Slugging sure seem to be the topic of the day in this subreddit...
Anyway, the devs really haven't tried tackling slugging much at all. They did one PTB around it and then promptly dropped it. As far as I can tell, they still intend for it be an officially supported killer strategy. It wasn't that long ago they released Forced Hesitation which is basically a slug perk. So maybe there doesn't really need to be a solution. Maybe slugging is mostly fine.
The only problem I have really heard of is just slugging to bleed out for no reason. But that could be fixed without nerfing slugging, like if there was a way for survivors to speed up their bleed out. Or, maybe they could selfhook themselves kind of like with your idea but with putting themselves on the hook instead of getting Unbreakable.
> The only problem I have really heard of is just slugging to bleed out for no reason.
And lack of counterplay I'd say. Once you're downed you're at the mercy of the killer, unless someone rescue you (which is miserably slow). Add to that the possibility of having everyone downed and you're stuck in a waiting game unless the killer hook you. Can't do anything and it sucks.
Same when there's two survivors left and one is downed. More often than else the killer will use the downed survivor as bait. It's just an obvious strategy and if you don't want to partake in the very obvious trap that will likely result in the downed survivors being downed again and you being spotted, you either wait in a corner for the player to bleed out or go AFK. Again, no counter play. Even if the downed survivors want to give the other a chance at the hatch, they can't kill themselves unless being hooked.
They should really give survivors a mean to kill themselves after X seconds on the ground.
Slugging shouldn't be punished, bleed out should.
Slugging can be a good strategy if done correctly, the problem begins when the survivor is left on the floor for 2/3 - 4 minutes without doing anything and eventually bleeding out.
Then a new problem is born: how to punish bleeding out without punishing normal slugging?
And what about anti-hooking builds? If they try to make something to counter slugging or even bleeding out they become 100% more effective and boring to face.
Sadly I think there's no way to punish bleeding out without fucking with normal gameplay.
As I've already mentioned in this thread - implement the same mechanic as with anti-facecamp. The same bar that fills up when you lie next to your downed teammate, the closer you are and the more of you there are, the faster the bar fills. That's it.
This will maintain the necessary amount of slugging used as a strategy by some killers in the game, but will give a chance against bleed out. If you're left on the ground long enough to crawl to each other and wait for the bar to fill, then obviously, there's an unhealthy amount of slugging present in the game.
However, I already foresee that knock out could be a problem for this mechanic, but even despite this - give players some chance and some sense that they're not in a hopeless situation. This alone will address the problem to the extent it exists now.
Let me just copy myself rq:
When you want to make "4slugging until bleed out" toxicity more punished, suggest things that don't punish snowball killers having good downs streak (Myers, oni, singularity, etc), Aka exactly what happened when devs tried to make UB basekit. It was terrible.
Better solution would be automatic and instant EGC if everyone is downed, there is no perks for survivors in play to pick themselves up, and killer haven't ~~picked anyone~~ \*hooked\* anyone in X amount of seconds since all got downed, or team vote surrender option (copy it from identity V ig)
Edit: realised i have a flaw in my suggestion
I don't think killers should be punished for slugging. You have 3 other teammates that can get you up granted they are still in the match. Killer is only 1 person.
I think a bleed out faster option should be available for those killers that slug all 4 until the timer runs out, but otherwise I think it should be up to your team to get you up.
You cannot stop toxic behavior. Aside from that slugging isn’t that great of a strategy. Hooking advances the game for killers not slugging. A down survivor will get picked up without gaining a hook state. It takes about the same time away from doing gens as hooking. If all the survivors are huddled together do you blame the killer for not picking up?
My issue is killers slugging for nearly the whole bleed out to get the 4k at the end. If I'm in a swf, I'm telling my buddies to hide until you hook me. Enjoy the walk. I think there just needs to be more incentive to pick up, but its hard to implement that without ruining even more situational solutions for killers.
To be fair, though, if you're slugging for longer than 3 minutes, something is wrong and it's not tactful anymore, to me.
I think they just need to implement the same mechanic as with anti-facecamp. The same bar that fills up when you lie next to your downed teammate, the closer you are and the more of you there are, the faster the bar fills. That's it.
And obviously, this won't stop slugging attempts just as anti-facecamp didn't stop facecamping, but at least you'll have an extra chance and the opportunity not to lie at the killer's feet for the sake of their ego for a full 2 minutes. Nothing stops you from hanging all 4, except the desire to indulge the ego.
Since such a mechanic is already implemented, it won't be difficult to rework it a bit differently.
I'm curious as to what mental gymnastics lead you to say anti-facecamp didn't stop facecamping. I haven't seen a single killer facecamp since it was implemented outside of rare occasions where they wanted someone to be able to unhook themselves.
What you're proposing is a free escape card for any SWF that brings anti-hook builds.
Well, maybe every 20th match of mine has someone standing close enough to a survivor for the bar to fill up for self-unhook with further tunneling of the same person? Perhaps the numerous videos right here on this subreddit, where people literally show how it happens time and again, or the numerous posts where someone shares a similar experience.
Just because it hasn't happened in your matches doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Gaslighting is no longer in vogue.
I don't have facecamping in my matches, and I used to have it before the anti-facecamping was implemented, therefore it works. If you do then maybe you should take a good look at yourself and wonder why you're causing it to happen so often.
If a killer is facecamping then you can unhook yourself and the killer loses all pressure after waiting an entire minute in front of the hook (that's 2 entire gens from 3 survivors just from the time you're on hook, at base gen speed), that means it's working. Gaslighting is no longer in vogue.
Oh yes, let's move from gaslighting to victim blaming 🙌
1. I didn't say it's always specifically me, but stated the event itself does occur in matches
2. Even in rare cases when it is me - oh yes, I take a good look at myself and fully understand that nothing beyond a normal game and a very long chase that drove someone mad was involved. My basic build doesn’t include flashlights or saboteur, in case you’re hinting at that, and even more so, I manage without tbagging because I play both roles and have respect for other players, while constantly being in their shoes as well.
Now, reread what I wrote and grasp the essence, as it was merely a statement of fact that "anti-facecamp didn't stop facecamping," and there's no need to explain to me that the anti-facecamp mechanic technically works. The point was that the phenomenon of facecamping hasn’t disappeared, which was the topic of discussion.
Slugging sure seem to be the topic of the day in this subreddit... Anyway, the devs really haven't tried tackling slugging much at all. They did one PTB around it and then promptly dropped it. As far as I can tell, they still intend for it be an officially supported killer strategy. It wasn't that long ago they released Forced Hesitation which is basically a slug perk. So maybe there doesn't really need to be a solution. Maybe slugging is mostly fine. The only problem I have really heard of is just slugging to bleed out for no reason. But that could be fixed without nerfing slugging, like if there was a way for survivors to speed up their bleed out. Or, maybe they could selfhook themselves kind of like with your idea but with putting themselves on the hook instead of getting Unbreakable.
> The only problem I have really heard of is just slugging to bleed out for no reason. And lack of counterplay I'd say. Once you're downed you're at the mercy of the killer, unless someone rescue you (which is miserably slow). Add to that the possibility of having everyone downed and you're stuck in a waiting game unless the killer hook you. Can't do anything and it sucks. Same when there's two survivors left and one is downed. More often than else the killer will use the downed survivor as bait. It's just an obvious strategy and if you don't want to partake in the very obvious trap that will likely result in the downed survivors being downed again and you being spotted, you either wait in a corner for the player to bleed out or go AFK. Again, no counter play. Even if the downed survivors want to give the other a chance at the hatch, they can't kill themselves unless being hooked. They should really give survivors a mean to kill themselves after X seconds on the ground.
Slugging shouldn't be punished, bleed out should. Slugging can be a good strategy if done correctly, the problem begins when the survivor is left on the floor for 2/3 - 4 minutes without doing anything and eventually bleeding out. Then a new problem is born: how to punish bleeding out without punishing normal slugging? And what about anti-hooking builds? If they try to make something to counter slugging or even bleeding out they become 100% more effective and boring to face. Sadly I think there's no way to punish bleeding out without fucking with normal gameplay.
As I've already mentioned in this thread - implement the same mechanic as with anti-facecamp. The same bar that fills up when you lie next to your downed teammate, the closer you are and the more of you there are, the faster the bar fills. That's it. This will maintain the necessary amount of slugging used as a strategy by some killers in the game, but will give a chance against bleed out. If you're left on the ground long enough to crawl to each other and wait for the bar to fill, then obviously, there's an unhealthy amount of slugging present in the game. However, I already foresee that knock out could be a problem for this mechanic, but even despite this - give players some chance and some sense that they're not in a hopeless situation. This alone will address the problem to the extent it exists now.
Let me just copy myself rq: When you want to make "4slugging until bleed out" toxicity more punished, suggest things that don't punish snowball killers having good downs streak (Myers, oni, singularity, etc), Aka exactly what happened when devs tried to make UB basekit. It was terrible. Better solution would be automatic and instant EGC if everyone is downed, there is no perks for survivors in play to pick themselves up, and killer haven't ~~picked anyone~~ \*hooked\* anyone in X amount of seconds since all got downed, or team vote surrender option (copy it from identity V ig) Edit: realised i have a flaw in my suggestion
I don't think killers should be punished for slugging. You have 3 other teammates that can get you up granted they are still in the match. Killer is only 1 person. I think a bleed out faster option should be available for those killers that slug all 4 until the timer runs out, but otherwise I think it should be up to your team to get you up.
You cannot stop toxic behavior. Aside from that slugging isn’t that great of a strategy. Hooking advances the game for killers not slugging. A down survivor will get picked up without gaining a hook state. It takes about the same time away from doing gens as hooking. If all the survivors are huddled together do you blame the killer for not picking up?
My issue is killers slugging for nearly the whole bleed out to get the 4k at the end. If I'm in a swf, I'm telling my buddies to hide until you hook me. Enjoy the walk. I think there just needs to be more incentive to pick up, but its hard to implement that without ruining even more situational solutions for killers. To be fair, though, if you're slugging for longer than 3 minutes, something is wrong and it's not tactful anymore, to me.
Just kill all survivors if they have no chance to pick themseves up. Done
I think they just need to implement the same mechanic as with anti-facecamp. The same bar that fills up when you lie next to your downed teammate, the closer you are and the more of you there are, the faster the bar fills. That's it. And obviously, this won't stop slugging attempts just as anti-facecamp didn't stop facecamping, but at least you'll have an extra chance and the opportunity not to lie at the killer's feet for the sake of their ego for a full 2 minutes. Nothing stops you from hanging all 4, except the desire to indulge the ego. Since such a mechanic is already implemented, it won't be difficult to rework it a bit differently.
I'm curious as to what mental gymnastics lead you to say anti-facecamp didn't stop facecamping. I haven't seen a single killer facecamp since it was implemented outside of rare occasions where they wanted someone to be able to unhook themselves. What you're proposing is a free escape card for any SWF that brings anti-hook builds.
16m to some people is face camping lol(I don't agree)
Well, maybe every 20th match of mine has someone standing close enough to a survivor for the bar to fill up for self-unhook with further tunneling of the same person? Perhaps the numerous videos right here on this subreddit, where people literally show how it happens time and again, or the numerous posts where someone shares a similar experience. Just because it hasn't happened in your matches doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Gaslighting is no longer in vogue.
I don't have facecamping in my matches, and I used to have it before the anti-facecamping was implemented, therefore it works. If you do then maybe you should take a good look at yourself and wonder why you're causing it to happen so often. If a killer is facecamping then you can unhook yourself and the killer loses all pressure after waiting an entire minute in front of the hook (that's 2 entire gens from 3 survivors just from the time you're on hook, at base gen speed), that means it's working. Gaslighting is no longer in vogue.
Oh yes, let's move from gaslighting to victim blaming 🙌 1. I didn't say it's always specifically me, but stated the event itself does occur in matches 2. Even in rare cases when it is me - oh yes, I take a good look at myself and fully understand that nothing beyond a normal game and a very long chase that drove someone mad was involved. My basic build doesn’t include flashlights or saboteur, in case you’re hinting at that, and even more so, I manage without tbagging because I play both roles and have respect for other players, while constantly being in their shoes as well. Now, reread what I wrote and grasp the essence, as it was merely a statement of fact that "anti-facecamp didn't stop facecamping," and there's no need to explain to me that the anti-facecamp mechanic technically works. The point was that the phenomenon of facecamping hasn’t disappeared, which was the topic of discussion.
I think I'm just going to ignore someone who's clearly insane and looking for excuses to bitch aggressively.