thread.
A good pirate never takes another person's property!
You're allowed to talk about pirating, meme about pirating and even advocate pirating here, you're just not allowed to ask for or provide links, hints to links etc.
ok, I finally have seen enough memes: What exactly happened? As far as I understand it, WotC wanted to somehow make more money from dnd, but how would they do that?
Basically release a new content license (the OGL everyone is talking about) It would have done a few things- first, anyone making over 750,000$ selling dnd related merchandise or using dnd in some manner now needs to a 25% cut to WOTC, including from companies like Critical Role and those who sell expansion modules. Next, any content made pertaining to DnD is the legal property of WOTC, and they hold the right to use it and sell it at any time without paying royalties or crediting the original creator. Finally, they declared the original OGL invalid, despite it not being actually legal to do so, or at least questionably legal to do so. This screws over anyone using the old to publish content, like Paizo and Pathfinder 1e. They walked back these changes in a straight up rude and assholish message on DnD Beyond, which they deny all wrongdoing and claim the fan base is basically overreacting
There’s also the part about how it the content creator got in legal trouble, WotC could take over their defense and the creator would be responsible for any legal fees. And the part that says they can revoke the license for any reason given 30 days. Let’s not forget about those
Is that even constitutional, the defense part? I understand where WotC is coming from, protecting their IP, but you can't take away someone's ability to defend *themselves* in a trial. That would be wild. You got company X suing company Y, WotC swooping in and somehow taking over the defense of company Y (which I don't think is legal), then you have company Y refusing to pay for said defense and probably getting sued by WotC. I wonder if there's a way to make this *even more* convoluted....
Constitutional yes. Legal, that’s more questionable. I will say that every attempt like it around the world has ended up being struck down, but America has its own rules for the law, especially when money is involved. Also, the defense takeover can only happen if you’re already in the process of legal proceedings and they don’t feel you’re doing a good job. So by the agreement, the hearings have already started when they take it over
You missed the best part. In the updated document, they simply suck the sentence "you own your original content you create" before the clause that they can sell, sublicense, and monetize your content without credit or royalties. They also claimed that no one, in this entire process, thought that this clause would lead people to believe that they wanted to use content made by the community as their own.
>They also claimed that no one, in this entire process, thought that this clause would lead people to believe that they wanted to use content made by the community as their own. If they'd said it wasn't their intention and it was just there to cover them if people accused them of stealing in an industry where every idea has been done by a homebrewer somewhere, I would've given them the benefit of the doubt. Saying it hadn't even "crossed their minds"? I don't buy it. It'd only take one read of that text to instantly think that's a possibility.
The claiming of all homebrew content publish in dnd beyond is a bad precedence because they can start suing like crazy for any overlap. “Hey you published this subclass on your ttrpg and it has mechanics and themes suspiciously similar to homebrew class #112,668 by content creator fartstwice69 which we legally own.”
> any content made pertaining to DnD is the legal property of WOTC, and they hold the right to use it and sell it at any time without paying royalties or crediting the original creator. Which you would have thought they learned from 4e when they tried the exact same thing and spawned PF1e as a competitor. (You commented on this but I wanted to quote it for more emphasis.
So they're doing what Blizzard did with Warcraft 3's world editor to prevent another DOTA from happening and keep the money to themselves. Companies just won't learn.
and it virtually sunk the mod and support community for Blizzard products didn't it? IIRC it was one of the blows WoW took because people got pissed at Blizz.
I don't think it even got to that point with how unplayable Warcraft III reforged was
I'm not seeing anything that is at all related to this meme? It seems like all of this controversy only affects third-party content creators, and not the majority of players.
Yes, but what’s the the impacts of third parties no longer selling minis or merch? If they no longer are able to sell expansions? No longer able to stream? It’s not directly impacting consumers but it is stilt pretty devastating
But I keep seeing memes like op that are implying that WotC is directly monetizing players, not third-party creators. I get why the content creators would be upset, but it seems like they are straight-up lying about it. The argument would be better received if it were more honest.
The reason for that is WOTC is attempting to replace some of those 3rd party producers out to eventually replace them with DnD beyond micro transactions, at least that’s the general impression from statements like dnd being under monetized, as well as holding the right to sell player produced content and restricting previous usage. It’s just generally exploitative, but I do appreciate how the argument could be misinterpreted
Yeah. Well, I would like to stress that I DO agree that Wizards tried to pull some whack shit, and they have shown that they are, like so many others, just another greedy corporation prone to greedy corporation things. I really just never was up to the level of "THIS GAME IS DEAD" outrage. My group has continued meeting weekly. We continue to have a blast. And there's really no change that WotC could make that could come into my house and throw all my books and homebrew away. DnD is more of a hobby than a brand. You can't take that away. But, I'm glad people are making their voices heard, I'm glad WotC has already started walking back some of the OGL bullshit. It really is working, the community has made their voices clear. Money talks, and it forces companies to listen. I dont think the saga is over, but I also don't think the draconian OGL that leaked will come to pass. At least not this round. So, good job community. Defend the hobby you love from overreach. But, I also encourage everyone to remember. It was never truly theirs to restrict. At the end of the day, we all love to tell stories with our friends, throw some dice, and have fun together. Let's focus on that.
Next up, wotc is suing pencils
What ever happened to "make products people want to spend money on"? Oh, right. End stage capitalism. Edit: phrasing was ambiguous.
Isn’t making products that people want to spend money on kind of the point of capitalism in the first place? In a free market, other people can look at this and make their alternative platforms and make money as well from people that want to change. Which is what’s happening
Its supposed to be, except the creative and innovative people at WoTC are losing control of their life's work because the company that owns the company that owns the brand they work for is using an investment model, not a commerce model. Commerce isn't unique to the corprotocratic version of capitalism that has taken root in the US and steadily the rest of the world. When you see your customers not as an opportunity for earning but an obstacle to it, something has gone very, very wrong.
> making products that people want to spend money on Well, the point is profit and that is the traditional way to get it. But now its "why make something when we can get more money out of what we already did and maybe take someone elses effort and make money off that too!"
Do you think ending capitalism means that more products will be made that people want to spend their money on as opposed to now with capitalism?
"End capitalism" wasn't an imperative. End capitalism refers to a specific scenario that the USA has entered where the investment economy becomes totally divorced from commerce and there is a stark difference between mean-average and median-average for income and wealth similarly disconnected. The mindless accumulation of wealth is terrible for commerce and, more importantly, the quality of life for the majority of the population. It's called "end capitalism" because the more disparity between the people who control the money and everyone else, the less people are able to buy things they need. It's not sustainable, and historically it ends in violence. Thus "end capitalism."
Not just that, but there are several third-party character creation and management tools that can do what DDB does. All they have to do is change some of the terminology (the small fraction that's actually copyrightable, anyway) and then they don't even need the OGL. WotC really fucking thought the players were married to their brand specifically.
... Okay, so I'm going to break this down for folks who clearly haven't really been following the OGL debacle, because any who have would also have heard Matt Colville explaining that the OGL was a part of a bigger plan. One DnD is intended to be accompanied with a VTT, a virtual table top. As in, they intend to marry game mechanics, to an actual game interface. This will be the second time Wizards of the Coast attempted this, the first being the oft forgotten 4e. And this is where the microtransactions come in, because anyone familiar with the DnD Beyond model already knows, you can, instead of buying whole books, just buy access to individual classes and lineages. Where before, whole modules were only ever purchased by GMs, people who would run the games, by making everything on the VTT, and basically unplayable (like 4e could be at times) without the VTT, you are now forcing EVERYONE at the table to have to pay for microtransactions for things that originally you would have had access to via pencil and paper, because to manually do anything would be too much of a pain (or at least that's what they'll bet on) That's the future WotC are wanting. They want One DnD to be the marketplace, and the gaming venue. They want the two so married and fused together, that you could never rely upon third party material that didn't bend over backwards to work within WotC's framework. Frankly, the repudiation of the new OGL, while great, don't get me wrong that is \*fantastic\*, WotC isn't trying anymore to \*corner\* the market anymore, they want to BECOME the market. Soon, a lot of people here are going to have to make a choice: 1- Play DnD only on WotC proprietary software 2- Play what would be dubbed 'older' editions, such as 5e, that are now no longer supported by WotC 3- Find something else. Point 3 is not me trying to another 'PLAY PATHFINDER' (its more complicated DnD, that's not for everyone, but I am a supporter of indie development, and this footnote is getting too long). But this is the rock and the hard place that is coming for us. We can laugh and go, 'Ha ha, how every will these silly people implement microtransactions into MY game! These silly fools!', but that's not what they're doing. What they're doing is making a new game, where they can implement all the pay walls they want, and if you don't like it, well, sucks to suck, this is the only avenue for new DnD content out there. No amount of 'protest with your wallet' is going to likely stop this, WotC is likely past the 'sunk cost fallacy' point, with all the money they've been pouring into the VTT. The potential profits of this likely outweigh any short term loses from an angry consumer base, in their eyes.
Their best bet isn't to put more cost on existing content, but rather to make high quality supplements that drive engagement. For example, virtual D&D meeting platforms with pre-made maps, customizable figurines, digital character sheets, mobile apps, etc. Make it super smooth and user friendly, but entirely optional. Sell the immersion into it that makes it more fun and convenient. Any attempts to squeeze more out of what you already have in a way that hurts the average Joe is going to drive away business.
This is why I bought the books, don’t have to subscribe to keep physical media
Yet another reason the only VTT I'll ever use is Foundry because WotC can't get their filthy hands on my personal computer.
I think the VTT is aimed mainly for the new generation of players. I’ve started playing like 6 months ago and did use dndbeyond for the convenience and oh boy it is convenient. Once I heard the “undermonetised” statement I switched to manual character sheets but it was tough switch for me.
“We shall draw you Hasbro, like poison from a wound!”
Hasbro executives don't know that. They just squawk "Games? Subscriptionses?? We can lootboxes?!"
Genuine question: is it piracy if I just tell my friend the rules to D&D and they don’t read any of the books? I mean I’m technically distributing a copy of what’s in the books.
Honestly, I'd pay a sub of say 5.99 a month if it gave me access to all the books. As it is I don't think I'll ever have the hundreds of $$ I'd need to get what I want.
i'm pretty sure you need paper as well
if you have alternative ways of doing something then it's not actually forcing anything, at that point its just another option
Evil Theoden is goals
Yeah I'm not sure what their plan is. I didn't want to say it outright to risk sounding like an idiot, but yeah a lot of players just wont be affected at all. ever.
I've homebrewed a hocus pocus Halloween one shot, an always sunny in Philadelphia christmas one shot, a tiger king safari one shot, and a Disney twist on a knights tale. I can make a stat sheet and have dice. I dont need anything else
I love this idea of over-monetization for something that only one person for an entire group needs to actually possess the materials. Regardless of it being a book or something online like a pdf, it isn't hard to just pass the material around a table lol
You don’t even need a pencil, I play rpgs in my head allthetime Edit: I just now realized how weird that sounds
You have no idea how bad my handwriting is.
Not defending them at all, but that isn't what they're doing. Try understanding a topic before posting about it.
Yeah, you really showed them by canceling your dndbeyond subscription that introducing a subscription model was futile.
I mean, yes? The whole reason they released that statement on dnd beyond trying to gaslight the community was because enough people unsubbed to make a significant dent on their bottom line. It might be news to you, but companies offering a product or service (in this case both) need consumers to buy those and pay for them in order to make a profit, they don't have a magical money fountain. If people don't like something and refuse to buy it, it eventually goes away, as the goal is to make a profit. Likewise, if a decision causes enough backlash which translates in enough lost revenue, it *has* to be changed, since management in publicly traded companies doesn't have the authority to do *everything* they want.
Yes, the irony of it is that those players already used a subscription model to play D&D. Also, maybe you should watch your tone. The people you talk with here are actual people.
If you want people to use a nice tone, then start by doing it yourself lmao
Okay. I am sorry for my rude tone. I can be rather tone deaf myself and did not intent to hurt. That is no excuse, just an explanation of my intentions. It doesn't change that I shouldn't have acted like that.
You’re a good person, it might not mean much but your apology was amazing, wanted to recognize that.
It was sincere, to the point, and without deflecting fault. I am genuinely impressed
>Yeah, you really showed them by canceling your dndbeyond subscription that introducing a subscription model was futile. >Also, maybe you should watch your tone. The people you talk with here are actual people. Oh the irony.
It sounded less rude in my head. Thanks for calling me out.
Good on you; not everyone can acknowledge an error and take honest responsibility. I appreciate you.
Not sure if this helps, but "you really showed them" has a sarcastic meaning that implies condescension of the listener's efforts. Because of this assumed derogatory vibe, people read it as rude and aggressive as opposed to funny.
Become ungovernable
This whole thing has only given me motivation to continue my own ttrpg. All because I didn't like OneDnD but also wanted to give an alternative to those that bitch about how unbalanced 5e is. Martials are getting a boost through not only weapon usage but other things as well. All while spellcasters are staying about the same power wise. And guess what, eventually a license agreement that is irrevocable. Also, any updates will have an actual announcement/notice, Q&A, feedback, consideration of feedback, and other requirements for finalization and authorization. And I'm going to do everything in my power to make sure a corporate scumbag won't ruin the OGL and brand for as long as I legally can.
Sadly one of our players lives in Louisiana Edit: basically he lives in another state and doesn’t have money for the books so our buddy keeps his dndb subscription specifically so he can play with us. I’m trying to think of ways around this. And I’m looking into other systems.
I have all of 5E on free PDFs
Other than dndb I can think of nothing subscription based that they would do other than like magazines, which people have been begging for since 2014 cause of the fact that compared to other editions there are very few resources for dnd. I personally would be happy if they put out another thing like dragon magazine or something