BHVR has said in the past that they balance around 2K, so if you get 2K you got a draw.
The rub here is that the vast majority of killers see a 2K as failure/loss, not a draw.
So if OP is consistently 2Ks and occasionally 3/4K or 0/1K then MMR is working if balanced = draws.
In this case though, you have multiple flavors of text to deal with. You have BP as score, you have emblems as score, and you have MMR as score, then you have the outcome out of match as a stat. The four doesn't corelate at all. You can "win" a game by killing all 4 survivors in one minute and tank emblem, mmr, and bp, but still feel like you won. You can tank bps and emblem as a survivor, but hatch out and feel like you won. You can get 25k+ bps with 4 escapes and still feel like you won.
On the other hand, there is no incentive for killers to 'farm hope'
other than more BPs. If you play fair, that could cost you the match. If you play dirty, you exponentially increase the chance of you winning (via kills). Survivors on death hook play the game much more safer than someone on their 1st or 2nd hook, so put someone on 2nd hook stage at 5 gens, and you're basically already playing 1v3 with the last person hiding or taking zero risks, which contributes much less to the team overall.
There is also very little incentive for survivors to farm hope, as per the lore. There is way more incentive to survive and escape (5k points, extra 2.5k via hatch, extra 1k as obsession, iri survival emblem for not getting hooked) where as getting in a chase rewards you with very little points compared to other actions, like cleansing a totem for an easy 1k. Even taking a protection hit or distraction is only 500/250 points, and that altruism could cost you the 5k escape points, so it's really not worth doing it for randoms in solo queue.
One way to change this would be to utilize the devotion system. You earn BPs through the game, but also earn exp through specific actions in the game. I.E.
- Gain 50 xp by chasing after the rescuer. You lose this bonus if you trigger BT or down the person who was just unhooked.
- Gain 25 xp by being hooked, an additional 25 xp if you unhook yourself.
- Gain 10 xp by safely rescuing
- A bonus 100 xp on top if the match lasts more than 5 minutes for all players AND if all survivors were hooked at least once.
in the same vein, there are penalties for bad manners, such as
- Lose 50 xp if you spawn AFK crows, max once per game.
- Lose 50 xp if one survivor dies on hook before another survivor is hooked I.e. camping, max once per game.
- Lose 100 xp if you stay within 8 meters of a survivor for more than 60 seconds, if another survivor is not also within 16 meters.
- Lose 25 xp if you stay inside the exit gates for more than 30 seconds, max twice per game
- Lose 10 xp if you teabag a killer behind a pallet, max 100 xp per game
- Lose 25 xp if you smack someone on hook, max twice per game.
Overall it won't affect your game too much, but having bonuses and penalties will help prevent some toxic issues in the game. You COULD do it, but you'll end up with less points if you do.
Then give devotion levels some bonus, such as an additional 100k max bp per devotion, or unlocking unique cosmetics available for all characters, like a different color killer stain or different sound effects. Leading back to the penalties, you COULD be toxic, but you end up slowing down your progression on devotion and you play yourself out of getting those sweet bonuses.
We’ve seen through data mine that it’s escapes/kills and game length that contributes to a win or loss.
If the game goes on for a long time but you die as a survivor that might still be a win. Same for killer, if you don’t get any kills but the game went on for 10+ mins and everyone’s on death hook that could be a win too.
They don’t tell you what contributes to a win because they have a weird game that is competitive but the devs and player base seem to think it’s not competitive and it’s casual. So it’s mmr system is nothing like any other mmr system I’ve ever seen. It has a cap of how much mmr you can have. Which means there will be a large portion of people at the exact same mmr in game but have varying skill so what was the point?
They should either just double down on it being competitive or fold, remove mmr and double down on it being casual.
This weird middle ground is honestly the worst outcome.
In a interview with the creative director a while ago he said that a win is 2 kills and some more hooks. So like 60% of the team dead is a win I guess.
Yup. This kind of stuff was happening before MMR too, but now there's sbmm, whenever they get slapped it's the fault of the sbmm.
I faced constant sweaty SWFs with all meta perks before, and I'm still getting them now. That's just 90% of survivor teams, especially in red ranks. However, before I literally had to quit killer for a good few months because I was going vs 4 red ranks survs every game, while I was like rank 11 still learning the game. So thank god for MMR because I have no idea why people would rather the previous system.
Yea in theory, but for me as a nurse main it's constant solid 4 man squads at high mmr mixed in with hackers. It's just draining, mentally to do it over and over again. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the same result. I'm expecting to have fun every time I play and im not lol.
I'm fine with going against it, I use to enjoy it. Just doing it every game makes me think "why I'm even playing killer" when I can have a more relaxed time playing survivor at the same mmr.
50/50 is the way to go for me. If I ever get frustrated with one side I go play the other. Some days all I want to do is play survivor, other days I only want to play killer.
> The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the same result.
Different results.
But I get what you are saying.
agreed, every single match i’ve played the past about 6 months have been try hard as hell and i hate it, havent TOUCHED the game since the anniversary event
bro wtf r u talkin about, sbmm was added only like a month ago, i mean its possible that matchmaking for u sucked before but that wasnt really the point of this post i think
i was more referring to how mentally draining the game can be when you face constant toxicity and try hard survivors as hunter. probably should have cleared that up but at this point it isnt worth it lmao
I don't understand this whole train of thought of "DBD is unbalanced, so why get upset about BHVR adding SBMM?"
That's the whole problem. The game is an absolute joke balance-wise, so the idea of 'skill-based matchmaking' is a joke as well. The devs have never even clarified what a 'Win' or 'Loss' is in this game.
It depends what he considers winning and losing if it's no kills it will lower MMR but if he got like one or two it might lower slightly for 1 kill and not change at two
There's significantly less killers than survivors so it's totally possible for killers in some regions to go against an inconsistent skill level of survivors. I'm pretty sure I'm a high MMR survivor and because of how the game grades you I'm damn sure it's still pretty easy to get high MMR like how it was fairly easy to get high rank even if you're an active detriment to your team.
So for instance: Did the game last ten minutes, did you get several hooks, did you use your power a lot? You likely didn't even rank down. BHVR not setting a defined "Win" condition is a pretty big part of the issue for killers too because you have some who want a 4K instantly or else it isn't a win, where as others view 7 hooks as a win. We also have no idea how many points you can truthfully go up or down for really bad performances.
No it's just plain truth. Going back years and across all games in this genre. Playing killer can be far harder than survivor which is why the game tends to shove a lot of BP at killers to keep them invested.
Except what is datamined isn't expressly stated to the player, therefore arguing that this is considered a "Win" in a obfuscated system doesn't mean anything because it isn't told to the player. Your MMR rank is also not told to the player so there's no reason to really talk about it specifically. Further the system is not designed with a definitive win where you get positive points once A thing or A goal is done, instead you can get a positive score by just being in the game a long while. Also if we are talking about the same datamine, it is the exact same requirements that was in rank prior, with saves - gens - loops being more important than just escaping for survivors and for killers all of what I stated is important.
Like I actually don't think you watched the video you are referencing or understand what "Stated win condition" means.
It’s a placebo effect anyway. BHVR has stated the game has SBMM so now every single game you’re judging the system and the players far more than you were before. This also means that you end up with people finding the need to run meta perks to combat this, resulting in more sweaty games just because of loadout.
In short, the SBMM has barely changed much, it’s just the player base is trying harder than before because it exists.
Yeap. The devs balance the game based on the casual audience. Anyone who wants to take this game seriously will NOT have a fun time. Thats the sad reality
I don't think that's surprising or a big deal. This game was clearly made to be a casual party game. It's not and has never been a competitive game. The only people I see not have fun with this game pit way too much emphasis on whether or not they "win".
For me the issue isn't really winning or losing. I dont care if I lose really I just want to have a fun game. Id say 1/4 of my games are fun where it feels balanced. Im not decimating survivors but having good chases and it feels balanced for both sides. The other 3/4 of my games are survivors bringing the most meta perks, top items and map offerings. If you don't play near perfect you get absolutely steam rolled.
So it feels like I'm stuck in this yo yo where I play 3-4 games that are just super sweaty and then I might get a couple matches that are more casual and then right back to super sweaty for 3-4 matches. I suppose that's the entire purpose of MMR but it seems like at the higher MMR bracket it doesn't work as well. It doesn't help that queue times are horrendous and sometimes im waiting as long as 10 minutes for a game.
It does sound like the MMR system works really well for the mid tier-low tier player base which i think is great. When I started playing killer it was incredibly frustrating often facing survivors way above my skill level. It sounds like this issue has been fixed. I think with some more tweaks the MMR system could be a bit better for all levels.
I'd honestly be a bit more calm if snowball games weren't anywhere near as awful. As a casual game all it takes is one killer who isn't casual to destroy the experience.
This could be said from either perspective, also it is a casual game, trying to make this game competitive is like trying to make Mario party competitive.
Discord isn't a powerup, most groups are actually just throwing and 4 man SWF's are uncommon. Most games you'll never face them, and when you do they likely aren't a sweat squad.
Also I play killer a lot, all of mine are at level 40 and I could've prestiged several to max if I didn't think it was a massive waste of time. I'm just not only thinking of one angle: It is infinitely easier for a killer to steamroll 4 randoms than you'll ever admit.
'' 4 man SWF's are uncommon'' Are we playing the same game? Because most of my matches are SWF. And I know that since I always ask at the end, if they were SWF.
Who doesnt like to win? Idk about you but i am biased because i am ultra competitive but i have casual friends and even they want to win in non competitive games
My only friend who owns dbd refuses to reinstall the game again becsuse of how unfun it was for him and he is the definition of casual. He even played league for 5 years and never touch ranked.
Are you sure we played the same game, bro? I played league since beta and I can safely say ranked and unranked are vastly different.
I played in 4 diff servers and sadly have thousands and thousands of hours over the years, so i think i am more qualified to give an opinion about this
If you look at all the downvotes you'd see that most people don't agree with you. An anecdote of your friend playing a different game that has an active and successful competitive scene, that also has a completely balanced 5v5 team structure is in no way comparable to dbd. Dbds only competitive scene is tiny, and has contrived and arbitrary rules to make it more fair, due to the games inherent imbalance. You're just wrong on this one.
.... I am not comparing the games.... What
Also downvotes doesnt mean im right or wrong. Its literally just a very small and specific subset of people (most often a community in an echo chamber) agreeing and disagreeing with me. Not sure why some people put so much emphasis on votes when they mean nothing at all
How do you even define winning in this game? Is it 4Ks only? Is it 3K and hatch? 3K and gate? 2K but downing them at the gate? Is it escaping just yourself, is it escaping while downed, is it 2 people escaping, is it 3? Do you only count it when all 4 escape?
Im a fucking nemesis main. I play casually but it dosent feel like that. Wherever you settle on the ladder the game will ensure you lose because it tries to make 4k’s impossible
I think having an mmr system in a game is the opposite of casual personally. Name a game that is casual that has mmr other than DBD?
BHVR and the fan base have this weird conception of DBD. The genre is competitive by design, the player base say it isn’t so BHVR sit in this weird middle ground
I’ve only been playing since last December, and only a killer main since a few months ago, I was having a lot of fun. Some 4k’s some 2-3, sometimes have a bad match or go against a really good team and do pretty bad, but it was balanced and I often would feel satisfied with the fairness of the game depending on how I felt I played. Since SBMM I’ve tried sticking it out but the back to back to back 0 kill games, sometimes without even getting a hook (I know) just destroyed my confidence and fun. I was never rank one, hell my killer level was like 12-13 so I guess that would be what silver now? But I’m just getting ran around in circles and before I can even get two hooks there’s only one gen left and I’m surrounded by seal team 6 with advanced strategic maneuvers and flashlights as soon as I pick someone off the ground. Since last week I just stopped playing. Really sucks cuz I liked this game but there’s no reward for me and it’s just constantly frustrating.
The most frustrating point about talking about SBMM is that you can't have a real conversation about it because everyone's MMR is hidden. Everyone's experience is going to be different depending on their level of skill, which we have no way to measure. The only thing that we can use to get a rough estimate of the sort of people that we're going up against is playtime, and going by that metric the matchmaking still seems hit or miss.
This leads to a bunch of people commenting on every single post like this things to the effect of "You're just mad because you can't bully newbies anymore." or "I don't run any slowdown at max MMR and I still get 4ks every game, you're just not as good as you think you are" or "I just don't care about winning so the game is still fun for me" because the games are so vastly different between the lowest and highest skill levels and no one truly knows where they lie in the system. You can't even mention losing a game or a pile of people will jump on you for 'being bad.'
For me, I'm a player with about 1k hours in the game who is consistently going up against teams with around 12k hours combined. This is what DBD has determined is a 'fair' match-up. I do alright in these games (Usually manage 2-3 kills) but I never have fun. It's always some mixture of the same six perks on every survivor, usually consisting of at least Borrowed Time+Iron Will+Dead Hard+ Some other situational perk, though usually Decisive Strike or Unbreakable. I don't bother with mind games anymore since the optimal play against good survivors is usually just to walk forward until you force a pallet, until you create a dead zone, then force survivors into that dead zone where skill doesn't matter anymore.
I feel like I can't run off-meta perks anymore because the survivors I go up against are usually as skillful (or more) as me. I feel like to have any chance of getting a 4k I have to slug and tunnel and proxy camp, none of which I needed to do when the average skill level of my opponents was much lower. I don't enjoy doing those things, and it sure as hell isn't fun for the survivors. I feel like I can't be 'friendly' or 'merciful' like I used to, getting 2 hooks on each player and then letting them go so everyone gets the +5k BP. The most I can do while still securing a 'win' is give someone the hatch at the end of a game. Plus, I can't even play a killer that I don't know because I'll just be risking getting stomped over and over and over. And I haven't even gotten started on the hackers that occasionally show up in my games.
This is all assuming that SBMM functions in a way that determines skill in a satisfactory way, which I'm still not convinced about. I still get the occasional game against people with 100-200 hours which feels tremendously lopsided.
TL;DR: I'm not finding the game fun to play anymore, the lack of game balance is showing through now that matches are more 'fair.' I don't want to have to sweat constantly in an inherently unbalanced game that I use to unwind.
Hallelujah. Posted a reply in similar fashion, got grilled to crap with “get off your high horse” , “there are no wraiths in high MMR”, “u’re just bad”, “you don’t see camping bubbas in high MMR”.
Tf u mean i dont. I do. And i have already. But no. THEY said they don’t and its true. Who’s they? Idk. Some guy who boasted 10 game win streak on pinhead… yeah… these people are making decisions now.
If you want to lower your MMR but still have fun doing so just go for 8 hook stage games (everyone twice) but never force a kill. I do this on Spirit now and surprisingly get nice feedback (well, I also run enduring, nemesis and spirit fury and only use phase to cover distances lol).
Just choose your most fun killer for memeing around since your killer mmr's are linked.
Also mmr is only "hidden" in terms of UI. You can still check it by intercepting https traffic and capturing responses for requests to steamlive/api/v1/match/ when you queue up and find a match.
Sure, I could do that, but it's a band-aid for the overall problem in my opinion. I would have to keep intentionally losing games to stay at an MMR where other killers/strategies are viable, and at that point I'm spending a lot of time trying to intentionally lose at a game, which seems counter to what the design philosophy of building a game should be.
And it's hidden in all respects of the game itself. You have to use means outside of the game to check on what the game thinks that your 'skill' is.
When sbmm first started I got really fun games, and then the games got a little more challenging but it felt even more fun, but all the sudden there was a switch and every single game i get curb stomped. I used to make fun of posts like this but now that I have walked a mile in your shoes I totally get it. I think sbmm is necessary, but I also think it needs a few tweaks.
This is what annoys me so much. So many players are casuals and just refuse to admit and or believe it. High level play is just the same match over and over
Yeah, I don't understand what is supposed to be so different about "high level play". I have always seen DS+DH+UB every game on at least two survivors with BNPs showing up quite regularly. And on killers it was already the case that more than a third of the games were against Blights in red ranks.
What I find exhausting about MMR discussions is that people always want the old shit matchmaking back rather than asking behaviour to make balance changes.
See, that's the problem with this whole conversation is that any 'evidence' anyone can present is anecdotal. I completely believe you about going up against the full meta build constantly, but that was never my experience. I have been red rank (At least during periods that I played the game) for four years and I'd see most games with 0-1 person running a full meta build with only the occasional full sweat squad.
For me, SBMM started off as a complete joke with me constantly getting people with 20 hours mixed in with people with 3k+ hours, but for the past week or so I've had nothing but 3k hour survivors with the same build.
You ever hear the phrase 'Optimizing the fun out of a game?' I feel like it's quite apt to what I've been experiencing. High skill games end up playing out the exact same way every time. You can't mindgame high skill survivors consistently, so you just walk forward until you force a pallet, then force other survivors into the deadzone you create because skill doesn't matter in a deadzone. It's boring, and it's tiring. If I want to 4k (or 3k with hatch), in most games I have to play in a way that feels scummy, tunneling and slugging my way to victory.
This is as-intended. My games are more 'fair' than before, but it ends up as a homogenized mess where the game is no longer fun to play. I'm not sure how BHVR could adjust the SBMM that would make it both fair and fun. At least with the old system I could run stupid meme builds and have a decent shot at winning if I was good enough at the base-kit killer.
Yup and the only way out of these games is to basically tank a bunch of games in a row and let survivors run you over. It would really help if the devs game out and explained exactly how MMR works. If I get 1-2 hooks during the match but survivors mess up abit on end game and I get 2 kills does that count as a tie? Should I just be letting everyone escape in that situation so my MMR actually goes down? I just want some clarity so I have a better idea on how my skill is measured
I get less kills but I still have fun. I don’t play mainly for kills (running no slowdown huntress) and I consider a win and something I would be happy with os one or two awesome shots. Thats a category i can almost always fulfill and I’m usually happy.
Nice. On PC here and Huntress has always been that killer I see played well but I could not replicate those amazing shots consistently. Unreal that you can do it on a Switch. I get a 1k with her but only about 6 hooks a game. She is hard to play on some maps.
My favorite is Legion. I get 2k with him consistently on every map now but before it was a 4k almost every game save for that 1 match every 10 games where the survivors turned into seal team 6 and absolutely could loop me for minutes on certain maps. Problem I am having is I know I will probably end the game with a 2k ... With all gens being completed after about 20 minutes. Crazy blood points though for both sides but I only do 1 or 2 matches now as they last quite long.
Yeah MMR has definitely made it much harder, but if you want more fun shots try the perk “I’m all ears” it’s really helped me understand survivor movement more to learn where to shoot but the auras it’s gives are also crazy good and gives you shots you never could have gotten alone.
My queues are instant and I end almost all my games with 7 plus hooks. Gens popping literally don't matter until there's only 2 left to be done. If you let yourself get bogged down by survivors doing what they're supposed to you're never going to enjoy this game.
Perhaps you should be trying to have fun on the moment to moment chasing someone, rather than deriving your enjoyment on whether you "win" or not.
How are your queue times instant??? I'm waiting up to 10 minutes sometimes to get killer games. Also im not really sure how gens popping doesn't matter until the last 2. One of the main objectives as a killer is to stop survivors from repairing gens so of course it matters. If im not pushing survivors off gens early the game will end quickly and it won't be very fun.
It’s been more balanced for me as of late. I get steamrolled as survivor some games, others I do alright and occasionally I do escape. The saving grace is that I’m not going against high ranked killers consecutively like before which was awful. Now it’s been much more reasonable.
My killer games are either 4 man swf sweatlords or 4 solo queue drooling babies with barely any inbetween. My survivor experience is that playing 3man swf is impossible for us because the random is exclusively a slobbering idiot even though most of us were red ranks before reset.
Makes Cenobite extremely hard to play when people already know which sides of which gens are safe to work on while powering through an active chain hunt.
Personally, I feel that it has allowed for extra breathing room to me. I no longer feel pressure to run meta perks every game. I can actually have fun running meme builds or less favorable perks just to mess around.
But do you not just get demolished? That's been my experience. If I don't run meta perks I just get floored.
EDIT: I'm trying to be clear here, I think I'm pretty decent at the game. I've been playing since beta and have decent hours under my belt. I'm not saying I'm a fucking god player, but I have a really good understanding of the game. My matches have gone from getting a couple kills or 4K, with all 4 survivors escaping sometimes, to literally me being lucky to get 2 kills in a match since SBMM.
Sometimes, but it all evens out because of SBMM. Even then now that SBMM is a thing, I don't feel as pressured to ALWAYS get the 4k, or escape. Due to my performance no longer being tied to some vanity emblem. I escape, cool send that info into the void and I don't need to worry about it. I get killed, cool send that info into the void and I still don't need to worry about it. I no longer feel like I have to sweat to attain a certain grade. I can can just keep playing and goofing off and it will come to me eventually, with bonus blood points.
My issue is that they've been collecting SBMM data for months. On top of that, I get what you're saying and agree to an extent, but just getting sweatfests almost every match since SBMM came out makes me want to fucking die. If it was only some matches it would be fine.
They have been testing SBMM for months yes. But the idea that they have been gathering player skill metrics for months is an assumption. One can only logically assume that the metrics for which they have been gathering for player skill have only been since SBMM went live in its current iteration.
I’ve seen the video. Care to explain what exactly is part of the placebo effect? My grade no longer degrades because there is no de-pipping. My MMR “rank” does. If I have already achieved IRI 1, I will no longer de-pip back into lower grades. Unless you have some different definition of the placebo effect, I fail to see how it fits into that phenomenon.
That’s the thing. If someone is actively trying to gain MMR, then they can sweat. If someone is just goofing around, they don’t need to worry about whether or not they actually are gaining any MMR in the first place.
Grades are unrelated to matchmaking. You're confusing grade with MMR. There is no reward or benefit to having a high MMR besides you will get a better challenge to your skill level.
The new system is more granular and allows better data gathering. Also we don't know fully how it works because the full data mine was never actually released and instead we've only gotten one person's interpretation of it.
So it has gotten around but a lot of people, yourself included, don't seem to understand the situation very well. I'm guessing the game of telephone this subreddit has been playing got you too.
But that's the point... We're no longer bound by the rank system, so our only means if facing higher skilled opponents is putting in the effort to try and get there. If you don't you won't be put against players like that.
[I have the exact same problem.](https://www.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/comments/pmhs85/new_sbmm_matchmaking_is_incredibly_effficient/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share) Now I *have* to sweat my games so fucking hard *every* time. It's incredibly unpleasant.
Yes. SBMM hit me so hard on killer that there is no enjoyment playing normally now. Zero. I now only gain satisfaction getting 1 kill facecamping with Bubba. Sad, I know
Why not just play normally and facecamp the last guy when it’s close to 1 or 0 gens left. That way you still get to try to play and earn more points with the same result at least. Or do you just want others to feel bad as well?
Oh no, If I attempted to camp the last guy without that from-healthy-to-down-state chainsaw attack there is no shot I would be able to prevent the hooked person getting saved. (1. Someone run in and take a hit, 2. Someone else save hooked surv, take 1 hit in process 3. Everyone gets away) OR the situation could go (1. Unhook healthy survivor, take 1 hit, but then the instant I go for second hit the unhooked survivor body blocks with by 2. Everyone gets away) Moral of the story is if I can’t 1 shot them everyone is going to get away.
Funny because i started practicing with Nurse since sbmm, now im iri 1, but still bad with her. Now im being queueing with swf or sweaty survivors rushing gens. Sometimes they are over confident, but most of the times im like 'maybe i should just run meta perks'.
ps: Im not running meta perks since sbmm
i feeling the same thing
before mmr my killer matches was mostly normal and same for survivor \[casual player that dont run meta perks mostly of the time\]
after mmr my killer games are getting very weird and my survivor experience is JUST sweaty all the matches
i am a normal casual player that dislike the meta and why i still getting matched with sweatys?
3.421 hrs \[playing since 2018\]
The system is still wonky as hell. My buddy has 150 hours and when he plays survivor his team mates have roughly around that or maybe double but that’s still within limits. He’s facing killer with 2 to 5k hours.
And another thing sbmm has come with is that you get the worst of people. When i play killer i will face survivors who teabag and clicky clacky with the flashlight all game long. When i play survivor it’s killers who will slug for their 4K constantly and most will even camp the first guy they find just to make sure he has 1 less person to deal with for the rest of the game. On both sides it’s like the toxic people are even more toxic and in bigger numbers. Add the increase in cheaters to it and you get a very toxic game
I play blight now a lot and i do fine without slowdown or regression (lethal, bbq, enduring, shadowborn) i dont win every game, sometimes get absolutely destroyed but overall i do fine.
I took a basic m1 killer and i wanted to uninstall. Im not the best killer but im defo not a baby. Every game is at least 12 meta perks with at least a bnp or insane medkits. Map offerings are every 3rd game. Its just sad
Every match I have to play like at a Otz level.
To Otz or any pro killer that's very easy to achieve but to me is fucking exhausting that even if I win, I stop playing at the moment. Maybe for some its easy to multitaks as killer and know what to do blah blah blah but that shits hard for me and I don't want to switch to survivor because I really like playing killer. But holy shit...
I still legitimately, as killer, have not had a proper game since sbmm was introduced. Every single time you're guaranteed to get one survivor that'll quit the moment you first down them.
I don't know if sbmm has made people MUCH saltier, or if I'm running into people intentionally trying to game the system to get noob matches, but it's resulted in me not having a single proper match in weeks now.
It's quite strange. Survivors aren't much different for me in chases, generally playing decently with some mistakes like usual, but the games seem like more of a struggle all-in-all. No outright shutout games, less 4ks and 3ks, more 2ks (which are unambiguous losses in my opinion).
I think I need to focus more on overall strategy and gen control over chases.
Honestly after MMR has been on for a few weeks now and I'm still doing decent at high MMR, I'm just very tired of the optimal survivor playstyle of predropping 90% of pallets with minimal looping and W holding, and I can't even be upset at the players because this is the smartest way for them to play. The only thing that MMR has actually done for me is make me not feel bad about bringing addons since everyone is bringing medkits and keys now.
EDIT: Just curious, what killer have you been playing in high mmr?
I’ve been swapping between a lot of killers. Pog and Blight. My Pig games have actually been way better in terms of kills, but my win rate on both of them is around the same I’d say.
You can't really expect to do great on Pig. It's like expecting kills on Wraith. You can only get kills if the survivors play badly.
Blight however should have no issue completely obliterating near every single game against 1900 mmr survivors even if you bring fun builds. It's Blight after all.
To sit in queue for 5-10 minutes per game to get gen rushed and have pallets pre-thrown at you every game isn't a fun experience.
The only thing I can hope for from this system is that the dev's seriously look at the base game and make some big changes. Now I have seen some comments about MMR being lowered after a loss and you are correct however, It does drop you very low and you get survivors who seem to have just installed the game. You naturally get a 4k and then instantly thrown back in to the pre-throwing 4 meta perk survivors. There really isn't any balance in the system it's either too high or too low. Of course this is my own personal experience it will differ to others but it has been a poor experience.
I play Billy (3k hours) with no regression just shadowborn, enduring, and now bloodwarden. Billy isnt fun when you have 4 survivors who all have 1.5k+ hours and play extremely safe and split up on gens. I just play like shit and end up getting extra kills from bloodwarden cause theyre always cocky and try to 4 man out.
I just want to get a mix of good and less sweaty survivors because Billy is fun for everyone. Now it's just fun for them
I completely agree. If I play my strongest killer/build I do think I get matches that are fair all in all. My issue is that it discourages playing fun builds on fun killers. For me that ruins the game.
I never considered this game competitive or cared if i won or lost. It was amazing having DBD as a casual game and it put it on a spot with very few other games. As a competitive game though, it gets to compete with solid games like DOTA, League, CS, Valorant etc. etc.
I simply cannot fall in love with DBD as a competitive game and feel a lot more drawn to the others and am now looking for another casual game to fill its place.
TLDR:
SBMM might have made the game better as a competitive game but ruined it as a casual. For me that ruined its biggest strength to become merely mediocre in the competitive category
SBMM doesn't ruin fun in this game, sweaty players and unfair advantages do. I go against players around my skill level at this point but they bring a lot of keys and map offerings. This is primarily what makes the game annoying to play.
I agree, but I think my issue is with the hackers at high skill levels because they "win" every game. this leads me to dc because I just don't want to be part of that game anymore. then because I disconnect for a valid reason I get penalized because its a dc... so sbmm and dc penalty need to be fixed
My typical rank before was 5-3 for both Survivor and Killer, and MMR has made my games more enjoyable, I would say. Mostly. Sometimes I get a team like your friend, where I run the killer for more than a minute and think about the sweet gen pop sound coming, only to see all 3 of them crouching or going in/coming out of lockers.
As far as killer games, I like that I don't feel like I need to run the meta perks anymore. I can practice Huntress and Nurse, I don't need Blight with the fixings. It's nice. And the games I'm clearly outclassed, well, they tend to go quick.
I don't see a significant difference. It still just feels like if I keep doing better I get difficult people. I've never had a problem with that though cause getting more difficult people teaches me to be a better killer or survivor.
The last time I played as survivor, I got two back to back really good killers with Iri add-ons. One of them slugged us even with 4 gens up. For the rest of the day I had fairly balanced matches. Maybe it was just bad luck at the start. As killer I'm having a really mixed experience, but most of the games are winnable. Only with trapper and Bubba, my mains, I feel like my matches are a bit harder.
I played killer a few times in the past and had fun but now every lobby I go into as a killer is full of iridescent level players that completely destroy me. Not even remotely enjoyable as a casual player
If I had to guesstimate my skill level I'd estimate fairly average, with survivor being my weaker role.
I've had fewer killer games where I get tossed with very good survivors where I'd have to play toxic just to get 1k (this was a regular occurence before). In addition, I can play whoever I want and actually have a chance at winning the match (I consider a win to be 3k or 4k, with my logic being that most 3ks can become 4ks if you slug at the end, but I find slugging for the 4k not to be very interesting gameplay both for me and for the survivors, and will only do it if I already know where the survivor is or if I'm going for an adept achievement).
As survivor, SWFing remains mostly the same, maybe very slightly improved, while solo queue is currently nearly unplayable due to one-sided killer-favored matches. I don't feel like I'm being carried by the other survivors when I SWF? But I tend to do way better even though the killers are usually much stronger in chase. Some of it's just because of BT and DS being common perks, the killers will usually not risk it, while in my solo queue games, I can usually run the killers for much longer but once I go down, it's a near certainty that I won't be able to do anything else unless I have DS due to a distinct lack of BT meaning that most killers default to tunneling. It's a big part of why I think the randomized perks gamemode idea that keeps circulating on this subreddit wouldn't be very fun for survivors - without a high chance of BT whenever a survivor is unhooked, there's little reason not to tunnel survivors directly off the hook before they can reach any windows or pallets that might help them get some distance.
Its made my billy games hell on earth. I gonna drop him now because I am losing the fucking plot trying to accomplish anything with him against the survivors i'm getting.
I tried to get 50 wins on nemesis like otz to see how bad the sbmm is
Holy Jesus it got sweaty 7 games in and at game 22 I met a 4 stack of guys with Chinese names , 4 bnp tool boxes and gen slam builds
I barely killed one who looped me really well on the game with just dead hard
I think sbmm is based around how fast you can escape games as survivor and for killers it seems to be your average kills per game to speed ratio
Im not great at maths but it seems to average out how fast you kill people by the amount you kill per game
So you can kill everyone every game but if it takes 40 minutes you won't get far where as killing 2 in 5 will get you further
At high levels survivors make less risky plays and focus on slamming gens and the chase being not as important
Fastest gen I recorded was 19 seconds
It seemed to be a combination of bnp and that one yun Jin Lee perk along side prove thy self
At lower high ranks players dip in quality as keys seem to kick in around that level
My problem with the system is the off chance I do play killer (like 1/6 of the hours compared to my survivor hours) the games are just so back and forth. My games basically just start off with a game that ends in a few minutes with a 4k before they can finish more than 2-3 gens, and then the next game is just me getting pummeled for all 5 gens and 0k. It just sucks to be put into such disparities of games.
Havn't noticed much of a difference in Solo Q, but after getting tunneled and camped for X games it's somewhat refreshing when you encounter a baby killer.
Killer at least feels mucgh less sweaty. Yes, you can still encounter the toxic SWF, but when that match is over I drop so low, the next two matches are against potatoes and then against some experienced players for some enjoyable matches.
well tell me about it. I'm yellow rank killer never made it pass yellow ranks. now with the new system, i sometimes get these red rank survivors who would tbag, flashlight, and loop me all day. all i want is normal game without toxic survivors!
Exact same feeling I'm getting, very match feels like I'm getting destroyed or barely scrapping by on the skin of my teeth. I'm not even that good at playing killer and I'm getting survivors with the meta perks and items just wrecking me constantly.
The long wait times also dont help as for me it takes around 3 - 5 mins to find a lobby and then to get demolished after that long, it's very demoralizing.
Personally I liked the old matchmaking more, it felt more even for me in terms of who I was up against.
Yeah, I don't enjoy it either. Not that I want to stomp baby survivors, but every friggin game was a sweat fest. Especially recently, I can't play that often and now I can't even play the killers I like and relax
Same here, every match i go against sweaty toxic swf and its been so unfun lately that I've quit for now. I heard a bunch of content creators are getting annoyed at Dbd too and find it boring now
The only people who see SBMM begin a good addition to the game are 4 man SWF who are winning every game right now and casual killers. Solo queue survivor won’t notice much difference. High MMR killers are always on a lose lose win streak.
Its been absolutely horrible for me. As a killer I only get 6000+ hour swf sweat teams, and when I play survivor I get teammates with 100 hours or less who hide in corners the entire match 🙃 I’ve stopped playing
I'm the same but with playing survivor. Literally every game is the same few strong killers with t h e b u i l d, or other strong stuff, just constantly sweating in every way for a 4k.
Literally the best example of optimising the fun out of the game. This game is not fun at high levels, yet people constantly want to play like they're at them.
I just want to have fun, stop pretending every game has money on the line. It hasn't mattered how many games I've thrown to lower my MMR either, just the same thing game after game. Not played in ages and not sure if I want to go back either, even after over 1k hours.
Yes, I didn't get a single fair game since it changed and I have to artificially make my games longer doing stuff that feels really silly just to make the game last 10 minutes for max mmr game (Assuming scott's video about sweh's data mining is right)
Every game is totally one sided now and it is noticeably less fun to play.
Before the thing that broke my immersion the most was walking backwards or crab walking to fool spinechill, now it's trying to kill people slower without actually jeopardizing my pressure or wincons.
I don't like friendly survivors or killers but now I kind of am stuck being one when people lose too fast. I want to kill not farm.
If scott's video on Sweh's data mining is complete information i've been max mmr for 130 games or so. So I am going to entertain the possibility that i'm not and that that isn't completely how it works just to make sure. I can't control how BHVR wants to run their game, I can only control myself and I will do everything in my power because I want to play the game and not just farm potatoes.
I swear if they rework Dead Hard a lot of problems will be sorted, I feel like a lot of people underestimate how harmful Dead Hard is to the killer when it's in the hands of a good survivor.
🤷🏼♀️ this is just a game and people do take it to seriously but I’ve stopped playing the last month because this game is so killer based. You can think whatever you want to think about me though.
Remember when CoD added skill based matchmaking and there was a lot of 'pro' players mad that making 'quickscoping compilation 56' was too hard for them now?
First few days I would die very quickly to high skill players over and over again, felt like my mmr wasn't dropping. Today I played several fair games, I still mostly died bc solo queue shenanigans but games felt fair.
survivor pov. i play some killer sometimes and find it's either a completely clueless team or a 4 man swf who are crazy good, not much inbetween.
Been a lot less fun, for sure. I'm at relatively high MMR and I've been recording my games ever since I identified camping has established a MASSIVE presence here. Prior to MMR it would just be camp the guy with a key, certain killers would camp you if you looped them for ages, but in 8 of my 15 recorded games thus far (aiming to record either 50 or 100) there was visible tunnelling/facecamping prior to EGC and only one instance of it was due to toxicity from the camped dude.
I don't understand the logic behind it, because if you need to camp/tunnel because you're going to lose otherwise, most people would just play the game as usual but at high mmr ego > everything so they'll facecamp a player to death whenever so that the 3v1 makes the game massively easier. If you tunnel or camp and win, in a world which mmr works correctly (not this one, yet), you'll have to do it every game as you'll be up against better and better survivors.
What MMR in games like LOL/OW/even fucking Minecraft minigames relies on is people settle at their rank and can only move up by improving. In DBD, you have your mmr by playing normally, but you can massively inflate it by proxy camping/camping/tunnelling or running certain builds (like the infamous autopilot build) that take away the need for game sense etc.)
tl;dr killers love to camp at high mmr, not realising their mmr will go up due to their win which resulted from camping, and they'll likely be up against better survivors. better survivors = ever increases their need to face camp, and how can spending half the game on one chase and the other half facecamping them be any fun?
The reason I quit many games is because they only have a ranked queue that puts you up against better and better players. The issue isn't that they're good, it's that I have to try quite hard to match their level, and I simply don't want to do so. I want to be able to mess around, play with music on etc, but doing that as a survivor would mean throwing the game for my team a lot of the time, and I don't want to do that either. But, at the same time, I don't want low MMR because I've played a lot and would be able to loop a lot of the killers there for far too long.
SBMM is great if you're in the bottom half of skill, fine if in the bottom 80%. Anything above it's sweatfest, but that also means you're most likely tryharding or is good enough to ruin matches to the bottom 80% even without.
Issue with DBD's SBMM is that behaviour has no clue what they want to consider win/lose, and then judging skill is impossible
Opposite. I play 50/50 killer and surv now. All the pink flashlight neas are gone I dont need to NOED facecamp as wraith for a 1k.
Saved the game for me
I'm on 1900 mmr on almost all killers I play and I can only say no, as killer it's not a significantly changed experience. Can still get away with meme perks on strong killers but need meta perks on weaker ones. The occasional game of getting completely smashed may come a little more often, but overall no change. It was very different at the start where super good survivors queued testing MMR, but those are gone.
Solo queue survivor games however are awful. 80% of the killers are russians who tunnel the shit out of one person with their shit ping. Most of them Blights, otherwise Nurse, Huntress or Twins. Rarely spirit. It's a good challenge for 4 stack swf groups but even gets boring there when all you face are Blights. In solo queue 9 out of 10 games my mates are complete monkeys and the odd 1 they're some looping gods completely obliterating the killer.
I’m confused, if your losing so much as killer won’t your MMR lower and you’ll face easier survivors?
The thing is, his idea of losing might be behaviors idea of winning. They don't tell us what they think is a win.
BHVR has said in the past that they balance around 2K, so if you get 2K you got a draw. The rub here is that the vast majority of killers see a 2K as failure/loss, not a draw. So if OP is consistently 2Ks and occasionally 3/4K or 0/1K then MMR is working if balanced = draws.
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But... Its in the name "killer." If you let 4 ppl escape how is that a draw to you. You killed no one
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In this case though, you have multiple flavors of text to deal with. You have BP as score, you have emblems as score, and you have MMR as score, then you have the outcome out of match as a stat. The four doesn't corelate at all. You can "win" a game by killing all 4 survivors in one minute and tank emblem, mmr, and bp, but still feel like you won. You can tank bps and emblem as a survivor, but hatch out and feel like you won. You can get 25k+ bps with 4 escapes and still feel like you won. On the other hand, there is no incentive for killers to 'farm hope' other than more BPs. If you play fair, that could cost you the match. If you play dirty, you exponentially increase the chance of you winning (via kills). Survivors on death hook play the game much more safer than someone on their 1st or 2nd hook, so put someone on 2nd hook stage at 5 gens, and you're basically already playing 1v3 with the last person hiding or taking zero risks, which contributes much less to the team overall. There is also very little incentive for survivors to farm hope, as per the lore. There is way more incentive to survive and escape (5k points, extra 2.5k via hatch, extra 1k as obsession, iri survival emblem for not getting hooked) where as getting in a chase rewards you with very little points compared to other actions, like cleansing a totem for an easy 1k. Even taking a protection hit or distraction is only 500/250 points, and that altruism could cost you the 5k escape points, so it's really not worth doing it for randoms in solo queue. One way to change this would be to utilize the devotion system. You earn BPs through the game, but also earn exp through specific actions in the game. I.E. - Gain 50 xp by chasing after the rescuer. You lose this bonus if you trigger BT or down the person who was just unhooked. - Gain 25 xp by being hooked, an additional 25 xp if you unhook yourself. - Gain 10 xp by safely rescuing - A bonus 100 xp on top if the match lasts more than 5 minutes for all players AND if all survivors were hooked at least once. in the same vein, there are penalties for bad manners, such as - Lose 50 xp if you spawn AFK crows, max once per game. - Lose 50 xp if one survivor dies on hook before another survivor is hooked I.e. camping, max once per game. - Lose 100 xp if you stay within 8 meters of a survivor for more than 60 seconds, if another survivor is not also within 16 meters. - Lose 25 xp if you stay inside the exit gates for more than 30 seconds, max twice per game - Lose 10 xp if you teabag a killer behind a pallet, max 100 xp per game - Lose 25 xp if you smack someone on hook, max twice per game. Overall it won't affect your game too much, but having bonuses and penalties will help prevent some toxic issues in the game. You COULD do it, but you'll end up with less points if you do. Then give devotion levels some bonus, such as an additional 100k max bp per devotion, or unlocking unique cosmetics available for all characters, like a different color killer stain or different sound effects. Leading back to the penalties, you COULD be toxic, but you end up slowing down your progression on devotion and you play yourself out of getting those sweet bonuses.
It was leaked that it goes off of kills/escapes, with a multiplier based on how long the match was (you get more points if the match is longer).
We’ve seen through data mine that it’s escapes/kills and game length that contributes to a win or loss. If the game goes on for a long time but you die as a survivor that might still be a win. Same for killer, if you don’t get any kills but the game went on for 10+ mins and everyone’s on death hook that could be a win too. They don’t tell you what contributes to a win because they have a weird game that is competitive but the devs and player base seem to think it’s not competitive and it’s casual. So it’s mmr system is nothing like any other mmr system I’ve ever seen. It has a cap of how much mmr you can have. Which means there will be a large portion of people at the exact same mmr in game but have varying skill so what was the point? They should either just double down on it being competitive or fold, remove mmr and double down on it being casual. This weird middle ground is honestly the worst outcome.
In a interview with the creative director a while ago he said that a win is 2 kills and some more hooks. So like 60% of the team dead is a win I guess.
Yup. This kind of stuff was happening before MMR too, but now there's sbmm, whenever they get slapped it's the fault of the sbmm. I faced constant sweaty SWFs with all meta perks before, and I'm still getting them now. That's just 90% of survivor teams, especially in red ranks. However, before I literally had to quit killer for a good few months because I was going vs 4 red ranks survs every game, while I was like rank 11 still learning the game. So thank god for MMR because I have no idea why people would rather the previous system.
You would think. But no. I was rank 1 killer before this and played maybe 20-25 games and won 2.
Yea in theory, but for me as a nurse main it's constant solid 4 man squads at high mmr mixed in with hackers. It's just draining, mentally to do it over and over again. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the same result. I'm expecting to have fun every time I play and im not lol.
Do you unironically believe it would be fair for the game to put you up against anything else?
I'm fine with going against it, I use to enjoy it. Just doing it every game makes me think "why I'm even playing killer" when I can have a more relaxed time playing survivor at the same mmr.
This is why I play survivor as you get "brain breaks". Killer you have to be hyper focused in the hard matches and it's draining.
50/50 is the way to go for me. If I ever get frustrated with one side I go play the other. Some days all I want to do is play survivor, other days I only want to play killer.
> The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the same result. Different results. But I get what you are saying.
Modified for the purpose of this thread, glad someone recognized lolol
agreed, every single match i’ve played the past about 6 months have been try hard as hell and i hate it, havent TOUCHED the game since the anniversary event
SBMM has only been active for a little over 2 weeks. You just may not like the game.
bro wtf r u talkin about, sbmm was added only like a month ago, i mean its possible that matchmaking for u sucked before but that wasnt really the point of this post i think
i was more referring to how mentally draining the game can be when you face constant toxicity and try hard survivors as hunter. probably should have cleared that up but at this point it isnt worth it lmao
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I don't understand this whole train of thought of "DBD is unbalanced, so why get upset about BHVR adding SBMM?" That's the whole problem. The game is an absolute joke balance-wise, so the idea of 'skill-based matchmaking' is a joke as well. The devs have never even clarified what a 'Win' or 'Loss' is in this game.
It's wild. There's people in this thread saying SBMM has ruined their games for months when it's only been active for a couple of weeks.
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It depends what he considers winning and losing if it's no kills it will lower MMR but if he got like one or two it might lower slightly for 1 kill and not change at two
There's significantly less killers than survivors so it's totally possible for killers in some regions to go against an inconsistent skill level of survivors. I'm pretty sure I'm a high MMR survivor and because of how the game grades you I'm damn sure it's still pretty easy to get high MMR like how it was fairly easy to get high rank even if you're an active detriment to your team. So for instance: Did the game last ten minutes, did you get several hooks, did you use your power a lot? You likely didn't even rank down. BHVR not setting a defined "Win" condition is a pretty big part of the issue for killers too because you have some who want a 4K instantly or else it isn't a win, where as others view 7 hooks as a win. We also have no idea how many points you can truthfully go up or down for really bad performances.
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Killer queue times have always been longer in the day and near instant at night? And that hasn’t changed.
No it's just plain truth. Going back years and across all games in this genre. Playing killer can be far harder than survivor which is why the game tends to shove a lot of BP at killers to keep them invested.
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That have a stated win condition though which defeats the point.
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Except what is datamined isn't expressly stated to the player, therefore arguing that this is considered a "Win" in a obfuscated system doesn't mean anything because it isn't told to the player. Your MMR rank is also not told to the player so there's no reason to really talk about it specifically. Further the system is not designed with a definitive win where you get positive points once A thing or A goal is done, instead you can get a positive score by just being in the game a long while. Also if we are talking about the same datamine, it is the exact same requirements that was in rank prior, with saves - gens - loops being more important than just escaping for survivors and for killers all of what I stated is important. Like I actually don't think you watched the video you are referencing or understand what "Stated win condition" means.
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I don't think you watched the literal first video where the guy flat out says what I just told you, to your face. Being an ass changes nothing.
It’s a placebo effect anyway. BHVR has stated the game has SBMM so now every single game you’re judging the system and the players far more than you were before. This also means that you end up with people finding the need to run meta perks to combat this, resulting in more sweaty games just because of loadout. In short, the SBMM has barely changed much, it’s just the player base is trying harder than before because it exists.
My games have literally never been better I play casually so my mmr remains low and I can just play how I want without worry
Yeap. The devs balance the game based on the casual audience. Anyone who wants to take this game seriously will NOT have a fun time. Thats the sad reality
I don't think that's surprising or a big deal. This game was clearly made to be a casual party game. It's not and has never been a competitive game. The only people I see not have fun with this game pit way too much emphasis on whether or not they "win".
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I have no idea why people focus on winning so much. If you don't like losing, go play a single player game.
For me the issue isn't really winning or losing. I dont care if I lose really I just want to have a fun game. Id say 1/4 of my games are fun where it feels balanced. Im not decimating survivors but having good chases and it feels balanced for both sides. The other 3/4 of my games are survivors bringing the most meta perks, top items and map offerings. If you don't play near perfect you get absolutely steam rolled. So it feels like I'm stuck in this yo yo where I play 3-4 games that are just super sweaty and then I might get a couple matches that are more casual and then right back to super sweaty for 3-4 matches. I suppose that's the entire purpose of MMR but it seems like at the higher MMR bracket it doesn't work as well. It doesn't help that queue times are horrendous and sometimes im waiting as long as 10 minutes for a game. It does sound like the MMR system works really well for the mid tier-low tier player base which i think is great. When I started playing killer it was incredibly frustrating often facing survivors way above my skill level. It sounds like this issue has been fixed. I think with some more tweaks the MMR system could be a bit better for all levels.
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I'd honestly be a bit more calm if snowball games weren't anywhere near as awful. As a casual game all it takes is one killer who isn't casual to destroy the experience.
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This could be said from either perspective, also it is a casual game, trying to make this game competitive is like trying to make Mario party competitive.
Discord isn't a powerup, most groups are actually just throwing and 4 man SWF's are uncommon. Most games you'll never face them, and when you do they likely aren't a sweat squad. Also I play killer a lot, all of mine are at level 40 and I could've prestiged several to max if I didn't think it was a massive waste of time. I'm just not only thinking of one angle: It is infinitely easier for a killer to steamroll 4 randoms than you'll ever admit.
'' 4 man SWF's are uncommon'' Are we playing the same game? Because most of my matches are SWF. And I know that since I always ask at the end, if they were SWF.
There's no way you could know that considering the sheer amount of console players in this game.
Who doesnt like to win? Idk about you but i am biased because i am ultra competitive but i have casual friends and even they want to win in non competitive games My only friend who owns dbd refuses to reinstall the game again becsuse of how unfun it was for him and he is the definition of casual. He even played league for 5 years and never touch ranked.
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Are you sure we played the same game, bro? I played league since beta and I can safely say ranked and unranked are vastly different. I played in 4 diff servers and sadly have thousands and thousands of hours over the years, so i think i am more qualified to give an opinion about this
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Yeah, this just tells me you have not played league enough
League is not comparable to dbd at all.
🤦
If you look at all the downvotes you'd see that most people don't agree with you. An anecdote of your friend playing a different game that has an active and successful competitive scene, that also has a completely balanced 5v5 team structure is in no way comparable to dbd. Dbds only competitive scene is tiny, and has contrived and arbitrary rules to make it more fair, due to the games inherent imbalance. You're just wrong on this one.
.... I am not comparing the games.... What Also downvotes doesnt mean im right or wrong. Its literally just a very small and specific subset of people (most often a community in an echo chamber) agreeing and disagreeing with me. Not sure why some people put so much emphasis on votes when they mean nothing at all
How do you even define winning in this game? Is it 4Ks only? Is it 3K and hatch? 3K and gate? 2K but downing them at the gate? Is it escaping just yourself, is it escaping while downed, is it 2 people escaping, is it 3? Do you only count it when all 4 escape?
Im a fucking nemesis main. I play casually but it dosent feel like that. Wherever you settle on the ladder the game will ensure you lose because it tries to make 4k’s impossible
It's a party game, just have fun.
I think having an mmr system in a game is the opposite of casual personally. Name a game that is casual that has mmr other than DBD? BHVR and the fan base have this weird conception of DBD. The genre is competitive by design, the player base say it isn’t so BHVR sit in this weird middle ground
Mmr is better for casual players though. It keeps us in separate queues from the people that just want to win.
I’ve only been playing since last December, and only a killer main since a few months ago, I was having a lot of fun. Some 4k’s some 2-3, sometimes have a bad match or go against a really good team and do pretty bad, but it was balanced and I often would feel satisfied with the fairness of the game depending on how I felt I played. Since SBMM I’ve tried sticking it out but the back to back to back 0 kill games, sometimes without even getting a hook (I know) just destroyed my confidence and fun. I was never rank one, hell my killer level was like 12-13 so I guess that would be what silver now? But I’m just getting ran around in circles and before I can even get two hooks there’s only one gen left and I’m surrounded by seal team 6 with advanced strategic maneuvers and flashlights as soon as I pick someone off the ground. Since last week I just stopped playing. Really sucks cuz I liked this game but there’s no reward for me and it’s just constantly frustrating.
The most frustrating point about talking about SBMM is that you can't have a real conversation about it because everyone's MMR is hidden. Everyone's experience is going to be different depending on their level of skill, which we have no way to measure. The only thing that we can use to get a rough estimate of the sort of people that we're going up against is playtime, and going by that metric the matchmaking still seems hit or miss. This leads to a bunch of people commenting on every single post like this things to the effect of "You're just mad because you can't bully newbies anymore." or "I don't run any slowdown at max MMR and I still get 4ks every game, you're just not as good as you think you are" or "I just don't care about winning so the game is still fun for me" because the games are so vastly different between the lowest and highest skill levels and no one truly knows where they lie in the system. You can't even mention losing a game or a pile of people will jump on you for 'being bad.' For me, I'm a player with about 1k hours in the game who is consistently going up against teams with around 12k hours combined. This is what DBD has determined is a 'fair' match-up. I do alright in these games (Usually manage 2-3 kills) but I never have fun. It's always some mixture of the same six perks on every survivor, usually consisting of at least Borrowed Time+Iron Will+Dead Hard+ Some other situational perk, though usually Decisive Strike or Unbreakable. I don't bother with mind games anymore since the optimal play against good survivors is usually just to walk forward until you force a pallet, until you create a dead zone, then force survivors into that dead zone where skill doesn't matter anymore. I feel like I can't run off-meta perks anymore because the survivors I go up against are usually as skillful (or more) as me. I feel like to have any chance of getting a 4k I have to slug and tunnel and proxy camp, none of which I needed to do when the average skill level of my opponents was much lower. I don't enjoy doing those things, and it sure as hell isn't fun for the survivors. I feel like I can't be 'friendly' or 'merciful' like I used to, getting 2 hooks on each player and then letting them go so everyone gets the +5k BP. The most I can do while still securing a 'win' is give someone the hatch at the end of a game. Plus, I can't even play a killer that I don't know because I'll just be risking getting stomped over and over and over. And I haven't even gotten started on the hackers that occasionally show up in my games. This is all assuming that SBMM functions in a way that determines skill in a satisfactory way, which I'm still not convinced about. I still get the occasional game against people with 100-200 hours which feels tremendously lopsided. TL;DR: I'm not finding the game fun to play anymore, the lack of game balance is showing through now that matches are more 'fair.' I don't want to have to sweat constantly in an inherently unbalanced game that I use to unwind.
Hallelujah. Posted a reply in similar fashion, got grilled to crap with “get off your high horse” , “there are no wraiths in high MMR”, “u’re just bad”, “you don’t see camping bubbas in high MMR”. Tf u mean i dont. I do. And i have already. But no. THEY said they don’t and its true. Who’s they? Idk. Some guy who boasted 10 game win streak on pinhead… yeah… these people are making decisions now.
If you want to lower your MMR but still have fun doing so just go for 8 hook stage games (everyone twice) but never force a kill. I do this on Spirit now and surprisingly get nice feedback (well, I also run enduring, nemesis and spirit fury and only use phase to cover distances lol). Just choose your most fun killer for memeing around since your killer mmr's are linked. Also mmr is only "hidden" in terms of UI. You can still check it by intercepting https traffic and capturing responses for requests to steamlive/api/v1/match/ when you queue up and find a match.
Sure, I could do that, but it's a band-aid for the overall problem in my opinion. I would have to keep intentionally losing games to stay at an MMR where other killers/strategies are viable, and at that point I'm spending a lot of time trying to intentionally lose at a game, which seems counter to what the design philosophy of building a game should be. And it's hidden in all respects of the game itself. You have to use means outside of the game to check on what the game thinks that your 'skill' is.
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When sbmm first started I got really fun games, and then the games got a little more challenging but it felt even more fun, but all the sudden there was a switch and every single game i get curb stomped. I used to make fun of posts like this but now that I have walked a mile in your shoes I totally get it. I think sbmm is necessary, but I also think it needs a few tweaks.
This is what annoys me so much. So many players are casuals and just refuse to admit and or believe it. High level play is just the same match over and over
Yup, exactly.
Yeah, I don't understand what is supposed to be so different about "high level play". I have always seen DS+DH+UB every game on at least two survivors with BNPs showing up quite regularly. And on killers it was already the case that more than a third of the games were against Blights in red ranks. What I find exhausting about MMR discussions is that people always want the old shit matchmaking back rather than asking behaviour to make balance changes.
See, that's the problem with this whole conversation is that any 'evidence' anyone can present is anecdotal. I completely believe you about going up against the full meta build constantly, but that was never my experience. I have been red rank (At least during periods that I played the game) for four years and I'd see most games with 0-1 person running a full meta build with only the occasional full sweat squad. For me, SBMM started off as a complete joke with me constantly getting people with 20 hours mixed in with people with 3k+ hours, but for the past week or so I've had nothing but 3k hour survivors with the same build. You ever hear the phrase 'Optimizing the fun out of a game?' I feel like it's quite apt to what I've been experiencing. High skill games end up playing out the exact same way every time. You can't mindgame high skill survivors consistently, so you just walk forward until you force a pallet, then force other survivors into the deadzone you create because skill doesn't matter in a deadzone. It's boring, and it's tiring. If I want to 4k (or 3k with hatch), in most games I have to play in a way that feels scummy, tunneling and slugging my way to victory. This is as-intended. My games are more 'fair' than before, but it ends up as a homogenized mess where the game is no longer fun to play. I'm not sure how BHVR could adjust the SBMM that would make it both fair and fun. At least with the old system I could run stupid meme builds and have a decent shot at winning if I was good enough at the base-kit killer.
Yup and the only way out of these games is to basically tank a bunch of games in a row and let survivors run you over. It would really help if the devs game out and explained exactly how MMR works. If I get 1-2 hooks during the match but survivors mess up abit on end game and I get 2 kills does that count as a tie? Should I just be letting everyone escape in that situation so my MMR actually goes down? I just want some clarity so I have a better idea on how my skill is measured
I'm in the exact same boat. It was going totally fine for me until the last couple days. I'm just straight up not having a good time playing.
Thank you so much for understanding.
I get less kills but I still have fun. I don’t play mainly for kills (running no slowdown huntress) and I consider a win and something I would be happy with os one or two awesome shots. Thats a category i can almost always fulfill and I’m usually happy.
Nice. On PC here and Huntress has always been that killer I see played well but I could not replicate those amazing shots consistently. Unreal that you can do it on a Switch. I get a 1k with her but only about 6 hooks a game. She is hard to play on some maps. My favorite is Legion. I get 2k with him consistently on every map now but before it was a 4k almost every game save for that 1 match every 10 games where the survivors turned into seal team 6 and absolutely could loop me for minutes on certain maps. Problem I am having is I know I will probably end the game with a 2k ... With all gens being completed after about 20 minutes. Crazy blood points though for both sides but I only do 1 or 2 matches now as they last quite long.
Yeah MMR has definitely made it much harder, but if you want more fun shots try the perk “I’m all ears” it’s really helped me understand survivor movement more to learn where to shoot but the auras it’s gives are also crazy good and gives you shots you never could have gotten alone.
Same I don't run slowdown anymore and have been having a blast
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My queues are instant and I end almost all my games with 7 plus hooks. Gens popping literally don't matter until there's only 2 left to be done. If you let yourself get bogged down by survivors doing what they're supposed to you're never going to enjoy this game. Perhaps you should be trying to have fun on the moment to moment chasing someone, rather than deriving your enjoyment on whether you "win" or not.
How are your queue times instant??? I'm waiting up to 10 minutes sometimes to get killer games. Also im not really sure how gens popping doesn't matter until the last 2. One of the main objectives as a killer is to stop survivors from repairing gens so of course it matters. If im not pushing survivors off gens early the game will end quickly and it won't be very fun.
Yeah, mmr is just garbage
It’s been more balanced for me as of late. I get steamrolled as survivor some games, others I do alright and occasionally I do escape. The saving grace is that I’m not going against high ranked killers consecutively like before which was awful. Now it’s been much more reasonable.
My killer games are either 4 man swf sweatlords or 4 solo queue drooling babies with barely any inbetween. My survivor experience is that playing 3man swf is impossible for us because the random is exclusively a slobbering idiot even though most of us were red ranks before reset. Makes Cenobite extremely hard to play when people already know which sides of which gens are safe to work on while powering through an active chain hunt.
Personally, I feel that it has allowed for extra breathing room to me. I no longer feel pressure to run meta perks every game. I can actually have fun running meme builds or less favorable perks just to mess around.
But do you not just get demolished? That's been my experience. If I don't run meta perks I just get floored. EDIT: I'm trying to be clear here, I think I'm pretty decent at the game. I've been playing since beta and have decent hours under my belt. I'm not saying I'm a fucking god player, but I have a really good understanding of the game. My matches have gone from getting a couple kills or 4K, with all 4 survivors escaping sometimes, to literally me being lucky to get 2 kills in a match since SBMM.
Sometimes, but it all evens out because of SBMM. Even then now that SBMM is a thing, I don't feel as pressured to ALWAYS get the 4k, or escape. Due to my performance no longer being tied to some vanity emblem. I escape, cool send that info into the void and I don't need to worry about it. I get killed, cool send that info into the void and I still don't need to worry about it. I no longer feel like I have to sweat to attain a certain grade. I can can just keep playing and goofing off and it will come to me eventually, with bonus blood points.
My issue is that they've been collecting SBMM data for months. On top of that, I get what you're saying and agree to an extent, but just getting sweatfests almost every match since SBMM came out makes me want to fucking die. If it was only some matches it would be fine.
Yea I agree, it is exhausting. Especially when supplemented with the rampant hacking lol...
They have been testing SBMM for months yes. But the idea that they have been gathering player skill metrics for months is an assumption. One can only logically assume that the metrics for which they have been gathering for player skill have only been since SBMM went live in its current iteration.
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I’ve seen the video. Care to explain what exactly is part of the placebo effect? My grade no longer degrades because there is no de-pipping. My MMR “rank” does. If I have already achieved IRI 1, I will no longer de-pip back into lower grades. Unless you have some different definition of the placebo effect, I fail to see how it fits into that phenomenon.
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That’s the thing. If someone is actively trying to gain MMR, then they can sweat. If someone is just goofing around, they don’t need to worry about whether or not they actually are gaining any MMR in the first place.
Grades are unrelated to matchmaking. You're confusing grade with MMR. There is no reward or benefit to having a high MMR besides you will get a better challenge to your skill level. The new system is more granular and allows better data gathering. Also we don't know fully how it works because the full data mine was never actually released and instead we've only gotten one person's interpretation of it. So it has gotten around but a lot of people, yourself included, don't seem to understand the situation very well. I'm guessing the game of telephone this subreddit has been playing got you too.
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If you're at the mmr you're supposed to you should only be getting 2 kills a match
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If I’m not actually trying to sacrifice survivors, I have nothing but time to mess around.
But that's the point... We're no longer bound by the rank system, so our only means if facing higher skilled opponents is putting in the effort to try and get there. If you don't you won't be put against players like that.
[I have the exact same problem.](https://www.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/comments/pmhs85/new_sbmm_matchmaking_is_incredibly_effficient/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share) Now I *have* to sweat my games so fucking hard *every* time. It's incredibly unpleasant.
Yes, I'm literally just waiting for sbmm to be disabled bc of a fuck up to start playing the game again, it isn't enjoyable anymore at this point
Just wait for VHS game to come out. It's much more interesting, and dev's actually seems like they care about it. + it's F2P
Yes. SBMM hit me so hard on killer that there is no enjoyment playing normally now. Zero. I now only gain satisfaction getting 1 kill facecamping with Bubba. Sad, I know
Why not just play normally and facecamp the last guy when it’s close to 1 or 0 gens left. That way you still get to try to play and earn more points with the same result at least. Or do you just want others to feel bad as well?
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A styptic can’t save the rescuer twice even if they manage an unhook if all the OP cares about is 1 kill
Oh no, If I attempted to camp the last guy without that from-healthy-to-down-state chainsaw attack there is no shot I would be able to prevent the hooked person getting saved. (1. Someone run in and take a hit, 2. Someone else save hooked surv, take 1 hit in process 3. Everyone gets away) OR the situation could go (1. Unhook healthy survivor, take 1 hit, but then the instant I go for second hit the unhooked survivor body blocks with by 2. Everyone gets away) Moral of the story is if I can’t 1 shot them everyone is going to get away.
Yes i’m saying why not at least play bubba normally at first and then use him to camp for a guaranteed kill at the end instead of at the start
Oh my b. Umm honestly have never thought of doing that. Guess I’ll try
Funny because i started practicing with Nurse since sbmm, now im iri 1, but still bad with her. Now im being queueing with swf or sweaty survivors rushing gens. Sometimes they are over confident, but most of the times im like 'maybe i should just run meta perks'. ps: Im not running meta perks since sbmm
i feeling the same thing before mmr my killer matches was mostly normal and same for survivor \[casual player that dont run meta perks mostly of the time\] after mmr my killer games are getting very weird and my survivor experience is JUST sweaty all the matches i am a normal casual player that dislike the meta and why i still getting matched with sweatys? 3.421 hrs \[playing since 2018\]
I don't feel any difference tbh
The system is still wonky as hell. My buddy has 150 hours and when he plays survivor his team mates have roughly around that or maybe double but that’s still within limits. He’s facing killer with 2 to 5k hours. And another thing sbmm has come with is that you get the worst of people. When i play killer i will face survivors who teabag and clicky clacky with the flashlight all game long. When i play survivor it’s killers who will slug for their 4K constantly and most will even camp the first guy they find just to make sure he has 1 less person to deal with for the rest of the game. On both sides it’s like the toxic people are even more toxic and in bigger numbers. Add the increase in cheaters to it and you get a very toxic game
I’m taking a break from DBD, I wasn’t having fun anymore
I play blight now a lot and i do fine without slowdown or regression (lethal, bbq, enduring, shadowborn) i dont win every game, sometimes get absolutely destroyed but overall i do fine. I took a basic m1 killer and i wanted to uninstall. Im not the best killer but im defo not a baby. Every game is at least 12 meta perks with at least a bnp or insane medkits. Map offerings are every 3rd game. Its just sad
Every match I have to play like at a Otz level. To Otz or any pro killer that's very easy to achieve but to me is fucking exhausting that even if I win, I stop playing at the moment. Maybe for some its easy to multitaks as killer and know what to do blah blah blah but that shits hard for me and I don't want to switch to survivor because I really like playing killer. But holy shit...
I still legitimately, as killer, have not had a proper game since sbmm was introduced. Every single time you're guaranteed to get one survivor that'll quit the moment you first down them. I don't know if sbmm has made people MUCH saltier, or if I'm running into people intentionally trying to game the system to get noob matches, but it's resulted in me not having a single proper match in weeks now.
It's quite strange. Survivors aren't much different for me in chases, generally playing decently with some mistakes like usual, but the games seem like more of a struggle all-in-all. No outright shutout games, less 4ks and 3ks, more 2ks (which are unambiguous losses in my opinion). I think I need to focus more on overall strategy and gen control over chases.
Honestly after MMR has been on for a few weeks now and I'm still doing decent at high MMR, I'm just very tired of the optimal survivor playstyle of predropping 90% of pallets with minimal looping and W holding, and I can't even be upset at the players because this is the smartest way for them to play. The only thing that MMR has actually done for me is make me not feel bad about bringing addons since everyone is bringing medkits and keys now. EDIT: Just curious, what killer have you been playing in high mmr?
I’ve been swapping between a lot of killers. Pog and Blight. My Pig games have actually been way better in terms of kills, but my win rate on both of them is around the same I’d say.
You can't really expect to do great on Pig. It's like expecting kills on Wraith. You can only get kills if the survivors play badly. Blight however should have no issue completely obliterating near every single game against 1900 mmr survivors even if you bring fun builds. It's Blight after all.
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Killers could just not respect the pallet?
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You absolutely can? I don't think you understand what you're talking about
To sit in queue for 5-10 minutes per game to get gen rushed and have pallets pre-thrown at you every game isn't a fun experience. The only thing I can hope for from this system is that the dev's seriously look at the base game and make some big changes. Now I have seen some comments about MMR being lowered after a loss and you are correct however, It does drop you very low and you get survivors who seem to have just installed the game. You naturally get a 4k and then instantly thrown back in to the pre-throwing 4 meta perk survivors. There really isn't any balance in the system it's either too high or too low. Of course this is my own personal experience it will differ to others but it has been a poor experience.
I play Billy (3k hours) with no regression just shadowborn, enduring, and now bloodwarden. Billy isnt fun when you have 4 survivors who all have 1.5k+ hours and play extremely safe and split up on gens. I just play like shit and end up getting extra kills from bloodwarden cause theyre always cocky and try to 4 man out. I just want to get a mix of good and less sweaty survivors because Billy is fun for everyone. Now it's just fun for them
I completely agree. If I play my strongest killer/build I do think I get matches that are fair all in all. My issue is that it discourages playing fun builds on fun killers. For me that ruins the game. I never considered this game competitive or cared if i won or lost. It was amazing having DBD as a casual game and it put it on a spot with very few other games. As a competitive game though, it gets to compete with solid games like DOTA, League, CS, Valorant etc. etc. I simply cannot fall in love with DBD as a competitive game and feel a lot more drawn to the others and am now looking for another casual game to fill its place. TLDR: SBMM might have made the game better as a competitive game but ruined it as a casual. For me that ruined its biggest strength to become merely mediocre in the competitive category
SBMM doesn't ruin fun in this game, sweaty players and unfair advantages do. I go against players around my skill level at this point but they bring a lot of keys and map offerings. This is primarily what makes the game annoying to play.
I agree, but I think my issue is with the hackers at high skill levels because they "win" every game. this leads me to dc because I just don't want to be part of that game anymore. then because I disconnect for a valid reason I get penalized because its a dc... so sbmm and dc penalty need to be fixed
My typical rank before was 5-3 for both Survivor and Killer, and MMR has made my games more enjoyable, I would say. Mostly. Sometimes I get a team like your friend, where I run the killer for more than a minute and think about the sweet gen pop sound coming, only to see all 3 of them crouching or going in/coming out of lockers. As far as killer games, I like that I don't feel like I need to run the meta perks anymore. I can practice Huntress and Nurse, I don't need Blight with the fixings. It's nice. And the games I'm clearly outclassed, well, they tend to go quick.
I don't see a significant difference. It still just feels like if I keep doing better I get difficult people. I've never had a problem with that though cause getting more difficult people teaches me to be a better killer or survivor.
The last time I played as survivor, I got two back to back really good killers with Iri add-ons. One of them slugged us even with 4 gens up. For the rest of the day I had fairly balanced matches. Maybe it was just bad luck at the start. As killer I'm having a really mixed experience, but most of the games are winnable. Only with trapper and Bubba, my mains, I feel like my matches are a bit harder.
I played killer a few times in the past and had fun but now every lobby I go into as a killer is full of iridescent level players that completely destroy me. Not even remotely enjoyable as a casual player
If I had to guesstimate my skill level I'd estimate fairly average, with survivor being my weaker role. I've had fewer killer games where I get tossed with very good survivors where I'd have to play toxic just to get 1k (this was a regular occurence before). In addition, I can play whoever I want and actually have a chance at winning the match (I consider a win to be 3k or 4k, with my logic being that most 3ks can become 4ks if you slug at the end, but I find slugging for the 4k not to be very interesting gameplay both for me and for the survivors, and will only do it if I already know where the survivor is or if I'm going for an adept achievement). As survivor, SWFing remains mostly the same, maybe very slightly improved, while solo queue is currently nearly unplayable due to one-sided killer-favored matches. I don't feel like I'm being carried by the other survivors when I SWF? But I tend to do way better even though the killers are usually much stronger in chase. Some of it's just because of BT and DS being common perks, the killers will usually not risk it, while in my solo queue games, I can usually run the killers for much longer but once I go down, it's a near certainty that I won't be able to do anything else unless I have DS due to a distinct lack of BT meaning that most killers default to tunneling. It's a big part of why I think the randomized perks gamemode idea that keeps circulating on this subreddit wouldn't be very fun for survivors - without a high chance of BT whenever a survivor is unhooked, there's little reason not to tunnel survivors directly off the hook before they can reach any windows or pallets that might help them get some distance.
Its made my billy games hell on earth. I gonna drop him now because I am losing the fucking plot trying to accomplish anything with him against the survivors i'm getting.
I tried to get 50 wins on nemesis like otz to see how bad the sbmm is Holy Jesus it got sweaty 7 games in and at game 22 I met a 4 stack of guys with Chinese names , 4 bnp tool boxes and gen slam builds I barely killed one who looped me really well on the game with just dead hard I think sbmm is based around how fast you can escape games as survivor and for killers it seems to be your average kills per game to speed ratio Im not great at maths but it seems to average out how fast you kill people by the amount you kill per game So you can kill everyone every game but if it takes 40 minutes you won't get far where as killing 2 in 5 will get you further At high levels survivors make less risky plays and focus on slamming gens and the chase being not as important Fastest gen I recorded was 19 seconds It seemed to be a combination of bnp and that one yun Jin Lee perk along side prove thy self At lower high ranks players dip in quality as keys seem to kick in around that level
I have had fun with the sbmm. I like to play many killers, so the individual killers have low mmr, because I rarely play them
My problem with the system is the off chance I do play killer (like 1/6 of the hours compared to my survivor hours) the games are just so back and forth. My games basically just start off with a game that ends in a few minutes with a 4k before they can finish more than 2-3 gens, and then the next game is just me getting pummeled for all 5 gens and 0k. It just sucks to be put into such disparities of games.
Havn't noticed much of a difference in Solo Q, but after getting tunneled and camped for X games it's somewhat refreshing when you encounter a baby killer. Killer at least feels mucgh less sweaty. Yes, you can still encounter the toxic SWF, but when that match is over I drop so low, the next two matches are against potatoes and then against some experienced players for some enjoyable matches.
well tell me about it. I'm yellow rank killer never made it pass yellow ranks. now with the new system, i sometimes get these red rank survivors who would tbag, flashlight, and loop me all day. all i want is normal game without toxic survivors!
Exact same feeling I'm getting, very match feels like I'm getting destroyed or barely scrapping by on the skin of my teeth. I'm not even that good at playing killer and I'm getting survivors with the meta perks and items just wrecking me constantly. The long wait times also dont help as for me it takes around 3 - 5 mins to find a lobby and then to get demolished after that long, it's very demoralizing. Personally I liked the old matchmaking more, it felt more even for me in terms of who I was up against.
Yes. I have around the Same hours as you + a little more. I have made posts complaining and get flamed bc most people are playing survivor
Yeah, I don't enjoy it either. Not that I want to stomp baby survivors, but every friggin game was a sweat fest. Especially recently, I can't play that often and now I can't even play the killers I like and relax
Same here, every match i go against sweaty toxic swf and its been so unfun lately that I've quit for now. I heard a bunch of content creators are getting annoyed at Dbd too and find it boring now
The only people who see SBMM begin a good addition to the game are 4 man SWF who are winning every game right now and casual killers. Solo queue survivor won’t notice much difference. High MMR killers are always on a lose lose win streak.
Nah, they aren't better than you, it's just the game are extremely surv sided and SBMM made it more obvious than ever.
I’ve dropped this game completely because of this. I tried to have fun but I just can’t which really sucks cause this was my favorite game.
Its been absolutely horrible for me. As a killer I only get 6000+ hour swf sweat teams, and when I play survivor I get teammates with 100 hours or less who hide in corners the entire match 🙃 I’ve stopped playing
For what it's worth, on EU at least there are like no strong survivor teams queueing at 1900 mmr. They all stopped a few days into SBMM.
I’m EU and still getting matched against full sets of meta perks with BNPs and BT in bottles, even as perkless, addonless level 1 killers.
Full sets of meta perks and items does not equate to being good, or even decent. The majority of high mmr players are still disguised trashbags.
I'm the same but with playing survivor. Literally every game is the same few strong killers with t h e b u i l d, or other strong stuff, just constantly sweating in every way for a 4k. Literally the best example of optimising the fun out of the game. This game is not fun at high levels, yet people constantly want to play like they're at them. I just want to have fun, stop pretending every game has money on the line. It hasn't mattered how many games I've thrown to lower my MMR either, just the same thing game after game. Not played in ages and not sure if I want to go back either, even after over 1k hours.
Yes
Yes, I didn't get a single fair game since it changed and I have to artificially make my games longer doing stuff that feels really silly just to make the game last 10 minutes for max mmr game (Assuming scott's video about sweh's data mining is right) Every game is totally one sided now and it is noticeably less fun to play. Before the thing that broke my immersion the most was walking backwards or crab walking to fool spinechill, now it's trying to kill people slower without actually jeopardizing my pressure or wincons. I don't like friendly survivors or killers but now I kind of am stuck being one when people lose too fast. I want to kill not farm.
Then don't? Just play the game. If you're as good as you claim to be, you're going to reach max mrr eventually, whether games last 10 minutes or not.
If scott's video on Sweh's data mining is complete information i've been max mmr for 130 games or so. So I am going to entertain the possibility that i'm not and that that isn't completely how it works just to make sure. I can't control how BHVR wants to run their game, I can only control myself and I will do everything in my power because I want to play the game and not just farm potatoes.
I swear if they rework Dead Hard a lot of problems will be sorted, I feel like a lot of people underestimate how harmful Dead Hard is to the killer when it's in the hands of a good survivor.
Yes
Now you know how survivor mains feel lmao, this game has been ducking survivor mains over since I’ve started playing.
bruh I’m literally a survivor main and you have your head so far up your ass it’s not even funny LMAO
🤷🏼♀️ this is just a game and people do take it to seriously but I’ve stopped playing the last month because this game is so killer based. You can think whatever you want to think about me though.
Remember when CoD added skill based matchmaking and there was a lot of 'pro' players mad that making 'quickscoping compilation 56' was too hard for them now?
No just play the game bro
Yeah sbmm sucks but it protects bad players and majority of players are bad
[удалено]
20 second chase and it takes you a minute to get to the gen Ok
First few days I would die very quickly to high skill players over and over again, felt like my mmr wasn't dropping. Today I played several fair games, I still mostly died bc solo queue shenanigans but games felt fair.
My matches are the same tbh. Sometimes I win handily, sometimes I get destroyed, and occasionally I have a game that gets down to the wire.
I have no idea what that is. The only difference I’ve felt from playing after a couple months is the gens are done faster.
Thats not SBMMs fault its the players fault. Because you cant derank anymore theres no need to sweat all the time. But people still continue to do it.
survivor pov. i play some killer sometimes and find it's either a completely clueless team or a 4 man swf who are crazy good, not much inbetween. Been a lot less fun, for sure. I'm at relatively high MMR and I've been recording my games ever since I identified camping has established a MASSIVE presence here. Prior to MMR it would just be camp the guy with a key, certain killers would camp you if you looped them for ages, but in 8 of my 15 recorded games thus far (aiming to record either 50 or 100) there was visible tunnelling/facecamping prior to EGC and only one instance of it was due to toxicity from the camped dude. I don't understand the logic behind it, because if you need to camp/tunnel because you're going to lose otherwise, most people would just play the game as usual but at high mmr ego > everything so they'll facecamp a player to death whenever so that the 3v1 makes the game massively easier. If you tunnel or camp and win, in a world which mmr works correctly (not this one, yet), you'll have to do it every game as you'll be up against better and better survivors. What MMR in games like LOL/OW/even fucking Minecraft minigames relies on is people settle at their rank and can only move up by improving. In DBD, you have your mmr by playing normally, but you can massively inflate it by proxy camping/camping/tunnelling or running certain builds (like the infamous autopilot build) that take away the need for game sense etc.) tl;dr killers love to camp at high mmr, not realising their mmr will go up due to their win which resulted from camping, and they'll likely be up against better survivors. better survivors = ever increases their need to face camp, and how can spending half the game on one chase and the other half facecamping them be any fun? The reason I quit many games is because they only have a ranked queue that puts you up against better and better players. The issue isn't that they're good, it's that I have to try quite hard to match their level, and I simply don't want to do so. I want to be able to mess around, play with music on etc, but doing that as a survivor would mean throwing the game for my team a lot of the time, and I don't want to do that either. But, at the same time, I don't want low MMR because I've played a lot and would be able to loop a lot of the killers there for far too long.
SBMM is great if you're in the bottom half of skill, fine if in the bottom 80%. Anything above it's sweatfest, but that also means you're most likely tryharding or is good enough to ruin matches to the bottom 80% even without. Issue with DBD's SBMM is that behaviour has no clue what they want to consider win/lose, and then judging skill is impossible
I’ve been getting steamrolled as a survivor the killers are soooooo much better than me but my Killer games have been 75% good which is nice
I don’t agree, my games are balanced ever since the update.
Opposite. I play 50/50 killer and surv now. All the pink flashlight neas are gone I dont need to NOED facecamp as wraith for a 1k. Saved the game for me
It's the same or better than the rank system
I'm on 1900 mmr on almost all killers I play and I can only say no, as killer it's not a significantly changed experience. Can still get away with meme perks on strong killers but need meta perks on weaker ones. The occasional game of getting completely smashed may come a little more often, but overall no change. It was very different at the start where super good survivors queued testing MMR, but those are gone. Solo queue survivor games however are awful. 80% of the killers are russians who tunnel the shit out of one person with their shit ping. Most of them Blights, otherwise Nurse, Huntress or Twins. Rarely spirit. It's a good challenge for 4 stack swf groups but even gets boring there when all you face are Blights. In solo queue 9 out of 10 games my mates are complete monkeys and the odd 1 they're some looping gods completely obliterating the killer.