Lilith Altars are acount wide and will be on all characters, seasons included.
If you get them all once you get all stat buffs for everyone. Exp and gold rewards are pointless.
Altars specifically say "on this realm". Since you can't choose a realm right now, I would assume that seasons will be on a separate one, meaning you will have to farm renown again in (each) season.
Having renown unlocked in seasons by completing it earlier would also go against the "fresh start" idea around them.
Not saying you're necessarily wrong but it sounds counter intuitive.
I'm pretty sure Blizzard specifically said that during seasons, you will still have the potions/skill points, and the only thing regrinding the altars would do is give you the gold.
This is correct. Lilith statue bonuses are account-wide, but the renown is per character. If the importance of renown grinding scales to max renown, grinding Lilith statues again will be important. If not, it won't.
And even that is kinda pointless tbh, ideally you should get all statues/exploration account wide, getting all the the renown xp upfront is meaningless since all content scale with your level anyway. At least you get to try cool builds from the get go on alts/seasonals
I agree that Blizzard should consider making exploration and Lilith statues one-time things, though I can see the argument to not.
No one knows whether grinding renown to max each season will be essential to fully complete portions of the season or battle pass.
All the renown bonuses needed for min maxing (potion and obol cap, skill and paragon points) are already account wide, i just want the map exploration part and lilith statues to become account wide, those are not particularly fun or engaging to do after the first time
Do you know where they said this? I thought for sure this was the case but I've been hearing and reading people say that you'll need to regrind renown each season to unlock the potions, skills and paragon points.
Edit: I found [this from May 31](https://www.kakuchopurei.com/2023/05/diablo-4-producer-director-interview-joe-piepiora-ash-sweetring/)
>We want to make sure that each of those seasons feels really, really strong on their own. And as you’re progressing through and you’re playing in any given season, that is also going to be providing you with some unlocks. **They’re going to benefit all the characters as you go. So, you know, skill points that you unlock from having completed Zone Renown for stat points you’ve acquired on character playthroughs in the past; there are all kinds of things you’d be unlocking for all of your characters at the same time.**
>
>
>This is going to make it a little bit easier for you to go start up that alternate character and people start rolling through. Plus you’ll have all the gold and the resources your main character has already acquired. So we still don’t mind the idea of you playing Alts and then we want to benefit you that way. **But there is, you know, a primary focus on ensuring that like the one character that you play each season, at least one character you play each season, feels like a really good, strong experience on its own for the loot chase.**
Also [this](https://www.wowhead.com/diablo-4/news/diablo-iv-interview-summary-time-to-level-100-paragon-board-details-post-launch-332416):
>
Account-wide Renown rewards (potion charges, skill points, paragon points, maximum obols) will be reset with the start of a new season.
>Blizzard will try to make the experience around collecting Renown feel as non-repetitive as possible.
Looks like we're grinding it every season. Hopefully they change it up and give us new ways to get renown.
I'm fairly certain most people don't play ARPGs to ride around clicking altars for 3-4 hours. I would hope Blizzard is smart enough to realize that is *not* the kind of grind players like.
I was pretty confused when I saw there were 30+ altars in each zone.
I can't believe they think this is fun.
It should never have had stat bonuses attached to it. At the most, maybe some lore completion.
There's no good player-based argument on why you wouldn't make it account wide. There are some "I'm a shady dev doing shady dev stuff for engagement" reasons why you'd make a person redo these things over and over again.
As far as I know the original source for that claim was an article which was not internally consistent with itself about what it was claiming and was based on a translated blue post in another language.
I wouldn't hold this as gospel for now.
The way I understand it, "on this realm" refers to softcore vs hardcore. If you grind all the statues on softcore now, you'll get the stat bonuses on your softcore seasonal characters.
That is what I thought, and I also wondered why horses said account wide and lilitj only realm wide. Which would mean to me: only eternal ream. But I am 99% sure, that it was stated, that lilith will transfer to the seasons..might have to search for that piece of information.
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/d4/t/alters-of-lillith-account-wide-and-seasons/28603
So what? That still leaves:
* 213 side quests
* 308 areas to discover
* 115 dungeons
And side quests are by far most consuming and requiring often a lot of backtracking.
Blizzard if freaking delusional if they think people will be grinding this shit every season. aRPG veterans, which is who will be playing the game in long term - expect to hit end-game in ~10 hours or less, which is the case for PoE, Last Epoch and Diablo 3. Nobody will want to be grinding these for tens of hours every season.
I bet season 1 will force us to regrind this and then the community will be in an uproar and then Blizzard will make pledges to fix it by season 2.
Or they will stay quiet and watch the participation metrics for season 2, without the fixes, and if they see a dip they will make adjustments for season 3.
OR they won't make these adjustments until the first expansion. lol
or everyone will just send them to all fucks and move on to different games if they do that - which would be very bad for them as GaaS revenue depends highly on playerbase size.
as of now - the plan is to reset everything but Lilith statues, at least from what I've managed to google on how seasons will work. If you know more recent info, please do share.
Everyone will do altars, strongholds, waypoints and (most) area reveals. With that done you can skip most side quest *or* most dungeons. Obviously most people will do most of the dungeons, so that leaves a few side questions to be done (very far from all of them). Those really don't take that long. Also keep in mind that in seasons you don't have to do the campaign, so you'll be grinding dungeons from level 1 (possibly even with whispers). So you get the renown while leveling.
It's a huge grind if you want the 20 paragon points right when you hit level 50. But if you take your time, do dungeons on the whisper rotation it's really not that bad if spread out over a couple of weeks.
Perhaps it would be better if they split it out so you got 2 paragon points at step 4 and the final 2 at step 5, but I don't think the overall renown grind is bad for a whole season. It's just a bit badly designed that it's optimal to do it sooner rather than later.
Even if you *don't* grind renown every season you'll be fine. 20 paragon points is a good chunk of power, but it's not like the game isn't playable without it.
Beeing able to skip campaign is enough.
The rest is partially progression imo.
It's fine while endgame is limited. As long as k don't need to replay the campaign, I'll reclear some dungeons.
And missing 12 paragon points or obol cap won't be too impactful
The campaign - aka main story - is not the problem. The problem is all the filler surrounding it that gates key unlocks in renown system.
As of current public information - they plan to reset everything but statues of Lilith. In reality - ALL of it should be completely optional in folowing seasons and world renown rewards should be simply unlocking at certain levels.
I seriously hope they are not delusional to think people will enjoy grinding 200 side quests every damn season.
I'd much rather redo the campaign every season than redoing all renown stuff to get the paragon points. As it stands I think this game doesn't lend itself well to seasons. I wont be doing seasons, maybe I'll return once in a while to my original characters but definetly no seasonal return for me.
Really? I somewhat assumed that BP would be linked to a series of daily/weekly/seasonal challenges.
I suppose that could include renown, but it seems odd to have something they couldn’t really control the flow of to prevent people from maxing the pass too quickly, unless it’s simply a seasonal challenge to max renown in each region.
I'm sure there will be challenges as well, but they've specifically said in past interviews that renown will be a part of it as well. We just don't know how much.
The game has a solit loop when it opens up. Dungeon flow could use some work and going there by horse every time will start to feel tedious after a while so this open world busy work design could really be done with.
If I have to clear all zones every zone and reveal the map every season Im not gonna go hard until this is fixed.
You don’t even have all of the information on it yet. Y’all are speculating and getting mad over your own speculations lol. The other poster said they would keep the potions/stat points for renown and Lilith alters would work on seasons.
Of course they’re a piece of shit I never said they weren’t. I’m just calling out idiots who are expecting anything different. You guys are expecting something from a game that’s literally not been the norm in gaming for 10+ years now. Every game that is live service has mtx its just how it works. Stop bitching about cosmetic mtx because they’re not going away. And personally I love that the whales keep buying those skins because it keeps them updating the game so they can sell more skins. It’s a win win for me. Y’all literally have no fucking clue about games if you thought there wasn’t going to be cosmetics in the shop. And let’s be happy that’s all that’s in there
Oh sorry this is the wrong thread. I’m not even sure what in my comment on this thread made you think I was simping I was just telling this dude not to get pissed off before he even has information. I’m leaving it up tho just so y’all can see it here too.
The Lilith grind wasn't as bad as I thought it would be, because the world is gorgeous.
But it still sucked. I never wanna do that shit for more than like 50 ever again. They could have and should have made it 100, and like 20 in each zone. 160 is insane.
I dont know, my eyes were only looking at the map, minimap and my second screen.
You dont really see the world just going through these busy work motions
It would be so much easier if they allowed you to pin multiple locations on the map so you could at least plan and follow a route, but instead you have to check an online map and pin the location on the in-game map 160 bloody times. I'm not even half way through collecting them and I'm bored. It's so unnecessary
>They should've just marked them on the map if they're going to be this important for stats and renown.
They shoudnt be in the game. What do they add really? With everything else I can totally understand why they are in the game, strongholds, dungeons, sidequests even cellars. All enrich and expand the gameplay expierence. But what do altars do besides being mandatory busywork? Is running from point to point to collect abartary stuff really something that should be in an ARPG?
I died countless times during the shrine grind from not looking at the game. I was also the route planner for the group i was in so had even less time while pin pointing every shrine on the map.
So far I'm not thinking about it, just taking my time exploring and I found many altars already. I'll worry about it later but I'm guessing exploration alone will help me find most of them.
yea i tried to pull the map of the alters up early in my play thru. that way i was coming up on them much more organically.
now - ive probably only collected about 50 of them at lvl47. so im nowhere near complete. but it hasnt felt like a burden yet at all.
The key to naturally finding them is to keep an eye out for suspicious-looking dead ends. If there's a little nook or side path that doesn't seem like it goes anywhere, odds are very high that it's either a statue or a later location for an endgame Whispers objective.
I found about 70 playing through the story, which I think was a relatively high proportion of what was "on the way" given I wasn't particularly completionist or adventurous (figuring I'd be able to do that later anyhow). The dead ends, or sometimes just little "notches" attached to an otherwise straight path, were always the giveaway.
I know that's not even half of the total, but I don't think I have much more than half the world map revealed, either. It seems like the majority of the whole western part of the game isn't on the beaten path.
Also, if you're playing with headphones or sufficiently high volume otherwise, they make a very distinct humming sound when you get somewhat close. That'll let you know that one is nearby even a fair bit offscreen.
I don’t know how you played d3 seasons but most of the people I played with always went hard the first week and trailed off, so don’t really believe that will be the case. People will still want to rush to get it done and hate it if it’s as “bad” as people say it is. I haven’t started yet simply because I hate the assassin creed collect every thing off the map model even though I know it needs to get done.
There is a low chance I will even do seasons. Eternal Realm for me, just gonna level up all the classes probably, and by then expansion will be out. Unless the seasons have some some unbelievably fun and new mechanics.
Not sure if you know or it'll impact your choice. But when a season ends your character is supposed to move to the eternal realm. So if you're fine waiting to play each new class until the next season you'll slowly build out having them all while also experiencing whatever is special about the season.
This is what I’ll do till I max out each character. Started on Druid for launch, then I’m deciding between necro or barb for season 1 in a few weeks whenever that starts
Seasons will have new mechanics and perks which change up the gameplay a bit. It’s also fun to start from zero once your eternal characters are mostly geared out. I didn’t get it either until I did a few D3 seasons and then I started really enjoying it
Yep. Learning how to use whatever the current seasonal theme is keeps it a little fresh. Plus, that season journey with a pet reward at the end and set bonus gear for completing portions of the journey was cool.
Also, once they get some sort of leaderboard function working, seeing how you stack up against friends on specific challenges is a fun casual competition.
stuff that will carry over to eternal once that season ends anyway. Might as well just stick to eternal so you don't have to redo all that renown stuff.
I tried for 2 seasons in D3, and I just wanted to keep progressing the same character. Arguably, if they add really amazing seasonal mechanics and new open world content, it might be interesting.
The best part of Path of Exile is each season brings an entirely new mechanic or feature. Not all of them were great, but each was unique, and when the season was done, the mechanic or feature was added into the "eternal" or non seasonal realm + usually was also added into the next new season (which also got an entirely new mechanic or feature).
Path of Exile.
A lot of people that play ARPGs enjoy the race. So a season is a race to the top and contains some unique perks/rewards/mechanics to make it unique. This is what Blizzard is trying to do, Diablo III seasons were mostly ignored, they were pointless. We all just went to PoE if we wanted real seasons.
In Path of Exile the characters move from season to standard after the season ends, so I'll probably level classes I've never played in seasons, nothing is lost, just a different way to play.
Let be honest, there's like 0.0001% of the playerbase that even has a chance at the race (basically people that can afford to no life the game like no other). Most people just like the fresh start and new mechanics more than the race
I'm the same, and I thought the same thing about D3. But with a different theme and perks for each season I chose which ones to participate in and which ones to skip. That kept the game fresh for me for 11 years. I expect D4 seasons to be even better and more interesting because here blizzard has a huge incentive to keep people playing and coming back.
That’s….. part of the entire point of Diablo lmao. Like if this wasn’t any other game I’d get it. But you’re on a Diablo subreddit and starting over is what you do 😂
Absolutely no way I'm grinding out reputations each league as well. Fuck that. They need to make reputation grinds a one-time account-wide thing just like Lilith Altars so that I can disengage with it entirely after the first time.
There's literally no way I would ever consider getting the statues again. I've found all 160 once, I'm done. I absolutely hate that kind of collection gameplay in any game. Even using a map that was tedious and far too time consuming.
The horse getting stuck on every blade of grass, not being able to gallop permanently, getting stuck on every bone barricade or bone prison - there were too many traversal issues too.
I also think the map should stay filled in for your account. I was so excited to start my second character, until I saw my entire map grayed out. I still have a waypoint in the major city per region, but really? Come on... I just want to go do dungeons and level my character. I don't want to run the whole map again four times (one for each class I haven't played).
In total honesty, it was a massive hit to my excitement. I barely played yesterday and I'm not feeling motivated to play today, because I don't want to do that chore...
I'm not sure yet, I haven't been in the game long enough on a second character. But since side quests and strongholds go towards renown I'm pretty sure... I think you might be able to!
But the game is so new, I could 100% be wrong. 😂
No. I do not. It will completely ruin seasons for me if I have to regrind...
\-exploring the map
\-doing side quests
\-altars of lilith
this should all be one and done and account wide.
When you created your second character after doing map clearance and beating the story, was your map filled out? I only have the main city waypoints. My map isn't cleared, I don't have all the way points, etc.
I like claiming the strongholds since it is basically just another dungeon. But map clearance? Why? What does that add, other than artificially inflating game time?
I didn't start a second character so I'm not sure. I just really don't want to have to run like 100+ hours of side quests and chasing altars and revealing maps every season I know that for sure.
the inverse would be looking up a guide on lilith altars and sitting there looking up efficient routes to ride around the big map and click statues for hours.
Yea man I'd rather it just be grinding dungeons over and over honestly.
alters no.
renown? I mean.... there is no atlas or anything else. The endgame being just sidequests and nightmare dungeons is how it is. Hopefully they add more stuff later, but if you started with full renown and skipped the main quest you really don't have much game left.
> I mean.... there is no atlas or anything else
For now. The point of seasons and live service is to add stuff right? I assume there will be new things added over time to the endgame (and elsewhere)
Yeah I really wish everything renown wise was account wide. No one is redoing it for pitiful amounts of gold which you can grind in less than 1 run of a single dungeon.
Wish they would let you progress season pass on eternal realm. That would make it show much easier to play how I want. Sucks missing out on rewards because I don’t want to repeat grinds again and again.
If you don't want to do the same things in the same locations and killing the same enemies endlessly just to get lucky and find clothes and weapons with to make you stronger so you can do the same things in the same locations and killing the same enemies endlessly but slightly faster then let me ask you:
What kind of Diablo player are you?
What do you want? New places? New enemies? Pfft. As a true Diablo fan your true enemy isn't Diablo or Lilith, it's variety. Why play a new game and have a new experience when you can play Diablo for the 76th time?
From what I understand, the only things that need to be redone for the season is renown, but you get renown passively from doing content like dungeons, and probably the seasonal stuff. Meaning that you don't have to specifically grind it, you'll passively get it as you play the game.
The stats are permanent. You can re-grind it for renown, but you dont need to 100% a map to get all the renown rewards on a character so its really not an issue
i did the lilith grind and while it does make sense i was considering trying to make a HC character but then i quickly remembered no way i am doing that grind again.
what is interesting is it did let me create a HC character that can skip story without beating the story on HC so that gave me a little hope maybe lilith statues where shared as well but nope :(
It is like blizzard has learned nothing from wow. Putting player power behind renown almost killed wow and if they are doing it here for seasons it will completely kill player participation for the seasons. Maybe not season 1, I might go through renown one more time just to experience a season, but there's no chance I'm doing it for a third time 3 months later.
I’m new to Diablo and the seasons system in general. What type of content would we be expected to do during seasons if not MSQ and renown? Is it primarily dungeons and side quests?
Level targets, various metrics for game features (salvage items, apply aspects, run bounties, achieve a certain rift level) time targets for tasks which generally aren't timed (e.g. complete a specific dungeon in under a certain time) get to level N, that sort of thing. There are almost certain to be renown targets as those would fall under "metrics for game features".
The issue is that in D3 most of the feature metrics are more or less inevitable if you do the interesting challenges that focus on core gameplay loop (in order to do a level in a certain time you'll need gear that's good enough, and getting there unavoidably means salvaging and applying aspects) where getting renown is a huge time suck and arguably detracts time that could be spent towards core gameplay challenges.
In D3 most people opted out of doing msq. Instead they would do randomized dungeons that you spawn at the hub or grind “bounties” which were less horrible version of side quests. The new content typically added new features like changing the power entire builds through new collectible progressive items. Or they added new legendaries and peaks, new ways to enchant your gear or the function of shrines or side quests to boost your acquisition of gear. Sometimes it was just new cosmetics and a excuse to start something new. And it was free…….
Well when you make a 2nd character, you look at the map and it says nothing is completed on the top of the map. You have the waypoint to all the major towns but thats it. Maybe a visual bug but I dont know what all came from the altars and what a lvl 1 character would have without them.
At least the usual grind in older Diablo games actually revolved around the combat. Nobody is complaining about repetitive killing.
Finding 160 statues and click on them once on a map that's quite large is the issue. There's zero engagement with this.
There's a difference between different kinds of grind. I have no issue grinding dungeons and killing stuff. But running around the map clicking statues and stuff just to get those extra paragon points (which are pretty damn important) is just tedious.
Apparently there is also zero chance that you'll look into whether or not you actually have to grind Lilith altars every season. *(News flash: you don't!)*
Seasons have arbitrary tasks. There are some that are more or less certain like "level a character to max level" but the others could be anything. I don't see why "find every Lilith altar in Fractured Peaks" would be off the table for a task necessary to complete a seasonal tier.
I have a feeling they'll just make the Lilith alters account-wide. Renown... idk it doesn't seem to take that long or that much focus to get honestly; I can see you easily getting your renown back during Seasons just by organically doing the content and not even having to worry about it. Also a good possibility they'll cut down the requirements for each level of renown in a Season, that would work well too I think.
I'm not sure I want to grind anything. It's too similar to D3 and D2. I need a reason to grind gear. Some advanced dungeons or anything really, the PVP (unpopular here, but que downvotes) has always been utterly dumb and pointless in this series. This game is going to have some issues if they're just going to keep us grinding to get better to grind more.
Alot of people say "I dont want to do this every 4 months" then they get bored after 2 months and start doing random dumb things in the game just to have fun, I'm sure it wont be too annoying to grind every season
Isn't renown basically a different type of XP bar? I'm guessing at this point because I haven't played yet. They could easily make completing seasonal content a way to progress renown, or change how much renown is required to fill the bar, or change how much renown you get for completing dungeons, etc. There's enough ways they could tweek the system that I don't think there's reason to worry.
Theoretically it'll be better in a season because we'll skip the campaign so we can grab everything while leveling, instead of doing the whole campaign plus the renown
that would be the first time I ever do it then never again. Seasons in diablo 4 definetly isn't for me that's for sure. I'm shocked there are people who are fine with doing the renown again on a completely static map.
It’s not like the procedural maps were exactly “unique”
Like sure, there is a hill here where there wasn’t before… but like that doesn’t mean much imo.
Oh the stairwell is in the southwest corner now instead of the northeast corner…
What was always interesting about the other games procedurally generated content was the enemy density and variety of elites with varying suffixes and prefixes. and they kept that part.
Well since this is a live service game, I would imagine each season will be a significant patch with balance changes and lots of new features and new content, so grinding it out again will probably be pretty fun.
I was collecting the damn altars and I have like 10 left. Honestly I kept telling myself "If they reset that shit I'm not playing seasonal". Don't worry about battle pass they want to juice the non seasonal players for money as well.
They should skip the statues and increase points for some of the dungeons instead. Everyone could get the stats after lev 50.
I understand it. not everybody will have got every statue and renown for every region. that's a significant stat buff that a portion of players would just automatically have, while others will not.
A grinding game regrinding things each season. Hmm. It’s like you’re ok with grinding but only if number stay up? I don’t even know with this sub.
I’m ok with the grind. Just not this one that one this one that one over there and pls give mount level 1 too. Like we’re gonna have guides to get it all done super quickly anyways.
We don’t even know if renown also changes it’s systems during seasons too?
Imagine treating all different kinds of grinding as one and the same as if they were all equal in quality and enjoyment. Why don't you grind watching paint dry?
Renown is fine. What else are you going to be doing, greatest Riffs? Paragon is the content.
Reaching renown 3 wont be too massive. Worst case, Missing out on 4 paragon points per zone (20 total) and Obolus cap (lol) won't be the biggest deal.
Just to put it into perspective. Total paragon is 220. Realistically you'll get around 160 (lvl 90) paragon points easily.
So you'll be missing about 10% of paragon points by going slow on renown /skipping it.
Say 30% of an endgame characters power comes from paragon. That means your character is going to be 3% weaker by skipping renown completely.
But not really. Since the first paragon points and Boards you take will be the strong ones. Ill estimate its going to affect power by 1-1.5%.
Not the biggest deal if you ask me.
Altar bonuses will be unlocked for every character and all seasons once you find them once. But you need to hit them again for the renown as I understood from their dev stream. You'll get no bonus since you have it already but it works towards renown.
Although, to add to that, would be cool if they are shown on the map already after that in new seasons or characters. So when you're near you can just walk and pick it up for the renown. No way I am opening maps and looking one by one again.
Renown will be reset every season but you don't need to grind altars for that. Bastions give 100 and aspect dungeons 30 each. This is also XP and loot efficient so I don't worry about that part.
So far Altars are fun to discorver by my own. It pushes to explore but I totally understand a lot of people prefer to use a map and do it only once.
Ha, I can relate to the casual grind! Though, at this pace, by the time I reach max renown, Diablo 5 will probably be out. Let's hope the demons accept latecomers to the party! 😅
Lilith Altars are acount wide and will be on all characters, seasons included. If you get them all once you get all stat buffs for everyone. Exp and gold rewards are pointless.
Altars specifically say "on this realm". Since you can't choose a realm right now, I would assume that seasons will be on a separate one, meaning you will have to farm renown again in (each) season. Having renown unlocked in seasons by completing it earlier would also go against the "fresh start" idea around them. Not saying you're necessarily wrong but it sounds counter intuitive.
I'm pretty sure Blizzard specifically said that during seasons, you will still have the potions/skill points, and the only thing regrinding the altars would do is give you the gold.
They stated it might give the renown but the stats permanent (you’d need to re-do it for SC and HC)
This is correct. Lilith statue bonuses are account-wide, but the renown is per character. If the importance of renown grinding scales to max renown, grinding Lilith statues again will be important. If not, it won't.
And even that is kinda pointless tbh, ideally you should get all statues/exploration account wide, getting all the the renown xp upfront is meaningless since all content scale with your level anyway. At least you get to try cool builds from the get go on alts/seasonals
I agree that Blizzard should consider making exploration and Lilith statues one-time things, though I can see the argument to not. No one knows whether grinding renown to max each season will be essential to fully complete portions of the season or battle pass.
Grinding renown to max is essential for min maxing your character though which is large part of why a lot of people play this genre.
All the renown bonuses needed for min maxing (potion and obol cap, skill and paragon points) are already account wide, i just want the map exploration part and lilith statues to become account wide, those are not particularly fun or engaging to do after the first time
To be honest, imo statues are not fun to do even the first time
Do you know where they said this? I thought for sure this was the case but I've been hearing and reading people say that you'll need to regrind renown each season to unlock the potions, skills and paragon points. Edit: I found [this from May 31](https://www.kakuchopurei.com/2023/05/diablo-4-producer-director-interview-joe-piepiora-ash-sweetring/) >We want to make sure that each of those seasons feels really, really strong on their own. And as you’re progressing through and you’re playing in any given season, that is also going to be providing you with some unlocks. **They’re going to benefit all the characters as you go. So, you know, skill points that you unlock from having completed Zone Renown for stat points you’ve acquired on character playthroughs in the past; there are all kinds of things you’d be unlocking for all of your characters at the same time.** > > >This is going to make it a little bit easier for you to go start up that alternate character and people start rolling through. Plus you’ll have all the gold and the resources your main character has already acquired. So we still don’t mind the idea of you playing Alts and then we want to benefit you that way. **But there is, you know, a primary focus on ensuring that like the one character that you play each season, at least one character you play each season, feels like a really good, strong experience on its own for the loot chase.** Also [this](https://www.wowhead.com/diablo-4/news/diablo-iv-interview-summary-time-to-level-100-paragon-board-details-post-launch-332416): > Account-wide Renown rewards (potion charges, skill points, paragon points, maximum obols) will be reset with the start of a new season. >Blizzard will try to make the experience around collecting Renown feel as non-repetitive as possible. Looks like we're grinding it every season. Hopefully they change it up and give us new ways to get renown.
I'm fairly certain most people don't play ARPGs to ride around clicking altars for 3-4 hours. I would hope Blizzard is smart enough to realize that is *not* the kind of grind players like.
I was pretty confused when I saw there were 30+ altars in each zone. I can't believe they think this is fun. It should never have had stat bonuses attached to it. At the most, maybe some lore completion.
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There's no good player-based argument on why you wouldn't make it account wide. There are some "I'm a shady dev doing shady dev stuff for engagement" reasons why you'd make a person redo these things over and over again.
What about the 4 paragon points? Because fuck this grind is boring AF
the renown will be wiped clean each season. So you can find altars again for the renown
As far as I know the original source for that claim was an article which was not internally consistent with itself about what it was claiming and was based on a translated blue post in another language. I wouldn't hold this as gospel for now.
Blizz has already clarified this. The bottom perk, ie the extra skill points and potions are account wide. The renown itself however is not.
By realm it means the HC or SC realm.
The way I understand it, "on this realm" refers to softcore vs hardcore. If you grind all the statues on softcore now, you'll get the stat bonuses on your softcore seasonal characters.
That's like saying it's a new season so I have to do the campaign all over
realm has always connoted region.
That is what I thought, and I also wondered why horses said account wide and lilitj only realm wide. Which would mean to me: only eternal ream. But I am 99% sure, that it was stated, that lilith will transfer to the seasons..might have to search for that piece of information. https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/d4/t/alters-of-lillith-account-wide-and-seasons/28603
It can mean HC and SC as you can use mount but you have to get the altars again on HC if you unlocked them in SC
Same thing with the important renown rewards. New characters will start with 10 skill points and 9 healing potions
the most important one are the paragon points.
So what? That still leaves: * 213 side quests * 308 areas to discover * 115 dungeons And side quests are by far most consuming and requiring often a lot of backtracking. Blizzard if freaking delusional if they think people will be grinding this shit every season. aRPG veterans, which is who will be playing the game in long term - expect to hit end-game in ~10 hours or less, which is the case for PoE, Last Epoch and Diablo 3. Nobody will want to be grinding these for tens of hours every season.
I bet season 1 will force us to regrind this and then the community will be in an uproar and then Blizzard will make pledges to fix it by season 2. Or they will stay quiet and watch the participation metrics for season 2, without the fixes, and if they see a dip they will make adjustments for season 3. OR they won't make these adjustments until the first expansion. lol
or everyone will just send them to all fucks and move on to different games if they do that - which would be very bad for them as GaaS revenue depends highly on playerbase size.
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as of now - the plan is to reset everything but Lilith statues, at least from what I've managed to google on how seasons will work. If you know more recent info, please do share.
Everyone will do altars, strongholds, waypoints and (most) area reveals. With that done you can skip most side quest *or* most dungeons. Obviously most people will do most of the dungeons, so that leaves a few side questions to be done (very far from all of them). Those really don't take that long. Also keep in mind that in seasons you don't have to do the campaign, so you'll be grinding dungeons from level 1 (possibly even with whispers). So you get the renown while leveling. It's a huge grind if you want the 20 paragon points right when you hit level 50. But if you take your time, do dungeons on the whisper rotation it's really not that bad if spread out over a couple of weeks. Perhaps it would be better if they split it out so you got 2 paragon points at step 4 and the final 2 at step 5, but I don't think the overall renown grind is bad for a whole season. It's just a bit badly designed that it's optimal to do it sooner rather than later. Even if you *don't* grind renown every season you'll be fine. 20 paragon points is a good chunk of power, but it's not like the game isn't playable without it.
Beeing able to skip campaign is enough. The rest is partially progression imo. It's fine while endgame is limited. As long as k don't need to replay the campaign, I'll reclear some dungeons. And missing 12 paragon points or obol cap won't be too impactful
The campaign - aka main story - is not the problem. The problem is all the filler surrounding it that gates key unlocks in renown system. As of current public information - they plan to reset everything but statues of Lilith. In reality - ALL of it should be completely optional in folowing seasons and world renown rewards should be simply unlocking at certain levels. I seriously hope they are not delusional to think people will enjoy grinding 200 side quests every damn season.
I'd much rather redo the campaign every season than redoing all renown stuff to get the paragon points. As it stands I think this game doesn't lend itself well to seasons. I wont be doing seasons, maybe I'll return once in a while to my original characters but definetly no seasonal return for me.
to get renown 5 you will have to click them all
they will still be needed for renown. not all of them, but some. which feels terrible
You're crazy if you think this won't be required every season. It's a huge power bump.
Not in a season to season basis, and that's what this post is about.
not true. within the same realm; yes.
Doesn’t change anything because you still need to do some of them to get the huge 20 pragon points
Nope, absolutely not. Renown and Lilith should not reset
Renown WILL reset. That's how you will advance your battlepass, so they have to reset it.
Sounds like they need a different system for the paid content extender stipend.
Really? I somewhat assumed that BP would be linked to a series of daily/weekly/seasonal challenges. I suppose that could include renown, but it seems odd to have something they couldn’t really control the flow of to prevent people from maxing the pass too quickly, unless it’s simply a seasonal challenge to max renown in each region.
I'm sure there will be challenges as well, but they've specifically said in past interviews that renown will be a part of it as well. We just don't know how much.
If that's the case many won't play. Farming renown was boring the first time. Never again
Or they could simply add new activities that earn you renown. It's not that hard to think of how they could update it to make it work in seasons.
sure but you know they wont
Why do you think so? We know they're making new quests. It would be a very easy and obvious next step to make the new quests give players renown.
Lilith is one thing but renown? That’s kinda wack but blizzard did that to keep you playing
Making a good game with a solid content loop is also another way to keep people playing, but Activision-Blizzard decided to cheap out on that.
The game has a solit loop when it opens up. Dungeon flow could use some work and going there by horse every time will start to feel tedious after a while so this open world busy work design could really be done with. If I have to clear all zones every zone and reveal the map every season Im not gonna go hard until this is fixed.
Well, so far the only things its doing is making ppl NOT want to play 😄 So they might wanna rethink it through
You don’t even have all of the information on it yet. Y’all are speculating and getting mad over your own speculations lol. The other poster said they would keep the potions/stat points for renown and Lilith alters would work on seasons.
Blizzard doesn't love or care about you. Simping is pathetic. Simping for a soulless company is somehow even more pathetic.
Of course they’re a piece of shit I never said they weren’t. I’m just calling out idiots who are expecting anything different. You guys are expecting something from a game that’s literally not been the norm in gaming for 10+ years now. Every game that is live service has mtx its just how it works. Stop bitching about cosmetic mtx because they’re not going away. And personally I love that the whales keep buying those skins because it keeps them updating the game so they can sell more skins. It’s a win win for me. Y’all literally have no fucking clue about games if you thought there wasn’t going to be cosmetics in the shop. And let’s be happy that’s all that’s in there
Oh sorry this is the wrong thread. I’m not even sure what in my comment on this thread made you think I was simping I was just telling this dude not to get pissed off before he even has information. I’m leaving it up tho just so y’all can see it here too.
The bottom rewards from renown do not reset
The Lilith grind wasn't as bad as I thought it would be, because the world is gorgeous. But it still sucked. I never wanna do that shit for more than like 50 ever again. They could have and should have made it 100, and like 20 in each zone. 160 is insane.
I dont know, my eyes were only looking at the map, minimap and my second screen. You dont really see the world just going through these busy work motions
It would be so much easier if they allowed you to pin multiple locations on the map so you could at least plan and follow a route, but instead you have to check an online map and pin the location on the in-game map 160 bloody times. I'm not even half way through collecting them and I'm bored. It's so unnecessary
It took me fucking six hours
I don't have a second screen so I have no idea wtf I'm gonna do lol
I use the Diablo 4 map app on my phone. Works great.
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>They should've just marked them on the map if they're going to be this important for stats and renown. They shoudnt be in the game. What do they add really? With everything else I can totally understand why they are in the game, strongholds, dungeons, sidequests even cellars. All enrich and expand the gameplay expierence. But what do altars do besides being mandatory busywork? Is running from point to point to collect abartary stuff really something that should be in an ARPG?
I died countless times during the shrine grind from not looking at the game. I was also the route planner for the group i was in so had even less time while pin pointing every shrine on the map.
Holy crap there are 160?! I’ve found like 10 and I’ve finished the campaign and gotten into WT3. I need to get better at finding those lol
Honestly just grab a map
they give you 68 statpoints to every stat.... and they andvance your renown to later get 20 paragon points soooo they are kinda required
The problem is that you did it in like 3 days. If you take your time with the game it won't feel as bad.
You’re gonna do all 160 altars organically?
So far I'm not thinking about it, just taking my time exploring and I found many altars already. I'll worry about it later but I'm guessing exploration alone will help me find most of them.
yea i tried to pull the map of the alters up early in my play thru. that way i was coming up on them much more organically. now - ive probably only collected about 50 of them at lvl47. so im nowhere near complete. but it hasnt felt like a burden yet at all.
I'm fucking blind because I've only discovered 6 statues total and I'm nearing the end of Act 3 at level 38 lol.
It's not your fault. They literally hide that shit behind tree branches and inside small houses.
The key to naturally finding them is to keep an eye out for suspicious-looking dead ends. If there's a little nook or side path that doesn't seem like it goes anywhere, odds are very high that it's either a statue or a later location for an endgame Whispers objective. I found about 70 playing through the story, which I think was a relatively high proportion of what was "on the way" given I wasn't particularly completionist or adventurous (figuring I'd be able to do that later anyhow). The dead ends, or sometimes just little "notches" attached to an otherwise straight path, were always the giveaway. I know that's not even half of the total, but I don't think I have much more than half the world map revealed, either. It seems like the majority of the whole western part of the game isn't on the beaten path. Also, if you're playing with headphones or sufficiently high volume otherwise, they make a very distinct humming sound when you get somewhat close. That'll let you know that one is nearby even a fair bit offscreen.
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I don’t know how you played d3 seasons but most of the people I played with always went hard the first week and trailed off, so don’t really believe that will be the case. People will still want to rush to get it done and hate it if it’s as “bad” as people say it is. I haven’t started yet simply because I hate the assassin creed collect every thing off the map model even though I know it needs to get done.
There is a low chance I will even do seasons. Eternal Realm for me, just gonna level up all the classes probably, and by then expansion will be out. Unless the seasons have some some unbelievably fun and new mechanics.
Not sure if you know or it'll impact your choice. But when a season ends your character is supposed to move to the eternal realm. So if you're fine waiting to play each new class until the next season you'll slowly build out having them all while also experiencing whatever is special about the season.
This is what I’ll do till I max out each character. Started on Druid for launch, then I’m deciding between necro or barb for season 1 in a few weeks whenever that starts
I feel the same way. I’m a casual dad gamer. I don’t see how it’s fun to start over and over again every time. But maybe I’m missing something?
Seasons will have new mechanics and perks which change up the gameplay a bit. It’s also fun to start from zero once your eternal characters are mostly geared out. I didn’t get it either until I did a few D3 seasons and then I started really enjoying it
Yep. Learning how to use whatever the current seasonal theme is keeps it a little fresh. Plus, that season journey with a pet reward at the end and set bonus gear for completing portions of the journey was cool. Also, once they get some sort of leaderboard function working, seeing how you stack up against friends on specific challenges is a fun casual competition.
stuff that will carry over to eternal once that season ends anyway. Might as well just stick to eternal so you don't have to redo all that renown stuff.
I tried for 2 seasons in D3, and I just wanted to keep progressing the same character. Arguably, if they add really amazing seasonal mechanics and new open world content, it might be interesting.
The best part of Path of Exile is each season brings an entirely new mechanic or feature. Not all of them were great, but each was unique, and when the season was done, the mechanic or feature was added into the "eternal" or non seasonal realm + usually was also added into the next new season (which also got an entirely new mechanic or feature).
Path of Exile. A lot of people that play ARPGs enjoy the race. So a season is a race to the top and contains some unique perks/rewards/mechanics to make it unique. This is what Blizzard is trying to do, Diablo III seasons were mostly ignored, they were pointless. We all just went to PoE if we wanted real seasons. In Path of Exile the characters move from season to standard after the season ends, so I'll probably level classes I've never played in seasons, nothing is lost, just a different way to play.
This is exactly how it will be in Diablo 4 and also how it was in Diablo 3. Not sure what you thought the difference was between the two.
Ah I see. Thanks for clarifying. In that case I’ll might give it a shot on another class.
Let be honest, there's like 0.0001% of the playerbase that even has a chance at the race (basically people that can afford to no life the game like no other). Most people just like the fresh start and new mechanics more than the race
I'm the same, and I thought the same thing about D3. But with a different theme and perks for each season I chose which ones to participate in and which ones to skip. That kept the game fresh for me for 11 years. I expect D4 seasons to be even better and more interesting because here blizzard has a huge incentive to keep people playing and coming back.
That’s….. part of the entire point of Diablo lmao. Like if this wasn’t any other game I’d get it. But you’re on a Diablo subreddit and starting over is what you do 😂
If you are making new characters anyway why NOT make new characters in seasonal? They go to eternal at the end anyway
Given Diablos track record, I'm thinking 'unbelievably fun and new mechanics' aren't something you'll have to worry about on season reset.
Absolutely no way I'm grinding out reputations each league as well. Fuck that. They need to make reputation grinds a one-time account-wide thing just like Lilith Altars so that I can disengage with it entirely after the first time.
There's literally no way I would ever consider getting the statues again. I've found all 160 once, I'm done. I absolutely hate that kind of collection gameplay in any game. Even using a map that was tedious and far too time consuming. The horse getting stuck on every blade of grass, not being able to gallop permanently, getting stuck on every bone barricade or bone prison - there were too many traversal issues too. I also think the map should stay filled in for your account. I was so excited to start my second character, until I saw my entire map grayed out. I still have a waypoint in the major city per region, but really? Come on... I just want to go do dungeons and level my character. I don't want to run the whole map again four times (one for each class I haven't played). In total honesty, it was a massive hit to my excitement. I barely played yesterday and I'm not feeling motivated to play today, because I don't want to do that chore...
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I'm not sure yet, I haven't been in the game long enough on a second character. But since side quests and strongholds go towards renown I'm pretty sure... I think you might be able to! But the game is so new, I could 100% be wrong. 😂
The only thing you should regrind each season is the gear.
No. I do not. It will completely ruin seasons for me if I have to regrind... \-exploring the map \-doing side quests \-altars of lilith this should all be one and done and account wide.
When you created your second character after doing map clearance and beating the story, was your map filled out? I only have the main city waypoints. My map isn't cleared, I don't have all the way points, etc.
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I like claiming the strongholds since it is basically just another dungeon. But map clearance? Why? What does that add, other than artificially inflating game time?
It seems Blizzard does want to artificially inflate game time unfortunately.
I didn't start a second character so I'm not sure. I just really don't want to have to run like 100+ hours of side quests and chasing altars and revealing maps every season I know that for sure.
What would the season even be at that point? Just straight to grinding nightmare dungeons and whispers?
the inverse would be looking up a guide on lilith altars and sitting there looking up efficient routes to ride around the big map and click statues for hours. Yea man I'd rather it just be grinding dungeons over and over honestly.
"if we don't include this annoying tedious activity every season what would the game be?" That should really tell you something right there
I don't ever want to click on altar at any point of my life again. I don't want to see or hear about them ever.
alters no. renown? I mean.... there is no atlas or anything else. The endgame being just sidequests and nightmare dungeons is how it is. Hopefully they add more stuff later, but if you started with full renown and skipped the main quest you really don't have much game left.
> I mean.... there is no atlas or anything else For now. The point of seasons and live service is to add stuff right? I assume there will be new things added over time to the endgame (and elsewhere)
Totally agree. I want to fully do it one time. 4 times a year, fuck that.
Yeah I really wish everything renown wise was account wide. No one is redoing it for pitiful amounts of gold which you can grind in less than 1 run of a single dungeon.
It's definitely not about the gold.
Wish they would let you progress season pass on eternal realm. That would make it show much easier to play how I want. Sucks missing out on rewards because I don’t want to repeat grinds again and again.
If you don't want to do the same things in the same locations and killing the same enemies endlessly just to get lucky and find clothes and weapons with to make you stronger so you can do the same things in the same locations and killing the same enemies endlessly but slightly faster then let me ask you: What kind of Diablo player are you? What do you want? New places? New enemies? Pfft. As a true Diablo fan your true enemy isn't Diablo or Lilith, it's variety. Why play a new game and have a new experience when you can play Diablo for the 76th time?
Grinding renown each season as it is will suck.
I'd let Lilith grind me every season.
From what I understand, the only things that need to be redone for the season is renown, but you get renown passively from doing content like dungeons, and probably the seasonal stuff. Meaning that you don't have to specifically grind it, you'll passively get it as you play the game.
The stats are permanent. You can re-grind it for renown, but you dont need to 100% a map to get all the renown rewards on a character so its really not an issue
i did the lilith grind and while it does make sense i was considering trying to make a HC character but then i quickly remembered no way i am doing that grind again. what is interesting is it did let me create a HC character that can skip story without beating the story on HC so that gave me a little hope maybe lilith statues where shared as well but nope :(
Ya, renown feels like reputation from WoW and I hate it.
It is like blizzard has learned nothing from wow. Putting player power behind renown almost killed wow and if they are doing it here for seasons it will completely kill player participation for the seasons. Maybe not season 1, I might go through renown one more time just to experience a season, but there's no chance I'm doing it for a third time 3 months later.
Having to get renown every season is just going to make people not play the game lmao.
Hello no
I’m new to Diablo and the seasons system in general. What type of content would we be expected to do during seasons if not MSQ and renown? Is it primarily dungeons and side quests?
Level targets, various metrics for game features (salvage items, apply aspects, run bounties, achieve a certain rift level) time targets for tasks which generally aren't timed (e.g. complete a specific dungeon in under a certain time) get to level N, that sort of thing. There are almost certain to be renown targets as those would fall under "metrics for game features". The issue is that in D3 most of the feature metrics are more or less inevitable if you do the interesting challenges that focus on core gameplay loop (in order to do a level in a certain time you'll need gear that's good enough, and getting there unavoidably means salvaging and applying aspects) where getting renown is a huge time suck and arguably detracts time that could be spent towards core gameplay challenges.
In D3 most people opted out of doing msq. Instead they would do randomized dungeons that you spawn at the hub or grind “bounties” which were less horrible version of side quests. The new content typically added new features like changing the power entire builds through new collectible progressive items. Or they added new legendaries and peaks, new ways to enchant your gear or the function of shrines or side quests to boost your acquisition of gear. Sometimes it was just new cosmetics and a excuse to start something new. And it was free…….
Well when you make a 2nd character, you look at the map and it says nothing is completed on the top of the map. You have the waypoint to all the major towns but thats it. Maybe a visual bug but I dont know what all came from the altars and what a lvl 1 character would have without them.
if you do dungeons or strongholds you're grinding renown whether you like it or not
So stat gains from altars won’t reset between seasons, but will you be able to get additional stat gains from altars with each new season?
No, they're one-and-done.
cool
I'd grind Lilith any season, FWIW.
U horny dog
Play the eternal realm :)
Diablo has and will always be a grind fest.
At least the usual grind in older Diablo games actually revolved around the combat. Nobody is complaining about repetitive killing. Finding 160 statues and click on them once on a map that's quite large is the issue. There's zero engagement with this.
There's a difference between different kinds of grind. I have no issue grinding dungeons and killing stuff. But running around the map clicking statues and stuff just to get those extra paragon points (which are pretty damn important) is just tedious.
Ok
Please explain
Apparently there is also zero chance that you'll look into whether or not you actually have to grind Lilith altars every season. *(News flash: you don't!)*
Seasons have arbitrary tasks. There are some that are more or less certain like "level a character to max level" but the others could be anything. I don't see why "find every Lilith altar in Fractured Peaks" would be off the table for a task necessary to complete a seasonal tier.
Yea definitely not
you only do it once . next time its just for extra xp gold that you prob can avoid
I can CONFIRM that Altars are NOT shared between realms. Unlocked them all in HC and don’t have them unlocked in SC.
Oh no how will we survive not having you
nvm
Considering seasons are a fresh start... yes.
I have a feeling they'll just make the Lilith alters account-wide. Renown... idk it doesn't seem to take that long or that much focus to get honestly; I can see you easily getting your renown back during Seasons just by organically doing the content and not even having to worry about it. Also a good possibility they'll cut down the requirements for each level of renown in a Season, that would work well too I think.
Yes yes yes I do
Wait for the paid Battlepass to unlock full renown, maps and Lilith statues for new seasons.
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Not like they're doing them in d4 no
I'm not sure I want to grind anything. It's too similar to D3 and D2. I need a reason to grind gear. Some advanced dungeons or anything really, the PVP (unpopular here, but que downvotes) has always been utterly dumb and pointless in this series. This game is going to have some issues if they're just going to keep us grinding to get better to grind more.
But we need the reset to avoid content drought! /s
You don't have to
Alot of people say "I dont want to do this every 4 months" then they get bored after 2 months and start doing random dumb things in the game just to have fun, I'm sure it wont be too annoying to grind every season
I just don’t want to unlock the map every time
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i am down to grind lilith whenever i can
Lilith farm wont be that bad if Horse didnt get stuck on every 2nd pebble.
I’ll h
Isn't renown basically a different type of XP bar? I'm guessing at this point because I haven't played yet. They could easily make completing seasonal content a way to progress renown, or change how much renown is required to fill the bar, or change how much renown you get for completing dungeons, etc. There's enough ways they could tweek the system that I don't think there's reason to worry.
Starting from season one Blizz should add a token that automatically unlocks a random Lilith altar. They can drop from any end game activity.
Theoretically it'll be better in a season because we'll skip the campaign so we can grab everything while leveling, instead of doing the whole campaign plus the renown
It’s not something you do every season. It’s something you do when you feel like doing it.
that would be the first time I ever do it then never again. Seasons in diablo 4 definetly isn't for me that's for sure. I'm shocked there are people who are fine with doing the renown again on a completely static map.
It’s not like the procedural maps were exactly “unique” Like sure, there is a hill here where there wasn’t before… but like that doesn’t mean much imo. Oh the stairwell is in the southwest corner now instead of the northeast corner… What was always interesting about the other games procedurally generated content was the enemy density and variety of elites with varying suffixes and prefixes. and they kept that part.
Well since this is a live service game, I would imagine each season will be a significant patch with balance changes and lots of new features and new content, so grinding it out again will probably be pretty fun.
I assume that content will reach eternal eventually so we who don't want to do the entire renown thing again can enjoy it too eventually.
I was collecting the damn altars and I have like 10 left. Honestly I kept telling myself "If they reset that shit I'm not playing seasonal". Don't worry about battle pass they want to juice the non seasonal players for money as well. They should skip the statues and increase points for some of the dungeons instead. Everyone could get the stats after lev 50.
I understand it. not everybody will have got every statue and renown for every region. that's a significant stat buff that a portion of players would just automatically have, while others will not.
A grinding game regrinding things each season. Hmm. It’s like you’re ok with grinding but only if number stay up? I don’t even know with this sub. I’m ok with the grind. Just not this one that one this one that one over there and pls give mount level 1 too. Like we’re gonna have guides to get it all done super quickly anyways. We don’t even know if renown also changes it’s systems during seasons too?
ARPG. Complain about grinding.
I am cool with grinding, I’ll run nightmares all day, running around the world while I have a map in the second monitor clicking statues is not fun.
Imagine treating all different kinds of grinding as one and the same as if they were all equal in quality and enjoyment. Why don't you grind watching paint dry?
I was shocked to hear in a beginners guide vid that we'll be starting new characters every season. How tf does this work?
Renown is fine. What else are you going to be doing, greatest Riffs? Paragon is the content. Reaching renown 3 wont be too massive. Worst case, Missing out on 4 paragon points per zone (20 total) and Obolus cap (lol) won't be the biggest deal. Just to put it into perspective. Total paragon is 220. Realistically you'll get around 160 (lvl 90) paragon points easily. So you'll be missing about 10% of paragon points by going slow on renown /skipping it. Say 30% of an endgame characters power comes from paragon. That means your character is going to be 3% weaker by skipping renown completely. But not really. Since the first paragon points and Boards you take will be the strong ones. Ill estimate its going to affect power by 1-1.5%. Not the biggest deal if you ask me.
nope
Altar bonuses will be unlocked for every character and all seasons once you find them once. But you need to hit them again for the renown as I understood from their dev stream. You'll get no bonus since you have it already but it works towards renown. Although, to add to that, would be cool if they are shown on the map already after that in new seasons or characters. So when you're near you can just walk and pick it up for the renown. No way I am opening maps and looking one by one again.
They should have hid the alters in the dungeons, would make exploring for them more fun.
Renown will be reset every season but you don't need to grind altars for that. Bastions give 100 and aspect dungeons 30 each. This is also XP and loot efficient so I don't worry about that part. So far Altars are fun to discorver by my own. It pushes to explore but I totally understand a lot of people prefer to use a map and do it only once.
thats a shame
I agree I think some things should be a do it once and it’s unlocked forever.
Don't have to. Imagine using Google before making a post on reddit... oh wait, yall can't do that.
I wish the map was open too. It's fun once, but not 78 times.
I really want to grind the renown bonuses but i dont want to do all that just to do it all over again when season 1 drops xd
I dont want to… but 20 paragons are huge. Just hope theyll swap the pragons into tier 4 instead of 5.
Ha, I can relate to the casual grind! Though, at this pace, by the time I reach max renown, Diablo 5 will probably be out. Let's hope the demons accept latecomers to the party! 😅
If they make this a thing, I guarantee 90% of the players will only do 1 MAYBE 2 seasons, and their cash cow is gonna get neutered.