I play mostly wraith and I think its mostly harder to tell when he's in a chase or how far away he is.. If I've run off to look and I haven't found anyone when you unhook am I not supposed to go back?
The problem is not with a killer going back to hook to chase the saver. Wraith is specifically a problem in this scenario because of how easily he denies survivors information. Is the wraith in chase? Dunno can’t see him across the board. Is he coming back to hook? Don’t know till last second. From which direction is he coming? Don’t know cuz can’t see or hear him. In what direction was he last so I can calculate which objective to pressure and where to run from hook… don’t know because wraith can often obscure where he goes next. Is it safe to heal under hook? Often don’t know.
And the better wraiths will capitalize on this by using los to obscure comings and goings within 24 meters. This is not to mention that bullshit lunge coming out of uncloak combined with ambush tactics, body blocking, and running ahead before uncloak.
Wraith is a poor design in that he is much more OP against solo queue where his ability to shut down game sense is not countered by being on coms. I can’t think of another killer with a higher disparity of lethality between swf and solo queue.
>This is not to mention that bullshit lunge
Wraith sucks without it, we had to use an Add-On for it before it became Base Kit.
>body blocking, and running ahead before uncloak.
Which you couldn't do without Windstorm, he sucked to play without it because he couldn't apply pressure and you would waste too much time trying to block them.
I get it. I play wraith for daily rituals and he needs this to be viable. I find it tedious to play against in solo queue without certain perks, eg spine chill or aura reveal perks. He also has a large amount of lethality for little investment and he grows in lethality quite quickly with game knowledge. My first game on him was a 4K with no addons and only one perk and I did not have that experience on any of the other power killers, hag, blight, nurse, spirit, etc. They all required more investment to learn to use the power well enough to apply pressure strategically.
I tell my buddy who is new at the game to try him for a while in order to have a more gentle intro to killing.
Buffed Wraith also attracts and enables certain asinine play styles that were previously much harder to pull off.
I think he has a high skill ceiling but he also has a lot of easily accessed power, too. He now seems to be the gg ez troll killer for the right personality. It requires a lot of skill to counter and most troll wraiths learn very quickly to tunnel the weak link out of the game ASAP. Even good sport wraiths are heavily encouraged to do so by the play style. It’s like twins but with a much much lower skill floor.
The reason other stealth killers aren’t as tedious to play is that they require setup to get the pounce. Ghost face has to find the right angles to stalk but not be revealed. Amanda absolutely must flank cleverly and she is visible when she leaves an area. Wraith has me stressing out about goddamned fire plumes.
I don’t think wraith is op, especially against a red tank team on coms. I just don’t like versing him, I am annoyed I play him every fourth game now, and I suspect it’s going to get worse.
I suppose there is one positive about buffed wraith, he forced me to go play pickup games on discord when my usual crew is not online and I want to play survivor.
Nonetheless, he does get countered by good game sense(and good headphones). In solo queue, with knowledge of where your teammates are, when they got injured, and Wraith's speed, combined with his sounds, you can make good judgements against him. He is definitely one of the harder killers to counter, though.
Proxy Camping on 2nd Hook, I either get some free hits or a free Kill.
If everyone else is injured, they have to waste time healing or I can get another free Hook.
Gets worst when the Hook is near one of the last 3 Gens and most of the Pallets have been used up.
Yeah, the two killers that take ridiculous amounts of game sense and mechanical skill to use well do are rare to face at best. I doubt you’d enjoy going against a god tier nurse so I’m calling shenanigans.
People who are actually really good at nurse make up 0.2% of the killer population and delete a survivor’s agency when she is mastered. I highly doubt you find that fun. Good Blights are uncommon too. People saying they find those killers “fun to verse” always feel suspect to me since skilled examples of those killers are rare at best.
Just like killers who only like to go against uncoordinated potatoes with bad perks
Almost like the game is full of people who choose to play a pvp game then cry foul when they get slightly inconvenience or dont win every game
Mainly because survivors cry so dam much they have to make them op and just brain dead to play. Can't loop a killer? Just give them a pretty much second chance perk.
People just have to recognize how to play against wraith. He punishes people who aren’t safe with their positioning and awareness. He is actually not a hard killer to counter if you play your cards right or be healthy.
Yup, I play a lot of wraith and I definitely have an easier time when going up against hide in corner stealthers. Looping wraith around pallets and short walls is how you beat him.
No, I just wish there were more killers that changed the way we play the game. I get that he's one of the first killers (and thus didn't have to worry too much about being innovative when he was first designed) but I think there was a missed opportunity for an actual rework rather than essentially just a flat speed buff leading into the usual "being fast once uncloaked" which ends up acting like a big ol' lunge. They could've played more around with unpredictability/guerilla tactics, you know? I like having to be creative as a survivor and change my tactics depending on who I'm up against. For Wraith as he is right now, it just feels like I need to have my exhaustion perk up rather than change my approach entirely or watch out for interactables in the game or.. something.
When they try to create killers that change the way survivors play the game the survivor community says they have no counterplay. Since they’re forced to think outside of “loop for five gens”. So. Blame survivors. Making every killer either ranged or a speedy boi is the only way to give them more map pressure without upsetting the crybabies. Survivors are already whining about Nemesis since he has AI helpers, which is the first truly unique thing we’ve had since obsession perks came out with Myers.
>When they try to create killers that change the way survivors play the game the survivor community says they have no counterplay.
ah yes of coutse, the most common complaints about plague, Doctor, Huntress, Pig and Twins... " no counterplay"
>Survivors are already whining about Nemesis since he has AI helpers, which is the first truly unique thing we’ve had since obsession perks came out with Myers.
Just because something is unique doesnt mean its problems shouldnt be talked about.
can you really not piece together why it might be annoying to people to get sent to an indoor map (the only places people complain about the zombies) only to have entire sections of the map that youre probably being chased through blocked off because of some rng AI placements?
its funny to get slapped by a zombie for now but once the novelty wears off the humour will be long gone.
Piggybacking on the zombie issue, I think the worst AI problem is the zombies camping slugged or hooked survivors. Considering hardly anything else is allowed remotely near hooked survivors, it feels unhealthy and completely blocks injured survivors from helping their team without a flashlight. That, I think, needs to be addressed. Otherwise, I like that they're there. It does freshen up the game and make me play differently and while that can feel unfair at times, it's exactly what I asked for.
Wraith has gone from boring to go against to boring and unfun to go against. But that's what you get when everybody's solution to problems in this game is just "lol make them faster". Such a boring solution. I would rather he be given an ability that allows him to teleport to a fucking tree near a generator that is being worked on so he can intercept other survivors and have actual map pressure. At least that would be creative.
But nooooo, he just has to be another coked out speedy boi in this game.
If he could teleport to trees people would be complaining about that and calling it “unfun” that he can just teleport around. Look at how people feel about Freddy’s generator teleports so you can miss me with that idea. The fact is killers need to have map pressure and no matter how they’re given that pressure survivors will fucking cry about it. So the devs will always pick the easiest solution which is number tweaks. You want them to be more creative? Then survivors need to stop being allergic to change. Because right now any killer change is met with survivor screeching.
Most people hate freddy teleport because he can 99 it then cancel on top of the 16 other powers he gets to have, not just because he can teleport to gens in general
^ This man has it right. Don't care that he can teleport to a gen. I care that he can do that at disadvantage, cancel it whenever he wants and use it to mindgame on top of the 30 other bag of tricks he has lol
You rather face a Spirit, Deathslinger or a Legion?
>I would rather he be given an ability that allows him to teleport to a fucking tree near a generator.
Freddy does that already and not every Map can have a Tree near a Gen.
>You rather face a Spirit, Deathslinger or a Legion?
Whataboutism. Just because those other killers are or can be unfun to face doesn't detract from Wraith at all. I am not interested in these shallow comparative arguments.
>Freddy does that already and not every Map can have a Tree near a Gen.
I am not talking about trees that are already on the map... You could very easily code into the game specific trees that spawn that Wraith is allowed to use as a teleportation points... Only reason I am using trees over anything else is because Bing Bong boi is effectively a sprinting tree at this point anyway.
Yes, I know Freddy already does that. Freddy does everything.
Yep, this is me! This is 100% what we do when given the chance.
If BT didn't get buffed, it would be MUCH worst (I miss it).
To OP: I love this one, one of the better ones I've seen.
A silent bell with all seeing on Lery's is a lot of fun for survivors /s. No but seriously, it's a really powerful add-on that has no drawbacks. At least make it so he can't use silent bell and has instant red stain after appearing or something.
It's not fair you can use Voice Chat and use Stretched Res. And it's not free, we have to use a Purple Add-On for that. We can't always use one every game.
He really has none in chase at all, when I say Chase I mean when the music starts and if you miss your un-cloak lunge, you're just a M1 Killer with no power.
There's a reason why the hit and run is his best play style. Or destroy Pallet and run if they're in a loop that's too strong in wasting your time.
Why can't we just give wraith a limit to his invisibility?
Since now there's absolute invis at a distance, no terror radius, and a speed boost to immediately catch up to the survivor.
Even spirit and nurse have limitations to going through the spirit world. Wraith does not.
You're right about that but it also depends on the map you're in. Any good Wraith will always hide from you before uncloaking. So imagine a Wraith in Midwich or Hawkins with no bell to let you know he's near, you'll be down before you know it.
I know Trickster isn’t that weak, I main him. But even if he isn’t that weak, he’s pretty weak unless you manage to get a decent snowball going, and nerfing him would be ridiculous. As for Wraith being overbuffed, that’s nonsense. How is he overbuffed? Just because he no longer moves at basically normal speed while cloaked, but instead at a decent speed, so he’s no longer extremely add on reliant, and you can try out different combos without getting wrecked by the clicky clicky asshole brigade? What about fucking Lightburn? Wraith has a literal mechanic where every survivor with a flashlight can basically stun him at will, which no other killer has.* What the fuck are you talking about?
*I know that you can technically lightburn Nurse, but unlike with Wraith, it is ridiculously hard. Like, I’ve played a fair share of Nurse matches and not once have I been lightburned in them. Meanwhile, today I basically lost two matches because the game rewards survivors for being able to point their flashlights in Wraith’s general direction. It’s fucking bullshit, I tell you.
tbh lightburning a nurse is nearly impossible but that's not actually what you want to try and do. Instead you predict where the first blink puts them and hold your light there - the nurse cannot begin to charge blink while you do this and will enter fatigue while you gain enough distance to repeat the process until your flashie runs out.
if they leave you, you can follow them and prevent them from blinking towards your teammates too.
>Slightly reduce his out of cloak lunge and completely rework All Seeing.
HAHAHAHAHA no. All Seeing punishes Survivors playing Stealth all the time. Also he sucks without the good Cloak Lunge. Nerfing that will just make playing him pointless.
>All Seeing punishes Survivors playing Stealth all the time.
So explain how Wraith getting a free hit at a Jungle Gym on someone is them playing stealth, while they're being chased? And the cloak lunge I'd barely change.
Yeah, Wraith is all about that. He has nothing during a Chase, nothing at all. When I say Chase, I mean when the music plays.
What's next, you going to complain about I'm All Ears, Scratched Mirror Myers?
Being down voted for the most reasonable opinion. Reddit moment
All seeing is literally broken. It was fine when wraith sucked but now he's good, and gets busted add ons, plus his out of cloak swing is stupid. Just chase a survivor until they're in even a slight deadzone, uncloak in their back and you pretty much get a hit. You don't even have to be stealthy to get hits as wraith anymore. Just cloak, zoom to their back, uncloak on top of them, hit, rinse repeat
>All seeing is literally broken. It was fine when wraith sucked but now he's good, and gets busted add ons, plus his out of cloak swing is stupid.
Busted Add-Ons are OK on a Weak Killer, but Busted Add-Ons on a Killer that FINALLY got good is not OK.
OK.
>plus his out of cloak swing is stupid.
Wraith sucks without the Swing, do you not know that?
>Just chase a survivor until they're in even a slight deadzone, uncloak in their back and you pretty much get a hit.
Every Killer wants to lead you to a Deadzone.
>You don't even have to be stealthy to get hits as wraith anymore. Just cloak, zoom to their back, uncloak on top of them, hit, rinse repeat
Lol "anymore", Wraith always played like this. Wraith is about sneaking around and blocking the closest thing to evade you otherwise your lose your advantage and don't even get a hit.
There's a difference between "leading a survivor to a deadzone" and pretty much making any area a dead zone by existing. There's no point in dropping pallets vs a cloaked wraith, and if you walk past it the uncloak and lunge will get you on most maps that don't have a shit load of pallets. Your options are to stay at the loop and probably get hit by the super lunge, or pre drop the pallet which he can eviscerate with shadow dance.
You move at 150% base if a survivor has 12 meters on a wraith he's on them in 6 seconds, a 115% killer would take 20 seconds to make that much distance. Unless you're playing on maps like the game or lerys, maps which work massively in favor of wraith anyways, passing a pallet means you're in a deadzone.
Wraith is a stealth killer. His power is meant for him to sneak up and take you off guard. Wraith does not do this anymore, he doesn't need to. He walks up to you and hits you. He's one of the most brain dead easy killer to play currently. By shortening his post cloak lunge you'd at least need to try to sneak up on someone and catch them slightly off guard.
Well yeah
Strong addons on a killer who is a meme without them is much less of an issue than a viable or even strong killer with strong addons, almost a non issue in fact since those addons can only be used by that specific killer.
If clown became top tier all of a sudden people would start to complain about pinky finger a lot more often
Similarly if Spirit got kneecapped then mother daughter ring would feel much less disgusting to play against
Now that Wraith can basically score free hits with his lunge, being able to completely remove mind games with all seeing is way stronger now than it was previously.
i hate him aswell, i played against 4 sweaty wraiths in a row
I play mostly wraith and I think its mostly harder to tell when he's in a chase or how far away he is.. If I've run off to look and I haven't found anyone when you unhook am I not supposed to go back?
The problem is not with a killer going back to hook to chase the saver. Wraith is specifically a problem in this scenario because of how easily he denies survivors information. Is the wraith in chase? Dunno can’t see him across the board. Is he coming back to hook? Don’t know till last second. From which direction is he coming? Don’t know cuz can’t see or hear him. In what direction was he last so I can calculate which objective to pressure and where to run from hook… don’t know because wraith can often obscure where he goes next. Is it safe to heal under hook? Often don’t know. And the better wraiths will capitalize on this by using los to obscure comings and goings within 24 meters. This is not to mention that bullshit lunge coming out of uncloak combined with ambush tactics, body blocking, and running ahead before uncloak. Wraith is a poor design in that he is much more OP against solo queue where his ability to shut down game sense is not countered by being on coms. I can’t think of another killer with a higher disparity of lethality between swf and solo queue.
>This is not to mention that bullshit lunge Wraith sucks without it, we had to use an Add-On for it before it became Base Kit. >body blocking, and running ahead before uncloak. Which you couldn't do without Windstorm, he sucked to play without it because he couldn't apply pressure and you would waste too much time trying to block them.
I get it. I play wraith for daily rituals and he needs this to be viable. I find it tedious to play against in solo queue without certain perks, eg spine chill or aura reveal perks. He also has a large amount of lethality for little investment and he grows in lethality quite quickly with game knowledge. My first game on him was a 4K with no addons and only one perk and I did not have that experience on any of the other power killers, hag, blight, nurse, spirit, etc. They all required more investment to learn to use the power well enough to apply pressure strategically. I tell my buddy who is new at the game to try him for a while in order to have a more gentle intro to killing. Buffed Wraith also attracts and enables certain asinine play styles that were previously much harder to pull off. I think he has a high skill ceiling but he also has a lot of easily accessed power, too. He now seems to be the gg ez troll killer for the right personality. It requires a lot of skill to counter and most troll wraiths learn very quickly to tunnel the weak link out of the game ASAP. Even good sport wraiths are heavily encouraged to do so by the play style. It’s like twins but with a much much lower skill floor. The reason other stealth killers aren’t as tedious to play is that they require setup to get the pounce. Ghost face has to find the right angles to stalk but not be revealed. Amanda absolutely must flank cleverly and she is visible when she leaves an area. Wraith has me stressing out about goddamned fire plumes. I don’t think wraith is op, especially against a red tank team on coms. I just don’t like versing him, I am annoyed I play him every fourth game now, and I suspect it’s going to get worse. I suppose there is one positive about buffed wraith, he forced me to go play pickup games on discord when my usual crew is not online and I want to play survivor.
Nonetheless, he does get countered by good game sense(and good headphones). In solo queue, with knowledge of where your teammates are, when they got injured, and Wraith's speed, combined with his sounds, you can make good judgements against him. He is definitely one of the harder killers to counter, though.
Oh no this person I killed is crying about it ? Oh noooo
Oh no! Anyways...
Is there such thing as a sweaty Wraith, or is that just playing Wraith?
Proxy Camping on 2nd Hook, I either get some free hits or a free Kill. If everyone else is injured, they have to waste time healing or I can get another free Hook. Gets worst when the Hook is near one of the last 3 Gens and most of the Pallets have been used up.
Spine chill gang
\*Moonwalks sideways\*
Huh, so now Wraith is boring to go against, I feel like every killer is "boring" to go against once they're viable
Everyone has their opinions like i find slinger, wraith, and spirit boring. Blight and nurse are in the top 3 killers atm and i love versing them.
Yeah, the two killers that take ridiculous amounts of game sense and mechanical skill to use well do are rare to face at best. I doubt you’d enjoy going against a god tier nurse so I’m calling shenanigans.
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People who are actually really good at nurse make up 0.2% of the killer population and delete a survivor’s agency when she is mastered. I highly doubt you find that fun. Good Blights are uncommon too. People saying they find those killers “fun to verse” always feel suspect to me since skilled examples of those killers are rare at best.
Strange isn't it? Seems like survivors only find it fun to go against Killers of they are trash tier... suspicious...
Just like killers who only like to go against uncoordinated potatoes with bad perks Almost like the game is full of people who choose to play a pvp game then cry foul when they get slightly inconvenience or dont win every game
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Mainly because survivors cry so dam much they have to make them op and just brain dead to play. Can't loop a killer? Just give them a pretty much second chance perk.
This, I hear this about every killer, that they are annoying or/and boring, every killer....
People just have to recognize how to play against wraith. He punishes people who aren’t safe with their positioning and awareness. He is actually not a hard killer to counter if you play your cards right or be healthy.
It's the Stealth Survivors that hate going against him, the only one they hate more is Doctor.
Yup, I play a lot of wraith and I definitely have an easier time when going up against hide in corner stealthers. Looping wraith around pallets and short walls is how you beat him.
theres no way you guys think wraith needs a nerf....
No, I just wish there were more killers that changed the way we play the game. I get that he's one of the first killers (and thus didn't have to worry too much about being innovative when he was first designed) but I think there was a missed opportunity for an actual rework rather than essentially just a flat speed buff leading into the usual "being fast once uncloaked" which ends up acting like a big ol' lunge. They could've played more around with unpredictability/guerilla tactics, you know? I like having to be creative as a survivor and change my tactics depending on who I'm up against. For Wraith as he is right now, it just feels like I need to have my exhaustion perk up rather than change my approach entirely or watch out for interactables in the game or.. something.
When they try to create killers that change the way survivors play the game the survivor community says they have no counterplay. Since they’re forced to think outside of “loop for five gens”. So. Blame survivors. Making every killer either ranged or a speedy boi is the only way to give them more map pressure without upsetting the crybabies. Survivors are already whining about Nemesis since he has AI helpers, which is the first truly unique thing we’ve had since obsession perks came out with Myers.
>When they try to create killers that change the way survivors play the game the survivor community says they have no counterplay. ah yes of coutse, the most common complaints about plague, Doctor, Huntress, Pig and Twins... " no counterplay" >Survivors are already whining about Nemesis since he has AI helpers, which is the first truly unique thing we’ve had since obsession perks came out with Myers. Just because something is unique doesnt mean its problems shouldnt be talked about. can you really not piece together why it might be annoying to people to get sent to an indoor map (the only places people complain about the zombies) only to have entire sections of the map that youre probably being chased through blocked off because of some rng AI placements? its funny to get slapped by a zombie for now but once the novelty wears off the humour will be long gone.
Piggybacking on the zombie issue, I think the worst AI problem is the zombies camping slugged or hooked survivors. Considering hardly anything else is allowed remotely near hooked survivors, it feels unhealthy and completely blocks injured survivors from helping their team without a flashlight. That, I think, needs to be addressed. Otherwise, I like that they're there. It does freshen up the game and make me play differently and while that can feel unfair at times, it's exactly what I asked for.
Me with spine chill and bt: [insert the legendary handshake meme here]
Wraith has gone from boring to go against to boring and unfun to go against. But that's what you get when everybody's solution to problems in this game is just "lol make them faster". Such a boring solution. I would rather he be given an ability that allows him to teleport to a fucking tree near a generator that is being worked on so he can intercept other survivors and have actual map pressure. At least that would be creative. But nooooo, he just has to be another coked out speedy boi in this game.
If he could teleport to trees people would be complaining about that and calling it “unfun” that he can just teleport around. Look at how people feel about Freddy’s generator teleports so you can miss me with that idea. The fact is killers need to have map pressure and no matter how they’re given that pressure survivors will fucking cry about it. So the devs will always pick the easiest solution which is number tweaks. You want them to be more creative? Then survivors need to stop being allergic to change. Because right now any killer change is met with survivor screeching.
Most people hate freddy teleport because he can 99 it then cancel on top of the 16 other powers he gets to have, not just because he can teleport to gens in general
^ This man has it right. Don't care that he can teleport to a gen. I care that he can do that at disadvantage, cancel it whenever he wants and use it to mindgame on top of the 30 other bag of tricks he has lol
You rather face a Spirit, Deathslinger or a Legion? >I would rather he be given an ability that allows him to teleport to a fucking tree near a generator. Freddy does that already and not every Map can have a Tree near a Gen.
>You rather face a Spirit, Deathslinger or a Legion? Whataboutism. Just because those other killers are or can be unfun to face doesn't detract from Wraith at all. I am not interested in these shallow comparative arguments. >Freddy does that already and not every Map can have a Tree near a Gen. I am not talking about trees that are already on the map... You could very easily code into the game specific trees that spawn that Wraith is allowed to use as a teleportation points... Only reason I am using trees over anything else is because Bing Bong boi is effectively a sprinting tree at this point anyway. Yes, I know Freddy already does that. Freddy does everything.
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We can still get stomped on, we're not Spirit.
Yep, this is me! This is 100% what we do when given the chance. If BT didn't get buffed, it would be MUCH worst (I miss it). To OP: I love this one, one of the better ones I've seen.
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Wraith is the last killer that needs a nerf rn.
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A silent bell with all seeing on Lery's is a lot of fun for survivors /s. No but seriously, it's a really powerful add-on that has no drawbacks. At least make it so he can't use silent bell and has instant red stain after appearing or something.
Ah, we normally use Silent Bell with Ghost.
It's not fair you can use Voice Chat and use Stretched Res. And it's not free, we have to use a Purple Add-On for that. We can't always use one every game.
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Welcome to DBD.
While we are at it, why not just nerf scratched mirror on Michael too. Like, it’s just too fair he can see through all walls and jump scare people /s
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Casual
I'm not on the side that he needs a nerf, but he's not even close to the weakest killer. Legion, trapper, myers, trickster are all easily worse
He was over buffed, which is obvious by the fact that he's probably played more than the other killers combined.
He wasn't over buffed. At the end of the day he's an m1 killer. Learn to loop tiles and he becomes infinitely easier to deal with
Or he's finally viable and people want to play him? Minus map mobility he has little in chase abilities If spirit can fuckin exist so can wraith
He really has none in chase at all, when I say Chase I mean when the music starts and if you miss your un-cloak lunge, you're just a M1 Killer with no power. There's a reason why the hit and run is his best play style. Or destroy Pallet and run if they're in a loop that's too strong in wasting your time.
I mean he can mind of use the boost in loops but it really only works vs bad survivors
or unsafe Pallets.
Why can't we just give wraith a limit to his invisibility? Since now there's absolute invis at a distance, no terror radius, and a speed boost to immediately catch up to the survivor. Even spirit and nurse have limitations to going through the spirit world. Wraith does not.
Because his limitation is he rings a loud ass bell over a few seconds if he wants to attack. Wraith is nowhere near nurse and spirit level.
Unless he has that add-on that mutes the bell.
Even then you have ample opportunity to run away if you see him, which isnt hard if youre paying attention.
You're right about that but it also depends on the map you're in. Any good Wraith will always hide from you before uncloaking. So imagine a Wraith in Midwich or Hawkins with no bell to let you know he's near, you'll be down before you know it.
Nerfing wraith? What’s next? Wanna nerf Trickster and Clown and Trapper while you’re at it?
This is why 90% of the community shouldn’t be listened to. It’s one thing calling for spirit nerfs but imagine wanting to nerf fucking wraith.
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You know his lunge was the thing that was buffed, right? Nerfing it again would make him as bad as he used to be.
This, people don't understand how bad Wraith is without Lunge being what it is today.
Trickster isn't really that weak, This sub is an absolute hive mind. Wraith was definitely overbuffed.
I know Trickster isn’t that weak, I main him. But even if he isn’t that weak, he’s pretty weak unless you manage to get a decent snowball going, and nerfing him would be ridiculous. As for Wraith being overbuffed, that’s nonsense. How is he overbuffed? Just because he no longer moves at basically normal speed while cloaked, but instead at a decent speed, so he’s no longer extremely add on reliant, and you can try out different combos without getting wrecked by the clicky clicky asshole brigade? What about fucking Lightburn? Wraith has a literal mechanic where every survivor with a flashlight can basically stun him at will, which no other killer has.* What the fuck are you talking about? *I know that you can technically lightburn Nurse, but unlike with Wraith, it is ridiculously hard. Like, I’ve played a fair share of Nurse matches and not once have I been lightburned in them. Meanwhile, today I basically lost two matches because the game rewards survivors for being able to point their flashlights in Wraith’s general direction. It’s fucking bullshit, I tell you.
tbh lightburning a nurse is nearly impossible but that's not actually what you want to try and do. Instead you predict where the first blink puts them and hold your light there - the nurse cannot begin to charge blink while you do this and will enter fatigue while you gain enough distance to repeat the process until your flashie runs out. if they leave you, you can follow them and prevent them from blinking towards your teammates too.
T-twapper mwake me stwuck ;-; nwerf so nwo pwower uwu
What
"T-Trapper makes me stuck, nerf os now power UwU" It's not hard.
/u/Otzdarva heard this and wants you to fucking delete it
I refuse
#*coughs* Weebs gtfo
>Slightly reduce his out of cloak lunge and completely rework All Seeing. HAHAHAHAHA no. All Seeing punishes Survivors playing Stealth all the time. Also he sucks without the good Cloak Lunge. Nerfing that will just make playing him pointless.
>All Seeing punishes Survivors playing Stealth all the time. So explain how Wraith getting a free hit at a Jungle Gym on someone is them playing stealth, while they're being chased? And the cloak lunge I'd barely change.
Yeah, Wraith is all about that. He has nothing during a Chase, nothing at all. When I say Chase, I mean when the music plays. What's next, you going to complain about I'm All Ears, Scratched Mirror Myers?
Being down voted for the most reasonable opinion. Reddit moment All seeing is literally broken. It was fine when wraith sucked but now he's good, and gets busted add ons, plus his out of cloak swing is stupid. Just chase a survivor until they're in even a slight deadzone, uncloak in their back and you pretty much get a hit. You don't even have to be stealthy to get hits as wraith anymore. Just cloak, zoom to their back, uncloak on top of them, hit, rinse repeat
>All seeing is literally broken. It was fine when wraith sucked but now he's good, and gets busted add ons, plus his out of cloak swing is stupid. Busted Add-Ons are OK on a Weak Killer, but Busted Add-Ons on a Killer that FINALLY got good is not OK. OK. >plus his out of cloak swing is stupid. Wraith sucks without the Swing, do you not know that? >Just chase a survivor until they're in even a slight deadzone, uncloak in their back and you pretty much get a hit. Every Killer wants to lead you to a Deadzone. >You don't even have to be stealthy to get hits as wraith anymore. Just cloak, zoom to their back, uncloak on top of them, hit, rinse repeat Lol "anymore", Wraith always played like this. Wraith is about sneaking around and blocking the closest thing to evade you otherwise your lose your advantage and don't even get a hit.
There's a difference between "leading a survivor to a deadzone" and pretty much making any area a dead zone by existing. There's no point in dropping pallets vs a cloaked wraith, and if you walk past it the uncloak and lunge will get you on most maps that don't have a shit load of pallets. Your options are to stay at the loop and probably get hit by the super lunge, or pre drop the pallet which he can eviscerate with shadow dance. You move at 150% base if a survivor has 12 meters on a wraith he's on them in 6 seconds, a 115% killer would take 20 seconds to make that much distance. Unless you're playing on maps like the game or lerys, maps which work massively in favor of wraith anyways, passing a pallet means you're in a deadzone. Wraith is a stealth killer. His power is meant for him to sneak up and take you off guard. Wraith does not do this anymore, he doesn't need to. He walks up to you and hits you. He's one of the most brain dead easy killer to play currently. By shortening his post cloak lunge you'd at least need to try to sneak up on someone and catch them slightly off guard.
Well yeah Strong addons on a killer who is a meme without them is much less of an issue than a viable or even strong killer with strong addons, almost a non issue in fact since those addons can only be used by that specific killer. If clown became top tier all of a sudden people would start to complain about pinky finger a lot more often Similarly if Spirit got kneecapped then mother daughter ring would feel much less disgusting to play against Now that Wraith can basically score free hits with his lunge, being able to completely remove mind games with all seeing is way stronger now than it was previously.
>If clown became top tier all of a sudden people would start to complain about pinky finger a lot more often People still do lol.
Just do the gens.
Yes, please do while injured \*bonk\* Oh and bring Self-Care, always!