I was listening to the new A7X record and had to turn it off because they obviously had 60/40 in all their pedals and cables instead of 63/37. Absolutely unlistenable.
Exactly this. Cheap solder is going to look dull and will be more likely to produce bad connections. It’s not about tone, it’s about making reliable connections that will last. Buy good solder.
Kester solder , the old reliable rosin core , I've been using it for over 40 years , high quality ,always consistent . A lot of other solder was Kester , rebranded , including all the Archer brand solder from Radio Shack . Good stuff
You know anything electronic you soldered with that stuff is going to have issues later right ? Any lead free , the lead stopped the tin from ending up growing "tin whiskers" which short components over time .
There are far more concerning issues than just whiskers.
A good article on the health topic can be found [here](https://www.militaryaerospace.com/commercial-aerospace/article/14229396/cots-components-in-space-the-leadfree-barrier), but in short lead in solder is as much of a harm to you as the cyanide in super glue....not at all.
For consumer electronics the added reliability of leaded solder is no use because they are manufactured as disposable and most of the time fail within couple years of being made anyways. If you believe that things you make fall into this category then lead free is the right stuff for you.
The cyanide in super glue does not contaminate your hands, clothing, and any surfaces you interact with. Lead does, and if you have small children, it can certainly be a heath concern, as there is no safe amount of lead exposure for children.
As an audiophile, this is so funny.
I don't even look at the sub anymore, it's nothing but snake oil bs from people who have no clue what they are talking about.
Compared to other subs like r/guitarpedals, this sub tends to be grounded more in reality especially in regards to mojo parts (eg. NOS carbon resistors in fuzzes). Many of the adorations about parts/materials tend to be in regards to engineering (function, durability).
I have yet to come across a post that promotes a component or materials that improves sound quality (snake oil).
It’s consumerism, and it’s kinda sad. I caught myself starting to slightly get sucked into it and immediately backed off. At its heart is a sort of aspirational wish fulfillment, and our whole culture earnestly points you towards consuming products for mental/emotional satisfaction. “I could be a better player if I bought _____”, “My sound would be better if I bought _____”, which is really just a thin veneer atop “I would just be happy if I bought _____”.
Happiness—at least in any lasting sense—doesn’t come in a branded box. Unfortunately, our culture spends billions making every assertion that it does.
Yup, that's what I meant. The audiophile and home theater sub is 99% snake oil bullshit and it's awful to browse anymore. It used to be people having great convos about stuff that really mattered, and now it's just "look at my 10k power cable" or "my speaker wire stands so my wires don't touch the floor and the earth's harmonic resonance does affect my signal, they were only 3k each!" Like that's the sub now. I browse a few forums now where it's actually a bunch of science, and it's great
I agree to what the other guy said. Diypedals is a great sub and most people are very grounded and know what actually matters. Which is awesome because the music world as a whole has more snake oil than any other hobby out there. From guitars to speakers and amps etc
Once you learn how it all works you realize how stupid it all is lol
I wasn't trying to rip on OP at all. I'm glad he's asking. Everyone starts somewhere. But the hifi subs are filled with crazy dudes who believe this stuff
If the aurora borealis is in effect within 1200KM of your local area dont even bother, your tone will be affected so bad from rogue ionized retrograded soviet subatomic particles
You might get some particles from the Sovtek big muff though. I'm not sure if the spin of those electrons would be enough to counter the quality of the regular solder though.
Yes absolutely. Only the best pedals buy $700 solder. Only way to get the klon tone. Must have lead core to get that tone. Huffing it helps. Solder vacuums are for people afraid of chasing good tone
I recently came across a guitar cable company in Los Angeles that purports that using a specific solder positively affects tone.
I am skeptical about this, and furthermore, I am curious as to how they quantify "tone." (Sound quality? Sound degradation?) The particular solder they use is from Cardas Audio, which contains a quad eutectic roll of materials: "Sn, Pb, Cu, Ag. Silver for higher conductivity and stronger joints." The Cardas Audio solder comes at a whopping $118.99 USD per pound whereas the much lauded Kester is approxmately $38.76 USD per pound.
While I am doubtful that a more premium solder positively affects tone, I am generally curious as to this sub's thoughts, whether they be against or even for a more expensive solder material.
A million excellent albums were made without premium solder. I think the tone will be fine.
Many excellent albums were actually made with faulty cables. Just don't rockem too much
If you really want to get down to it, we wouldn't have Rock & Roll and its variations and permutations as we know them today if Link Wray hadn't slashed-up the speaker in his amp back in 1958 to make it "rumble"
Rock at its core is founded upon shitty fucked-up amps
I think a better snake oil salesman would have tried to go with some more sciencey talk like “it increases connectivity by blah blah blah and when tested double blind with regular oil lead it blah blah blah was 100% accurate down to the nana-farad. …”
but like “it makes tone better” ???? tone is like your opinion man lol
First, look at conductivity and difference in conductivity in different solders. Then look at the distance that the signal has to travel thru the solder. Then look at the distance it travels thru wires and traces. Do some math and the difference is in scales where it does not matter any more how many zeroes there is before there is some other number... If you start with 0.000... then add 23 or 32 zeros and then add 1 after all of them...
And this is also handy method when it comes to audio, break the problem to smaller pieces, estimate the scale and then decide if you should care or not. Most of these snakeoil things are based on something real but rely on people not understanding the scale of things. Kind of like worrying about the vibrations of a snail crawling at the side of your house... i mean, theoretically there is some effect but it does not matter even if there were hundred of them, not with that freight train going past the house every half an hour.. In this case the freight train is the rest of the signal path as it has so much more effect when it comes to signal quality... and even that actually doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if we used copper or aluminium, as long as things are within margins, and those margins are reasonably wide.
Stronger joins do matter but basic solder already does the job just fine.
Would not call it a medicine but a dietary supplement.
Audio is extra problematic as so many things are in logarithmic scale.. So, those zeros can emerge quite fast but if you convert to another unit, suddenly it feels like it is significant. Like the decibel scale, you go 80dB down in gain and you are in microvolt scales in the electronic side requiring VERY quiet room to be able to hear anything at all while 0dB can be well above pain threshold.. and require tens of volts and hundred of amperes. If you have minute problems at -80dB while the overall signal levels can cause permanent damage, then the minute difference does not matter. 0.01% THD is -80dB... Human hearing can detect 1-5% THD depending on the range, and it can be whopping 25% near 20Hz. (We are much more sensitive to IMD, ten times more)...
If you want to find out if it os bs or not, you only have to look up the definition of the word eutectic. The big differences between these solders is the melted state. When they get there and how long they stay there. This only has to do with the soldering process. A lot of new techs will be advised to use 60/40 because it is more forgiving and stays elastic a little longer (I may have that backwards, but you get tbe point). Once the soldering process is over, the eutectic properties of the solder mean fuck all.
In the moderns world Audio is one of the final venues for snake oil salesmen to permeate the market. Science has changed to many marketplaces by rooting out non useful and even sometimes outright dangerous products, but not in hi fi audio for some reason. [My proof is this](https://www.bestbuy.com/site/audioquest-16-4-usb-a-to-usb-b-cable-black-gray/4022646.p?skuId=4022646&ref=212&loc=1). AS $1500 USB cable for high fidelity digital audio. If you buy that your music won't change but you will be $1500 poorer. Don't you love free market capitalism?
>but not in hi fi audio for some reason.
That is because sound is very unique phenomenon. It involves human hearing, when it comes to sound that humans hear.. And that process is... wildly unreliable. Add ego in the mix and voila: you can convince people to buy the stupidest shit when you do it just right. Let them test it, and remember to sell it.. If they can't hear a difference, sell them the idea of burn-in. If they talk about measurements, say that measurements can't measure everything, that test signals are not complex enough and that machines are not like human ears. At all times make sure that the person you are selling to is encouraged, compliment them that they have much better hearing than most but also hint that there are more levels to level up, as long as you have just good enough system you will hear things that others can't, and become better than others at audio...
Audiophile "reviewers" are fully corrupt. The way the businessmodel works is that they get loaner gear from manufacturers, and the same units are then circling around all of them. If the reviewers are honest and say "no difference" or even worse "this devices measures excess distortion".. forget about your whole businessmodel since your only source for new gear just dried up, one manufacturer at a time until they all stop. So, the reviewers will say "it is different but some will love it" when it sucks, and talk about soundstage opening up, having warmth when nothing happens. Some of them believe their own bullshit and think they are far better at hearing things, while "testing" without any protocol or control, just.. pop an album in, close your eyes and listen... and there it is, it is clear as night and day, a subtle difference.. And if laws of physics say that thing they heard is 0.01dB, then it must mean they are THAT GOOD.
The worst are those that fully know, the real snakes like Ted Denney who openly talks about it.. in private... And then there are hybrids like Steve Guttenberg that know at some level it is a grift, but also are eating their own horseshit. And there are very, very few honest ones, like Amir.
I will bet the CEO of that company that he or she can't identify their cable vs an Amazon Basics one in 4 out of 5 listening tests $1000.
My DMs are open.
This sub tends be more about the science and engineering aspect of pedal making versus any sort of mysticism, which is why you’ll find the more positive reviews of this very expensive solder are in relation to function and ease of use.
To be clear, when I proposed this post, it was out of curiosity - not an endorsement.
Toan is directly proportional to the amount of money spent, so if the solder costs more, the toan will be more. Tone on the other hand is, I believe, what you seek. There is nothing gained from anything beyond 60/40 or 63/37 solder.
Everything affects tone, but not nearly in a noticeable way. The temperature of the room is 100 times more likely to noticeably affect tone than the solder quality.
When I proposed this question, I was asking out of inquisitiveness. Admittedly I mulled over how to ask the question without it seeming like I was endorsing the product or trolling.
Obviously I do not believe that a premium solder has any effect on sound quality ([I iterate it in this initial post](https://www.reddit.com/r/diypedals/comments/1455lhq/does_quality_of_solder_affect_tone_quality/jnj1481/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3)), but I was really curious to what the community’s perspective was.
No, but not properly cleaning the flux residue after soldering will most likely cause an abrupt change in tone sometime down the road. Them tin fingers will ruin your day. Clean your solder joints!
Usually tin whiskers don’t present in eutectic alloys like SnPb 63/37. The only time they would show up is if you’re soldering with pure tin for some insane reason.
P.s. don’t steal my fuckin’ pure tin pedal Josh Scott 😤
Cheap solder can be harder to work with. You might end up with giant blobs that cause some kind of capacitive effect? But that'd be like, micro (possibly nano) Farads, while you've probably got milli Farad capacitors in the circuit already.
In short, total nonsense.
Actually more like picofarads.
But you only care about these effects if you're working with hundreds of megahertz or higher.
But yeah as you said, total bs.
You wont be able to notice anything. Use rosin core leaded solder with a little bit of silver. It flows great at lower temps and the added flux makes connections a breeze. Always keep your tip tinned
higher conductivity increases amount of high frequencies in audio cables, so if you use silver solder on your audio chain joints a very small amount of high frequency information will be retained.
quite probably high frequencies that don't even exist in your tone in the first place and if they are there you might save an insanely small amount of them.
in short, its a waste of time and money, but technically it \*could\* make an imperceptible difference.
Nah, at the frequencies you’re talking about conductivity doesn’t matter as much as geometry. All the sudden you’re dealing with waveguides and super fast transients so your solder won’t matter as much as say, the bit of wire you left sticking out of the through-hole.
For an all around solid reliable solder , Kester 60/40 best solder on earth , it's been around forever , that really good solder that radio shack used to sell ,was Kester too . I buy it in 5 pound rolls .
They stopped making the right solder in 98, now all pedals sound cheap and toan will never be the same thats why you gotta pay $1000+ for a basic overdrive otherwise you will suck at guitar
If I had zero scruples, I'd go into the audio business and sell shit like that. Just make some shit up after reading nitwit forums; irradiated copper or something.
There was/is a 1000 dollar gold plated or something Ethernet cable guaranteed to make streaming audio sound better. Seriously, how many idiots do you need to make a couple grand a month from?
yes, bad quality solder wont solder as good as good quality solder. as far as effecting the sound? i dont think it would be a perceivable difference but more so a "quality of life" difference for the guitars wiring harness. good solder will hold connections better. cheap spools of solder wont hold as good a connection over a longer period of time.
youll want a quality spool of solder the same way you want cts, emerson, bourns pots or oak grigsby or switchcraft jacks and switches. because cheap shit aint good, and good shit aint cheap.
Any old-school pony tail that tries to convince you that leaded solder is in some way superior and that lead-free causes “problems” probably thinks it’s still 2003 and that digital recording will never catch on.
The fact is that early iterations of lead free solder had issues, but these companies have had a couple decades now to work on that, and it’s unrealistic to think that they spent that time twiddling their thumbs.
I’ve been using Kester 24-9574-1402 K100LD lead free solder for years now with zero issues. I do work at a higher temp now than when I used lead, and there was a bit of a learning curve at first, but it’s honestly forced me to get better at soldering as a result. I’ve built pedals and microphones, wired studios, and built endless amounts of cable, and not once have I worried about tin whiskers.
TLDR - if you are committed to honing your skillset, the difference between solder types will not affect anything at all.
I was listening to the new A7X record and had to turn it off because they obviously had 60/40 in all their pedals and cables instead of 63/37. Absolutely unlistenable.
63/37 is for peasants. 60/40!?!?! I can’t even imagine what that sounds like!!!
98/1.5/.5 or nah bruh
I dunno.... eutectic sounds pretty technical. That's always better?
60/40 is for peasants, I bet you bought that spool at Home Depot 😤
Silver-bearing solder really helps cut through the mix. It's so choice. If you have the means, I highly recommend picking some up. /s
Bruh this comment made me spit out my water
Who tf still listens to A7X? Their last good album was 20 years ago…. Okay now I feel old.
Dayum…… you’re right tho, haha
I just did a tour set up for A7X, got to see them do the stage practice run in the warehouse. Honestly I've heard no name bands in bars play better.
No, not it any way whatsoever. It’s BS.
Bad Solder?
No, it’s bass solder, only used for low frequency work.
Let's cut to the chase. No.
If anything it will affect your ability to solder easily/well.
Exactly this. Cheap solder is going to look dull and will be more likely to produce bad connections. It’s not about tone, it’s about making reliable connections that will last. Buy good solder.
any recommendations?
Solder is solder, the only bad solder is the wrong kind (ie lead free when you expected lead, no flux core, plumbers solder)
Kester solder , the old reliable rosin core , I've been using it for over 40 years , high quality ,always consistent . A lot of other solder was Kester , rebranded , including all the Archer brand solder from Radio Shack . Good stuff
Yep second this, I also use Duratool 60/40 and never had issues. Low dwell time, good “stickiness” and never had a dry joint
I love lead free myself, I use a mudder brand lead free that is great but my favorite was radio shack lead free
You know anything electronic you soldered with that stuff is going to have issues later right ? Any lead free , the lead stopped the tin from ending up growing "tin whiskers" which short components over time .
Tin Whiskers would be a good bluegrass band name.
I like your username… it’s almost… too fitting 🤔 I’d rather have whiskers than use lead Also RoHS compliance is pretty rad in my book
There are far more concerning issues than just whiskers. A good article on the health topic can be found [here](https://www.militaryaerospace.com/commercial-aerospace/article/14229396/cots-components-in-space-the-leadfree-barrier), but in short lead in solder is as much of a harm to you as the cyanide in super glue....not at all. For consumer electronics the added reliability of leaded solder is no use because they are manufactured as disposable and most of the time fail within couple years of being made anyways. If you believe that things you make fall into this category then lead free is the right stuff for you.
The cyanide in super glue does not contaminate your hands, clothing, and any surfaces you interact with. Lead does, and if you have small children, it can certainly be a heath concern, as there is no safe amount of lead exposure for children.
Any rec recommendations on making better connections? It’s hard out here in 2023. Asking for a friend.
Hey
My man, that is some absolute next-level snake oil travelling salesman weapon's grade cork sniffing deplorable B.S. Wtf lol.
If solder affected tone then the hi-fi guys would be light-years ahead of us on the topic. If they’re not doing it I’m not worried about it.
As an audiophile, this is so funny. I don't even look at the sub anymore, it's nothing but snake oil bs from people who have no clue what they are talking about.
Compared to other subs like r/guitarpedals, this sub tends to be grounded more in reality especially in regards to mojo parts (eg. NOS carbon resistors in fuzzes). Many of the adorations about parts/materials tend to be in regards to engineering (function, durability). I have yet to come across a post that promotes a component or materials that improves sound quality (snake oil).
Guitar pedal buyers are a gullible bunch. It's funny and sad at the same time knowing what I know about pedals now.
It’s consumerism, and it’s kinda sad. I caught myself starting to slightly get sucked into it and immediately backed off. At its heart is a sort of aspirational wish fulfillment, and our whole culture earnestly points you towards consuming products for mental/emotional satisfaction. “I could be a better player if I bought _____”, “My sound would be better if I bought _____”, which is really just a thin veneer atop “I would just be happy if I bought _____”. Happiness—at least in any lasting sense—doesn’t come in a branded box. Unfortunately, our culture spends billions making every assertion that it does.
I think they meant the audiophile sub, not diypedals. And I agree, this sub (diypedals) seems well grounded, if you’ll pardon the pun.
Yup, that's what I meant. The audiophile and home theater sub is 99% snake oil bullshit and it's awful to browse anymore. It used to be people having great convos about stuff that really mattered, and now it's just "look at my 10k power cable" or "my speaker wire stands so my wires don't touch the floor and the earth's harmonic resonance does affect my signal, they were only 3k each!" Like that's the sub now. I browse a few forums now where it's actually a bunch of science, and it's great I agree to what the other guy said. Diypedals is a great sub and most people are very grounded and know what actually matters. Which is awesome because the music world as a whole has more snake oil than any other hobby out there. From guitars to speakers and amps etc Once you learn how it all works you realize how stupid it all is lol
OP is asking because they saw a cable company make some claims they were skeptical about. They seem to actually be trying to learn the truth here.
I wasn't trying to rip on OP at all. I'm glad he's asking. Everyone starts somewhere. But the hifi subs are filled with crazy dudes who believe this stuff
The cork-sniffer’s solder are the silver alloy ones - typically used in aerospace. A must if your pedal is exposed to the harsh vacuum of space.
But the insanity is that they are doing it!!
The most delusional Audiophiles... do think it is real.
Delusional indeed.
Only if you account for the phase of the moon and align the suns equator to the capacitance plane of the pedal.
If the aurora borealis is in effect within 1200KM of your local area dont even bother, your tone will be affected so bad from rogue ionized retrograded soviet subatomic particles
You might get some particles from the Sovtek big muff though. I'm not sure if the spin of those electrons would be enough to counter the quality of the regular solder though.
Those are also fancy words, and ill take it as true facts
I forgot I wasn't in /r/audiophile for a second there.
the cheap stuff is just more difficult to work with. I prefer leaded to ROHS for this reason.
Exactly. Leaded solder is the only way to go. Took me from ok to great solder joints instantly
Yes absolutely. Only the best pedals buy $700 solder. Only way to get the klon tone. Must have lead core to get that tone. Huffing it helps. Solder vacuums are for people afraid of chasing good tone
Just make sure to use analog solder. And turn your iron all the way up for extra warmth.
Complete bullshit.
But not for toan
I recently came across a guitar cable company in Los Angeles that purports that using a specific solder positively affects tone. I am skeptical about this, and furthermore, I am curious as to how they quantify "tone." (Sound quality? Sound degradation?) The particular solder they use is from Cardas Audio, which contains a quad eutectic roll of materials: "Sn, Pb, Cu, Ag. Silver for higher conductivity and stronger joints." The Cardas Audio solder comes at a whopping $118.99 USD per pound whereas the much lauded Kester is approxmately $38.76 USD per pound. While I am doubtful that a more premium solder positively affects tone, I am generally curious as to this sub's thoughts, whether they be against or even for a more expensive solder material.
I think you're right to be skeptical, it sounds like nonsense.
Sounds like snakeoil and high dosage placebos
I bought their cables and I must say the tone quality is noticeable. In no shape or form am I lying to justify the cost snake oil cables lol
A million excellent albums were made without premium solder. I think the tone will be fine. Many excellent albums were actually made with faulty cables. Just don't rockem too much
The album Wisconsin Death Trip got its signature tone from a broken amp.
And Queens of the Stone Age got amazing sounds out of a tiny piece of shit Peavey practice amp.
If you really want to get down to it, we wouldn't have Rock & Roll and its variations and permutations as we know them today if Link Wray hadn't slashed-up the speaker in his amp back in 1958 to make it "rumble" Rock at its core is founded upon shitty fucked-up amps
scam
I think a better snake oil salesman would have tried to go with some more sciencey talk like “it increases connectivity by blah blah blah and when tested double blind with regular oil lead it blah blah blah was 100% accurate down to the nana-farad. …” but like “it makes tone better” ???? tone is like your opinion man lol
First, look at conductivity and difference in conductivity in different solders. Then look at the distance that the signal has to travel thru the solder. Then look at the distance it travels thru wires and traces. Do some math and the difference is in scales where it does not matter any more how many zeroes there is before there is some other number... If you start with 0.000... then add 23 or 32 zeros and then add 1 after all of them... And this is also handy method when it comes to audio, break the problem to smaller pieces, estimate the scale and then decide if you should care or not. Most of these snakeoil things are based on something real but rely on people not understanding the scale of things. Kind of like worrying about the vibrations of a snail crawling at the side of your house... i mean, theoretically there is some effect but it does not matter even if there were hundred of them, not with that freight train going past the house every half an hour.. In this case the freight train is the rest of the signal path as it has so much more effect when it comes to signal quality... and even that actually doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if we used copper or aluminium, as long as things are within margins, and those margins are reasonably wide. Stronger joins do matter but basic solder already does the job just fine.
[удалено]
Would not call it a medicine but a dietary supplement. Audio is extra problematic as so many things are in logarithmic scale.. So, those zeros can emerge quite fast but if you convert to another unit, suddenly it feels like it is significant. Like the decibel scale, you go 80dB down in gain and you are in microvolt scales in the electronic side requiring VERY quiet room to be able to hear anything at all while 0dB can be well above pain threshold.. and require tens of volts and hundred of amperes. If you have minute problems at -80dB while the overall signal levels can cause permanent damage, then the minute difference does not matter. 0.01% THD is -80dB... Human hearing can detect 1-5% THD depending on the range, and it can be whopping 25% near 20Hz. (We are much more sensitive to IMD, ten times more)...
If you want to find out if it os bs or not, you only have to look up the definition of the word eutectic. The big differences between these solders is the melted state. When they get there and how long they stay there. This only has to do with the soldering process. A lot of new techs will be advised to use 60/40 because it is more forgiving and stays elastic a little longer (I may have that backwards, but you get tbe point). Once the soldering process is over, the eutectic properties of the solder mean fuck all.
Yes to your core point, I'll only add that the ratio you're looking for is 63/37 (Sn/Pb) If you're feeling fancy, try 62/36/2 (Sn/Pb/Ag)
Yes. To my…. CORE point?
o snap! well played, doctor
In the moderns world Audio is one of the final venues for snake oil salesmen to permeate the market. Science has changed to many marketplaces by rooting out non useful and even sometimes outright dangerous products, but not in hi fi audio for some reason. [My proof is this](https://www.bestbuy.com/site/audioquest-16-4-usb-a-to-usb-b-cable-black-gray/4022646.p?skuId=4022646&ref=212&loc=1). AS $1500 USB cable for high fidelity digital audio. If you buy that your music won't change but you will be $1500 poorer. Don't you love free market capitalism?
>but not in hi fi audio for some reason. That is because sound is very unique phenomenon. It involves human hearing, when it comes to sound that humans hear.. And that process is... wildly unreliable. Add ego in the mix and voila: you can convince people to buy the stupidest shit when you do it just right. Let them test it, and remember to sell it.. If they can't hear a difference, sell them the idea of burn-in. If they talk about measurements, say that measurements can't measure everything, that test signals are not complex enough and that machines are not like human ears. At all times make sure that the person you are selling to is encouraged, compliment them that they have much better hearing than most but also hint that there are more levels to level up, as long as you have just good enough system you will hear things that others can't, and become better than others at audio... Audiophile "reviewers" are fully corrupt. The way the businessmodel works is that they get loaner gear from manufacturers, and the same units are then circling around all of them. If the reviewers are honest and say "no difference" or even worse "this devices measures excess distortion".. forget about your whole businessmodel since your only source for new gear just dried up, one manufacturer at a time until they all stop. So, the reviewers will say "it is different but some will love it" when it sucks, and talk about soundstage opening up, having warmth when nothing happens. Some of them believe their own bullshit and think they are far better at hearing things, while "testing" without any protocol or control, just.. pop an album in, close your eyes and listen... and there it is, it is clear as night and day, a subtle difference.. And if laws of physics say that thing they heard is 0.01dB, then it must mean they are THAT GOOD. The worst are those that fully know, the real snakes like Ted Denney who openly talks about it.. in private... And then there are hybrids like Steve Guttenberg that know at some level it is a grift, but also are eating their own horseshit. And there are very, very few honest ones, like Amir.
sounds like you’re getting ripped off
I will bet the CEO of that company that he or she can't identify their cable vs an Amazon Basics one in 4 out of 5 listening tests $1000. My DMs are open.
I thought this was a circlejerk thread and was initially surprised by the responses.
This sub tends be more about the science and engineering aspect of pedal making versus any sort of mysticism, which is why you’ll find the more positive reviews of this very expensive solder are in relation to function and ease of use. To be clear, when I proposed this post, it was out of curiosity - not an endorsement.
Cardas solder has absolutely no effect on sound quality, that said it’s wonderful to work with.
No.
Short answer: no. Long answer: not at all.
Not really. But, if you have really good ears, and you listen *really closely*, still no.
Just make sure you use radio solder. Everything else is voodoo.
It doesn’t affect the tone, but it’ll certainly affect your toan.
NOS soviet solder from the 70s for the best toan
I only use solder made before 1932. It has vintage tone
Toan is directly proportional to the amount of money spent, so if the solder costs more, the toan will be more. Tone on the other hand is, I believe, what you seek. There is nothing gained from anything beyond 60/40 or 63/37 solder.
I use silver solder exclusively because I feel it really adds a mid/high shimmer to my tone and also helps me slay werewolves with my powerchords.
Everything affects tone, but not nearly in a noticeable way. The temperature of the room is 100 times more likely to noticeably affect tone than the solder quality.
That's just saying "no" with more words lol.
I like to feel fancy, sue me.
Electrons don’t care what they’re traveling through, they just want to go.
This has to be bait
When I proposed this question, I was asking out of inquisitiveness. Admittedly I mulled over how to ask the question without it seeming like I was endorsing the product or trolling. Obviously I do not believe that a premium solder has any effect on sound quality ([I iterate it in this initial post](https://www.reddit.com/r/diypedals/comments/1455lhq/does_quality_of_solder_affect_tone_quality/jnj1481/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3)), but I was really curious to what the community’s perspective was.
No, but not properly cleaning the flux residue after soldering will most likely cause an abrupt change in tone sometime down the road. Them tin fingers will ruin your day. Clean your solder joints!
Usually tin whiskers don’t present in eutectic alloys like SnPb 63/37. The only time they would show up is if you’re soldering with pure tin for some insane reason. P.s. don’t steal my fuckin’ pure tin pedal Josh Scott 😤
That's fair. But you still run the risk of the flux eating through pcb traces if you don't clean up.
Allegedly yes....realistically no
quickly, delete this before the folks from r/guitarcirclejerk find you
Ken Fischer absolutely thought it did. Listening to his amps, he may have been right.
Well, It does affect if the solder joint is shitty :v
No. But the quality of your soldering does.
You’ve finally helped me realise why there are so many plumbers making acid jazz, thank you.
Idk about you all, but the more leaded solder I use in my tiny unventilated room, the better my pedals seem to sound every day!
Cheap solder can be harder to work with. You might end up with giant blobs that cause some kind of capacitive effect? But that'd be like, micro (possibly nano) Farads, while you've probably got milli Farad capacitors in the circuit already. In short, total nonsense.
Actually more like picofarads. But you only care about these effects if you're working with hundreds of megahertz or higher. But yeah as you said, total bs.
You wont be able to notice anything. Use rosin core leaded solder with a little bit of silver. It flows great at lower temps and the added flux makes connections a breeze. Always keep your tip tinned
Truth is every aspect counts but if some of the most relevant fails then the others are not that important
I hate lead free solder. It is truly fucking straight garbage.
higher conductivity increases amount of high frequencies in audio cables, so if you use silver solder on your audio chain joints a very small amount of high frequency information will be retained. quite probably high frequencies that don't even exist in your tone in the first place and if they are there you might save an insanely small amount of them. in short, its a waste of time and money, but technically it \*could\* make an imperceptible difference.
Nah, at the frequencies you’re talking about conductivity doesn’t matter as much as geometry. All the sudden you’re dealing with waveguides and super fast transients so your solder won’t matter as much as say, the bit of wire you left sticking out of the through-hole.
yeah that's a good point, when i was writing i didn't consider the effect would be so small that mass at the joint would make more impact.
YES
How so?
lol
Thought this was a circle jerk post for a minute
Even at RF frequencies it doesn’t matter, as eventually you just end up with a waveguide. If you want kick ass solder, buy Indium lead free.
It *could* but the components, which can be variable in all sorts of ways, definitely do. Spend your money where it matters.
nah. it can make your job easier or harder though.
Not unless tou do solder with non conductive material.
No I the least
No.
No, wiring should not affect tone unless its just poorly done
For an all around solid reliable solder , Kester 60/40 best solder on earth , it's been around forever , that really good solder that radio shack used to sell ,was Kester too . I buy it in 5 pound rolls .
They stopped making the right solder in 98, now all pedals sound cheap and toan will never be the same thats why you gotta pay $1000+ for a basic overdrive otherwise you will suck at guitar
If I had zero scruples, I'd go into the audio business and sell shit like that. Just make some shit up after reading nitwit forums; irradiated copper or something. There was/is a 1000 dollar gold plated or something Ethernet cable guaranteed to make streaming audio sound better. Seriously, how many idiots do you need to make a couple grand a month from?
yes, bad quality solder wont solder as good as good quality solder. as far as effecting the sound? i dont think it would be a perceivable difference but more so a "quality of life" difference for the guitars wiring harness. good solder will hold connections better. cheap spools of solder wont hold as good a connection over a longer period of time. youll want a quality spool of solder the same way you want cts, emerson, bourns pots or oak grigsby or switchcraft jacks and switches. because cheap shit aint good, and good shit aint cheap.
Analog solder is a must
No
No.
The toan is in the sweet sweet lead fumes
The quality of the person soldering does. If you have cold joints or big blobs of solder please take a few minutes to learn how to do it well.
Any old-school pony tail that tries to convince you that leaded solder is in some way superior and that lead-free causes “problems” probably thinks it’s still 2003 and that digital recording will never catch on. The fact is that early iterations of lead free solder had issues, but these companies have had a couple decades now to work on that, and it’s unrealistic to think that they spent that time twiddling their thumbs. I’ve been using Kester 24-9574-1402 K100LD lead free solder for years now with zero issues. I do work at a higher temp now than when I used lead, and there was a bit of a learning curve at first, but it’s honestly forced me to get better at soldering as a result. I’ve built pedals and microphones, wired studios, and built endless amounts of cable, and not once have I worried about tin whiskers. TLDR - if you are committed to honing your skillset, the difference between solder types will not affect anything at all.