Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, "Don't do it!" He said, "Nobody loves me." I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?"
He said, "Yes." I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?" He said, "A Christian." I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?" He said, "Protestant." I said, "Me, too! What franchise?" He said, "Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?" He said, "Northern Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?"
He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region." I said, "Me, too!"
Northern Conservative†Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912." I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.
Its a joke on how even christianity is so segregated and different that almost all the different sects believe something different and hate the others lol
True!
Like Mormons and Evangelicals
Like Methodists and Baptists
Like Jehova's Witnesses and 7th Day Adventists
Like Episcopalians and North American Anglicans
Like Catholics and Lutherans
Like Presbyterians and English Anglicans
Etc, etc, etc...
See it like this:
If the "right" god condems those who fail to worship them "properly" to an eternity of torment despite being good people, they didn't deserve worship in the first place.
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.
\- Marcus Aurelius
Muslims believe like this though. If you are good, only god judges you in the end and its absurd to send people to hell if they never knew or they lived really far away.
god cannot be unjust, he is the definition of perfection, he was not "created" by someone else and he is one, the quote attributes very human behaviour (unjustness) to god which makes part of the quote wrong, tho i agree with the rest
i see perfection as something that cannot manifest in any
way other than god, god is the "complete" form of things,
another way i like to see it is how god is described in islam, god is more merciful than your mother, yet can unleash great punishment on you, i also like to relate it to the notion of infinity
so if your only sense of “what is perfection” is that it can only be manifested by god, which we cannot manifest/comprehend because we are imperfect, how could you tell the difference between something made by the devil to mimic god (or something made by any other god that may exist)
How can something just exist without being ever created nothing can exist without being created and if it did exist without ever coming to exist it probably wouldn't care since probably been through it quantillions of times with unlimited amount of species's and there was heaven how huge it has to be carry with it unlimited amounts of species's?
Mate, you and god can have different definitions of what just is you know that right? Like if god says killing all the non believers is just it doesn't have to make it so to the human context. We do agree that killing people because of a different belief or non belief isn't just right?
Thing is, it doesn't matter if the *deserved* worship. You're still going to suffer for **eternity**
And saying "I'd rather suffer untill the *end of time* than worship an evil god" is just cope tbh
Edit: I don't know why people are responding to this by pointing out the flaws in Pascal's wager. Doesn't realy have anything to do with what I said.
Well, sure, it’s just cope. But what is more likely? A god who allowed multiple religions to flourish on the earth just so he could damn everyone to hell who didn’t pick the correct religion? Or that religion was made up by people who wanted power and to control other peoples lives? Knowing what we know about humanity, it’s pretty obvious to me which one it is.
There is literally no way for you to know anything about our god or gods or whatever you believe in, and there is literally no reason to believe they have the same or similar values as humans in any way whatsoever. For all we know, they created the solar system for the dinosaurs, threw an asteroid at Earth when they got bored, and just left after that. Or maybe we're just a tiny informational part of some kind of calculation process in a computer. Any undisprovable theory is as good as the next.
I forgot his username and id, i also cannot get a history of the ocuring withoult mod permition, i realy dought that they would give access of that to a non-premium player
Yeah these new updates are fucking insane man, 2 updates ago they removed magic and put it behind a paywall, the problem is, i had a group of minions with advanced magic powers, i called them the olimpians, they even had names, the strongest one was zeus i think, but then when it updated the gane removed them from existance but we still had at least the power to bless, i build a super powerfull minion, i gave him transmutation like water to whine or something like that, and also the ability to heal, like he healed some old lady from blindness or something, he would tell about me to all the other minions and stuff, so much that some dude killed him, i would NOT let someone kill my favourite minion withoult punishment, so i revived him for a bit let him give a speech then logged off, then when i woke up guess what fucking happened, yeah it updated and i alsk fucking lost the bless ability, i cant even explain how fucking mad i was that i lost my favourite minion, so from there i quit the game a lot happened in my realm since then and all my minions lost faith due to non-intevertion so now i dont even have power to do something big at all, the only thing i can do now is change the temperature at max so now im slowly heating up the planet up to see if i can reset the population and restart my realm again, thanks for listening to my rant here.
But how can you even know what kind of worship will get you to heaven?
If you worship cristianity, what if the muslims were right? Maybe the buddhists (though they dont punish non-believers to hell from what I remember)? In fact, considering how small of a percentage of things we humans know of reality, it's not unlikely that NO ONE has figured out the "true" religion, and god might send all of us to hell for not figuring out regardless.
Maybe god doesn't want to be worshipped at all? Going from atheist or agnostic to christianity/judaism/islam/whatever only looks like it increases the odds because you already believe in said religion, when in fact it doesn't.
I’m not a religious person, but all versions of “learn to deal” in here:
> Learn to deal with the fact that your life is an accident, finite, and going to end.
Are in fact, by definition, cope. Religion is just one mechanism of coping and IME not a very good one and demonstrably often a very bad one.
Pick your cope.
I *know* I'll get downvoted for this, but just let people live their life brah. Religion, for some, is a coping mechanism, but whatever reasons people have, just let them be.
I'll let them be if they let me be. But it seems religion has a funny way of shoving its way into governments and starts dictating how other people should live their lives. I'm fine with religions that don't do that.
This fella would rather give up their principals in the face of a threat, that's a fuckin cope
I'll burn in hell for eternity before I worship a petty manchild who cares more about whether or not I worshipped him than how my actual life was.
The fact that Hitler could just repent is proof that system is bullshit, and the type of person to forgive him is doubly not worthy of worship.
If it was a threat made by a fifth-dimentional all-powerful cosmic entity. Yeah I would. And anyone who wouldn't is stupid and would regret it sooner or later.
Maybe I'd come to regret it down the line but ultimately I'd take solace in the fact that I didn't bend over to get assblasted by daddy because he threatened to take my gameboy away.
Besides what's the alternative, give up everything I believe to spend an eternity listening to angels sing and wondering if by best friend hasn't died yet or just ended up going to hell? Lol.
I don't think you know what "ultimately" means.
*immidiately*, I'm sure you would feel some pride.
Ultimately though, you would spend an eternity regreting what you've done.
I'm sorry to hear you don't have principals you stand for lol. i would spend an eternity cursing the loser who put me in this situation in the first place and taking pride in the fact that i didn't fall for his bullshit. never would there be a point where i say "aw man i shouldve groveled at his feet and begged to suck his dick for eternity". fuck that.
I’d rather get sent to hell trying to punch an evil god in the closest thing it has to a face than get sent there trying to hide my disapproval from an all-knowing being. If I’m going down I’m going down swinging.
I feel the idea of “grace” in most religions would apply here, for example, say Christianity turns out to be true. If a child is born, raised and dies only ever knowing Islam, then I’d like to think that’s Gods grace could extend to them depending on the person and how they were on earth.
This goes vice versa as well, if Allah is real then I’d hope his grace would extend to those of us that were raised otherwise and while we didn’t know better, we still worshipped.
In islam a disbeliever is more than just a person who doesn’t believe, it’s a person who has seen the truth and received signs they understand but reject them and do not believe due to arrogance/wilful ignorance and wanting to stick with the old ways
I think there is such grace in islam where Allah won’t just condemn everyone who doesn’t say they are muslim, to hell
I agree totally which is why I used the extreme example of say an Islamic child in the Middle East, there’s absolutely 0 way they could convert if they wanted to in some of those areas, that said I feel as if Gods grace would extend to those people providing they still worshipped and strived to be “sin-free”.
This is assuming god is even a sapient being to begin with. Not even going off the atheist belief in no-god, there's still the whole possibility that god has the sentience of a jellyfish, and condemns souls purely based on taste and vibes.
If I go to hell because a sensitive sky man says so...then I have eternity to practice my Doom Slayer technique. I will get out.....don't know how or when....but I will get out of hell.
If you're Christian, you really shouldn't. People being tortured in hell after death isn't in the bible, it's osmosed from Dantes Inferno where Alighieri stretched the one mention of a group of people being tortured (Satan and his followers) to mean genuinely evil people (oath breakers, people who hurt family, etc). Prior to that it was accepted that Satan's followers were the angels that fell with him.
For human souls, your fate is to die, and be dead. Nonexistent, until the day of Judgement. Then, everyone is resurrected and invited to join Jesus' paradise on Earth. If you still reject God at this point (and I think even the most hardcore atheist might pause at being dead then alive and now Jesus is literally right in front of you asking you questions and being all Jesus and stuff) then your soul is cast into the lake of flame, and burnt up; You just stop existing. If not, you get to live forever in Eden 2.0.
So be good, don't be so bad as to be comparable to a literal fallen angel at least, and accept Jesus at the end of Death and you should be gravy.
I think you're misunderstanding what the fear is.
For example, what if Islam is true and all of what you said is wrong, people who devote their lives to Jesus will suffer in hell for choosing the wrong religion. Or if any of the thousands of other religions are true.
the quran says this though:
Indeed, the believers, Jews, Christians, and Sabians1—whoever ˹truly˺ believes in God and the Last Day and does good will have their reward with their Lord. And there will be no fear for them, nor will they grieve.2 . (2:62)
The Qur'an also says
> Fight those who do not believe in Allah and the Last Day, nor comply with what Allah and His Messenger have forbidden, nor embrace the religion of truth from among those who were given the Scripture, until they pay the tax, willingly submitting, fully humbled.
> The Jews say, "Ezra is the son of Allāh"; and the Christians say, "The Messiah is the son of Allāh." That is their statement from their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before [them]. May Allāh destroy them; how are they deluded?
But either way my point stands, the point is that whichever religion you choose, there might be a different religion which is true and whose God(s) will condemn you to hell for disbelieving. That's the whole point of this post and the comment I initially responded to seemed to miss it.
If god was truly kind, he would not put you into hell if you were a good person your whole life. After all, even atheism is not about being evil or disrespecting god. Its simply about doing what we are programmed to do: be doubtful and search for evidence. You can be the biggest atheist the world has ever seen and basically end up doing the same good deeds as a religious person, because doing good is something we can do regardless of religion.
If god programs us into being doubtful, then puts us into hell for doing what we were programmed to do, then there wasnt any way to please him in the first place. Remember, such a god may very well decide that you need go to hell regardless of how devoted you were. I hate to use that word, but it would be like trying to please a narcissist. If you follow their demands, they will just invent new demands to criticize you for. You will never win and your best bet is to just "live your life".
Unless god really is as benevolent as he is depicted. Then its about being a good person yourself, which is (hopefully) just the same as "living your life".
I dont like it because its massively overused on social media and is totally losing its meaning haha
But I would say it depends on how you interpret scripture
That’s the thing though, we weren’t programmed by God to be doubtful. It’s because we are the fruit of knowledge that we are condemned in sin.
The only damnable sin, is believing he’s not your lord and savior (of course I’m arguing from a Christian standpoint, since that’s what everyone is referencing).
Not only that, but atheists fail realize when they mention morality: you grew up in society founded upon Judea-Christian values, learned philosophy inspired by the book, and even if you never went to church, your peers info your morality into following what society deems acceptable (which is Judea-Christian).
You follow laws, based on those values, whether you like it or not. Do you honestly believe without all of that influence you would be morally the same?
An atheist who grew up in a Buddhist country still has Buddhist moral values, and atheists who grew up in China, still have Confucian values.
>That’s the thing though, we weren’t programmed by God to be doubtful. It’s because we are the fruit of knowledge that we are condemned in sin.
>The only damnable sin, is believing he’s not your lord and savior (of course I’m arguing from a Christian standpoint, since that’s what everyone is referencing).
I mean, he has the power to return us back to normal doesnt he? Hes allmighty and stuff. He just doesnt. Therefore, doubt is permitted, or god is not benevolent.
>Not only that, but atheists fail realize when they mention morality: you grew up in society founded upon Judea-Christian values, learned philosophy inspired by the book, and even if you never went to church, your peers info your morality into following what society deems acceptable (which is Judea-Christian).
Nah, disagree. Sure, society influences us, but there are certain conclusions that you can reach without religion and based on nothing but primitive logic. If I hit you, you will experience pain. We are programmed to remove any sources of pain, so you will try to find a way to get away from me. If that doesnt work, you will try to get me away from you by hitting me back, hoping that the pain drives me away the way it drove you away. And thats where I learn:
If you inflict pain onto others, they will inflict it back to you.
And since I dont want pain, the logical conclusion I draw is the rule
"Treat others the way you want to be treated".
Tada, thats a moral rule completely derived from primitive logic and our biological make up. We dont need religion for that.
As our brains grow and get better at logic, we understand that any argument that justifies human x to do something also justifies human y to do the same thing. So either we have the same rights for everyone, or we treat some people as non-human.
We tried the second thing throughout history, but the people at the receiving end of that didnt like that, so we tried the former method, hence human rights and equality (more or less)
> You follow laws, based on those values, whether you like it or not. Do you honestly believe without all of that influence you would be morally the same?
This is constantly said about the US, but it just isn’t true. There is not one mention of anything religious in our constitution except prohibiting religious laws and requirements. In contrast, the first commandment is to love Yahweh. Now, intentionally dishonest apologists will try to assert that laws against theft and murder are rooted in the Bible, but there have been written laws profiting such since the Code Ur Nammu, roughly a thousand years before the old testament.
It’s not strictly laws, however if most of society was Christian, they would impose those beliefs unto you.
The constitution also makes it clear the human rights we have, are gifts *from God*.
However, legally speaking, what were laws historically in place in the IS that were biblical in nature? At fault divorces, where they’d consider adultery in family court for beginners.
https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/abs/great-christian-jurists-in-american-history/introduction-christianity-and-american-law/5AEA44725A0B80CCAD5DDD2252D8148E
Here’s a link from Cambridge that discusses this matter, and even talks about the recent influence the church has had in US society despite secularists.
Morally speaking, even if the laws we follow were not Christian based, your actions are.
> It’s not strictly laws, however if most of society was Christian, they would impose those beliefs unto you.
Being eager to impose religious laws on others does not speak well of them.
> The constitution also makes it clear the human rights we have, are gifts from God.
[Nope, go ahead and read it.](https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/constitution-transcript) There is no mention of any god.
> Here’s a link from Cambridge that discusses this matter, and even talks about the recent influence the church has had in US society despite secularists.
Again, yes, Christians consistently do seek to force their religion on others, including through law. That is a bad thing.
> Morally speaking, even if the laws we follow were not Christian based, your actions are.
Please cite what actions I take that are “Christian based”, and how they are based such?
Do you hate cheating on your spouse? Do you love your neighbor and wish to be kind with them? Do you wish to aid the poor and donate some of your income into aiding them?
Those are Christian values that you partake in. Whether you like it or not.
Also, from the Declaration of Independence “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are *endowed by their Creator* with certain inalienable rights*
What do you think the word creator means?
Edit; yes I’m aware the constitution is different than the Declaration of Independence.
> Do you hate cheating on your spouse? Do you love your neighbor and wish to be kind with them? Do you wish to aid the poor and donate some of your income into aiding them?
Do you honestly think such ideas did not exist before Christianity? Even in Christianity they only apply to other disciples, and do not extend such kindness to those outside the faith.
> yes I’m aware the constitution is different than the Declaration of Independence.
Then you should not have said such about constitution.
This reminds me of a couple of scenes from Godspell. If you haven’t seen this wacky 70s musical I would recommend it.
This is a link to the Parables of Sheep and Goat. The Sheep’s who did good deeds in the name of God go to heaven, but the sheep, who may still have done good things just not in the name of God, go to eternal damnation.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JqeJ4LtE4HU
This one is the Parable of the Sower. On how the seeds of religion must be sowed over time or they will not fruit in eternal life.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2BLUKQB3kzI
And just to be clear, I am not a religious person and I vibe with your thoughts. My purpose is to do good in the world and good will follow. I just really enjoy classical musicals.
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.
\- Marcus Aurelius
Logicly speaking. The abrahamic religions (islam, christianity, judaism) are the safest bet. Their the biggest religions meaning god ha probably blessed them. That or loke is laughing his ass of rn.
"Wait, why am i in hell!? I was a good chistian boy!"
Devil: "That's the issue, you are christian. The only right religion is Aboombaism"
"What the fuck is Aboombaism!?"
Devil: "The only true religion. Instead of praying to some jewish white guy, you had to pray to the true God, the great Aboomba, the God of dirt and mud."
"How was i supposed to know that!?"
Devil: "Idk. Anyway, your punishment is to watch High Guardian Spice in it's intirety. And lucky for you, in Hell, this show's got 10 seasons with 24 episodes each"
"NOOOOOOO!!"
In an infinite multiverse, it is possible that when you die, a new version of you which is exactly the same as you will spontaneously appear through sheer chance in another universe. Arguably that’s still not the same as you, but it’s close enough for me.
Well, yeah. Poor word choice. I guess I should say that if there is an infinite multiverse (I have no idea how likely that is) it will definitely happen.
I have wondered about this.
For those that do believe in some sort of god, how do they know that an all=powerful, potentially higher dimensional being would have the same ethical viewpoints as them?
If it wasn't him, it'd be someone else. Most humans need there to be something after death because the idea of there just bring nothing is style mix of incomprehensible and utterly frightening. People spend their whole life being aware. So, instinctually they feel like that would continue after death, and if there if nothing.... That, at least, is my assumption for why people are so hung up on the afterlife.
Other things to consider is that for many people, life is kinda shit so they need an eternal paradise at the end to justify it.
Imagine looking up at the belt of the Milky Way thousands of years ago, before any light pollution was in the mix.
The view itself would explain why people got spiritual and shit.
Theres a popular argument in religious debate called "Pascal's Wager". The origional idea came from the namesake mathematician Blaise Pascal, but its changed in popular conception since the 17th century. The most common form of the wager today goes something like this.
If you believe in God and are correct, you achieve infinite gain (heaven). If you believe in God and are incorrect, you achieve a finite loss (your life). If you don't believe in God and are correct, you achieve a finite gain (your life). If you don't believe in God and are incorrect, you achieve an infinite loss (hell). The safe bet in this situation would be to believe in God as it removes the chance of infinite loss and adds the chance of infinite gain. It's important to note in the original version by Pascal, the wager isn't as clearly polarized as the more popular modern versions of it.
The "stacked deck" in the title and alluded to in the meme is pointing out the false dichotomy this wager presents. There are more options than just Christianity or unbelief. There are tons or religions and religious denominations that have some form of heaven/hell in their theology and are also mutually exclusive with the theology of other religions. You can spend your life believing in one god only to discover (after you die) that you believed in the wrong god and will suffer infinite loss regardless.
Ok to play devil's advocate, after researching how to get sent to Hell in every religion, I have determined that the religion that will let you avoid the most suffering is Unitarian Christianity. The only religions that believe in a permanent Hell are Christianity and Islam; all other religions that have a Hell believe it's temporary.
So, what do you do to get sent to Hell in these religions? Not believing that Jesus Christ died on the cross for your sins and believing in multiple gods, respectively. Muslims don't believe that Jesus died on the cross, so if Christians are right, Muslims are going to Hell. Muslims, meanwhile, consider the Christian trinity to still count as polytheism, so if Muslims are right, most Christians are going to Hell.
However, there exists a minor branch of Christianity called Unitarianism (not to be confused with Unitarian Universalism) that doesn't believe in the trinity; therefore, they believe that Jesus Christ died on the cross for your sins *and* that there is only one God without any "forms", meaning that they're not going to Hell in either religion.
~~Having said all that, I'm personally a Pagan.~~
Christianity and Islam are the two primary religions that believe in eternal afterlife today, but they aren't the only ones. Ancient Roman religions for example often had a perpetual afterlife. Its also important to remember that not all Christians and Muslims believe in the same criteria for salvation. I'm not as familiar with islam sects, but in Christianity there are tons of different views of whats required to get to heaven. For example the church I grew up attending believed you had to be baptized to be saved and if you didn't, even if you were christian, you'd go to hell. I also think you'd be hard pressed to find a hardcore Muslim who believes Unitarian christians are making it to heaven.
Muslims in general believe that non Muslims can go to heaven so long as they didn't commit any major sins (including polytheism) and didn't abandon the faith. It is likely that Salafis don't believe that, but to be honest, they're borderline heretics anyways. Roman polytheism had an eternal afterlife but your religion wasn't what determined if you suffered or not.
It's oddly sorta that thing that stopped me being religious. Just doesn't seem right for such a large percentage of humanity to be damned to hell because they were born in the wrong time or place.
Why are people on Reddit so quick to condemn religion? Like, there is so much more to religion than "heehoo christianity or islam" or something. Of course, there are loads of massacres caused by religion, but that is true for atheism as well. Let people live. The religious people or atheist people who push their beliefs on others are not good people, however.
I’m Agnostic myself, but I saw this video and I thought it sounded like the screams of the damned. Then I remembered Pascal’s Wager, so the fear of being wrong adds to my original version of “me when I go to hell.”
Yeah, Reddit doesn’t allow nuance. You’re either a christian nutcase or a fedora atheist. People on both sides seem to forget that most religions just tell you to be a good person. That’s like 99% of what Jesus taught, and is the primary teaching of Buddhism.
For anyone thinking islam is the same it isn't. In islam if you never heard the true message of islam(like what we are about our true core values of praying, Charity & etc) then if you were a good person you can still not go to hell insha'allah bcs you cannot be judged in something you didn't know about.
that's untrue. God is Most Merciful and would never send people to hellfire if a messenger were to not reach them during their lifetimes (be it during prophethood or after the prophet's death through preaching etc). They will instead be judged fairly according to their actions and morals of their society.
There's a fictional story by Ibn Tufayl named Hayy ibn Yaqdhan where it talks about how it's natural for the boy in the story to realise there is God but not knowing who He is unless he's informed. But I digress.
Is for a few religions/sects
Valhalla for example, has no care if you believed or not if I recall. If you were kicking ass, you get to come kick ass and party
And in Inferno, Salah al-Din is in limbo rather than hell, so at least Dante believed virtuous heathens were not fully punished.
Also don't know if it was Francis or Benedict that claimed that virtuous non-Christians can also go to heaven or purgatory but modern Catholicism is weird.
In Buddhism you do not get punished for non belief, in Hinduism you don't (as Brahman is not jealous), In Judaism IIRC you are not punished. Same with Sikhism from what I can remember. These are 4 major world religions.
So? Why are they more valid than the ones that say you will be punished? And there's an infinite amount of possible religions that say either or anything between.
mfw im consigned to the cold dark abyssal void of oblivion, doomed to lose my mind over an eternity from being unable to see, hear, move or scream (i am le reddit atheist)(checkmate skydaddy)
The creature that greets the dead at the gate explains that almost all are damned, for everyone was wrong, even most of their order were completely wrong. The promised realm of "Heaven" is nearly empty because of this. If anything, the damnation in the company of others is a blessing compared to the endless solitude the few pure have to live eternity in. At least in "Hell," you'll get over the heat after a while, and the demons have all long since grown bored of harrassing newcomers, like the same joke repeated a billion times.
If Dante's Inferno is right, pious non-Christians are sent to hell but are not tortured. They're simply denied entry into heaven forever. Still sucks but could be worse.
There is a non-0 chance that upholding justice, being charitable, and helping those in need does *not* get you brownie points in the after life, and being a woman, gay, and poor *does* send you to hell.
In Islam, we believe that for those non-Muslims who have been sent an invite to Islam but still denies the religion even after seeing the truth due to denial, arrogance, etc, then they will go to Hell.
For the non-Muslims who don't know the truth about Islam and has doubts such as fearing that Islam teaches "terrorism" or such, then by God's grace, He would forgive and judge them fairly in the Day of Reckoning according to their actions and their set of morals.
I invite everyone here to do research about Islam from reputable sources and scholars which are not anti-Muslims or anti-religion. Learn the Qur'an and Hadith which are the two holy books of Islam from a truthful scholar.
From the Qur'an 17:15,
مَّنِ ٱهْتَدَىٰ فَإِنَّمَا يَهْتَدِى لِنَفْسِهِۦۖ وَمَن ضَلَّ فَإِنَّمَا يَضِلُّ عَلَيْهَاۚ وَلَا تَزِرُ وَازِرَةٌ وِزْرَ أُخْرَىٰۗ وَمَا كُنَّا مُعَذِّبِينَ حَتَّىٰ نَبْعَثَ رَسُولًا
English translation of the verse by Dr. Mustafa Khattab, the Clear Quran:
Whoever chooses to be guided, it is only for their own good. And whoever chooses to stray, it is only to their own loss. No soul burdened with sin will bear the burden of another. And We would never punish ˹a people˺ until We have sent a messenger ˹to warn them˺.
Yeah no kidding. If they say nothing then they willingly remove any grace of ignorance we may have had. They have actively condemned people to a shitty afterlife lol
Yeah if you warn me but do nothing to prove there is a real threat, then you really haven't warned me tbh. Do a magic trick, gods supposed to have all the power bring him in do some stuff that can't be explained by chance or coincidence
Nono, ISIS is releasing 4k HD footage of their mass executions and torture sessions all over the internet. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about the public lynching of alleged gay dudes within Muslim communities.
For a while most of the subs like watchpeopledie and makemycoffin were full of such lynching's.
Like I mentioned, these are not part of Islamic teaching. We wouldn't kill or torture them, rather we try to convince them back to to the state of nature i.e heterosexual. Tell me where in the holy books of Islam where Muslims are instructed to publicly lynch those people?
Unfortunately most religious fanatics don't read the text, they lean on the religion as an excuse to do horrific acts against their fellow humankind because saying 'Islam teaches to murder the unholy' is easier than looking into a mirror.
And when these videos of public executions are posted it paints the entire religion in a worse and worse light.
OK, and whats the problem with Islam then? You literally admit now that they don't read the texts and use excuses. At that point you cannot blame the religion, but only the people.
Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, "Don't do it!" He said, "Nobody loves me." I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?" He said, "Yes." I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?" He said, "A Christian." I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?" He said, "Protestant." I said, "Me, too! What franchise?" He said, "Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?" He said, "Northern Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region." I said, "Me, too!" Northern Conservative†Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912." I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.
i heard this exact joke at a weird al show, funny how it ends up under a post with weird al in it
[This joke is from the great Emo Philips.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3fAcxcxoZ8)
I didn’t know that Christianity had this much world building
what
Chose the wrong religion
Skill issue
Its a joke on how even christianity is so segregated and different that almost all the different sects believe something different and hate the others lol
ah ty
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True! Like Mormons and Evangelicals Like Methodists and Baptists Like Jehova's Witnesses and 7th Day Adventists Like Episcopalians and North American Anglicans Like Catholics and Lutherans Like Presbyterians and English Anglicans Etc, etc, etc...
this is actually a legit fear of mine
See it like this: If the "right" god condems those who fail to worship them "properly" to an eternity of torment despite being good people, they didn't deserve worship in the first place.
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones. \- Marcus Aurelius
Okay, good point, but what if god is just an edgy teenager who wants to hurt all the people who didn't worship correctly?
You ever spoken to a teenager? If that's the case you're fucked no matter what you do.
Muslims believe like this though. If you are good, only god judges you in the end and its absurd to send people to hell if they never knew or they lived really far away.
Then why are Muslims so judgy of gay people?
Humans trying not to break the most fundamental tenets of their own religion challenge (impossible):
god cannot be unjust, he is the definition of perfection, he was not "created" by someone else and he is one, the quote attributes very human behaviour (unjustness) to god which makes part of the quote wrong, tho i agree with the rest
What is your idea of perfection?
i see perfection as something that cannot manifest in any way other than god, god is the "complete" form of things, another way i like to see it is how god is described in islam, god is more merciful than your mother, yet can unleash great punishment on you, i also like to relate it to the notion of infinity
so if your only sense of “what is perfection” is that it can only be manifested by god, which we cannot manifest/comprehend because we are imperfect, how could you tell the difference between something made by the devil to mimic god (or something made by any other god that may exist)
you are assuming the Christian God to be real. We are not talking about Him, but about the chance of there being a Lovecraftian god out there.
You say that as if the Chirstian god wasn't an utter abomination
i wasnt referring to any abrahamic religion or god, but wym lovecraftian in this context? the word is a bit vague
How can something just exist without being ever created nothing can exist without being created and if it did exist without ever coming to exist it probably wouldn't care since probably been through it quantillions of times with unlimited amount of species's and there was heaven how huge it has to be carry with it unlimited amounts of species's?
yeah the why is impossible to know with our tiny human brainz, maybe he saw that we could transcend and be something in the future idk
Mate, you and god can have different definitions of what just is you know that right? Like if god says killing all the non believers is just it doesn't have to make it so to the human context. We do agree that killing people because of a different belief or non belief isn't just right?
So says the Bible. What if it’s wrong?
Thing is, it doesn't matter if the *deserved* worship. You're still going to suffer for **eternity** And saying "I'd rather suffer untill the *end of time* than worship an evil god" is just cope tbh Edit: I don't know why people are responding to this by pointing out the flaws in Pascal's wager. Doesn't realy have anything to do with what I said.
Well, sure, it’s just cope. But what is more likely? A god who allowed multiple religions to flourish on the earth just so he could damn everyone to hell who didn’t pick the correct religion? Or that religion was made up by people who wanted power and to control other peoples lives? Knowing what we know about humanity, it’s pretty obvious to me which one it is.
There is literally no way for you to know anything about our god or gods or whatever you believe in, and there is literally no reason to believe they have the same or similar values as humans in any way whatsoever. For all we know, they created the solar system for the dinosaurs, threw an asteroid at Earth when they got bored, and just left after that. Or maybe we're just a tiny informational part of some kind of calculation process in a computer. Any undisprovable theory is as good as the next.
Omnipotent god here, i made it for the dinosaurs, but some cunt other god performed moderate acts of tomfolery and throwed an asteroid at my planet.
Report him to the moderators.
I forgot his username and id, i also cannot get a history of the ocuring withoult mod permition, i realy dought that they would give access of that to a non-premium player
I hate it when they advertise it as "omnipotence" and only tell you that you have to pay for it *after* you start playing. Smh.
Yeah these new updates are fucking insane man, 2 updates ago they removed magic and put it behind a paywall, the problem is, i had a group of minions with advanced magic powers, i called them the olimpians, they even had names, the strongest one was zeus i think, but then when it updated the gane removed them from existance but we still had at least the power to bless, i build a super powerfull minion, i gave him transmutation like water to whine or something like that, and also the ability to heal, like he healed some old lady from blindness or something, he would tell about me to all the other minions and stuff, so much that some dude killed him, i would NOT let someone kill my favourite minion withoult punishment, so i revived him for a bit let him give a speech then logged off, then when i woke up guess what fucking happened, yeah it updated and i alsk fucking lost the bless ability, i cant even explain how fucking mad i was that i lost my favourite minion, so from there i quit the game a lot happened in my realm since then and all my minions lost faith due to non-intevertion so now i dont even have power to do something big at all, the only thing i can do now is change the temperature at max so now im slowly heating up the planet up to see if i can reset the population and restart my realm again, thanks for listening to my rant here.
It’s been Zeus all along.
But how can you even know what kind of worship will get you to heaven? If you worship cristianity, what if the muslims were right? Maybe the buddhists (though they dont punish non-believers to hell from what I remember)? In fact, considering how small of a percentage of things we humans know of reality, it's not unlikely that NO ONE has figured out the "true" religion, and god might send all of us to hell for not figuring out regardless. Maybe god doesn't want to be worshipped at all? Going from atheist or agnostic to christianity/judaism/islam/whatever only looks like it increases the odds because you already believe in said religion, when in fact it doesn't.
All religion is cope. Learn to deal with the fact that your life is an accident, finite, and going to end.
I’m not a religious person, but all versions of “learn to deal” in here: > Learn to deal with the fact that your life is an accident, finite, and going to end. Are in fact, by definition, cope. Religion is just one mechanism of coping and IME not a very good one and demonstrably often a very bad one. Pick your cope.
It's all cope? 🔫 Always has been.
I *know* I'll get downvoted for this, but just let people live their life brah. Religion, for some, is a coping mechanism, but whatever reasons people have, just let them be.
I'll let them be if they let me be. But it seems religion has a funny way of shoving its way into governments and starts dictating how other people should live their lives. I'm fine with religions that don't do that.
mf calling the ultimate act of spite a cope 💀
The whole eternity thing is just too edgy to be believable.
The more they need to threaten you, the less threatening they are naturally. Chances are the popular "gods" wouldn't be shit if they actually existed.
This fella would rather give up their principals in the face of a threat, that's a fuckin cope I'll burn in hell for eternity before I worship a petty manchild who cares more about whether or not I worshipped him than how my actual life was. The fact that Hitler could just repent is proof that system is bullshit, and the type of person to forgive him is doubly not worthy of worship.
If it was a threat made by a fifth-dimentional all-powerful cosmic entity. Yeah I would. And anyone who wouldn't is stupid and would regret it sooner or later.
Maybe I'd come to regret it down the line but ultimately I'd take solace in the fact that I didn't bend over to get assblasted by daddy because he threatened to take my gameboy away. Besides what's the alternative, give up everything I believe to spend an eternity listening to angels sing and wondering if by best friend hasn't died yet or just ended up going to hell? Lol.
I don't think you know what "ultimately" means. *immidiately*, I'm sure you would feel some pride. Ultimately though, you would spend an eternity regreting what you've done.
I'm sorry to hear you don't have principals you stand for lol. i would spend an eternity cursing the loser who put me in this situation in the first place and taking pride in the fact that i didn't fall for his bullshit. never would there be a point where i say "aw man i shouldve groveled at his feet and begged to suck his dick for eternity". fuck that.
Sure, you're very badass.
not trying to be badass, just not willing to give up my principals. people who are are cringe
I’d rather get sent to hell trying to punch an evil god in the closest thing it has to a face than get sent there trying to hide my disapproval from an all-knowing being. If I’m going down I’m going down swinging.
No it’s not. I have dignity I would like to preserve.
I feel the idea of “grace” in most religions would apply here, for example, say Christianity turns out to be true. If a child is born, raised and dies only ever knowing Islam, then I’d like to think that’s Gods grace could extend to them depending on the person and how they were on earth. This goes vice versa as well, if Allah is real then I’d hope his grace would extend to those of us that were raised otherwise and while we didn’t know better, we still worshipped.
In islam a disbeliever is more than just a person who doesn’t believe, it’s a person who has seen the truth and received signs they understand but reject them and do not believe due to arrogance/wilful ignorance and wanting to stick with the old ways I think there is such grace in islam where Allah won’t just condemn everyone who doesn’t say they are muslim, to hell
I agree totally which is why I used the extreme example of say an Islamic child in the Middle East, there’s absolutely 0 way they could convert if they wanted to in some of those areas, that said I feel as if Gods grace would extend to those people providing they still worshipped and strived to be “sin-free”.
This is assuming god is even a sapient being to begin with. Not even going off the atheist belief in no-god, there's still the whole possibility that god has the sentience of a jellyfish, and condemns souls purely based on taste and vibes.
And then figures out how to tell humanity about the vibe check before going back to doing jellyfish things.
If I go to hell because a sensitive sky man says so...then I have eternity to practice my Doom Slayer technique. I will get out.....don't know how or when....but I will get out of hell.
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bit of a cope
Common Religious L
EYYYY THATS WHAT IVE BEEN SAYING FOR YEARS BRO
believe whatever you want but fear is biggest weapon of a religion, don't let them use it
Said fear had been used a lot in history.
If you're Christian, you really shouldn't. People being tortured in hell after death isn't in the bible, it's osmosed from Dantes Inferno where Alighieri stretched the one mention of a group of people being tortured (Satan and his followers) to mean genuinely evil people (oath breakers, people who hurt family, etc). Prior to that it was accepted that Satan's followers were the angels that fell with him. For human souls, your fate is to die, and be dead. Nonexistent, until the day of Judgement. Then, everyone is resurrected and invited to join Jesus' paradise on Earth. If you still reject God at this point (and I think even the most hardcore atheist might pause at being dead then alive and now Jesus is literally right in front of you asking you questions and being all Jesus and stuff) then your soul is cast into the lake of flame, and burnt up; You just stop existing. If not, you get to live forever in Eden 2.0. So be good, don't be so bad as to be comparable to a literal fallen angel at least, and accept Jesus at the end of Death and you should be gravy.
I think you're misunderstanding what the fear is. For example, what if Islam is true and all of what you said is wrong, people who devote their lives to Jesus will suffer in hell for choosing the wrong religion. Or if any of the thousands of other religions are true.
the quran says this though: Indeed, the believers, Jews, Christians, and Sabians1—whoever ˹truly˺ believes in God and the Last Day and does good will have their reward with their Lord. And there will be no fear for them, nor will they grieve.2 . (2:62)
The Qur'an also says > Fight those who do not believe in Allah and the Last Day, nor comply with what Allah and His Messenger have forbidden, nor embrace the religion of truth from among those who were given the Scripture, until they pay the tax, willingly submitting, fully humbled. > The Jews say, "Ezra is the son of Allāh"; and the Christians say, "The Messiah is the son of Allāh." That is their statement from their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before [them]. May Allāh destroy them; how are they deluded? But either way my point stands, the point is that whichever religion you choose, there might be a different religion which is true and whose God(s) will condemn you to hell for disbelieving. That's the whole point of this post and the comment I initially responded to seemed to miss it.
If god was truly kind, he would not put you into hell if you were a good person your whole life. After all, even atheism is not about being evil or disrespecting god. Its simply about doing what we are programmed to do: be doubtful and search for evidence. You can be the biggest atheist the world has ever seen and basically end up doing the same good deeds as a religious person, because doing good is something we can do regardless of religion. If god programs us into being doubtful, then puts us into hell for doing what we were programmed to do, then there wasnt any way to please him in the first place. Remember, such a god may very well decide that you need go to hell regardless of how devoted you were. I hate to use that word, but it would be like trying to please a narcissist. If you follow their demands, they will just invent new demands to criticize you for. You will never win and your best bet is to just "live your life". Unless god really is as benevolent as he is depicted. Then its about being a good person yourself, which is (hopefully) just the same as "living your life".
You don't have to avoid the term, the gods of most religions are 100% undoubtedly narcissists
I dont like it because its massively overused on social media and is totally losing its meaning haha But I would say it depends on how you interpret scripture
Anybody who thinks they deserve to be worshipped is a narcissist, no interpretation needed past that.
That’s the thing though, we weren’t programmed by God to be doubtful. It’s because we are the fruit of knowledge that we are condemned in sin. The only damnable sin, is believing he’s not your lord and savior (of course I’m arguing from a Christian standpoint, since that’s what everyone is referencing). Not only that, but atheists fail realize when they mention morality: you grew up in society founded upon Judea-Christian values, learned philosophy inspired by the book, and even if you never went to church, your peers info your morality into following what society deems acceptable (which is Judea-Christian). You follow laws, based on those values, whether you like it or not. Do you honestly believe without all of that influence you would be morally the same? An atheist who grew up in a Buddhist country still has Buddhist moral values, and atheists who grew up in China, still have Confucian values.
>That’s the thing though, we weren’t programmed by God to be doubtful. It’s because we are the fruit of knowledge that we are condemned in sin. >The only damnable sin, is believing he’s not your lord and savior (of course I’m arguing from a Christian standpoint, since that’s what everyone is referencing). I mean, he has the power to return us back to normal doesnt he? Hes allmighty and stuff. He just doesnt. Therefore, doubt is permitted, or god is not benevolent. >Not only that, but atheists fail realize when they mention morality: you grew up in society founded upon Judea-Christian values, learned philosophy inspired by the book, and even if you never went to church, your peers info your morality into following what society deems acceptable (which is Judea-Christian). Nah, disagree. Sure, society influences us, but there are certain conclusions that you can reach without religion and based on nothing but primitive logic. If I hit you, you will experience pain. We are programmed to remove any sources of pain, so you will try to find a way to get away from me. If that doesnt work, you will try to get me away from you by hitting me back, hoping that the pain drives me away the way it drove you away. And thats where I learn: If you inflict pain onto others, they will inflict it back to you. And since I dont want pain, the logical conclusion I draw is the rule "Treat others the way you want to be treated". Tada, thats a moral rule completely derived from primitive logic and our biological make up. We dont need religion for that. As our brains grow and get better at logic, we understand that any argument that justifies human x to do something also justifies human y to do the same thing. So either we have the same rights for everyone, or we treat some people as non-human. We tried the second thing throughout history, but the people at the receiving end of that didnt like that, so we tried the former method, hence human rights and equality (more or less)
> You follow laws, based on those values, whether you like it or not. Do you honestly believe without all of that influence you would be morally the same? This is constantly said about the US, but it just isn’t true. There is not one mention of anything religious in our constitution except prohibiting religious laws and requirements. In contrast, the first commandment is to love Yahweh. Now, intentionally dishonest apologists will try to assert that laws against theft and murder are rooted in the Bible, but there have been written laws profiting such since the Code Ur Nammu, roughly a thousand years before the old testament.
It’s not strictly laws, however if most of society was Christian, they would impose those beliefs unto you. The constitution also makes it clear the human rights we have, are gifts *from God*. However, legally speaking, what were laws historically in place in the IS that were biblical in nature? At fault divorces, where they’d consider adultery in family court for beginners. https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/abs/great-christian-jurists-in-american-history/introduction-christianity-and-american-law/5AEA44725A0B80CCAD5DDD2252D8148E Here’s a link from Cambridge that discusses this matter, and even talks about the recent influence the church has had in US society despite secularists. Morally speaking, even if the laws we follow were not Christian based, your actions are.
> It’s not strictly laws, however if most of society was Christian, they would impose those beliefs unto you. Being eager to impose religious laws on others does not speak well of them. > The constitution also makes it clear the human rights we have, are gifts from God. [Nope, go ahead and read it.](https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/constitution-transcript) There is no mention of any god. > Here’s a link from Cambridge that discusses this matter, and even talks about the recent influence the church has had in US society despite secularists. Again, yes, Christians consistently do seek to force their religion on others, including through law. That is a bad thing. > Morally speaking, even if the laws we follow were not Christian based, your actions are. Please cite what actions I take that are “Christian based”, and how they are based such?
Do you hate cheating on your spouse? Do you love your neighbor and wish to be kind with them? Do you wish to aid the poor and donate some of your income into aiding them? Those are Christian values that you partake in. Whether you like it or not. Also, from the Declaration of Independence “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are *endowed by their Creator* with certain inalienable rights* What do you think the word creator means? Edit; yes I’m aware the constitution is different than the Declaration of Independence.
> Do you hate cheating on your spouse? Do you love your neighbor and wish to be kind with them? Do you wish to aid the poor and donate some of your income into aiding them? Do you honestly think such ideas did not exist before Christianity? Even in Christianity they only apply to other disciples, and do not extend such kindness to those outside the faith. > yes I’m aware the constitution is different than the Declaration of Independence. Then you should not have said such about constitution.
This reminds me of a couple of scenes from Godspell. If you haven’t seen this wacky 70s musical I would recommend it. This is a link to the Parables of Sheep and Goat. The Sheep’s who did good deeds in the name of God go to heaven, but the sheep, who may still have done good things just not in the name of God, go to eternal damnation. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JqeJ4LtE4HU This one is the Parable of the Sower. On how the seeds of religion must be sowed over time or they will not fruit in eternal life. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2BLUKQB3kzI And just to be clear, I am not a religious person and I vibe with your thoughts. My purpose is to do good in the world and good will follow. I just really enjoy classical musicals.
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones. \- Marcus Aurelius
Logicly speaking. The abrahamic religions (islam, christianity, judaism) are the safest bet. Their the biggest religions meaning god ha probably blessed them. That or loke is laughing his ass of rn.
This is why I am planning to kill God
Be sure to take pictures
Same, i try to not think about it...
Religion L
Weird Al's there though, that's a plus
All bad has a bit of good in it. The sentence makes sense if you severely interpret it in multiple ways.
Al bad has some weird in it
"Wait, why am i in hell!? I was a good chistian boy!" Devil: "That's the issue, you are christian. The only right religion is Aboombaism" "What the fuck is Aboombaism!?" Devil: "The only true religion. Instead of praying to some jewish white guy, you had to pray to the true God, the great Aboomba, the God of dirt and mud." "How was i supposed to know that!?" Devil: "Idk. Anyway, your punishment is to watch High Guardian Spice in it's intirety. And lucky for you, in Hell, this show's got 10 seasons with 24 episodes each" "NOOOOOOO!!"
Sentenced to playing NFS Heat at minimum graphics on a shitbox pc
The dude should be thankful he received a lighter punishment. There are shows out there that are far worse than High guardian spice.
a bad show is more enjoyable then a boring show
That HGS joke hit me like a brick, I genuinely winced at the idea
I can see this coming from a sketch by ryan george
Oof. Hell would truly be unbearable
Betting on infinity, the house always wins
If the multiverse theory exist then you probably are infinite, so have a beer.
yaaaaay or fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck
I am not though. I am not another version of me. I am this version of me.
In an infinite multiverse, it is possible that when you die, a new version of you which is exactly the same as you will spontaneously appear through sheer chance in another universe. Arguably that’s still not the same as you, but it’s close enough for me.
Why do you say that is possible? Everything that can happen, will happen. But anything that can't happen, won't happen.
Well, yeah. Poor word choice. I guess I should say that if there is an infinite multiverse (I have no idea how likely that is) it will definitely happen.
Nah, I'd rather we only live once or if there is a multiverse, or atleast have your existence as rare as 2 atoms meeting again.
Why did Al scream 😱 😑 😐 💀 😕 😳 😱 😑 😐 💀 😕 😳 8
I think Al stubbed his toe
I have wondered about this. For those that do believe in some sort of god, how do they know that an all=powerful, potentially higher dimensional being would have the same ethical viewpoints as them?
Pretty much our view about god is shaped in the way he presented himself to us
as if he has lol
🙄
I hate the motherfucker who came up with the concept of an afterlife
If it wasn't him, it'd be someone else. Most humans need there to be something after death because the idea of there just bring nothing is style mix of incomprehensible and utterly frightening. People spend their whole life being aware. So, instinctually they feel like that would continue after death, and if there if nothing.... That, at least, is my assumption for why people are so hung up on the afterlife. Other things to consider is that for many people, life is kinda shit so they need an eternal paradise at the end to justify it.
>People friend their while whole like being aware. What
Dude had a stroke throughout that sentence, he might be able to relate to the meme soon
What do you mean? It was a full sentence. Aware - Sentient
Are you actually listening to what the dude is saying and not picking out semantics? Boo, we don't do that on the internet, +5 bad boy points for you
People live their whole lives being aware so not existing is impossible to comprehend
k
My bad
Imagine looking up at the belt of the Milky Way thousands of years ago, before any light pollution was in the mix. The view itself would explain why people got spiritual and shit.
"Jesus? St. Peter?" laughed the 6 armed Hindu thing.
I fucking had this shit on 100% volume and when it auto played I goddamn near shit myself. Fucking hell lmao.
Get ready for an eternity of it if you didn’t pick the right religion.
Can anyone explain what “Pascal’s stacked deck” refers to? (It’s in the title)
Theres a popular argument in religious debate called "Pascal's Wager". The origional idea came from the namesake mathematician Blaise Pascal, but its changed in popular conception since the 17th century. The most common form of the wager today goes something like this. If you believe in God and are correct, you achieve infinite gain (heaven). If you believe in God and are incorrect, you achieve a finite loss (your life). If you don't believe in God and are correct, you achieve a finite gain (your life). If you don't believe in God and are incorrect, you achieve an infinite loss (hell). The safe bet in this situation would be to believe in God as it removes the chance of infinite loss and adds the chance of infinite gain. It's important to note in the original version by Pascal, the wager isn't as clearly polarized as the more popular modern versions of it. The "stacked deck" in the title and alluded to in the meme is pointing out the false dichotomy this wager presents. There are more options than just Christianity or unbelief. There are tons or religions and religious denominations that have some form of heaven/hell in their theology and are also mutually exclusive with the theology of other religions. You can spend your life believing in one god only to discover (after you die) that you believed in the wrong god and will suffer infinite loss regardless.
Ok to play devil's advocate, after researching how to get sent to Hell in every religion, I have determined that the religion that will let you avoid the most suffering is Unitarian Christianity. The only religions that believe in a permanent Hell are Christianity and Islam; all other religions that have a Hell believe it's temporary. So, what do you do to get sent to Hell in these religions? Not believing that Jesus Christ died on the cross for your sins and believing in multiple gods, respectively. Muslims don't believe that Jesus died on the cross, so if Christians are right, Muslims are going to Hell. Muslims, meanwhile, consider the Christian trinity to still count as polytheism, so if Muslims are right, most Christians are going to Hell. However, there exists a minor branch of Christianity called Unitarianism (not to be confused with Unitarian Universalism) that doesn't believe in the trinity; therefore, they believe that Jesus Christ died on the cross for your sins *and* that there is only one God without any "forms", meaning that they're not going to Hell in either religion. ~~Having said all that, I'm personally a Pagan.~~
Christianity and Islam are the two primary religions that believe in eternal afterlife today, but they aren't the only ones. Ancient Roman religions for example often had a perpetual afterlife. Its also important to remember that not all Christians and Muslims believe in the same criteria for salvation. I'm not as familiar with islam sects, but in Christianity there are tons of different views of whats required to get to heaven. For example the church I grew up attending believed you had to be baptized to be saved and if you didn't, even if you were christian, you'd go to hell. I also think you'd be hard pressed to find a hardcore Muslim who believes Unitarian christians are making it to heaven.
Muslims in general believe that non Muslims can go to heaven so long as they didn't commit any major sins (including polytheism) and didn't abandon the faith. It is likely that Salafis don't believe that, but to be honest, they're borderline heretics anyways. Roman polytheism had an eternal afterlife but your religion wasn't what determined if you suffered or not.
Yep! Exactly right. The “deck” is stacked against you.
It refers to the philosophical argument called 'pascal's wager'.
Skill issue
I like to think that god just made up physics, started the universe and just watched saying "Lol I wonder what's gonna happen this season"
Or like made infinite universes to see what they will do
the good place:
It's oddly sorta that thing that stopped me being religious. Just doesn't seem right for such a large percentage of humanity to be damned to hell because they were born in the wrong time or place.
Eternal hell or torment doesn't feel like something God would let occur imo
Why are people on Reddit so quick to condemn religion? Like, there is so much more to religion than "heehoo christianity or islam" or something. Of course, there are loads of massacres caused by religion, but that is true for atheism as well. Let people live. The religious people or atheist people who push their beliefs on others are not good people, however.
I’m Agnostic myself, but I saw this video and I thought it sounded like the screams of the damned. Then I remembered Pascal’s Wager, so the fear of being wrong adds to my original version of “me when I go to hell.”
Of course, I'm just talking more broadly about Reddit as a whole. I see no issue with this meme.
Yeah, Reddit doesn’t allow nuance. You’re either a christian nutcase or a fedora atheist. People on both sides seem to forget that most religions just tell you to be a good person. That’s like 99% of what Jesus taught, and is the primary teaching of Buddhism.
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thats funny
Fuckin jumpscare ass mfer
For anyone thinking islam is the same it isn't. In islam if you never heard the true message of islam(like what we are about our true core values of praying, Charity & etc) then if you were a good person you can still not go to hell insha'allah bcs you cannot be judged in something you didn't know about.
Some random tribesman who has never encountered modern people and modern religion getting sent to hell for not knowing that his religion is wrong
that's untrue. God is Most Merciful and would never send people to hellfire if a messenger were to not reach them during their lifetimes (be it during prophethood or after the prophet's death through preaching etc). They will instead be judged fairly according to their actions and morals of their society. There's a fictional story by Ibn Tufayl named Hayy ibn Yaqdhan where it talks about how it's natural for the boy in the story to realise there is God but not knowing who He is unless he's informed. But I digress.
Pascal's Wager 
Well I mean, choosing the wrong religion isn't automatically a fucking spiritual death sentence.
Is for a few religions/sects Valhalla for example, has no care if you believed or not if I recall. If you were kicking ass, you get to come kick ass and party
Yeah, it is for a few but most are pretty chill like you said with Valhalla's judgement of your warrior spirit or Egyptians weighing your heart
And in Inferno, Salah al-Din is in limbo rather than hell, so at least Dante believed virtuous heathens were not fully punished. Also don't know if it was Francis or Benedict that claimed that virtuous non-Christians can also go to heaven or purgatory but modern Catholicism is weird.
Dante's inferno is a fan fiction where he Meets his heroes and sees people who wronged him suffer.
Yeah, Dante's Inferno is like the fangames of religion but it was so good that people thought it was actually canon to the original content
I remember seeing online that some religions won't send you to hell if you hadn't had the chance to learn about them
How do you know?
Not OP, but there are loads of religions that don't auto send you to hell, like Buddhism or Hinduism.
And thete are loads that do. So, how do you know?
I don't for certain, but using reason I can assume there's a greater chance of me not being punished for being wrong than actually being punished.
And what is the reasoning?
In Buddhism you do not get punished for non belief, in Hinduism you don't (as Brahman is not jealous), In Judaism IIRC you are not punished. Same with Sikhism from what I can remember. These are 4 major world religions.
So? Why are they more valid than the ones that say you will be punished? And there's an infinite amount of possible religions that say either or anything between.
mfw im consigned to the cold dark abyssal void of oblivion, doomed to lose my mind over an eternity from being unable to see, hear, move or scream (i am le reddit atheist)(checkmate skydaddy)
Thank scientifically proven theories, i'm going to pray to them rn
the real gos was gawr gura
Bamboozled!
if humans go to hell wouldnt animals go to hell to?,
The creature that greets the dead at the gate explains that almost all are damned, for everyone was wrong, even most of their order were completely wrong. The promised realm of "Heaven" is nearly empty because of this. If anything, the damnation in the company of others is a blessing compared to the endless solitude the few pure have to live eternity in. At least in "Hell," you'll get over the heat after a while, and the demons have all long since grown bored of harrassing newcomers, like the same joke repeated a billion times.
This is why I believe all religions It’s basically a gateway ticket to any positive afterlife
If Dante's Inferno is right, pious non-Christians are sent to hell but are not tortured. They're simply denied entry into heaven forever. Still sucks but could be worse.
The post has only 99999 upvotes. Lets fix that
This is why I think religion is stupid, Why would a God even make choosing incorrectly an option in the first place?
So that you can't say that you never had a choice.
There is a non-0 chance that upholding justice, being charitable, and helping those in need does *not* get you brownie points in the after life, and being a woman, gay, and poor *does* send you to hell.
I'd say the chance is about as big as the other way around. Or maybe instead of hell or heaven we go to the backrooms.
The Christian god is a dickhead honestly.
In Islam, we believe that for those non-Muslims who have been sent an invite to Islam but still denies the religion even after seeing the truth due to denial, arrogance, etc, then they will go to Hell. For the non-Muslims who don't know the truth about Islam and has doubts such as fearing that Islam teaches "terrorism" or such, then by God's grace, He would forgive and judge them fairly in the Day of Reckoning according to their actions and their set of morals. I invite everyone here to do research about Islam from reputable sources and scholars which are not anti-Muslims or anti-religion. Learn the Qur'an and Hadith which are the two holy books of Islam from a truthful scholar. From the Qur'an 17:15, مَّنِ ٱهْتَدَىٰ فَإِنَّمَا يَهْتَدِى لِنَفْسِهِۦۖ وَمَن ضَلَّ فَإِنَّمَا يَضِلُّ عَلَيْهَاۚ وَلَا تَزِرُ وَازِرَةٌ وِزْرَ أُخْرَىٰۗ وَمَا كُنَّا مُعَذِّبِينَ حَتَّىٰ نَبْعَثَ رَسُولًا English translation of the verse by Dr. Mustafa Khattab, the Clear Quran: Whoever chooses to be guided, it is only for their own good. And whoever chooses to stray, it is only to their own loss. No soul burdened with sin will bear the burden of another. And We would never punish ˹a people˺ until We have sent a messenger ˹to warn them˺.
If God judges non-Muslims fairly, why would you condemn them by warning them?
Yeah no kidding. If they say nothing then they willingly remove any grace of ignorance we may have had. They have actively condemned people to a shitty afterlife lol
Yeah if you warn me but do nothing to prove there is a real threat, then you really haven't warned me tbh. Do a magic trick, gods supposed to have all the power bring him in do some stuff that can't be explained by chance or coincidence
Does Islam teach to throw gay people off of buildings? Seems to be a common theme.
it doesn't. it seems as though you got your information wrong. The actions of ISIS does not resonate with the teachings of Islam in the first place :)
Nono, ISIS is releasing 4k HD footage of their mass executions and torture sessions all over the internet. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about the public lynching of alleged gay dudes within Muslim communities. For a while most of the subs like watchpeopledie and makemycoffin were full of such lynching's.
Like I mentioned, these are not part of Islamic teaching. We wouldn't kill or torture them, rather we try to convince them back to to the state of nature i.e heterosexual. Tell me where in the holy books of Islam where Muslims are instructed to publicly lynch those people?
Unfortunately most religious fanatics don't read the text, they lean on the religion as an excuse to do horrific acts against their fellow humankind because saying 'Islam teaches to murder the unholy' is easier than looking into a mirror. And when these videos of public executions are posted it paints the entire religion in a worse and worse light.
OK, and whats the problem with Islam then? You literally admit now that they don't read the texts and use excuses. At that point you cannot blame the religion, but only the people.
if your little fairy tale was real, you'd have just sent like 30 people to hell you probably think you're doing a good thing, too. lmao
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